Ukrainian Losses

[Gipsy]

RU MOD yesterday released copies of documents found in one of the Ukrainian military communications centers regarding deaths, wounded, AWOL personal, unaccounted for, and soldiers who have transferred their allegiance to the DPR/LRP militaries, these documents were dated March 29, 2022.

These doc's gave the serial No's, names, units, age, where/when data, and for the dead, where buried..

The stated therein losses are reportedly,
Deaths of Ukrainian soldiers, 23,376.
Wounded, 38,000approx.
AWOLs, 8,500 approx.
Unaccounted for, 7,157.
Transferred allegiance, 13,456.

The documents showing the above figures were posted on twitter yesterday..

Personally, I cannot prove nor disprove the above..

Remember the date of the doc's, as now it is 19 April 2022, so there would likely be further additions to the above

[patagonie]

RU MOD yesterday released copies of documents found in one of the Ukrainian military communications centers regarding deaths, wounded, AWOL personal, unaccounted for, and soldiers who have transferred their allegiance to the DPR/LRP militaries, these documents were dated March 29, 2022.

These doc's gave the serial No's, names, units, age, where/when data, and for the dead, where buried..

The stated therein losses are reportedly,
Deaths of Ukrainian soldiers, 23,376.
Wounded, 38,000approx.
AWOLs, 8,500 approx.
Unaccounted for, 7,157.
Transferred allegiance, 13,456.

The documents showing the above figures were posted on twitter yesterday..

Personally, I cannot prove nor disprove the above..

Remember the date of the doc's, as now it is 19 April 2022, so there would likely be further additions to the above

That's very high and doesn't look good.
Even Russian losses are not so high IMHO.
Except if Ukrainian civilians are included in the numerals.
 
Just my two cents, that looks a fake.

[AJ]

Could* be accurate.
My thought is it may* show totals to that march date from start of hostilities in 14.
The number of transfers to seperatist happened a bit more initially.

Overall the 98k number out of action seems fake.
That's almost a 50% reduction in troops while Russia lost thier advance and had to regroup.
Meanwhile half the Ukrainian force left noylt only held but after such pushed back some in the south and the east?

Defender loses are typically a third of the offensive forces, , Russia hasn't used much air support to minimize this average factor.
If those numbers are accurate we'd typically  be seeing russian loses in the 200k to 300k area and that.for sure hasn't occured.

They have  had 12k troops dedicated to Mariupol fo98mmr 4 weeks  where only 2 to 4k Ukrainian troops were.

[Texan77]

Why doesn't Russia collect gas payments in Euro and pay its debt? I do not understand this.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russia%20faces%20first%20foreign%20default%20in%20a%20century%20%E2%80%93%20which%20could%20complicate%20putin's%20war%20in%20ukraine/ar-AAWlm5l?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=0b69dbee38c545c2aca634951afd05be

[Gipsy]

Could* be accurate.
My thought is it may* show totals to that march date from start of hostilities in 14.
The number of transfers to seperatist happened a bit more initially.

Overall the 98k number out of action seems fake.
That's almost a 50% reduction in troops while Russia lost thier advance and had to regroup.
Meanwhile half the Ukrainian force left noylt only held but after such pushed back some in the south and the east?

Defender loses are typically a third of the offensive forces, , Russia hasn't used much air support to minimize this average factor.
If those numbers are accurate we'd typically  be seeing russian loses in the 200k to 300k area and that.for sure hasn't occured.

They have  had 12k troops dedicated to Mariupol fo98mmr 4 weeks  where only 2 to 4k Ukrainian troops were.

I feel that you may be right about the timeframe of the losses..

I would also agree that RU has not been used in a good strategic manner, but would say that the move on Kiev was a feint IMHO..

Ref troops in Mariupol, I suggest that you are way out, as according to reports that I have heard from residents there, and other sources, and according to the certified deaths of soldiers there and those who surrendered, and those estimated to still be in Azovstahl, 8-10k is more accurate.....

Edit to add, there are reportedly somewhere in the region of 50k Ukrainian troops in the southern areas, Donbass/Lugansk. and Kharkov areas, east to central area.
Also, from Kiev to the western borders, there are estimated to be less than 30k military available..
All this would mean that there are less than 100k Ukrainian military left..
If this is anywhere near correct, then the initial reported losses would seemingly be nearer than is thought..

[Gipsy]

Why doesn't Russia collect gas payments in Euro and pay its debt? I do not understand this.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russia%20faces%20first%20foreign%20default%20in%20a%20century%20%E2%80%93%20which%20could%20complicate%20putin's%20war%20in%20ukraine/ar-AAWlm5l?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=0b69dbee38c545c2aca634951afd05be

Oh dear Tex, posting crap from MSN written by a couple of questionable persons.

RU has the same problem using Euro's as it has with its stolen dollars....

[AJ]

Could* be accurate.
My thought is it may* show totals to that march date from start of hostilities in 14.
The number of transfers to seperatist happened a bit more initially.

Overall the 98k number out of action seems fake.
That's almost a 50% reduction in troops while Russia lost thier advance and had to regroup.
Meanwhile half the Ukrainian force left noylt only held but after such pushed back some in the south and the east?

Defender loses are typically a third of the offensive forces, , Russia hasn't used much air support to minimize this average factor.
If those numbers are accurate we'd typically  be seeing russian loses in the 200k to 300k area and that.for sure hasn't occured.

They have  had 12k troops dedicated to Mariupol fo98mmr 4 weeks  where only 2 to 4k Ukrainian troops were.

I feel that you may be right about the timeframe of the losses..

I would also agree that RU has not been used in a good strategic manner, but would say that the move on Kiev was a feint IMHO..

Ref troops in Mariupol, I suggest that you are way out, as according to reports that I have heard from residents there, and other sources, and according to the certified deaths of soldiers there and those who surrendered, and those estimated to still be in Azovstahl, 8-10k is more accurate.....

Edit to add, there are reportedly somewhere in the region of 50k Ukrainian troops in the southern areas, Donbass/Lugansk. and Kharkov areas, east to central area.
Also, from Kiev to the western borders, there are estimated to be less than 30k military available..
All this would mean that there are less than 100k Ukrainian military left..
If this is anywhere near correct, then the initial reported losses would seemingly be nearer than is thought..

Possibly.

As far as Mariupol I was going off battalions initially documented there which was 3.
There certainly could have been, or could be far more.

I'd actually  guess  that there was or Russia wouldn't have likely  dedicated so many battalions to that.


90k on troop loses since 14 is possible, but seems particularly high even over 8 - years.

If true (it certainly could be) id expect to see equal loses on the republics and russian side, over the same prior years.

[patagonie]

Could* be accurate.
My thought is it may* show totals to that march date from start of hostilities in 14.
The number of transfers to seperatist happened a bit more initially.

Overall the 98k number out of action seems fake.
That's almost a 50% reduction in troops while Russia lost thier advance and had to regroup.
Meanwhile half the Ukrainian force left noylt only held but after such pushed back some in the south and the east?

Defender loses are typically a third of the offensive forces, , Russia hasn't used much air support to minimize this average factor.
If those numbers are accurate we'd typically  be seeing russian loses in the 200k to 300k area and that.for sure hasn't occured.

They have  had 12k troops dedicated to Mariupol fo98mmr 4 weeks  where only 2 to 4k Ukrainian troops were.

I feel that you may be right about the timeframe of the losses..

I would also agree that RU has not been used in a good strategic manner, but would say that the move on Kiev was a feint IMHO..

Ref troops in Mariupol, I suggest that you are way out, as according to reports that I have heard from residents there, and other sources, and according to the certified deaths of soldiers there and those who surrendered, and those estimated to still be in Azovstahl, 8-10k is more accurate.....

Edit to add, there are reportedly somewhere in the region of 50k Ukrainian troops in the southern areas, Donbass/Lugansk. and Kharkov areas, east to central area.
Also, from Kiev to the western borders, there are estimated to be less than 30k military available..
All this would mean that there are less than 100k Ukrainian military left..
If this is anywhere near correct, then the initial reported losses would seemingly be nearer than is thought..

That doesn't make any sense. Look:
The Ukrainian army was around 200000
Plus territorial forces plus Police forces (the quality of these people is questionable on the battlefield but they control the territory avoiding infiltration, reconnaissance, and sabotage).Their number is more than the whole Ukrainian Army IMHO
Plus volunteers (the number of volunteers is questionable, the organization seemed to be a mess and the Russian Federation targeted the training camps in Lvov which probably lead to a few dozens of KIA and hundreds of wounded maybe). But one thing is sure, from the foreign volunteers manys guys with combat experience are already on the front.
And the global mobilization that is delivering or will deliver brigades after brigades.

They have too many fighters or people who want to fight considering the equipment + weapons + training available
One million have come back since the beginning of the struggle, and among them, some want to fight (including women, and some are already on the front)

As you wrote, "Defender loses are typically a third of the offensive forces, Russia hasn't used much air support to minimize this average factor."
For the moment I consider that losses of the Russian Federation (KIA, wounded, prisoners) are around 50000 in total.
For Ukraine, I consider that we come along 30000 (which is largely above your rules if we follow the rules' ratio).
This ratio is probably going to change in the incoming campaign (Donbass campaign), it will be more bloody for Ukraine because the war will be more conventional.
 
The problem that the Russian Federation meets now is the most determinant factor: they don't have more regular or elite troops left and cannot retrieve more or in a very tiny proportion in the short term, the vast majority of the Russians simply don't want to fight. For the 9 May, it severely limits their options.

They now try to encircle the Ukrainian divisions in the Donbass. We will see what happens.
 
Even if the President of the Russian Federation don't care about losses the attrition is working against Russia, or he needs to make a general mobilization. But look, that's just a special operation no? The regular army should be enough no?

[Tom Cat]

The ghost of kiev's identity has been revealed.
Not sure how much was fact or fiction,  but he will be a part of Ukrainian history.

https://nypost.com/2022/04/29/ghost-of-Kiev-major-stepan-tarabalka-killed-in-battle/

[patagonie]

The ghost of kiev's identity has been revealed.
Not sure how much was fact or fiction,  but he will be a part of Ukrainian history.

https://nypost.com/2022/04/29/ghost-of-Kiev-major-stepan-tarabalka-killed-in-battle/

Accordingly to fighters pilots if he has 3 or 4 kills he will be lucky. So 6 kills the first day, that's why lol is called a legend.

[Tom Cat]

The ghost of kiev's identity has been revealed.
Not sure how much was fact or fiction,  but he will be a part of Ukrainian history.

https://nypost.com/2022/04/29/ghost-of-Kiev-major-stepan-tarabalka-killed-in-battle/

Accordingly to fighters pilots if he has 3 or 4 kills he will be lucky. So 6 kills the first day, that's why lol is called a legend.

The article link I posted is not very accurate. The pilot mentioned is a hero, but not the Ghost of Kiev.
The Ghost of Kiev is a legend, a collective of fighter pilots not a single individual.

[jseddy]

How many civillians are they counting as "soldiers"?

[Texan77]

Why doesn't Russia collect gas payments in Euro and pay its debt? I do not understand this.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/russia%20faces%20first%20foreign%20default%20in%20a%20century%20%E2%80%93%20which%20could%20complicate%20putin's%20war%20in%20ukraine/ar-AAWlm5l?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=0b69dbee38c545c2aca634951afd05be

Oh dear Tex, posting crap from MSN written by a couple of questionable persons.

RU has the same problem using Euro's as it has with its stolen dollars....

So what is wrong with the news article. Russia likely to not pay debt because they do not have dollars. If you dis agree why not tell me why? Why not sell gas in Euros and trade them for dollars and pay debt. I do not get it. Since you are so smart explain it to me.

[Steveboy]

Russia must win this war.. what ever the cost.. cos its all about beating the US way of running the planet.. Just like Navalny must be locked up for a long time and if he dies in prison tough shit!

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2021/04/21/pers-j01.html?fbclid=IwAR1CSCun-yFg4_9yqc5D5Mu5pqxjBaJnXOaam7KsFBPcCAlbPh7Qs7PfQjU

Way to much selective outrage outrage in the world, double standards and hypocrisy ... It needs to end asap.. so come on Russia do the job.. and whilst your their keep the other twat locked up till he rots!

[Tom Cat]

There is some good news out of Mariupol,  about 100 people were evaluated by the UN yesterday.
Maybe they will be able to shed some truths on how they have been treated by the soldiers from both sides?

[Texan77]

Russia must win this war.. what ever the cost.. cos its all about beating the US way of running the planet.. Just like Navalny must be locked up for a long time and if he dies in prison tough shit!

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2021/04/21/pers-j01.html?fbclid=IwAR1CSCun-yFg4_9yqc5D5Mu5pqxjBaJnXOaam7KsFBPcCAlbPh7Qs7PfQjU

Way to much selective outrage outrage in the world, double standards and hypocrisy ... It needs to end asap.. so come on Russia do the job.. and whilst your their keep the other twat locked up till he rots!

What is really ashamed is so many Russians will end up dead over destroying the country which is likely to occur no matter what the final outcome of the war. This makes what happened in Afghanistan war look like nothing which set the stage for the fall of the USSR. Fasten your seatbelts as life is going to get much harder everywhere.

[Jonas!]

Way to much selective outrage outrage in the world, double standards and hypocrisy ... 

I do agree with all of this.   It is outrageous when Russia makes a move. When the US does it's characterized differently.    China hasn't yet made a move, nevertheless the West tries to thwart them, and almost provoke them into doing something.    The west doesn't like competitors and will do all it can to constrict them all the while pretending to be the good guys.   

Jonas! 

[Texan77]

Way to much selective outrage outrage in the world, double standards and hypocrisy ... 

I do agree with all of this.   It is outrageous when Russia makes a move. When the US does it's characterized differently.    China hasn't yet made a move, nevertheless the West tries to thwart them, and almost provoke them into doing something.    The west doesn't like competitors and will do all it can to constrict them all the while pretending to be the good guys.   

Jonas!

Whatever you want to believe.  War will not end any time soon unless Russia gives up and goes home. Some of the countries supplying Ukraine in this conflict.

[WestCoast]

Russia must win this war.. what ever the cost.. cos its all about beating the US way of running the planet.. Just like Navalny must be locked up for a long time and if he dies in prison tough shit!

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2021/04/21/pers-j01.html?fbclid=IwAR1CSCun-yFg4_9yqc5D5Mu5pqxjBaJnXOaam7KsFBPcCAlbPh7Qs7PfQjU

Way to much selective outrage outrage in the world, double standards and hypocrisy ... It needs to end asap.. so come on Russia do the job.. and whilst your their keep the other twat locked up till he rots!

The reason people prefer the US or Russia is simple to understand, the USA has far better PR. American politicians and businesses get taken down all the time by the press, courts and public opinion. In Russia you don't say anything really bad against Putin. The Russian court system isn't going to rule against Putin and the Russian government and say a new law is unconstitutional.

[Steveboy]

Do you know what? I really do not care on anyones opinions the war is "Self Inflicted" Its not the peoples faults as usual it is the governments AND the US and NATO.. the people are just pawns..

What a "Self inflicted " mess.. that is it ..

[Texan77]

Steve, All this war is, is a land and resource grab and everything else is bull shit. There is nothing to do about Nazis and helping the people in Ukraine that is real. Too bad young Russians are going to pay for this war with their lives and the future of your son will dimmer because of this war.

[Steveboy]

Russia must win this war.. what ever the cost.. cos its all about beating the US way of running the planet.. Just like Navalny must be locked up for a long time and if he dies in prison tough shit!

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2021/04/21/pers-j01.html?fbclid=IwAR1CSCun-yFg4_9yqc5D5Mu5pqxjBaJnXOaam7KsFBPcCAlbPh7Qs7PfQjU

Way to much selective outrage outrage in the world, double standards and hypocrisy ... It needs to end asap.. so come on Russia do the job.. and whilst your their keep the other twat locked up till he rots!

What is really ashamed is so many Russians will end up dead over destroying the country which is likely to occur no matter what the final outcome of the war. This makes what happened in Afghanistan war look like nothing which set the stage for the fall of the USSR. Fasten your seatbelts as life is going to get much harder everywhere.

You know what tex.. If I get the chance Im happy to fight.. I do not really fight or argue for anyone other than Hypocrisy and your country is NUMBER 1 for hypocrisy .. it is as simple as that.. something needs to be done about it.. if that means lots need to die.. so be it.. In the end I think soon enough the world will not be global or a global village.. its going to be the double standards and hypercritical West.. and on the other side the East .. I do not care what side you are on or listening to you bla bla bla bla.. I will be on the East... Good luck on your side..

I don't need your Pepsi cola.. thanks..

[Steveboy]

Steve, All this war is, is a land and resource grab and everything else is bull shit. There is nothing to do about Nazis and helping the people in Ukraine that is real. Too bad young Russians are going to pay for this war with their lives and the future of your son will dimmer because of this war.

My wife is also happy to fight.. no its not all about Nazis I already told you what it is about DOUBLE STANDARDS & HYPOCRISY.. If we all die in the process lest speak about it on the other side..

[WestCoast]

Steve, All this war is, is a land and resource grab and everything else is bull shit. There is nothing to do about Nazis and helping the people in Ukraine that is real. Too bad young Russians are going to pay for this war with their lives and the future of your son will dimmer because of this war.

My wife is also happy to fight.. no its not all about Nazis I already told you what it is about DOUBLE STANDARDS & HYPOCRISY.. If we all die in the process lest speak about it on the other side..

Steve, why don't you and your wife start a website to recruit Brits, Americans and others to fight for Russia? The Ukrainian government has been very successful in recruiting foreigners to fight for Ukraine, maybe you could be equally successful in getting foreigners to fight for Russia?

You and your wife say you're happy to fight for Russia? Then do it. You could take cameras along when you fighting and get some photos and videos. I'm sure Manny would allow you to post them here.

Maybe Manny will even allow you to do posts about recruiting foreigners to fight for Russia? Since Manny is very much pro Putin I'm surprised he doesn't have a section here about recruiting foreigners to fight for Russia? Best of luck. 

[Jonas!]

Maybe Manny will even allow you to do posts about recruiting foreigners to fight for Russia? Since Manny is very much pro Putin I'm surprised he doesn't have a section here about recruiting foreigners to fight for Russia? Best of luck.

I'm not sure where Manny lives but here in the states I think a person would be sent to Guantanamo bay Cuba if he tried this sort of thing.  On a related subject, here in the states a person can't make that choice.  Also here in the states no person can travel to Cuba for tourism. 

Jonas!