Two Trips to UA and Going Back Again

[anotheropus]

Hello good people.

I would like to share my limited experiences; and I think add some positive light to a few topics.

I've been to UA twice. I stayed in Kiev, Rivne, Odessa and Ivano-Frankivsk. I visited the Carpathians and had that wonderful shastlik on a very pleasant picnic afternoon in nature. And if you can find a really good shaw-arma... get it!

I met several ladies on several agencies and corresponded, chatted, texted, and phone called like I needed to do it to breathe and live. LOTS of money gone... The first time you experience agencies, and you get responses to your profiles and letters from the first 300+ super models at a rate of 20 to 60 letters per day--you QUICKLY start thinking you are just SPECIAL!

Time. Money. Lessons.

When I went over there I met a few ladies, some did not show up, some were mildly not as advertised, and most I met when I got there!

The best experiences I had with UA ladies was meeting random lovely ladies and striking up a conversation with them (me and all 400 RU words and about 30 common phrases memorized). I met them almost anywhere, and the simple, "Izviniy, guvareet pa Anglaski?" was an AMAZING door opener! I'm friends with several ladies via Skype till today.

You can walk up to them on Krashatik and start up a conversation. Sometimes it's an angry, "Nyet!" And a few minutes later your having lunch with one of the other super models that seem to be everywhere. [sidebar: Has anyone ever found the factory doors where all these super models pour out of?].

The three McDonald's in center gorod Kiev, are wonderful places to meet the girls working there!

If you do everything right, and you're a decent person, and half-way good looking, you're about a 10% celebrity if you speak EN as a native when in UA.

Here's where I stayed:
Kiev - Hotel Rus
Rivne - Hotel MYP
Odessa - Black Sea Hotel (the one in town), and also an apartment
Ivano-Frankivsk - Hotel Nadiya

And what about the agencies? Anastasia, NatashaClub, OdessaDarlings, and two or three other's I've forgotten by now.

I met one Odessa lady from Anastasia for two low cost and very pleasant, interpreted meetings. Despite all the posturing and perhaps several bad experiences, I've found Anastasia to be reliable but expensive--just get the ladies on the phone as soon as possible and get away from the agencies! About 40% + opf the ladies I get on the phone drop off the planet after a week or two anyway--those would be the "agency girls". Accept it, and file those costs under "Operating Losses".

I met one Rivne lady on NatashaClub, she turned out to be an interpreter for the local agency in  Rivne feeding NatashaClub, and I learned a lot from her. We had several fun days and went our separate ways as we discovered we weren't the ones for life for each other.

Two wonderful (and LOVELY) friends I have till today, I met as they worked at hotels; one in Kiev and the other in I-F. I enjoyed several dates with each of them and one even brought her STUNNING girlfriend (who is also a friend till today) with us on an all day, tour of Kiev date. That priceless and very memorable day only cost me a cab for a few hours, three metro tickets (you just have to ride 40 mph escalators and the 9 miles underground Kiev metro!) and a very affordable lunch at a wonderful cafe. If I had a groundhog day in life--I'd pick that one

Not that I noticed, but I heard about it later, those beaches I visited in Odessa were loaded with topless super models... GOD!!!!!!!!!!!

Of all the ladies I've met, none of them were "The One". So, I network through them, use agencies, and a couple of other avenues, and I apply well thought-out planning now.

I dumped tons of money into the first two experiences. Then I came back and started dating RU speaking ladies here at home. Would you believe it, the same "Excuse me, do you speak English?" asked in RU, works here too!!!! They light up and the universal response is an incredulous, "You speak Russian?!?!?" Which I always follow up with humor leading towards their smile and our first date, "Ya iz soyudzeeyomnich shtatif, e kaknibutzz, ya guvaru pa Ruskeya--nye munoga... non, ye ochin horoshow..."

I've dated lovely ladies from Moscow, Yaraslova, St. Petersberg, Lithuania, Ukraine, and actually ended up boyfriend girlfriend, living together for a year with a former CCCP, Sport Master gymnast from Minsk! That year would be a forum in itself!

The best advice I have is:

1. ONLY search for ladies with enough EN so that no interpreters are ever required--duh! I did this in all but one case--she was just subtly pretty and so very nice--not a prodater.

2. Load up your profile and first letter or two with every kind of filtering device you can think of--good and bad. 70% of the "I'm interested in yous" drop like flies.

3. I don't know if this is wise, as I've read everything everywhere against it, but I come right out and talk about EVERY subject you can imagine--including specific sexual topics. They almost always come back with something like, "Christopher, we will not discuss this topic--I will only talk about this with a man I'm married..." I respond, "No, we will talk about it because I am not going to give my life to a woman and after we're married--discover she's a fish." And a few more drop off... it really is a nice filter! The remainder, respond that I'm "...passionate, a lover, romantic, etc..." and they're even more interested to meet!

4. And after I've done these things, my favorite advice is to get their contact info ASAP and get away from the agency expenses. Ironically, in every case, with every girl I've met from every agency, NONE of them would leave their agency even when I was flying to meet them. I do not understand the magical power agencies have over these ladies... I hope when the right lady and I discover each other, we can do something at the US Embassy in Kiev (as part of the K1 process?) where we can receive UA state level authorization of agency release...

5. Learn Russian.

6. See number five, above.

7. Let them know you want their mom to come over and be a nanny for your children.

8. Use obvious photos on your agency profiles of you in RU speaking countries! Golden Tip!

9. Be a gentleman, and be a real man. Be confident, not arrogant, never crude, and never indecisive. You may want to research this one because this is the key to the whole thing with RU speaking ladies.

10. GO TO THE GYM EVERY DAY! I'm going on 45 and I use the gym like the world was going to end and I wanted to die with big muscles. Most guys desire an RU lady first because she's a dozen kgs lighter and leaner than the girl next door. Why would a lady, who knows she's attractive, desire a man who can't see his belt buckle? And if you've seen those young UA guys--just get your ass into the gym!

11. Here's one I'm wishing I wouldn't share--but, I'm a nice guy and this is going to cut into my gig!!!!! Look up above. See numbers five and six? Okay, now open up Google, look for something like "learn Russian online", or "practice Russian with Russian speaking people", and you get the idea! I have more RU speaking friends now than I can manage! Really. I have several ladies in several cities I Skype, phone, FB and email with, as well as a few really cool guys (one my who's like a grandfather to me) I'd like to meet. I haven't spent a DIME on the language sites! ...and I haven't spent a thing on agency sites!

12. Be honest. I know guys go over there for fun. Let the girls know that's what you're doing. Or if you're like me, let them know you are sincerely looking for a faithful wife, best friend and life partner! In fact (get ready to laugh!) I've never even kissed a Ukrainian lady!!! Pravda! GOD KNOWS I wanted to! But why waste the energy and build up something on the wrong one?

This could easily turn into a 100 list, but I'll stop here for now and add in more as I think of 'em.

Oh!

13. Dress to kill--masculine, and European style! HIGH quality, killer, slip-on dress shoes; nice belt and a good looking watch; Italian nicely fitted jeans ($$$), and classy fitted shirts or light sweaters that show you've got taste. In fact, just go to Milan first.

and

14. March 8th!

15. You'll sadly discover that many ladies have no desire to leave UA! Most of them know things are different there, but it's also their comfort zone...

I hope this post helped a few of you laugh (and not always at me ))) and a few others learn a few things.

Thanks for your time,

Christopher

[el_guero]

Nice,

welcome to the site.

[Eduard]

Hi Chris, and welcome to the site.
Although I enjoyed your post - well written, nice sense of style and humor, still you come off as "your way is the best way! It really works!". Meanwhile you are still single and searching, and I might add have a lot to learn. On ne hand you do give some good advice, like keeping yourself in good shape and dressing nicely (although flying to Milan to by clothes might be a bit too much IMO). On the other hand you seem to be surprised that the "agency girls" don't want to get away from their agency... the answer is pretty obvious - many of them meet guys like you, who use agencies, to pay their rent. Why would they want their cash flow cut off?
I appload your efforts to learn Russian. It definitely improves your chances but I'm afraid that your advice to "not use translators" isn't very wise. Sure using a few Russian words and talking to them in broken Russian will make the girls smile, some will give you their numbers, some will even go out on dates with you. I encourage my clients to learn Russian as much as they can, and I've had several who speak your level of Russian. They try to spend as much onioning time as possible with their girls but as soon as they need to have a deeper discussion my phone always rings and it's: "Ed can you join us for dinner, we need to discuss a few important issues and don't want any misunderstandings".  I assure you, that if you ever do find that special gal that you might consider a long term relationship with, your very limited Russian and her very limited English will be just enough to get your budding relationship in trouble. I see this happen every day. some of my clients get on Skype with the girls to soon just after they exchanged 3 or 4 letters. They chat on Skype a couple of times and oops, the girl doesn't wanna talk to them any longer. I found that there are 2 reasons for that.

1. They chat, there is a misunderstanding, the girl thinks that he is weird, the girl disappears.
2. And this one is very common - they've only exchanged 3 or 4 letters at this point and they were in perfect Russian (translated by me), revealing his sense of humor, nice personality, etc. Now that they are chatting in English and she has to struggle to understand and speak it, or use an on line translator constantly, it becomes a bit too much of a struggle. At this point she just exchanged a few messages with you and has absolutely no feelings invested in you. If she is attractive she has plenty of local guys who write her and it's only logical that she might chose the easier, more sure thing: drop you and chat with local guys.

Chris, communication IS the key to success in this. And once you are passed the first couple of dates, unless there is fantastic chemistry and sex is out if this world and  you both become completely addicted to being with each other, you both will need to get into deeper discussions in order to understand whether you can consider each other a potential mate for life. Surely there are exceptions to this rule, but I know RW pretty well, and they have to know where you are coming from on a deeper level to seriously consider you to be her potential husband. Do you realize how important of a decision it is for a woman to uproot from where she was born and raised, has family, friends, career, etc and come to an unfamiliar country where she doesn't know any one, has no support system and the only person in the world she can trust and count on is you? Do you honestly think that a few phrases like:  "Izviniy, guvareet pa Anglaski?" or "Ya iz soyudzeeyomnich shtatif, e kaknibutzz, ya guvaru pa Ruskeya--nye munoga... non, ye ochin horoshow..." will get her there?

Another thing,
you seem very comfortable starting a conversation and even do it on the street. Good for you! But do you realize that not ALL men are comfortable with doing that? I've done it, but even I would have to have "the right" situation where there is an opening to say something funny or to ask a question. I find that meeting somebody interesting and with substance are better if you do this on line first and definitely not through those MOB agencies that you advocate here.

You seem to be a DYI guy and very comfortable with going at it the way you have been. And very possibly you will find your wife after a bunch of trips. Or maybe not... But IMHO you shouldn't be talking like this is the only way to skin the cat and one size fits all.

[MBS01]

Having read the initial post the best advise that one can give is:

GET OFF THE PAY SITES!!!  Move to the Free Sites then you can begin to save money and actually connect and get to know real ladies and not just the agency types that are making a career of fleesing guys like you that cannot think or do outside the box.

As noted as soon as possible manage to do it without a translator.  However this takes a lot of paticence that many people do not have.  We spend time with another fellow a few years ago and just did not have the paticence to go slow in communication with the ladies he was meeting.  Some of them seemed very nic and would liked to have found a man in their life, but he could not slow down to the point of working as a team with them in order to move forward to creating a realationship.  Note he was well educated and already spoke 3 or more languages, but just could not handle working with someone who did not know one of the ones he spoke.

Looking back it is almost a wonder how we managed with a simple dictionary between us in the beginning.  Of course once you find a jewel in the rough do help her with her English (or your native language) lessons so that your future visits will move forward better.

[anotheropus]

Hello good people

Thank you for your replies!

I'd hope each person would look at as many approaches as possible and hybridize the method that seems to work best for them. Please forgive me if my writing indicated that I was advocating "only" my methods ...I didn't intend for it to come off that way.

Even with that said, I absolutely DO INSIST that you get your butt into a gym! I lost 43 pounds of fat (not weight--I lost FAT WEIGHT see http://www.tomvenuto.com), and I gained visible muscle for the first time in my life! It took almost a year to gain the discipline to loose the fat. And for three years I've gone to the gym regularly.

See my photos below and you can see I'm no athlete (or model)--but the gym work made a difference!!!

And, here's an update!

I met a wonderful friend, Olga, on a language site (http://www.busuu.com) and we discovered we liked spending time together. When I met her I wasn't looking because it's not an agency! I was exploring yet another no cost way to build up my RU language skills.... but when I saw her eyes I fell in love! [yes you read that correctly--on the internet, in a photo of a face, and only her eyes!]

One thing led to another and we started Skyping daily. Then we found out we REALLY liked each other. Talks became more and more serious... but she pushed me back and pushed me back. Olga had (and has) no interest to immigrate to US. She's going back to university to earn a second masters degree in teaching EN and children. Finally I realized I wanted to at least meet her! I told her I was coming to UA and she would be the first lady I wanted to meet. She said, "Ha! I'm glad I'm not the last lady you want to meet!" After a few more weeks I made up my mind that I only wanted to meet her and pursue her for life together.

So I decided to move to her! See http://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php?topic=15581.0

One day after Olga and I had realized we both want life together she told me, "I can't imagine how my life would be if you listened to me and stopped pursuing me. Thank you for not giving up on me."

Olga told me yesterday that she really began to be very interested in me when I told her I would only see her and that I was determined to win her attention.

Skipping, skipping, skipping, I now live and work in Ukraine, we have an apartment, and we've gone through the amazing UA bureacratic hoops and we're getting married in her home town Saturday, November 19, 2011!!!

I wish everyone the best of luck. Simple phrases and my approach sometimes works.

Christopher

BTW I don't know about Russian speaking women, but for me age does not matter. I'm not bothered at all by the fact that I'm 45 and Olga is 29 (15.5 years younger than me). It hasn't lessened my opinion of her ever. 

[Bruce Lee]

Congrats Chris and good luck with the rest of your adventure, hopefully you will keep us posted

[Donhollio]

 Hi Chris, where the hell is that beach?     You're right about the beaches in Odessa, some even have little kova waitresses bring you food and beer. 

 So what is your game plan while living in UA? How are you able to keep in a positive cash flow?  Are you planning on living there for years?

[Slumba]

It all sounds very exciting!  I am looking forward to hearing more!  I certainly agree about the gym part - I am nowhere near your level of fitness but have lost some 30 lbs and am starting to feel better about the 10-year age gap (me 40 - targets are 30), should I be able to drop some more and add more muscle.

[calmissile]

Anotheropus,
I really enjoyed your post.  This is the kind of post that is helpful to our newbies..... A post that describes a detailed account of one persons experience and methods.  I am not sure why Ed is so sensitive. You did not say it was the ONLY way to go about this adventure, it was YOUR way.

I am in agreement with your approach and hope you find what you are looking for.  I am in particular agreement with your 'laying it out on the table" in the beginning.  My philosphy is that if they don't want to talk about some subject until much later (and expenses) in the relationship, then they probably are not the type of communicator I want in a wife anyway.  For me it saved me a lot of time and money to determine if they are serious and compatible without having to make a career out of dating (like some of our members).

For those without your social skills there are other options such as a wingman (Ed, etc).  You seem to have the skills to accomplish your mision and I doubt you will be spending a lot of time and money finding your bride.

Good luck!

[anotheropus]

Thank you my friends!

Olga and I will be married in 20 days! ...IN UKRAINE!

Calmissle - Thank you for your comments Life is tooooo short to be so serious and sensitive about things I hope everyone can find happiness and love regardless of their path. Yes, I put everything up front with all the ladies in my life and Olga was no exception. In fact I feel I've been more open and purposeful with her because I realized right away that she was different and special.

Slumba - With age gaps we need advantages! The gym and being a gentleman help! And most importantly, finding that "golden middle" where your a real man (strong but not rude or abusive) balanced with genuine care. RU/UA men our age typically carry around the results of their wonderful, delicious diets! We must sacrifice! We can't have our 30 somethings eyeing the 20 somethings on the beach while sitting with us!

Even so, I've gained 2.5 Kgs since I've been here a month! Olga and her mom and sister keep trying to fatten me up so my face is more round ("handsome") to them. I smile, and because I want to be polite, I DEVOUR all the delicious food they make for me

Money. If you have money and you're in the game for a trophy and not pursuing love and happiness, UA and RU are definitely the places for your hunting! I've found 50% +/- of UA RU ladies are real ladies. They're affectionate, loving, supportive and faithful. The others... well, bring cash and get ready to party. Me? I have no money. I've been in IT since 1993, in California and Colorado. If you find a chart somewhere you'll see that these specific economies have not been rewarding to the masses, only the top is rewarded in this life . I've used up my retirement investments and lost a (VERY NICE) house to foreclosure. I'm starting life over.

Donhollio - Oh, you're going to kick me HARD! My income comes from inside UA, in an IT company (a UA IT company!)--I've read your posts. I know I'm taking the less traveled path! I'll consider posting my income, budget and expense for others to marvel at! Trust me. Everyone will be stunned at what Olga and I accomplish. My income is above average for a UA worker. It is WAY below average for an American who would work in UA for an American IT company (I.e. MS, Intel, etc.), WAY BELOW. As for US standards I live well below the US poverty level! But I live in Ukraine and I have an amazing partner. So we manage to live comfortably and without luxury.

The beach is in Alupka, below Voroncov Palace and park. I LOVE THE PARK!!!!! But the beach is difficult to enjoy as it has many large hidden, submerged rocks and it goes into the water deep pretty quick. But when your love is with you, and she wears a thong, and ... and ... I LOVE UKRAINE!

I'm planning to live in Ukraine for many years. And we want to start our family here. I want our kids to be proud Ukrainian Americans. We're on track to get my TRV temporary resident visa and then a PRV permanent resident visa. I'll write about those processes and experiences in another post. In short,

• I'm here for 90 days (for any reason according to the new September 10, 2011 UA laws - http://ukraine.usembassy.gov/message_09122011.html).
• Then after were married, Olga and I take our stack of docs and proof of residency and marriage, to the local bureau and they stamp my passport for another SIX MONTHS.
• Ten or so days before that new expiration date (I.e. about 5.5 months from the marriage date and date of the new stamp), we go in again with docs and they stamp my passport again for another six months.
• Wash, rinse and repeat until I've been here two years.
• Now we show proof of residency for the two years, and proof of marriage for the two years, and I'm eligible to apply for a permanent resident visa. With the PRV I will have a UA passport that lets me come and go as I please in and out of UA. I can stay as long as I want as I'll then be a permanent resident.

A PRV will entitle the holder to everything except voting and citizenship. And I can keep my US Citizenship and passport [I already know what some of you little hummingbirds are thinking of writing--it's okay, sip your nectar and go criticize someone else. I've researched this extensively and literally and specifically spoke directly with the Consular Officer at the US Embassy, in Kiev, about this!]. And more importantly, I don't care. I'll have my PRV and a pretty little blue UA passport, WITH my US passport, while other people argue that I cannot do this

Bruce Lee - Thank you for your note! I hope to post often about real experiences. I've always appreciated the folks who post here and give real, useful and entertaining info! I like to contribute

And for all would be Moshes (husbands of an RU speaking lady). Get a plane ticket. Get away from the Internet. Go to life. Go to your favorite city (you only need one I.e. Nikolayev, Dnipro, Kharkov, Kherson, Ivano-Frankivsk, etc... stay off the treasure map path! Kiev, Odessa, etc.), hit the streets with style (don't dress like you do at the sports bar with your buddies! GQ magazine and the movie Hitch are your friends!), go to restaurants, shops, stores, abtekas, flower shops, cafes, supermarkets!!! ...ride buses, walk, walk, walk. Ukraine is a wonderful country with helpful people, and in one day of the above activities you will see more than 300 women you would DIE FOR! If you ask each of them any question, then youre 90% of the way to them! '

One thing men do not understand about women is that they're nervous as hell to talk to you! Be a gentleman. Be considerate. I am an average guy. I just asked one after another if they wanted to go to lunch. It's daytime. It's safe. In Ukraine and US, with RU ladies, I've batted 900!

Some times they say, "Sure, I'll be done with work in two hours. Meet me at X." You smile, say "Great! I'll be so happy to see you [then and there]". You leave and look back at her with a genuine happy smile. Then you worry for two hours that you'll be standing alone at [then and there]. Nope! She's there, maybe late, maybe early--but it's okay because YOU ARE EARLY.

You walk in the city and she talks about things there. She is proud of her city and likes her life there! She will want to talk about it. When she apologizes for anything about Ukraine (and she WILL--often), smile, look into her eyes, tell her the truth--that Ukraine is wonderful and she must never feel the need to apologize for Ukraine!

Finally you're sitting at a cafe with a woman your friends would never believe your with. And now she starts asking you questions about your life (and WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOING IN UKRAINE?). Be honest. Tell her you felt your heart was in Ukraine. You see that Ukrainian women care about their beauty and their families--and that this is the type of woman you want to spend your life faithfully with (she will not believe the faithful part--but she hopes its true because she's heard we're different men--BE FAITHFUL, she WILL BE for you). Don't forget to answer and respond with your own questions. It's called "conversation."

HAVE FUN, be sincere, joke at your own expense (but never be pathetic), and look into her eyes and smile. DO NOT look at all the other insanely beautiful, sexy women around you! She SEES YOUR EYES and SHE SEES all these other women, and [amazingly] SHE THINKS THEY'RE ALL PRETTIER THAN SHE IS. Look at her only, if she is the most beautiful woman you've ever had lunch with--tell her that as you look in her eyes and smile! Thank her for your amazing date with Miss Ukraine!

[STOP SMOKING! And do not drink more than two drinks--very slowly! Note: In Ukraine you do not need to smoke or buy cigarettes. You only need to walk on the street and breath in all the smoke from everyone's cigarettes]

If you both enjoy your time you can tell her you like her, you feel she's a kind person, genuine and a real lady (if you tell her this and it's true, and she knows it, you are on the fast track to MANY more dates and perhaps even your wonderful life partner). Then tell her (don't ask) that you'd like to see her tomorrow again (or later for dinner), and you want to meet her [this place at this time]. UA RU ladies do not like indecisive men.

TELL her you like her. TELL her you want to meet her again. TELL her when and where. The COOLEST thing about UA RU ladies is that if they don't like this idea they will tell you so! It will not be games and guessing! If she tells you she does not want to see you gain. That's it. But I'd bet she'll tell you "yes" and smile.

If she doesn't say no to YOU, then she only wants to meet you at another time and another place. So you say, "Great, we do not need to meet [this place this time], I want to meet you again, I like you (insert your smile and kind, honest eyes here)--do you want to meet me again? She will say yes. Tell her two options for days and times. If these are both "no", then you are free to ask her when she wants to meet you!

They're so happy to have a real gentleman with them for a date, who will speak English with them and who doesn't want to take them to his hotel or apartment and play hide the salami with her. Trust me, if you do this right and you are a real gentleman, you will enjoy experiences you have never even dreamed of yet!!! Don't push anything. These ladies are MORE PATIENT than you can imagine. And they're testing you as a real man every second with every action. Be the real man and you will live in heaven! [read that again... be patient, and you WILL LIVE IN HEAVEN]

I've done this again and again with super model looking ladies I was afraid to approach. It starts with a genuine smile when they see your eyes looking at their eyes. And then your eyes continue looking at her eyes and smiling as you boldly walk up to her and change both of your lives!

And this month I'm marrying my dream super model, MY Miss Ukraine!

Guys, everyone. It really is so easy. Watch the movie Hitch and watch Ricky Christina Barcelona! The cool, Spanish MAN (MAN MAN) walks up to two gorgeous girls. They ask him what he wants. So he tells them! "The three of us can go back to my place, drink some wine, make some love..." They may slap you and tell you "NO!" But, REAL woman LOVE this kind of confidence! [Girls and "tired" lesser women are not worth your time]. If you do not have this confidence, follow my recipe above and after one or two successful dates YOU WILL BE A CONFIDENT MAN! I was the same until I decided to TRY to be confident! And I'm AVERAGE in EVERY way--I will never win a three legged race alone, and I have almost NO money! But I'm genuine, sincere, contemplative (on occasion), creative, funny, sexy, handsome as the devil and absolutely, completely and almost embarrassingly modest to the core

I hope you will find love, happiness, confidence and peace!

Your friend,

Christopher

P.s. Yes, I'm surrounded by many beautiful, sexy amazing looking ladies, all day, everywhere, every day now. When I see them, I smile, see my beautiful Olga's eyes and image smiling at me, and realize I now live my happy life with the best one of them all. None of them can compare to my Miss Ukraine.

[msmoby]

Guys, everyone. It really is so easy. Watch the movie .... Ricky Christina Barcelona! The cool, Spanish MAN (MAN MAN) walks up to two gorgeous girls. They ask him what he wants. So he tells them! "The three of us can go back to my place, drink some wine, make some love..." They may slap you and tell you "NO!" But, REAL woman LOVE this kind of confidence! [Girls and "tired" lesser women are not worth your time]. If you do not have this confidence, follow my recipe above and after one or two successful dates YOU WILL BE A CONFIDENT MAN! I was the same until I decided to TRY to be confident! And I'm AVERAGE in EVERY way--I will never win a three legged race alone, and I have almost NO money! But I'm genuine, sincere, contemplative (on occasion), creative, funny, sexy, handsome as the devil and absolutely, completely and almost embarrassingly modest to the core

Christopher... it's Vicky Cristina Barcelona and it's a Woody Allen film...  a guy who's ideas on sex might not be considered 'the norm' ...

I'm a confident guy and not ugly, but such stunts work mostly in the world of ( some folks ) fantasy..

The handsome Spanish chap is Javier Bardem ...in real life his wife is his 'ex-wife' in the film..Penélope Cruz !!

[anotheropus]

Guys, everyone. It really is so easy. Watch the movie .... Ricky Christina Barcelona! The cool, Spanish MAN (MAN MAN) walks up to two gorgeous girls. They ask him what he wants. So he tells them! "The three of us can go back to my place, drink some wine, make some love..." They may slap you and tell you "NO!" But, REAL woman LOVE this kind of confidence! [Girls and "tired" lesser women are not worth your time]. If you do not have this confidence, follow my recipe above and after one or two successful dates YOU WILL BE A CONFIDENT MAN! I was the same until I decided to TRY to be confident! And I'm AVERAGE in EVERY way--I will never win a three legged race alone, and I have almost NO money! But I'm genuine, sincere, contemplative (on occasion), creative, funny, sexy, handsome as the devil and absolutely, completely and almost embarrassingly modest to the core

Christopher... it's Vicky Cristina Barcelona and it's a Woody Allen film...  a guy who's ideas on sex might not be considered 'the norm' ...

I'm a confident guy and not ugly, but such stunts work mostly in the world of ( some folks ) fantasy..

The handsome Spanish chap is Javier Bardem ...in real life his wife is his 'ex-wife' in the film..Penélope Cruz !!

THANK YOU for the correction! It's funny how your mind looses the US synapses once you're in UA!

I agree that what he did is not possible for every man--but it was inspirational! And ditto about W. Allen! But CHEERS to Woody for getting Penelope and Scarlet to have love scenes with each other... O...M...G...!

[Chris]

Chris, its refreshing to have someone like you come through our door once in a while rather than the scam hunters  socially challenged and simpletons that we seem to aquire all too regularly,    keep coming back 

[anotheropus]

Chris, its refreshing to have someone like you come through our door once in a while rather than the scam hunters  socially challenged and simpletons that we seem to aquire all too regularly,    keep coming back 

Thank you Chris!

Some people go out to dinner just knowing it's going to be a terrible evening. And they're usually right. I go out every day knowing that anything and everything can go wrong--but i hope and feel it will be wonderful. And I'm usually right.

And for anyone who thinks I look at the world through rose colored lenses, remember that I now live in Ukraine where I regularly travel from Donetsk to Gorlovka in cars with drivers I do not know, riding with passengers who like me have all paid our 20 odd grivnas to get a ride to the next city. And every day I ride in buses that are overloaded, beyond capacity and perhaps 10 or more years beyond their service life! It's cool to trust life.

And I'll really open up now. I was married to my best friend in 1989. Nine years later, at her age of 30, I lost her to our two year battle with her breast cancer. Less than one year later I was in a motorcycle accident, punctured a lung, broke many bones, and worst of all I had three vertebrates blown out (T3, T4 and T5), and my spinal cord was almost severed. I lay in ICU with a traumatic head injury (my helmet saved my life), and I was in diapers and needed a catheter to pee. The doctors did outrageous surgeries and told me I was now a T4 paraplegic and I'd never move my body again below my chest. Off to rehab at Northridge Hospital Medical Center and time to learn how to live life in my wheelchair. I wheeled up to the rooftop many nights seeking the courage to throw myself off of the seven story building. One day my foot twitched--BUT I FELT my foot twitch this time. I worked and finally could move that leg. I worked and I could walk with a walker and two people holding me, then a walker, then crutches, then a cane for 12 years. Today I cannot run, but I have walked without a cane for almost two years (thanks to aggressive gym work!)...and OMG it's hard as hell to walk on UA streets!!!!! But Olga is at my side, and while it looks like we're holding hands, now you know that she's often balancing me [see us waling down the steps at Vornonsov Palace, Alupka, Crimea--my Miss Ukraine is balancing me in more ways than one ]

If I can come and live in Ukraine, stumble along streets and marry this amazing Miss Ukraine--anyone can do this!

[sparky114]

Chris, its refreshing to have someone like you come through our door once in a while rather than the scam hunters  socially challenged and simpletons that we seem to aquire all too regularly,    keep coming back 

Thank you Chris!

Some people go out to dinner just knowing it's going to be a terrible evening. And they're usually right. I go out every day knowing that anything and everything can go wrong--but i hope and feel it will be wonderful. And I'm usually right.

And for anyone who thinks I look at the world through rose colored lenses, remember that I now live in Ukraine where I regularly travel from Donetsk to Gorlovka in cars with drivers I do not know, riding with passengers who like me have all paid our 20 odd grivnas to get a ride to the next city. And every day I ride in buses that are overloaded, beyond capacity and perhaps 10 or more years beyond their service life! It's cool to trust life.

And I'll really open up now. I was married to my best friend in 1989. Nine years later, at her age of 30, I lost her to our two year battle with her breast cancer. Less than one year later I was in a motorcycle accident, punctured a lung, broke many bones, and worst of all I had three vertebrates blown out (T3, T4 and T5), and my spinal cord was almost severed. I lay in ICU with a traumatic head injury (my helmet saved my life), and I was in diapers and needed a catheter to pee. The doctors did outrageous surgeries and told me I was now a T4 paraplegic and I'd never move my body again below my chest. Off to rehab at Northridge Hospital Medical Center and time to learn how to live life in my wheelchair. I wheeled up to the rooftop many nights seeking the courage to throw myself off of the seven story building. One day my foot twitched--BUT I FELT my foot twitch this time. I worked and finally could move that leg. I worked and I could walk with a walker and two people holding me, then a walker, then crutches, then a cane for 12 years. Today I cannot run, but I have walked without a cane for almost two years (thanks to aggressive gym work!)...and OMG it's hard as hell to walk on UA streets!!!!! But Olga is at my side, and while it looks like we're holding hands, now you know that she's often balancing me [see us waling down the steps at Vornonsov Palace, Alupka, Crimea--my Miss Ukraine is balancing me in more ways than one ]

If I can come and live in Ukraine, stumble along streets and marry this amazing Miss Ukraine--anyone can do this!

Our congratulations to you both  , we are not far away just over the border in Russia Taganrog, a truely amazing story of how you got here  but it is not the path it is the road you now tread good luck and long life

Mark & Elena

[ECR844]

Chris, its refreshing to have someone like you come through our door once in a while rather than the scam hunters  socially challenged and simpletons that we seem to aquire all too regularly,    keep coming back 

Thank you Chris!

Some people go out to dinner just knowing it's going to be a terrible evening. And they're usually right. I go out every day knowing that anything and everything can go wrong--but i hope and feel it will be wonderful. And I'm usually right.

And for anyone who thinks I look at the world through rose colored lenses, remember that I now live in Ukraine where I regularly travel from Donetsk to Gorlovka in cars with drivers I do not know, riding with passengers who like me have all paid our 20 odd grivnas to get a ride to the next city. And every day I ride in buses that are overloaded, beyond capacity and perhaps 10 or more years beyond their service life! It's cool to trust life.

And I'll really open up now. I was married to my best friend in 1989. Nine years later, at her age of 30, I lost her to our two year battle with her breast cancer. Less than one year later I was in a motorcycle accident, punctured a lung, broke many bones, and worst of all I had three vertebrates blown out (T3, T4 and T5), and my spinal cord was almost severed. I lay in ICU with a traumatic head injury (my helmet saved my life), and I was in diapers and needed a catheter to pee. The doctors did outrageous surgeries and told me I was now a T4 paraplegic and I'd never move my body again below my chest. Off to rehab at Northridge Hospital Medical Center and time to learn how to live life in my wheelchair. I wheeled up to the rooftop many nights seeking the courage to throw myself off of the seven story building. One day my foot twitched--BUT I FELT my foot twitch this time. I worked and finally could move that leg. I worked and I could walk with a walker and two people holding me, then a walker, then crutches, then a cane for 12 years. Today I cannot run, but I have walked without a cane for almost two years (thanks to aggressive gym work!)...and OMG it's hard as hell to walk on UA streets!!!!! But Olga is at my side, and while it looks like we're holding hands, now you know that she's often balancing me [see us waling down the steps at Vornonsov Palace, Alupka, Crimea--my Miss Ukraine is balancing me in more ways than one ]

If I can come and live in Ukraine, stumble along streets and marry this amazing Miss Ukraine--anyone can do this!

Welcome to the forum 'another' and congrats to you and your intended on your impending nuptials. It's nice to hear from someone else on the forum who is treading a 'different path' from the what others will preach as 'the only way to......'; or what they consider to be the 'norm'.

As Stuart said above usually the successful folks are the 'self starters' and those who can make their own way independently.  I wish you luck in the future and hope you'll also share some insights in the 'expat' part of the forum as well with your experiences and musings on living in Ukraine.

Remember as always there's an element to folks in this endeavor where there is so much more than meets the eye.

[Dogsoldier]

Chris, its refreshing to have someone like you come through our door once in a while rather than the scam hunters  socially challenged and simpletons that we seem to aquire all too regularly,    keep coming back 

Thank you Chris!

Some people go out to dinner just knowing it's going to be a terrible evening. And they're usually right. I go out every day knowing that anything and everything can go wrong--but i hope and feel it will be wonderful. And I'm usually right.

And for anyone who thinks I look at the world through rose colored lenses, remember that I now live in Ukraine where I regularly travel from Donetsk to Gorlovka in cars with drivers I do not know, riding with passengers who like me have all paid our 20 odd grivnas to get a ride to the next city. And every day I ride in buses that are overloaded, beyond capacity and perhaps 10 or more years beyond their service life! It's cool to trust life.

And I'll really open up now. I was married to my best friend in 1989. Nine years later, at her age of 30, I lost her to our two year battle with her breast cancer. Less than one year later I was in a motorcycle accident, punctured a lung, broke many bones, and worst of all I had three vertebrates blown out (T3, T4 and T5), and my spinal cord was almost severed. I lay in ICU with a traumatic head injury (my helmet saved my life), and I was in diapers and needed a catheter to pee. The doctors did outrageous surgeries and told me I was now a T4 paraplegic and I'd never move my body again below my chest. Off to rehab at Northridge Hospital Medical Center and time to learn how to live life in my wheelchair. I wheeled up to the rooftop many nights seeking the courage to throw myself off of the seven story building. One day my foot twitched--BUT I FELT my foot twitch this time. I worked and finally could move that leg. I worked and I could walk with a walker and two people holding me, then a walker, then crutches, then a cane for 12 years. Today I cannot run, but I have walked without a cane for almost two years (thanks to aggressive gym work!)...and OMG it's hard as hell to walk on UA streets!!!!! But Olga is at my side, and while it looks like we're holding hands, now you know that she's often balancing me [see us waling down the steps at Vornonsov Palace, Alupka, Crimea--my Miss Ukraine is balancing me in more ways than one ]

If I can come and live in Ukraine, stumble along streets and marry this amazing Miss Ukraine--anyone can do this!

You have been severely tested in the many battles you have fought and have come out the other side looking ahead to a happy future. I am sure you are an inspiration to many people in many ways. I hope you and your intended find happiness in abundence and with such a positive outlook on life, I am sure you will.

Поздравляю тебя

DS

[Jinny]

9. Be a gentleman, and be a real man. Be confident, not arrogant, never crude, and never indecisive. 

10. GO TO THE GYM EVERY DAY!  ... Why would a lady, who knows she's attractive, desire a man who can't see his belt buckle? And if you've seen those young UA guys--just get your ass into the gym!

12. Be honest.

13. Dress to kill--masculine, and European style! HIGH quality, killer, slip-on dress shoes; nice belt and a good looking watch;

14. March 8th!

       

[Jinny]

Christopher,

I sincerely wish you happy family life with your Miss Ukraine Olga!    

Jinny

[mcs]

Hey Chris!!!
This is possibly one of the most inspirational reads I have had for quite some time. I agree with all your points. I myself can say this was my guide to happiness as well. I especially agree with your point about looking into your gals eyes. It is something that my Aly told me was the one thing that drew her to me and she knew that I was the man for her. Best of luck on the 19th.
Cheers

Smitty

[anotheropus]

Our congratulations to you both  , we are not far away just over the border in Russia Taganrog, a truely amazing story of how you got here  but it is not the path it is the road you now tread good luck and long life
Mark & Elena

Thank you Mark and Elena! I'm happy to be here on this great site, and to live and work in UA! Perhaps we can meet some day in the new year It's a pain in the butt for me to get an RU visa though.

Warmest!

Christopher

[anotheropus]

Welcome to the forum 'another' and congrats to you and your intended on your impending nuptials. It's nice to hear from someone else on the forum who is treading a 'different path' from the what others will preach as 'the only way to......'; or what they consider to be the 'norm'.

As Stuart said above usually the successful folks are the 'self starters' and those who can make their own way independently.  I wish you luck in the future and hope you'll also share some insights in the 'expat' part of the forum as well with your experiences and musings on living in Ukraine.

Remember as always there's an element to folks in this endeavor where there is so much more than meets the eye.

ECR844 - Thank you

Many people, fail and fail and fail--I have! And eventually they succeed because they do not know how to stop trying! Now that I've made it to UA, living, working and loving, I'm so happy I did not give up at so many places and at so many challenges.

Yes, I absolutely will share my expat experiences.

And I agree with you--this endeavor and the people who give their lives to it have much more in them (and supporting them) than anyone can imagine.

And for all of you who already know, and for those of you who wonder--when you're home, living with your amazing RU speaking woman, after the dating and romance... the challenges become greater. And so do the rewards for the man who leads his lady with respect, and listens to her and considers her SIGNIFICANT wisdom, through all of the challenges. I cannot believe how lucky I am to share life, love and challenges with Olga.

Warmest,

Christopher

[anotheropus]

You have been severely tested in the many battles you have fought and have come out the other side looking ahead to a happy future. I am sure you are an inspiration to many people in many ways. I hope you and your intended find happiness in abundence and with such a positive outlook on life, I am sure you will.

Поздравляю тебя

DS

Dogsoldier - Hello and thank you for your congrats and warm wishes I also wish this for you and your life and love.

Life is beautiful, painful, sweet and bitter, often imperfect (tough for perfectionistic, idealistic, romantics like ME!)... so life is perfect.

Every day we must chose what we will feel and how we will look at the day, our life and our world. I wish I could live for a thousand years now! Thank you for that--Olga!

Warmest,

Christopher

[anotheropus]

Christopher,

I sincerely wish you happy family life with your Miss Ukraine Olga!    

Jinny

Hello Jinny

I can see from your thumbs up that you are a real woman and a classic lady. Bravo!

Thank you for your warm wishes... and I do intend to enjoy a happy family life with my sweet Miss Ukraine

Hmmmm... it may be too early, but Olga told me I can tell my US friends that we're working on adding to our family (we're practicing on purpose to add our first baby!). Well, I want to be loyal to my precious love Olga, so I cannot tell anyone other than my US friends about this--so everyone else, please disregard this paragraph. And as for naming our new family members, we're going to name them with both US and UA names, as well as my patronymic (Christopherovna/Christopherovich) "class!" ...and she likes US names and I like UA names! So, I'll let everyone know how our first is named

Warmest, poka poka, Jinny,

Christopher

[anotheropus]

Hey Chris!!!
This is possibly one of the most inspirational reads I have had for quite some time. I agree with all your points. I myself can say this was my guide to happiness as well. I especially agree with your point about looking into your gals eyes. It is something that my Aly told me was the one thing that drew her to me and she knew that I was the man for her. Best of luck on the 19th.
Cheers

Smitty

Smitty - Hello Kanuk! ...and thank you for your warm wishes!

Theses ladies know our eyes are truly the windows to our soul. And when you look into a real man or a real woman's eyes, and their eyes smile in concert with their mouth--you know you've met a sincere person. Olga's little thumbnail photo of her face, smile and SMILING EYES just NAILED me! And it got better on Skype, and it got really great when she met me at DOK when my plane landed, and I LIVE IN HEAVEN every morning when I wake up and kiss her beautiful, sleepy, sweet eyes and then her nose and then her lips and--well... lettuce leave it at that. From a couple of things I've read, that members have written on this forum, I KNOW there are children present here! ;0