starting over, how would you begin?

[Donhollio]

The most DEFINITE thing I'd begin with is finding an attorney who could craft an absolute bulletproof pre nuptial agreement.  Second I would have it professionally translated it into Russian. Finally, I would find the most competent Russian attorney available and hire him/her to represent my fiancées interest and explain the document completely.  She would sign it or there would be no marriage.  Period.

Only a fool would fail to follow this advice.

 I take it things are not going very well?

I would avoid the MOB industry cities like Kiev, Odessa and Nikolayev. Those cities
have a dedicated industry designed to suck your money and send you home high
and dry.

Maybe avoid the agency's in Odessa, I never found them to useful. However they typical girl in Odessa is quite normal, very proud of their city. Try to get contacts not involved and you'll do just fine.

[Volshe]

The most DEFINITE thing I'd begin with is finding an attorney who could craft an absolute bulletproof pre nuptial agreement.  Second I would have it professionally translated it into Russian. Finally, I would find the most competent Russian attorney available and hire him/her to represent my fiancées interest and explain the document completely.  She would sign it or there would be no marriage.  Period.

Only a fool would fail to follow this advice.

 I take it things are not going very well?

Oops, i am sorry for being insensitive, i thought it a generic advice... Sorry 

[2tallbill]

You can find jaded girls anywhere. I would not cross these places off simply because of their association with the worst of the MOB industry. I met just one girl from Kiev, and she is now my wife.
To add to that: she is simply the best.

I agree that you can find an excellent girl from Kiev or Odessa as well as
that you can find a jaded girl anywhere.

[TomT]

The most important thing to remember is that it wouldn't be fair to expect someone to live up to the image that you have of your late wife. Not only is the image likely to be idealized but there is a tendency to see people as we wish that they were, not as they are. It would be pretty easy to project qualities onto someone that they lack. Expect to be grilled, as soon as you disclose that you are a widower, and, for God's sake, don't address anyone by the wrong name!

[Slumba]

You can find jaded girls anywhere. I would not cross these places off simply because of their association with the worst of the MOB industry. I met just one girl from Kiev, and she is now my wife.
To add to that: she is simply the best.

I agree that you can find an excellent girl from Kiev or Odessa as well as
that you can find a jaded girl anywhere.

Yes but on the ground experience, from e.g. ChristianV, seems to indicate that Odessa girls that are quality, are rare.  On the other hand, Sashathecat married a girl from Odessa, and AJ - a girl from Nikolayev.

[d672]

 Tom Cat, so sorry for your loss. I wish you the best in your new search. 

[cufflinks]

Tom Cat, so sorry for your loss. I wish you the best in your new search. 

TC very sorry for your tragic loss... curious is Tuberculosis exposure common with FSUW?

You may find this post useful:

http://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php?topic=21685.msg380942;highlight=erudite#msg380942

[Tom Cat]

The most important thing to remember is that it wouldn't be fair to expect someone to live up to the image that you have of your late wife. Not only is the image likely to be idealized but there is a tendency to see people as we wish that they were, not as they are. It would be pretty easy to project qualities onto someone that they lack. Expect to be grilled, as soon as you disclose that you are a widower, and, for God's sake, don't address anyone by the wrong name!

This is sound advice, I have noticed that I am looking for a woman so very different from my late wife.
Before blondes were my first choice now dark hair catches my attention.
Many of the physical features would be much different.
I don't want to replace the past, I want to start new
 I'm still in the early stages of the search and have sent just a few intro letters.
I did mention the passing of my wife and the ladies are respectful of this.

[Tom Cat]

Tom Cat, so sorry for your loss. I wish you the best in your new search. 

TC very sorry for your tragic loss... curious is Tuberculosis exposure common with FSUW?

You may find this post useful:

http://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php?topic=21685.msg380942;highlight=erudite#msg380942

Cufflinks,
I really couldn't tell you how common it is,
But I can say that this never would have happened with proper treatment.
What happened is she got antibiotics from the pharmacy and took till she felt better.
She didn't take the proper dosage, the TB, came back and antibiotics no longer had any effect.
This is what I was told, but I have some doubts and will never know for sure.

I read the link, and I have in the past done much the same with AWEB,
I now use another site that is very little cost, many of the same ladies,and much easier to know if you're communicating with the real lady or a young girl just trying to make money 

[Tom Cat]

A few months ago, I reopened a profile on a PPL site.
In the short time it's been active, there is over 13,000 messages
It's good for a laugh, but it also helps greatly to eliminate those pesky agency letters.
For a small monthly fee,I can read unlimited messages.
Being I'm searching for a more mature woman it's easy by reading most messages are written by immature minds.
After a short time there are patterns develop where the same ladies will message during the same short period of time.

Just by reading and using common sense, I can get a feel for which ladies did or didn't write me.

I am still months away from planning an actual trip so I have just contacted a couple ladies that I couldn't tell their sincerity.
As expected generic letters come every day.

I will not waste time by communicating to soon.
4 to 6 weeks is plenty, then get on the plane.

[redroo]

TC, I also would like to add my thoughts and best wishes for your future.
Losing a spouse (or child) is something that shatters our lives for ever.
Lives eventually come back together,and go on to new and different paths, but you can still feel the scars/joins.
We don't get "over" things, we get "on" with things. Hopefully as better, more reflective people.
Cherish your happy memories,
and as a much wiser man than me said;
"May your choices reflect your hopes, and not your fears"
Nelson Mandela

[sharonhaber00]

Cufflinks,
I really couldn't tell you how common it is,
But I can say that this never would have happened with proper treatment.
What happened is she got antibiotics from the pharmacy and took till she felt better.
She didn't take the proper dosage, the TB, came back and antibiotics no longer had any effect.
This is what I was told, but I have some doubts and will never know for sure.

It does make sense. Patients tend to withdraw with antibiotics prematurely when they feel better. Problem is antibiotic is a poison who designed to kill bacteria, but it doesn't heal the body, hence it doesn't remove the reason for the illness (weak immune system). It way kill some of the bacteria or most of them. If the full dosage is not taken - more bacteria will survive, and they will develop RESISTANCE. Hence the same antibiotic is not effective anymore. In this case they should change the substance that is ingested.

Sorry for you loss

Good luck in your search.       

[sashathecat]

I am deeply sorry for your loss Tom. I do not know what I would do should this ever occur.

curious is Tuberculosis exposure common with FSUW?

Tuberculosis is very common in Ukraine. They say it is an epidemic and there are numerous sanatoriums dedicated to housing the patients.

What is the monthly costs of an apartment in kiev,or Odessa?

Unlike many here I would not rule out Odessa, especially if planning on living there. My wife mentioned an apartment that would meet our needs could run $400-500 per month. This would be one a bit under the standards of the apartments they rent to Westerners.

What happened is she got antibiotics from the pharmacy and took till she felt better.
She didn't take the proper dosage, the TB, came back and antibiotics no longer had any effect.
This is what I was told, but I have some doubts and will never know for sure.

 Patients tend to withdraw with antibiotics prematurely when they feel better. Problem is antibiotic is a poison who designed to kill bacteria, but it doesn't heal the body, hence it doesn't remove the reason for the illness (weak immune system). It way kill some of the bacteria or most of them. If the full dosage is not taken - more bacteria will survive, and they will develop RESISTANCE. Hence the same antibiotic is not effective anymore. In this case they should change the substance that is ingested.       

There is currently a drug resistant strain of TB in Ukraine as well which is very worrying.

http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736%2814%2961914-0/fulltext

[Tom Cat]

I am deeply sorry for your loss Tom. I do not know what I would do should this ever occur.

curious is Tuberculosis exposure common with FSUW?

Tuberculosis is very common in Ukraine. They say it is an epidemic and there are numerous sanatoriums dedicated to housing the patients.

What is the monthly costs of an apartment in kiev,or Odessa?

Unlike many here I would not rule out Odessa, especially if planning on living there. My wife mentioned an apartment that would meet our needs could run $400-500 per month. This would be one a bit under the standards of the apartments they rent to Westerners.

What happened is she got antibiotics from the pharmacy and took till she felt better.
She didn't take the proper dosage, the TB, came back and antibiotics no longer had any effect.
This is what I was told, but I have some doubts and will never know for sure.

 Patients tend to withdraw with antibiotics prematurely when they feel better. Problem is antibiotic is a poison who designed to kill bacteria, but it doesn't heal the body, hence it doesn't remove the reason for the illness (weak immune system). It way kill some of the bacteria or most of them. If the full dosage is not taken - more bacteria will survive, and they will develop RESISTANCE. Hence the same antibiotic is not effective anymore. In this case they should change the substance that is ingested.       

There is currently a drug resistant strain of TB in Ukraine as well which is very worrying.

http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736%2814%2961914-0/fulltext

The official cause of death was terberuloses, but I think her illness was caused by breathing in toxic chemicals from the fires of 2010 which surrounded Moscow.
We lived just outside the ring in southeast Moscow.
If ever there was hell on earth it was there.
I will never forget the odors that filled the air.
Her youngest son was hospitalized because of his severe asthma
My wife soon after developed a slight cough and over time got worse.
If you have ever gotten medical treatment in Moscow you will find that they are very quick to pick out an illnesses and weather or not you have it your gonna get treated for it

[Donhollio]

 Tom Cat, thanks for telling us how she died. I think many of us were curious. TB takes time to leave the body. A strict Rx treatment must be followed, otherwise the results will not be achieved. 

You can find jaded girls anywhere. I would not cross these places off simply because of their association with the worst of the MOB industry. I met just one girl from Kiev, and she is now my wife.
To add to that: she is simply the best.

I agree that you can find an excellent girl from Kiev or Odessa as well as
that you can find a jaded girl anywhere.

Yes but on the ground experience, from e.g. ChristianV, seems to indicate that Odessa girls that are quality, are rare.  On the other hand, Sashathecat married a girl from Odessa, and AJ - a girl from Nikolayev.

 I'll add that the circles I moved in while in Odessa the girls were all quality. Having the flakey girls (I think that is the word he used) was rare for me. Sipping coffee on Deribaskova and trying to get a girls attention, wouldn't be my idea of a plan to find a date.

[Tom Cat]

The best strategy for one person isn't necessarily the best strategy for another.

There are many strategies to find an FSUW to Marry.
The two primary strategies are to visit one girl or visit many

Visit one girl

This has been my primary strategy. I write many girls, I eliminate all of them
except for one girl. I write her every day, I skype with her, call her, send her
sms and focus entirely on her. Then I get on a plane and I visit her.

This strategy is high risk and high reward. You spend a lot of time getting to
know this girl and she has spent a lot of time getting to know you.
If you have mutual chemistry then you will have an amazing time together.

However, if there isn't any chemistry, or if you don't like each other you
are now alone far from home and you have to start all over again.

In the past this was the method I used,and it does work fairly well,there are some flaws I encountered.

This method is best used with women that are near fluent in the language you are communicating.
All the ladies I wrote had good English skills, but even then there were times misunderstanding caused some very frustrating moments.
It's much easier to explain in person than the days of silence that can happen with Skype or email.
 Another flaw is you do invest a large amount of time, and you still might be shocked when you do meet.

I had a very nice lady from northern Siberia, fluent in English long blonde hair.
Very beautiful woman.
We decided to meet in st.Petersburg .
Being I felt I knew her well we planned a family meeting, she had a young daughter and I have 2 young daughters.

I was in complete shock when I seen her at the airport.
She had very short hair looked much older.
This I could have over looked.
What I could not get beyond was her very large popka.
I think it had its own gravitational pull.
We made the best of our 2 weeks, our daughters had a great time together.
I was very glad we had our children there.
Even if there was no chemistry the children made for a good time together.

[2tallbill]

In the past this was the method I used,and it does work fairly well,there are some flaws I encountered.

This method is best used with women that are near fluent in the language you are communicating.
All the ladies I wrote had good English skills, but even then there were times misunderstanding caused some very frustrating moments.
It's much easier to explain in person than the days of silence that can happen with Skype or email.
 Another flaw is you do invest a large amount of time, and you still might be shocked when you do meet.

I had a very nice lady from northern Siberia, fluent in English long blonde hair.
Very beautiful woman.
We decided to meet in st.Petersburg .
Being I felt I knew her well we planned a family meeting, she had a young daughter and I have 2 young daughters.

I was in complete shock when I seen her at the airport.
She had very short hair looked much older.
This I could have over looked.
What I could not get beyond was her very large popka.
I think it had its own gravitational pull.

I've been surprised myself back in the day (2005) before I knew about Skype.
The girl used 10 year old photos appearing both young and thin. When I met
her in person I could see that she aged well but her poppa had grown several
sizes larger.

Note: this is my opinion and advice as opposed to rock solid facts.

If you are going to visit one girl you want to get her on Skype as soon as possible
so that the hair or the Popka won't be surprises. I wouldn't agree to visit any girl
WOVO without skype conversations.

On a visit many trip you just write one letter. Once you meet you can size her up
in seconds. If she is tubby no worries just send her away and meet the next girl. On a
visit one trip not seeing her on Skype in advance is far too expensive to make in my
opinion. If a girl refuses, I dump her and move on.

Udachi!


Bill

[Boris]

Does your post mean what I think it means?

Unfortunately my wife died suddenly last January from tuberculosis.

Sorry, TC...

[kcalipso]

i would just wish you luck, you will need it....  dedicating energy, time, money, emotional involvement for nothing can be discouraging and damage your motivation sharply little by little... till giving up.

[Slumba]

i would just wish you luck, you will need it....  dedicating energy, time, money, emotional involvement for nothing can be discouraging and damage your motivation sharply little by little... till giving up.

You might do better by noticing that he was already happily married to an FSUW, and ask yourself what perspective or behavior that he engaged in, that allowed him to be successful.

[AvHdB]

The most important thing to remember is that it wouldn't be fair to expect someone to live up to the image that you have of your late wife. Not only is the image likely to be idealized but there is a tendency to see people as we wish that they were, not as they are. It would be pretty easy to project qualities onto someone that they lack. Expect to be grilled, as soon as you disclose that you are a widower, and, for God's sake, don't address anyone by the wrong name!

Top Cat,

My sympathy for your loss.

Tom gives some good advice. I would like to add something. For those who have loved once, they often know better what is love. Unfortunately many who wander in this search have to many fantasies. And for some it seems with women of the former Soviet Union love grows slower. But it is there for you to grasp.

Go slow and you will find a woman of quality and unless you date a woman with your wife's first name take care. That will be a deal killer.

[Tom Cat]

i would just wish you luck, you will need it....  dedicating energy, time, money, emotional involvement for nothing can be discouraging and damage your motivation sharply little by little... till giving up.

Kcalipso,
A positive attitude ,goes a long way to success.
If you have been blessed to have had a relationship with a lady from the FSU you would understand what warm and caring women they are.

This is not an easy process but the rewards are worth it.
You don't always find happiness the first time, but if you don't give up, you might  feel like your the luckiest   man in the world.

[between]

Much has changed since I first started 10 years ago'
seems there are some here who think that the glory days of the day at work butRussian bride industry have long gone, but I see things to be changing in a more positive way.

Maybe the traditional ways are a thing of the past, but current events could bring a new revival to the Russian brides industry.

My question is, how would you start your search?
What sites would you use?
Which countries, cities?
 
I am doing everything that has been said to be the most difficult.
I am using pay per letter sites, placing my efforts in Ukraine,
I am doing this because , I want to show others that this is not rocket science.
There are thousands of women available, and I will show you just how easy it is!

Tom, this is dillusional thinking. Sorry but there, I said it.

The MOB business is a total scam from top to bottom.
The western facing sites are about making money ONLY. THe girls are the bait. Its all BS.

Many years have passed since this Ukraine thing got started, and it is an industry dominated by Amastasia Date. Nothing more. Yes you may actually tickle the interest of a girl with just enough to get her to "marry" you, if that is the right word for a financial relationship resulting from misrepresentation, exploitation of western men and outright fraud, but the chances are so slim you are most likely to waste years and thousands.

I met many wonderful Ukraine women. NONE of them are from the MOB industry. The perception that Ukraine women are unique in some way is TOTALLY misplaced and the product of pure hype. Almost any Eastern European country would be a better choice.

[Tom Cat]

 
(Quote)

Tom, this is dillusional thinking. Sorry but there, I said it.

The MOB business is a total scam from top to bottom.
The western facing sites are about making money ONLY. THe girls are the bait. Its all BS.

Many years have passed since this Ukraine thing got started, and it is an industry dominated by Amastasia Date. Nothing more. Yes you may actually tickle the interest of a girl with just enough to get her to "marry" you, if that is the right word for a financial relationship resulting from misrepresentation, exploitation of western men and outright fraud, but the chances are so slim you are most likely to waste years and thousands.




Between,

Thanks for taking the time to write your thoughts about the MOB.
I will agree the marketing is deceptive, but it's not a total scam.

It's only a scam if you allow yourself to be scammed.
I have used Aweb in the past and met a very wonderful woman, that never tried to take advantage of me.

You might think I'm delusional, but I am very rational in my strategy.

I  can agree finding a serious women under the age of 30 on an MOB site would be a very difficult task.
But I'm looking for women in their late 30s and older.
By the time I complete the vetting processes, I would think she will be a woman in her mid 40s

This eliminates roughly 90+ percent of the ladies on a given site.

I dated women from Ukraine and Russia, my wife was from Tajikistan.
There is a difference between each country if you spend enough time there, you will also see a difference in the women from each country.

[between]

But I'm looking for women in their late 30s and older.

Tom, with the greatest respect, you are not making any sense.
30 somethings are that societies outcasts. They are thick on the ground as no one wants them.

This eliminates roughly 90+ percent of the ladies on a given site.

my point exactly. You are looking in the wrong place if 90% of the women are disqaulified right off the bat (probably more like 98%)

The MOB business is not a good option for any of us over 40. Its an expensive waste of time.

Your question: "How should I go about this" is within the MOB business is moot.