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Information & Chat => News & Political Discussion => Topic started by: Manny on April 21, 2017, 02:40:06 AM

Title: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 21, 2017, 02:40:06 AM
So I thought I'd open the North Korea topic.

As we know, Trump has now started threatening North Korea, who have warned him not to bother or they will retaliate to any attack or attempted US invasion.

Russia and China are rapidly moving troops and equipment to their respective borders with NK, ostensibly to stem any refugee crisis that may occur if there is some kind of war there.

Personally, I think Trump has foolishly bitten off more than he can chew here. This is more aggression and warmongering from the US. NK is not his business and is in China's sphere of influence (sounds like Ukraine and Russia again, no?). I can't see China letting much happen on their doorstep, and Russia has voiced concerns about nuclear clouds that would take 2 hours to reach Vladivostok.

Trump cannot be permitted to continue the worldwide terrorism that his predecessors started. The man has bombed two countries in a fortnight and is now threatening a third. But NK wouldn't be like bombing some blokes on camels as usual. This conflict he seeks has the potential to unravel him faster than anything at home if North Korea's neighbours are forced to intervene.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on April 21, 2017, 02:48:10 AM
I think North Korea, albeit under extreme leadership, should be left alone for now. However, they have proven capable of being a nuclear power, which means that no aggressive military strike will succeed without a very high cost in human life. Better seek to dispose of current administration through spies, assassination and other means.

I had a small hope that Kim-Jung Un would be better than his father, but alas... another mad dictator at the helm.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on April 21, 2017, 03:40:28 AM
Kim Jong Un is playing a limited hand brilliantly. Right now we see just how necessary Korea's nuclear weapon program is as a deterrent to US aggression.

There's a reason those aircraft carriers are not where the US said they'd be.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steamer on April 21, 2017, 06:28:13 AM
I think Kim Jong Un has a Napoleon complex and should be very careful how he plays this. If he keeps poking the US in the eye Trump may rename N Kor as "The Great Smoking Ditch".
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on April 21, 2017, 06:40:09 AM
I think Kim Jong Un has a Napoleon complex and should be very careful how he plays this. If he keeps poking the US in the eye Trump may rename N Kor as "The Great Smoking Ditch".

See, that's where you and millions of others have not understood why North Korea has a nuclear weapons program or why it is that the US has actually done nothing.

A nuclear weapons program is the only defence against US silliness because it is the only thing that can actually impact the US. The apparent bellicosity that you have been programed to see by your thought leaders is, in truth, the leader of a tiny, poor, but independent nation doing all it can to tell the aggressor, the United States, to stop its threats and attacks.

Also, when you talk in such silly, unthought, pre-programmed, terms you are neglecting to understand that North Korea is bordered to the north by both China and Russia and just how well do YOU think that a nuclear attack upon North Korea would go down with those two?

Truth time here: you and millions of other poor USAians have been programmed to think that rational people act irrationally. As such you are willing to accept irrationality on the part of your own leadership. Your leadership may well lack skills, may well lack understanding of geopolitical realities, may have counter intuitive world views and hidden motivations and drivers but there is one thing that they are not: they are not irrational. Your leadership is no more irrational than Assad in Syria, Putin in Russia, Xi in China or Kim in Korea.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 21, 2017, 07:23:46 AM
This is why the Ukraine needs nuclear weapons to protect against Russia silliness.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on April 21, 2017, 07:38:18 AM
This is why the Ukraine needs nuclear weapons to protect against Russia silliness.


Nice to see you posting as insightfully as ever!
I don't think you noticed the differences between Ukraine and Korea. The USA may have been behind the coup in Ukraine and Korea wants none of that. Russia is not known for being similar to the USA in foreign policy terms.

Texan77, try thinking before trying to appear smart.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on April 21, 2017, 07:49:30 AM
This is why Ukraine needs nuclear weapons to protect against Russia silliness.

Fixed that for you. And true.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on April 21, 2017, 08:50:47 AM


Thoughts?

1/ It is amusing to read of your surprise at Trump's waking up to reality

2/ N.Korea has even exceedingly pee'd off China and China's concern isn't for the Koreans living under the wack job dictator  .... it's the thought of having a re-united Korea that would be grateful to the US. Same applies to Russia.

3/ Normal N.Korean behaviour is to pipe up lots - seem threatening - then gets lots of money to pipe down.....   How long can such blackmail continue ?



Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steamer on April 21, 2017, 09:15:37 AM
See, that's where you and millions of others have not understood why North Korea has a nuclear weapons program or why it is that the US has actually done nothing.

I understand that fine. I don't understand how some tin pot dictator can threaten a nuclear attack (repeatedly), take pot shots with his missiles while promising to hit Hawaii and San Fran yet the US is supposed to laugh it off? No.

I'm also against a nuclear FIRST strike (pollution concerns etc.) but in the 2nd strike Ok. Actually dropping a MOAB on Un's head  taking HIM out would be the best for both of our countries.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on April 21, 2017, 09:56:23 AM
See, that's where you and millions of others have not understood why North Korea has a nuclear weapons program or why it is that the US has actually done nothing.

I understand that fine. I don't understand how some tin pot dictator can threaten a nuclear attack (repeatedly), take pot shots with his missiles while promising to hit Hawaii and San Fran yet the US is supposed to laugh it off? No.

I'm also against a nuclear FIRST strike (pollution concerns etc.) but in the 2nd strike Ok. Actually dropping a MOAB on Un's head  taking HIM out would be the best for both of our countries.

I agree 100% with your points.  :thumbsup: tiphat
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: B.B. on April 21, 2017, 10:00:31 AM
As we know, Trump has now started threatening North Korea, who have warned him not to bother or they will retaliate to any attack or attempted US invasion.

Trump has no plans - and no plans to make plans - to invade NoKoLand. 

Russia and China are rapidly moving troops and equipment to their respective borders with NK, ostensibly to stem any refugee crisis that may occur if there is some kind of war there. 

Fine.  Then they won't be available to cause trouble elsewhere.

Personally, I think Trump has foolishly bitten off more than he can chew here.

And you're wrong.  Read on.

This is more aggression and warmongering from the US.

If the NoKos could mind their own business, we'd go back to not giving a shit about them. 

Trump cannot be permitted to continue the worldwide terrorism that his predecessors started.

Oh, look!  Someone's agenda is showing!

The man has bombed two countries in a fortnight and is now threatening a third.

What?  He gave Assad a love tap to remind him to stay in his own lane and not use chemical weapons - chemical weapons that he wasn't supposed to HAVE anymore - and he gave the Russians an hour to clear out of the way before he did it.  Assad tested boundaries, Trump let him know to get back over the line, and he didn't start a globalist war in the M/E to do it.

The ragheads in Afghanistan brought this shit on themselves.  Do you think George W. Bush could have found Afghanistan on a map on September 10, 2001?  You want to sponsor terrorist organizations, you can expect "death from above". 

In Korea, he sent Pence tot he DMZ and had the Carl Vinson do a drive-by.  He correctly signaled to China that the NoKos are their problem, and they need to manage it appropriately.

Nothing to see here, move along.

B/B
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on April 21, 2017, 12:21:09 PM
North Korea gained Nukes thanks to Bill Clinton.  :coffeeread:

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C99Lj4GXoAImhWb.jpg)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on April 21, 2017, 05:05:00 PM
What if..... NK has a nuke and they can shoot it with reasonable accuracy between 300-400 km far (200 miles)

Suppose war breaks out between USA and NK. Whats stopping them from launching a nuke against an aircraft carrier group. As I understand it, Satellite systems can guide such a rocket so the blast-radius will take out the carrier group, even if it isn't a perfect hit.

Mark.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steamer on April 21, 2017, 05:22:15 PM
What if..... NK has a nuke and they can shoot it with reasonable accuracy between 300-400 km far (200 miles)

Suppose war breaks out between USA and NK. Whats stopping them from launching a nuke against an aircraft carrier group. As I understand it, Satellite systems can guide such a rocket so the blast-radius will take out the carrier group, even if it isn't a perfect hit.

Mark.

That's why the US has been moving anti missile systems to S Kor and the Chinese are having fits about it.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on April 21, 2017, 07:08:15 PM
What if..... NK has a nuke and they can shoot it with reasonable accuracy between 300-400 km far (200 miles)

Suppose war breaks out between USA and NK. Whats stopping them from launching a nuke against an aircraft carrier group. As I understand it, Satellite systems can guide such a rocket so the blast-radius will take out the carrier group, even if it isn't a perfect hit.

Mark.

That's why the US has been moving anti missile systems to S Kor and the Chinese are having fits about it.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C9-oM5bUMAAO5-U.jpg)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Tom Cat on April 21, 2017, 07:10:38 PM
After the Chinese president and president Trump had their meeting, Trump has changed his position about China.
I think Trump understands how to negotiate a deal with China to take care of the North Korea problem.

Trump: China will solve North Korea problem 'if they want to'

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/04/21/trump-china-north-korea-tweet-237450
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 22, 2017, 04:50:20 AM
Some interesting - if far-fetched sounding - content here suggesting Japan may be behind what Trump is doing: http://journal-neo.org/2017/04/22/insanity-and-the-art-of-trump-s-deal/

Quote
The witness statements in this case included an accusation that Trump admitted to killing a 12-year-old girl. Curiously, or perhaps not so curious, is a report out of Japan that their intelligence agency has purchased a video tape of Trump murdering a 12-year-old girl. The source on this is a former CIA asset living in Japan who I questioned. Normally such a claim might be seen as a wild conspiracy theory except that soon afterward, Trump sent an American naval flotilla to confront North Korea.

Our CIA asset had claimed this is what Japan demanded in their blackmail of Trump, information that predated the military order by 10 days. Let’s call it a coincidence but also be forewarned as well as we are piling up coincidences. They are forming a pattern and the pattern is now overwhelming, blackmail, personal deals, radical policy changes, it doesn’t take a genius to put it together.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on April 22, 2017, 04:54:29 AM
Many, are you seeking a listing as a fake news site for RUA?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on April 22, 2017, 05:31:34 AM
Some interesting - if far-fetched sounding - content here suggesting Japan may be behind what Trump is doing: http://journal-neo.org/2017/04/22/insanity-and-the-art-of-trump-s-deal/

Quote
The witness statements in this case included an accusation that Trump admitted to killing a 12-year-old girl. Curiously, or perhaps not so curious, is a report out of Japan that their intelligence agency has purchased a video tape of Trump murdering a 12-year-old girl. The source on this is a former CIA asset living in Japan who I questioned. Normally such a claim might be seen as a wild conspiracy theory except that soon afterward, Trump sent an American naval flotilla to confront North Korea.

Our CIA asset had claimed this is what Japan demanded in their blackmail of Trump, information that predated the military order by 10 days. Let’s call it a coincidence but also be forewarned as well as we are piling up coincidences. They are forming a pattern and the pattern is now overwhelming, blackmail, personal deals, radical policy changes, it doesn’t take a genius to put it together.

That's some pretty outrageous and silly slander you've just published against the President of the USA.  :coffeeread:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 22, 2017, 06:46:43 AM
Many, are you seeking a listing as a fake news site for RUA?

Do you consider Journal Neo a fake news site? Or the editor of Veterans Today who wrote it to be a fake news person?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 22, 2017, 06:51:02 AM
That's some pretty outrageous and silly slander you've just published against the President of the USA.  :coffeeread:

Slander is speech not writing, I quoted a linked source. This is not an American site, we are free to discuss media articles freely here. Even outrageous or silly ones.

The rape case was certainly real: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/donald-trump-accused-underage-rape-lawsuit-a7352976.html
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on April 22, 2017, 08:57:32 AM
No, the rape case isn't real.
Somebody, some organisation, keeps popping up with these applications but they never proceed. The purpose is not that the cases should ever proceed, they are usually based upon false information (addresses that don't exist, people who don't exist and the like). The idea behind it is to associate Trump with rape so that, by repetition of a lie, we come to associate Trump with rape and of being a rapist.

Here's a little thought experiment for you: If Japan was blackmailing the US and specifically the president do you really think that they'd allow word of the blackmail to escape? As soon as the info goes into the wild, as soon as we know about it, the blackmail becomes useless, the leverage is lost. Blackmail, for its effect, relies upon secrecy and the threat of disclosure. If the claims made have substance then their benefit to Japan (or interests within Japan) are now totally defused.

So, given that the kompromat, if genuine, ever existed is now exposed and that the interests of all concerned stakeholders were best served by secrecy we can infer that this is a made up story, not genuine. Did Engdahl make it up, or report upon claims of others? That doesn't matter in this context. It is notable that he does have a tendency to jump upon bandwagons, it is how he earns his living.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on April 22, 2017, 10:41:40 AM
That's some pretty outrageous and silly slander you've just published against the President of the USA.  :coffeeread:

Slander is speech not writing, I quoted a linked source. This is not an American site, we are free to discuss media articles freely here. Even outrageous or silly ones.

The rape case was certainly real: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/donald-trump-accused-underage-rape-lawsuit-a7352976.html

Oh okay. Guess I meant defamation. I'm glad you posted the Independent link. A certain creepy fellow stands out.
I suggest you dig on that fellow. I wouldn't blame Japan. Strong rumor is that the Epstein operation on that island is a Mossad operation. They knew of Bill Clinton's weakness, had him out to that island numerous times and filmed his dirty deeds. 

Furthermore the efforts to discredit Trump before the election and even after he won, IMO were because he had stated that he would not continue perpetual wars and that he wanted a better relationship with Russia. I posted a link about CIA director Brennan's efforts to discredit the President in the Trump thread.

Now your job is to connect the dots with this fellow who wrote the story about Japan and our efforts in North Korea. The Clinton's know that Bill is the one who was filmed raping girls, but why not hire a guy to blame the Donald? Classic Clinton dirty politics. If you've read Hillary's interviews she blames her loss of the election on misogyny, the FBI and the Russians.  :coffeeread:

quote from Independent linked above:
In the lawsuit a witness, identified by the pseudonym Tiffany Doe, alleges she saw Mr Trump and billionaire-paedophile Jeffrey Epstein repeatedly rape the plaintiff, identified as Jane Doe.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 22, 2017, 11:02:18 AM
Furthermore the efforts to discredit Trump before the election and even after he won, IMO were because he had stated that he would not continue perpetual wars and that he wanted a better relationship with Russia.

Thats the point though, isnt it? He has u-turned completely. He has bombed two countries in a fortnight, Syria was without evidence and because Ivanka saw a pic on Twitter?  (:)  I mean come on......

And now he is threatening North Korea, who from what I can make out simply wants to be left alone. It seems Trump started the warmongering again against NK, and they are responding by pointing out they won't be bullied and will defend themselves.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on April 22, 2017, 11:10:03 AM
Furthermore the efforts to discredit Trump before the election and even after he won, IMO were because he had stated that he would not continue perpetual wars and that he wanted a better relationship with Russia.

Thats the point though, isnt it? He has u-turned completely. He has bombed two countries in a fortnight, Syria was without evidence and because Ivanka saw a pic on Twitter?  (:)  I mean come on......

And now he is threatening North Korea, who from what I can make out simply wants to be left alone. It seems Trump started the warmongering again against NK, and they are responding by pointing out they won't be bullied and will defend themselves.

Okay well you're engaging in gross exaggeration and as B/B pointed out you've got an agenda. The whole world is cheering the MOAB dropped on terrorists heads in Afghanistan, and the situation with North Korea was bound to happen someday, which is right now.

The missile strikes in Syria I've already expressed my opinion about. A way for him to get out from under re-accusations he's Putin's "puppet".
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 22, 2017, 11:12:47 AM
the situation with North Korea was bound to happen someday, which is right now.

OK, why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steamer on April 22, 2017, 01:17:59 PM
OK, why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?

The wars are already started. Trump is trying to end them.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 23, 2017, 07:52:23 AM
OK, why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?

The wars are already started. Trump is trying to end them.

There is no war with North Korea. So why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steamer on April 23, 2017, 08:02:21 AM

There is no war with North Korea. So why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?

There will be no problem if Un behaves. If he takes a shot at our navy with his missiles then Un is the one starting a war and we will respond.

It's about who shoots first.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on April 23, 2017, 08:33:31 AM


There is no war with North Korea. So why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?

Did I  miss something?  When was the peace treaty signed?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 23, 2017, 10:34:29 AM

There is no war with North Korea. So why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?

There will be no problem if Un behaves. If he takes a shot at our navy with his missiles then Un is the one starting a war and we will respond.

It's about who shoots first.

The point is your navy has no business being there. It is a provocative action. If you left them alone, they wouldn't need to remind you they will defend themselves.

Trump is itching to invade the place - for no reason - and ruin it as you did with Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. Should they sit there and wait for that or threaten retaliation as they are doing?

This is the US doing what it does, and Trump doing exactly the opposite of what he said he would do. I fail to see how this "makes America great again" or why you people might make whooping noises at the prospect of more war.

Or are you all too brainwashed to even question it?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on April 23, 2017, 10:58:54 AM


There is no war with North Korea. So why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?

Did I  miss something?  When was the peace treaty signed?

I take it that you did not notice that there has not been a state of war for many years? That there is an armistice, but not a peace treaty, between North and South Korea? That the United States has no territorial claims upon North Korea?
Whoops no, that'd require some knowledge as opposed to 'feelz' and programming.

Time for you lot to start acquiring the knowledge required to enable you to overcome your programing because right now your lack of knowledge is what allows you lot to go along with the madness of your leadership.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on April 23, 2017, 11:05:20 AM

There is no war with North Korea. So why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?

There will be no problem if Un behaves. If he takes a shot at our navy with his missiles then Un is the one starting a war and we will respond.

It's about who shoots first.

The point is your navy has no business being there. It is a provocative action. If you left them alone, they wouldn't need to remind you they will defend themselves.

Trump is itching to invade the place - for no reason - and ruin it as you did with Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. Should they sit there and wait for that or threaten retaliation as they are doing?

This is the US doing what it does, and Trump doing exactly the opposite of what he said he would do. I fail to see how this "makes America great again" or why you people might make whooping noises at the prospect of more war.

Or are you all too brainwashed to even question it?

maybe you're too brainwashed cause you lump North Korea in with the middle east.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steamer on April 23, 2017, 11:27:17 AM

The point is your navy has no business being there. It is a provocative action. If you left them alone, they wouldn't need to remind you they will defend themselves.

I think that S Kor and Japan would disagree with that.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 23, 2017, 11:30:45 AM

There is no war with North Korea. So why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?

There will be no problem if Un behaves. If he takes a shot at our navy with his missiles then Un is the one starting a war and we will respond.

It's about who shoots first.

The point is your navy has no business being there. It is a provocative action. If you left them alone, they wouldn't need to remind you they will defend themselves.

Trump is itching to invade the place - for no reason - and ruin it as you did with Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. Should they sit there and wait for that or threaten retaliation as they are doing?

This is the US doing what it does, and Trump doing exactly the opposite of what he said he would do. I fail to see how this "makes America great again" or why you people might make whooping noises at the prospect of more war.

Or are you all too brainwashed to even question it?

Gee the British navy is there also. Maybe you blots has no business being there neither.

Since his meeting with Trump, the Chinese have conducted and excise with the US navy for what was called anti-pirate in this region. Mean while a six nation collation seems to be forming to deal with the problem in North Korea.

I would not be surprise if the Chinese deal with North Korea themselves. They tried to rain him in when North Korea threaten them with nuclear war. Most likely Kim was just mouthing off again but you have to know he has nuclear missiles that can hit anywhere in China and he has 50 submarines that could shut down all Chinese trade for and extended time plus many thousands of other missiles that could travel well into China. We very well maybe at a time where the Chinese are seeing the problem.

The Chinese have been displease with him for sometime now. Kim killed his half brother because he was afraid the Chinese might make him leader. We might finally be at the breaking point.

At the meeting with the President of China, Trump covered the problem with North Korea and the Chinese President seem to be OK with the terms. Then we were only going to degrade the nuclear capability of North Korea. After the meeting when the Chinese president got back and they realized what that war might cost China they seem to have a change of heart. Then when the north Koreans threaten China our air craft carrier end up in Australia. When if left, Australia became part of our team to deal with North Korea. 


Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: B.B. on April 23, 2017, 12:46:38 PM
The point is your navy has no business being there. It is a provocative action. If you left them alone, they wouldn't need to remind you they will defend themselves.

Lulz.  If only. 


Trump is itching to invade the place - for no reason - and ruin it as you did with Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.

The Europeans were all hot and heavy to intervene in Libya, and we pretty much got *invited* into Afghanistan.

This is the US doing what it does, and Trump doing exactly the opposite of what he said he would do. I fail to see how this "makes America great again" or why you people might make whooping noises at the prospect of more war.

As I noted, above, Trump exercised some hard power on Assad, and later on Afghanistan.  A few bombs doth not an "invasion" make.  With the NoKos, he did a drive by with the Carl Vinson.

The US would love nothing more than for Kim Jong Un to stop threatening SoKo and Japan, and go back to watching Donald Duck cartoons.  Or maybe that was his father.  In any case, Trump is doing precisely what he should do, which is signal to China that KJU is *their* problem and they need to handle it.

For folks who live in SoKo, there are basically, in sum, 11 months of "normal" and one month of Kim behaving like a twit and other countries responding.  Simple.

B/B
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on April 23, 2017, 01:10:07 PM


There is no war with North Korea. So why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?

Did I  miss something?  When was the peace treaty signed?

I take it that you did not notice that there has not been a state of war for many years? That there is an armistice, but not a peace treaty, between North and South Korea? That the United States has no territorial claims upon North Korea?
Whoops no, that'd require some knowledge as opposed to 'feelz' and programming.

Time for you lot to start acquiring the knowledge required to enable you to overcome your programing because right now your lack of knowledge is what allows you lot to go along with the madness of your leadership.

Why is it that you always try to insult people?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 23, 2017, 05:11:26 PM
The point is your navy has no business being there. It is a provocative action. If you left them alone, they wouldn't need to remind you they will defend themselves.

Lulz.  If only. 


Trump is itching to invade the place - for no reason - and ruin it as you did with Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.

The Europeans were all hot and heavy to intervene in Libya, and we pretty much got *invited* into Afghanistan.

This is the US doing what it does, and Trump doing exactly the opposite of what he said he would do. I fail to see how this "makes America great again" or why you people might make whooping noises at the prospect of more war.

As I noted, above, Trump exercised some hard power on Assad, and later on Afghanistan.  A few bombs doth not an "invasion" make.  With the NoKos, he did a drive by with the Carl Vinson.

The US would love nothing more than for Kim Jong Un to stop threatening SoKo and Japan, and go back to watching Donald Duck cartoons.  Or maybe that was his father.  In any case, Trump is doing precisely what he should do, which is signal to China that KJU is *their* problem and they need to handle it.

For folks who live in SoKo, there are basically, in sum, 11 months of "normal" and one month of Kim behaving like a twit and other countries responding.  Simple.

B/B

You are all flip-flopping and avoiding the question.

Here it is again:

The point is your navy has no business being there. It is a provocative action. If you left them alone, they wouldn't need to remind you they will defend themselves.

Can one of our American friends tell us WHY Trump is provoking NK?

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 23, 2017, 06:09:19 PM
Since only North Korea has nuclear weapons this is pretty much the Chinese saying the North must get rid of them. It appears the North Koreans appear to be getting ready for another Nuclear test. Another possibly answer that was given some time ago was to give the South Koreans nuclear weapons which China has said would lead to nuclear war as soon as we started to ship them. 

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/china-urges-korea-peninsula-denuclearisation/ar-BBAbiWy?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=U218DHP

Let talk about a nuclear Ukraine and see what Putin does. I bet if we were to even talk about a Nuclear Canada with missiles that could reach Russia, Putin would go Crazy. 

Manny maybe you need to take a chill pill or something until you get over it. Our Navy has the right to be in international waters all over the world like everyone else's Navy including that of Russia and Great Britain.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Tom Cat on April 23, 2017, 06:13:03 PM
Looks more like North Korea is the one looking for a fight. Has Trump threatened to nuke NK?

North Korea threatens Australia with nuclear strike over 'toeing the line' with U.S.

https://www.aol.com/article/news/2017/04/23/north-korea-threatens-australia-with-nuclear-strike-over-toeing-line-with-us-alliance/22051796/

US tells North Korea to cease 'destabilizing actions and rhetoric'

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/23/politics/pentagon-north-korea/
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: B.B. on April 23, 2017, 08:00:22 PM
You are all flip-flopping and avoiding the question.

Here it is again:

The point is your navy has no business being there. It is a provocative action. If you left them alone, they wouldn't need to remind you they will defend themselves.

Can one of our American friends tell us WHY Trump is provoking NK?

KJU is rattling his cage bars again, and when he unsettles our Allies in the region (i.e. SoKo and Japan) Big Daddy turns up and reminds "Little Fatty the Third" (which is what he is called in the Chinese press) and reminds him to stay in his own lane. Simples.  All KJU has to to is tend to his own knitting, but he can't help himself.

B/B
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on April 23, 2017, 08:58:57 PM

Here it is again:

The point is your navy has no business being there. It is a provocative action. If you left them alone, they wouldn't need to remind you they will defend themselves.

Can one of our American friends tell us WHY Trump is responding to the provocations of NK?

Because sometimes we really are the leader of the free World, at least in this case. and FTFY.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: tonton on April 23, 2017, 09:33:30 PM
Looks more like North Korea is the one looking for a fight. Has Trump threatened to nuke NK?

North Korea threatens Australia with nuclear strike over 'toeing the line' with U.S.

https://www.aol.com/article/news/2017/04/23/north-korea-threatens-australia-with-nuclear-strike-over-toeing-line-with-us-alliance/22051796/

US tells North Korea to cease 'destabilizing actions and rhetoric'

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/23/politics/pentagon-north-korea/

We are not taking that threat seriously. That dictator knows he will blown away if any action happens against us, US, UK etc
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: tonton on April 23, 2017, 09:43:19 PM
http://www.news.com.au/world/north-america/north-korea-slams-americas-gross-animal/news-story/ec93aebd0a80b6c8ec0400f006071acd


US Navy has cancelled Australia trip, rather head to Korean waters.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on April 24, 2017, 04:29:19 AM
Our Navy has the right to be in international waters all over the world like everyone else's Navy including that of Russia and Great Britain.

GB hasn't got a Navy .... the United Kingdom used to have one .... 'We' haven't got a working aircraft carrier at the mo :)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on April 24, 2017, 07:30:44 AM
This is why the Ukraine needs nuclear weapons to protect against Russia silliness.

I have read some strange and whacky ideas on RUA, but this might be the winner for this year.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Volshe on April 24, 2017, 09:05:48 AM
This is why the Ukraine needs nuclear weapons to protect against Russia silliness.

I have read some strange and whacky ideas on RUA, but this might be the winner for this year.

 (:)

Avvy, are you surprised the idea comes from Texan77?

How do you know you are shopping in Texas? @ 0:13

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: dcguyusa on April 24, 2017, 04:46:11 PM
All 100 US Senators were called to a meeting with the President on Wednesday about NK issue.  Also, the National Security team and Secretaries of State and Defense will be there too.   :whist11:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on April 24, 2017, 05:43:53 PM

There is no war with North Korea. So why has a bloke elected on a "no wars" rhetoric suddenly decided to do his best to start one?

Did I  miss something?  When was the peace treaty signed?

I take it that you did not notice that there has not been a state of war for many years? That there is an armistice, but not a peace treaty, between North and South Korea? That the United States has no territorial claims upon North Korea?
Whoops no, that'd require some knowledge as opposed to 'feelz' and programming.

Time for you lot to start acquiring the knowledge required to enable you to overcome your programing because right now your lack of knowledge is what allows you lot to go along with the madness of your leadership.

Perhaps Andrew buying a dictionary (in English) may be helpful for your postings and knowledge. An armistice is a cessation of hostilities but with regads to the Korean Peninsula it has been frequently broken. Bear in mind between the Korea's there have been numerous weapons fired at each other since with resulting loss of life. North Korea has for as long as I can recall used threatening language directed to South Korea, Japan and The United States. For quite a few years now they have tried to develop nuclear weapons and launch vehicles.

No where is anyone bringing up territorial claims, but you feel it is necessary to belittle another poster via a falsehood. Way to go big man.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on April 24, 2017, 09:56:29 PM


I have read some strange and whacky ideas on RUA, but this might be the winner for this year.

You DO remember Ukraine declared itself nuclear non-aligned - having the 3rd largest stock of Nukes in '91 ?

But it was OK - a few Nuked up nations said that they would project her integrity ...

That worked out well for them ........
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on April 25, 2017, 02:45:24 AM
Avhdb, please take more care. When you write it is convenient to make sure that you do not contradict yourself. (at least you did not pull the specious call to authority trick again)

As you pointed out, when trying to disagree with me, there is an armistice and the Koreans are not at war.

It is not the Koreans winding up the bellicosity.

Time to sleep it off old boy. The liver is less effective as one reaches early old age.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Tom Cat on April 27, 2017, 08:23:04 PM
Exclusive: Trump says 'major, major' conflict with North Korea possible, but seeks diplomacy

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN17U04E
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: dcguyusa on May 09, 2017, 04:53:50 PM
Time to evacuate.  It will be all over soon!

Quote
Prepare for what comes next

http://nypost.com/2017/05/08/anonymous-warns-world-to-prepare-for-world-war-3/

https://www.yahoo.com/news/north-korea-could-preparing-electromagnetic-224138037.html

Quote
I don’t think we will survive another 1,000 years without escaping beyond our fragile planet
Quote
I think the development of full artificial intelligence could spell the end of the human race

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/speaking-of-science/wp/2017/05/05/stephen-hawking-just-moved-up-humanitys-deadline-for-escaping-earth/?utm_term=.43e9a8aa8b28

Hasta la vista, baby    :chuckle:   :scared0005:  :o
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on May 09, 2017, 10:21:19 PM
Avhdb, please take more care. When you write it is convenient to make sure that you do not contradict yourself. (at least you did not pull the specious call to authority trick again)

As you pointed out, when trying to disagree with me, there is an armistice and the Koreans are not at war.

It is not the Koreans winding up the bellicosity.

Time to sleep it off old boy. The liver is less effective as one reaches early old age.

The armistice is a temporary cease fire and north Korea consider itself the only real government of the one Korea. This is about like the eastern Ukraine except with nuclear weapons and medium range missiles. I guess you would not call that a war neither would you. There is a ceasefire there also. 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on May 27, 2019, 08:13:39 AM
North Korea calls John Bolton a “defective human”.  :laugh:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/1249183001
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: dcguyusa on May 28, 2019, 04:52:56 PM
Kim Jong Un also said Biden was a "low IQ" person, so they have equal opportunity insults there.   :chuckle:

Saw the video program "Korea: the never ending war".  When the Japanese got booted out at the end of WW 2, they divided up the country just like Berlin.  Funny, when one group tries to take control of the whole map and then when you kick them out, all of the subjugated then emerge to take over the power vacuum.  However, they have to rely on the victors to try to get the upper hand over the other competing factions.  Three terms come out from that period.
38th parallel - let's just put a boundary line here.
Pusan perimeter - North Korea nearly takes over the entire peninsula
Landing at Inchon - a highly questionable offensive to cut the invading forces off from behind
 :fighting0025:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 30, 2019, 05:12:32 AM
I’m contemplating a trip to North Korea later this year.  :nod:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on May 30, 2019, 07:55:01 AM
I’m contemplating a trip to North Korea later this year.  :nod:

I would NOT risk that! You’re a family man with others relying on you.  :coffeeread:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on May 30, 2019, 08:20:17 AM
Unless the U.S starts dropping bombs on North Korea I am sure he will be perfectly safe - he won't do daft stuff like taking posters for souvenirs!
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on May 30, 2019, 08:27:15 AM
I like going to interesting countries but one that starved it's citizens...?

Not on my wish list
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steveboy on May 30, 2019, 08:56:00 AM
I’m contemplating a trip to North Korea later this year.  :nod:

If you need any close quarter protection just let me know.. But I don't come cheap!! You get what you pay for!! If a situation arrises I can get you out alive and in one piece  :laugh:

(https://scontent-arn2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/29871999_10212069592871845_8883128159240205502_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_ht=scontent-arn2-1.xx&oh=b25b113d1700e901194924df8144b235&oe=5D8AEDAC)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on May 30, 2019, 09:53:56 AM
I’m contemplating a trip to North Korea later this year.  :nod:

If you need any close quarter protection just let me know.. But I don't come cheap!! You get what you pay for!! If a situation arrises I can get you out alive and in one piece  :laugh:

(https://scontent-arn2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/29871999_10212069592871845_8883128159240205502_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_ht=scontent-arn2-1.xx&oh=b25b113d1700e901194924df8144b235&oe=5D8AEDAC)

You don’t know too much about N. Korean military training do you?

They’d quickly beat the phock out of you, then you’d be another Otto Warmbier and leave in a coma, if you even left at all.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steveboy on May 30, 2019, 10:02:57 AM
I’m contemplating a trip to North Korea later this year.  :nod:

If you need any close quarter protection just let me know.. But I don't come cheap!! You get what you pay for!! If a situation arrises I can get you out alive and in one piece  :laugh:

(https://scontent-arn2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/29871999_10212069592871845_8883128159240205502_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_ht=scontent-arn2-1.xx&oh=b25b113d1700e901194924df8144b235&oe=5D8AEDAC)

You don’t know too much about N. Korean military training do you?

They’d quickly beat the phock out of you, then you’d be another Otto Warmbier and leave in a coma, if you even left at all.

You think Im going to have some N Korean 4ft midget give me a hard time.. :ROFL:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on May 30, 2019, 10:18:07 AM
I’m contemplating a trip to North Korea later this year.  :nod:

If you need any close quarter protection just let me know.. But I don't come cheap!! You get what you pay for!! If a situation arrises I can get you out alive and in one piece  :laugh:

(https://scontent-arn2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/29871999_10212069592871845_8883128159240205502_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_ht=scontent-arn2-1.xx&oh=b25b113d1700e901194924df8144b235&oe=5D8AEDAC)

You don’t know too much about N. Korean military training do you?

They’d quickly beat the phock out of you, then you’d be another Otto Warmbier and leave in a coma, if you even left at all.

You think Im going to have some N Korean 4ft midget give me a hard time.. :ROFL:

Just imagine that you are the board they’re smashing.  :laugh:

         
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steveboy on May 30, 2019, 10:29:30 AM
I’m contemplating a trip to North Korea later this year.  :nod:

If you need any close quarter protection just let me know.. But I don't come cheap!! You get what you pay for!! If a situation arrises I can get you out alive and in one piece  :laugh:


I would never put my self in the situation of being "the board" Christ they are bloody slow!! I would of grabbed his foot and broken it within a few seconds..  ;D
(https://scontent-arn2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/29871999_10212069592871845_8883128159240205502_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_ht=scontent-arn2-1.xx&oh=b25b113d1700e901194924df8144b235&oe=5D8AEDAC)

You don’t know too much about N. Korean military training do you?

They’d quickly beat the phock out of you, then you’d be another Otto Warmbier and leave in a coma, if you even left at all.

You think Im going to have some N Korean 4ft midget give me a hard time.. :ROFL:

Just imagine that you are the board they’re smashing.  :laugh:

         

I would never put my self in the position of being "The board" they are as slow as hell.. I would of broken his foot by now.. :Zzzzsleep:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on May 30, 2019, 05:32:14 PM
I’m contemplating a trip to North Korea later this year.  :nod:

If you need any close quarter protection just let me know.. But I don't come cheap!! You get what you pay for!! If a situation arrises I can get you out alive and in one piece  :laugh:


I would never put my self in the situation of being "the board" Christ they are bloody slow!! I would of grabbed his foot and broken it within a few seconds..  ;D
(https://scontent-arn2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/29871999_10212069592871845_8883128159240205502_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_ht=scontent-arn2-1.xx&oh=b25b113d1700e901194924df8144b235&oe=5D8AEDAC)

You don’t know too much about N. Korean military training do you?

They’d quickly beat the phock out of you, then you’d be another Otto Warmbier and leave in a coma, if you even left at all.

You think Im going to have some N Korean 4ft midget give me a hard time.. :ROFL:

Just imagine that you are the board they’re smashing.  :laugh:

         

I would never put my self in the position of being "The board" they are as slow as hell.. I would of broken his foot by now.. :Zzzzsleep:

Bruce Lee famously said “boards don’t hit back”.

In your case you wouldn’t be hitting back either, after they pulverized you.  :chuckle:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on May 30, 2019, 11:12:03 PM
 Kim Jong Un executes officials of the failed nuke summit and send others to hard labor and re-education camps.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/north-koreas-kim-jong-un-carrying-out-purge-after-hanoi-summit-collapse-chosun-ilbo/ar-AAC9ZgJ?ocid=spartanntp
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steveboy on May 31, 2019, 03:11:37 AM
Kim Jong Un executes officials of the failed nuke summit and send others to hard labor and re-education camps.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/north-koreas-kim-jong-un-carrying-out-purge-after-hanoi-summit-collapse-chosun-ilbo/ar-AAC9ZgJ?ocid=spartanntp

Yeah but I think it is a good idea..  :laugh:

They never did the job properly ... If that rule was applied to everyone life would be much better.. for a start the population would be halved and secondly everyone else would be doing their job as they are supposed to be doing..  nice one.. :ROFL:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on May 31, 2019, 06:46:37 AM
A word to the wise, manny and steve: don't go accepting jobs as advisors or negotiators for the DPRK.

On the basis that such an opportunity is unlikely to be presented, one can infer that one is pretty safe in North Korea.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steveboy on May 31, 2019, 08:15:37 AM
What I don't understand is these people who work for him in one way or another..

If I was one of these guys and I knew I **** up a job I certainly wouldn't be going home to drink tea..I would of packed my bags and got out of there, in fact I would of had a contingency plan even before I started the job..

I like the idea of the hard labour camps though, it is some thing the UK needs , I know thousands already that 3 years hard labour would give a totally different view on life..

It would also be a good way to deter petty criminals , at the moment they just go to holiday camps!!

N Korea has its good points!  :laugh:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 31, 2019, 10:10:35 AM
I like going to interesting countries but one that starved it's citizens...?

Not on my wish list

There is actually quite a large and vibrant tourist industry that has sprung up. Departures are from Vladivostok or Beijing. I’m researching at the moment and will probably do it as a side trip while in China in a few months.

I’m thinking of maybe five days, quite a few firms do interesting trips. Starvation not required.

Look at the #NorthKorea on Instagram and it looks like the world and his wife are there already. Its heaving with Russians.

As with Russia or China, North Korea is no different in the respect that if you don’t do silly things nothing bad happens. With the propaganda that Americans are fed, I can see why it might be an eye-opening prospect for some over the pond.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on May 31, 2019, 10:40:10 AM
What I don't understand is these people who work for him in one way or another..

If I was one of these guys and I knew I **** up a job I certainly wouldn't be going home to drink tea..I would of packed my bags and got out of there, in fact I would of had a contingency plan even before I started the job..

I like the idea of the hard labour camps though, it is some thing the UK needs , I know thousands already that 3 years hard labour would give a totally different view on life..

It would also be a good way to deter petty criminals , at the moment they just go to holiday camps!!

N Korea has its good points!  :laugh:

This killing of advisors is a common trope used by propagandists. The idea feeds into the dehumanisation and demonisation of opponents - essential if one is to enable the sheeple to hate and fight the supposed enemy. The problem is that whilst there may be some basis in truth, that is, somebody might've been executed, at some time in the past, too many of the 'executed' turn up fresh as a daisy and bright as a button at some point after their supposed forced leap off this mortal coil.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steveboy on May 31, 2019, 05:18:00 PM
I like going to interesting countries but one that starved it's citizens...?

Not on my wish list

There is actually quite a large and vibrant tourist industry that has sprung up. Departures are from Vladivostok or Beijing. I’m researching at the moment and will probably do it as a side trip while in China in a few months.

I’m thinking of maybe five days, quite a few firms do interesting trips. Starvation not required.

Look at the #NorthKorea on Instagram and it looks like the world and his wife are there already. Its heaving with Russians.

As with Russia or China, North Korea is no different in the respect that if you don’t do silly things nothing bad happens. With the propaganda that Americans are fed, I can see why it might be an eye-opening prospect for some over the pond.

I should think there is! Auschwitz is pretty popular now with the tourists they do plenty of tours around the place, and the prisoners are all dead.. so not really much to see..

You get a better deal in North Korea , they do tours of live and working concentration and labour camps where you can actually see REAL ALIVE starving people with a few executions chucked in..

They even have a feeding time just like at the zoo , and for a few $ you can chuck cabbages in for the prisoners.. :laugh:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on May 31, 2019, 08:31:08 PM

They never did the job properly ... If that rule was applied to everyone life would be much better.. for a start the population would be halved and secondly everyone else would be doing their job as they are supposed to be doing..  nice one.. :ROFL:

What's a proper job? Make no deal and get executed. Make a deal with Trump, give up too much, and get executed.

This killing of advisors is a common trope used by propagandists. The idea feeds into the dehumanisation and demonisation of opponents - essential if one is to enable the sheeple to hate and fight the supposed enemy.


If you worked for somebody and they killed you because your work performance was unsatisfactory, you don't want us to believe they are a bad person? When's the last time anybody seen Un's uncle?

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steveboy on June 01, 2019, 12:30:36 AM

They never did the job properly ... If that rule was applied to everyone life would be much better.. for a start the population would be halved and secondly everyone else would be doing their job as they are supposed to be doing..  nice one.. :ROFL:

What's a proper job? Make no deal and get executed. Make a deal with Trump, give up too much, and get executed.

This killing of advisors is a common trope used by propagandists. The idea feeds into the dehumanisation and demonisation of opponents - essential if one is to enable the sheeple to hate and fight the supposed enemy.


If you worked for somebody and they killed you because your work performance was unsatisfactory, you don't want us to believe they are a bad person? When's the last time anybody seen Un's uncle?

Funny species human beings!! They juuuuust love killing each other ....

Chimps don't do it
Ants don't do it
cows don't do it
Dolphins don't do it

Actually even plants don't do it?

I know the praying mantis kind of does it!

It's just humans..  :laugh:  yeah funny planet we live on...

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on June 01, 2019, 02:39:19 AM
Billy, we already know that you are very susceptible to propaganda, especially when it feeds directly to your prejudices and fears so here are a couple of examples for you of how you have been lied to and why you need to be a little more sceptical of what you are told by your favoured propagandists:

Kim Jong Un's ex-girlfriend executed: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/hyon-song-wol_n_3837098
Kim Jong Un's ex-girlfriend resurrected: https://nypost.com/2014/05/17/kim-jong-uns-executed-ex-seen-alive-on-tv/
Kim Jong Un's ex-girlfriend elected to a senior party position: http://english.chosun.com/site/data/html_dir/2017/10/10/2017101001096.html

General executed as part of a reign of terror: https://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/11/world/asia/north-korea-ri-yong-gil-reportedly-executed.html
General resurrected and working in a senior administration role: https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/may/10/ri-yong-gil-north-korean-general-thought-be-execut/

The cool thing about how propaganda works with people like you is that you get told about the first story, you remember it, because it fits with your prejudices and, of course, you don't ever seek out the truth.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 01, 2019, 09:58:24 AM

Andrew, I asked where's Un's uncle? How about his half brother assassinated in Vietnam? Propaganda too? If you want evidence, go to N Korea and break the law and come back and tell us there's no hard labor camps where people get beaten. Or you can just ask the many people who escaped about the system there. In a court of law, witness testimony is evidence. I don't believe everything I hear but when enough people who's been there, done that say certain events happened and none of those people know each other but have the same story, then it's likely true.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 01, 2019, 03:13:47 PM
I think we can all agree the streets of North Korea are safer than those of the USA?

I expect there is a zero likelihood of being shot either by criminals or the police.

Another dozen shot in the town hall in Virginia Beach today I gather......

I expect that is another tough pill to swallow for our friends over the pond.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 01, 2019, 11:55:32 PM
I think we can all agree the streets of North Korea are safer than those of the USA?


I can agree the streets in N Korea are safer than in America. People are scared to get in trouble. They have no freedoms to carry weapons. Most are skinny, small, malnourished and weak. I've never heard of a N Korean citizen going off on a tourist. It's the government that one needs to worry about. Even with gun deaths in America, most N Koreans would prefer life here than over there. Most Americans don't care how Un runs his country. We just don't want the nut to have nukes.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on June 02, 2019, 01:22:43 AM
I think we can all agree the streets of North Korea are safer than those of the USA?

I expect there is a zero likelihood of being shot either by criminals or the police.

Another dozen shot in the town hall in Virginia Beach today I gather......

I expect that is another tough pill to swallow for our friends over the pond.

I think any major european city (maybe paris excepted) is safer than most american large cities.

I can walk at night in any district of amsterdam without fear of being killed. Robbed maybe, but not killed.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on June 02, 2019, 01:52:29 AM
I think we can all agree the streets of North Korea are safer than those of the USA?


I can agree the streets in N Korea are safer than in America. People are scared to get in trouble. They have no freedoms to carry weapons. Most are skinny, small, malnourished and weak. I've never heard of a N Korean citizen going off on a tourist. It's the government that one needs to worry about. Even with gun deaths in America, most N Koreans would prefer life here than over there. Most Americans don't care how Un runs his country. We just don't want the nut to have nukes.

Who the fcuk are you (plural) to dictate to another independent Nation what they must do for the defence of their Nation and to protect their country from from threatening bullies like the USA ?

Here in the UK we say:

"Take care of your own backyard and then come and teach us how to suck eggs!"

The fact of the matter is that IF N Korea did not have its nukes, for sure the US would have used its forces, stationed and occupying the S. Korea peninsula and also those in Japan to invade and destroy the country, making it a thorn in China's under belly, who is your real ENEMY for your survival.

I think any major european city (maybe paris excepted) is safer than most american large cities.

I can walk at night in any district of amsterdam without fear of being killed. Robbed maybe, but not killed.

Mark

You are wasting your time...... he will think you are telling him porkies.

Actually BillyB have you been out of the US after escaping "Uncle Ho" ("Ho Chi Minh") arriving in Saigon?

JUST WONDER.......

 ;D  :coffeeread:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 02, 2019, 02:00:09 AM
I agree that if Kim didn’t have nukes as a deterrent the US would have invaded and killed him by now.

NK isn’t a threat unless you prod them with a sharp stick. Leave them be and they’ll leave you be.

The actions of the US around the world is a way bigger threat to stability and peace than NK will ever be.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 02, 2019, 09:31:10 AM
Who the fcuk are you (plural) to dictate to another independent Nation what they must do for the defence of their Nation and to protect their country from from threatening bullies like the USA ?


Wiz, if you  fukc  with me disguising it as defense, I fukc with you to make your life uncomfortable. That is how life works.

I agree that if Kim didn’t have nukes as a deterrent the US would have invaded and killed him by now.


I don't think so. Un's father and grandfather both survived from the 1950 ceasefire to 2006 before they acquired nukes and America hasn't invaded them. We've given them concessions, not war.

NK isn’t a threat unless you prod them with a sharp stick. Leave them be and they’ll leave you be.


S Korea is constantly harassed by N Korea. S Korea's land gets shelled, missiles shot over their heads, people kidnapped, and boats sunk. N Korea is the biggest counterfeiter of American dollars in the world. They also sell nuke technology to America's enemies. If a neighbor of yours is hostile to you, shoots over your head, kidnap or family, and sells weapons to neighbors that are hostile to you, you are free to do nothing hoping that is the trick that will make it all go away. I will do something my neighbor doesn't like. Don't fault America for taking care of it's friends and being hostile to our enemies. This type of taking care of friends and being hostile to enemies behavior has been happening since the beginning of man. It's normal behavior.


Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on June 02, 2019, 09:37:27 AM
Who the fcuk are you (plural) to dictate to another independent Nation what they must do for the defence of their Nation and to protect their country from from threatening bullies like the USA ?


Wiz, if you  fukc  with me disguising it as defense, I fukc with you to make your life uncomfortable. That is how life works.

I agree that if Kim didn’t have nukes as a deterrent the US would have invaded and killed him by now.


I don't think so. Un's father and grandfather both survived from the 1950 ceasefire to 2006 before they acquired nukes and America hasn't invaded them. We've given them concessions, not war.

NK isn’t a threat unless you prod them with a sharp stick. Leave them be and they’ll leave you be.


S Korea is constantly harassed by N Korea. S Korea's land gets shelled, missiles shot over their heads, people kidnapped, and boats sunk. N Korea is the biggest counterfeiter of American dollars in the world. They also sell nuke technology to America's enemies. If a neighbor of yours is hostile to you, shoots over your head, kidnap or family, and sells weapons to neighbors that are hostile to you, you are free to do nothing hoping that is the trick that will make it all go away. I will do something my neighbor doesn't like. Don't fault America for taking care of it's friends and being hostile to our enemies. This type of taking care of friends and being hostile to enemies behavior has been happening since the beginning of man. It's normal behavior.

Kim Jong Un starves his own people and sends his closest associates to labor camps or murders them with artilary.

He’s a sick puppy and megalomaniac, not the type of character who should get a nuke.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on June 02, 2019, 11:20:07 AM
Who the fcuk are you (plural) to dictate to another independent Nation what they must do for the defence of their Nation and to protect their country from from threatening bullies like the USA ?


Wiz, if you  fukc  with me disguising it as defense, I fukc with you to make your life uncomfortable. That is how life works.

Billy

After all the years you know me you should know better, by now, that i don't take threats kindly neither I am afraid of such threats like yours.

If you can't accept criticism for your New country USA, then don't get involved in any discussion and debate.

I expect you must have noticed that Europeans have a very different outlook on the news coming from the US, mostly fake and also see the world very different from the programmed and brainwashed American public from the Zionist controlled Mass Media.

BTW North Korea is supported and protected by China and that is why you have not invaded the country..... and

Confederate....I read a report from a Greek woman reporter that visited NK and she did not reported any starvation.......and any lack of consumer food and other items is probably it's down to the US Sanctions.

 tiphat
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on June 02, 2019, 12:22:31 PM
Who the fcuk are you (plural) to dictate to another independent Nation what they must do for the defence of their Nation and to protect their country from from threatening bullies like the USA ?


Wiz, if you  fukc  with me disguising it as defense, I fukc with you to make your life uncomfortable. That is how life works.

Billy

After all the years you know me you should know better, by now, that i don't take threats kindly neither I am afraid of such threats like yours.

If you can't accept criticism for your New country USA, then don't get involved in any discussion and debate.

I expect you must have noticed that Europeans have a very different outlook on the news coming from the US, mostly fake and also see the world very different from the programmed and brainwashed American public from the Zionist controlled Mass Media.

BTW North Korea is supported and protected by China and that is why you have not invaded the country..... and

Confederate....I read a report from a Greek woman reporter that visited NK and she did not reported any starvation.......and any lack of consumer food and other items is probably it's down to the US Sanctions.

 tiphat

It’s too easy for a dictator to hide starving people from prying eyes. Walter Duranty famously fell for that trick.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theatlantic.com/amp/article/542610/
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 02, 2019, 12:53:38 PM
After all the years you know me you should know better, by now, that i don't take threats kindly neither I am afraid of such threats like yours.

If you can't accept criticism for your New country USA, then don't get involved in any discussion and debate.


It's no threat Wiz. Just telling you how it works in the world on a personal and national level. Before criticizing the actions of America, acknowledge the reasons why America takes action on N Korea. They threaten America, counterfeit our money, and threaten our friends S Korea and Japan. If somebody bullied you, wouldn't you call for help such as the cops? S Korea and Japan has called on America.

If you can't accept criticism for your New country USA, then don't get involved in any discussion and debate.


I criticized N Korea and people couldn't accept the criticism and got upset.

BTW North Korea is supported and protected by China and that is why you have not invaded the country..... and


And S Korea is supported and protected by America. S Koreans are doing extremely well and are a major economic competitor to China. China doesn't want to see them unified in the way Germany was. Some or should I say few, choose to ally themselves with China and Russia and reject Western nations. Can you tell me one nation that relies on China and/or Russia and is doing well? Their problem isn't America.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 02, 2019, 01:51:42 PM
Kim Jong Un starves his own people and sends his closest associates to labor camps or murders them with artilary.

I have yet to see this "starves his own people" lark. The US will lock up its enemies till the end of time given a chance. The US murders many of thousands of people a year. With artillery. Abroad mostly, but sometimes it's your own cops on the streets. Some states also murder their criminals. Not so different when one looks at outcomes.

He’s a sick puppy and megalomaniac, not the type of character who should get a nuke.

Some would say the same about Trump.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 02, 2019, 02:02:33 PM
Can you tell me one nation that relies on China and/or Russia and is doing well? Their problem isn't America.

Well, aside from China being the world's biggest economy itself (or second depending how you measure), it's a fact that any country that seeks to do much with either gets sanctioned by the US who then leans on its cohorts (like the EU and the UK) to follow suit.

So what you are essentially saying is that US bullying has often historically worked.

And that is exactly why Russia, China and others seek to circumvent and exclude the US in many ways from de-dollarisation to self sufficiency to new payment systems or trade between themselves. The aggressive US hegemony needs to be carefully dismantled. It's a work in progress that seems to be going quite well. Hence why the US is lashing out against North Korea, Russia, China and others.

Russia prevented you from stealing Crimea and gaining full control of Ukraine, Russia prevented you from ousting and killing Assad, China (and NK's nukes) prevented you from ousting and killing Un. You are being boxed off each time you move to destroy another country. It's doubtful you'll be left alone to invade Venezuela either. Again, why you are lashing out like a wounded dinosaur. Russia, China and even Kim with his nukes are preventing the animal from feeding. The world is hearing the howls of hunger........
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on June 02, 2019, 02:26:59 PM
News for Billy.

Another top Korean official has been 'unexecuted'. More people rise from the dead in North Korea than anywhere else in the world. In the Middle East, just one man rises from the dead and he starts a new religion. In North Korea, or at least U.S reporting of Korean affairs, it is almost tiresome in its routineness!

Another North Korean general rises from the dead: https://edition.cnn.com/2016/05/10/asia/north-korea-army-chief-ri-yong-gil-alive/index.html

Here's another one, this time the bloke who was supposed to have been executed after the talks went badly in Hanoi: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2019/05/31/report-north-korean-officials-execution-prompts-skepticism-concern-about-gaps-knowledge/?utm_term=.96aca27389d1

Billy, when will you cease the gullibility? When will you learn to question your programming?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 02, 2019, 02:37:23 PM
Ahh yes, the resurrections.

Remember when he was alleged by western media to have bumped off his wife Ri Sol-ju?

Quote from: Fake News
Speculation is growing over the whereabouts of North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un 's wife - who has not been seen in public for SEVEN months.

There are genuine, growing fears that she has fallen out of favour with the leader of the communist state and/or his family.......

..............But Kim Jong-un also has form for getting rid of those close to him if they fall out of favour.

Source (https://www.sde.co.ke/article/2000221760/fears-grow-as-wife-of-north-korean-dictator-kim-jong-un-missing).

Oh but then she appeared again making jokes about the speculation:

Quote
Sept. 21 (UPI) -- North Korea first lady Ri Sol Ju reportedly asked a South Korean magician visiting Pyongyang if he could "make her disappear" during the landmark inter-Korea summit this week, according to a South Korean press report.

Source (https://www.upi.com/Top_News/World-News/2018/09/21/Report-North-Koreas-Ri-Sol-Ju-jokes-to-magician-about-disappearing/3851537548898/).

Yep, another one not dead.  :coffeeread:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on June 02, 2019, 03:05:03 PM
Who the fcuk are you (plural) to dictate to another independent Nation what they must do for the defence of their Nation and to protect their country from from threatening bullies like the USA ?


Wiz, if you  fukc  with me disguising it as defense, I fukc with you to make your life uncomfortable. That is how life works.

Billy remember what you post remains here...... and I suggest ask somebody else to explain to you the tone and language you have used. Never mind don't give a F......

I will suggest you to take a good time off and read the USA history after the end of WWII till today.

Starting with the Korean war...... were nearly 5 million people died. More than half of these–about 10 percent of Korea's prewar population–were civilians. (This rate of civilian casualties was higher than World War II's and Vietnam's.) Almost 40,000 Americans died in action in Korea, and more than 100,000 were wounded.

... and then you continue with the Vietnam war.

In 1995 Vietnam released its official estimate of war dead: as many as 2 million civilians on both sides and some 1.1 million North Vietnamese and Viet Cong fighters. The U.S. military has estimated that between 200,000 and 250,000 South Vietnamese soldiers died in the war.

I will let you continue reading and learn the History of the USA after WWII till today, because the list is very long......"The United States has invaded about 200 nations and territories."

Just to be helpful here is a list: Historically, how many countries has the US invaded? (https://www.quora.com/Historically-how-many-countries-has-the-US-invaded)

also

These are all the countries the USA has invaded, in one map (https://www.indy100.com/article/usa-american-army-invasions-police-actions-overseas-dod-defense-war-troops-deployment-marines-7908611)

Well I see some other people joined the debate..... so time for me to go to sleep.......early start tomorrow.

I hope you will learn something about the HISTORY OF the USA, the "Evil Empire", as President Ga ga Reagan said

I sea you are getting to start a war with Iran, on behalf of your Master... IsraHel but before it starts......

READ THIS: Iranians Ready for War Against US Great Satan; Khamenei Prophesies Total Persian Victory (https://russia-insider.com/en/iranians-ready-war-against-us-great-satan-khamenei-prophesies-total-persian-victory/ri27075?ct=t(Russia_Insider_Daily_Headlines11_21_2014)&mc_cid=e09b4c7229&mc_eid=da9ae1910f)

Enjoy it!

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on June 02, 2019, 04:02:55 PM
Kim Jong Un starves his own people and sends his closest associates to labor camps or murders them with artilary.

I have yet to see this "starves his own people" lark. The US will lock up its enemies till the end of time given a chance. The US murders many of thousands of people a year. With artillery. Abroad mostly, but sometimes it's your own cops on the streets. Some states also murder their criminals. Not so different when one looks at outcomes.

He’s a sick puppy and megalomaniac, not the type of character who should get a nuke.

Some would say the same about Trump.

 :laugh:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 02, 2019, 04:33:06 PM
And that is exactly why Russia, China and others seek to circumvent and exclude the US in many ways from de-dollarisation to self sufficiency to new payment systems or trade between themselves. The aggressive US hegemony needs to be carefully dismantled. It's a work in progress that seems to be going quite well. Hence why the US is lashing out against North Korea, Russia, China and others.


Good luck to those nations in their new endeavors. Hopefully someday they would be trusted more than America so that other nations would adopt their currencies and invite their troops into their homes. I don't think their plan is going to work. They need to figure out how to build trust first.

Ahh yes, the resurrections.

Remember when he was alleged by western media to have bumped off his wife Ri Sol-ju?

Quote from: Fake News
Speculation is growing over the whereabouts of North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un 's wife - who has not been seen in public for SEVEN months.

There are genuine, growing fears that she has fallen out of favour with the leader of the communist state and/or his family.......

..............But Kim Jong-un also has form for getting rid of those close to him if they fall out of favour.

Source (https://www.sde.co.ke/article/2000221760/fears-grow-as-wife-of-north-korean-dictator-kim-jong-un-missing).

Oh but then she appeared again making jokes about the speculation:

Quote
Sept. 21 (UPI) -- North Korea first lady Ri Sol Ju reportedly asked a South Korean magician visiting Pyongyang if he could "make her disappear" during the landmark inter-Korea summit this week, according to a South Korean press report.

Source (https://www.upi.com/Top_News/World-News/2018/09/21/Report-North-Koreas-Ri-Sol-Ju-jokes-to-magician-about-disappearing/3851537548898/).

Yep, another one not dead.  :coffeeread:

Nowhere in the article it claims Un wife was executed or dead. Just speculation there was marital problems or she was pregnant.

News for Billy.

Another top Korean official has been 'unexecuted'. More people rise from the dead in North Korea than anywhere else in the world. In the Middle East, just one man rises from the dead and he starts a new religion. In North Korea, or at least U.S reporting of Korean affairs, it is almost tiresome in its routineness!

Another North Korean general rises from the dead: https://edition.cnn.com/2016/05/10/asia/north-korea-army-chief-ri-yong-gil-alive/index.html

Here's another one, this time the bloke who was supposed to have been executed after the talks went badly in Hanoi: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2019/05/31/report-north-korean-officials-execution-prompts-skepticism-concern-about-gaps-knowledge/?utm_term=.96aca27389d1

Billy, when will you cease the gullibility? When will you learn to question your programming?

I don't care about those guys. I asked you where is Un's uncle and half brother. Not everything in life is propaganda Andrew. I can believe mistakes in intelligence gathering happens but too many people do get executed, sent to hard labor or re-education camps and starve in N Korea and some here support the man in charge.

Billy remember what you post remains here...... and I suggest ask somebody else to explain to you the tone and language you have used. Never mind don't give a F......


When you take a hostile tone with somebody, you need to expect a hostile reaction. That's life. And you wonder why America is upset with Iran and N Korea?

I will suggest you to take a good time off and read the USA history after the end of WWII till today.

Starting with the Korean war...... were nearly 5 million people died. More than half of these–about 10 percent of Korea's prewar population–were civilians. (This rate of civilian casualties was higher than World War II's and Vietnam's.) Almost 40,000 Americans died in action in Korea, and more than 100,000 were wounded.

... and then you continue with the Vietnam war.

In 1995 Vietnam released its official estimate of war dead: as many as 2 million civilians on both sides and some 1.1 million North Vietnamese and Viet Cong fighters. The U.S. military has estimated that between 200,000 and 250,000 South Vietnamese soldiers died in the war.

I will let you continue reading and learn the History of the USA after WWII till today, because the list is very long......"The United States has invaded about 200 nations and territories."

Just to be helpful here is a list: Historically, how many countries has the US invaded? (https://www.quora.com/Historically-how-many-countries-has-the-US-invaded)

also

These are all the countries the USA has invaded, in one map (https://www.indy100.com/article/usa-american-army-invasions-police-actions-overseas-dod-defense-war-troops-deployment-marines-7908611)


After WWII, America was glad the war was over and wanted to relax. After all, we didn't want to participate in the war but came in late due to being bombed by Japan. The USSR remained active and went into Eastern Europe to spread influence. They supported their commie friends in China, Korea, and Vietnam. America was late to China but supported our friends in Korea and Vietnam. The communist side in China, Korea, and Vietnam went to war against those that didn't want Communism.

You're free to believe whatever history you want. I'm just glad America ended on top. Now China realizes our money is critical to their success. Vietnam is real friendly with us and wants to do business. South Korea is thriving and have a better standard of living than China and Vietnam since they were able to keep the Communists out.


Ukraine has repeatedly chosen to seek closer ties with the West.


Poland is similar in size to Ukraine in size, population, and in location. Ukrainian watch Poland get out from Russia's foot and have a good standard of living with good income on par or better than the average Russian. Ukraine remained under Russia's foot and makes 3 times less than the average Russian. Most Ukrainians tried Russia and don't like it. Can't blame them for wanting a better life and desire to have closer ties to the West, like Poland did.






Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 02, 2019, 08:49:03 PM
And that is exactly why Russia, China and others seek to circumvent and exclude the US in many ways from de-dollarisation to self sufficiency to new payment systems or trade between themselves. The aggressive US hegemony needs to be carefully dismantled. It's a work in progress that seems to be going quite well. Hence why the US is lashing out against North Korea, Russia, China and others.


Good luck to those nations in their new endeavors. Hopefully someday they would be trusted more than America so that other nations would adopt their currencies and invite their troops into their homes. I don't think their plan is going to work. They need to figure out how to build trust first.

Ahh yes, the resurrections.

Remember when he was alleged by western media to have bumped off his wife Ri Sol-ju?

Quote from: Fake News
Speculation is growing over the whereabouts of North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un 's wife - who has not been seen in public for SEVEN months.

There are genuine, growing fears that she has fallen out of favour with the leader of the communist state and/or his family.......

..............But Kim Jong-un also has form for getting rid of those close to him if they fall out of favour.

Source (https://www.sde.co.ke/article/2000221760/fears-grow-as-wife-of-north-korean-dictator-kim-jong-un-missing).

Oh but then she appeared again making jokes about the speculation:

Quote
Sept. 21 (UPI) -- North Korea first lady Ri Sol Ju reportedly asked a South Korean magician visiting Pyongyang if he could "make her disappear" during the landmark inter-Korea summit this week, according to a South Korean press report.

Source (https://www.upi.com/Top_News/World-News/2018/09/21/Report-North-Koreas-Ri-Sol-Ju-jokes-to-magician-about-disappearing/3851537548898/).

Yep, another one not dead.  :coffeeread:

Nowhere in the article it claims Un wife was executed or dead. Just speculation there was marital problems or she was pregnant.

News for Billy.

Another top Korean official has been 'unexecuted'. More people rise from the dead in North Korea than anywhere else in the world. In the Middle East, just one man rises from the dead and he starts a new religion. In North Korea, or at least U.S reporting of Korean affairs, it is almost tiresome in its routineness!

Another North Korean general rises from the dead: https://edition.cnn.com/2016/05/10/asia/north-korea-army-chief-ri-yong-gil-alive/index.html

Here's another one, this time the bloke who was supposed to have been executed after the talks went badly in Hanoi: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2019/05/31/report-north-korean-officials-execution-prompts-skepticism-concern-about-gaps-knowledge/?utm_term=.96aca27389d1

Billy, when will you cease the gullibility? When will you learn to question your programming?

I don't care about those guys. I asked you where is Un's uncle and half brother. Not everything in life is propaganda Andrew. I can believe mistakes in intelligence gathering happens but too many people do get executed, sent to hard labor or re-education camps and starve in N Korea and some here support the man in charge.

Billy remember what you post remains here...... and I suggest ask somebody else to explain to you the tone and language you have used. Never mind don't give a F......


When you take a hostile tone with somebody, you need to expect a hostile reaction. That's life. And you wonder why America is upset with Iran and N Korea?

I will suggest you to take a good time off and read the USA history after the end of WWII till today.

Starting with the Korean war...... were nearly 5 million people died. More than half of these–about 10 percent of Korea's prewar population–were civilians. (This rate of civilian casualties was higher than World War II's and Vietnam's.) Almost 40,000 Americans died in action in Korea, and more than 100,000 were wounded.

... and then you continue with the Vietnam war.

In 1995 Vietnam released its official estimate of war dead: as many as 2 million civilians on both sides and some 1.1 million North Vietnamese and Viet Cong fighters. The U.S. military has estimated that between 200,000 and 250,000 South Vietnamese soldiers died in the war.

I will let you continue reading and learn the History of the USA after WWII till today, because the list is very long......"The United States has invaded about 200 nations and territories."

Just to be helpful here is a list: Historically, how many countries has the US invaded? (https://www.quora.com/Historically-how-many-countries-has-the-US-invaded)

also

These are all the countries the USA has invaded, in one map (https://www.indy100.com/article/usa-american-army-invasions-police-actions-overseas-dod-defense-war-troops-deployment-marines-7908611)


After WWII, America was glad the war was over and wanted to relax. After all, we didn't want to participate in the war but came in late due to being bombed by Japan. The USSR remained active and went into Eastern Europe to spread influence. They supported their commie friends in China, Korea, and Vietnam. America was late to China but supported our friends in Korea and Vietnam. The communist side in China, Korea, and Vietnam went to war against those that didn't want Communism.

You're free to believe whatever history you want. I'm just glad America ended on top. Now China realizes our money is critical to their success. Vietnam is real friendly with us and wants to do business. South Korea is thriving and have a better standard of living than China and Vietnam since they were able to keep the Communists out.


Ukraine has repeatedly chosen to seek closer ties with the West.


Poland is similar in size to Ukraine in size, population, and in location. Ukraine watched Poland get out from Russia's foot and have a good standard of living with good income on par or better than the average Russian. Ukraine remained under Russia's foot and makes 3 times less than the average Russian. Most Ukrainians tried Russia and don't like it. Can't blame them for wanting a better life and desire to have closer ties to the West, like Poland did.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Steveboy on June 03, 2019, 02:21:14 AM
And that is exactly why Russia, China and others seek to circumvent and exclude the US in many ways from de-dollarisation to self sufficiency to new payment systems or trade between themselves. The aggressive US hegemony needs to be carefully dismantled. It's a work in progress that seems to be going quite well. Hence why the US is lashing out against North Korea, Russia, China and others.


Good luck to those nations in their new endeavors. Hopefully someday they would be trusted more than America so that other nations would adopt their currencies and invite their troops into their homes. I don't think their plan is going to work. They need to figure out how to build trust first.

Ahh yes, the resurrections.

Remember when he was alleged by western media to have bumped off his wife Ri Sol-ju?

Quote from: Fake News
Speculation is growing over the whereabouts of North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un 's wife - who has not been seen in public for SEVEN months.

There are genuine, growing fears that she has fallen out of favour with the leader of the communist state and/or his family.......

..............But Kim Jong-un also has form for getting rid of those close to him if they fall out of favour.

Source (https://www.sde.co.ke/article/2000221760/fears-grow-as-wife-of-north-korean-dictator-kim-jong-un-missing).

Oh but then she appeared again making jokes about the speculation:

Quote
Sept. 21 (UPI) -- North Korea first lady Ri Sol Ju reportedly asked a South Korean magician visiting Pyongyang if he could "make her disappear" during the landmark inter-Korea summit this week, according to a South Korean press report.

Source (https://www.upi.com/Top_News/World-News/2018/09/21/Report-North-Koreas-Ri-Sol-Ju-jokes-to-magician-about-disappearing/3851537548898/).

Yep, another one not dead.  :coffeeread:

Nowhere in the article it claims Un wife was executed or dead. Just speculation there was marital problems or she was pregnant.

News for Billy.

Another top Korean official has been 'unexecuted'. More people rise from the dead in North Korea than anywhere else in the world. In the Middle East, just one man rises from the dead and he starts a new religion. In North Korea, or at least U.S reporting of Korean affairs, it is almost tiresome in its routineness!

Another North Korean general rises from the dead: https://edition.cnn.com/2016/05/10/asia/north-korea-army-chief-ri-yong-gil-alive/index.html

Here's another one, this time the bloke who was supposed to have been executed after the talks went badly in Hanoi: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2019/05/31/report-north-korean-officials-execution-prompts-skepticism-concern-about-gaps-knowledge/?utm_term=.96aca27389d1

Billy, when will you cease the gullibility? When will you learn to question your programming?

I don't care about those guys. I asked you where is Un's uncle and half brother. Not everything in life is propaganda Andrew. I can believe mistakes in intelligence gathering happens but too many people do get executed, sent to hard labor or re-education camps and starve in N Korea and some here support the man in charge.

Billy remember what you post remains here...... and I suggest ask somebody else to explain to you the tone and language you have used. Never mind don't give a F......


When you take a hostile tone with somebody, you need to expect a hostile reaction. That's life. And you wonder why America is upset with Iran and N Korea?

I will suggest you to take a good time off and read the USA history after the end of WWII till today.

Starting with the Korean war...... were nearly 5 million people died. More than half of these–about 10 percent of Korea's prewar population–were civilians. (This rate of civilian casualties was higher than World War II's and Vietnam's.) Almost 40,000 Americans died in action in Korea, and more than 100,000 were wounded.

... and then you continue with the Vietnam war.

In 1995 Vietnam released its official estimate of war dead: as many as 2 million civilians on both sides and some 1.1 million North Vietnamese and Viet Cong fighters. The U.S. military has estimated that between 200,000 and 250,000 South Vietnamese soldiers died in the war.

I will let you continue reading and learn the History of the USA after WWII till today, because the list is very long......"The United States has invaded about 200 nations and territories."

Just to be helpful here is a list: Historically, how many countries has the US invaded? (https://www.quora.com/Historically-how-many-countries-has-the-US-invaded)

also

These are all the countries the USA has invaded, in one map (https://www.indy100.com/article/usa-american-army-invasions-police-actions-overseas-dod-defense-war-troops-deployment-marines-7908611)


After WWII, America was glad the war was over and wanted to relax. After all, we didn't want to participate in the war but came in late due to being bombed by Japan. The USSR remained active and went into Eastern Europe to spread influence. They supported their commie friends in China, Korea, and Vietnam. America was late to China but supported our friends in Korea and Vietnam. The communist side in China, Korea, and Vietnam went to war against those that didn't want Communism.

You're free to believe whatever history you want. I'm just glad America ended on top. Now China realizes our money is critical to their success. Vietnam is real friendly with us and wants to do business. South Korea is thriving and have a better standard of living than China and Vietnam since they were able to keep the Communists out.


Ukraine has repeatedly chosen to seek closer ties with the West.


Poland is similar in size to Ukraine in size, population, and in location. Ukrainian watch Poland get out from Russia's foot and have a good standard of living with good income on par or better than the average Russian. Ukraine remained under Russia's foot and makes 3 times less than the average Russian. Most Ukrainians tried Russia and don't like it. Can't blame them for wanting a better life and desire to have closer ties to the West, like Poland did.


Poland is similar in size to Ukraine in size, population, and in location. Ukrainian watch Poland get out from Russia's foot and have a good standard of living with good income on par or better than the average Russian. Ukraine remained under Russia's foot and makes 3 times less than the average Russian. Most Ukrainians tried Russia and don't like it. Can't blame them for wanting a better life and desire to have closer ties to the West, like Poland did.

Yeah that's right! Poland have a better life style, new roads, new airports new ******* no wonder they have been using the EU as their own personal Cash cow for years!! ... :laugh:  Roads in Dorset are full of bloody pot holes and patches..

It's pretty easy to understand why Ukraine also want to move closer to the West...  :laugh: 

They also want new roads, new airports lots of new stuff and of course don't want to have to pay for it.. but the truth is they don't want any thing new, they just want the cash to steal "its what they do" in that part of the world..

Yeah I agree every one want to improve their lives, BUT unfortunately you have to work to  do that.. not pinch stuff..
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on June 03, 2019, 04:34:14 AM
Billy, you are, at the least, being disingenuous in trying to be specific about two particular people. You also referred to specific people as having been executed using horrendous means who we already know have come back from the dead.

The point I was trying, but obviously failing to make, is that you have fallen for propaganda about what happens in North Korea. Even when you are shown that the propaganda is untrue, you still cling to your programmed beliefs.

There is no way for I, or anyone else, to prove a negative, that a particular thing has not happened. However, there are some things we can know to be true:
1) North Korea employs the death penalty for certain crimes.
2) The United States employs the death penalty for certain crimes.
While I am not a great believer in the benefit of 'whataboutery' in an informed discussion, here it is relevant. The country that has adopted you employs exactly the same sort of legal sanctions as North Korea and thus it seems rather hypocritical to use execution as punishment for certain types of crime as a basis for criticism.

3) You believe the fairy stories about executions and their mode in North Korea despite plenty of evidence that such executions do not take place - evidence provided by the simple fact that the claimed victims are alive and well.

4) It is perfectly likely that Kim Jong-un's uncle has been executed. North Korean state media have said as much. From publically available information, he certainly seems to have been acting in a manner that was illegal and likely to carry the death penalty. Once one delves below the flowery and indirect language of the charges against him, it'd seem that he was organising a coup against the legitimate government. Given what we know, it seems very unlikely that any of the propaganda stories about how the execution was carried out match the reality because of the fact that the claimed victims of similar executions are alive and well.

5) Kim Jong-nam was certainly murdered, but there is no indication that it was carried out by representatives of the North Korean state or government although propaganda media has certainly pointed an evidence-free finger in that direction. The two women who carried out the murder did not suggest that the murder was linked to North Korea and the circumstances would suggest otherwise.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on June 03, 2019, 10:43:52 AM

I like going to interesting countries but one that starved it's citizens...?

Not on my wish list

There is actually quite a large and vibrant tourist industry that has sprung up. Departures are from Vladivostok or Beijing. I’m researching at the moment and will probably do it as a side trip while in China in a few months.

I’m thinking of maybe five days, quite a few firms do interesting trips. Starvation not required.

Look at the #NorthKorea on Instagram and it looks like the world and his wife are there already. Its heaving with Russians.

As with Russia or China, North Korea is no different in the respect that if you don’t do silly things nothing bad happens. With the propaganda that Americans are fed, I can see why it might be an eye-opening prospect for some over the pond.

Apart from your 'large and vibrant' claim - I seriously doubt you or I would be allowed to see / talk to  NK folk away from the cities

THIS is a report from an organisation that worked with the permission of the NK govt and agreed aims to improve the situation

https://reliefweb.int/sites/reliefweb.int/files/resources/DPRK%20Needs%20and%20Priorities%202017.pdf (https://reliefweb.int/sites/reliefweb.int/files/resources/DPRK%20Needs%20and%20Priorities%202017.pdf)

"two in five under-nourished"

A country that blocks internet access to the outside world ...  and 'news' is from the state controlled media, only


As I said - not on my wish list ... I have no desire to be a propaganda tool 






Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 03, 2019, 11:32:20 AM
I have no desire to be a propaganda tool

Unless on behalf of the BBC or the Guardian.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on June 03, 2019, 11:34:16 AM

Unless on behalf of the BBC or the Guardian.

You may be confusing your 'journalistic efforts' ...

I've rung a BBC phone in once ...     

Unlike you - do not take money for my opinion - nor accept paid advertising

Glad we cleared THAT one up .. 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on June 03, 2019, 01:38:19 PM
Can you tell me one nation that relies on China and/or Russia and is doing well? Their problem isn't America.

Well, aside from China being the world's biggest economy itself (or second depending how you measure), it's a fact that any country that seeks to do much with either gets sanctioned by the UK Globalists who then leans on its cohorts (like the EU and the USA) to follow suit.

So what you are essentially saying is that UK Globalists bullying has often historically worked.

And that is exactly why Russia, China and others seek to circumvent and exclude the UK Globalists in many ways from de-dollarisation to self sufficiency to new payment systems or trade between themselves. The aggressive UK Globalists hegemony needs to be carefully dismantled. It's a work in progress that seems to be going quite well. Hence why the UK Globalists is lashing out against North Korea, Russia, China and others.

Russia prevented UK Globalists from stealing Crimea and gaining full control of Ukraine, Russia prevented UK Globalists from ousting and killing Assad, China (and NK's nukes) prevented UK Globalists from ousting and killing Un. UK Globalists are being boxed off each time you move to destroy another country. It's doubtful UK Globalists will be left alone to invade Venezuela either. Again, why UK Globalists are lashing out like a wounded dinosaur. Russia, China and even Kim with his nukes are preventing the animal from feeding. The world is hearing the howls of hunger........
  There fixed all the Anti-USA rubbish for you...

And a bit of an interesting fact:

Donald J. Trump
‏Verified account
@realDonaldTrump
 2h2 hours ago
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1135603282104213504 
Russia has informed us that they have removed most of their people from Venezuela.

Interesting looks like Russia would rather work with the USA on improving trade relations then get bogged down in a Communist Chinese-Communist Cuba lead coup against the freedom-loving peoples of Venezuela...  Astounds one really how much the UK and EU have become such major Communists lovers after a 70 year Cold War with the old Soviets and now Communist Freaking Red Chinese Marxist worshippers.

Maybe you can buy some oceanside property cheap in the Peoples Communist Paradise of North Korea.  Good luck on ya!
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on June 03, 2019, 01:48:12 PM
Russia says something different.

Looks like more poor USAians are being misled again.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1135671/venezuela-crisis-vladimir-putin-news-russia-nicolas-maduro-washington-caracas-spt/amp

You poor misled, gullible, people.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on June 03, 2019, 02:04:04 PM
Russia says something different.

Looks like more poor USAians are being misled again.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1135671/venezuela-crisis-vladimir-putin-news-russia-nicolas-maduro-washington-caracas-spt/amp

You poor misled, gullible, people.

More assinine tripe from RUAs Yank Hater in Chief Lord Fifi... hmm from your link...

The Wall Street Journal reported on Sunday that Rostec – who train Venezuelan troops and offer advice on weapons contracts – cut their numbers to just a few dozen as crisis grips the nation. While there were up to 1000 staff in Caracas, the report goes on to say that a loss of trust in Venezuelan leader Nicolas Maduro was a key factor in the mass withdrawal. However, in response to the article, Russian ambassador to Venezuela Vladimir Zaemsky told Russian news outlet Sputnik: "This is another piece of 'news' which has absolutely nothing to do with reality.

Will be easy enough to verify via satellite how many giant Russian Antonov etc type Cargo Jets are left in the Communist Peoples Paradise of Venezuela a week or two from now.   Even Andrew Lord Fifi the omniscient knows that while Military Advisors withdraw from a potential theater of combat that has become over-heated that their Gov officials provide plausible deniability to again cover their intentions/withdrawal lest the shaken Cuban troops re-enforcing the Maduro regime lash out as the Russians quietly pull out under cover of night.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 03, 2019, 04:33:35 PM
Unlike you - do not take money for my opinion -

Because nobody offered you any money for your opinion. That may give you an indication as to the value of your opinion versus the value of mine. :coffeeread:

Nice job of trolling the North Korea topic by the way. Let’s return to the topic.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 03, 2019, 10:57:28 PM
There is no way for I, or anyone else, to prove a negative, that a particular thing has not happened. However, there are some things we can know to be true:

1) North Korea employs the death penalty for certain crimes.
2) The United States employs the death penalty for certain crimes.


Well, I guess that makes America and N Korea equals. No difference at all. (:)

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on June 04, 2019, 02:32:58 PM
Bang!!  Yuuuuge impact on Communist Cuba with sanctions greatly increased to reduce Cuban Military's access to hard currency.

US bans cruise ship travel to Cuba amid new restrictions:
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-48503821

Expect to see similar tightening on Communist Freaking Red China and their Commies puppets the NoKors and Murderer and Starver in Chief Kim Junk Un.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 16, 2019, 12:33:04 PM
So during a future visit to China, I was contemplating a side visit to North Korea. It's not terribly expensive and for anyone interested, I thought I'd drop a link of the outfit I am looking at: https://www.uritours.com/tours/the-dprk-weekender-north-korea/

A multi visit Chinese visa and the ability to arrive in Beijing or Shanghai is needed.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on July 16, 2019, 02:44:44 PM
So during a future visit to China, I was contemplating a side visit to North Korea. It's not terribly expensive and for anyone interested, I thought I'd drop a link of the outfit I am looking at: https://www.uritours.com/tours/the-dprk-weekender-north-korea/

A multi visit Chinese visa and the ability to arrive in Beijing or Shanghai is needed.

I’ve quite fancied seeing N Korea for some time. Irrespective of the veneer, it would be fascinating to see first hand.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: dcguyusa on July 16, 2019, 05:49:12 PM
Remember not to take any posters, pass out religious materials, or handle any controlled substances or you will be sorry.   :chuckle:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on July 16, 2019, 07:41:04 PM
Why the hell would anyone wanna go to N.Korea? it's a wasteland.  Google Otto Warmbier
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Lord of the Dance on July 16, 2019, 09:33:45 PM
Remember not to take any posters, pass out religious materials, or handle any controlled substances or you will be sorry.   :chuckle:

True, although I hardly think Manny will be doing any of that. The one thing that comes to mind is having proper documentation for any prescription medications one might be traveling with, but I'm sure he knows that.

Personally, you can count me out for any visitation there… too many 'ghost stories.'  :laugh:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 16, 2019, 11:38:47 PM
Remember not to take any posters, pass out religious materials, or handle any controlled substances or you will be sorry.   :chuckle:

True, although I hardly think Manny will be doing any of that. The one thing that comes to mind is having proper documentation for any prescription medications one might be traveling with, but I'm sure he knows that.

Personally, you can count me out for any visitation there… too many 'ghost stories.'  :laugh:

Ditto. You couldn’t catch me dead in NK.  :o
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on July 17, 2019, 01:34:46 AM
Not pointing fingers here but the reactions between people from certain countries is interesting.

Europeans/Brits tend to be curious and open to visiting Korea. The US boys are far more cynical.

I wonder, is that down to media hype and bogey man stories in your press, or are you just concerned that karma might catch up with you, after what you boys did to the Koreans earlier this century?  ;D
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Lord of the Dance on July 17, 2019, 02:19:49 AM
Not pointing fingers here but the reactions between people from certain countries is interesting.

Europeans/Brits tend to be curious and open to visiting Korea. The US boys are far more cynical.

I wonder, is that down to media hype and bogey man stories in your press, or are you just concerned that karma might catch up with you, after what you boys did to the Koreans earlier this century?  ;D

I'm mostly thinking of that poor kid from the States that visited a few years ago and made the unwise decision to toy with a state banner. He was sentenced to hard labor and by the time he was returned home, he was in a coma. I think he died shortly thereafter. What's there to see and do anyway? It seems that the government only permits limited tourism with special 'guides' to show you around where they so choose. Do they have nice malls, museums, restaurants, theaters and the like to visit? I mean I figure they must have something, but probably not anything I'd be interested in.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: 2tallbill on July 17, 2019, 04:45:35 AM

I wonder, is that down to media hype and bogey man stories
in your press, or are you just concerned that karma might catch up with you, after what you boys did to the Koreans earlier this century?  ;D


My Dad is 79 years old but he was 10 when the Korean war
started and 13 when it was over. I would be interested in
seeing Angkor Wat in Cambodia and Americans fought
there in my lifetime.

There are plenty of bogey man stories for sure. My brother was
in the Army and spent two tours in Korea, his bogey man stories sounded pretty credible to me.

If I was going to go on a holiday/vacation, I would be far more
interested in going to Seoul than Pyongyang. Am I curious? Sure
I am, but curious enough to load up the family spend 16+ hours
to get there when I haven't seen the Pyramids or Machu Picchu
yet?

There are at least 50 places I would really, really like to see
before I start feeding the worms and Pyongyang doesn't
crack the top 50.

Lastly, we Americans are somewhat restricted from traveling
to certain places and North Korea is one of those places.
We have to get a special validation

https://koryogroup.com/blog/can-us-citizens-travel-to-north-korea

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 17, 2019, 05:41:25 AM
Do they have nice malls, museums, restaurants, theaters and the like to visit? I mean I figure they must have something, but probably not anything I'd be interested in.

They have a captured American navy ship and a US plane they shot down in a museum people can gawp at.  :chuckle:

Quote
Pueblo, still held by North Korea today, officially remains a commissioned vessel of the United States Navy. Since early 2013, the ship has been moored along the Potong River in Pyongyang, and used there as a museum ship at the Pyongyang Victorious War Museum. Pueblo is the only ship of the U.S. Navy still on the commissioned roster currently being held captive.

There's actually quite a lot to see there for those interested in political history.

Europeans/Brits tend to be curious and open to visiting Korea. The US boys are far more cynical.

I wonder, is that down to media hype and bogey man stories in your press, or are you just concerned that karma might catch up with you, after what you boys did to the Koreans earlier this century?  ;D

Our friends over the pond are generally cautious about anywhere they think of as the "enemy" - why they go bint hunting in Ukraine instead of Russia, why they are scared or NK or China. The prospect of visas seems to perplex them too. As a nation, they're not great travellers; as you know so few of them even have a passport.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on July 17, 2019, 06:41:16 AM
Are you trying to up the post count with this ?..


Our friends over the pond are generally cautious about anywhere they think of as the "enemy" - why they go bint hunting in Ukraine instead of Russia, why they are scared or NK or China. The prospect of visas seems to perplex them too. As a nation, they're not great travellers; as you know so few of them even have a passport.

1/ YOU are on record moaning  about getting a RU visa from the UK..

2/ Nations - whose govts are setting off conflicts in their neighbours and issuing passports to citizens of those states (and posioning their citizens on UK soil ) are not 'friendly' acts ..

Many Brits think travelling to Spain and getting pissed out of their tiny minds and coming back with Tats is the epitomy of overseas travel..  I'd not be too quick to mock other nations


No doubt you can move this to my 'Russophobe' thread - lest too many of our cousins might read this ;)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: 2tallbill on July 17, 2019, 06:42:50 AM
Our friends over the pond are generally cautious about anywhere they think of as the "enemy" - why they go bint hunting in Ukraine instead of Russia, why they are scared or NK or China. The prospect of visas seems to perplex them too. As a nation, they're not great travellers; as you know so few of them even have a passport.

Most of the Americans on this forum have passports, and that's who
your talking to. I've personally been to Russia and married a girl from
there. Fear about travel to China? I haven't heard that one before,
is it new?

I'm not sure why you need to do your occasional American bashing. 
I don't like following up with my version of UK bashing, since it lumps
in a bunch of guys that I like around here.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 09:20:12 AM
Not pointing fingers here but the reactions between people from certain countries is interesting.

Europeans/Brits tend to be curious and open to visiting Korea. The US boys are far more cynical.

I wonder, is that down to media hype and bogey man stories in your press, or are you just concerned that karma might catch up with you, after what you boys did to the Koreans earlier this century?  ;D

What did we do, other than liberate half a continent from a murderous regime that starves it’s own citizens to death and “re-educates” free thinkers?

And what is this “you boys”? The UK, Canada, Australia and NZ were part of that action.

Not pointing fingers huh? Perhaps those who give much needed foreign currency to such a regime should consider what they are supporting.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 09:25:10 AM

I wonder, is that down to media hype and bogey man stories
in your press, or are you just concerned that karma might catch up with you, after what you boys did to the Koreans earlier this century?  ;D


My Dad is 79 years old but he was 10 when the Korean war
started and 13 when it was over. I would be interested in
seeing Angkor Wat in Cambodia and Americans fought
there in my lifetime.

There are plenty of bogey man stories for sure. My brother was
in the Army and spent two tours in Korea, his bogey man stories sounded pretty credible to me.

If I was going to go on a holiday/vacation, I would be far more
interested in going to Seoul than Pyongyang. Am I curious? Sure
I am, but curious enough to load up the family spend 16+ hours
to get there when I haven't seen the Pyramids or Machu Picchu
yet?

There are at least 50 places I would really, really like to see
before I start feeding the worms and Pyongyang doesn't
crack the top 50
.

Lastly, we Americans are somewhat restricted from traveling
to certain places and North Korea is one of those places.
We have to get a special validation

https://koryogroup.com/blog/can-us-citizens-travel-to-north-korea

Only 50? Let me help!!

https://www.amazon.com/000-Places-See-Before-You/dp/0761156860/ref=nodl_


Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 09:30:53 AM
Gee let me think about this. Visit a drab Communist country or go to a paradise like Hawaii, Fiji, Tahiti, etc

Anywhere on the California Coast. Lake Tahoe, Reno, Las Vegas....

Such a tough decision!  :laugh:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on July 17, 2019, 09:49:52 AM
Our friends over the pond are generally cautious about anywhere they think of as the "enemy" - why they go bint hunting in Ukraine instead of Russia, why they are scared or NK or China. The prospect of visas seems to perplex them too. As a nation, they're not great travellers; as you know so few of them even have a passport.

Most of the Americans in this forum have passports, and that's who
your talking to. I've personally been to Russia and married a girl from
there. Fear about travel to China? I haven't heard that one before,
is it new?

I'm not sure why you need to do your occasional American bashing. 
I don't like following up with my version of UK bashing, since it lumps
in a bunch of guys that I like around here.

This particular member has worked in 18 different countries plus visited another dozen or so.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on July 17, 2019, 10:23:16 AM
We travel for many reasons. Some just want to sit on a beach, others want new experiences and some travel to learn. The latter usually incorporates part of the second reason - experiences.

I too would like to visit North Korea but I'd likley  do so as part of a return visit to China, much as Manny would do.

Sunny beaches I can get anywhere. I hardly count that as travel.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 10:30:18 AM
Our friends over the pond are generally cautious about anywhere they think of as the "enemy" - why they go bint hunting in Ukraine instead of Russia, why they are scared or NK or China. The prospect of visas seems to perplex them too. As a nation, they're not great travellers; as you know so few of them even have a passport.

Most of the Americans in this forum have passports, and that's who
your talking to. I've personally been to Russia and married a girl from
there. Fear about travel to China? I haven't heard that one before,
is it new?

I'm not sure why you need to do your occasional American bashing. 
I don't like following up with my version of UK bashing, since it lumps
in a bunch of guys that I like around here.

This particular member has worked in 18 different countries plus visited another dozen or so.

How does someone manage to work in 18 different countries?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 17, 2019, 10:44:32 AM
Our friends over the pond are generally cautious about anywhere they think of as the "enemy" - why they go bint hunting in Ukraine instead of Russia, why they are scared or NK or China. The prospect of visas seems to perplex them too. As a nation, they're not great travellers; as you know so few of them even have a passport.

Most of the Americans on this forum have passports, and that's who
your talking to.

We have many more readers than participants. I'm talking to readers and of the US ones of those, most won't have a passport. I agree old hands and participants are more likely to, but the sentence started with "as a nation........" to exclude blokes like you. So faux offence not necessary.

I'm not sure why you need to do your occasional American bashing. 
I don't like following up with my version of UK bashing, since it lumps
in a bunch of guys that I like around here.

You love posting and quipping about snaggle toothed Brits and you know it.  :chuckle:

1/ YOU are on record moaning  about getting a RU visa from the UK..

Hardly moaning...... discussing perhaps.

2/ Nations - whose govts are setting off conflicts in their neighbours and issuing passports to citizens of those states (and posioning their citizens on UK soil ) are not 'friendly' acts ..

Nice bit of anti-Russian propaganda, but this is a topic on North Korea. Wipe the Novichok foam from around your mouth........

Many Brits think travelling to Spain and getting pissed out of their tiny minds and coming back with Tats is the epitomy of overseas travel.. 

I agree, but hardly the point.

No doubt you can move this to my 'Russophobe' thread - lest too many of our cousins might read this ;)

No doubt.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Lord of the Dance on July 17, 2019, 10:49:14 AM
Do they have nice malls, museums, restaurants, theaters and the like to visit? I mean I figure they must have something, but probably not anything I'd be interested in.

They have a captured American navy ship and a US plane they shot down in a museum people can gawp at.  :chuckle:

Quote
Pueblo, still held by North Korea today, officially remains a commissioned vessel of the United States Navy. Since early 2013, the ship has been moored along the Potong River in Pyongyang, and used there as a museum ship at the Pyongyang Victorious War Museum. Pueblo is the only ship of the U.S. Navy still on the commissioned roster currently being held captive.

There's actually quite a lot to see there for those interested in political history.

Which I'm sure they're all too enthused to display. Well whatever floats your boat Manny.  ;D

It would be interesting to see some tourist literature about North Korea. For instance, what are the hotels like? I don't suppose you might find a Four Seasons over there…?  :ROFL:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 17, 2019, 10:51:19 AM
If I was going to go on a holiday/vacation, I would be far more
interested in going to Seoul than Pyongyang. Am I curious? Sure
I am, but curious enough to load up the family spend 16+ hours
to get there when I haven't seen the Pyramids or Machu Picchu
yet?

For me that isnt a family visit. Kids dont understand it and wifey said that being born in the USSR she has no interest in going there.

There are at least 50 places I would really, really like to see
before I start feeding the worms and Pyongyang doesn't
crack the top 50.

I've been to a lot of places. The places I haven't been to that I want to are mostly in that area now: NK, SK, Singapore, Vietnam, etc. I enjoy China and Hong Kong and want to have a mooch about out there a bit. And NK is a very interesting place if you look at the photos and accounts of those who have been rather than what you read in your fake news media and acquire by groupthink osmosis.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 17, 2019, 10:52:45 AM
It would be interesting to see some tourist literature about North Korea. For instance, what are the hotels like? I don't suppose you might find a Four Seasons over there…?  :ROFL:

From my research, I'll be staying in the Koryo:


Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on July 17, 2019, 11:06:02 AM
Our friends over the pond are generally cautious about anywhere they think of as the "enemy" - why they go bint hunting in Ukraine instead of Russia, why they are scared or NK or China. The prospect of visas seems to perplex them too. As a nation, they're not great travellers; as you know so few of them even have a passport.

Most of the Americans in this forum have passports, and that's who
your talking to. I've personally been to Russia and married a girl from
there. Fear about travel to China? I haven't heard that one before,
is it new?

I'm not sure why you need to do your occasional American bashing. 
I don't like following up with my version of UK bashing, since it lumps
in a bunch of guys that I like around here.

This particular member has worked in 18 different countries plus visited another dozen or so.

How does someone manage to work in 18 different countries?

One travels to the country, one does some work, one leaves the country.  I only lived in 4 of the countries.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 11:14:23 AM
Our friends over the pond are generally cautious about anywhere they think of as the "enemy" - why they go bint hunting in Ukraine instead of Russia, why they are scared or NK or China. The prospect of visas seems to perplex them too. As a nation, they're not great travellers; as you know so few of them even have a passport.

Most of the Americans in this forum have passports, and that's who
your talking to. I've personally been to Russia and married a girl from
there. Fear about travel to China? I haven't heard that one before,
is it new?

I'm not sure why you need to do your occasional American bashing. 
I don't like following up with my version of UK bashing, since it lumps
in a bunch of guys that I like around here.

This particular member has worked in 18 different countries plus visited another dozen or so.

How does someone manage to work in 18 different countries?

One travels to the country, one does some work, one leaves the country.  I only lived in 4 of the countries.

Interesting. Some sort of self-employed contractor?

I only managed to live and work in a 2nd country.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Lord of the Dance on July 17, 2019, 11:14:39 AM
It would be interesting to see some tourist literature about North Korea. For instance, what are the hotels like? I don't suppose you might find a Four Seasons over there…?  :ROFL:

From my research, I'll be staying in the Koryo:


Well you have yourself a nice stay at the ping-pong inn and don't forget to bow to their statues.  :)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 11:24:49 AM
It would be interesting to see some tourist literature about North Korea. For instance, what are the hotels like? I don't suppose you might find a Four Seasons over there…?  :ROFL:

From my research, I'll be staying in the Koryo:


Did you watch that video? Guests are not allowed to step off of the property and go explore the city.

By admission of the person filming they’re in a type of prison.

I’d rather tour a Museum of Hitler and the Third Reich. At least there the guides can speak the truth.  :coffeeread:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on July 17, 2019, 11:35:16 AM
Are you trying to up the post count with this ?..


Our friends over the pond are generally cautious about anywhere they think of as the "enemy" - why they go bint hunting in Ukraine instead of Russia, why they are scared or NK or China. The prospect of visas seems to perplex them too. As a nation, they're not great travellers; as you know so few of them even have a passport.

1/ YOU are on record moaning  about getting a RU visa from the UK..

2/ Nations - whose govts are setting off conflicts in their neighbours and issuing passports to citizens of those states (and posioning their citizens on UK soil ) are not 'friendly' acts ..

Many Brits think travelling to Spain and getting pissed out of their tiny minds and coming back with Tats is the epitomy of overseas travel..  I'd not be too quick to mock other nations


No doubt you can move this to my 'Russophobe' thread - lest too many of our cousins might read this ;)

Oh, look who’s come along to argue, derail and disagree with everything.  :rolleye0009:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 12:04:01 PM
Not pointing fingers here but the reactions between people from certain countries is interesting.

Europeans/Brits tend to be curious and open to visiting Korea. The US boys are far more cynical.

I wonder, is that down to media hype and bogey man stories in your press, or are you just concerned that karma might catch up with you, after what you boys did to the Koreans earlier this century?  ;D

What did we do, other than liberate half a continent from a murderous regime that starves it’s own citizens to death and “re-educates” free thinkers?

And what is this “you boys”? The UK, Canada, Australia and NZ were part of that action.

Not pointing fingers huh? Perhaps those who give much needed foreign currency to such a regime should consider what they are supporting.

Caine stated that as the child of a working family who had grown up poor, he had been sympathetic to communism prior to his experience in Korea. But after he had fought the fanatical proponents of communism and saw firsthand how it dehumanized people, he changed his mind about it and came to greatly oppose the idea.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.warhistoryonline.com/instant-articles/michael-caine-a-korean-war-vet.html/amp
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on July 17, 2019, 12:13:33 PM
His experience being limited to killing as many North Koreans as possible. Of course he hardly was likely to have positive personal interactions with them.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 12:26:04 PM
His experience being limited to killing as many Communists, mostly Chinese as possible. Of course he hardly was likely to have positive personal interactions with them.

FTFY
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 17, 2019, 12:27:48 PM
Guests are not allowed to step off of the property and go explore the city.

Sure you can - with your guide, to places open to tourists. Its kinda part of the experience, yknow?  :prophead:

Well you have yourself a nice stay at the ping-pong inn and don't forget to bow to their statues.  :)

There are two you must take flowers to and dress formally. I'm undecided on a tour operator yet, of the many that exist, these seem the better ones for me:

https://www.youngpioneertours.com/
https://www.juchetravelservices.com/
https://www.uritours.com/

For anyone generally interested in the subject, I'd suggest following the #northkorea hashtag on Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/explore/tags/northkorea/) for photos and links to blogs etc from those who have been. Although it is a little polluted by Trump spam memes at the moment as he stepped five paces in there from the DMZ recently.  (:)

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 01:14:28 PM
Guests are not allowed to step off of the property and go explore the city.

Sure you can - with your guide, to places open to tourists. Its kinda part of the experience, yknow?  :prophead:

Well you have yourself a nice stay at the ping-pong inn and don't forget to bow to their statues.  :)

There are two you must take flowers to and dress formally. I'm undecided on a tour operator yet, of the many that exist, these seem the better ones for me:

https://www.youngpioneertours.com/
https://www.juchetravelservices.com/
https://www.uritours.com/

For anyone generally interested in the subject, I'd suggest following the #northkorea hashtag on Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/explore/tags/northkorea/) for photos and links to blogs etc from those who have been. Although it is a little polluted by Trump spam memes at the moment as he stepped five paces in there from the DMZ recently.  (:)

Ten paces.  :laugh:

Try going out in the city without your guide. Let us know how it goes!
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on July 17, 2019, 01:18:10 PM
His experience being limited to killing as many Communists, mostly Chinese as possible. Of course he hardly was likely to have positive personal interactions with them.

FTFY

That's fixed only if you are trying to put words into my mouth that there's no evidence to support. Tell us oh stupid 'expert' which of my words in my post above were not true?

If you want to 'fix something' do some learning and post something cogent in your own words. For example, please tell us how Mr. Caine came to be fighting Chinse soldiers and not Koreans and just how it was that he was able to form the personal relationships with his Korean adversaries that might give him the impression he said he had? I am especially keen to learn where Mr. Caine learned to speak the fluent Korean he would have used to communicate and make such conclusions.

Really, many of you poor Americans are so bloody stupid that it can be hard to take you at all seriously.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 01:25:52 PM
His experience being limited to killing as many Communists, mostly Chinese as possible. Of course he hardly was likely to have positive personal interactions with them.

FTFY

That's fixed only if you are trying to put words into my mouth that there's no evidence to support. Tell us oh stupid 'expert' which of my words in my post above were not true?

If you want to 'fix something' do some learning and post something cogent in your own words. For example, please tell us how Mr. Caine came to be fighting Chinse soldiers and not Koreans and just how it was that he was able to form the personal relationships with his Korean adversaries that might give him the impression he said he had? I am especially keen to learn where Mr. Caine learned to speak the fluent Korean he would have used to communicate and make such conclusions.

Really, many of you poor Americans are so bloody stupid that it can be hard to take you at all seriously.

Read the article dummy, you’ll learn something.

Better yet behave in No Korea like you do on this forum. It’ll be the last time.

In the meantime go to school. Even a 5th grader knows that Communist China flooded No Korea with hundreds of thousands of soldiers.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on July 17, 2019, 01:54:33 PM

Fear about travel to China? I haven't heard that one before,
is it new?

I'm not sure why you need to do your occasional American bashing. 
I don't like following up with my version of UK bashing, since it lumps
in a bunch of guys that I like around here.

Yeah, not sure about the China thing.  Much safer than N.Korea.  I noticed that anti-American sentiment too...reality is America is a much better place to live than the UK. 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on July 17, 2019, 01:59:09 PM
I lived in South Korea for a period of time and went to see the DMZ.  Most South Koreans want reunification and know the dire situation that their Northern brethren face.

It ain't no joke. Seems like a weird curiosity with N.Korea due to the news.  Why isn't Libya or Iraq, Iran on the list of "fascinating" places to visit?  Much closer to you British folks.  I recommend going there instead.  :laugh:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on July 17, 2019, 02:03:10 PM
Gee let me think about this. Visit a drab Communist country or go to a paradise like Hawaii, Fiji, Tahiti, etc

Anywhere on the California Coast. Lake Tahoe, Reno, Las Vegas....

Such a tough decision!  :laugh:

No kidding!  North Korea's climate sucks, let alone what they might do to you if you sneeze at the former "leader's" great statue :laugh: :laugh:

I wouldn't go to N.Korea if someone gave me an all expenses "luxury" trip there on first class.... I might be coming home in a body bag like that doofus Otto who stupidly decided to steal something there.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on July 17, 2019, 02:24:55 PM


Oh, look who’s come along to argue, derail and disagree with everything.  :rolleye0009:

was the forum rabbit let out of his cage again?!  give that man a carrot  :ROFL:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 17, 2019, 02:32:14 PM
Why isn't Libya or Iraq, Iran on the list of "fascinating" places to visit?

Plenty of companies go to those places too. One I linked above goes to Iraq and Iran, see >>here<< (https://www.youngpioneertours.com/international-tours/middle-east-tours/). I'm not terribly interested in backward Muslim countries personally though.

I'm leaning towards >>this tour<< (https://www.uritours.com/tours/the-dprk-classic-spring-fall-north-korea/) which seems to cover everything one might want to do.

I wouldn't go to N.Korea if someone gave me an all expenses "luxury" trip there on first class.... I might be coming home in a body bag like that doofus Otto who stupidly decided to steal something there.

Here in the civilised world we have a saying, "When in Rome, do as the Romans do". If you choose to visit North Korea, you research the local customs, the local rules, what you can and cannot do and listen to your local help. Same as when visiting Russia or China or anywhere else that isnt "western" where you can't behave badly with impunity.

So one stupid American decided to steal something in North Korea and came unstuck? Oh dear, what a shame, never mind. I haven't much sympathy. Didn't his parents teach him not to steal? I'd not be surprised if he was hollering about the constitution and waving his passport as he was locked up. Dumb American tourists are to be found in many places. The odd one comes unstuck and puts others off. Some would say that improves the experience for the rest of us if Hank, Bud and Chuck are dissuaded from visiting.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on July 17, 2019, 02:54:43 PM
Agreed what he did was STUPID..  but there have been cases where N.Korea will take people as hostages just for simply wandering into their territory unknown..

again, poor decision for these reporters : https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=126613763

It was the sister of a well known American reporter.

And you are interested in a dictator country where the leader kills even his close relatives for "treason"?

I'd rather go visit Macau and gamble and have fun anyday.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on July 17, 2019, 02:58:25 PM
If you steal a poster in Russia or China though you won't be sentenced to 15 years hard labour with a good chance of ending up brain dead.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on July 17, 2019, 03:09:25 PM
Confederate, we know that you are misguided, easily led and, well - not too bright.

So, please go back and tell us how my points are incorrect, tell us about how Michael Caine was in a position to know the 'facts' that you are now parroting. Go on, give it a try. The chances are that Caine would not even have known if he was fighting Chinese soldiers and if he did then why would he refer to North Koreans?

Yes, we know, thinking is hard, but it is a skill that is very useful. Thinking is a skill that can be learned and burnished to a bright flame that cuts through bullshit like an acetylene cutter through steel.

Right now, you can't even recognise bullshit, let alone cut through it!

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 04:13:07 PM
The intelligent observers will trust combat veterans with experience over an annoying and boorish propagandist who a few months ago was so obese he couldn’t even wipe his ass. The same buffoon were never in Ukraine either but fancies himself an expert.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 17, 2019, 04:19:54 PM
And you are interested in a dictator country where the leader kills even his close relatives for "treason"?

Many of them 'come back to life' six months later. Most of those tales are fake western media.

I'd rather go visit Macau and gamble and have fun anyday.

Macau and Pyongyang are chalk and cheese through aren't they? But then again so are Hong Kong and Shenzhen - but they are a few train stops apart.

As it goes, I was in the Bank of China queue in the Canton Fair last year and I got talking to a Mongolian girl who had a bunch of Macau Dollars she wanted to change for RMB. We had a good chat. And that unique sort of experience is one of many reasons why I want to go to North Korea.....
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on July 17, 2019, 04:34:49 PM
The intelligent observers will trust combat veterans with experience over an annoying and boorish propagandist who a few months ago was so obese he couldn’t even wipe his ass. The same buffoon were never in Ukraine either but fancies himself an expert.

What are you talking about? Did you change your meds or something?
Stop rambling and get help.
If you stopped taking your meds then get back on them. You might think you are OK, but you are not.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on July 17, 2019, 04:55:47 PM

Macau and Pyongyang are chalk and cheese through aren't they? But then again so are Hong Kong and Shenzhen - but they are a few train stops apart.

As it goes, I was in the Bank of China queue in the Canton Fair last year and I got talking to a Mongolian girl who had a bunch of Macau Dollars she wanted to change for RMB. We had a good chat. And that unique sort of experience is one of many reasons why I want to go to North Korea.....

hey man if you wanna go to N.Korea I ain't stoppin' you! I just see zero appeal in that wasteland.  I have seen N. Korea with my own eyes at the DMZ border.  Read this incident: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_axe_murder_incident

You can't compare Macau/Pyongyang to HK/Shenzhen.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Tom Cat on July 17, 2019, 04:56:51 PM
I remember when I first started this international dating quest I told myself I would never go to Russia.  All those years of propaganda I believed Russia was way too risky and dangerous.
But on my first trip to Russia I took my two young daughters along.  Never once did I have any worries.

Most people in the world are very accepting and a bit curious, so foreigners can be a novelty.
North Korea could be a  great country to visit as long as you respect the laws and customs.
Goes the same for most any country 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on July 17, 2019, 05:06:57 PM

Most people in the world are very accepting and a bit curious, so foreigners can be a novelty.
North Korea could be a  great country to visit as long as you respect the laws and customs.
Goes the same for most any country

You can't compare N.Korea and Russia.  There are many expats working, living in Russia. The normal N.Korea couldn't meet a foreigner let alone go on a date or marry. 

If you are really interested I would go to South Korea first.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: d672 on July 17, 2019, 05:38:56 PM
The intelligent observers will trust combat veterans with experience over an annoying and boorish propagandist who a few months ago was so obese he couldn’t even wipe his ass. The same buffoon were never in Ukraine either but fancies himself an expert.

What are you talking about? Did you change your meds or something?
Stop rambling and get help.
If you stopped taking your meds then get back on them. You might think you are OK, but you are not.




  One thing nice about this forum is how everyone is always worried whether everyone else is taking their meds    :chuckle:

 Ahh, we are such a close, caring group here, aren't we?   :chuckle:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on July 17, 2019, 05:52:51 PM

 Ahh, we are such a close, caring group here, aren't we?   :chuckle:

BAHAHAHAHHAH :ROFL: :ROFL:....
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: dcguyusa on July 17, 2019, 05:56:32 PM
Quote
As a nation, they're not great travellers; as you know so few of them even have a passport.

Did you realize that a 2015 law (the "FAST" Act) will nullify your passport renewal if you are tax scofflaw?  The State Dept. will be alerted to cancel passports by the IRS.   :money: :evilgrin0002: tiphat
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: dcguyusa on July 17, 2019, 06:06:17 PM
Quote
Why isn't Libya or Iraq, Iran on the list of "fascinating" places to visit? 

Because in those areas, anyone can get hit by bombs and random gunfire.  in NK, the general public must never disrupt the social order, or they get hit by rockets and gunfire.   :laugh:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: dcguyusa on July 17, 2019, 06:11:25 PM
Quote
Many of them 'come back to life' six months later. Most of those tales are fake western media.

Is that so?  You mean Kim Jong Un's half-brother is really alive?   :o  You mean the airport incident was just a publicity stunt?   ??? :chuckle: :duh:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: dcguyusa on July 17, 2019, 06:16:20 PM
If you get a chance to visit NK, please talk to the "comfort women" still alive there.  Get a first hand interview about how it was like to be gang raped by soldiers.  Apologies not accepted.   :offtopic: (:)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 17, 2019, 08:15:01 PM
His experience being limited to killing as many Communists, mostly Chinese as possible. Of course he hardly was likely to have positive personal interactions with them.

FTFY

That's fixed only if you are trying to put words into my mouth that there's no evidence to support. Tell us oh stupid 'expert' which of my words in my post above were not true?

If you want to 'fix something' do some learning and post something cogent in your own words. For example, please tell us how Mr. Caine came to be fighting Chinse soldiers and not Koreans and just how it was that he was able to form the personal relationships with his Korean adversaries that might give him the impression he said he had? I am especially keen to learn where Mr. Caine learned to speak the fluent Korean he would have used to communicate and make such conclusions.

Really, many of you poor Americans are so bloody stupid that it can be hard to take you at all seriously.

Andrew if you are too bloody stupid to know that Communist China did indeed flood Korea with Chinese troops that is your problem, not mine and not Michael Caine’s.

A bloke needn’t be fluent in order to tell the difference between Chinese troops and Korean troops. First of all they dress differently and they also sound different; no need to be fluent.

Andy if you doubt the veracity of Michael Caine the combat Veteran, it’s really too bad you couldn’t express your rude uneducated concerns directly with him.

Here folks, here’s the obese out of shape civilian, never in the military and definitely not bright enough to graduate in Korean War History nor tough enough to last a week or two in infantry, in the crucible that was Korean combat.

Michael this flabby dufus here without any manners says you don’t know what you’re talking about. Yeah that would be interesting to get Michael’s reaction.

Presumably there were also Army Intel types who were not only fluent in Chinese, they told incoming infantry troops which lines were Chinese. Really are all English so bloody stupid and as poorly educated as you Andy? It’s hard to take you poor sods seriously. Don’t you read or travel Andy? Don’t you inner city poor folks try to mix with some who do? Here Andy try reading. Any questions write a fan letter to Mr. Caine.


He spent his first few nights in a trench on a hill around a mile from the Chinese lines. On his very first night, he witnessed a Chinese attack on a position to his left. He watched with both awe and horror as the Chinese troops – who were clearly unafraid of death and fanatical in their cause – charged headlong into machine gun fire.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.warhistoryonline.com/instant-articles/michael-caine-a-korean-war-vet.html/amp

Any more questions you can come to the VFW down the street from me. Tell some Korean War Vets there were no Commie Chinese. Throw in your usual basket of anti-American insults.

@&$#*# $&?%#> you’d be lucky not to end up unconscious in another snow drift.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on July 17, 2019, 11:06:45 PM

From my research, I'll be staying in the Koryo:


Interesting to see the escalators turned off and when the receptionist see the guy filming, she rushes to go do something. Seconds later the guy turns the video camera around and the escalators are turned on.  The guy filming made many videos and he says almost everything in NK is scripted.

https://carbuzz.com/news/a-north-korean-car-dealership-is-the-creepiest-place-on-earth
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on July 18, 2019, 02:47:09 AM
Quote
As a nation, they're not great travellers; as you know so few of them even have a passport.

Did you realize that a 2015 law (the "FAST" Act) will nullify your passport renewal if you are tax scofflaw?  The State Dept. will be alerted to cancel passports by the IRS.   :money: :evilgrin0002: tiphat

As does the Netherlands, can't leave country with a tax-debt. Yet so many of the Dutchies travel.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on July 18, 2019, 03:21:04 AM
It would be interesting to see some tourist literature about North Korea. For instance, what are the hotels like? I don't suppose you might find a Four Seasons over there…?  :ROFL:

Having travelled extensively during my working life, almost everywhere in Europe, including US/Florida several times, NY plus California and of course Ukraine and Russia, I have to say that I never had any problems from local police on any country I have visited. The old guard, here, must remember that only loud mouthed Americans got in trouble in Ukraine and Russia attracting attention to them.

I agree with the saying: “When in Rome, do as the Romans do.”

To help everybody wishing to travel to North Korea, here is a very interesting video.


After watching this video I wonder what else you would like to see there.

Sorry there is no Disney Land, Universal Studios or Sea World parks…but plenty of local culture and interesting place to see and taste local food too.

I guess, even if you were inclined or would like to, there will be not many opportunities to become a “Sex tourist“ like so many others did/do.

 :laugh:

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: 2tallbill on July 18, 2019, 08:15:22 AM
You love posting and quipping about snaggle toothed Brits and you know it.  :chuckle:


And the food and the balmy beaches!
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 18, 2019, 10:03:06 AM

From my research, I'll be staying in the Koryo:


Interesting to see the escalators turned off and when the receptionist see the guy filming, she rushes to go do something. Seconds later the guy turns the video camera around and the escalators are turned on.  The guy filming made many videos and he says almost everything in NK is scripted.

https://carbuzz.com/news/a-north-korean-car-dealership-is-the-creepiest-place-on-earth

Can’t imagine paying to see a badly scripted version of that World.

When the people of No Korea are re-united with the South and have real Liberty and the guides could speak the truth about the brutality of the regime might be the time for a visit.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 18, 2019, 10:26:06 AM
I remember when I first started this international dating quest I told myself I would never go to Russia.  All those years of propaganda I believed Russia was way too risky and dangerous.
But on my first trip to Russia I took my two young daughters along.  Never once did I have any worries.

Most people in the world are very accepting and a bit curious, so foreigners can be a
novelty.

Russia isn’t No Korea. Russia is a modern and civilized country for the most part.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on July 18, 2019, 10:33:29 PM

You love posting and quipping about snaggle toothed Brits and you know it.  :chuckle:



And the food and the balmy beaches!

1/ Food..  The US with FIVE times the UK's population has less then three times the number of top rated Restaurants..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Michelin_3-star_restaurants (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Michelin_3-star_restaurants)

2/ Balmy beaches ... Steveboy came the wrong time ,,,

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/06/29/rails-buckle-roads-melt-temperatures-soar-across-britain/]
[url]https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/06/29/rails-buckle-roads-melt-temperatures-soar-across-britain/ (http://[url)[/url]

Always glad to help with misconceptions, Beel ! ;)

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 20, 2019, 12:49:59 PM

From my research, I'll be staying in the Koryo:


Interesting to see the escalators turned off and when the receptionist see the guy filming, she rushes to go do something. Seconds later the guy turns the video camera around and the escalators are turned on.  The guy filming made many videos and he says almost everything in NK is scripted.

https://carbuzz.com/news/a-north-korean-car-dealership-is-the-creepiest-place-on-earth

The "everything is scripted" line is pervasive in the west. I think it'd be so difficult to do as there is so much tourism there now. I watched the car dealership video and I see nothing conclusive there, only his speculation. I watched the hotel video again and see that the escalators are off at first and later on (a woman riding down one at one point). I'd suggest as electricity is in short supply in NK that they have sensors on so that they turn on as you approach them. Easy enough to do. I saw the woman diving for cover when she saw him filming and would say that's a normal reaction for many people anywhere.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on July 20, 2019, 12:53:41 PM

You love posting and quipping about snaggle toothed Brits and you know it.  :chuckle:



And the food and the balmy beaches!

1/ Food..  The US with FIVE times the UK's population has less then three times the number of top rated Restaurants..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Michelin_3-star_restaurants (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Michelin_3-star_restaurants)

2/ Balmy beaches ... Steveboy came the wrong time ,,,


[url=https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/06/29/rails-buckle-roads-melt-temperatures-soar-across-britain/]https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/06/29/rails-buckle-roads-melt-temperatures-soar-across-britain/]
[url]https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/06/29/rails-buckle-roads-melt-temperatures-soar-across-britain/]https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/06/29/rails-buckle-roads-melt-temperatures-soar-across-britain/]https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/06/29/rails-buckle-roads-melt-temperatures-soar-across-britain/]
[url]https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/06/29/rails-buckle-roads-melt-temperatures-soar-across-britain/ (http://[url=https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/06/29/rails-buckle-roads-melt-temperatures-soar-across-britain/)[/url]

Always glad to help with misconceptions, Beel ! ;)

1) Normal people don’t eat at Michelin rated restaurants on a normal basis. The USA has far more affordable chains with great food.

2) Your “Balmy beaches” links do not work.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on July 20, 2019, 12:58:22 PM
Obviously not a thing in the United States but over here, in civilisation, it is becoming more and more common for escalators and travelators to turn off when not in use and start as a user approaches. They are not everywhere yet, but they are not unusual.

For USAians, this might be akin to witchcraft but infrared and other sensors are very easy to install and cheap to buy from the workshop of the world, next door to Korea. :)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on January 01, 2020, 11:03:06 AM
As I've recently took an interest in North Korea (http://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,28510.msg501672.html#msg501672), having just watched Putin's New year address, I thought I'd look up Kim Jong-un's version.

This year he didn't do a traditional address, instead, to quote Bloomberg:

Quote from: Bloomberg
Instead, North Korean state TV showed Kim leading the four-day Workers’ Party meeting, with the stentorian narration that has long accompanied the regime’s biggest propaganda moments. Kim had delivered a televised address every year since 2013 and speculation was building for months about what he might say hours after the expiration of his year-end deadline for U.S. President Donald Trump to ease up on sanctions.

You can sift through the text >>here<< (https://kcnawatch.org/newstream/1577829999-473709661/report-on-5th-plenary-meeting-of-7th-c-c-wpk/) if you like, but here are some takeaways:

Quote from: Kim Jong un
He said that the U.S. labeled our state as its enemy, "axis of evil" and "target of its preemptive nuclear strike" and applied the most brutal and inhuman sanctions against and posed the persistent nuclear threat to the latter over the past seven decades, and the current situation on the Korean peninsula is getting more dangerous and reaching serious phase, owing to the former's hostile policy towards the latter.

In the past two years alone when the DPRK took preemptive and crucial measures of halting its nuclear test and ICBM test-fire and shutting down the nuclear-test ground for building confidence between the DPRK and the U.S., the U.S., far from responding to the former with appropriate measures, conducted tens of big and small joint military drills which its president personally promised to stop and threatened the former militarily through the shipment of ultra-modern warfare equipment into south Korea, he said. The U.S. also took more than ten independent sanctions measures only to show before the world once again that it remained unchanged in its ambition to stifle the former, he said.

He stressed that under such condition, there is no ground for us to get unilaterally bound to the commitment any longer, the commitment to which there is no opposite party, and this is chilling our efforts for worldwide nuclear disarmament and non-proliferation.

Quote from: Kim Jong un
Saying that we should more actively push forward the project for developing strategic weapons, he confirmed that the world will witness a new strategic weapon to be possessed by the DPRK in the near future, declaring that we can not give up the security of our future just for the visible economic results and happiness and comfort in reality now that hostile acts and nuclear threat against us are increasing and nothing has changed between the days when we maintained the line of simultaneously pushing forward the economic construction and the building of nuclear force and now when we struggle to direct our efforts to the economic construction owing to the U.S. gangster-like acts.

He solemnly declared that there is no need to hesitate with any expectation of the U.S. lift of sanctions even now that we had close look into the real intention of the U.S., adding if the U.S. persists in its hostile policy towards the DPRK, there will never be the denuclearization on the Korean peninsula and the DPRK will steadily develop necessary and prerequisite strategic weapons for the security of the state until the U.S. rolls back its hostile policy towards the DPRK and lasting and durable peace-keeping mechanism is built.

Bloomberg's summary which you can read >>here<< (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-01-01/kim-jong-un-keeps-world-guessing-with-new-year-s-speech-surprise) concluded:

Quote from: Bloomberg
The new year’s event was the latest example of Kim’s efforts to paint himself as a versatile leader, from handshake photo-ops with Trump to rides on horseback across the snowy slopes of the sacred Mt. Paektu. A year ago, when diplomacy between Kim and Trump looked more promising, the North Korean leader ditched the formalities of a podium and microphone bank to deliver his new year’s address from a plush leather chair in front of a wooden mantelpiece, like a fireside chat.


Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on January 01, 2020, 01:03:30 PM
I pointed out Manny is a now useful idiot to two nations who either have a dynasty that are a dictatorship or one that makes a mockery of free elections ....

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on January 01, 2020, 02:37:52 PM
I pointed out Manny is a now useful idiot to two nations who either have a dynasty that are a dictatorship or one that makes a mockery of free elections ....

Is there something specific you’d like to discuss? Something useful you’d like to add?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: NS1 on January 01, 2020, 05:36:41 PM
I pointed out Manny is a now useful idiot to two nations who either have a dynasty that are a dictatorship or one that makes a mockery of free elections ....

Is there something specific you’d like to discuss? Something useful you’d like to add?
No he just has to post in every thread.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on January 01, 2020, 08:25:04 PM
at least he ain't from a country which can't settle a 100 yr civil war over potatoes and church ahah :chuckle: :chuckle:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on January 01, 2020, 08:58:15 PM
As I've recently took an interest in North Korea (http://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,28510.msg501672.html#msg501672), having just watched Putin's New year address, I thought I'd look up Kim Jong-un's version.

This year he didn't do a traditional address, instead, to quote Bloomberg:

Quote from: Bloomberg
Instead, North Korean state TV showed Kim leading the four-day Workers’ Party meeting, with the stentorian narration that has long accompanied the regime’s biggest propaganda moments. Kim had delivered a televised address every year since 2013 and speculation was building for months about what he might say hours after the expiration of his year-end deadline for U.S. President Donald Trump to ease up on sanctions.

You can sift through the text >>here<< (https://kcnawatch.org/newstream/1577829999-473709661/report-on-5th-plenary-meeting-of-7th-c-c-wpk/) if you like, but here are some takeaways:

Quote from: Kim Jong un
He said that the U.S. labeled our state as its enemy, "axis of evil" and "target of its preemptive nuclear strike" and applied the most brutal and inhuman sanctions against and posed the persistent nuclear threat to the latter over the past seven decades, and the current situation on the Korean peninsula is getting more dangerous and reaching serious phase, owing to the former's hostile policy towards the latter.

In the past two years alone when the DPRK took preemptive and crucial measures of halting its nuclear test and ICBM test-fire and shutting down the nuclear-test ground for building confidence between the DPRK and the U.S., the U.S., far from responding to the former with appropriate measures, conducted tens of big and small joint military drills which its president personally promised to stop and threatened the former militarily through the shipment of ultra-modern warfare equipment into south Korea, he said. The U.S. also took more than ten independent sanctions measures only to show before the world once again that it remained unchanged in its ambition to stifle the former, he said.

He stressed that under such condition, there is no ground for us to get unilaterally bound to the commitment any longer, the commitment to which there is no opposite party, and this is chilling our efforts for worldwide nuclear disarmament and non-proliferation.

Quote from: Kim Jong un
Saying that we should more actively push forward the project for developing strategic weapons, he confirmed that the world will witness a new strategic weapon to be possessed by the DPRK in the near future, declaring that we can not give up the security of our future just for the visible economic results and happiness and comfort in reality now that hostile acts and nuclear threat against us are increasing and nothing has changed between the days when we maintained the line of simultaneously pushing forward the economic construction and the building of nuclear force and now when we struggle to direct our efforts to the economic construction owing to the U.S. gangster-like acts.

He solemnly declared that there is no need to hesitate with any expectation of the U.S. lift of sanctions even now that we had close look into the real intention of the U.S., adding if the U.S. persists in its hostile policy towards the DPRK, there will never be the denuclearization on the Korean peninsula and the DPRK will steadily develop necessary and prerequisite strategic weapons for the security of the state until the U.S. rolls back its hostile policy towards the DPRK and lasting and durable peace-keeping mechanism is built.

Bloomberg's summary which you can read >>here<< (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-01-01/kim-jong-un-keeps-world-guessing-with-new-year-s-speech-surprise) concluded:

Quote from: Bloomberg
The new year’s event was the latest example of Kim’s efforts to paint himself as a versatile leader, from handshake photo-ops with Trump to rides on horseback across the snowy slopes of the sacred Mt. Paektu. A year ago, when diplomacy between Kim and Trump looked more promising, the North Korean leader ditched the formalities of a podium and microphone bank to deliver his new year’s address from a plush leather chair in front of a wooden mantelpiece, like a fireside chat.

I’m no fan of North Korea but I’m also not a big fan of US economic sanctions against No Korea and Iran. Both bad ideas which could lead to more problems.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 20, 2020, 09:33:48 PM
CNN are claiming Kim Jong-un is in a coma following heart surgery.

The rest of the world’s media have copied and embellished the story with various bits of their own fake news.

Having read the original article, it appears to be uncorroborated speculation based on the claim he wasn’t present at the recent Day of the Sun celebrations. 

If it is true, and something happens to him, the future is unclear. His sister Kim Yo-jong some may assume the obvious successor, but a female leader is unlikely there. He has a ten year old son, but a child leader seems equally unlikely.

An overview without the western media hysteria here: https://www.rt.com/news/486390-kim-north-korea-surgery-cnn/
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 21, 2020, 12:06:13 AM
CNN are claiming Kim Jong-un is in a coma following heart surgery.


Although a little overweight and a heavy smoker, he's only 36 years young. His father died at age 70. His grandfather died at age 82. I don't know about his mother side if her family  had a history of heart problems. Kim recently missing out honoring his father and grandfather was odd. Kim has put his sister in a lot of leadership roles but I would think Kim would want his son to be future leader. If he had heart surgery, I'm sure he had a plan in case he didn't make it. Whether seasoned leaders in the party would honor his wishes or not is anybody's guess.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Olga_Mouse on April 22, 2020, 05:45:10 AM
An overview without the western media hysteria here:
https://www.rt.com/news/486390-kim-north-korea-surgery-cnn/

One more link in Russian, shall someone care...  :reading:
https://lenta.ru/brief/2020/04/22/kim_jong_healthy/
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on April 22, 2020, 06:00:29 AM
I've seen the 'Marshall' aged from 31 to 36 this week ..

Manny is suggesting the western press are 'naughty' for 'making stuff' up but which state owned news agency told Russia and the world that BoJo was 'on a ventilator' ? ...  :coffeeread:

https://web.archive.org/web/20200405221701/https://ria.ru/20200406/1569611571.html (https://web.archive.org/web/20200405221701/https://ria.ru/20200406/1569611571.html)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on April 22, 2020, 07:00:14 AM
An overview without the western media hysteria here:
https://www.rt.com/news/486390-kim-north-korea-surgery-cnn/

One more link in Russian, shall someone care...  :reading:
https://lenta.ru/brief/2020/04/22/kim_jong_healthy/

4th picture, who is that woman behind trump  :o
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 22, 2020, 07:48:59 AM

Although a little overweight and a heavy smoker, he's only 36 years young. His father died at age 70. His grandfather died at age 82. I don't know about his mother side if her family  had a history of heart problems. Kim recently missing out honoring his father and grandfather was odd. Kim has put his sister in a lot of leadership roles but I would think Kim would want his son to be future leader. If he had heart surgery, I'm sure he had a plan in case he didn't make it. Whether seasoned leaders in the party would honor his wishes or not is anybody's guess.

The big different between CNN and RT news is everyone knows CNN is fake.

Kim Jon is quite over weight. I bet he does not make 60 years old. It would not be a surprise to me if he was diabetic and not caring for it. I bet no Doctor in North Korea would tell him he needs to lose weight, eat a strict diet and the health problems he will have if he does not. I have not seen a picture of one other fat person in all of North Korea. Our original Alaskan population are Asians from the mainland and if they get much over weight they become diabetic and heart disease almost a 100 per cent of the time. 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Olga_Mouse on April 24, 2020, 11:19:52 AM
Couldn't help from posting it here  :chuckle:

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 24, 2020, 12:09:06 PM
No body seems to know what is going on in North Korea. But there is speculation the coronavirus is out of control there in a big way. Some of Kim Jon Un being out of site MAY have nothing to do with a heart operation if he even had one but rather waiting for the virus to run its course. What we seem to know is that some members of the population are being told to isolate while the country says there is no virus there and Kim is out of site himself. According western media that I read nothing beyond that is really known.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 25, 2020, 01:31:06 AM
The Guardian (often fake news) claims “China has sent a team to North Korea including medical experts to check on Kim Jong-un”

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/25/kim-jong-un-china-sends-doctors-to-advise-on-health-report

Donald Trump said CNN made the original report up.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-kim-jong-un-ill-north-korea-cnn-fake-news-a9481311.html

The Daily Mirror (often fake news) claims he is chilling in Wonsan to stay away from the virus.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/kim-jong-un-in-beach-21918041
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on April 25, 2020, 02:10:58 AM
And now theres a new rumour he is dead. If he turns up alive that newspaper will be degraded to tabloid status
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 25, 2020, 11:12:11 AM

Olga, the video showed Kim Jong Un having sex with a nuke bomb doggy style. Are those responsible for making that video still alive? I remember Sony Pictures getting hacked big time after releasing a comedy film that talked about Kim Jong Un getting assassinated.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 25, 2020, 11:25:25 AM
What has happened to Kim Jon Un? It seems even the Chinese are not sure and they sending a team to see what is going on.


http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/china-sends-doctors-to-north-korea-as-rumors-on-kim-jong-uns-health-swirl/ar-BB13aiqb
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: dcguyusa on April 25, 2020, 12:06:31 PM
Quote
Other unconfirmed reports, attributed to senior party sources in Beijing, said an operation to insert a stent went wrong because the surgeon’s hands were shaking so badly.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/kim-jong-un-in-vegetative-state-japanese-media-report-says-2020-04-25

Oops.   :duh: (:)

Never depend on a medical professional when your life is on the line.   tiphat :biggrin: :snivel: :scared0005: :sick0012: :GRAVE: :pointlaugh:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on April 25, 2020, 01:10:52 PM
Instead of the game 'Where's Waldo' one can have create a game 'Where's Kim?' If he is dead you can't tell!  :hidechair:     :-X
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Lord of the Dance on April 25, 2020, 01:19:21 PM
#KimJongUnDead is a clever hashtag when you think about it - it works either way!  :)

He disappeared from the public radar for a month and a half back in late summer 2014. I'm still not convinced that this thing is serious, but time will tell. I wouldn't put it past him to let the world think he was dead for a spell, then come back with a (literal) vengeance later on. If he does end up permanently debilitated or deceased it'll be quite fascinating to see how North Korea handles the situation.   
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Olga_Mouse on April 25, 2020, 01:21:25 PM
Olga, the video showed Kim Jong Un having sex with a nuke bomb doggy style.
:nod:

Are those responsible for making that video still alive?
Alive and doing well. Even nominated to represent Russia at Eurovision (which was, unfortunately, cancelled due to the coronavirus...).

More info here:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Big_(band)

The main (by now) hit: 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 25, 2020, 02:33:20 PM
Quote
Other unconfirmed reports, attributed to senior party sources in Beijing, said an operation to insert a stent went wrong because the surgeon’s hands were shaking so badly.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/kim-jong-un-in-vegetative-state-japanese-media-report-says-2020-04-25

Oops.   :duh: (:)

Never depend on a medical professional when your life is on the line.   tiphat :biggrin: :snivel: :scared0005: :sick0012: :GRAVE: :pointlaugh:

It's hard for a doctor to stay focused when there are guards pointing guns at his head.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 26, 2020, 12:56:27 AM
It's hard for a doctor to stay focused when there are guards pointing guns at his head.

Meanwhile, away from Billy's gun fantasies, RT report his train parked at Wonsan (as the Daily Mirror reported above) and his greetings to construction workers is reported by DPRK media:

https://www.rt.com/news/486905-kim-train-letter-health/

So, reading between the lines, it seems he may have had a procedure, is now recovering and avoiding the virus by chilling at the coast and isn't dead.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 26, 2020, 01:15:33 AM
https://www.rt.com/news/486905-kim-train-letter-health/

So, reading between the lines, it seems he may have had a procedure, is now recovering and avoiding the virus by chilling at the coast and isn’t dead.


Your article didn't say Kim Jong Un was at the coastal resort. The article was clear saying he sent his thanks to workers working at the coastal resort. RT provides a link to the letter that thanks the workers. His train was there. He wasn't there personally to thank the workers. Propaganda works. Not on me.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 26, 2020, 01:22:28 AM
Billy Bob, Samjiyon city is inland and not Wonsan.

Samjiyon city is where the new construction is. That he is reported to have sent his greetings is how they convey he isn’t dead. That he didn’t do it in person suggests he is out of action.

He likes to travel on his armoured train. Wonsan is a coastal resort where he has a residence. If his train has recently arrived there, it’s a pretty fair bet he was on it.

The Daily Mirror I linked up thread reported a few days ago he was at a coastal resort.

One reads between the lines to arrive at a likely scenario as I did. The only propaganda is you and your daft guns comment.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on April 26, 2020, 01:34:13 AM
The Guardian (often fake news)

[Edit: Moby's off topic Guardian stuff is >>here<< (https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,28884.msg509844.html#msg509844) and will remain there]

Is the Marshall dead ... ?  Probably not ..  if he's been unwell, going on a diet would help
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: NS1 on April 26, 2020, 04:43:01 AM
Dead or alive, until you see a body, don't believe anything.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 26, 2020, 06:39:24 AM
Maybe he caught the coronavirus.  :ROFL:  A bit troubling when you are claiming that the country does not have any cases. In all likelihood what ever the problem is he will show up one day and pretend nothing was ever wrong. No source for this just my thoughts.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 26, 2020, 08:20:21 AM
If his train has recently arrived there, it’s a pretty fair bet he was on it.


It's a fair bet he was on the train although his body was nowhere in site? And I'm the one talking propaganda? This is the time North Korea should be taking photos of Kim Jong Un but instead it is reported he writes letters to workers and World leaders.

Why the games? Presidents Ronald Reagan and JFK got shot, so it's reported. A President goes in for surgery, it gets reported. Boris Johnson gets coronavirus, it gets reported and everybody wishes him well! For some reason the Communist Party thinks being in the hospital is a sign of weakness. They should've never promoted Kim Jong Un as a God to begin with and there wouldn't be a need for games.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 26, 2020, 01:02:47 PM
If his train has recently arrived there, it’s a pretty fair bet he was on it.


It's a fair bet he was on the train although his body was nowhere in site? And I'm the one talking propaganda? This is the time North Korea should be taking photos of Kim Jong Un but instead it is reported he writes letters to workers and World leaders.

I'll be sure to pass along what Billy says they *should* be doing.  :ROFL:

Why the games? Presidents Ronald Reagan and JFK got shot, so it's reported. A President goes in for surgery, it gets reported. Boris Johnson gets coronavirus, it gets reported and everybody wishes him well!

All in countries that are not Korea. And not Korean culture.

For some reason the Communist Party thinks being in the hospital is a sign of weakness. They should've never promoted Kim Jong Un as a God to begin with and there wouldn't be a need for games.

Now you're getting close. If he is sick they won't trumpet it in their media (imagine the US chose that moment to invade again?). He'll appear when he is well again. Its how it works there. That isn't right or wrong, it's just their culture. They are not answerable to anyone in the west, they have no need to counter foreign media speculation and fantasy. They dont give a rats arse what anyone abroad thinks.

But to correct two other falsehoods you are pushing, he wasn't "promoted", he is not treated as a god and being quiet isn't a game, its just being quiet and minding their own business.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 26, 2020, 02:58:23 PM
(imagine the US chose that moment to invade again?).


In the old, old, old days a leader of a nation has to portray strength at all times so a neighbor won't invade. It's paranoia for Kim Jong Un thinks his military is weak without his leadership.


(They dont give a rats arse what anyone abroad thinks.


Yeah they do. It's why they are behaving strangely and aren't letting anybody know what's going on. So they should expect rumors and ridicule which is well deserved. It's not Korean culture, it's Communist culture. In South Korea, if a President commits suicide, it gets reported. There's no hiding death or even hiding the embarrassing way a leader died.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on April 26, 2020, 03:13:40 PM

(They dont give a rats arse what anyone abroad thinks.


Yeah they do. It's why they are behaving strangely and aren't letting anybody know what's going on. So they should expect rumors and ridicule which is well deserved. It's not Korean culture, it's Communist culture. In South Korea, if a President commits suicide, it gets reported. There's no hiding death or even hiding the embarrassing way a leader died.

Based on the few Korean people I have met they are hyper sensitive of how foreigners perceive there nation. I suspect it is a more Asian trait but the few people I know from the Phillipines really do not care. So not really sure if it nationality or ethnicity thing.

Also except for Sushi, Nam June Paik and the Sensei artists I am not that interested.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 26, 2020, 04:33:16 PM
Based on the few Korean people I have met they are hyper sensitive of how foreigners perceive their nation. I suspect it is a more Asian trait but the few people I know from the Phillipines really do not care. So not really sure if it nationality or ethnicity thing

That’s fair comment. It’s not far away from the “face” concept anyone familiar with China and Asia generally will understand.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 26, 2020, 04:37:00 PM
They dont give a rats arse what anyone abroad thinks.
Yeah they do. It's why they are behaving strangely and aren't letting anybody know what's going on. So they should expect rumors and ridicule which is well deserved. It's not Korean culture, it's Communist culture.

What obligation do they have to let anybody know what is going on?

Since when is minding your own business behaving strangely?

Why should they care about rumours and ridicule from abroad?

Those three concepts are completely irrelevant there.

In South Korea, if a President commits suicide, it gets reported. There's no hiding death or even hiding the embarrassing way a leader died.

South Korea is an occupied client state of the US. Not really the same thing.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 26, 2020, 05:31:28 PM
Based on the few Korean people I have met they are hyper sensitive of how foreigners perceive there nation. I suspect it is a more Asian trait but the few people I know from the Phillipines really do not care. So not really sure if it nationality or ethnicity thing.


I had a few Korean friends in school. I did not get that impression about them. I did watch a few videos of the 90 fiancée the other way where the American girl went to South Korea. The guy was an idiot and screwed up a lot. He was not prepared for a life with a wife. He certainly did not represent the Korean people well.


What obligation do they have to let anybody know what is going on?

Since when is minding your own business behaving strangely?

Why should they care about rumours and ridicule from abroad?

Those three concepts are completely irrelevant there.


Trump gets ridiculed and criticized often even by people on the other side of the world. What's the big deal if Kim Jong Un gets what other leaders get? If Trump goes missing for a month because his foot hurts or something secret, lets see how quiet the rest of the world gets. You think it's nobody's business when it's actually everybody's business. If somebody wants to get on stage and be a world leader, they need to remain on the stage at all times.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 26, 2020, 07:59:37 PM

South Korea is an occupied client state of the US. Not really the same thing.

Why don't you go to South Korea and learn something about it before you make all these very crazy statements. Why don't you go the museums that show the war crimes of the north and China? There is another complete other side of this. If you knew anything about South Korea it is less occupied than the UK is by the USA and has a standard of living as high. We have forces in the UK also. Out largest force in all of Europe next to Germany. Germany is another occupied country by the USA that is more occupied than South Korea if you count the amount of influence we have over the government. South Korea is a democracy and its people really vote not like the fake elections in Russia where you can vote for the Putin selected candidate of your choice.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on April 26, 2020, 08:29:11 PM

South Korea is an occupied client state of the US. Not really the same thing.

Why don't you go to South Korea and learn something about it before you make all these very crazy statements. Why don't you go the museums that show the war crimes of the north and China? There is another complete other side of this. If you knew anything about South Korea it is less occupied than the UK is by the USA and has a standard of living as high. We have forces in the UK also. Out largest force in all of Europe next to Germany. Germany is another occupied country by the USA that is more occupied than South Korea if you count the amount of influence we have over the government. South Korea is a democracy and its people really vote not like the fake elections in Russia where you can vote for the Putin selected candidate of your choice.

There goes the neighborhood!

Now we will get some Wiz diatribe about we started a War, if we are lucky only going back to the War in 1776, perhaps earlier though. Than ms will tell us he knows a friend who was there, after that Confederate will say it is a conspiracy from little green and yellow chaps who manipulate banks.

Manny will crack open a good red, Andrew will wonder why no one can understand what they read and Rosco will attempt to explain to ms that it was not possible what he states. LoyalMan will blame a bunch of slant eyed yellow people who have embraced Nazism. In the end Cuffy will drop a mega screed.

Shakes, B.B. And Chris will polish up the shit and another week will have started.

Did I miss anyone?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: d672 on April 26, 2020, 08:37:13 PM

South Korea is an occupied client state of the US. Not really the same thing.

Why don't you go to South Korea and learn something about it before you make all these very crazy statements. Why don't you go the museums that show the war crimes of the north and China? There is another complete other side of this. If you knew anything about South Korea it is less occupied than the UK is by the USA and has a standard of living as high. We have forces in the UK also. Out largest force in all of Europe next to Germany. Germany is another occupied country by the USA that is more occupied than South Korea if you count the amount of influence we have over the government. South Korea is a democracy and its people really vote not like the fake elections in Russia where you can vote for the Putin selected candidate of your choice.

There goes the neighborhood!

Now we will get some Wiz diatribe about we started a War, if we are lucky only going back to the War in 1776, perhaps earlier though. Than ms will tell us he knows a friend who was there, after that Confederate will say it is a conspiracy from little green and yellow chaps who manipulate banks.

Manny will crack open a good red, Andrew will wonder why no one can understand what they read and Rosco will attempt to explain to ms that it was not possible what he states. LoyalMan will blame a bunch of slant eyed yellow people who have embraced Nazism. In the end Cuffy will drop a mega screed.

Shakes, B.B. And Chris will polish up the shit and another week will have started.

Did I miss anyone?


 :chuckle:  :chuckle:  :chuckle:   :thumbsup:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on April 26, 2020, 09:49:30 PM

South Korea is an occupied client state of the US. Not really the same thing.

Why don't you go to South Korea and learn something about it before you make all these very crazy statements. Why don't you go the museums that show the war crimes of the north and China? There is another complete other side of this. If you knew anything about South Korea it is less occupied than the UK is by the USA and has a standard of living as high. We have forces in the UK also. Out largest force in all of Europe next to Germany. Germany is another occupied country by the USA that is more occupied than South Korea if you count the amount of influence we have over the government. South Korea is a democracy and its people really vote not like the fake elections in Russia where you can vote for the Putin selected candidate of your choice.

There goes the neighborhood!

Now we will get some Wiz diatribe about we started a War, if we are lucky only going back to the War in 1776, perhaps earlier though. Than ms will tell us he knows a friend who was there, after that Confederate will say it is a conspiracy from little green and yellow chaps who manipulate banks.

Manny will crack open a good red, Andrew will wonder why no one can understand what they read and Rosco will attempt to explain to ms that it was not possible what he states. LoyalMan will blame a bunch of slant eyed yellow people who have embraced Nazism. In the end Cuffy will drop a mega screed.

Shakes, B.B. And Chris will polish up the shit and another week will have started.

Did I miss anyone?


 :chuckle:  :chuckle:  :chuckle:   :thumbsup:


I believe that the "king" is dead.  Long live the "king".
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 26, 2020, 11:23:25 PM
South Korea it is less occupied than the UK is by the USA and has a standard of living as high.


There's not enough US troops in South Korea to effectively invade North Korea. South Korea is not interested in reunification by force either. The most likely reason North Korea is trying to give impression Kim Jong Un is healthy and alive is so nobody within their own country tries a coup. If somebody within the Communist party takes over, you won't see Kim Jong Un's family anymore. Has his sister or wife been seen at any time in the last two weeks?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 26, 2020, 11:52:29 PM

South Korea is an occupied client state of the US. Not really the same thing.

Why don't you go to South Korea and learn something about it before you make all these very crazy statements. Why don't you go the museums.....

I’d say standing at the DMZ looking at US soldiers manning the border with South Korea is kinda learning something. I also went to the Victorious Fatherland Liberation War Museum.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 27, 2020, 12:12:16 AM
What obligation do they have to let anybody know what is going on?

Since when is minding your own business behaving strangely?

Why should they care about rumours and ridicule from abroad?

Those three concepts are completely irrelevant there.

You think it's nobody's business when it's actually everybody's business. If somebody wants to get on stage and be a world leader, they need to remain on the stage at all times.

You think the intimate details of the life of any leader should me made available for consumption by foreigners. I disagree.

There's not enough US troops in South Korea to effectively invade North Korea.

Good. Nobody needs more of your mindless wars.

South Korea is not interested in reunification by force either.

The concept of reunification by force is something I believe you have just made up. There is no suggestion of this from either side
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 27, 2020, 01:03:21 AM
You think the intimate details of the life of any leader should me made available for consumption by foreigners. I disagree.


Seems like a lot of foreigners here want to discuss Trump. No big deal. It's human nature to talk about leaders even if they aren't your own. Why do you want Kim Jong Un to be the exception? You can visit America and bad mouth Trump and Kim Jong Un all you want and not get arrested. You can visit North Korea and only bad mouth Trump. If people aren't allowed to criticize leaders, there's no incentive for the leaders to improve. North Korea isn't run by the best available man. It's a family dynasty with had picked successors and they currently have a man with bad genes running the country. Either that or he parties too hard. Bad boy Dennis Rodman said he never knew anybody to party as hard as Kim Jong Un. Dennis is always drunk, on drugs and is a full time freak. I would think Dennis parties harder than anybody but Kim Jong Un is the man.


The concept of reunification by force is something I believe you have just made up. There is no suggestion of this from either side


If he is sick they won't trumpet it in their media (imagine the US chose that moment to invade again?).


You seem to think there will be use of force but also think there will be no force at the same time. There was never a peace treaty to end the Korean War. They are still technically at war. Probably why North Korea shoots missiles at South Korea from time to time. South Korea pays for American troops to help with their security. Many nations pay America for security and trust America over any other nation for that role. That's a good thing. I wish Russia, China, Iran and North Korea can someday be trusted as much.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on April 27, 2020, 03:27:21 AM
Well it appears that there's nothing wrong with Kim Jong Un and he's safe and well according to Sky News and South Korea.

https://news.sky.com/story/kim-jong-un-north-korean-leader-is-alive-and-well-says-south-korea-11979252

"Kim Jong Un is alive and well. He has been staying in the Wonsan area since 13 April. No suspicious movements have so far been detected."

I get what Tex and Billy are saying but I also completely understand Manny's POV. What I will say is that the speculation comes from a western media perversion where our news picks up on the smallest of details and then projects what they really want to happen. The US would love nothing more than for Kim to be ill or dead, some over this way would too. Here, most folk don't give a toss because its none of our business.

If Kim is in fact well, CNN and the rest of the liars should need to explain themselves and admit to speculation rather than news. We're back to the old, the news is just opinews, telling us what to think rather than actual impartial reporting of events.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on April 27, 2020, 04:10:13 AM
Billy, do you believe what you write, or do you go a bit 'Mystic Moby' and make stuff up just for fun.

If North Korea were to have launched missiles at South Korea then you can be certain that the frozen conflict would have heated up very fast. The conflict is still frozen, ergo, no missiles fired at South Korea.

You probably consider yourself well-informed by the standards of your peers, so how come you come out with this type of rubbish on a very consistent basis?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 27, 2020, 05:36:46 AM


I’d say standing at the DMZ looking at US soldiers manning the border with South Korea is kinda learning something. I also went to the Victorious Fatherland Liberation War Museum.

Yes you took the propaganda tour and want to the propaganda museum. So what. You only went there to build you belief the USA is bad and so you got your money worth.  South Korea pay us for those troop and maintain more control over them than what the Uk has over USA troops there. Recently when trump wanted to use Korea for USA military aircraft the request was deigned and we had to use bases elsewhere. They are not occupied and it is not a government that we control. These troops stay near the border to deter North Korea from attacking. North Korea could get rid of the troops easily by ending the war and recognizing the south. North Korea goal is to unify with the south by destroying it.  Standing on the border looking at US troops did not teach you anything. Everyone know they are there. Not exactly a state secrete like Russian troops in Lugansk.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on April 27, 2020, 06:56:52 AM


I’d say standing at the DMZ looking at US soldiers manning the border with South Korea is kinda learning something. I also went to the Victorious Fatherland Liberation War Museum.

Yes you took the propaganda tour and want to the propaganda museum. So what. You only went there to build you belief the USA is bad and so you got your money worth.  South Korea pay us for those troop and maintain more control over them than what the Uk has over USA troops there. Recently when trump wanted to use Korea for USA military aircraft the request was deigned and we had to use bases elsewhere. They are not occupied and it is not a government that we control. These troops stay near the border to deter North Korea from attacking. North Korea could get rid of the troops easily by ending the war and recognizing the south. North Korea goal is to unify with the south by destroying it.  Standing on the border looking at US troops did not teach you anything. Everyone know they are there. Not exactly a state secrete like Russian troops in Lugansk.

By the look of it, you’ve done your own wee propaganda tour yourself.  :coffeeread:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 27, 2020, 10:26:36 AM
Billy, do you believe what you write, or do you go a bit 'Mystic Moby' and make stuff up just for fun.

If North Korea were to have launched missiles at South Korea then you can be certain that the frozen conflict would have heated up very fast. The conflict is still frozen, ergo, no missiles fired at South Korea.


You continue to prove you live in a bubble and make stuff up. You'd be great for a propaganda machine since you like to erase and change history. Were you part of the team that erased Kim Jong Un's uncle from all historic photographs and videos and made his aunt disappear from public eye for 6 years? There's lots of propaganda going on in the world. There's a reason North Korea doesn't have many friends. Are the intelligent leaders of most nations in the World wrong? You don't 'get it'. It seems you like to side with the losers every time. See if the below articles refresh your deteriorating memory.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/picturegalleries/worldnews/8156067/Death-toll-rises-after-North-Koreas-missile-attack-on-South-Korea.html

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-pacific-11818005

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 27, 2020, 10:50:59 AM

By the look of it, you’ve done your own wee propaganda tour yourself.  :coffeeread:

Rocco I had a Vietnamese wife for twenty two years. We had south Korea friends. What is your source of insight. RT fake news?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 27, 2020, 10:52:33 AM
Billy, do you believe what you write, or do you go a bit 'Mystic Moby' and make stuff up just for fun.

If North Korea were to have launched missiles at South Korea then you can be certain that the frozen conflict would have heated up very fast. The conflict is still frozen, ergo, no missiles fired at South Korea.


You continue to prove you live in a bubble and make stuff up. You'd be great for a propaganda machine since you like to erase and change history. Were you part of the team that erased Kim Jong Un's uncle from all historic photographs and videos and made his aunt disappear from public eye for 6 years? There's lots of propaganda going on in the world. There's a reason North Korea doesn't have many friends. Are the intelligent leaders of most nations in the World wrong? You don't 'get it'. It seems you like to side with the losers every time. See if the below articles refresh your deteriorating memory.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/picturegalleries/worldnews/8156067/Death-toll-rises-after-North-Koreas-missile-attack-on-South-Korea.html

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-pacific-11818005

The circumstances of who fired first there are disputed. IIRC (from their war museum), the North Koreans say the first shot was fired by a US ship that was on manoeuvres with the South Koreans, and possibly in error. The North responded. That there is dispute is noted in the articles you posted. Also, that is a small island, and the missiles were on a military installation not the South Korean mainland. You were disingenuous to imply the North fires on the South routinely.

North Korea goal is to unify with the south by destroying it.

That simply isnt true. A former Kim wrote a full manifesto on their intentions. It is to be a one nation two systems policy similar to what was done with China and Hong Kong. If force was a factor, South Korean President Moon Jae-in wouldnt have been in reunification talks as recently as last year with Kim Jong-un. You might want to look beyond MSN for news, Tex.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 27, 2020, 10:54:05 AM
I had a Vietnamese wife for twenty two years.

I'd be interested in hearing more about that on a suitable topic.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on April 27, 2020, 11:25:12 AM

By the look of it, you’ve done your own wee propaganda tour yourself.  :coffeeread:

Rocco I had a Vietnamese wife for twenty two years. We had south Korea friends. What is your source of insight. RT fake news?

I’m suggesting you’ve been hoodwinked with all your US anti N Korea propaganda. For starters, you posted this today:

North Korea goal is to unify with the south by destroying it.

How ever much of a mug Kim may be, we all know what you claim is rubbish. You’d need to be completely brain washed to really believe that. There’s one for starters, I don’t think even the most bias western press would print that.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 27, 2020, 12:05:38 PM
The circumstances of who fired first there are disputed. IIRC (from their war museum), the North Koreans say the first shot was fired by a US ship that was on manoeuvres with the South Koreans, and possibly in error. The North responded. That there is dispute is noted in the articles you posted. Also, that is a small island, and the missiles were on a military installation not the South Korean mainland. You were disingenuous to imply the North fires on the South routinely.


History is almost always disputed between nations that aren't getting along. Who's telling the truth? Some nations are trusted more than others. North Korea is not in that group.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 27, 2020, 12:48:57 PM
The circumstances of who fired first there are disputed. IIRC (from their war museum), the North Koreans say the first shot was fired by a US ship that was on manoeuvres with the South Koreans, and possibly in error. The North responded. That there is dispute is noted in the articles you posted. Also, that is a small island, and the missiles were on a military installation not the South Korean mainland. You were disingenuous to imply the North fires on the South routinely.


History is almost always disputed between nations that aren't getting along. Who's telling the truth? Some nations are trusted more than others. North Korea is not in that group.

Trusted by whom? You have your US rose coloured glasses on again. You'll be telling us about US exceptionalism in a minute.  :sick0012:

Some nations are trusted more than others, indeed. All the countries that the US has destroyed might not be too trusting of Uncle Sam. Likewise, all the countries that the DPRK has good relations with will be likely to trust them. The DPRK has good relations with China, Russia, much of Asia, much of South America and more than one or two friends in the EU. In actual fact, they have good relations with more of the planet than the US I'd suggest.

Remember, not everyone shares the views of the US. Those that dont agree with you are not 'wrong', they merely hold a different opinion.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: NS1 on April 27, 2020, 01:41:21 PM
The circumstances of who fired first there are disputed. IIRC (from their war museum), the North Koreans say the first shot was fired by a US ship that was on manoeuvres with the South Koreans, and possibly in error. The North responded. That there is dispute is noted in the articles you posted. Also, that is a small island, and the missiles were on a military installation not the South Korean mainland. You were disingenuous to imply the North fires on the South routinely.


History is almost always disputed between nations that aren't getting along. Who's telling the truth? Some nations are trusted more than others. North Korea is not in that group.

Trusted by whom? You have your US rose coloured glasses on again. You'll be telling us about US exceptionalism in a minute.  :sick0012:

Some nations are trusted more than others, indeed. All the countries that the US has destroyed might not be too trusting of Uncle Sam. Likewise, all the countries that the DPRK has good relations with will be likely to trust them. The DPRK has good relations with China, Russia, much of Asia, much of South America and more than one or two friends in the EU. In actual fact, they have good relations with more of the planet than the US I'd suggest.

Remember, not everyone shares the views of the US. Those that dont agree with you are not 'wrong', they merely hold a different opinion.
Manny you realize that cuts both ways, not everyone has your views of the USA
Ya many don't like, but who do they call first when they have a problem?
including the UK
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on April 27, 2020, 01:51:06 PM

Remember, not everyone shares the views of the US. Those that dont agree with you are not 'wrong', they merely hold a different opinion.
I remember a Dutch government news broadcast (on Dutch 1, the gov't channel), that had president Mark Rutte say:

- Now that Trump is at the helm, perhaps we should work out scenarios where the USA isn't our friend.

I don't remember the exact date, but it was with Trump about 1 year in office.

Noteworthy. Of course he quickly mitigated the exact words, amended them to do a 180 later, but it was said, out loud on national TV.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on April 27, 2020, 02:42:54 PM

Remember, not everyone shares the views of the US. Those that dont agree with you are not 'wrong', they merely hold a different opinion.
I remember a Dutch government news broadcast (on Dutch 1, the gov't channel), that had president Mark Rutte say:

- Now that Trump is at the helm, perhaps we should work out scenarios where the USA isn't our friend.

I don't remember the exact date, but it was with Trump about 1 year in office.

Noteworthy. Of course he quickly mitigated the exact words, amended them to do a 180 later, but it was said, out loud on national TV.

Most likely he was thinking of Brussels.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 27, 2020, 04:35:45 PM
In 1975 South Viet Nam fell to the north. Untold numbers of people were killed including some of my wife's family. A great wave of poverty came after that. Hard for me to see anything good about it from first hand accounts. It is hard for me to see any different in North Korea. It is not the south that want to attack the north it is the north that want to attack the south.  In Lugansk my now girl friend continues to have to deal with the extreme poverty her family lives in brought about by Russian intervening to separated areas where 70 per Cent of the population left to get away from it. If you think seeing US troops on the border means anything trying having you wife family treated as such and then see how different you see things. If North Koreans could leave they would in large numbers just like they did in Lugansk. 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 27, 2020, 05:30:31 PM
it is the north that want to attack the south.

Why are you repeating this lie again after being corrected above several times?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 27, 2020, 05:32:46 PM

I remember a Dutch government news broadcast (on Dutch 1, the gov't channel), that had president Mark Rutte say:

- Now that Trump is at the helm, perhaps we should work out scenarios where the USA isn't our friend.


It is Trump see things differently than other presidents. He  sees the present arrangement with Europe is on longer to the benefit of the USA. We are no longer a manufacturing country and Europe buys much less form us than they sells. It is only a cost to us to have this close relationship with few benefits. Much of this being around the world is no longer any used to us because we no longer need large amounts of raw materials. When we started to produce our own oil in large enough quantities that there is no longer a need for the petrol dollar. It is a good thing to kill it. Now the Chinese are the world's largest importer of oil and the problem of the middle east is being slowly handed over top them. This is a huge expensed being lifted away form the USA.

This is also very much what Russia wants. If the USA stops buying products in as large quantities form Europe it will bring about a lower standard of living in Europe and help cause lack of unity in European nations where Russia can deal with countries one at a time as separate countries. India now has a more powerful military than any European nation. Russia maybe the most power military in the world and it pays for this with the sales of oil and gas mainly to European nations. It is time for Europe to pay for its own protection. Russian sponsored news is trying to encourage this as much as it can by bashing the USA as a terrorist nation and such making it where European people do not understand the connection between the USA and their standard of living. 

The USA is posed to have a manufacturing rebirth not were we export in quantities like before but where we import much less. A country where we still trade but where most of our trade partners have a more balanced trade with us. Trump is trying to bring an end to globalism as we know it now. This is why Putting likes him so much. This is why Trump is so hated in our globalistic press.   
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 27, 2020, 05:36:11 PM
it is the north that want to attack the south.

Why are you repeating this lie again after being corrected above several times?

Because it is not a lie. The south does not want to attacked the north and destroy it. You just believe an untruth. If the south would feel safe they would stop paying for USA troops and we would go home. Look at what happen in Vien Nam. WE went home and the North attacked the south not the other way around. This is no different.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on April 27, 2020, 06:00:23 PM
The USA is posed to have a manufacturing rebirth not were we export in quantities like before but where we import much less. A country where we still trade but where most of our trade partners have a more balanced trade with us. Trump is trying to bring an end to globalism as we know it now. This is why Putting likes him so much. This is why Trump is so hated in our globalistic press.   

Perhaps. What I think is going to happen is the rush to globalization is going to slow down, maybe even stop. Countries or perhaps regions will move to a more self sustaining mode. So yes The United States will start to manufacture more. China will suffer unless they can get there domestic economy moving. Presently it is a house of cards.

There are more voices being heard in The States to punish China. Not with sanctions but more a buy America mentality. Translated Joe America will pay more for a non Chinese product. Will this mentality last, not sure.

What seems obvious to me with oil being priced well under $50,= per barrel countries such as Nigeria, Russia and Venezuela are going to face increasing pressure to make ends meet. Yes Russia has a large financial cushion, maybe it can last 5 years if Putin does not engage in anymore 'away games.' Certainly they are going to have down size there ambitions.

Support to vassal States such as Venezuela, North Korea, and Syria whether from China or Russia is going to be diminished.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 27, 2020, 06:15:36 PM
In actual fact, they have good relations with more of the planet than the US I'd suggest.


Wonderful they feel good about that fact. With all the friends they have, they're sure to be prosperous someday, even more prosperous than Koreans down South.


In 1975 South Viet Nam fell to the north. Untold numbers of people were killed including some of my wife's family. A great wave of poverty came after that.


Some of my aunts and uncles were put in jail simply because they didn't believe in Communism. They got rotten rice to eat everyday and on holidays, a small bite sized piece of meat while in jail. With Communism, they make sure everybody is equal, equally poor except for the management on top of course. My aunts and uncles came to America in the mid 80's. The became engineers working at the nuclear reactors, nuke submarine base and developing software for the F-35. In Vietnam, they'd be nobodies and they'd be poor. Just look at the huge difference between S Korean and N Korea. The difference isn't the people. The difference is in the governments.

There are more voices being heard in The States to punish China. Not with sanctions but more a buy America mentality. Translated Joe America will pay more for a non Chinese product. Will this mentality last, not sure.


Manufacture's of products will see a decline in sales and they will move their factories to Vietnam, Mexico or similar nations. If there's a big enough backlash against China for their stupidity, even retail giants like Walmart and Amazon my tell manufactures to move their plants to another country or they won't buy.






Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on April 27, 2020, 10:34:07 PM
it is the north that want to attack the south.

Why are you repeating this lie again after being corrected above several times?

Once a fool always a fool..... and no brains or Memory there to remember the Carpet Bombing of North and South Vietnam. Laos and Cambodia!... His FAKE hero John McCain is Dead but still living in his brain!

Of course he gets his support from the Traitor of his country, Vietnam.... Pity that Ho Chi Minh did not finished the job .........  Bloody boring Crap!

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e1/John_McCain_official_portrait_2009.jpg/330px-John_McCain_official_portrait_2009.jpg)

 :sick0012: :dh: :fighting0025:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 27, 2020, 11:35:48 PM
it is the north that want to attack the south.

Why are you repeating this lie again after being corrected above several times?

Because it is not a lie. The south does not want to attacked the north and destroy it. You just believe an untruth. If the south would feel safe they would stop paying for USA troops and we would go home. Look at what happen in Vien Nam. WE went home and the North attacked the south not the other way around. This is no different.

The point wasn’t about if the south feels safe or unsafe. The whole US troops on the border is just theatre. I’ve seen it with my own eyes. You are repeating a lie about the north wanting to attack the south.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 28, 2020, 12:31:48 AM

Somebody should tell President Moon Jae-in of South Korea that North Korea doesn't want to attack his nation so he can make the decision to reduce the size of the South Korean Army and tell American troops to go home.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on April 28, 2020, 03:03:59 AM
In 1975 South Viet Nam fell to the north. Untold numbers of people were killed including some of my wife's family. A great wave of poverty came after that. Hard for me to see anything good about it from first hand accounts. It is hard for me to see any different in North Korea. It is not the south that want to attack the north it is the north that want to attack the south.  In Lugansk my now girl friend continues to have to deal with the extreme poverty her family lives in brought about by Russian intervening to separated areas where 70 per Cent of the population left to get away from it. If you think seeing US troops on the border means anything trying having you wife family treated as such and then see how different you see things. If North Koreans could leave they would in large numbers just like they did in Lugansk.

I recently watched the series on Netflix about Vietnam, a nice refresher. I think you suggesting anything about people dying and blaming the north is a tad rich. What we do know is that if you lot hadn't gotten involved, hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions of lives would have been saved and future generations would have a better outlook.
 
Remove CIA involvement, the US obsession with communism and influence at the other end of the earth and all the bombs and bullets you guys pumped into the place willy nilly, makes your post a bit silly. Vietnam seems to have done quite well in recent times without US forces being on any border.

I'm surprised you had the cheek to even reference Vietnam.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on April 28, 2020, 03:29:41 AM

There are more voices being heard in The States to punish China. Not with sanctions but more a buy America mentality. Translated Joe America will pay more for a non Chinese product. Will this mentality last, not sure.


Manufacture's of products will see a decline in sales and they will move their factories to Vietnam, Mexico or similar nations. If there's a big enough backlash against China for their stupidity, even retail giants like Walmart and Amazon my tell manufactures to move their plants to another country or they won't buy.

I suspect your government would need to push the propaganda none stop for this one to happen, install a siege like mentality. In the short term, you might find a few patriots willing to pay a bit more to avoid buying Chinese. In the end, consumerism is led by price and quality and when the talk of the enemy is over, capitalism wins.

For the sake of argument, lets discuss a TV. One retailer's USP is that they don't sell Chinese etc. The guy next door does and there's a great product that gets top reviews 30% cheaper. The guy with the anti China agenda soon goes out of business. It's how these things work.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on April 28, 2020, 03:41:17 AM
If the USA stops buying products in as large quantities form Europe it will bring about a lower standard of living in Europe...

Oh please. The living standards in European countries don't depend on the US. What doesn't get bought/sold from the US would get bought sold elsewhere. If you really believe this nonsense then its hard to have a meaningful discussion. We're really not as dependant on the US as you think.

India now has a more powerful military than any European nation....It is time for Europe to pay for its own protection......Russian sponsored news is trying to encourage this as much as it can by bashing the USA as a terrorist nation and such making it where European people do not understand the connection between the USA and their standard of living.

And why would India attack a European nation? Aside from discussing the ridiculousness, you have heard of NATO and I think it's more than likely the UK/Germany/France etc would club together given the situation. You do have a very American mindset when it comes to looking at each others armies. I can only imagine this paranoia sets in once you invade nations around the globe whilst the freedom facade starts to slip.

I agree many EU nations should pay their fair share though, Trumps right in this respect. I don't see why anyone should have a voice unless they pay their fair share.

Standard of living and being friends with America.......see above  :fighting0025:

The USA is posed to have a manufacturing rebirth not were we export in quantities like before but where we import much less. A country where we still trade but where most of our trade partners have a more balanced trade with us. Trump is trying to bring an end to globalism as we know it now. This is why Putting likes him so much. This is why Trump is so hated in our globalistic press.   

I had Trump odds on for re-election prior to the corona escapade. Since then he's behaved like an absolute idiot on global TV and with your economy about to tank, he's lost his trump card.

If the Dems get in, don't hold your breath for your manufacturing re-birth.


Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 28, 2020, 06:04:01 AM

Somebody should tell President Moon Jae-in of South Korea that North Korea doesn't want to attack his nation so he can make the decision to reduce the size of the South Korean Army and tell American troops to go home.

Ideally, yes. But as a client state of the US they have to do as they're told. The US needs its bogeymen. Remember "axis of evil", "war on terror" and "Russian aggression"? The whole "Rocketman" thing is a narrative same as those ideas were.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 28, 2020, 09:50:23 AM

Somebody should tell President Moon Jae-in of South Korea that North Korea doesn't want to attack his nation so he can make the decision to reduce the size of the South Korean Army and tell American troops to go home.

Ideally, yes. But as a client state of the US they have to do as they're told. The US needs its bogeymen. Remember "axis of evil", "war on terror" and "Russian aggression"? The whole "Rocketman" thing is a narrative same as those ideas were.

Manny what you said here has some truth to it but you have it backward. The north Koreans need a buggy man to keep the population under control and accept the poverty.  The best way to get support for a government is to be at war. This faking being the victim is what North Korea is beast at. This is just been seventy years of pretending of the victim when it was the north that attacked the south that started the war in the first place. China made it clear back in the 1950 that would go to all out war to save North Korea and no USA president wanted to even consider attacking them and have a war with China. The never had any thing to fear but needed all of the to keep the population under control.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 28, 2020, 10:08:49 AM
You're wrong, Tex. The US has had sanctions on North Korea since the Korean victory in the war. The US has refused to productively engage with them at all since that time. Sour grapes, really. 

Further, the US bullies and coerces other countries not to do business with them. You lot even blocked New Zealand selling them some cows.

Simply because they won't capitulate and surrender to the US it has continued. They would negotiate but not disarm. They armed themselves with nuclear weapons to protect themselves - and its worked. You lot dont invade countries that can fight back. You put sanctions on them instead. See Russia for details.

Trump pretended to engage with them, but delivered nothing and now they see it was just a PR exercise for Trump. He was wasting their time and never intended to make any progress.

Since then, your country has even engaged in acts of piracy (https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/u-s-seeks-seize-north-korean-ship-suspected-violating-u-n1003811) and has resorted to even stealing their trading ships.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on April 28, 2020, 10:24:44 AM

Somebody should tell President Moon Jae-in of South Korea that North Korea doesn't want to attack his nation so he can make the decision to reduce the size of the South Korean Army and tell American troops to go home.

Ideally, yes. But as a client state of the US they have to do as they're told. The US needs its bogeymen. Remember "axis of evil", "war on terror" and "Russian aggression"? The whole "Rocketman" thing is a narrative same as those ideas were.

Having worked with the South Korean military for several years I sincerely think you don't have a clue about what you are talking about (with regards to the South Koreans).
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 28, 2020, 10:29:12 AM

Somebody should tell President Moon Jae-in of South Korea that North Korea doesn't want to attack his nation so he can make the decision to reduce the size of the South Korean Army and tell American troops to go home.

Ideally, yes. But as a client state of the US they have to do as they're told. The US needs its bogeymen. Remember "axis of evil", "war on terror" and "Russian aggression"? The whole "Rocketman" thing is a narrative same as those ideas were.

Having worked with the South Korean military for several years I sincerely think you don't have a clue about what you are talking about (with regards to the South Koreans).

You're welcome to that opinion.  tiphat
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 28, 2020, 10:33:29 AM
I suspect your government would need to push the propaganda none stop for this one to happen, install a siege like mentality. In the short term, you might find a few patriots willing to pay a bit more to avoid buying Chinese. In the end, consumerism is led by price and quality and when the talk of the enemy is over, capitalism wins.


America's cheap goods used to be made in Japan and Taiwan. Nixon opened up America to China in the 70's and they eventually became our cheap goods supplier. Trump can close that door and make another nation our cheap goods supplier.


Ideally, yes. But as a client state of the US they have to do as they're told. The US needs its bogeymen. Remember "axis of evil", "war on terror" and "Russian aggression"? The whole "Rocketman" thing is a narrative same as those ideas were.


The North killed millions of South Koreans. That was real. For some people 9/11, Crimea invasion, Iraq hostility and violation of UN resolutions are not real but South Koreans know they have a real bogeyman next door.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 28, 2020, 10:42:56 AM
but South Koreans know they have a real bogeyman next door.

Sure, those aggressive North Koreans that have *not invaded* for seventy years. I'm sure the South Koreans are still trembling at the prospect.  :-\

It all rather smells like how Russia has allegedly - according to the US - constantly been poised to invade bits of the EU for decades. But um... didn't.

But yes, those pesky North Koreans. The impudence of wanting to reunify their country, buy some tractor parts, cows and develop a self sufficient agriculture and import/export industry without American interference. How dare they not want to be dictated to by some imperialists from thousands of miles away? :prophead:

Perhaps you think they should trust the US after John Bolton said, “We have very much in mind the Libya model from 2003, 2004,”

That means disarming voluntarily and then being invaded and the leader killed. The NYT helpfully explains that here so I don't have to: How the ‘Libya Model’ Became a Sticking Point in North Korea Nuclear Talks (https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/16/world/asia/north-korea-libya-model.html)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on April 28, 2020, 11:03:39 AM
but South Koreans know they have a real bogeyman next door.

Sure, those aggressive North Koreans that have *not invaded* for seventy years. I'm sure the South Koreans are still trembling at the prospect.  :-\

It all rather smells like how Russia has allegedly - according to the US - constantly been poised to invade bits of the EU for decades. But um... didn't.

But yes, those pesky North Koreans. The impudence of wanting to reunify their country, buy some tractor parts, cows and develop a self sufficient agriculture and import/export industry without American interference. How dare they not want to be dictated to by some imperialists from thousands of miles away? :prophead:

Perhaps you think they should trust the US after John Bolton said, “We have very much in mind the Libya model from 2003, 2004,”

That means disarming voluntarily and then being invaded and the leader killed. The NYT helpfully explains that here so I don't have to: How the ‘Libya Model’ Became a Sticking Point in North Korea Nuclear Talks (https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/16/world/asia/north-korea-libya-model.html)

Did you know that Bolton is no longer an advisor to the US?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 28, 2020, 11:13:41 AM
Sure, those aggressive North Koreans that have *not invaded* for seventy years. I'm sure the South Koreans are still trembling at the prospect.  :-\


You wonder why N Koreans have not invaded for 70 years? Who's providing security for South Korea?

 While N Korea heavily invests its economy into the military to create the 4th largest army in the world behind China, India, USA but ahead of Russia, S Koreans are living the good life.

https://www.globalfirepower.com/active-military-manpower.asp

If Kim Jong Un shares your belief American and South Korea wants to invade, he's missing out on the good life. Well, he won't miss it but his people will.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on April 28, 2020, 11:14:55 AM


The North killed millions of South Koreans. That was real. For some people 9/11, Crimea invasion, Iraq hostility and violation of UN resolutions are not real but South Koreans know they have a real bogeyman next door.

Crimea has been in a happy place since 2014.

You almost think they let them in with open arms......... oh wait


And yes i am in crimea every year
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 28, 2020, 11:17:25 AM
Crimea has been in a happy place since 2014.

You almost think they let them in with open arms......... oh wait


And yes i am in crimea every year

America can make a large portions of Russia a happy place too. Should we invade?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 28, 2020, 11:35:30 AM
Did you know that Bolton is no longer an advisor to the US?

Of course. But the underlying policy is unlikely to change. Knowing about Libya, if you were Kim Jong-un, would you trust the US? I wouldn't.

Sure, those aggressive North Koreans that have *not invaded* for seventy years. I'm sure the South Koreans are still trembling at the prospect.  :-\


You wonder why N Koreans have not invaded for 70 years? Who's providing security for South Korea?

 While N Korea heavily invests its economy into the military to create the 4th largest army in the world behind China, India, USA but ahead of Russia, S Koreans are living the good life.

https://www.globalfirepower.com/active-military-manpower.asp

If Kim Jong Un shares your belief American and South Korea wants to invade, he's missing out on the good life. Well, he won't miss it but his people will.

I never said South Korea wanted to invade the North - you made that up.

I said that if there were the prospect of winning easily and not pissing off China and Russia, the US would have overthrown Kim already. But they couldn't win 70 years ago and they certainly couldn't now, so they bully them with sanctions. Same as Russia. Both countries give you the middle finger so sanctions are permanent.

Of course the people and the leadership of the north want the good life. But they don't want to surrender to the US to get it, and why should they need to? Any poverty that exists in North Korea is a direct result of US sanctions. Your sanctions only hurt the people. The people there know that.

Trump threw away a huge opportunity. He could have gone down in history as the guy that solved a 70 year stalemate. I actually think he wanted to, but the deep state and the power behind the throne prevented it.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 28, 2020, 11:44:27 AM
Crimea has been in a happy place since 2014.

You almost think they let them in with open arms......... oh wait


And yes i am in crimea every year

America can make a large portions of Russia a happy place too. Should we invade?

You have not because you know you can't win. Hasn't the penny dropped yet? You lot even come second against blokes on camels and geezers in caves. You're good at destruction of third world countries. Actually winning and having a good outcome, less so. You came second in North Korea, Vietnam. Destroyed Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan with no good outcome. You're not really terribly good at it.  :coffeeread:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on April 28, 2020, 11:51:00 AM
How happy is the United States right now? 26 million unemployed and rising. Food shortages imminent. Social unrest across the nation.

Things are looking real good right now. I'd that the 'happiness' that USAians want to export right now?

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 28, 2020, 12:05:59 PM
I never said South Korea wanted to invade the North - you made that up.


South Korea is a puppet of the USA, right?

I said that if there were the prospect of winning easily and not pissing off China and Russia, the US would have overthrown Kim already. But they couldn't win 70 years ago and they certainly couldn't now, so they bully them with sanctions. Same as Russia. Both countries give you the middle finger so sanctions are permanent.


We give them sanctions and they give us the middle finger. I'll take that. USA is going to protect its friends and some people don't like that.


Of course the people and the leadership of the north want the good life. But they don't want to surrender to the US to get it, and why should they need to? Any poverty that exists in North Korea is a direct result of US sanctions. Your sanctions only hurt the people. The people there know that.


 If you have a boss that gives you a job and income or you have a hand that feeds you, you don't bite the people/hand that helps you survive and thrive. North Korea chose China and Russia to do business with and they remain a failure.

Trump threw away a huge opportunity. He could have gone down in history as the guy that solved a 70 year stalemate. I actually think he wanted to, but the deep state and the power behind the throne prevented it.


You mean Kim Jong Un passed up opportunity. Trump isn't like previous presidents that will shower North Korea with food and money hoping they keep their end of the bargain.


Crimea has been in a happy place since 2014.

You almost think they let them in with open arms......... oh wait


And yes i am in crimea every year

America can make a large portions of Russia a happy place too. Should we invade?

You have not because you know you can't win. Hasn't the penny dropped yet? You lot even come second against blokes on camels and geezers in caves. You're good at destruction of third world countries. Actually winning and having a good outcome, less so. You came second in North Korea, Vietnam. Destroyed Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan with no good outcome. You're not really terribly good at it.  :coffeeread:

Maybe we partnered up with UK and the UK is the reason for the results you didn't like? The only way to beat some people is to liquidate them. America and the UK won't do that but they have the means to liquidate people and get a win that will impress you.


North Korean defectors call family back home but can't get answers. Some family members hang up knowing the government is listening. You can't bad mouth Kim Jong Un without risking your life. You can bad mouth Trump on the phone, at home or in another country without risk of execution. N Korea reminds me of Iraq when Saddam Insane was in power. My Iraqi friend calls his father back in Iraq. Iraqi police put the father in prison after they learn he had a son in America.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/ignorance-fear-whispers-north-korean-defectors-say-contacts-in-the-dark-about-kim/ar-BB13jBZa?ocid=spartanntp

How happy is the United States right now? 26 million unemployed and rising. Food shortages imminent. Social unrest across the nation.

Things are looking real good right now. I'd that the 'happiness' that USAians want to export right now?


I'd say we're happy and healthy enough to add more money in the IMF so other countries can borrow. Weeks ago, the number was up to 94 nations that wanted to borrow from the IMF.  IMF hopes other countries add money too. People are getting $1390 a week on unemployment in my State plus $1200 per adult and $500 per child in the household. Amazing our government has trillions to keep us going and money left over to keep dozens of other governments afloat. Back during the 2008 worldwide recession, America added money to the IMF to loan other nations too. 8 years later, America has the strongest economy ever.

http://www.imf.org/en/News/Articles/2020/03/26/pr20109-usa-statement-on-the-united-states-congress-move-to-strengthen-the-imfs-resources


Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on April 28, 2020, 12:10:56 PM
Crimea has been in a happy place since 2014.

You almost think they let them in with open arms......... oh wait


And yes i am in crimea every year

America can make a large portions of Russia a happy place too. Should we invade?

No because you know the public there will be aggressive towards a hostile takeover.

Sabotage guerilla warfare and other nastyness will wait you there.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: NS1 on April 28, 2020, 12:22:08 PM
Crimea has been in a happy place since 2014.

You almost think they let them in with open arms......... oh wait


And yes i am in crimea every year

America can make a large portions of Russia a happy place too. Should we invade?

You have not because you know you can't win. Hasn't the penny dropped yet? You lot even come second against blokes on camels and geezers in caves. You're good at destruction of third world countries. Actually winning and having a good outcome, less so. You came second in North Korea, Vietnam. Destroyed Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan with no good outcome. You're not really terribly good at it.  :coffeeread:
You're correct to a point, because they way they do it, gives the results.
Many of the opposite hide in churches, schools hospitals etc.

If it came down to it, no one has what the US has for fire power.
change the rules and it might be  a tad bit different.

Why did Russia have so much quick success in Ukraine.
because they didn't give a shit, they would bomb anything and did.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on April 28, 2020, 12:40:58 PM
How happy is the United States right now? 26 million unemployed and rising. Food shortages imminent. Social unrest across the nation.

Things are looking real good right now. I'd that the 'happiness' that USAians want to export right now?

We have the capability of feeding ourselves and providing all of the energy we need.  How about you Muppets over there?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 28, 2020, 12:55:09 PM
North Korean defectors call family back home but can't get answers. Some family members hang up knowing the government is listening.

That isn't true. Most numbers in North Korea - those belonging to regular people - can't receive incoming international calls.

I wrote about this previously. Educate yourself >>here<< (https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,28510.msg502509.html#msg502509).

If you keep making things up like this, we'll have to start calling you Moby2.  :chuckle:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on April 28, 2020, 01:03:56 PM
North Korean defectors call family back home but can't get answers. Some family members hang up knowing the government is listening.

That isn't true. Most numbers in North Korea - those belonging to regular people - can't receive incoming international calls.

I wrote about this previously. Educate yourself >>here<< (https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,28510.msg502509.html#msg502509).

If you keep making things up like this, we'll have to start calling you Moby2.  :chuckle:

They are not capable of outgoing international calls either.  Why is that?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 28, 2020, 01:48:56 PM

But they couldn't win 70 years ago and they certainly couldn't now, so they bully them with sanctions. Same as Russia. Both countries give you the middle finger so sanctions are permanent.


The sanctions against North Korea were voted on in the UN and both Russia and Chine voted for them. Please explain
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on April 28, 2020, 04:28:04 PM
Trump threw away a huge opportunity. He could have gone down in history as the guy that solved a 70 year stalemate. I actually think he wanted to, but the deep state and the power behind the throne prevented it.
You mean Kim Jong Un passed up opportunity. Trump isn't like previous presidents that will shower North Korea with food and money hoping they keep their end of the bargain.

Crimea has been in a happy place since 2014.

You almost think they let them in with open arms......... oh wait

And yes i am in crimea every year

America can make a large portions of Russia a happy place too. Should we invade?

You have not because you know you can't win. Hasn't the penny dropped yet? You lot even come second against blokes on camels and geezers in caves. You're good at destruction of third world countries. Actually winning and having a good outcome, less so. You came second in North Korea, Vietnam. Destroyed Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan with no good outcome. You're not really terribly good at it.  :coffeeread:

Maybe we partnered up with UK and the UK is the reason for the results you didn't like? The only way to beat some people is to liquidate them. America and the UK won't do that but they have the means to liquidate people and get a win that will impress you.

Manny, you should feel ashamed and a failure of your self trying to Educate mentally defective people who have been brainwashed or as Andrew says Programmed and you are wasting your time! ???  :nod: :laugh:

On the other hand  I fail to understand how you can stomach statements like the one highlighted above?  >:(

But then what can you expect from a Person that has betrayed his own birth country and has been trained by their MAFIA run state. Do you really expect of him to have any morals?  :'( :dh:

 tiphat
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on April 28, 2020, 04:30:13 PM
How happy is the United States right now? 26 million unemployed and rising. Food shortages imminent. Social unrest across the nation.

Social unrest? Where? Some ones bedroom?

Sometimes I wonder about your filters. Except for limited toilet paper, there do not seem to be any shortages, except perhaps on common sense from those who are abroad. Yes some prices have risen others have fallen.

Yes there are many presently unemployed but I suspect in 6 weeks the only thing one will hear are foreign leaders asking for help from The United States.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on April 28, 2020, 04:30:34 PM

But they couldn't win 70 years ago and they certainly couldn't now, so they bully them with sanctions. Same as Russia. Both countries give you the middle finger so sanctions are permanent.


The sanctions against North Korea were voted on in the UN and both Russia and Chine voted for them. Please explain

Where are your evidence for your statement?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 28, 2020, 04:36:07 PM
Sanction against North Korea did little because China was able to supply them with everything they needed. It is only China that can have meaningful sanctions. Actually Sanction against Russia only have limited meaning and the only reason they have any bit in it because the EU sanctions them. As long as Europe keeps buying oil products from Russia they are more of a dog and pony show. China is only pretending to have sanctions against North Korea as part of a dog and pony show there. More cars are showing up and North Korea is continuing to build. In the Early days after the UN resolution the sanctions were causing North Korea some trouble. Kim had a couple of meeting with China and they seem to work thing out where it is back to normal. Now just a whole lot of North Korea claiming fake victim. No real meaningful sanctions against North Korea. The trouble is if Russia and China are going to let North Korea have nuclear weapons then why can not Japan and Ukraine not have nuclear weapons. That is why the fake dog and pony show over sanctions that do not really exist. 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on April 28, 2020, 04:37:52 PM

But they couldn't win 70 years ago and they certainly couldn't now, so they bully them with sanctions. Same as Russia. Both countries give you the middle finger so sanctions are permanent.


The sanctions against North Korea were voted on in the UN and both Russia and Chine voted for them. Please explain

Where are your evidence for your statement?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sanctions_against_North_Korea#United_Nations_Security_Council

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 28, 2020, 06:31:13 PM

That is your Reality....... from the Jewish Wikipedia  ;D

The United States imposed sanctions in the 1950s and tightened them further after international bombings against South Korea by North Korean agents during the 1980s, including the Rangoon bombing and the bombing of Korean Air Flight 858. In 1988, the United States added North Korea to its list of state sponsors of terrorism.

 Have you read thee whole article?     :biggrin:

It fooled you into thinking we really did something. Didn't it!! With China next door how do we sanction North Korea? How does it matter what list we add it to? They keep building new buildings and keep have more car and the gasoline to run them because there are no real sanction. Just a real nice dog and pony show. Boy does it look like we are tuff!!!
 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 28, 2020, 10:38:40 PM
Now just a whole lot of North Korea claiming fake victim. No real meaningful sanctions against North Korea.

That's inaccurate. Sanctions have and do hurt them. It means they can't trade as freely as they'd like. That has held them back considerably. Of course, many countries still trade with them, so they are not as cut off as the US would hope. But to say they claim fake victim or sanctions aren't meaningful is again, as with several of your statements about this country, simply false.

Many people misunderstand the sanctions. They don't prohibit all trade, they prohibit trade in certain types of things. Food for example is meant to be exempted from sanctions. But try sending some from the west and you'll hit a huge wall of terrified bureaucracy.

One of the difficulties of sanctions is they prohibit trade in what's called dual use goods; that is stuff that can be used by the military. But that doesn't just mean things like guns and components for weapons as you'd imagine. In the real world that can be applied to pretty much anything. Tyres, screwdrivers, automotive components, appliances, etc.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 28, 2020, 11:19:30 PM
Now just a whole lot of North Korea claiming fake victim. No real meaningful sanctions against North Korea.

That’s inaccurate. Sanctions have and do hurt them. It means they can’t trade as freely as they’d like. That has held them back considerably. Of course, many countries still trade with them, so they are not as cut off as the US would hope. But to say they claim fake victim or sanctions aren’t meaningful is again, as with several of your statements about this country, simply false.

Many people misunderstand the sanctions. They don’t prohibit all trade, they prohibit trade in certain types of things. Food for example is meant to be exempted from sanctions. But try sending some from the west and you’ll hit a huge wall of terrified bureaucracy.

One of the difficulties of sanctions is they prohibit trade in what’s called dual use goods; that is stuff that can be used by the military. But that doesn’t just mean things like guns and components for weapons as you’d imagine. In the real world that can be applied to pretty much anything. Tyres, screwdrivers, automotive components, appliances, etc.

China makes all that stuff. They have new cars and the gasoline for the cars and able to build new buildings because of their neighbor. They are able to kept the regime and all of its people under control because being at war. Part of why the Chinese vote for the sanction it give them more control of North Korea which they want. If the sanctions really hurt them then they would not be building new buildings like you stayed in and they would not have gasoline and would get rid of there nuclear weapons and bring all of this to an end. As you said the South does not want to attack the North. Our sanction against the North Korea is for everything. China buy their coal and other raw materials sell them anything they want. China does not want them to have factories which they could have if they would get rid of the nuclear weapons. Apparently they like it like this, want to complain I am a victim and clam they need the nuclear weapons for their protection when they do not. It is all a big game that keeps Kim in control of the country. I do not see an end to any of this because no one has a motive to end it. It works for China and it work for Kim Jong Un personally.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 29, 2020, 06:47:12 AM
They are able to kept the regime and all of its people under control because being at war.

They are not at war in reality.

and would get rid of there nuclear weapons and bring all of this to an end.

If they got rid of their weapons, you lot would be in there like a rat up a drainpipe. So they cant. Only their nuclear weapons are keeping you lot out.

Our sanction against the North Korea is for everything.

Not true. Go and read them.

China buy their coal and other raw materials sell them anything they want. China does not want them to have factories which they could have if they would get rid of the nuclear weapons.

China does buy their coal, but at a silly low price. Something like $15 a ton. They believe China does this to keep them down as you suggest. They do have factories by the way, just not as many as they'd like.

they need the nuclear weapons for their protection when they do not.

Untrue. See above and posts passim.

I do not see an end to any of this because no one has a motive to end it.

The end could be easy. Remove some sanctions in exchange for a suspension of weapons testing (which Kim did already but Trump reneged - so they started up again). And having dangled that carrot, get more co-operation and remove sanctions incrementally. The only thing that isn't on the table is getting rid of the nukes entirely, as to do so would be suicide. But further development could certainly be arrested.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 29, 2020, 11:47:18 AM
North Korean defectors call family back home but can't get answers. Some family members hang up knowing the government is listening.

That isn't true. Most numbers in North Korea - those belonging to regular people - can't receive incoming international calls.

I wrote about this previously. Educate yourself >>here<< (https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,28510.msg502509.html#msg502509).

If you keep making things up like this, we'll have to start calling you Moby2.  :chuckle:

Most numbers in NK can't be called to but some can. There are many calling card sites I can buy a calling card to call NK. Sure some hotels and government officials can be called but like anything, people can work around restrictions and break the law to receive international calls.

http://speedypin.com/phone/card/guide-call-north-korea.html

https://www.amantel.com/cheap-calling/calling-page.aspx

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-possible-to-make-a-phone-call-to-North-Korea

I'm sure NK blocks calls from certain countries like South Korea completely but they do allow calls from China. I'm sure some NK businessmen can accept calls from China and Russia. NK may even allow calls coming in from other nations to gather information about where their criminal defectors are located at and learn what's on their mind.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: dcguyusa on April 29, 2020, 02:05:34 PM
Quote
Most recently, one post suggested that Kim was injured by shrapnel from an exploding cruise missile while monitoring a weapons test.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/signs-from-north-korea-only-raise-more-questions-about-absent-kim-jong-un/ar-BB13mVbZ

This would be perfect karma.   :chuckle: (:)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 29, 2020, 02:15:54 PM
North Korean defectors call family back home but can't get answers. Some family members hang up knowing the government is listening.

That isn't true. Most numbers in North Korea - those belonging to regular people - can't receive incoming international calls.

I wrote about this previously. Educate yourself >>here<< (https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,28510.msg502509.html#msg502509).

If you keep making things up like this, we'll have to start calling you Moby2.  :chuckle:

Most numbers in NK can't be called to but some can. There are many calling card sites I can buy a calling card to call NK. Sure some hotels and government officials can be called but like anything, people can work around restrictions and break the law to receive international calls.

http://speedypin.com/phone/card/guide-call-north-korea.html

https://www.amantel.com/cheap-calling/calling-page.aspx

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-possible-to-make-a-phone-call-to-North-Korea

I'm sure NK blocks calls from certain countries like South Korea completely but they do allow calls from China. I'm sure some NK businessmen can accept calls from China and Russia. NK may even allow calls coming in from other nations to gather information about where their criminal defectors are located at and learn what's on their mind.

You didn't read the info I supplied, Billy Moby2.

Come back to us when you have dialled a few private people.

I dont need to speculate or Google. I've been there and had these discussions with North Koreans.  :coffeeread:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on April 29, 2020, 02:31:11 PM

You didn't read the info I supplied, Billy Moby2.

Come back to us when you have dialled a few private people.

I dont need to speculate or Google. I've been there and had these discussions with North Koreans.  :coffeeread:

Oooh,

Speaking of me,have you decided why the Russian in NK saw a completely different ( real?) side you 'missed' ..
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 29, 2020, 02:46:42 PM
I dont need to speculate or Google. I've been there and had these discussions with North Koreans.  :coffeeread:


You are speculating. Regardless of what the law is and the few people repeating what the law says, there's always a way around things. Always. Just got to find people smart enough to get around things.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on April 29, 2020, 04:04:06 PM
I dont need to speculate or Google. I've been there and had these discussions with North Koreans.  :coffeeread:


You are speculating. Regardless of what the law is and the few people repeating what the law says, there's always a way around things. Always. Just got to find people smart enough to get around things.

Manny, I think Moby 2 is working for NSA or the CIA so he knows better how to call N. Korea!

 :chuckle:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 29, 2020, 04:16:47 PM
I dont need to speculate or Google. I've been there and had these discussions with North Koreans.  :coffeeread:


You are speculating. Regardless of what the law is and the few people repeating what the law says, there's always a way around things. Always. Just got to find people smart enough to get around things.

Manny, I think Moby 2 is working for NSA or the CIA so he knows better how to call N. Korea!

 :chuckle:

He thinks Quora and 8c a minute call sites trumps actual experience. I think he’s just trolling me now in his new Moby2 persona.


You didn't read the info I supplied, Billy Moby2.

Come back to us when you have dialled a few private people.

I dont need to speculate or Google. I've been there and had these discussions with North Koreans.  :coffeeread:

Oooh,

Speaking of me,have you decided why the Russian in NK saw a completely different ( real?) side you 'missed' ..

No, I intend to finish his videos. Thanks for the reminder.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on April 29, 2020, 10:15:51 PM

If North Korea can hack into Sony and America can shut down North Korea's internet as retaliation, I'm sure somebody is smart enough to figure out how to make a phone call in and out of North Korea. But you guys go on thinking people can't work around the law.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 29, 2020, 11:29:00 PM
The only reason for the Nuclear weapons is simple to extort money from the USA and play victim while having aggressive behavior. They proved this beyond any doubt when the would no longer up held the agreement with Clinton.  Manny the real thing is you approve of nuclear extortion and government that kill many of its own citizens. You just love a head of state who even killed much of his own family to be sure he keeps power. What the sanction do is mainly they can not build factories and sell stuff to the USA like the south. When given the opportunity they turned it down.  All of this is exactly what China wants. I'm sure the Chinese are doing their part to see to it the sanction in North Korea do not end soon.

China just loves USA sanctions. They screw Russia then, They screw over Iran and they screw over Venezuela. You just got to love these Chinese. Screwing over North Korea is really the Chinese style. They suck up money where ever they go kill any buddies else's factories, steal technology, and ruin their economies. I recently read an article that said Australia is wondering if China is worth if because of the interference with their internal politics. China buys 1/3 of all Australia export. Now they act like they own the country.  I am sure our buying Chinese products is not worth it to us.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on April 30, 2020, 01:06:37 AM

I dont need to speculate or Google. I've been there and had these discussions with North Koreans.  :coffeeread:
Don't try Manny.

I am going to Crimea every year and nobody wishes to hear what its like out there. Everyone seems to buy the propaganda its a wasteland where the military is running around with Guns and unhappy people everywhere.

Some of the things I heard would lead me to believe there is some sort of mini 'mad max' scenario going on there  :rolleye0009:

That it is a beautiful peninsula where tourism blooms so much that last year saw a 1-hour traffic-jam where previously there wasnt is of course a work of fiction  :'(

I truly hope that that road in Saky is improved this year. (If my trip still stands).


And on-topic:

Soon kim yong un wil come out perfectly healthy (or appear to be) and western propaganda tabloids will be stuck with even lower
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on April 30, 2020, 01:10:04 AM

If North Korea can hack into Sony and America can shut down North Korea's internet as retaliation, I'm sure somebody is smart enough to figure out how to make a phone call in and out of North Korea. But you guys go on thinking people can't work around the law.

Whilst you may have a point that people can phone in/out of NK around the law, this is just a minority for 2 reasons:

1) It isn't against the law to phone internationally in NK. If I read Manny's trip report, it is only not possible because of the phone-net and you have to pay extra to get an international line because of limited supply.

2) The Majority of NK-citizens do not have friends outside of NK , and therefore do not pay extra for the intl. line.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Omega1982 on April 30, 2020, 03:17:56 AM
CNN are claiming Kim Jong-un is in a coma following heart surgery.

The rest of the world’s media have copied and embellished the story with various bits of their own fake news.

Having read the original article, it appears to be uncorroborated speculation based on the claim he wasn’t present at the recent Day of the Sun celebrations. 

If it is true, and something happens to him, the future is unclear. His sister Kim Yo-jong some may assume the obvious successor, but a female leader is unlikely there. He has a ten year old son, but a child leader seems equally unlikely.

An overview without the western media hysteria here: https://www.rt.com/news/486390-kim-north-korea-surgery-cnn/

It has to be mount paektu bloodline
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Omega1982 on April 30, 2020, 03:25:40 AM
How happy is the United States right now? 26 million unemployed and rising. Food shortages imminent. Social unrest across the nation.

Things are looking real good right now. I'd that the 'happiness' that USAians want to export right now?

No export. We only want to import a million Natalya's and half a million svetlanas. 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on April 30, 2020, 04:19:30 AM
It looks as though the mass entertainment/news media is walking back the dead story and going over to a self-isolation story.

The latter makes more sense.

If the guy was dead then, by now, somebody would likely have been put forward as a replacement and that has not happened.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Lord of the Dance on April 30, 2020, 12:50:43 PM
A question relating to personal freedoms in North Korea: does anyone know if Kim's subjects are able to pursue a private pilot's license (PPL) for fixed wing, rotary wing or lighter-than-air aircraft? Any evidence of a balloon rally ever being held in NK? Balloon rallies are held everywhere from Japan to England, from Russia to Australia. Surely the Great King Kim wouldn't deprive his people of the joy derived from watching dozens of colorful balloons take to the skies, would he?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 30, 2020, 01:01:11 PM
A question relating to personal freedoms in North Korea: does anyone know if Kim's subjects are able to pursue a private pilot's license (PPL) for fixed wing, rotary wing or lighter-than-air aircraft?

Some people must be able to because one can take flights there. The Mirim flying club offers locals and foreigners microlight flights. I didn't do it as I didn't want to trust some little microlight with an unknown service history.

Koryo tours do the microlight thing and helicopter flights as well: https://koryogroup.com/blog/2016-in-review-the-year-we-conquered-both-air-and-sea

Even US media seems to have picked up on it: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/north-koreas-latest-fad-sightseeing-in-ultralight-airplanes/

Quote
Officials say more than 4,000 North Koreans have gone up in the ultralight fleet since, along with "hundreds of foreigners" from 12 countries.

The flights go directly over some of Pyongyang's most iconic spots, including the gargantuan May Day stadium, the torch-tipped Juche Tower and Kim Il Sung Square area, and the Munsu Water Park, yet another of Kim's leisure spot "gifts" to the city.

Flights start off over a typically rural setting, with a mixture of farmland and small hamlets.

That said, the man in the street probably wouldn't have the disposable income to pursue such a hobby. As anywhere, it will be a middle class pursuit there.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Lord of the Dance on April 30, 2020, 01:19:05 PM
A question relating to personal freedoms in North Korea: does anyone know if Kim's subjects are able to pursue a private pilot's license (PPL) for fixed wing, rotary wing or lighter-than-air aircraft?

Some people must be able to because one can take flights there. The Mirim flying club offers locals and foreigners microlight flights. I didn't do it as I didn't want to trust some little microlight with an unknown service history.

Koryo tours do the microlight thing and helicopter flights as well: https://koryogroup.com/blog/2016-in-review-the-year-we-conquered-both-air-and-sea

Even US media seems to have picked up on it: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/north-koreas-latest-fad-sightseeing-in-ultralight-airplanes/

Quote
Officials say more than 4,000 North Koreans have gone up in the ultralight fleet since, along with "hundreds of foreigners" from 12 countries.

The flights go directly over some of Pyongyang’s most iconic spots, including the gargantuan May Day stadium, the torch-tipped Juche Tower and Kim Il Sung Square area, and the Munsu Water Park, yet another of Kim’s leisure spot "gifts" to the city.

Flights start off over a typically rural setting, with a mixture of farmland and small hamlets.

That said, the man in the street probably wouldn't have the disposable income to pursue such a hobby. As anywhere, it will be a middle class pursuit there.

Probably a good choice. Just lost a friend last year in a microlight crash due to poor maintenance (blocked carb, engine-out into trees). Fascinating to hear that microlight flights are an option. But the balloon rally question still stands... have you ever heard of any ballooning activities in NK? I mean, maybe they really do hold rally and sport flights, but they're just super-secretive about it? Then again, a balloon ain't easy to keep secret.  ;D
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 30, 2020, 01:39:06 PM
I follow all the tour operators, many guides, some diplomats and a range of interesting people connected with there on social media and I've never seen hot air ballooning mentioned. 

The only balloons I recall mentioned were the ones filled with propaganda, USB sticks and DVDs etc., sent by activists floated over from the south. I think they shoot those down.....
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Lord of the Dance on April 30, 2020, 02:09:02 PM
The only balloons I recall mentioned were the ones filled with propaganda, USB sticks and DVDs etc., sent by activists floated over from the south. I think they shoot those down.....

Easy targets!  :laugh:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on April 30, 2020, 03:00:22 PM
The mention of Hot Air Balloons peaked my interest as I used to do this, regularly. A former next door neighbor was a pilot.

I found this info on Koreans using non passenger balloons


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balloon_propaganda_campaigns_in_Korea (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balloon_propaganda_campaigns_in_Korea)


Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on April 30, 2020, 03:20:03 PM
The mention of Hot Air Balloons peaked my interest as I used to do this, regularly. A former next door neighbor was a pilot.

I found this info on Koreans using non passenger balloons


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balloon_propaganda_campaigns_in_Korea (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balloon_propaganda_campaigns_in_Korea)

Yes, those are the ones I meant.

Reading the Wiki link, It's not really credible they could send those type of balloons as far as Pyongyang, not at least without a very lucky directional strong tail wind. If they are launching them from the region near Kaesong at the DMZ, Pyongyang is a long drive north from there. You'd notice balloons floating all that way. They'd be downed before reaching Pyongyang.

The photo on the link made me laugh. They always use shots of NK that make it look dreary, drab and grey.

This is the one from Wikipedia.

[attachimg=1]

That shot is from the top of the Juche Tower, I know this because I took almost the identical shot, on mine you can just see the stone balcony on the top of the tower where I'm standing.

[attachimg=2]

And my shot was hurried as you are not allowed to take photos up there any more. A shouty woman stops you.

Down on the ground, by the waters edge, you can see it's not drab at all. It's actually very clean, the water is crystal clear, there's exceptionally clean air and it's really rather nice.

[attachimg=3]
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on April 30, 2020, 06:42:32 PM
The Wikipedia image is quite an old one - you can see there's been quite a lot of new building since the Wikipedia pic that you can see in your, more recent, image.

Not quite like Shanghai that seems to change almost overnight, but there's clearly been quite a bit of development. I wonder how old the other picture is? It looks like a digital image so probably less than 15 years old.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on April 30, 2020, 08:23:06 PM
Lets see if I get this right. The DRPK produces a military that no European country could afford and with nuclear intercontinental missiles,  they have one of the world largest fleet of submarines, builds first rate cities, have no poverty and we are suppose to feel sorry for them because our sanction is not letting their life get better.

The reason no matter what the DRPK did that we did not invade them was simple. The city of soul was with in shelling distance of North Korea. It would taken us several days to get all the artillery pieces out but that time the city of soul would been in ruin.  Then the Chinese would shown up. It was a no win war for us without them having nuclear weapons. These weapons were just a means to extort money from us.

If they wanted to sell products to the USA they should of made friends with the USA. They sure had enough chances. The only thing the DPRK is really crying over is they want to USA to leave so they can use their over whelming military force to over run the south.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: dcguyusa on April 30, 2020, 11:59:47 PM
Quote
Pak cited accounts from defectors with family still inside North Korea. The message, she said: "It's really bad here."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2020/04/30/coronavirus-north-korea-claims-zero-cases-amid-kim-jong-un-rumors/3040447001/

If there is no virus there, why is everyone wearing a mask at the statue grounds on April 15?   :duh: (:)
Saw a short TV video program of someone who traveled into DPRK several years ago.  He got rare access to the mausoleum of the "eternal president".  Talk about overblown hero worship.   (:) :king:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 01, 2020, 12:40:34 AM
If they wanted to sell products to the USA they should of made friends with the USA.

I haven't seen it written that they want to sell to the US.

They'd like to trade with more places without your interference through.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 01, 2020, 11:37:29 PM
It's hard for a doctor to stay focused when there are guards pointing guns at his head.

Meanwhile, away from Billy's gun fantasies, RT report his train parked at Wonsan (as the Daily Mirror reported above) and his greetings to construction workers is reported by DPRK media:

https://www.rt.com/news/486905-kim-train-letter-health/

So, reading between the lines, it seems he may have had a procedure, is now recovering and avoiding the virus by chilling at the coast and isn't dead.

As predicted, Kim Jong-un is alive and well.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8279299/Kim-Jong-makes-public-appearance-20-days-fertiliser-plant.html

And the western fake news media are again exposed having spent the last two weeks reporting on his likely death.

What happens when you rely on "defectors" for information.

And now theres a new rumour he is dead. If he turns up alive that newspaper will be degraded to tabloid status

Quite.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Omega1982 on May 02, 2020, 12:05:14 AM
Manny do you think the virus will open new windows of opportunity for you to do business there or in China?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Olga_Mouse on May 02, 2020, 05:53:07 AM
As predicted, Kim Jong-un is alive and well.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8279299/Kim-Jong-makes-public-appearance-20-days-fertiliser-plant.html

 :nod:   https://news.mail.ru/politics/41632010/?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 02, 2020, 06:01:05 AM
Manny do you think the virus will open new windows of opportunity for you to do business there or in China?

I doubt new. Apart from maybe the mask business. But the world and his wife will be all over that soon enough and there'll be no profit to be had once its a race to the bottom.

China is pretty much business as usual again, and mostly open. NK haven't confirmed they had any virus at all. Unofficial reports suggest they have, but they were on it quite quickly and its well under control.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on May 02, 2020, 10:12:05 AM

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8279299/Kim-Jong-makes-public-appearance-20-days-fertiliser-plant.html


More BS propaganda photos N Korea provided. The two murals behind Kim Jong Un aren't the same. They better execute the photoshop workers so the next crew will do a better job. Another photo below that showing an army of people celebrating is very fuzzy. Photographers 100 years ago could take better photos than that. Photographers take hundreds of photos at events and the State media chooses the fuzzy one. Lol.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 02, 2020, 10:21:29 AM

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8279299/Kim-Jong-makes-public-appearance-20-days-fertiliser-plant.html


More BS propaganda photos N Korea provided. The two murals behind Kim Jong Un aren't the same. They better execute the photoshop workers so the next crew will do a better job. Another photo below that showing an army of people celebrating is very fuzzy. Photographers 100 years ago could take better photos than that. Photographers take hundreds of photos at events and the State media chooses the fuzzy one. Lol.

You won't be happy till he holds a sign up saying "Hello BillyB". Till then, everything you see will be fake for the same reasons I outlined here (https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,28896.msg510325.html#msg510325).

But wait.  :chuckle:

[attachimg=1]

PS, is the video >here<< (https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/01/kim-jong-un-reportedly-appears-public-following-health-rumours/) fake as well, Billy? :prophead:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on May 02, 2020, 10:24:14 AM

Is that all you got for me? I thought you were going to try to claim the two photos N Korea State media supplied with different photoshopped murals were actually the same with some funny reasoning behind it. Maybe somebody else will come forward and claim the photos are real?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 02, 2020, 12:46:03 PM
I'm sure even North Koreans know that about America.

In North Korea, in conversation, I was asked if I'd been to the US. As I said have been quite a few times, this caused some interest and questions about the place.

The take away from that discussion for them was they were happy to learn that although the US has more freedoms, Pyongyang has cleaner streets, less pollution, much lower crime, no unwanted immigration, better education for the masses, no traffic jams, no rent, no healthcare costs, no school/mall mass shooters and fewer social problems.

When asked if I'd like to live in the US, I answered that I wouldn't particularly choose to, but I could do if needed. They knew already that the notion that "everyone" wanted to live in the US was fake news and why.

They extrapolated from that in NK, what we perceive to be fewer freedoms meant a higher quality of life in their eyes. And on balance, they are happy not being shot, raped and mugged, not having the stress of monthly rent and bills and the need to live on credit. They'd rather not live in a polluted and dirty city sitting an hour each way each day to and from work in traffic.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on May 02, 2020, 01:32:56 PM
Things Billyb hasn't heard of, number 9,235: perspective.

Perspective is the way a 3 dimensional scene is depicted in 2 dimensional form. Images that are captured from a different position to each other will have differing relationships in terms of size and position.

In the images that have so confused poor Billyb we can see that various elements of each image are visible in both the images. Because they are a 2 dimensional representation of a 3 dimensional scene the relationships between the elements are different.

The 'mural' that so concerned poor Billykins is clearly the same, one can see elements of the mural in both pics and there are parts of the mural in common. In addition, the positioning and size of the elements are consistent across both photos.

While, from the evidence provided it is not possible to be certain that President Kim is alive, the images do not seem to be fakes or misrepresentations - at least not on the grounds that poor Billyb thought.

I bet that it's hard for you to drive, eh Billy? Or do you have special spectacles to help you with depth perception?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on May 02, 2020, 01:46:22 PM
Is that all you got for me? I thought you were going to try to claim the two photos N Korea State media supplied with different photoshopped murals were actually the same with some funny reasoning behind it. Maybe somebody else will come forward and claim the photos are real?

The video does not have any obvious evidence of doctoring or being made at different times. One would need a special program to be absolutely certain.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on May 02, 2020, 07:18:04 PM
I believe Kim is alive. He looks like he put on weight if that is possible. He most likely isolated for a coupled of weeks to not catch the virus and had nothing else to do but eat.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Omega1982 on May 02, 2020, 07:34:28 PM
Manny do you think the virus will open new windows of opportunity for you to do business there or in China?

I doubt new. Apart from maybe the mask business. But the world and his wife will be all over that soon enough and there'll be no profit to be had once its a race to the bottom.

China is pretty much business as usual again, and mostly open. NK haven't confirmed they had any virus at all. Unofficial reports suggest they have, but they were on it quite quickly and its well under control.

Perhaps cleaning supplies and medical equipment and pharmaceuticals.

Does North Korea have any type of non military manufacturing?

I imagine they import almost everything from China.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on May 02, 2020, 08:41:54 PM
Lots of non-military manufacturing.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c4/Kore_DR_Export_Treemap.jpg
The image shows the sectors of export goods. Only the larger sectors are identified for size reasons. The interested researcher can easily find the raw data to satisfy his thirst for knowledge.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on May 02, 2020, 09:40:01 PM
Things Billyb hasn't heard of, number 9,235: perspective.

Perspective is the way a 3 dimensional scene is depicted in 2 dimensional form. Images that are captured from a different position to each other will have differing relationships in terms of size and position.

In the images that have so confused poor Billyb we can see that various elements of each image are visible in both the images. Because they are a 2 dimensional representation of a 3 dimensional scene the relationships between the elements are different.

The 'mural' that so concerned poor Billykins is clearly the same, one can see elements of the mural in both pics and there are parts of the mural in common. In addition, the positioning and size of the elements are consistent across both photos.

While, from the evidence provided it is not possible to be certain that President Kim is alive, the images do not seem to be fakes or misrepresentations - at least not on the grounds that poor Billyb thought.

I bet that it's hard for you to drive, eh Billy? Or do you have special spectacles to help you with depth perception?

A fool speaks up! He also makes things up....again. Not only is one photo is elongated compared to the other the railroad tracks are a completely different pattern. Click on the photos to blow them up and if you can't see, use a magnifying glass or reading glasses.

We are suppose to be old enough to understand by now State controlled media puts out propaganda but we have adults who are naïve on how the world words thinks everything State controlled media puts in front of their face is true. They even defend a poorly done photoshop job. AnastasiaDate does a better job than them
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 02, 2020, 10:17:15 PM
Perhaps cleaning supplies and medical equipment and pharmaceuticals.

Pharmaceuticals is an interesting sector, but a regulatory nightmare in many respects. The book I am rereading, A Capitalist in North Korea, is written by a Swiss bloke who ran a pharmaceutical company there for eight years.

This is why trade takes time. Having identified a particular sector, one must do some light learning on it and then have a conversation to establish demand. At that point you find out local preferences can differ to what you imagine.

A good example of a growth industry there is domestic solar panels and 12v appliances. you’d think with China next door that supply might be plentiful, and it is. But they’d rather pay more for European made stuff as quality matters.

Does North Korea have any type of non military manufacturing?

One of the concepts of Juche is self sufficiency. They are constantly striving to to expand and improve local manufacturing. An example being their best selling beer is brewed locally using equipment that mostly came from the UK.

I know there’s a big glass factory they let people visit. I visited a bottled water factory. A lot of industry is centred around foodstuffs as imports are restricted. The new factory Kim visited the other day was a fertiliser one. Red ginseng, various teas and confectionery production they are proud of. Seafood and rice they also produce enough of to export.

I imagine they import almost everything from China.

As does much of the world.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on May 02, 2020, 10:27:43 PM
Billykins, go hand in your drivers licence.

If you are trying to be honest then you are a danger to others every time your turn on the ignition of any automobile.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 02, 2020, 10:28:18 PM
Not only is one photo is elongated compared to the other the railroad tracks are a completely different pattern. Click on the photos to blow them up and if you can't see, use a magnifying glass or reading glasses.

If this were the case, what would it prove? That state photographs are touched up a little? You’re grasping at straws really. State media releases photos and video of the leader opening a new factory, and to you this is suspicious. Yet a few days ago you were moaning that they wasn’t releasing enough of his movements to satisfy you, and that was suspicious too. Make your mind up.  :chuckle:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on May 02, 2020, 10:44:32 PM
The video does not have any obvious evidence of doctoring or being made at different times. One would need a special program to be absolutely certain.


Kim Jong Un learned from Stalin to erase certain things from history such as his uncle who was erased from every photo and video. They did a good job. Link below. N Korea's propaganda team can write up history any way you want.

https://www.theguardian.com/global/gallery/2013/dec/09/kim-jong-uns-uncle-vanishes-from-documentary-footage-in-pictures

State media releases photos and video of the leader opening a new factory, and to you this is suspicious.


All world leaders attend the grand opening of fertilizer plants. Nothing suspicious about that. Attending the grand opening of a fertilizer plant is more important than celebrating the birth anniversary celebrations of the nation's founder Kim Il Sung, his grandfather.

Most people don't care what's going on in N Korea or care for their propaganda games but it is funny to watch so although we don't laugh with N Korea, we laugh at them. Imagine if Trump disappeared for 3 weeks with no word on his whereabouts and it's reported he showed up attending a grand opening of a fertilizer plant without addressing the nation what just happened. Lol.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 02, 2020, 10:54:40 PM
There was some coverage on Fox on this subject that made sense (yes, really).

Quote
Others think skipping the ceremonies on Wednesday had more to do with the current dictator trying to distance himself from his family and highlight his own legacy.

"Kim Jong Un wants to break away from the past, as well as the North's traditional cult of personality," Ahn Chan-il, a North Korean defector and researcher in Seoul, told Agence France-Presse.

"He wants to come across and brand himself as a leader who is modern and competent, rather than a descendant of his predecessors," he told the news agency. "And he wants to gradually tone down the idolization of the two late leaders as it goes against his agenda to brand the North as a 'normal state.'"

Another North Korean observer noted that the country had an "unusually low-key commemoration" for the national holiday this year.

"This could be part of North Korea's ongoing propaganda effort to distance Kim Jong Un from the legacies of his grandfather and his father, a trend detected since the latter half of last year, the North's handling of the party founding anniversary in October 2019 being one example," Minyoung Lee, an expert in North Korean media and leadership, told NK News.

Celebrations in North Korea were noticeably quieter this year, with no large-scale events. A major marathon event in Pyongyang to mark the holiday was also canceled, according to Yonhap.

Source (https://www.foxnews.com/world/north-koreas-kim-jong-un-day-of-the-sun-coronavirus-cases-reclusive-nation)

When viewed in that context, his "disappearance" may not be so strange.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on May 03, 2020, 07:48:13 AM
That analysis makes some sense. Kim Jong Un's administration has been responsible for some very significant changes in the way the country is run in social, political and economic terms. In those terms moving away from the past makes sense.

There's another reason for having low key celebrations this year. Although Covid-19 has been efficiently dealt with (it seems) we know that the country has been engaging in a fair degree of low key social distancing and other measures such as mask wearing. Covid-19 is clearly regarded as a risk factor in the country. Bringing hundreds of thousands of people together from across the country into close proximity would be a big risk.

As an example of the risk associated with large gatherings look at Spain where on March 8th the government encouraged mass rallies in Madrid in particular, and other places. The Madrid rally in particular sparked off the severe increase in uncontrolled infection across the country. That's a lesson that few sensible administrations will have missed!
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Danchik on May 03, 2020, 08:30:05 AM
I was watching another video when this one came on afterwards. Not sure why as I never follow what's happening in NK.  Any truth to it?

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 03, 2020, 10:49:22 AM
Any truth to it?

As discussed in posts passim, one never knows how much credence to give testimony of defectors; it should be viewed through that skeptical lense. But none of it sounds too surprising. We can't be sure it's all accurate, but it seems mostly credible.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on May 03, 2020, 11:53:10 AM
That analysis makes some sense. Kim Jong Un's administration has been responsible for some very significant changes in the way the country is run in social, political and economic terms. In those terms moving away from the past makes sense.


The analyst didn't make sense to me. If Kim Jong Un doesn't want to attend anymore celebrations pertaining to his grandfather and father, he can just miss those days, not 3 weeks. Or better yet, he can cancel those holidays so every citizen understands they are moving away from the past. But if the past was so great, why move away from it?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on May 03, 2020, 02:21:58 PM

As discussed in posts passim, one never knows how much credence to give testimony of defectors; it should be viewed through that skeptical lense. But none of it sounds too surprising. We can't be sure it's all accurate, but it seems mostly credible.

You see that is the problem. When I leave the USA I am a tourist. When a north Korean Leaves north Korea he/she is a defector.  When I return home often the people working at customs often say welcome home. When the North Korea returns home he/she is put in prison. It is a huge difference.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 03, 2020, 03:13:53 PM

As discussed in posts passim, one never knows how much credence to give testimony of defectors; it should be viewed through that skeptical lense. But none of it sounds too surprising. We can't be sure it's all accurate, but it seems mostly credible.

You see that is the problem. When I leave the USA I am a tourist. When a north Korean Leaves north Korea he/she is a defector.  When I return home often the people working at customs often say welcome home. When the North Korea returns home he/she is put in prison. It is a huge difference.

An American - who doesn't get alternative political systems - wonders why the whole world isn't like America.  :coffeeread:  :fighting0025:  (:)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: NS1 on May 03, 2020, 03:22:48 PM

As discussed in posts passim, one never knows how much credence to give testimony of defectors; it should be viewed through that skeptical lense. But none of it sounds too surprising. We can't be sure it's all accurate, but it seems mostly credible.

You see that is the problem. When I leave the USA I am a tourist. When a north Korean Leaves north Korea he/she is a defector.  When I return home often the people working at customs often say welcome home. When the North Korea returns home he/she is put in prison. It is a huge difference.

An American - who doesn't get alternative political systems - wonders why the whole world isn't like America.  :coffeeread:  :fighting0025:  (:)
There is some truth to that statement,
but you see it polar opposite.
Why is the whole  world not like Russia or China.
Funny being the industrial type you are ( capitalist )
I am not sure why you think communism at any level is good?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 03, 2020, 03:41:09 PM
An American - who doesn't get alternative political systems - wonders why the whole world isn't like America.  :coffeeread:  :fighting0025:  (:)
There is some truth to that statement,
but you see it polar opposite.
Why is the whole  world not like Russia or China.
Funny being the industrial type you are ( capitalist )
I am not sure why you think communism at any level is good?

I see different systems where I go and accept them for what they are: Different. I dont seek to change them or wonder why this place isn't like that place. 

'When in Rome, do as the Romans do"
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on May 03, 2020, 04:58:16 PM

As discussed in posts passim, one never knows how much credence to give testimony of defectors; it should be viewed through that skeptical lense. But none of it sounds too surprising. We can't be sure it's all accurate, but it seems mostly credible.

You see that is the problem. When I leave the USA I am a tourist. When a north Korean Leaves north Korea he/she is a defector.  When I return home often the people working at customs often say welcome home. When the North Korea returns home he/she is put in prison. It is a huge difference.

Mainly you do not like America. It is a large continent with many counties.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on May 04, 2020, 10:09:14 AM
Well 'high profile' defectors from North Korea have been busy apologising today.

I bet that their stipends for their 'information' and 'insights' will be taking something of a hit henceforth.

Billykins, do you still think that Kim Jong Un is dead?
Did you get that optometrist test sorted out?

Prejudices without knowledge can be problematic, eh?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on May 04, 2020, 01:07:57 PM
Just watched this video and I like what I see.........

Life in North Korea


 tiphat
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 04, 2020, 02:01:19 PM
Just watched this video and I like what I see.........

Life in North Korea


 tiphat

I enjoyed that. That's the Korea I saw. I recognised very many places in that video.

According to Billy and Tex, that's all fake, they're all actors, these folks are oppressed, starving and poised to invade the south.  :chuckle:

What you see in that video is how it actually is. Anyone can see that's not fake.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on May 04, 2020, 10:08:06 PM
I enjoyed that.


If you enjoyed that, you'd be thrilled watching a video of Disneyland.

That’s the Korea I saw.


That's the Korea they wanted you to see.

Billykins, do you still think that Kim Jong Un is dead?


I don't care if he's dead. He'd be replaced by somebody as kind and intelligent as he is. It'll be a new boss, same shit. Every time he disappears for weeks or months and not running the country, the media will report it and the world will laugh at the games they play. Boris Johnson got COVID-19 hanging on for his life yet he still worked hard for the UK citizens. That's a leader worth respecting. What's Kim Jong Un's excuse?

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Olga_Mouse on May 05, 2020, 01:31:44 AM
Unlike Czech authorities (who have recently removed a monument to Marshal Konev :D), Kim dynasty takes good care of the graves of Soviet soldiers, who died in Korea in 1945. Thus a medal for Kim the young:
https://news.mail.ru/politics/41655000/?

More pics here:
https://www.facebook.com/pg/RusEmbDPRK/posts/
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on May 05, 2020, 04:57:10 AM
Billykins, whether you care about the Korean president's life is not at issue. The point was your willingness to believe stupid stories that fit your prejudices and your inability to see.

I doubt that you have the ability to think for yourself, relying mainly upon prejudice and the old standby of the thinking challenged, gut instinct.

How confident do you feel in your perspicacity having once again discovered your lack in that area?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on May 05, 2020, 09:52:14 AM
Unlike Czech authorities (who have recently removed a monument to Marshal Konev :D), Kim dynasty takes good care of the graves of Soviet soldiers, who died in Korea in 1945. Thus a medal for Kim the young:
https://news.mail.ru/politics/41655000/?

More pics here:
https://www.facebook.com/pg/RusEmbDPRK/posts/

Too bad Kim Jong Un wasn't there to accept the medal from Putin.


I doubt that you have the ability to think for yourself,


Says the guy who believe the two murals behind Kim Jong Un was the same and then tried to prove they were the same! Lol. You got duped and then tried to dupe us with that propaganda.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on May 08, 2020, 05:09:09 AM
Manny Just come across this video from a Greek woman, working for UNICEF who lived in N. Korea for 2 years, between 2012 - 2014. As part of the UNICEF she was given a Diplomatic Passport and was able to travel everywhere without any Government Companion. She was living in a poor area.....so she know a lot more than all those clever "Know all USians" but I am sure Moby who speaks fluent Greek.... he will correct me! !!!! :laugh:

Unfortunately they have no transcript to translate but I suggest you translate the page and read the comments......... very revealing! Is teh one at the bottom of the picture!

"The Greek woman who lived in North Korea"


 tiphat

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on May 08, 2020, 06:34:33 AM
In the Land of Kim
Fragkiska Megaloudi

(https://s0.wp.com/wp-content/themes/pub/karuna/assets/images/header.jpg)

In the Land of Kim/Στη Χώρα των Κιμ (https://fragkiskamegaloudi.wordpress.com/in-the-land-of-kim-%CF%83%CF%84%CE%B7-%CF%87%CF%8E%CF%81%CE%B1-%CF%84%CF%89%CE%BD-%CE%BA%CE%B9%CE%BC-the-book-%CF%84%CE%BF-%CE%B2%CE%B9%CE%B2%CE%BB%CE%AF%CE%BF/)

I lived and worked 2 years in North Korea. The idea for this book was born while I was still living in North Korea. From the very first days that I arrived, I felt that there was a truth there that needed to be told. It isn’t easy to unlock the secrets of North Korea; from the moment you arrive in the country you realise that everything you know or have heard about it is pretty much worthless. This book was written so that I could say what I saw and what I learnt during these two years I lived the life of an expat in Pyongyang. I wanted to give the picture of the country that I had experienced, without exaggerations and in as balanced a way as possible.I would like to believe that when someone finishes reading this book, he or she will know a little more about the country than they did before.

Living in North Korea


What we know about North Korea?


 tiphat       
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on May 08, 2020, 06:36:25 AM
A little late, there, Wiz ...
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Olga_Mouse on May 08, 2020, 10:32:12 AM
https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/4340868?

 :reading:  :coffeeread:

And Kim continues again
North Korean leader continues to amaze everyone


DPRK State Council Chairman Kim Jong-un resumed diplomatic activity interrupted due to his recent absence, congratulating Chinese leader Xi Jinping on "a landslide victory in the war against an unprecedented pandemic." An unexpected "oral personal message" to Xi Jinping is rife with laudatory rhetoric addressed to China and its leader, noting the special proximity of the DPRK and the PRC. Before that, Kim Jong-un did not publicly react to the awarding of his Russian anniversary medal of Victory. Russian Ambassador to Pyongyang, Alexander Macegora, handed over the medal awarded to the North Korean leader by Russian President Vladimir Putin and DPRK Foreign Minister Lee Song Gwon. Against this background, the desire to meet with the North Korean leader was announced by Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe.

The fact that Kim Jong-un, who reappeared in public after a three-week absence, sent an "oral personal message" to President Xi Jinping of the PRC, was announced today by the North Korean agency TsTAK.

Without specifying why such an unusual form was chosen for the message and how it was sent to Beijing, the CCTC abundantly quotes Kim Jong-un, expressing admiration for the PRC and its leader. In a situation where China is under increasing pressure from the United States and its allies, blaming Beijing for distributing COVID-19, Kim Jong-un congratulated Chinese leader Xi Jinping on "a landslide victory in the war against an unprecedented pandemic."

"Dear senior leader, comrade Kim Jong-un, noted that he was pleased with the success of China as his own, and expressed confidence that under the wise leadership of Secretary General Comrade Xi Jinping, the party and people of China will strengthen and constantly increase the successes already achieved to achieve a final victory," notes CTC.

It is noteworthy that, having declared China's victory in the fight against the pandemic, on the eve of May 9, Kim Jong-un did not publicly respond to awarding him with the Russian jubilee medal "75 years of Victory in the Great Patriotic War of 1941-1945".

The decree of Russian President Vladimir Putin, who awarded the honorary award to 36-year-old Kim Jong-un, emphasizes that the North Korean leader made "a great personal contribution to perpetuate the memory of Soviet citizens who died and were buried in the DPRK and showed concern for the preservation of burials and memorials of Soviet soldiers in Korean People's Democratic Republic. "

Recall that in the territory of North Korea there are 11 mass and 345 separate graves in which 1375 Soviet troops are buried. According to the Russian embassy in Pyongyang, distributed on the eve of Victory Day, "in the battles for the liberation of Korea in 1945, more than 4.7 thousand Soviet soldiers died and died from wounds." At the same time, one of the main attractions of Pyongyang was the Liberation Monument - the Soviet military who died in the battles for the liberation of Korea from Japanese occupation in 1945.

What could the disappearance of Kim Jong-un be for the world?

However, Kim Jong-un did not appear at the awards ceremony held in Pyongyang on May 5 in Pyongyang's Palace of Congresses, during which Russian Ambassador to the DPRK Alexander Matagorda handed over the medal to North Korean Foreign Minister Lee Song Gwon. The official photos from the Mansudae Congress Palace featured the head of North Korean diplomacy and Ambassador Machagora standing opposite each other and dressed in medical masks. Although, according to official figures, in North Korea there is not a single case of coronavirus infection.

Kim Jong-un was not in Moscow five years ago, during the celebration of the 70th anniversary of the Victory: at that time, taking advantage of the invitation and coming to the celebrations was not allowed at home.

Nevertheless, in an interview with TASS, Alexander Matsegora once again expressed special gratitude to the North Korean leader, pointing out that "the leadership of our country simply could not fail to note the contribution of Comrade Kim Jong-un to this noble cause of preserving memory." "I was very pleased to meet with the DPRK Foreign Minister and passed this medal to Comrade Kim Jong-un through him," the Russian diplomat said. And he added: "The DPRK emphasizes that the Soviet Union played a decisive, decisive role in the victory in World War II. Today, by the way, the minister once again spoke about this, and this attitude just follows this attitude towards our monuments. "

Kim Jong-un has not appeared in public since the beginning of April, having been absent for the whole 20 days, in connection with which the leading world media were swept by a wave of publications about his alleged heart surgery , followed by suggestions of his possible death.

However, on May 2, alive and well, Kim Jong-un, as if nothing had happened, again appeared in front of television cameras, attending the opening ceremony of the Suncheon Chemical Fertilizer Plant. In the footage promulgated by Pyongyang from the scene, he looks cheerful and healthy, smiling and energetically gesturing during a conversation with his companions.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on May 08, 2020, 05:23:15 PM
That’s the Korea I saw.


That's the Korea they wanted you to see.

That is a convenient propagandist line that people who have never been like to tell everybody and anyone who will listen.

If you had the balls to visit, you might understand. You haven’t, so you won’t.

I know what I saw. It’s all spelled out in the topic, there’s video, photos, etc. I doubt they’re going to put on a theatre production involving thousands of people for somebody spending €1000. Use your brain.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on May 09, 2020, 12:26:02 AM
That’s the Korea I saw.


That's the Korea they wanted you to see.

That is a convenient propagandist line that people who have never been like to tell everybody and anyone who will listen.

If you had the balls to visit, you might understand. You haven’t, so you won’t.

I know what I saw. It’s all spelled out in the topic, there’s video, photos, etc. I doubt they’re going to put on a theatre production involving thousands of people for somebody spending €1000. Use your brain.

In Greece we say:  "On the door of a deaf person you can knock as hard as you like!"
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Danchik on May 09, 2020, 05:49:11 AM
For some reason I have never had a hankering to go to North Korea.

I don't believe much of what the MSM says, even though you can find some truth nestled in the nonsense there.

I have never wanted to go to South Korea either although I do consider them the prettiest of the Asians overall. Nor has China interested me much.

I am relatively close to these places and others such as Thailand and Vietnam, but my head seems to look to the West when I consider traveling abroad.

Maybe a thread about places we've been or want to go and reasons why might seem interesting?

I have heard nice things about Thailand, Vietnam, South Korea, Japan, etc., but usually end up in California for my winter vacation. There are a lot of nice places within reach (or short flight) from LA such as Mexico, Hawaii, Nevada, etc. should I want to venture out a bit.

Thailand and Vietnam would probably be my first choice should I decide to go East in the future. Maybe this winter. Any thoughts on places we've been or would like to go and people's experiences there?

This thread has changed my opinion some about North Korea.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on June 16, 2020, 03:06:25 AM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-53060620 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-53060620)

All is 'not sweetness and light' between the Korea's

"North Korea blows up joint liaison office with South in Kaesong"

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 16, 2020, 02:19:23 PM
I know about this, it has been smouldering for months.

Kim Jong-un has given more responsibility to his sister Kim Yo-jong in recent months. She has responsibility for much of the inter-relations.

Organisations in the south - some openly funded the US - have been flying drones and balloons full of western propaganda into the north. The north has repeatedly asked them to prevent it and simply leave them alone. Especially if they want to continue good north-south relations.

The south - as US puppets - did nothing. The balloons kept coming.

The industrial zone at Kaesong - a place I have been - was already pretty much closed. What they have done is made a dramatic example of one building to make their point and get media attention in the south at the ineptitude of the south government.

There is no *actual* real threat. It's mostly theatre. The north wants sanctions relief.

This statement from this RT article (https://www.rt.com/op-ed/492033-pyongyang-blow-up-liaison-office/) is quite accurate I think:

Quote from: RT
But the prospects for any major positive breakthrough on the peninsula are rather slim for the time being. The US is far too busy at home to have time to actively deal with the Korea situation and it would be a risky feat politically for Trump to attempt any kind of diplomacy with the North as of now.

The only way things could move in the right direction would be if the US had a sudden change of heart and was willing to finally allow the reduction or removal of certain sanctions currently in place against the North. This would be a major help to Pyongyang, given that it is currently suffering serious economic problems caused by the border closure with China over the coronavirus.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 16, 2020, 03:02:39 PM
Kim Jong-un has given more responsibility to his sister Kim Yo-jong in recent months. She has responsibility for much of the inter-relations.


Where's Kim Jong Un? He's an absent leader.


Organisations in the south - some openly funded the US - have been flying drones and balloons full of western propaganda into the north. The north has repeatedly asked them to prevent it and simply leave them alone. Especially if they want to continue good north-south relations.

The south - as US puppets - did nothing. The balloons kept coming.


When I was in the Army in the early 90's, soldiers I knew who were stationed in South Korea said North Korea would fly balloons over and drop propaganda leaflets and blast speakers all night with more propaganda so they couldn't sleep.

Interesting, still today, the North Koreans say only South Korea does those awful things. That's propaganda for you.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on June 16, 2020, 03:53:30 PM
Organisations in the south - some openly funded the US - have been flying drones and balloons full of western propaganda into the north. The north has repeatedly asked them to prevent it and simply leave them alone. Especially if they want to continue good north-south relations.

The south - as US puppets - did nothing. The balloons kept coming.


When I was in the Army in the early 90's, soldiers I knew who were stationed in South Korea said North Korea would fly balloons over and drop propaganda leaflets and blast speakers all night with more propaganda so they couldn't sleep.

Interesting, still today, the North Koreans say only South Korea does those awful things. That's propaganda for you.

A month or so ago I looked a Windguru.cz to see the mid and low altitude winds for the Korean Peninsula. While more an app for kite sailors it was clear the prevailing winds were not conducive for balloons flying from South Korea to North Korea.

With out doubt there will be days where perhaps this is feasible.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on June 16, 2020, 04:15:47 PM
Organisations in the south - some openly funded the US - have been flying drones and balloons full of western propaganda into the north. The north has repeatedly asked them to prevent it and simply leave them alone. Especially if they want to continue good north-south relations.

The south - as US puppets - did nothing. The balloons kept coming.


When I was in the Army in the early 90's, soldiers I knew who were stationed in South Korea said North Korea would fly balloons over and drop propaganda leaflets and blast speakers all night with more propaganda so they couldn't sleep.

Interesting, still today, the North Koreans say only South Korea does those awful things. That's propaganda for you.

A month or so ago I looked a Windguru.cz to see the mid and low altitude winds for the Korean Peninsula. While more an app for kite sailors it was clear the prevailing winds were not conducive for balloons flying from South Korea to North Korea.

With out doubt there will be days where perhaps this is feasible.


NK Commie propaganda fail!  :laugh: :laugh: tiphat
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 16, 2020, 04:31:46 PM
Kim Jong-un has given more responsibility to his sister Kim Yo-jong in recent months. She has responsibility for much of the inter-relations.


Where's Kim Jong Un? He's an absent leader

You are weeks out of date. Have you been too sick to get to a computer during your absence?

See this post (https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,26512.msg510295.html#msg510295) and this post (https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,26512.msg510328.html#msg510328).
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 16, 2020, 09:58:51 PM
Kim Jong-un has given more responsibility to his sister Kim Yo-jong in recent months. She has responsibility for much of the inter-relations.


Where's Kim Jong Un? He's an absent leader

You are weeks out of date. Have you been too sick to get to a computer during your absence?

See this post (https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,26512.msg510295.html#msg510295) and this post (https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,26512.msg510328.html#msg510328).

I've already addressed those posts. There are two murals behind Kim Jong Un at the fertilizer plant grand opening. Both murals look close but the photoshop was still bad enough to see there are differences. Even if Kim Jong Un actually showed up for a grand opening of a fertilizer plant once a month, he deserves ridicule. No world leader has gone into hiding as long as he does from time to time. Even Boris Johnson almost dead from the coronavirus kept working hard for the people of the UK. That's how a real leader behaves.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on June 17, 2020, 02:29:43 AM
Billy, I know that I am repeating myself, but you really do need to get your eyes checked. From what you keep telling us you could be a danger to those around you.

Your eyesight problems have, as you know, been an issue in at least one other thread.

I can tell you that getting your eyesight corrected will, quite literally, change the way you see the world.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on June 17, 2020, 09:00:41 AM
With all the problems we have in the USA and other western power no one cares how many building Kim blows up inside North Korea or who paid to build them. It appears that Covid-19 is causing sanctions to work much better than they did before.

EU to start to add tariffs on Chinese imports soon. China lost a WTO case for predatory trade practices against the EU. China now having on going trade war with the USA and tariffs. China most likely not spending much time thinking about North Korea's trade problems neither. I am not sure if the UK is going to be part of this on not because they were part of the EU when all of this happened.

The big question is why is Kim turning over more of the government to his sister? Maybe he is not all that well? Does he have a heart problem and needs to slow down? I surely do not know just asking.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 17, 2020, 10:26:27 AM
The big question is why is Kim turning over more of the government to his sister? Maybe he is not all that well? Does he have a heart problem and needs to slow down? I surely do not know just asking.

Unconfirmed rumours are that he has recently had one or more stents fitted so is taking it easier. Also he drinks and smokes a lot and is heavy. As his children aren't old enough to succeed him if something happens, it's time to train up the second in command so any future transition would be smooth. It wouldn't be usual to have a woman as president there, so if that protocol will in the future change, she has to have her legs well under the table and some hands on experience. If there was no firm successor, the party and/or the army would take control with unpredictable results.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 17, 2020, 11:11:55 AM
Billy, I know that I am repeating myself, but you really do need to get your eyes checked. From what you keep telling us you could be a danger to those around you.

Your eyesight problems have, as you know, been an issue in at least one other thread.

I can tell you that getting your eyesight corrected will, quite literally, change the way you see the world.

I gave you simple instructions even a child could follow. I'll repeat myself again for you. From a distance, the two railroad tracks look like straight lines. Blow them up. Use a magnifying glass if you have to. They are clearly different patterns. Even from a distance, you can see the color tone and shapes of objects the murals are clearly off but the people sitting in front of them aren't off.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 20, 2020, 09:33:42 PM

 In the past the North just did it. Now they announce they are going to send propaganda leaflets to South Korea. With the joint liaison office blown up, little sister making big moves and a lot of other noise going on, has it taken our attention off of Kim Jong Un being an absent leader?

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/north-korea-vows-to-send-anti-south-leaflets-amid-tensions/ar-BB15LRE3?ocid=spartanntp
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 21, 2020, 01:14:22 AM
This is simple tit for tat.

The 2018 agreement was broken by the south as they continually allowed US funded groups (let’s not forget that bit) to send leaflets into the north.

The north is responding with some of the same.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 21, 2020, 02:04:48 AM
US funded groups (let’s not forget that bit) to send leaflets into the north.


If the US wants to get hostile, there's better ways than dropping leaflets. Got any N Korean news of N Korea blaming US for the leaflets?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 21, 2020, 07:38:32 AM
US funded groups (let's not forget that bit) to send leaflets into the north.


If the US wants to get hostile, there's better ways than dropping leaflets. Got any N Korean news of N Korea blaming US for the leaflets?

Plenty to be found on western sources.

Must I lead you by the hand?

From the New York Post (http://www.nkfreedom.org/)

Quote
To help the people left behind, Park and other North Korean defectors are big supporters of the US-funded, Seoul-based Free North Korea Radio that began the year Park escaped and which broadcasts news of the outside world every day and night without fail into the Hermit Kingdom.

From Wiki (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_North_Korea_Radio)

Quote
Free North Korea Radio receives an annual grant from the U.S. National Endowment for Democracy.

https://flashdrivesforfreedom.org/

Quote
Human Rights Foundation
P.O. Box 35677
Los Angeles, CA 90035
USA

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balloon_propaganda_campaigns_in_Korea

Quote
Recent organizations involved with the balloon campaigns include North Korean defectors' organizations, South Korean evangelical Protestants and conservatives, various organizations of other Christian denominations and United States based organizations.[34] In the participating North Korean defectors' organizations, ex-military members are overrepresented. Women constitute up to 70 percent of North Korean defectors; however, it is mainly men from relatively elite or military background who lead the balloon campaigns.[8] The defectors' organizations are the most active ones; the two main organizations for flying leaflets to North Korea are Fighters for a Free North Korea and North Korean Christian Association.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fighters_for_a_Free_North_Korea

Quote
FFNK has partnered with the Human Rights Foundation on activities to get liberty-oriented materials across the border and into North Korea since 2013

Human Rights Foundation: HUMAN RIGHTS FOUNDATION 350 5TH AVENUE, NEW YORK, NY

All these groups that do the leaflets are linked together and mostly funded from the US.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on June 21, 2020, 08:45:19 AM
A group of defector living in south Korea wanted to derail peace talks and sent a bunch leaflets. The stupid north Koreans over reacted and the defectors dreams come true. Now they blow up building and continue to act stupid to everyone benefit except there own. It was explained to the north what happen but the stupid woman they put in charge  goes off the deep end and act like the spoil brat she really is. To those in South Korea who were trying to find common ground with the north this is a huge set back. To the enemies of the north in the south it has been a huge benefit  as all talks with the north have stopped. As far as the USA goes we do not ever do anything that works that well. Maybe someday we will get some smart enough to think of this stuff and get the timing right.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 21, 2020, 11:38:01 AM

All these groups that do the leaflets are linked together and mostly funded from the US.


Got any N Korean actual news of N Korea blaming US for the leaflets? If I give money to a bum to eat and he  later commits a crime, how is that my fault? N Korea blamed South Korea for not stopping the defectors. Here's an article in which we learn defectors were dropping leaflets since April. Why not take action months ago? N Korea taking action on it now helps divert attention away from the fact Kim Jong Un is still an absent leader.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/defectors-drop-leaflets-cash-north-21958799


 It's been months. Are we going to wait years before we criticize Kim Jong Un for failing to work for the people of N Korea? Producing more photoshopped events of fertilizer plant grand openings will get old. The announcement of Kim Jong Un writing letters to world leaders isn't enough to convince the world he's healthy or even alive. Have they announced he even spoke to a world leader since he gone missing? They can't because a World leader can verify if the conversation even took place.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 21, 2020, 12:54:13 PM

All these groups that do the leaflets are linked together and mostly funded from the US.


Got any N Korean actual news of N Korea blaming US for the leaflets?

This is well documented. Its one reason why they've broken off relations again because the south is guided - as a puppet - by the US. Why they refused a "peace envoy" from Seoul. But I'm not your researcher, you can find it for yourself. Google is your friend.

It's been months. Are we going to wait years before we criticize Kim Jong Un for failing to work for the people of N Korea? Producing more photoshopped events of fertilizer plant grand openings will get old. The announcement of Kim Jong Un writing letters to world leaders isn't enough to convince the world he's healthy or even alive. Have they announced he even spoke to a world leader since he gone missing? They can't because a World leader can verify if the conversation even took place.

As posts passim, we are back to this obsession you have that you believe he must parade himself about for your satisfaction. You are concerned with his absence still. In fact, he doesn't appear to be absent. I already showed you a video of him doing something in recent weeks. Is that fake too?  (:)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 21, 2020, 02:43:04 PM
Google is your friend.


Google hasn't said anything pertaining to N Korea blaming the US for the balloons and leaflets being dropped in their country. Just wondering where you came up with that idea.


You are concerned with his absence still.


People should worry more about a leaders absence over balloons and leaflets. Has any world leader actually talked to the guy in the last two months or is writing letters Kim Jong Un's preferred method of communicating now? North Korea's propaganda machine obsession in trying to prove Kim Jong Un is alive with periodic announcements he did something is amusing and worth having a good laugh over. What was their excuse again on why attending a fertilizer factory grand opening was more important than attending the festivities honoring his father and grandfather?

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 21, 2020, 04:22:15 PM
Google is your friend.


Google hasn't said anything pertaining to N Korea blaming the US for the balloons and leaflets being dropped in their country. Just wondering where you came up with that idea.

I didn’t write that NK specifically blamed the US, but of course they do as the US - or entities based there - are behind most of the leaflet drops, balloons, USBs, drones, etc. “Defectors“ don’t spontaneously appear in the south with a lot of funds to create newspapers and media organisations, you know? There’s a whole network set up to “support” the so-called defectors. Why so many appear on TV, start newspapers, radio stations or get publishing deals. Use your brain.

Why do you feel you need to particularly hear this opinion from the north when this public secret is even on Wikipedia? Are you asking that I indulge you and get you a quote from contacts that you won’t find in the media? I could, but I wouldn’t for a random forum conversation. I already got a clarification for a hotel Wi-Fi connection question for you previously.

You can find several reliable information feeds on Twitter if you look. I read the details you seek today but I’m not going to dredge through hundreds of history pages to find it for you.

There is even an Instagram feed where NK news is translated and posted. Look here: https://www.instagram.com/p/CBNgCy4j1aW/?igshid=1vm33w0pcqgma

You can find this info yourself, use a VPN and Yandex or Duck Duck Go if Google is throttling results where you live.

North Korea's propaganda machine obsession in trying to prove Kim Jong Un is alive

Are you alleging he is dead?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 21, 2020, 06:57:18 PM
There is even an Instagram feed where NK news is translated and posted. Look here: https://www.instagram.com/p/CBNgCy4j1aW/?igshid=1vm33w0pcqgma


The NK news on Instagram says they're pissed with S Korea, not US. They said they won't sit down with S Korea for talks. They did not say they will not sit down with the US.


Are you alleging he is dead?


All we know is that he's a missing leader and he's been missing for 2 months. If we're lucky, next week they'll put out a video showing Kim Jong Un attending the grand opening of a rice bowl factory.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 22, 2020, 12:30:39 AM
They did not say they will not sit down with the US.

You’re getting confused again. Meetings with the US over funding of protest groups hasn’t been mentioned in this discussion. That elements in the US are the hands that rock the cradle certainly gets mentioned.

Are you alleging he is dead?


All we know is that he's a missing leader and he's been missing for 2 months. If we're lucky, next week they'll put out a video showing Kim Jong Un attending the grand opening of a rice bowl factory.

We don’t “know” he is missing at all. Again, this is your fantasy because he won’t parade about for the international media as often as you’d like.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 22, 2020, 01:41:35 AM
We don’t “know” he is missing at all. Again, this is your fantasy because he won’t parade about for the international media as often as you’d like.


If we don't see somebody for awhile, they are missing. When Trump and Boris are seen everyday, it's not done because they are parading themselves for international media, it's about showing up for work for their people.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on June 22, 2020, 03:23:40 AM
We don’t “know” he is missing at all. Again, this is your fantasy because he won’t parade about for the international media as often as you’d like.


If we don't see somebody for awhile, they are missing. When Trump and Boris are seen everyday, it's not done because they are parading themselves for international media, it's about showing up for work for their people.

The role and requirements of the UK Prime Minister and the US President are very different from that of the Supreme Leader of the DPRK. You know that Billy. He’s been pretty quiet but it appears that your prejudice can’t stop you from being a bit silly here.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 22, 2020, 07:16:37 AM
The role and requirements of the UK Prime Minister and the US President are very different from that of the Supreme Leader of the DPRK.


He's supposed to be running a friggin country! What is the role of the Supreme Leader then? Hide and let his sister do it? There is no leader on earth that disappears for as long as he does, then have the ministry of propaganda fake a fertilizer plant  grand opening appearance.


it appears that your prejudice can’t stop you from being a bit silly here.


I'm not the one that is giving him a pass from doing his duties. That's silly.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on June 22, 2020, 08:00:21 AM
The role and requirements of the UK Prime Minister and the US President are very different from that of the Supreme Leader of the DPRK.


He's supposed to be running a friggin country! What is the role of the Supreme Leader then? Hide and let his sister do it? There is no leader on earth that disappears for as long as he does, then have the ministry of propaganda fake a fertilizer plant  grand opening appearance.


it appears that your prejudice can’t stop you from being a bit silly here.


I'm not the one that is giving him a pass from doing his duties. That's silly.

He’s a dictator Billy and one with a mythical legend about his grandfathers conception! I think even you can grasp the concept of him not being held accountable by an electorate.

Comparing his duties with that of an elected official pulling a state wage would be Mobyesk.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on June 22, 2020, 08:13:26 AM
There seems for as long as there have been two Koreas a wonderful quirky dysfunctionality in the Northern Kingdom. Shakespeare said something to the effect, 'though this is/was madness, there is method to it.' I suspect we are seeing a new form of this manifesting itself.

And to summarize my thinking from Gone With the Wind, 'Frankly my dear I don't give a damn.'

It is Monday and not enough coffee to find the exact words.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 22, 2020, 01:22:37 PM
There is no leader on earth that disappears for as long as he does, then have the ministry of propaganda fake a fertilizer plant  grand opening appearance.

Olga Mouse reported from Russian news on this thread recently he gave oral congratulations to Xi Ping on his handling of the virus. And the fertiliser plant you think was photoshopped, you can read back and see I posted VIDEO too.

The dude is chilling in Wonsan away from the virus and possibly following a small procedure - as any of us would do. It's all documented on the thread if you go back and read.

You made the whole "missing" narrative up.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 22, 2020, 01:59:05 PM
The fact that Kim Jong-un, who reappeared in public after a three-week absence, sent an "oral personal message" to President Xi Jinping of the PRC, was announced today by the North Korean agency TsTAK.

Without specifying why such an unusual form was chosen for the message and how it was sent to Beijing, the CCTC abundantly quotes Kim Jong-un, expressing admiration for the PRC and its leader.


Manny, when was the last time Kim Jong Un spoke on the phone to a world leader? Oral messages sent by email or through mail on cassette tape don't count.

North Korea always announces when Kim Jong Un is communicating with another world leader. No phone call announcements made for awhile.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 22, 2020, 05:07:22 PM
Manny, when was the last time Kim Jong Un spoke on the phone to a world leader?

What is this obsession you’ve developed? Amazingly, KJU doesn’t keep me informed of his phone conversations. He doesn’t tend to alert the western media either. You can subscribe to Rodong Sinmun instead of asking me. I am not a cultural attaché, nor am I your researcher.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 22, 2020, 06:58:28 PM
What is this obsession you’ve developed?


People here and propaganda there are obsessed with trying to prove Kim Jong Un is alive. Can we just agree nobody knows and we ALL are speculating what happened to Kim Jong UN?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on June 22, 2020, 07:56:37 PM
Who even cares if Kim Jon is a live or dead. If he is gone then his sister will run the show not likely much will change in the short term. She likely to murder more north Koreans than Kim just to prove she has balls and is not a weak woman.  Sort if the mind set Kim Jon had when he took office at a young age.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 22, 2020, 11:39:39 PM
Kim Yo-jong accuses South Korea of being a US ‘flunky’ amid tense cross border relations

KIM YO-JONG has accused South Korea of being a US "flunky" as tensions between the two Koreas remain high following the North's decision to blow up a joint liaison office.

Seoul’s unification minister Kim Yeon-chul tendered his resignation on Wednesday, saying he bears responsibility for the breakdown in relations. Pyongyang state media accused South Korea of "systemically breaching and destroying" recent bilateral agreements. As per the BBC, state media called the South Korean defence ministry a "feared mongrel dog" that was "bragging and bluffing, rattling the dialogue partner and stoking [a] confrontational atmosphere".

Ms Kim said: "The reason the north-south agreements which were so wonderful did not see even a single step of implementation was due to the noose of the pro-US flunkeyism into which he [South Korean President Moon Jae-in] put his neck.

"Even before the ink on the north-south agreement got dry, he accepted the 'South Korea-US working group' under the coercion of his master."

https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1298017/North-Korea-news-South-Korea-minister-resigns-liaison-office-blown-up-Kim-Yo-jong



Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 23, 2020, 01:00:13 AM

North Korea is bringing back the loudspeakers. They will disrupt a lot of people's sleep with soft relaxing continuous propaganda.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/north-korea-seen-reinstalling-border-loudspeakers-satellite-pictures-show-liaison-office-standing-but-damaged/ar-BB15QQm8?ocid=spartanntp
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on June 23, 2020, 03:23:49 AM
Who even cares if Kim Jon is a live or dead. If he is gone then his sister will run the show not likely much will change in the short term. She likely to murder more north Koreans than Kim just to prove she has balls and is not a weak woman.  Sort if the mind set Kim Jon had when he took office at a young age.

A bit like each new US President who signs off another illegal airstrike or war, killing innocent civilians to get the ball rolling. It's just easier for you guys to accept when it comes from N Korea.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on June 23, 2020, 03:25:29 AM
What is this obsession you’ve developed?


People here and propaganda there are obsessed with trying to prove Kim Jong Un is alive. Can we just agree nobody knows and we ALL are speculating what happened to Kim Jong UN?

I expect he's alive and you lot need to prove he's dead. Not the other way around. The obsession you guys have is unhealthy.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 23, 2020, 09:15:20 AM
What is this obsession you’ve developed?


People here and propaganda there are obsessed with trying to prove Kim Jong Un is alive. Can we just agree nobody knows and we ALL are speculating what happened to Kim Jong UN?

I expect he's alive and you lot need to prove he's dead. Not the other way around. The obsession you guys have is unhealthy.

I never said he's dead. It's those who claim he's alive that are obsessed with trying to prove it. He's missing and no fertilizer factory photoshopped photos are going to convince me otherwise. For now, we need to get used to his sister calling the shots.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 23, 2020, 12:47:06 PM
I never said he's dead. It's those who claim he's alive that are obsessed with trying to prove it. He's missing and no fertilizer factory photoshopped photos are going to convince me otherwise. For now, we need to get used to his sister calling the shots.

I'll say it again: There was a video. You can find it here (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8279299/Kim-Jong-makes-public-appearance-20-days-fertiliser-plant.html#v-703896288604699574). Is that fake too?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 23, 2020, 01:53:07 PM
I never said he's dead. It's those who claim he's alive that are obsessed with trying to prove it. He's missing and no fertilizer factory photoshopped photos are going to convince me otherwise. For now, we need to get used to his sister calling the shots.

I'll say it again: There was a video. You can find it here (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8279299/Kim-Jong-makes-public-appearance-20-days-fertiliser-plant.html#v-703896288604699574). Is that fake too?


A video can be altered. Kim Jong Un's uncle has been erased from all historical videos and photos to rewrite history. The mural mural behind Kim in the video doesn't match the one in one of the photos.  Why the obsession to prove he's alive? The only facts we have is that he's missing and his sister is calling all the shots.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 23, 2020, 04:41:56 PM
So next time he appears, will you be eating crow or will you just claim every photo and video is altered?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 23, 2020, 09:25:44 PM
So next time he appears, will you be eating crow or will you just claim every photo and video is altered?

He's missing right now. If he shows up tomorrow, that doesn't make me wrong. Let Trump go missing for two months. You don't think the world would be laughing about it?

Did you guys see the massive explosion of the liaison offices? It was so powerful it did a lot of collateral damage to other buildings. Probably blew out the eardrums of those living in those buildings.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on June 23, 2020, 11:44:37 PM

He's missing right now. If he shows up tomorrow, that doesn't make me wrong. Let Trump go missing for two months. You don't think the world would be laughing about it?

Did you guys see the massive explosion of the liaison offices? It was so powerful it did a lot of collateral damage to other buildings. Probably blew out the eardrums of those living in those buildings.


Yea she is stupid and over reacting. It is a sure sign any treaty with her is a waste of time. With the virus and all the stuff going on with China there was no way anything was going to happen until after the elections anyway. She just making sure it does not happen even then. In this video she threaten war on the south which also proves she can not be trusted to be in any form of a treaty. She gets angry and acts stupid just what Kim Jon did when he first came to power. The real problem is the virus is making the sanctions work better. Her action with the south is further alienating north Korea further which is helping US policy.

She trying to be a hero so she can stay in power when Kim jon is gone. It is likely Kim Jon has some type of health problem where he is going for weeks at a time then returns for a short while then gone again. He has done this for years but he is doing this more frequently to where it is rare he is there.

North Korea thought that when they got nuclear weapons everyone would come running every time they snapped their fingers but it is not working. For the most part no one cares what is happening in North Korea or how long the sanctions have to stay in place. Yea they could fire one of those weapons but no people would be left alive in all of north Korea if they do. So the weapons are pretty much useless.

There was a time when the government of South Korea would be acceptable to the north about having a peace treaty that would lead to renunciation. But North Korea over played their hand and the president South Korea no longer has the support to be able to do anything like that. I know Kim Jon was educated in the west but it is like he does not understand how governments work in the west. It is like he gets believing his own propaganda and thinking the USA controls everything and elections in South Korea do not matter.  He is very wrong.

When his sister talks about punishing South Korea it is as if she thinks that is going to make South Korean voters vote in people that will be friendly to her. She really does not get it.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on June 24, 2020, 03:09:37 AM
So next time he appears, will you be eating crow or will you just claim every photo and video is altered?

He's missing right now. If he shows up tomorrow, that doesn't make me wrong. Let Trump go missing for two months.

Billy you're better than this. We've already discussed why Kim's position and responsibility, is different from a democratically elected paid official in the West. Maybe he's just hiding away from cover-19 in a retreat with some female company, recovering from a procedure?

You're obsessed and I'm not sure what it is you really want from this thread?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on June 24, 2020, 03:22:33 AM
Perhaps it's BillyB's (rightful) sense of frustration at the usual suspects USA'ian phobia?

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 24, 2020, 08:32:52 AM
Maybe he's just hiding away from cover-19 in a retreat with some female company, recovering from a procedure?


You're speculating. When I say Kim is missing, I'm not speculating. It's the truth and instead of people embracing truth, there's a lot of resistance and excuses. Why? Truth hurts? Anyway NK reports zero deaths from the virus so don't know why he would even be hiding from Covid-19 unless he knows the truth about it but don't want to tell his people.


Got another video of the building that got collateral damage. At the 45-47 second mark, the building's exterior walls fall off easily. They are not concrete but made of studs, metal or wood, and flimsy wall material. The inside of the building floors consist of columns. There are no walls and it's empty inside. Probably one of those fake buildings they build that nobody occupies.



Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on June 24, 2020, 09:02:28 AM
Quite Ironic that the CCP lab hybridized HIV- Coronavirus bioweapon did more damage to TopJobs UK funded slave labor camps than any US retaliation .

One thing you Imperial USA haters need to be critically aware of the moment that fat demonic deviant Maoist phocker or his Psycho Sister comes close to launching nukes at the USA their entire slave labor camps country will be vaporized... and if the CCP and Vladisfromvostoks want to join in the USA has been prepared for a nuclear winter since the 1950s Cold War with Stalin's Supreme Soviet Union.

We have so many brainwashed BLM Antifas CCP socialst Marxist wierdos that a nuclear winter likely to save us from a CCP instigated Civil War in the USA so bring it on MoFos.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 24, 2020, 09:43:49 AM
Yea she is stupid and over reacting. It is a sure sign any treaty with her is a waste of time.

This is wrong.

In the west, it is common to start out assuming the north is in the wrong and anything they do is a first provocation. This is often wrong as well. Westerners also look at anything that happens through our own eyes without the benefit of their methodology, worldview and culture.

Leaflet propaganda (including balloons and similar) is something that both sides did for decades. Several years ago, both Koreas came to an agreement that they would both stop, and they did. But because the south blamed other groups (groups pretending to be independent, but usually funded by the US as I demonstrated already), they had to agree to prevent all those groups from launching from their soil too. For a while, they were successful and all was well.

Then the balloons from the south started again. The north protested, and the south prevented some launches. But they didn't really try very hard and many launches went ahead, one from an island the groups had to take a lot of stuff out to. The south did not prevent it. The north believes this is because the south is a US client/puppet state, and the propaganda serves US interests, and they're probably right.

So the balloons, drones and leaflets kept coming and the north warned the south this would sour relations, and provoke a reaction unless they stopped it. The balloons, drones and leaflets kept coming, so KYJ warned the south that she would withdraw from the cooperation they enjoy at Kaesong near the DMZ. There was an industrial park that has mostly been mothballed already. The building that was blown up was on the north's side, so their own building, and it was simply symbolic. Maybe it was falling down anyway and they were going to replace or demolish it - we dont know. What we do know is they destroyed their own building on their own side of the border in such a way to attract attention and get publicity.

Perhaps they naively hoped the world media would report on the south's breach of contract, but of course our fake news media reports the north is at it again provoking the south. Similarly, the speakers, its symbolic. Nobody really lives within earshot of them but a few farmers. It's all theatre.

The south apologised (not many reported that), and offered to send two peace envoys to Pyongyang. KYJ refused as she correctly noted, if the US is the hand that rocks the cradle, what use is there talking to the puppets? But the organ grinder Trump never sought peace and anything productive with NK, he only wanted PR. Now Trump is tied up with BLM and virus stuff, NK isnt on his radar.

The culture dictates one makes a huge fuss and later is seen to be placated, and then talks will happen. It's all theatre and about saving face. Meanwhile, the north gives the south a taste of its own medicine with a few million leaflets and balloons full of litter and old cigarette ends; again symbolic. Send some soldiers to the border to look menacing. Following which, face will be restored, the south will apologise again, KYJ will be seen to have pulled off a victory, and the balloons will stop.

Throughout all, western media will report every movement of the north as provocation and people like Billy will make more stuff up.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 24, 2020, 09:48:57 AM
Maybe he's just hiding away from cover-19 in a retreat with some female company, recovering from a procedure?

Those ladies are called Kippumjo, in English Joy Division. Where the music group got its name I believe.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on June 24, 2020, 10:23:29 AM
Anyway NK reports zero deaths from the virus so don't know why he would even be hiding from Covid-19 unless he knows the truth about it but don't want to tell his people.

I knew you'd say that. I even wrote that in my original post before edit, how predictable.  :chuckle:

You seem to think I'm defending Kim here, I'm not. I think we all know that covid-19 will have reached N Korea but with the DPRK being run as it currently is, we'd expect the response they've given. That doesn't stop the leader from hiding away at some retreat in the meantime. Perhaps he's carrying an illness, had surgery or been advised by doctors that his unhealthy lifestyle puts him in the risk zone? Maybe he's just stroking his cat watching the US disintegrate as a society without him firing a rocket?

The thing is we won't know and he doesn't need to tell you. You on the other hand are still obsessing over it and you cant let it go. You're not a stupid bloke but you're pretending to play dumb in this very discussion, to try and make your point. Yes he's not made many public moves lately but you're forgetting a dictator can do whatever he wants......even if some American bloke on the internet says its wrong.  ;D

This has gone back and forth with you and Manny for pages and I've chipped in with my bit. I just expected you to be more *open minded.

* Being open minded doesn't make you a supporter of Kim or N Korea but it can stop you from being CNN fed hillbilly.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on June 24, 2020, 10:26:59 AM

In the west, it is common to start out assuming the north is in the wrong and anything they do is a first provocation. This is often wrong as well. Westerners also look at anything that happens through our own eyes without the benefit of their methodology, worldview and culture.

Leaflet propaganda (including balloons and similar) is something that both sides did for decades.

The irony here is that the same guys filling their boots with this stuff on N Korea, will then in the same breath, call out the democrats or the own liberal media for doing the same against their beloved Donald Trump.

I'm not sure if that makes said person a hypocrite or stupid.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on June 24, 2020, 10:35:57 AM
Quite Ironic that the CCP lab hybridized HIV- Coronavirus bioweapon

Do some folk still not realise the virus was around much earlier than first thought and almost certainly not created by man.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on June 24, 2020, 10:41:01 AM
I never said he's dead. It's those who claim he's alive that are obsessed with trying to prove it. He's missing and no fertilizer factory photoshopped photos are going to convince me otherwise. For now, we need to get used to his sister calling the shots.

I'll say it again: There was a video. You can find it here (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8279299/Kim-Jong-makes-public-appearance-20-days-fertiliser-plant.html#v-703896288604699574). Is that fake too?

I do video editing. A real top notch CG person could make the whole thing fake but someone like me could not do that. What this looks like is the video is lit in a away that would make easy to replace the background. The way the edges around Kim Jon look, it very well may be replaced back ground. Like when you watch the weather girl on TV the background is replaced as the background is just a green wall.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 24, 2020, 01:10:05 PM
You on the other hand are still obsessing over it and you cant let it go.


Kim Jong Un is missing
Kim Jong Un is missing
Kim Jong Un is missing

Yet, some respond with excuses obsessed with protecting Kim Jong Un from embarrassment of his own doing. You can't let it go and you're so obsessed with what I said you're even imagining things claiming I said Kim Jong Un was dead. If you respond with an excuse for his behavior or deny he's missing, I'm going to repeat the fact Kim Jong Un is missing. It's going to sound like a broken record.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on June 24, 2020, 03:23:25 PM
You on the other hand are still obsessing over it and you cant let it go.


Kim Jong Un is missing
Kim Jong Un is missing
Kim Jong Un is missing

Yet, some respond with excuses obsessed with protecting Kim Jong Un from embarrassment of his own doing. You can't let it go and you're so obsessed with what I said you're even imagining things claiming I said Kim Jong Un was dead. If you respond with an excuse for his behavior or deny he's missing, I'm going to repeat the fact Kim Jong Un is missing. It's going to sound like a broken record.

What I posted was neither excuses or protection. It’s simply reasoning but let’s leave it at that. I’ll move on with my day unperturbed whilst you accuse me of shielding a bloke I couldn’t give a toss about.

Get shouting over the internet, someone else might play along with you.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on June 24, 2020, 03:28:57 PM

Kim Jong Un is missing
Kim Jong Un is missing
Kim Jong Un is missing

If you respond with an excuse for his behavior or deny he's missing, I'm going to repeat the fact Kim Jong Un is missing. It's going to sound like a broken record.

Classic. I just googled Kim Jong Un and looked what popped up from 3 hours ago.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-53159577

From the BBC

But at a meeting chaired by leader Kim Jong-un, state media said the decision was taken to suspend military action.

Is that enough for you Billy or do you need him to FaceTime you so you can verify?

You’re obsessed.  :chuckle:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 24, 2020, 04:56:17 PM
But at a meeting chaired by leader Kim Jong-un, STATE MEDIA said the decision was taken to suspend military action.


State media said it happened so it must be true! When Kim Jong Un meets or has a phone call with another World leader, I'll believe, okay?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on June 25, 2020, 01:25:01 AM
But at a meeting chaired by leader Kim Jong-un, STATE MEDIA said the decision was taken to suspend military action.


State media said it happened so it must be true! When Kim Jong Un meets or has a phone call with another World leader, I'll believe, okay?

It looks like the BBC are happy enough with it, they maybe even watched the state footage? I’d expect the BBC to mention his absence in the article if there was even a hint of a problem but not once did it crop up. Not even a one liner suggesting he wasn’t actually there and hasn’t been seen in months.

So it’s just you grumbling on and on and on.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on June 25, 2020, 05:46:06 AM
Billykins desperate to be right is willing to ignore everything in order to keep the idea of being right in his head.

The smell of cognitive dissonance must be so strong in his house that the local thought police have placed a demolition order on the property.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on June 25, 2020, 10:55:02 AM

It looks like the BBC are happy enough with it, they maybe even watched the state footage?


More speculation. If there is footage provided by N Korea, the BBC should be sharing it.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on June 25, 2020, 12:49:01 PM

It looks like the BBC are happy enough with it, they maybe even watched the state footage?


More speculation. If there is footage provided by N Korea, the BBC should be sharing it.

 :'(
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on June 27, 2020, 03:17:00 AM
My take:

The Fat Controller is ill..

 Sis' has been trying to build up her creds to take over .. Fat Controller ( or his associates ) are now trying to reign in Sis'

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-53061613 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-53061613)

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on June 28, 2020, 01:18:47 AM
There is no “trying to reign in” going on. I explained above what’s going on.

The BBC article, apart from using silly evocative language like “causing alarm around the world”, which I’d suggest is untrue, quotes three “experts”. The first, someone called “Ankit Panda”, is mostly wrong and slightly off base throughout.

The other two, Prof. George Mason and Van Jackson get it and are on the money.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 23, 2020, 04:33:28 PM
You can't even tell me of one positive thing coming out of NK.

Rejection of US hegemony.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on July 23, 2020, 06:38:21 PM
You can't even tell me of one positive thing coming out of NK.

Rejection of US hegemony.

If that is the best thing they got going for them, glad it improves their lives.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 23, 2020, 11:17:10 PM
You can't even tell me of one positive thing coming out of NK.

Rejection of US hegemony.

If that is the best thing they got going for them, glad it improves their lives.

You didn’t say the best, you said one.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on July 24, 2020, 05:24:41 AM
You can't even tell me of one positive thing coming out of NK.

Rejection of US hegemony.

They better get used to it as it appears to be in the rise.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on July 24, 2020, 09:20:27 AM
Texan, try doing the maths.
Don't believe everything you are told - yes, that's what you've been trained to do but you can learn for yourself. You can think. You can analyse. These are tools given to every human, in greater or lesser measure.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on July 24, 2020, 10:12:16 AM
Texan, try doing the maths.
Don't believe everything you are told - yes, that's what you've been trained to do but you can learn for yourself. You can think. You can analyse. These are tools given to every human, in greater or lesser measure.

Closing gates and bolted horsage springs to mind.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on July 24, 2020, 01:13:02 PM
Closing gates and bolted horsage springs to mind.

Sad to say you are probably right.
Cognitive dissonance is very stressful. The best way to reduce it is to be well informed and to analyse for oneself what one learns.

It's got to be very disconcerting to have to keep updating one's understanding (or beliefs for the less well informed) as one is presented with new programing. 1984 is a great read for many reasons, insight into language and how it is used for programing, insight into politics. But one aspect not looked at so often: the stress upon a populace forced to reinvent their worldview on a continuous basis.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 26, 2020, 09:54:11 PM
Oh no Billy, KJU still not missing:  DPRK leader confers pistols to officers on armistice anniversary (https://news.cgtn.com/news/2020-07-27/DPRK-leader-confers-pistols-to-officers-on-armistice-anniversary-SsBrfbm6UU/share_amp.html)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on July 27, 2020, 09:12:07 PM
You were bubbling your guts out for pages, whinging that he was missing and maybe dead.


You're repeating yourself like a broken record instead of looking for a quote you'll never find. I never said he's dead.



And whilst we’re discussing comprehension and stupidity, can you please link me to where I stated or gave the impression that I believed N Korea to be a covid free sanctuary? You can’t because I didn’t but your prejudices and propaganda identify me as a sympathiser, in your mind.



You're the one that supplied the article. Are you telling me you don't believe NK to be covid free, that's a lie, but you believe the other stuff in that article? You have the ability to know what is propaganda and what is truth?


Also the article came from the BBC, they’re not North Korean BTW.  :'(


Do you think the BBC reported the events because they were actually there or do you think state media news agency KCNA the BBC gave credit to reported it?


Oh no Billy, KJU still not missing:  DPRK leader confers pistols to officers on armistice anniversary (https://news.cgtn.com/news/2020-07-27/DPRK-leader-confers-pistols-to-officers-on-armistice-anniversary-SsBrfbm6UU/share_amp.html)

Let me know when he actually speaks or meets with another world leader. Passing out pistols and celebrating fertilizer factory grand openings doesn't give me a hard on.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 28, 2020, 10:50:07 AM
Oh no Billy, KJU still not missing:  DPRK leader confers pistols to officers on armistice anniversary (https://news.cgtn.com/news/2020-07-27/DPRK-leader-confers-pistols-to-officers-on-armistice-anniversary-SsBrfbm6UU/share_amp.html)

Let me know when he actually speaks or meets with another world leader. Passing out pistols and celebrating fertilizer factory grand openings doesn't give me a hard on.

Admitting he is no longer "missing" would suffice. I wasn't aware I'd have to supply sexually gratifying material for you too.  :scared0005:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: AvHdB on July 28, 2020, 08:33:29 PM
The UN human rights body released a scathing report against North Korea Tuesday, accusing the nation of torture and sexual violations against women who were forcibly repatriated after seeking to flee the country to find work, usually in neighboring China.

The UN office interviewed more than 100 North Korean female escapees who were detained by North Korean officials between 2009 and 2019.  The women spoke to the UN in South Korea after fleeing the country following their detention.

The former detainees described unsanitary conditions in prisons, malnourishment, as well as forced abortions and rape by guards at prisons and detention centers.

"There were two pregnant women, three months and five months pregnant, who were kicked very badly so that they would have lost their baby by the time they left the facility," said one of the women. Detainees were treated worse if they visited a church while abroad, as another witness noted.

"If one is found to have gone to a South Korean church while staying in China, they are dead. I therefore tried hard not to reveal my life in China. I was beaten up as a result. I was beaten to a level that my rib was broken. I still feel the pain."

Women who were brought back to the country faced extreme punishment for leaving the nation, including torture and forced abortion. The UN has repeatedly sanctioned the country for human rights abuses.
   
The UN human rights body released a scathing report against North Korea Tuesday, accusing the nation of torture and sexual violations against women who were forcibly repatriated after seeking to flee the country to find work, usually in neighboring China.

The UN office interviewed more than 100 North Korean female escapees who were detained by North Korean officials between 2009 and 2019.  The women spoke to the UN in South Korea after fleeing the country following their detention. The former detainees described unsanitary conditions in prisons, malnourishment, as well as forced abortions and rape by guards at prisons and detention centers.

"There were two pregnant women, three months and five months pregnant, who were kicked very badly so that they would have lost their baby by the time they left the facility," said one of the women. Detainees were treated worse if they visited a church while abroad, as another witness noted. "If one is found to have gone to a South Korean church while staying in China, they are dead. I therefore tried hard not to reveal my life in China. I was beaten up as a result. I was beaten to a level that my rib was broken. I still feel the pain."

UN experts High Commissioner Michelle Bachelet said "it is heartbreaking to read these stories of women who fled their country looking to make ends meet, but who end up getting punished," in a statement accompanying the report. "These women have a right to justice, truth and reparation," she added. Daniel Collinge, a UN human rights officer who co-authored the report entitled "I Still Feel the Pain," said the project was aimed to pressure North Korea to improve its situation while demanding other countries to not deport defectors.

The UN has accused North Korea several times of "systematic, widespread and gross" human rights violations from extrajudicial killings to running prison camps. The nation has been hit by sanctions over human rights abuses and threatening to use its nuclear program against other nations.

North Korea did not immediately respond to the report.

The above is from an UN report regarding North Korea. It certainly does not depict the regime of North Korea as an open and tolerant society, capable of being a mature member of world balance.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on July 28, 2020, 11:24:43 PM
The term "fleeing to find work" doesn't ring true. You can't just leave of your own volition to find work in China (many people do work legitimately in China though). If you are going to go to "find work", first that implies you can come back without issue (untrue unless you're going with permission), and it ignores the fact that as a Communist country, there is 100% employment.

So they are referencing defectors who were caught. And that a North Korean prison might not be nice isn't a great surprise.

So they were caught defecting, caught and jailed, then defected successfully a second time, and 10 a year of them just happened to end up meeting UN interviewers? How fortuitous!

And the source is the UN. 22% funded by the US and headquartered in New York.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on August 13, 2020, 11:57:12 AM
I thought this a good article. Some elements of this may resonate with Billy.  ;D

==========

Why the Western media keeps getting North Korea wrong

Western media's repeated blunders in reporting on North Korea show its continuing lack of understanding and expertise.

After 20 days of absence, proof of life for North Korea's Kim Jong Un finally came on May 2. North Korean state media released images of the leader touring a fertiliser factory. Contrary to mounting speculation by much of the international media and many so-called North Korea watchers, Kim was clearly not on his deathbed.

Western journalists are not always adept at covering this reclusive country, but the latest fiasco surrounding Kim's supposedly imminent demise proved just how eager they are to accept unconfirmed rumours as objective news and how poorly they judge information about North Korea.

It all started on April 20, when the North Korean-defector-run news site Daily NK published a story that Kim had undergone heart surgery. Initially citing multiple sources, the site claimed that the North Korean leader "suffered from inflammation of blood vessels involving the heart ... but his condition worsened".

Daily NK often relies on anonymous informers in the North to run critical articles about the regime, and its track record on accuracy is spotty at best. In this instance, the English version of the article was later edited to say "a cardiovascular procedure" instead of "a heart surgery", and the editor ran a correction that there were no multiple sources, but only one.

Within hours, CNN put forward its own single-source piece, with the sensationalist headline, "US source: North Korean leader in grave danger after surgery." MSNBC anchor Katy Tur tweeted to her more than 700,000 followers: "North Korean leader Kim Jong Un is brain dead, according to two US officials." She called it a "CNN scoop" confirmed by NBC News.

CNN later revised its headline to "US monitoring intelligence that North Korean leader is in grave danger after surgery" and Tur apparently deleted her tweet, both conveying that the intel was less than credible. But the cat was already out of the bag. For the next 11 days all manner of news outlets and sites worldwide would join the game of guessing "Is Kim Jong Un really dead?" and "Who will be the next ruler of North Korea?"

So great was the noise generated by Western media that even the normally more reserved South Koreans became rattled, wondering if they had missed out on something, even though the country's National Security Council maintained that "there are at present no unusual developments within North Korea". At times "Kim Jong Un death" trumped even coronavirus in search rankings on major portal websites.

To be fair, the North Korean state contributed to the drama when Kim did not publicly pay respect to his grandfather Kim Il Sung on his April 15 birth anniversary for an unspecified reason. But in hindsight, there was not even a shred of concrete proof that Kim Jong Un's health and the succession question merited serious discussion.

This is hardly the first major Western media fail over North Korea. In November 2018, the august New York Times ran a front-page article titled, "In North Korea, Missile Bases Suggest a Great Deception." Written by two reporters including Pulitzer-winning correspondent David E Sanger, it cited satellite imagery and a report by the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS) to argue that North Korea was continuing to secretly develop missiles in violation of the June 2018 Singapore agreement between Kim and US President Donald Trump.

But as longtime Korea analyst Tim Shorrock wrote in his great takedown of the piece, the prominently embedded satellite photo was dated March 2018 - three months before Kim and Trump met in Singapore - and the missile bases presented as damning evidence of Kim's duplicity had been known to South Korea for at least two years. Laughably, the CSIS report at the heart of the article even featured a disclaimer that "some of the information used in the preparation of this study may eventually prove to be incomplete or incorrect".

All of that, though, did not stop the story from being spread by overeager Western media, and the Times tweeted that it stood by the story, without elaboration.

I have come to find that Western media are quick to blame North Korea for their own bad reporting, on the grounds that the regime does not share much information. The CNN article even contains an acknowledgment to that effect: "gathering intelligence out of North Korea is notoriously difficult ... North Korea tightly controls any information surrounding its leader." It is what many Western journalists on the North Korea beat tend to say in self-defence.

Over coffee in downtown Seoul a few years ago, the then-Asia director of a large European news organisation said just as much to me: "North Korea is important. Shouldn't we at least try to report on it?"

That intention may be good, but does it justify publishing half-truths or articles written with outright ignorance? Again in June 2018, at the press conference following the Singapore summit, Trump commented that the US and South Korea "will stop the war games," prompting a flurry of criticisms in Western media that he had slighted South Korea, which was "taken by surprise" and was allegedly concerned about the announcement.

That reading of Seoul's position was entirely wrong since most of these Western reporters operate without deep knowledge of regional politics. The South Korean government, under president Moon Jae-in, has been of the position that reducing the chances of military confrontation - including limiting military exercises - is important for advancing inter-Korean peace. Anyone who knows this would never say that suspending war games would worry Seoul.

In my five years on the English-language media scene, I have met not one Western reporter covering the Korean Peninsula who could speak Korean fluently. Whether a foreign language skill is imperative to have when reporting abroad may be debatable, but in the context of North Korea coverage, not speaking Korean means sidelining from the global conversation qualified experts who do not speak English - of whom there are many in South Korea.

Instead, their places are taken by the convenient English-speaking pundits, whose CVs reveal that most of them have no expertise related to North Korea; or by defectors whose suitability as commentators on the politics in Pyongyang or Kim's state of mind is compromised by inexperience or obvious political motives. 

Had Western media made genuine attempts to engage with reputable North Korea experts in the South, many exaggerated rumours about the regime would not receive the attention that they do.

Already more than two weeks ago, a number of respected South Korean researchers, including Cheong Seong-Chang at the Sejong Institute, cautioned against overreading Kim's public absence.

On April 17, Cheong wrote in his widely read newsletter: "Although there may be a temporary issue with Chairman Kim Jong Un's health or personal circumstance … the possibility of an emergency in the North is extremely unlikely."

And that was indeed the case.

The views expressed in this article are the authors' own and do not necessarily reflect Al Jazeera's editorial stance.

==========

Source (https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/indepth/opinion/western-media-north-korea-wrong-200505155134971.html)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on August 13, 2020, 02:10:24 PM
I thought this a good article. Some elements of this may resonate with Billy.  ;D

==========

Why the Western media keeps getting North Korea wrong

Western media's repeated blunders in reporting on North Korea show its continuing lack of understanding and expertise.

After 20 days of absence, proof of life for North Korea's Kim Jong Un finally came on May 2. North Korean state media released images of the leader touring a fertiliser factory. Contrary to mounting speculation by much of the international media and many so-called North Korea watchers, Kim was clearly not on his deathbed.

Western journalists are not always adept at covering this reclusive country, but the latest fiasco surrounding Kim's supposedly imminent demise proved just how eager they are to accept unconfirmed rumours as objective news and how poorly they judge information about North Korea.

It all started on April 20, when the North Korean-defector-run news site Daily NK published a story that Kim had undergone heart surgery. Initially citing multiple sources, the site claimed that the North Korean leader "suffered from inflammation of blood vessels involving the heart ... but his condition worsened".

Daily NK often relies on anonymous informers in the North to run critical articles about the regime, and its track record on accuracy is spotty at best. In this instance, the English version of the article was later edited to say "a cardiovascular procedure" instead of "a heart surgery", and the editor ran a correction that there were no multiple sources, but only one.

Within hours, CNN put forward its own single-source piece, with the sensationalist headline, "US source: North Korean leader in grave danger after surgery." MSNBC anchor Katy Tur tweeted to her more than 700,000 followers: "North Korean leader Kim Jong Un is brain dead, according to two US officials." She called it a "CNN scoop" confirmed by NBC News.

CNN later revised its headline to "US monitoring intelligence that North Korean leader is in grave danger after surgery" and Tur apparently deleted her tweet, both conveying that the intel was less than credible. But the cat was already out of the bag. For the next 11 days all manner of news outlets and sites worldwide would join the game of guessing "Is Kim Jong Un really dead?" and "Who will be the next ruler of North Korea?"

So great was the noise generated by Western media that even the normally more reserved South Koreans became rattled, wondering if they had missed out on something, even though the country's National Security Council maintained that "there are at present no unusual developments within North Korea". At times "Kim Jong Un death" trumped even coronavirus in search rankings on major portal websites.

To be fair, the North Korean state contributed to the drama when Kim did not publicly pay respect to his grandfather Kim Il Sung on his April 15 birth anniversary for an unspecified reason. But in hindsight, there was not even a shred of concrete proof that Kim Jong Un's health and the succession question merited serious discussion.

This is hardly the first major Western media fail over North Korea. In November 2018, the august New York Times ran a front-page article titled, "In North Korea, Missile Bases Suggest a Great Deception." Written by two reporters including Pulitzer-winning correspondent David E Sanger, it cited satellite imagery and a report by the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS) to argue that North Korea was continuing to secretly develop missiles in violation of the June 2018 Singapore agreement between Kim and US President Donald Trump.

But as longtime Korea analyst Tim Shorrock wrote in his great takedown of the piece, the prominently embedded satellite photo was dated March 2018 - three months before Kim and Trump met in Singapore - and the missile bases presented as damning evidence of Kim's duplicity had been known to South Korea for at least two years. Laughably, the CSIS report at the heart of the article even featured a disclaimer that "some of the information used in the preparation of this study may eventually prove to be incomplete or incorrect".

All of that, though, did not stop the story from being spread by overeager Western media, and the Times tweeted that it stood by the story, without elaboration.

I have come to find that Western media are quick to blame North Korea for their own bad reporting, on the grounds that the regime does not share much information. The CNN article even contains an acknowledgment to that effect: "gathering intelligence out of North Korea is notoriously difficult ... North Korea tightly controls any information surrounding its leader." It is what many Western journalists on the North Korea beat tend to say in self-defence.

Over coffee in downtown Seoul a few years ago, the then-Asia director of a large European news organisation said just as much to me: "North Korea is important. Shouldn't we at least try to report on it?"

That intention may be good, but does it justify publishing half-truths or articles written with outright ignorance? Again in June 2018, at the press conference following the Singapore summit, Trump commented that the US and South Korea "will stop the war games," prompting a flurry of criticisms in Western media that he had slighted South Korea, which was "taken by surprise" and was allegedly concerned about the announcement.

That reading of Seoul's position was entirely wrong since most of these Western reporters operate without deep knowledge of regional politics. The South Korean government, under president Moon Jae-in, has been of the position that reducing the chances of military confrontation - including limiting military exercises - is important for advancing inter-Korean peace. Anyone who knows this would never say that suspending war games would worry Seoul.

In my five years on the English-language media scene, I have met not one Western reporter covering the Korean Peninsula who could speak Korean fluently. Whether a foreign language skill is imperative to have when reporting abroad may be debatable, but in the context of North Korea coverage, not speaking Korean means sidelining from the global conversation qualified experts who do not speak English - of whom there are many in South Korea.

Instead, their places are taken by the convenient English-speaking pundits, whose CVs reveal that most of them have no expertise related to North Korea; or by defectors whose suitability as commentators on the politics in Pyongyang or Kim's state of mind is compromised by inexperience or obvious political motives. 

Had Western media made genuine attempts to engage with reputable North Korea experts in the South, many exaggerated rumours about the regime would not receive the attention that they do.

Already more than two weeks ago, a number of respected South Korean researchers, including Cheong Seong-Chang at the Sejong Institute, cautioned against overreading Kim's public absence.

On April 17, Cheong wrote in his widely read newsletter: "Although there may be a temporary issue with Chairman Kim Jong Un's health or personal circumstance … the possibility of an emergency in the North is extremely unlikely."

And that was indeed the case.

The views expressed in this article are the authors' own and do not necessarily reflect Al Jazeera's editorial stance.

==========

Source (https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/indepth/opinion/western-media-north-korea-wrong-200505155134971.html)

Manny it is not a news report it is the UN report. Nothing quote "western news" about it. They do not get there info from reporters.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on August 13, 2020, 03:27:03 PM
Manny it is not a news report it is the UN report. Nothing quote "western news" about it. They do not get there [sic] info from reporters.

Could you eleborate please?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on August 13, 2020, 03:34:59 PM
Good read with some pretty fair comments. Written from an angle of course but using your own expression Manny, this stuffs like catnip for certain people. ^^
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on August 17, 2020, 08:22:29 PM
Media Reports Kim Jung Un telling subjects to turn in Dog pets so their fellow NoKors can eat... something, anything curious what else is on the menu Rats, Pigeons, Squirrels?

Here is UK Media's PC Spin:

https://www.express.co.uk/news/nature/700598/Kim-Jong-un-wants-North-Koreans-eat-dog-meat-stamina-food

Now Kim Jong-un wants North Koreans to eat DOG for 'stamina food'

NORTH Korean dictator Kim Jong-un wants his famished people to eat more dogs because it is “stamina food”, according to local reports.

To make the pet meat even tastier, dogs should be beaten, flayed and then scorched, says the reviled despot.

Cooked dog – called “dangogi” or sweet meat in Korean – is also being described to the country’s starving masses as having more vitamins than chicken, pork, beef and duck as well as having medicinal benefit for the stomach and intestines.

Famine in the communist dictatorship, the result of floods and droughts as well as economic management failings, has been blamed for the deaths of up to 300,000 people during 1990s.

Feeding dog to the starving masses is one answer to its food shortages, and the country’s heavily-controlled media appears to have been given the nod from on high to promote canine meat.

North Korea’s answer to a reality cookery show has been recently witnessing contestants creating dishes out of the animals, while in the capital of Pyongyang a dog meat restaurant recently opened.

Now if you order Bulkogi they serve you Dogbarkie.

Meanwhile Huge delicious Boa on the SHTF menu in London fattened on Thames River Rats...

https://www.express.co.uk/news/nature/1324008/london-news-rspca-boa-constrictor-river-thames-barnes-bridge

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on August 18, 2020, 05:43:37 AM
ERRATTA'

When you order bulkogi they serve UdoggiNObarkie.

Curious about cats?

Last night in the flood light entrance to my building there were two wild brown bunnies one a younger adult and one a new smaller one.  Got me thinking about a possible gofundme campaign to raise funds for haveaheart live capture traps to Catch a Bunnie feed a NORK.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on August 18, 2020, 06:07:00 AM
Media Reports Kim Jung Un telling subjects to turn in Dog pets so their fellow NoKors can eat... something, anything curious what else is on the menu Rats, Pigeons, Squirrels?

Here is UK Media's PC Spin:

https://www.express.co.uk/news/nature/700598/Kim-Jong-un-wants-North-Koreans-eat-dog-meat-stamina-food

I cant find the original quote or source for this story, but I did find this less newsworthy one from recently suggesting it may be fake news based on this article:

Quote from: Daily NK
North Korean authorities are urgently trying to buy up dogs from several parts of the country for dog meat restaurants in Pyongyang, Daily NK has learned.

“The authorities have ordered that officials in several areas of the country, including Pakchon County, buy up dogs weighing 15 kilograms or larger and send them to Pyongyang,” a North Pyongan Province-based source told Daily NK yesterday.

The order directed local officials to send the dogs to 36 well-known dog meat restaurants in Pyongyang.

Local officials in Pakchon County have reportedly been ordered to supply dogs to a famous restaurant in Pyongyang’s Taesong District.

Over a period of seven days, Pakchon County officials reportedly purchased dogs weighing 15 to 18 kilograms from dog owners and have already sent a total of 720 kilograms worth of dogs to Pyongyang.

Source (https://www.dailynk.com/english/north-korea-buying-up-dogs-supply-restaurants-pyongyang/)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on August 18, 2020, 06:33:22 AM
Famine in the communist dictatorship, the result of floods and droughts as well as economic management failings, has been blamed for the deaths of up to 300,000 people during 1990s.

1990? Kim wasn't even in power back then. talk about recent news, thats 30 years ago!
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on August 18, 2020, 07:14:04 AM
Of course, absent the ecomonic blackade on the country things would've been much, much better.

When one knows a little about how the economy is organised one would be hard pressed to honestly suggest that the economy was being mismanaged. But hey, that's propaganda for you.

The simple story that we are being told to accept is that the program of starvation carried out by the west, led by the USA, causes no harm to the people and that everything done by the government to minimise the effect of blockades is bad.

We have heard that same story time and again over the past couple of decades. To swallow that line requires extensive programing and disinformation among those receiving the untire stories.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on August 18, 2020, 07:26:02 AM
I understand Kim has open up his food reserve but it is a year until the next crop. Crops were damaged by flooding in North Korea and China. China has a political operation called clean plate which is a complete reversal of what they saying last month when they said there was no food shortage. They have asked restaurants to give smaller portions and made groups to buy one less plate than the number of people in the group. 21 Chinese were arrested in Vietnam for entering the country illegally. They claimed there was not enough food in China. 600 million people in China live off of less than 144 dollars a month. It appears rising food cost is making it hard on those people. 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on August 18, 2020, 07:43:40 AM
The simple story that we are being told to accept is that the program of starvation carried out by the west, led by the USA, causes no harm to the people and that everything done by the government to minimise the effect of blockades is bad.


Hasn't NK sanctioned America? It's not starving us because we have good management here. If true NK depends on America, they shouldn't bite the hand that feeds them.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on August 18, 2020, 07:57:21 AM
Billykins, you really are that dumb aren't you? It's not just poor education and an inability to think for yourself. This is a real issue for you.

Do you really think that North Korea is as powerful and influential as the USA? Honestly?

There must be a kiddies program that you need to watch on TV.  :(
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on August 18, 2020, 08:02:22 AM
Do you really think that North Korea is as powerful and influential as the USA? Honestly?


When I say NK shouldn't bite the hand that feeds them, most intelligent people would know America and NK aren't equals. You have comprehension issues.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on August 18, 2020, 08:17:14 AM
Billykins, don't be more stupid than you have to. You raised the stupid comparison, not I. I pointed out to you the stupidity of your point.

Tell us from your great knowledge exactly what the United States has offered to North Korea? Go on, be specific and don't rely upon you prejudices. Go research the topic. Removing illegal sanctions is not a benefit, as I am sure even you are aware, it is merely returning to some form of stays quo.

Go on, Silly Billy, give it a shot, prove you know something.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on August 18, 2020, 08:31:14 AM
Billykins, don't be more stupid than you have to. You raised the stupid comparison, not I. I pointed out to you the stupidity of your point.

Tell us from your great knowledge exactly what the United States has offered to North Korea? Go on, be specific and don't rely upon you prejudices. Go research the topic. Removing illegal sanctions is not a benefit, as I am sure even you are aware, it is merely returning to some form of stays quo.

Go on, Silly Billy, give it a shot, prove you know something.

If they have   been approved by the UN then they are "legal".  If they are illegal then they should go to the appropriate court.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on August 18, 2020, 09:42:20 AM

Andrew, you'd make for a good Communist Party manager for nations like NK. Your brain ain't normal.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on August 18, 2020, 02:53:55 PM
because we have good management here.

Good management of what? Not the country. Crumbling infrastructure, opoid addiction, poor race relations, floods of illegal aliens, no wall as promised, Pinkos taking over, riots everywhere, defunding the police, gun crime, rampant virus, tourism collapsed, etc.

Food you have, yes. Why so many of you are so enormous and unhealthy.

Billy, nobody envies the US right now. Not even North Korea I think. Look at the article Cuffy posted on NYC, it's truly a saddening read. I dont think I'll be visiting the US for some years now. It's simply too dangerous to do so on so many levels. North Korea on the other hand, I have plans to go back as soon as I can. And I'm pretty sure I'll have plenty to eat (not dogs), police will be on the streets, I won't get shot, there'll be no BLM protestors, and the virus will be zero or close to it.

It's very easy to be blasé about the problems the US has, and if it's not in your backyard, sweep it under the carpet. As I have told you before, and you have read from my first visit, life in North Korea is not as bad as westerners are told. Is everything rosy everywhere? I'm sure it isn't. But it isn't in the US either, you folks forget that. You've still got post-Katrina blacks living in poverty, a huge homeless problem and many other social problems.

Life in Pyongyang is quite OK, surprisingly OK in fact. Why many foreigners choose to live there. The same can't be said for New York of late. People are fleeing.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on August 18, 2020, 08:27:11 PM
Ironic really except for the Wall same can be said about London and UK.

The main exception is most all of the Latin and India migrants come here to work... Whereas the Islamists flooding London and many other UK cities come to game your NHS and welfare dole, groom your daughters to breed out you bloodlines and behead your men.

I can't ever see myself visiting such a dangerous country with feral Islamists running wild with NO rights to free speech or self defense and the only business opps are trading with Communist Slave Labor States... Our S&P just made a new All Time High for a V Shaped rapid recovery despite BLMantifa agitators and a lingering pandemic... Many segments of our economy are in fact booming...  Unemployment is still high due to Dems perverse UI incentives to stay home to slow our recovery.

China and NoKor will pay for their evil soon after Trump's reelection,. Fortunately for UK he has a soft spot for his mother's Scots ancestral homeland if you aren't already  completely buggered by ISIS sympathizers...

Fences and greener grass etc.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on August 18, 2020, 09:16:51 PM
floods of illegal aliens,


Rome had that problem. The best, most prosperous region in the world will always have that problem. Most of America isn't like what you see on tv with a few idiots in liberal cities rioting. America will continue to excel and pull away from other nations because we have a lot of good things happening here all the time.


Life in Pyongyang is quite OK, surprisingly OK in fact. Why many foreigners choose to live there. The same can't be said for New York of late. People are fleeing.


Start a poll and ask if people want to live in America or NK. I already know the answer. Also I don't see what is so special about NY for international tourists. It's in overcrowded, rude, and dirty city. Lots of better places in America to see and meet people.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on August 19, 2020, 12:37:28 AM
Ironic really except for the Wall same can be said about London and UK.

The main exception is most all of the Latin and India migrants come here to work... Whereas the Islamists flooding London and many other UK cities come to game your NHS and welfare dole, groom your daughters to breed out you bloodlines and behead your men.

I can't ever see myself visiting such a dangerous country with feral Islamists running wild

In reference to London and the Islam infected parts of the UK I agree with you.

Start a poll and ask if people want to live in America or NK. I already know the answer.

It depends who you’re polling. In Pyongyang the US would lose.

Also I don't see what is so special about NY for international tourists. It's in overcrowded, rude, and dirty city. Lots of better places in America to see and meet people.

I say the same about London.

China and NoKor will pay for their evil soon after Trump's reelection

Tell us Cuffy, what is this evil you imagine North Korea has perpetrated?

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on August 19, 2020, 03:08:16 AM

Andrew, you'd make for a good Communist Party manager for nations like NK. Your brain ain't normal.

I think we can discern from your reply here that you had no idea what you were bleating on about and have no way to answer the question?

Billy, why do you insist on being so poorly informed and yet continue to offer your valueless opinions on a myriad of topics?

I have to say that if normalcy as you see it is related to your standards then I am happy to be abnormal. I can only take your words as a compliment and reflect that, sadly, you will never reach the standards set, every day, by your betters.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on August 19, 2020, 04:25:12 AM
Rome had that problem. The best, most prosperous region in the world will always have that problem. Most of America isn't like what you see on tv with a few idiots in liberal cities rioting. America will continue to excel and pull away from other nations because we have a lot of good things happening here all the time.

 :ROFL:

Billy and Tex still live their lives believing that the US is the greatest place on earth without question. Anywhere else is poorer, more corrupt and more stupid. I like the US but I know its not the best, the safest, the most free or the most prosperous. In fact its way down that list.

If you don't believe me, google is your friend;

https://li.com/news/norway-is-the-most-prosperous-country-in-the-world/
https://www.prosperity.com/rankings
https://www.insider.com/20-most-prosperous-nations-2019-legatum-index-2019-11

The US is listed in 18th behind Australia, Canada, Ireland, UK and a whole host of European places. Top of the pops is Denmark, Norway and Switzerland. The UK is 11th.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on August 19, 2020, 08:24:22 AM
Billy and Tex still live their lives believing that the US is the greatest place on earth without question.


What's wrong with that? You should have an idea of what nation you think is best. What is it? Don't let a journalist's article influence your beliefs. People can say what they want but actions are louder than words. Look how people vote with their feet. Here is an interactive map of where people are going in the World. More people would come to America if it weren't for our very restrictive immigration policies. Enlarge the map. Europe isn't doing too well even with a large migration of people from the Middle East. Many of the White folks are leaving.

http://metrocosm.com/global-migration-map.html

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on August 19, 2020, 08:46:59 AM
I have a great fondness for the UK and the warm welcoming I got most everywhere I went there Warrington, Manchester and Liverpool.

That said in reply to

Quote from: Manny
Tell us Cuffy, what is this evil you imagine North Korea has perpetrated?

Imagine for a moment you had male Ancestors who fought against Turks at Gallipoli and against Germans being gased in trenches in WW1 and your major cities bombed by Nazi Air Raids in WWIi with 80% of London, Liverpool and Manchester homes damaged or destroyed.  This residual anger towards the NAZI 4th Reich aka the EU is in large measure why the independent minded Brits booted out the 4th Reich with Brexit.

The NORKS and Chicommunists are an extreme existential threat to the USA and our Constitution.  They are one and the same.  We rattle their cages with Taiwan, and Japan and Chairman Xi borrows another hand to kill and rattles our cage by feeding advanced Nuke missiles to the NORKS that can hit any major US city.  This is a direct threat to US.  Now add the fact that Chinese Maoist Communist overan South Korea and killed over 50,000 plus US Troops after we helped liberate China from Imperial Japan...  My father served on US Navy diesel subs against Japan and was called back from reserves for the Korea China war.

The Chinese/Koreans are an extreme Nuclear threat to the US and the sooner we vaporize them the safer we will be.

In the immortal words of a West by God Virginia Mountain Man submarines classmate when we were getting the full reenlistment speeches after our first 6 year tours by a full Commander he said "Sir I been in this here man's Navy nigh on 6 years now and I ain't got to kill me one commie yet.

The Chinese Communist bioweapons lab SarsHIV virus will kill 250,000 Americans by Christmas, FIVE phocking times Korea ... A biowar anihilation... We have huge accurate sea air and land thermonukes that work every time and 250,000 of our dead souls are crying out for revenge.  If there was ever a time to unleash our entire depth and massive destructive power of our arsenal against the Red CHICOMMS AND NORKS it is NOW right after our elections.  I plan to enjoy a holiday by the sea as it may be our last till the radiation clouds dissipate.

Good speed to you all and Death to all Marxist Communists.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on August 19, 2020, 09:20:15 AM
So the answer is, in fact, they haven't perpetrated any evil, just you're scared of them.

North Korea's nukes are a very necessary deterrent. Leave them alone and they'll never have to use them. The fact that they are capable of hitting the US is the only thing that has stopped you lot invading them again.

The US invaded North Korea (and lost) previously. They haven't invaded or attacked you. And they won't if you leave them alone. Thus they are no threat.

Quote from: Cuffy
The NORKS and Chicommunists are an extreme existential threat to the USA and our Constitution.  They are one and the same.

North Korea and China are not one and the same.  (:)

You really do have a typical US view of the world.

[attachimg=1]


Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on August 19, 2020, 09:32:29 AM


The US invaded North Korea (and lost) previously. They haven't invaded or attacked you. And they won't if you leave them alone. Thus they are no threat.


On June 25, 1950, the Korean War began when some 75,000 soldiers from the North Korean People’s Army poured across the 38th parallel, the boundary between the Soviet-backed Democratic People’s Republic of Korea to the north and the pro-Western Republic of Korea to the south.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on August 19, 2020, 09:36:38 AM
The US invaded North Korea (and lost) previously. They haven't invaded or attacked you. And they won't if you leave them alone. Thus they are no threat.


How did anybody lose? The war never ended. They don't have to attack America. They attacked our friends. Don't you help your friends in need? Even China and the Soviets do the same thing.


North Korea's nukes are a very necessary deterrent. Leave them alone and they'll never have to use them.


That's not only how it works. Eventually there could be a nuke arms race in Asia that does nobody any good. Wars always happen. Nuke war will happen. Without taking preventive measures now, it'll happen sooner than later and on greater scales.




The US invaded North Korea (and lost) previously. They haven't invaded or attacked you. And they won't if you leave them alone. Thus they are no threat.


On June 25, 1950, the Korean War began when some 75,000 soldiers from the North Korean People’s Army poured across the 38th parallel, the boundary between the Soviet-backed Democratic People’s Republic of Korea to the north and the pro-Western Republic of Korea to the south.

Is that what the NK history books say? Because some people believe the NK history books.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: yankee on August 19, 2020, 10:04:00 AM
The US invaded North Korea (and lost) previously. They haven't invaded or attacked you. And they won't if you leave them alone. Thus they are no threat.


How did anybody lose? The war never ended. They don't have to attack America. They attacked our friends. Don't you help your friends in need? Even China and the Soviets do the same thing.


North Korea's nukes are a very necessary deterrent. Leave them alone and they'll never have to use them.


That's not only how it works. Eventually there could be a nuke arms race in Asia that does nobody any good. Wars always happen. Nuke war will happen. Without taking preventive measures now, it'll happen sooner than later and on greater scales.




The US invaded North Korea (and lost) previously. They haven't invaded or attacked you. And they won't if you leave them alone. Thus they are no threat.


On June 25, 1950, the Korean War began when some 75,000 soldiers from the North Korean People’s Army poured across the 38th parallel, the boundary between the Soviet-backed Democratic People’s Republic of Korea to the north and the pro-Western Republic of Korea to the south.

Is that what the NK history books say? Because some people believe the NK history books.

Billy, I don't understand your response to what I wrote.  Please read my response again.  I said NK started the war.  Do you disagree with that?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on August 19, 2020, 10:09:24 AM
Billy and Tex still live their lives believing that the US is the greatest place on earth without question.


What's wrong with that? You should have an idea of what nation you think is best. What is it? Don't let a journalist's article influence your beliefs. People can say what they want but actions are louder than words. Look how people vote with their feet. Here is an interactive map of where people are going in the World. More people would come to America if it weren't for our very restrictive immigration policies. Enlarge the map. Europe isn't doing too well even with a large migration of people from the Middle East. Many of the White folks are leaving.

http://metrocosm.com/global-migration-map.html

What’s wrong with it, is that you’re pretending/lying to yourself. You're measuring yourself against other countries with a faulty barometer.

You then find yourself playing the annoying yank who arrogantly assumes that everything is better at home and you miss enriching yourself with all the better things you’ll find abroad.

And of course there isn’t one way to define the best country in the world but we both know it isn’t the USA. Your migration map essentially shows us that people are moving to the US from much poorer countries who can access the US via a land border or from next door.

Not exactly ground breaking stuff.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on August 19, 2020, 10:24:11 AM

Billy, I don't understand your response to what I wrote.  Please read my response again.  I said NK started the war.  Do you disagree with that?


Of course I believe what you wrote. Just saying there are some people that believe other history books.


What’s wrong with it, is that you’re pretending/lying to yourself. You're measuring yourself against other countries with a faulty barometer.


The websites you provided are based on someone else's opinion using their own barometers. I provided a link for you to see actual results. If you don't believe more people want to come to America than anywhere else, you're lying to yourself. Just think how much more people we'd have if we had open borders with no restrictions.

You then find yourself playing the annoying yank who arrogantly assumes that everything is better at home and you miss enriching yourself with all the better things you’ll find abroad.


You don't have to listen to the annoying yank anymore. Listen to the feet of the foreigners in the link I provided. Quit being stubborn and accept the facts more people want to come here because they like it here better than anywhere else.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on August 19, 2020, 12:56:35 PM
Billy, you conveniently ignored and cut out my point about where these people are arriving from. Do you think that poor south & Central American’s are more likely to walk over the boarder to the US or swim over to Europe?

Yes some wealthy/skilled people do want to move to the US, there’s some amazing parts to live but let’s be honest with your ‘feet’ moving north from developing countries because we can see that’s where most of the traffic is.

These feet can’t get to Scandinavia, Australia, New Zealand or Northern Europe.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on August 19, 2020, 01:15:00 PM
Fact is Manny is shiteing himself knowing that his rackets of buying Red Chinese/Norks slave labor made stuff will soon vaporize.

The Chinese Reds have killed 150,000 soon to be 250,000 of our people with their viral biowar and are encouraging the Norks to threaten us with long range thermonukes (Hydrogen Bombs) that the Red Chinese Phock Communists gave the Norks the components to assemble so they can deny they were made in Red China.

250,000 Dead Americans due to a massive intentional Biowar attack... Patriots DEMAND the Red Communists PAY for this EVIL.

Suggest you avoid China/NoKor for a bit... the land will eventually be habitable again in 50 years or so just like Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

You can whine and moan about it all you want.  We Patriots will make sure the Communist Phockers pay a severe price for their mass murder of Americans including the BLM/Antifas backed by the same Chinese Reds in our midsts.  Will take us about a year to smoke them all out and execute them all.

NBF Nuke Boats Forever!

[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on August 19, 2020, 01:31:21 PM

North Korea and China are not one and the same.  (:)


The North Koreans are quietly being invaded by the Chinese. When Kim dies the Chinese will pick the next leader. Then the invasion will be complete.  Nuclear weapons will not save them.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: d672 on August 19, 2020, 02:16:58 PM
So the answer is, in fact, they haven't perpetrated any evil, just you're scared of them.

North Korea's nukes are a very necessary deterrent. Leave them alone and they'll never have to use them. The fact that they are capable of hitting the US is the only thing that has stopped you lot invading them again.

The US invaded North Korea (and lost) previously. They haven't invaded or attacked you. And they won't if you leave them alone. Thus they are no threat.


 The Korean war ended in 1953, and NK didn't have nukes until 2006. Care to explain to us how the nukes are needed as a deterrent against the US when they hadn't been at war them with them 50 years before they had the nukes? :coffeeread:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on August 19, 2020, 02:46:21 PM
Billy, you conveniently ignored and cut out my point about where these people are arriving from. Do you think that poor south & Central American’s are more likely to walk over the boarder to the US or swim over to Europe?

Yes some wealthy/skilled people do want to move to the US, there’s some amazing parts to live but let’s be honest with your ‘feet’ moving north from developing countries because we can see that’s where most of the traffic is.

These feet can’t get to Scandinavia, Australia, New Zealand or Northern Europe.

USA is bordered by only 2 nations. European nations have more opportunity for people to walk on in than USA. UK has more immigrants show up than any other EU nation. Your excuse it's easy to come to America by way of walking doesn't fly.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on August 19, 2020, 03:02:17 PM
Billy, you conveniently ignored and cut out my point about where these people are arriving from. Do you think that poor south & Central American’s are more likely to walk over the boarder to the US or swim over to Europe?

Yes some wealthy/skilled people do want to move to the US, there’s some amazing parts to live but let’s be honest with your ‘feet’ moving north from developing countries because we can see that’s where most of the traffic is.

These feet can’t get to Scandinavia, Australia, New Zealand or Northern Europe.

USA is bordered by only 2 nations. European nations have more opportunity for people to walk on in than USA. UK has more immigrants show up than any other EU nation. Your excuse it's easy to come to America by way of walking doesn't fly.

Yea ok Billy. Whatever pal!
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on August 20, 2020, 03:41:47 PM
So the answer is, in fact, they haven't perpetrated any evil, just you're scared of them.

North Korea's nukes are a very necessary deterrent. Leave them alone and they'll never have to use them. The fact that they are capable of hitting the US is the only thing that has stopped you lot invading them again.

The US invaded North Korea (and lost) previously. They haven't invaded or attacked you. And they won't if you leave them alone. Thus they are no threat.


 The Korean war ended in 1953, and NK didn't have nukes until 2006. Care to explain to us how the nukes are needed as a deterrent against the US when they hadn't been at war them with them 50 years before they had the nukes? :coffeeread:

 :thumbsup:  tiphat
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on August 20, 2020, 03:49:27 PM
Manny said:

"The US invaded North Korea (and lost) previously. They haven't invaded or attacked you. And they won't if you leave them alone. Thus they are no threat."

To qoute Beijing Biden "Come on, Man!"

That's like saying that UK invaded Nazi Germany and basically lost until the USA and Stalin stepped in to save your bungling butts as your crocodile mouths bit off more than you could chew...
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on August 20, 2020, 11:28:15 PM
For our friends over the pond, learn something: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/asia-pacific/unknown-to-most-americans-the-us-totally-destroyed-north-korea-once-before-1.3227633


More facts you’re not taught, the US invasion and war crimes: https://www.vox.com/2015/8/3/9089913/north-korea-us-war-crime

Quote
That act was this: In the early 1950s, during the Korean War, the US dropped more bombs on North Korea than it had dropped in the entire Pacific theater during World War II. This carpet bombing, which included 32,000 tons of napalm, often deliberately targeted civilian as well as military targets, devastating the country far beyond what was necessary to fight the war.

Most people might regard that as an invasion.  :whist11:

And after all that, they still didn’t surrender, but they did think to themselves, “What if we developed some nuclear weapons? We can stop this from happening again”
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on August 21, 2020, 12:11:21 AM

They started a fight and got hit back twice as hard. They shouldn't be complaining. Maybe America should've let Japan keep parts of Korea and China since they aren't very appreciative
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on August 24, 2020, 04:38:21 PM

North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un has fallen into a coma as his sister seizes the reins of power in the communist country, according to a former aide to the South Korean president.

According to the Mirror, Chang Song-min, who served as an aide to former South Korean President Kim Dae-jung, told South Korean media of the 36-year-old Kim Jong Un, “I assess him to be in a coma, but his life has not ended.”

https://www.dailywire.com/news/disaster-for-the-country-kim-jong-un-reportedly-in-coma
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on August 24, 2020, 05:32:54 PM
He was chairing meetings two days ago. More fake news.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: cufflinks on August 26, 2020, 12:26:10 PM
Little Rocketman's Animatronic Body Double under control of his sister DraygunLady Un ...
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on August 26, 2020, 12:28:42 PM
Little Rocketman's Animatronic Body Double under control of his sister DraygunLady Un ...

 :Zzzzsleep:

Its on their Instagram feed.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on August 27, 2020, 10:05:28 PM
Kim is showing up to less than ten per cent of the meeting he went to a year ago. The time between him showing varies a lot. Sometime he will show up for several meetings a few days apart other time it is weeks between him showing up for anything.  Most of the time no ones knows when he is going to show up in advance. A body guard is claiming he has look a like doubles. I doubt the doubles are real but, it is interesting that they would tell that to a body guard.  I do not think all of this missing Kin Jon Un lately has anything to do with health but rather it is about his security.  He is making it hard for anyone to plan to kill him.  Parentally he does not feel as safe as he did a year ago.  Maybe it is just his imagination or maybe there is a real reason.

I understand the virus is getting bad in north Korea. They have had floods causing some crops to have been ruin leading to a food shortage. China is having the same problem and maybe not helping much. The economy, like the rest of the world, is also have a more than usual problems. Maybe he feel someone thinks it is his leadership causing all the problems. 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on August 27, 2020, 10:15:10 PM
Where was you reading this please, Tex?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on August 28, 2020, 09:30:57 AM
Where was you reading this please, Tex?

The idea that he maybe having a security problem is my thought not something I read. Other than that what part would you like me to find the article? Their was one on him only doing 1/10 the number of in person visits than he has done other years. There is where where they are now admitting the have a Virus problem. There is a few about the food shortage. There is one where the body guard claiming he was told there are doubles. I just put it all together and this is what I came up with. I do not believe the body guard's claim that there are doubles but he may have been told that.  There was a mark on his arm where he might of had heart surgery. But this does not explain is on going disconnect from running the country. He seem to be in good enough health to make meeting and public appearances. So why isn't he making more appearances? 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on August 28, 2020, 04:10:49 PM
As you know, I take an interest in what’s going on there. If it wasn’t for the virus I would be going back there any time now with a view to discussing a little bit of business. As it goes, my next visit will likely be next year when the borders reopen.

I still communicate with people there, but speculation on the leader and political chit chat isn’t welcome, that isn’t something they discuss happily. I have to assume email is monitored.

Marks that were reported on his wrist are synonymous with stents. Chinese media backed that up when he was “missing” for a few weeks. That isn’t a terribly big deal, I had those, but you do want to take it easy for a few months and get into a particular exercise regime for recovery. That might explain his limited appearances.

I do know there was a limited outbreak of the virus in Kaesong. I gather they’re on top of it now. Lockdowns are not difficult to enforce there as you can imagine. I don’t think they have any need for body doubles and stuff like that. If he chooses not to make very many appearances the people won’t question it. As long as he makes some, he is still sitting in the big chair.

The media is over playing the food shortage. This story about dogs being sequestered is complete fake news. What they are doing is buying dogs from dog farmers in the regions that are over 15kg to serve particular restaurants in the capital. I don’t think there is any worrying food shortage because they can easily import from Russia, China and India.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on September 11, 2020, 07:03:27 AM
Trump posted this on his Facebook page, yesterday at 14.08;

"Kim Jong Un is in good health. Never underestimate him!"

It looks like Billie's leader and idol has dropped him in it twice this week. First with Navalny and now Kim Jong Un. I wonder if Billie still claims to have better information than the president of the best country in the world or maybe this time, he'll admit to spreading unsubstantiated rumours to justify his prejudice?

Either way, Billie's hero is making him look a right fool.  :chuckle:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on September 11, 2020, 09:48:03 AM

Rosco, I never said Kim Jong Un is dead. I said he's missing and even if he talked to Trump recently, he's still a missing leader. He could be scared of the coronavirus or recovering from a major operation.

I checked your last 25 posts and they all pretty much insult somebody. You even had the nerve to call people out for trolling. How old are you? You're worse than Andrew.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on September 11, 2020, 04:37:14 PM
Er, Switzerland is in the EEA... do you understand wht that means, Rosco.. ?  This has been a BAD week for you re fails .

EEA :  You obey EU rules, but don't make the rules.

When one says obey that means you are compelled to follow the statues.

Switzerland, as has large portions of the world, harmonized certain areas of cooperation. But over an even largeer number of other rules the Swiss have given to Brussels the single finger salute. I seem to recall something about minarets on mosques as an example.


Switzerland also trades with North Korea. Something not allowed in the EU.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on September 12, 2020, 12:09:03 AM
[
Switzerland also trades with North Korea. Something not allowed in the EU.

Please show us where the EU has banned trade with N.Korea

Because of sanctions re N.Korea's nuclear activities, the EU restricts trade with certain individuals and entities and certain materials.

Easily googled
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: rosco on September 12, 2020, 04:41:34 AM

Rosco, I never said Kim Jong Un is dead. I said he's missing and even if he talked to Trump recently, he's still a missing leader. He could be scared of the coronavirus or recovering from a major operation.

I checked your last 25 posts and they all pretty much insult somebody. You even had the nerve to call people out for trolling. How old are you? You're worse than Andrew.

You’ve dug yourself a hole and your only option is to point the finger at me.

It is true that anyone’s posting turns less savoury when they get entrenched in arguments or proving people and their wild claims to be wrong but the fact you’ve had to look at my posting history means your upset and stuck in that hole of yours.

I just find it ironic that Trump of all people, has disproved 2 of your most recent wild claims. That must sting a bit.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on September 12, 2020, 11:34:33 AM
You’ve dug yourself a hole


What hole have I dug myself it? I asked you a long time ago to quote me where I claimed Kim Jong Un is dead. I never claimed he was dead but you still post as if I made that claim. Time to give it up if you can't quote somebody. Don't let your imagination run wild next time.

If any world leader is as absent as Kim Jong Un is, they'd be the laughing stock so don't get upset if some of us are laughing at Kim Jong Un. He deserves it.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on September 12, 2020, 12:52:25 PM
Here's an interesting thing. Its been touched upon here by Andrew and I that defectors may not be the best witnesses, and may need to spread untruths about what stuff is like in North Korea to appear credible. To have something to be seen to "run away from". Reality is often they have done something and they are fleeing because of that.

Some will know of Park Yeon-mi (whose name is westernised as Yeonmi Park), her Wiki page is here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Park_Yeon-mi

I read some of her stuff on social media and it didn't ring quite true. If anyone questions her, she won't engage. But the US and western media laps it up, she has had help publishing books, etc., and she is an "authority", apparently.

I engage with a bloke called Felix Abt on Twitter (https://twitter.com/felixabt) who wrote this book (https://www.amazon.com/Capitalist-North-Korea-Hermit-Kingdom/dp/0804844399). He lived in North Korea for seven years. He is often outing her articles and interviews as "the worst North Korea stereotypes and offers sensationalist cocktails made of elements of truths, half-truths & lies".

He recently posted an article with this comment: This North Korean defector was the child of an elite family who now claims she was poor and survived on eating grass. Her contradictions and lies — for fame and $$$ — are exposed here: Yeonmi Park: The Defector Who Fooled the World (http://jooparkblog.blogspot.com/2014/12/yeonmi-park-defector-who-fooled-world.html)

That led back to this older article: Yeonmi Park - North Korean defector has harrowing stories to tell. But are they true? (https://thediplomat.com/2014/12/the-strange-tale-of-yeonmi-park/)

In subsequent conversation, he said to me: "She left North Korea in 2007, me in 2009. She lived in Hyesan and in Pyongyang but didn't travel around the country. She claimed having seen heaps of dead bodies in the streets and corpses in rivers. I did travel across the country but there were no bodies in the streets and rivers".

He lived there, started a business school there, owned pharmacies there, no guides and "off limits" areas for him.

Park Yeon-mi is a classic example of a defector with an agenda spreading lies for personal gain or advantage. Readers can read the links and make their own mind up.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on September 12, 2020, 01:17:14 PM
Please show us where the EU has banned trade with N.Korea

Direct trade with North Korea is defacto banned. Statute says you can trade food, non dual use goods, etc. The reality is you can't do so direct from the EU - I tried. Its banned at the behest of the US. I was contacted by the UK Customs "naughty department" for a telephone interview when a parcel of mine was intercepted. They asked me many questions and despite me having filled in paperwork correctly, including sanctions waivers and indemnities, etc. and being utterly legally correct, he made it very clear the stuff was going nowhere.

I was directed to Spire >here< (https://www.spire.trade.gov.uk/spire/fox/espire/LOGIN/login) to get an export licence. The reality there is they won't give you one and won't tell you why. Yes Moby, declared legal trade with the DPRK is defacto banned. EU law says it isn't, but in reality it is. This was also confirmed by a chap I know socially (who did some digging for me) who was a diplomat and now works as an advisor to the government and the army.

If you want to trade with North Korea, you have to do so via alternative locations.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on September 12, 2020, 02:08:23 PM


Direct trade with North Korea is defacto banned. Statute says you can trade food, non dual use goods, etc. The reality is you can't do so direct from the EU - I tried. Its banned at the behest of the US. I was contacted by the UK Customs "naughty department" for a telephone interview when a parcel of mine was intercepted. They asked me many questions and despite me having filled in paperwork correctly, including sanctions waivers and indemnities, etc. and being utterly legally correct, he made it very clear the stuff was going nowhere.

I was directed to Spire >here< (https://www.spire.trade.gov.uk/spire/fox/espire/LOGIN/login) to get an export licence. The reality there is they won't give you one and won't tell you why. Yes Moby, declared legal trade with the DPRK is defacto banned. EU law says it isn't, but in reality it is. This was also confirmed by a chap I know socially (who did some digging for me) who was a diplomat and now works as an advisor to the government and the army.

If you want to trade with North Korea, you have to do so via alternative locations.

We (UK) aren't in the EU ...but still subject to the EU rules If it isn't banned and not on the  excluded list .. it simply can't be ..

I'd not have given up so easily ... I'd wear my Irish hat and use SolVIT ..They've been VERY helpful ..

"The UK continues to be part of the SOLVIT network until the end of the Transition Period (31.12.2020)."

https://ec.europa.eu/solvit/index_en.htm


Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: andrewfi on September 12, 2020, 03:00:40 PM
It's unlikely that the people who most need to open their eyes will actually do so - sadly that's how the world is.

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: BillyB on September 12, 2020, 05:56:36 PM

There are people trying to leave the NK because they committed a crime and don't want to get arrested but the overwhelming defectors want a better life. How do we know if their stories are true if the NK government doesn't let foreign journalist in the country to see for themselves? When a defector goes to Russia, another to China, and another to South Korea and they don't know each other but they all have the same story, then we can get an idea of the oppression they've seen and experienced.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: msmoby on September 13, 2020, 02:08:20 AM
Here's an interesting thing. Its been touched upon here by Andrew

I missed him relating the murder of the great leader's brother by poisoning him Malaysia .. Indeed we know what happens to those who spread negative news and defect by forgetting to return
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on September 13, 2020, 11:53:05 AM


Direct trade with North Korea is defacto banned. Statute says you can trade food, non dual use goods, etc. The reality is you can't do so direct from the EU - I tried. Its banned at the behest of the US. I was contacted by the UK Customs "naughty department" for a telephone interview when a parcel of mine was intercepted. They asked me many questions and despite me having filled in paperwork correctly, including sanctions waivers and indemnities, etc. and being utterly legally correct, he made it very clear the stuff was going nowhere.

I was directed to Spire >here< (https://www.spire.trade.gov.uk/spire/fox/espire/LOGIN/login) to get an export licence. The reality there is they won't give you one and won't tell you why. Yes Moby, declared legal trade with the DPRK is defacto banned. EU law says it isn't, but in reality it is. This was also confirmed by a chap I know socially (who did some digging for me) who was a diplomat and now works as an advisor to the government and the army.

If you want to trade with North Korea, you have to do so via alternative locations.

We (UK) aren't in the EU ...but still subject to the EU rules If it isn't banned and not on the  excluded list .. it simply can't be ..

I'd not have given up so easily ... I'd wear my Irish hat and use SolVIT ..They've been VERY helpful ..

"The UK continues to be part of the SOLVIT network until the end of the Transition Period (31.12.2020)."

https://ec.europa.eu/solvit/index_en.htm

You're right we have left the EU but continue to be bound by some of its rules for a while. The department behind Spire is what was the Dept for Trade and Industry. The people making the decisions there are above HMRC, and I would say, pretty much exempt from enforcement on inconvenient statutes by lesser bodies. I think an outfit like Solveit would make you more of a target. You'd perhaps win the battle but not the war. You'd be on the shit list. VAT investigations, EORI checks, customs checks and delays on imports, constant border control checks, etc would follow. That was subtly implicated already.

I know you'd revel in all that and make it a personal crusade. You like challenging daft rules and authority. In principle I agree with you, but in this area, decisions are politically motivated. It wouldn't be sound business to fight a government department this way. It would be a time and money sink. The ex-diplomat bloke I know used to work in Moscow and Africa and had involvement in sanctions when they were first a thing, and now advises various companies, the government and the army. It was his considered opinion not to ship direct there from the UK although it is technically legal. I told him the tale, he nodded sagely and said, "you just won't get an export licence". And he was right.

But there is more than one way to skin a cat. You can buy Chanel handbags, Range Rovers, Italian wine and Swiss cheese in Pyongyang because creative people find other legal ways to do stuff.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on November 18, 2020, 08:19:42 PM
Manny I though you might enjoy this video on North Korea, Russia and China about fishing in the area. 

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Guile on November 19, 2020, 11:30:38 PM
Good video Texan, I watched most of it.  Good way to learn Russian and Chinese! although their accents are quite harsh.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on November 24, 2020, 01:28:50 PM
Manny I though you might enjoy this video on North Korea, Russia and China about fishing in the area. 


Very interesting, Tex. Thanks.  tiphat
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on December 05, 2020, 01:18:15 PM
There has been some stuff in the news recently about very high suicide rates in South Korea (https://www.dw.com/en/south-koreas-soaring-suicide-self-harm-rates-pinned-on-pandemic/a-54931167).

On social media, accounts from the North (or their supporters), have been posting stuff like this.

[attachimg=1]

I suppose it does raise the question, is life in North Korea as bad as the western media tells us? And more to the point, South Korea, which IIRC is the 14th richest country in the world, what there is so bad that so many people want to commit suicide?
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on December 05, 2020, 04:07:50 PM
There has been some stuff in the news recently about very high suicide rates in South Korea (https://www.dw.com/en/south-koreas-soaring-suicide-self-harm-rates-pinned-on-pandemic/a-54931167).

On social media, accounts from the North (or their supporters), have been posting stuff like this.

(Attachment Link)

I suppose it does raise the question, is life in North Korea as bad as the western media tells us? And more to the point, South Korea, which IIRC is the 14th richest country in the world, what there is so bad that so many people want to commit suicide?

Probably a very high cost for housing in relation to income.

Capitalism does have some drawbacks.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on December 11, 2020, 10:43:30 PM
There has been some stuff in the news recently about very high suicide rates in South Korea (https://www.dw.com/en/south-koreas-soaring-suicide-self-harm-rates-pinned-on-pandemic/a-54931167).

I suppose it does raise the question, is life in North Korea as bad as the western media tells us? And more to the point, South Korea, which IIRC is the 14th richest country in the world, what there is so bad that so many people want to commit suicide?

The highest income earners in the USA such as dentist, investment bankers, lawyers and doctors have a high suicide rate. It is the pressure and stress of success. Probably the highest suicide rate is Japan.

Is Kin Jon Un dead? This question never goes away. This woman say he had been slowly poison. That is why we saw less of him over the last year. Until North Korea selects a new leader they have a double that does not meet anybody just shows up at events to make everything look good. She claims China killed him. She claims North Korea will not meet any world leader until a new leader has been selected.  Until then all we will see is Kim Jon Un cut ribbons, wave and show up for big events where he does not do or say much. 

Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on December 12, 2020, 10:01:45 AM
He just recently did a long address to the people, I think they'd have noticed a fake Kim.


The video wasn't made a day later, it was live in front of thousands. The potbelly she refers to his father and grandfather had.

That is South Korean (US) propaganda. Going back through her videos, she claims the US is about to attack NK and Trump will win the election. Her claims tend not to age well.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: tfcrew on December 15, 2020, 07:53:09 PM
 


Is Kin Jon Un dead? This question never goes away.
He just recently did a long address to the people, I think they'd have noticed a fake Kim. 
No one dare talk (https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/Smileys/DarkB/rolleyes.gif) The guy in the video [crying?] looks like a double to me. Esp after seeing earlier videos. Also...the wife seems to be missing---


 Voice of North Korea by Yeonmi Park--------RNK lady who defected to the south. 
Quote
Thank you for helping me to shine a light on the darkest place in the world!
So grateful for your subscription to my channel.



Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on December 16, 2020, 10:01:00 AM
Yeonmi Park

A US asset.

The Strange Tale of Yeonmi Park
A high-profile North Korean defector has harrowing stories to tell. But are they true? (https://thediplomat.com/2014/12/the-strange-tale-of-yeonmi-park/)
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: tfcrew on December 16, 2020, 02:47:13 PM
As a side ...I have been watching this movie [made in South Korea with subtitles] I am totally...completely impressed with the entire production.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memories_of_the_Sword

 
 
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on December 17, 2020, 11:44:55 AM
If you like Korean films, especially with North Korea as a subject, look up Crash Landing on You, it's on Netflix. It's a great watch.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Wiz on December 28, 2020, 10:17:27 PM
Yeonmi Park

A US asset.

The Strange Tale of Yeonmi Park
A high-profile North Korean defector has harrowing stories to tell. But are they true? (https://thediplomat.com/2014/12/the-strange-tale-of-yeonmi-park/)

Clearly not very convincing narrative and Definitely a US propaganda Asset!

The comments below are from the article of the link you gave above:

"Yeonmi Park is backed by the American Libertarian non-profit organization, Atlas Foundation. She’s one of its Young Voices and has recently started her own foundation based in New York – you can donate online through PayPal, but what exactly your money will be used for is not clear. What is clear though, is that “Yeonmi is travelling and speaking in 2014” and “is available for international speeches.”

“I want the world to know my story so they will know and remember the story of North Korea” the foundation’s website reads.

But can the world rely on the memory of a 21 year old who left North Korea when she was thirteen? And what are the consequences if her memory has failed her and the picture she’s presenting of her life in North Korea and her escape to South Korea is not accurate?"


 :reading:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Contrarian on June 18, 2021, 02:23:41 AM
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on January 04, 2022, 03:16:28 AM
https://www.telegraaf.nl/nieuws/1826007172/noord-koreaanse-overloper-kon-met-zijn-baan-als-schoonmaker-nauwelijks-de-kost-verdienen

Looks like someone from North Korea defected to the south and after a year went back because he could not earn enough to buy food with his job as a cleaner.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on January 04, 2022, 10:27:40 AM
The article notes 30 people have been recorded as returning under their own steam in the past ten years. I bet Yeonmi Park won't be making a video on that.  :prophead:
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Markje on January 04, 2022, 10:32:06 AM
The article notes 30 people have been recorded as returning under their own steam in the past ten years. I bet Yeonmi Park won't be making a video on that.  :prophead:

I liked the part about how he crossed the border twice and nobody saw him do it
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Manny on January 04, 2022, 11:37:43 AM
If you look at the DMZ, where the blue houses are, I don't think it'd be so hard.

(https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28510.0;attach=60720;image)

(https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28510.0;attach=60722;image)

Certainly not if you're a border guard. Or are repairing the blue houses or can otherwise access the inside of them or the area. Or have another valid reason to be there.

There's no fence there. Even if you make a run for it from the bottom of the steps, it's only maybe 50 yards. Those guards aren't exactly on high alert. They are mostly smoking and chatting.

This is looking from the South side.

(https://i.ibb.co/2FkMv4q/tr.jpg)

The way the land is laid out near the border is probably quite accessible as it's farmland on both sides of the road with lots of tree cover on the approach road.

(https://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28510.0;attach=60716;image)

The border elsewhere is heavily guarded with cameras and watchtowers. Probably better to do it in plain sight.
Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: 2tallbill on January 04, 2022, 12:04:12 PM
Selfies and Historical Recreation at Korea’s Fake Border
https://www.magnumphotos.com/arts-culture/society-arts-culture/selfies-and-historical-recreation-at-koreas-fake-border/


Title: Re: North Korea.
Post by: Texan77 on January 27, 2024, 07:58:19 AM
I just thought I would make a note here. The big winner in war in Ukraine is North Korea. The selling weapons to Russia has been a big boost to their economy. Who would ever thought that would happen? One of the fastest growing economies in the world.