Would you hire a RW?

[mendeleyev]

Our region's Russian-Ukrainian Cultural Society has a job board. In browsing thru it this afternoon I noticed several RW/UW looking for work. Several of them are looking to work inside a home for domestic help.

For our Russian ladies reading this, it means they wish to do housework and get paid. In most cases they're new to the USA and don't yet have all the documents for getting a job but they want to earn some money instead of sitting around the house. Sometimes it's an older person who wants a second, part time income.  It's not "slavery" or anything even similar.


For example here are two listings:

1-  Job Needed: Caregiver, Babysitter, Cook, Housecleaning -- Phoenix

I am looking for a job as a baby sitter, or caring for elderly or disabled
people. I am married, 31 years old. I prefer children 2 week-old or older.
I am CPR and first-aid certified, and I have a fingerprint clearance card.
I have experience with twins and also children with special needs.
I drive a car, and can run errands and I also can cook. I have work
experience being a nanny for Russian children in AZ and if you wish can
tutor your child for Russian language.
Contact: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX



2- Job Needed: Cook, Housecleaning, Childcare -- Scottsdale

I want job and make experience the person cares about baby. I make clean
your home. I make tasty and cooker is good. As to bus, will be necessary to live near or to train station.
In Russia I have document from University about teach children but no inside USA.
Contact: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


Especially in #2, I imagine we're talking a "Cash" job with no payroll taxes. We see she doesn't drive so needs to work near a bus stop or Valley Metro train station.


Lets say you have children at home or you need housecleaning and cooking help. So, would you, or would you not, hire a RW to care for your home?

[Paul]

So, would you, or would you not, hire a RW to care for your home?

No. A RW expectations of coming here must be higher than those of someone coming from a country south of the border, so I couldn't do it (sorry if that offends anyone, but it's how I feel).

Mendy, you should have added the words "an unattractive older RW", the answers would be different, I'm sure. 

[BelleZeBoob]

So, would you, or would you not, hire a RW to care for your home?

No. A RW expectations of coming here must be higher than those of someone coming from a country south of the border, so I couldn't do it (sorry if that offends anyone, but it's how I feel).
 

day_dreamer, how can you be so sure about the expectations of particular two  job applicants being higher than they state in their ads? I am surprised by your answer.

Any indications of possible hidden agenda in the ads? I did not find any.

[Paul]

day_dreamer, how can you be so sure about the expectations of particular two  job applicants being higher than they state in their ads? I am surprised by your answer.

Any indications of possible hidden agenda in the ads? I did not find any.

Belle, I do not see a hidden agenda in the ads, I see (possibly) two women who came here with higher goals and for whatever reason, need to do that kind of work now.

It is hard for me to explain, but I see people who do that kind of work as being exploited. People come here by the thousands millions illegally to do that kind of work from countries south of the United States, I guess it's what they expect, and they do not care. I do not see any RW (in my mind) traveling 5,000 plus miles with the intention to do the same.

[BelleZeBoob]

How do you know their goals of coming to the US from these ads?

Okay, even if we assume that they look for this kind of jobs in order to make cash out of their spare time, what wrong do you see in this? Don't you know anyone who supplement their income this way?

By the way, what negative do you see in having the life goals higher than cleaning or housekeeping job? Does this mean that those people will do the jobs worse than expected, and therefore people should think twice before answering to their job ads?

If, for instance, a student does babysitting or something like that on the weekend while studying during workweek, does this mean that people should abstain from hiring students because they have some higher goals?

[kievstar]

I would hire a RW house keeper why not?  Swedish women have been coming for years to do that work in the USA.

Tiger Woods married a nanny of another golfer (Jesper Parnivik - spelling).   http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20042990,00.html
But she was a good nanny before that.

[WestCoast]

Mendy we don't have a job board at the community centre that I volunteer at but word of mouth is used when some new Canadians are looking for work.  The older and younger immigrants use this method extensively to find work when they have no local experience or have only housekeeping experience.  Most of the work is done for cash, no taxes deducted

We have a small percentage of non-Asians at the centre but even they will use the word of mouth method to obtain work if possible.  I see no reason why any RW wouldn't be able to find work some type of housekeeping or nanny work in greater Vancouver if she was willing to use the same method.  I've never hired anyone using this method but my ex has on several occasions hired some women for short term assignments doing housekeeping for her when she was busy at work.

[Wild Orchid]

It is hard for me to explain, but I see people who do that kind of work as being exploited. People come here by the thousands millions illegally to do that kind of work from countries south of the United States, I guess it's what they expect, and they do not care. I do not see any RW (in my mind) traveling 5,000 plus miles with the intention to do the same.

I know that older women often get jobs like that. Younger ones and with profession in education resort to child minding. I had to do jobs here in Au that I'd never ever agreed to in Russia but it is absolutely different game and i didn't care much. For me it was just a first job, a stepping stone, to get some references and to let people know me. I'd rather do something that stay at home without any prospects of finding a job. I'm not sure I'd like to do domestic cleaning, just not my cup of tea..  But my mother did that while she was here on holiday and i hope she will do that again. I prefer her to clean other people's houses for money instead of endlessly scrubbing mine because she doesn't know what else to do with herself while we are at work. She was offered a work to clean a house of a local doctor, it was once a fortnight and she could walk there. It was perfect for her.

[fireeater]

Mendeleyev

To answer your original question about hiring an RW. The answer would be yes, but only after you interviewed her, and got a feel for who she is, and if she was capable of what you needed her to do.

More so if it involved children or the care of an elder.

For housekeeping your eyes would be the judge of that. 
For cooking your stomach the true judge.   

By the way does she come with a sexy cute maid outfit.   

[fireeater]

day_dreamer, how can you be so sure about the expectations of particular two  job applicants being higher than they state in their ads? I am surprised by your answer.

Any indications of possible hidden agenda in the ads? I did not find any.

Belle, I do not see a hidden agenda in the ads, I see (possibly) two women who came here with higher goals and for whatever reason, need to do that kind of work now.

It is hard for me to explain, but I see people who do that kind of work as being exploited. People come here by the thousands millions illegally to do that kind of work from countries south of the United States, I guess it's what they expect, and they do not care. I do not see any RW (in my mind) traveling 5,000 plus miles with the intention to do the same.

Day Dreamer

Not all women who do this work, have to. Some do because it fits into their lifestyle at the moment. They may only want a part time job, and the idea
is to fill in some time. They may have children, and it fits into the schedule of them going  to school. Plus the added bonus of making a little money for themselves.

Reasons vary, buy I also know you can hire them from agencies here, so they are not being exploited, or are here illegally. But also from vary messages boards or even word of mouth. 

If you are looking for home daycare (both parents working), schools usually have a list of mothers who do stay home and do this for others.

Reasons why someone does this vary so greatly you cannot put one picture on this area. 

[froid]

I do not see any RW (in my mind) traveling 5,000 plus miles with the intention to do the same.

Maybe putting RW on a pedestal a little there?  

Those south of the border are only good for housekeeping and picking crops then too?

Since I now live in a mixed Canadian Russian household I could see us hiring a RW just for that reason, to keep the culture mixture at home for us and our children the same as the ones we know.  

[Paul]

How do you know their goals of coming to the US from these ads?

Okay, even if we assume that they look for this kind of jobs in order to make cash out of their spare time, what wrong do you see in this? Don't you know anyone who supplement their income this way?

By the way, what negative do you see in having the life goals higher than cleaning or housekeeping job? Does this mean that those people will do the jobs worse than expected, and therefore people should think twice before answering to their job ads?

I just seems like a step back, not forward, to me. I know my logic is flawed, but I can't knowingly help someone do that.

If, for instance, a student does babysitting or something like that on the weekend while studying during workweek, does this mean that people should abstain from hiring students because they have some higher goals?

My answer would be different for someone that was a student. Somehow I did not get the impression from the ads, that those women are of that age. I could never hire anyone from another country who was here legally to do any job that was so far beneath what they were educated to do in their home country.  Belle, please tell me that you would never allow yourself to wear a fast food restaurant uniform. 

[Paul]

I had to do jobs here in Au that I'd never ever agreed to in Russia but it is absolutely different game and i didn't care much.

I'm sorry WO, but that is a bad reflection on your husband to me.

[Paul]

Maybe putting RW on a pedestal a little there?

I wouldn't hire an adult man with an eastern European accent to pull the weeds in my yard either.  

Those south of the border are only good for housekeeping and picking crops then too?

No, not at all, they have been driving down the wages of honest, legal, tax paying people who are construction works, landscapers, factory works, plant works, and etc. for years now. If they come here legally, they should be able to do whatever they were educated to do.

To Fireeater and Froid, the population of illegal immigrants living in the United States is roughly have that of the people living legally in Canada, I think the both of you would have different views if you lived here.

Since I now live in a mixed Canadian Russian household I could see us hiring a RW just for that reason, to keep the culture mixture at home for us and our children the same as the ones we know.  

Seems wrong to me, to use someone for that purpose.

[froid]

Yes but making the leap from an ad and someone's background and eastern european accent to the premise that they are obviously overqualified for housekeeping and/or gardening is just that...a big leap.  Maybe they WERE a gardener or maid back in Minsk.

My opinion of illegal aliens is exactly the same as yours.  So first call them illegal aliens like they should be named.  They are NOT immigrants at all and that is an insult to real lawful immigrants.    And I agree with the economic impact they do create in the job markets. 

Of course I also know a few Mexican's who would also be way overqualified as well. 

And since I wouldn't be "using" someone but actually paying them legally there is no problem with it at all.  The fact that they would have a similar cultural background to my wife, speak the same language, and be able to cook similar food as to what we are used to would all help a RW's chances to get the job over any other nationality. 

[ECR844]

"froid,"

   You make some good points. Although I wouldn't ever hire a Crimimmigrant, or a Crimalien. I would consider hiring someone who wanted to work, was willing and capable to perform the work in a competent and timely fashion. They would be of any nationality, as long as they fit the criteria set I forth, and what is needed for the position.

   I think this touches on an issue some of us may encounter in our future. Our wives, may have friends or become friends, and or acquainted with someone who is looking for work and would like to do work of this nature. The person may also be having trouble for one reason or another finding a job. Additionally, it might not be inconceivable that if your wife is involved in the expat community she may be approached or asked for 'help' from someone of this nature. It's been my experience that the FSU grapevine-network is how a lot of people find jobs, get favorite goods or foods from home, etc.. I think it goes to the cultural 'collective' mentality. If someone in the community needs a hand, and is willing to contribute they are assisted and helped to be put in a position where they can help 'the collective good'.

   I think you'll find that if they are successful these people would be willing to do the same for another who may need help, and so on. I don't think there is anything demeaning about being willing to work and earn an honest days pay. Should you shoot for the stars? YES! Should you try to work in a job and area befitting your education and experience? YES! Should they try to earn the best wage they can? YES! But, sometimes that takes time and work, while in the interim a person and family will still have bills, and obligations to meet. I think it's more admirable than someone sitting at home and becoming a fat, lazy, Dorito munching, Oprah watching, professional welfare breeding leech.  Just my .02, your opinion and MMV... 8)

[froid]

Well I have a RW at home who has just started looking for work so of course I have lots of opinions about this right now.  She is working very hard at it and is aiming high and has created a new english resume and cover letter.  She has already attended one of the local free seminars on communications and networking provided to newcomers and is planning to take others.  Both for learning and to practice her english. 

Still she is worried about her English and lack of Canadian experience.  She has met a couple other RW locally already.  One found a position in her field but says things are more  difficult with the current "crisis".  The other is married and neither she or her husband ended up working in the field they trained in.  These stories have made Mila wonder if she might end up in a position that is lower than what she had back home. 

So it seems that many immigrants do have problems working in their field because of English and or local experience...and then we have people thinking like day_dreamer would not hire the "overqualified" RW for anything below what they trained in.  A catch 22!!!

[fireeater]

Maybe putting RW on a pedestal a little there?

I wouldn't hire an adult man with an eastern European accent to pull the weeds in my yard either.  

Those south of the border are only good for housekeeping and picking crops then too?

No, not at all, they have been driving down the wages of honest, legal, tax paying people who are construction works, landscapers, factory works, plant works, and etc. for years now. If they come here legally, they should be able to do whatever they were educated to do.

To Fireeater and Froid, the population of illegal immigrants living in the United States is roughly have that of the people living legally in Canada, I think the both of you would have different views if you lived here.

Since I now live in a mixed Canadian Russian household I could see us hiring a RW just for that reason, to keep the culture mixture at home for us and our children the same as the ones we know.  

Seems wrong to me, to use someone for that purpose.

Well for accents, maybe one company I worked for part time in my younger years should not have hired an American with that drawl of his. Seems he got hold of a gun and decided to try robbery as a part time activity. We had fun afterwards imitating his accent over the PA system.  

Accent has nothing to do with qualifications, or where they are from.

As for illegal aliens, we all have them somewhere. But the idea is she would be a there legally, and considered as a member of your country.

As for wages some areas could use the competion they are sadly and grossly overpaid.  

[2tallbill]

I could see hiring someone providing they weren't too hot.
There could be a zillion good reasons that a person would be
willing to work at a job when they are "mostly" qualified for
something better.

The woman below wouldn't get hired.

[Paul]

...and then we have people thinking like day_dreamer would not hire the "overqualified" RW for anything below what they trained in.  A catch 22!!!

I said my logic is flawed 

The woman below wouldn't get hired.

Nice pic of her at her "office desk" 

[froid]

I said my logic is flawed

It is also based on stereotypes too I think.  Stereotypes like "mail order brides". 

[Paul]

I said my logic is flawed

It is also based on stereotypes too I think.  Stereotypes like "mail order brides". 

Nope, people from Russia are far better educated than the millions of people already here who are "qualified" for those jobs.

[Brasscasing]

I just seems like a step back, not forward, to me. I know my logic is flawed, but I can't knowingly help someone do that.

Which, having looked and found someone in Eastern Europe to be his partner in life, is making DD a little uncomfortable and that's reasonable. Some people even get uncomfortable having an attentive server in a restaurant, we've all seen them.

This would be a good vetting question for the hiring process with an au pair. "Do you feel traveling to [insert country here] and working in a domestic capacity within a household is a personal step back for your/career/life/plans or beneath what you feel your station is in society?


Brass

[froid]

Nope, people from Russia are far better educated than the millions of people already here who are "qualified" for those jobs.

Actually SOME people would be better educated.  Maybe even MOST.  Again you are stereotyping.  Link on here seems well educated.  A few people I know are highly educated and from Mexico.  And I am sure not EVERYONE in Russia is well educated. 

And personally I would rather have an educated housekeeper.  Anyone who has no schooling and is illiterate would not have the qualifications I would require. 

[Ada]

If someone chooses to look for a certain job, and get payed for it, I wouldn't call it exploitation.
The employer obviously needs someone for that job, the person hired needs to do that job, or just get payed for it, the reasons for doing it are a different story.  Whether it is a step back for that person or not, it is that person's concern, and she/he probably had no other choice at that time. If they are not illegal in the country and yet can't find something they would be qualified for, what should they do? Starve?