Covid-19 / Coronavirus / China Virus Information

[andrewfi]

I have been learning a lot about Covid-19 in terms of the medical, political, economic and social issues. One of the biggest problems is that many people really do not have access to good sources of information.

A site that I use in my writing work is Medscape, they publish a whole host of material and link to research papers, commentaries and analysis as well as having their own good quality, timely content.

Some of their content requires a login following a brief questionnaire designed, I think, to keep out the hoi polloi, but they let me in.

Here's a link to their Coronavirus section which is well worth a read if you want to become well acquainted with what's really going on. Some of the article comment sections show signs of infestation by members of the hoi polloi with self awarded doctorates but the real value is usually in the articles and linked content.

https://www.medscape.com/resource/coronavirus

[andrewfi]

Just been for my first jab.
As I was vaccinated at a mass vaccination centre, a huge county showground, I was given the Oxford/AstraZeneca jab. It seems that AstraZeneca is preferred in mass vaccination centres and Pfizer is used in hospital settings where cold chain security can be easily managed.

Everything was slick as mashed up bananas. There are different car parks for different appointment times, marshalls everywhere. Everybody is issued with a fresh surgical mask as they walk in, even if, as in my case, I had just donned a fresh one as I approached the door.

Checking of ID is quick and efficient.

I was in and out in just over 15 minutes. I chose to not sit in the waiting area for an additional 15 minutes - that's OK as long as you pinky swear to not leave the car park for 15 minutes. I sat and checked messages.

At this centre they normally do 800-1000 arms per day but right now they are only doing about 400. I was told that the reason is that stockpiles are being built up to handle the second jabs that are now coming due and the slowdown should be over in about a week - a total of ten days slowdown. Is that true - don't know, but the timing makes sense.

Almost painless little prick, so far no discomfort or after-effects.

One thing, when I booked my appointment I used the Swiftqueue.co.uk system. When you make a booking through its service you get two appointment dates. Apparently, if you go through your GP or other routes then you do not get the second appointment. Notification of the second appointment will come out later on. Assuming that my second appointment is not postponed, then I much prefer the Swiftqueue route. Using this service gave me a wide range of choices of convenient locations and times. I appreciated knowing when the second dose will be due as it means I can plan for it.

One last point. I cannot be certain of this, but I think that the UK is further along with the vaccination plan than they claim credit for. I had been using an app that monitors the vaccination rate and it had been showing a first vaccination date in early April that then fell back to late March.

I had my jab today, but I could've had it done in late February given the date that I received my invitation to get vaccinated (February 19th). I also know of people significantly younger than I who are just now getting invites for vaccination - again significantly sooner than the claimed rate of vaccinations would suggest.

If I am right then we may be looking at some more good news a little sooner than expected.

[NS1]

Based on what I have read, the UK is leading in vaccinations
over 30% of population vaccinated. Good on them.
Canada is a shit show, with less than a million done so far.
Way behind for 1st world country, I beleive we rank 19th
in terms of vacinations to date.

[Texan77]

According to the dangers of the vaccine by Faux Pas I guess 30 of the population of the UK died and just some how was not reported. 

[Faux Pas]

According to the dangers of the vaccine by Faux Pas I guess 30 of the population of the UK died and just some how was not reported. 

It's really not okay to be stupid and ignore the truth when the truth has been presented to you. If you die after the injection you'll simply be stupid and dead. Folks are dying, that is a fact. As funny as you find that scenario you'd probably hope the numbers are higher. Rest easy, the more they inject, the more will die.

If you are one of the 402 UK deaths to date after a vaccine injection I suppose in effect you are vaccinated and dead. It's your choice, for now.

[andrewfi]

Can you people REALLY not do maths?

In the UK, over 23,000,000 people have received at least one vaccine shot.

Most of those people are those who are aged and/or otherwise unwell - predisposed to bad outcomes from Covid-19.

In the UK, over the course of a year, about 9 people in 1000 will die for any reason. Last year is rather different and for this simple demonstration, I am not going to consider the effects of Covid-19.

So, that means in the course of 3 months, the approximate period of time that the Covid-19 vaccinations have been going on in the UK about 2.25 people per thousand would have died.

So, with 23 million jabs that means of that population, we would expect 0.0025*23,000,000 deaths. That's a nice easy 51,750 deaths among the population who have received the vaccination. Of course, that nice clean number is for normal years and with the entire UK population. We would expect that more people would die than this among the cohorts that have already been vaccinated as they are aged or unwell.

That tells us that if only 402 people have died after taking a Covid-19 vaccine in the UK then things are going very, very, well.

It looks to me like the innumerate have been misled by their own ignorance. Sad.

When one drills down into the numbers in respect of the 'problems' reported in Europe one finds the same thing. The numbers who have been ill or died as a result of blood clotting are at, or lower than, the level for these events in the normal population.

The chances of dying of Covid-19 in the general population seems to be higher than the rate for people dying with unusual blood clotting. Thus, halting vaccinations is inevitably going to lead to more deaths than would have happened with the clotting events. Thus, even if the clotting is due to Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine (which does not seem to be the case) then it is better to continue using the Oxford/AstraZeneca product!

Why are governments behaving so foolishly - denying their citizens the right to live rather than die? I don't know. My guess is that it is a mixture of blame-shifting to justify a delayed rollout of vaccinations and innumeracy on the part of the decision-makers who - in most cases seem to be politicians and not relevant experts. Indeed I have seen some non-English media statements that make it clear that the 'experts' do not have the same opinions as the politicians.

[andrewfi]

Oh, I have side/after effects to report.

Within a couple of hours of getting the jab, I started to get a whole raft of cold symptoms. Runny nose, big sneezing and a tickly cough. It came on very fast and I ended up having an early, but restless, night. I don't think I had a fever, but I did not check that.

It is now just after 09:30 the day after and already the symptoms are declining. Still got a slight tickly cough, but then I have been abusing my throat with coughing yesterday and overnight.

It seems that up to about 10% of people get this effect. It is a sign that the immune system has been stimulated so it is actually a good thing. The reaction is reportedly worse when one has previously suffered from Covid-19, as I am sure that I have.

[Faux Pas]

FiFi

The maths is precisely what you conveniently ignore while you consume all of the propaganda marketing materials disguised as science provided you by big pharma. All this in your zest for security and protection. You have a propensity to take to and suck that sales information like a piglet to teat. I wish you well, go for it, wear that mask, keep your distance and wallow in fear.

Do you know what that pretty pearly white stuff on the top of chicken shit is? It's chicken shit too. All I can do is put some common sense information out there for those like you, who often struggle with common sense. I'll try once more to break it down so that it may be palettable to even you.

Back away from your propaganda fueled brilliant scientific thinking process for just a moment and think outside the box. The patented virus did not evolve in a wet market or bat cave in Wuhan. How or why it was unleashed has yet to be made public but nonetheless, it's here.

Of those infected by the virus less than .05% will die from it. Those statistics are likely padded and much less given the accounting of the deaths by the WHO and the CDC. That leaves a greater than 99.5% chance of surviving infection for most of the worlds population. There is zero data that if the entire worlds population were indeed vaccinated that those numbers would even be affected. Efficacy of all the vaccines is 80% at best. Why alter your immune system?

The Astra/Zeneca mRNA vaccine you're so proud of injects a foreign substance into your body to change the behavior of your immune system. Forget the after and side effects or the 402 deaths to date. These foreign particles are changing your immune system to do what your body already does naturally.  Where is the logic in that? When or how did you lose your reasoning, logic and critical thinking skills?

The vaccine is rushed and untested even on animals. That makes you the animal. The ignored question to that is why? Nobody really knows what the mid or the long term effects are but, the early short term effects aren't favorable.

I really do hope and pray all who have taken the vaccine have no deaths, after or side effects but, that just isn't the case, is it? The idea that 23 million have had at least one injection is of little comfort to those 402 lab animals in the UK that may or may not have died anyway. That is an "acceptable" number to you?

[andrewfi]

Fauxpas. What has your dislike of United States produced chicken got to do with your inability to count?

By the way, over in the civilised world we enjoy much higher food quality and safety standards to the extent that many food items from the United States cannot be imported here. Chicken is one such product.

Now, go away and work through the numbers I shared with you. None of it requires peer review, it is public record, not academic publishing. Sad that you don't even understand these basics.

As it happens there is a huge amount of peer reviewed data available. If you don't think there is much/any it is because you are willfully ignorant. Sadly only you can address your own ignorance.

But let's give it a go.
Go through the numbers I shared and the very simple calculation that even you should be able to manage. Then get back to me with evidence to refute the calculated point. Otherwise you're just a waste of time.

Nobody should limit themself as you are clearly doing. You're wasting yourself.

Do the numbers and refute the points with evidence. That means numbers and facts.

Don't waste yourself. You deserve better of yourself, just as poor Billykins does.

[Faux Pas]

Fauxpas. What has your dislike of United States produced chicken got to do with your inability to count?

By the way, over in the civilised world we enjoy much higher food quality and safety standards to the extent that many food items from the United States cannot be imported here. Chicken is one such product.

Now, go away and work through the numbers I shared with you. None of it requires peer review, it is public record, not academic publishing. Sad that you don't even understand these basics.

As it happens there is a huge amount of peer reviewed data available. If you don't think there is much/any it is because you are willfully ignorant. Sadly only you can address your own ignorance.

But let's give it a go.
Go through the numbers I shared and the very simple calculation that even you should be able to manage. Then get back to me with evidence to refute the calculated point. Otherwise you're just a waste of time.

Nobody should limit themself as you are clearly doing. You're wasting yourself.

Do the numbers and refute the points with evidence. That means numbers and facts.

Don't waste yourself. You deserve better of yourself, just as poor Billykins does.

FiFi,

I asked you very intentionally designed simple questions because it's obvious you find it difficult to answer the tougher more complex ones. Rather than admit you can't even answer the simpler questions, you resort to the expected Moby tactics of strawman building and attacking to avoid providing those answers. I tried to help you but it's become painfully obvious you are beyond help. Your perception of my ability to count and the quality of chickens world wide is your argument and I'll let you pursue that without me.

I will continue to try to help you with your reasoning and critical thinking skills even though it is akin to teaching a pig to sing. The application of the chicken shit analogy was a fair one. While you are all comfy on being safe as a bug in a rug with your new vaccy you are focusing on the pretty pearly white shit and ignoring the ugly pile it sits upon.

I asked you simple fair questions. Until you are ready to answer them I will not be able to help you further. Take some time and study them if you must. Until we can designate exactly why you lack critical thinking skills I won't be able to help you overcome it.

[BillyB]

Some of you may think all is going well but last I counted, 7 nations using the AstraZeneca vaccine halted the vaccination of their people due to an excessive number of people getting blood clots and dying. Who knows? After investigation, they may determine the excess number of side effects and deaths are worth resuming the vaccination program.

[Manny]

Just been for my first jab.
As I was vaccinated at a mass vaccination centre, a huge county showground, I was given the Oxford/AstraZeneca jab. It seems that AstraZeneca is preferred in mass vaccination centres and Pfizer is used in hospital settings where cold chain security can be easily managed.

Everything was slick as mashed up bananas. There are different car parks for different appointment times, marshalls everywhere. Everybody is issued with a fresh surgical mask as they walk in, even if, as in my case, I had just donned a fresh one as I approached the door.

Checking of ID is quick and efficient.

I had my first one today as well. Also AstraZeneca.

I went to a drive-in centre similar to that Andrew noted. No ID check, just a name check. I'd previously booked in online.

It was quite busy but pretty well run. I was in and out quite fast.

It's only been about three or four hours, no side effects and I haven't grown any extra limbs yet. 

[andrewfi]

Glad you have had no effects. I can't be certain that what I experienced was the jab, although the symptoms are noted as possible side effects in up to 10% of people. In favour of it being the jab is that the effects came and went so fast. A normal cold would not go away this fast - at least not in my experience, and again, the rapid return to fine fettle is noted in the side effects document.

It does seem like they've gotten all this sorted out.

[andrewfi]

Some of you may think all is going well but last I counted, 7 nations using the AstraZeneca vaccine halted the vaccination of their people due to an excessive number of people getting blood clots and dying. Who knows? After investigation, they may determine the excess number of side effects and deaths are worth resuming the vaccination program.

When you read up, as I am sure you didn't yet, you will see that the effects appeared in, as I recall, Norway and Austria and in, again, from memory, 4 people. The other countries have not had any ill-effects and the countries are all saying that they do not think it is related to the vaccine.

Worth noting, the side-effects leaflet that ALL vaccine recipients in the UK receive and go through with the staff before vaccination, clearly states that some bruising and subcutaneous clotting is quite possible and should be treated as normal.

Sadly, one needs to look beyond the headline to find out what is actually going on - that's hard for some people so they get misled and scare themselves.

Gentlemen, do some learning and stop making yourselves into easily manipulated victims.

[BillyB]

Andrew, you're not a very good salesman. While 7 nations suspended their vaccination program, YOU are telling everybody it's okay to get a shot. The overwhelming majority of vaccines and medicines never make it to the market. There's good reasons for that. If it weren't for a declared 'emergency', I doubt any of the COVID vaccines would get approval to be used on humans.

[Texan77]

This is just a anti vaccine propaganda thing in the USA among right extremists who are useful idiots for the anarchists who want to destroy the country. 2.2 million people in the USA get the vaccine everyday and that number is ramping up. The number of people in the USA who are not willing to take the vaccine has dropped from November of around 50 per cent down to just over twenty per cent. Hospitalization and infections are declining the vaccine as administered. There are always useful idiots who get used to disrupt the country and used there exaggerated and fake news to back up their position. The last time I checked after my vaccination I did not only not grow an extra limb, I did not even glow in the dark. Maybe I died and I just do not know it.

I personally know people who got very sick with Covid-19. I do not know anyone who has had a vaccine problem. This is a small city of 22,000 and news travel fast if something does not work like a vaccine problem.  I have not heard of a single complaint.

[BillyB]

This is just a anti vaccine propaganda thing in the USA among right extremists who are useful idiots for the anarchists who want to destroy the country. 2.2 million people in the USA get the vaccine everyday and that number is ramping up. The number of people in the USA who are not willing to take the vaccine has dropped from November of around 50 per cent down to just over twenty per cent. Hospitalization and infections are declining the vaccine as administered. There are always useful idiots who get used to disrupt the country and used there exaggerated and fake news to back up their position. The last time I checked after my vaccination I did not only not grow an extra limb, I did not even glow in the dark. Maybe I died and I just do not know it.

I personally know people who got very sick with Covid-19. I do not know anyone who has had a vaccine problem. This is a small city of 22,000 and news travel fast if something does not work like a vaccine problem.  I have not heard of a single complaint.

I showed you the FDA's and Pfizer's documents that show certain studies on safety haven't been concluded. One study pertains to reproductive toxicity. Knowing kids and young adults have almost a zero chance in dying from COVID, would you recommend them taking a vaccine that can ruin their ability to reproduce? I think you would because you bought into the narrative that vaccines are 100% safe. I've educated all my young immediate and extended family members. I hope you do the same for yours instead of asking them to inject a product into their bodies that hasn't finished all it's studies on safety.

[yankee]

This is just a anti vaccine propaganda thing in the USA among right extremists who are useful idiots for the anarchists who want to destroy the country. 2.2 million people in the USA get the vaccine everyday and that number is ramping up. The number of people in the USA who are not willing to take the vaccine has dropped from November of around 50 per cent down to just over twenty per cent. Hospitalization and infections are declining the vaccine as administered. There are always useful idiots who get used to disrupt the country and used there exaggerated and fake news to back up their position. The last time I checked after my vaccination I did not only not grow an extra limb, I did not even glow in the dark. Maybe I died and I just do not know it.

I personally know people who got very sick with Covid-19. I do not know anyone who has had a vaccine problem. This is a small city of 22,000 and news travel fast if something does not work like a vaccine problem.  I have not heard of a single complaint.

I showed you the FDA's and Pfizer's documents that show certain studies on safety haven't been concluded. One study pertains to reproductive toxicity. Knowing kids and young adults have almost a zero chance in dying from COVID, would you recommend them taking a vaccine that can ruin their ability to reproduce? I think you would because you bought into the narrative that vaccines are 100% safe. I've educated all my young immediate and extended family members. I hope you do the same for yours instead of asking them to inject a product into their bodies that hasn't finished all it's studies on safety.

Billy, I am going to side with Texan77 on this issue.  I get my second shot tomorrow.  Sometimes the need of the many outweigh the need of the few.

[AvHdB]

For a couple days now I have read a bit from different sides regarding the vaccine types, both pro and con. I still am not convinced that there is an approach, headlong lemming over the cliff rush, to get vaccinated is wise.

But here is food for thought, from various posters I have read in the past a strong resistance to consuming GMO foods whether animal or plant. I recognize there is a difference between the vaccines and food production. In the end though we are on some what the same slope, in my opinion.

Understand I am not advocating don't get vaccinated, but perhaps we should be more cautious.

[Markje]

Gmo is not just about genetics. Its also about patents and fair price for food.

[AvHdB]

Gmo is not just about genetics. Its also about patents and fair price for food.

Very true, some of the producers are monopolistic to say the best of there practices.

[BillyB]

Billy, I am going to side with Texan77 on this issue.  I get my second shot tomorrow.  Sometimes the need of the many outweigh the need of the few.

If you're at the age where you may have 10% chance of dying if you get COVID, I don't blame you for getting the second shot. If you're in your 20's, have almost no chance of dying and want to have healthy kids someday, best to hold off from getting an mRNA vaccine. Like the vaccine expert I mentioned previously, I hope we don't do harm to humanity. If something goes wrong, we can't take it back.

Some people, usually religious people, are against the Johnson and Johnson vaccine because it has fetal tissue and DNA in it.

[Texan77]

You need to know that there is over a 150 ships off the LA coast waiting to get off loaded. The USA ports on the west coast are so backed up every time a ship get off loaded more arrive waiting. Locks along the Ohio river are also back up with often as much as a 150 barge tows at each lock containing up to twelve barges trying to get thru our out dated lock system. Get on Craig list and see there is no end to trucking companies trying to hire truckers because there is so much fright to be moved. Every major business is betting on this vaccine is going to work and the USA will completely open up and is ordering goods, parts. and anything else that ships.  The vaccine works.

One of the trouble you have is you are only looking a death number with paying any attentions to how many people the disease effects seriously who do not die from it. When it is thought that bloods clots come from the vaccine you feel it is a serious problem but many covid-19 patients without symptoms also get bloods clots and that point you totally miss. Even navy ships with only young people on them have enough people get sick enough that the ship can not function. 

When you are my age there is a problem that is still much more likely than dying. That is to have ended up never recovering from the disease and having the rest of my life being disabled. This is true at all age groups but since the death rate is higher on old people this happens a very lot among the retired. The death rate is only a small part of what covid-19 does.

We need to open up for business and stop sending everyone checks while there is still a country to open up and the USA dollar still buys anything. The vaccine needs to work and this country needs to be completely open where no one has any fears of being safe when shopping, visit friends and going to events. It is very good we are on track for that to happen.

[BillyB]

When it is thought that bloods clots come from the vaccine you feel it is a serious problem but many covid-19 patients without symptoms also get bloods clots and that point you totally miss.

A number of European nations have suspended their vaccination programs for weeks so they can investigate a blood clot issue with the AstraZeneca vaccine. If you disagree with them, write them a letter. I don't know about those nations but I do know the American government hasn't approved one COVID vaccine yet. They've only given emergency use authorization to some vaccines.

We need to open up for business and stop sending everyone checks while there is still a country to open up and the USA dollar still buys anything. The vaccine needs to work and this country needs to be completely open where no one has any fears of being safe when shopping, visit friends and going to events. It is very good we are on track for that to happen.

Then let's open up! We don't need a vaccine to do so. I know people who have been vaccinated and they have to still wear a mask and social distance just like the unvaccinated people. Vaccines won't last forever. If the government says you need two shots every three months or our economy will suffer, you'd believe it?

We need to deal with reality. Some people won't take vaccines made with new technology. Some people won't take vaccines made with DNA and tissue from babies and monkeys. Some people are simply anti vaccine and some people just don't trust our government telling us what to do, especially after the election rigging.

[BillyB]

Who gets the say when we open up?