Omsk, Win, Lose or Draw? My experience

[Chillidog]

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[Chillidog]

Why not? It is Chillidog's desire to waste his time or not. It is obvious that he is in love so I will not wonder if he will go back to her. Looks like everything was his own dream from first place.
He described her not wish to hold his hands but he was writing that his love was growing every day despite of that.

Mirror,

I would not use the word "Love" this is too strong of an emotion, which I was not feeling. Do I like her, Yes, very much, but this is far from love.

Is this all in my mind, "my fantasy" quite possible, only time will tell

[Chillidog]

CD, I want to thank you for your trip reports.

CD... it's not the greatest feeling to be alone - facing a long time "stewing" over what you did "wrong" - IF it didn't work out ....  I hope you got the chance to "clear the air"

I've met women with whom we clicked instantly, only to find we weren't suited and I've had a situation - a bit like yours - where communication was lousy and I "knew" there was no spark - only to find the lady wanted to visit me in my home  to see how I lived.... and it was me that didn't want her...

Gut feelings *can* be misconceptions - and no two people are the same..  treat all the advice you read with a  "pinch of salt" and decide what's best for you....  Don't give up...

msmoby,

thanks for your comments,

I agree with most, but will comment on a couple that I am not in a greement with

1) I do not feel that there was anything I did "wrong" and quite the opposite, that no matter what comes, I have "no regrets"

2) lousy communication--- I disagree with this completely (maybe I did not project this well enough in my trip report) we had absolutely fantastic communication, conversations were always smooth and flowing. and my gut "tells me there is more going on then what is apparent on the surface" and this is why I have not given up, up to this point

my gut says, even without outward throwing me on the bed passion, she is feeling a good connection also.

[blucatz]

my gut says, even without outward throwing me on the bed passion, she is feeling a good connection also.

But, that would have definately curbed any doubts you had about her feelings for you...LOL

[bobjf]

good luck chili,i'm glad my intuition was closer to the mark.

mate just remember that regardless of what some say ,there is no right or wrong way.
everyone is different.
there are no rules about how long it takes,if its right ,it will come around.

cheers
bob

[andrewfi]

The problem now is that you have to start making choices.

If this was a woman you met in your home town you would almost certainly NOT continue the relationship becasue you would know that there are plenty of women who, in potential at least, CAN feel strongly for you or at the least where you can develop the relationship and see how things go.

You are stuck.

To find out more is going to take great resources (and will probably still end up nowhere) or you go with your 'gut feelings' and decide that this the women to whom you offer your passport.

Here is why the closeness of your relationship is important:
Words mean almost nothing, especially when each party has high expectations in terms of outcomes. It is actions that count. If a woman does not feel enough affection to kiss you then that TELLS something. If you have sex but still feel like the loneliest man on the planet, that tells you something - as does the converse!

What you have to go on is almost nothing, given what you have told us here.

Assuming that you have relationships with women in your own community and thus have some recent experience upon which to draw; if this woman was in your community and you went out on a couple of dates and ended up where you are now in terms of actions and feelings, what would you do now?
Would you be thinking of marrying her?
Would you be thinking about your date at the weekend with the other woman you are seeing?
Would you cut her loose as you can see that the thing is not going anyhere?

Treat this as though she lives next door, in terms of how you choose to develop this thing. If your choice is to see here more and see how things go, then, given that she is on the other side of the world then you might well choose to cut her loose and look for someone who makes your heart sing and where your feelings are reciprocated and backed with actions.

This woman likes you, but does not have the important chemical reaction that enforces bonding - basically, she does not fancy you enough to shag you and that will ALWAYS be a problem in your relationship. Think of this - we may stop fancying somebody, but we never START fancying somebody after we know them for longer. The fancying (physical attraction) is there from the outset, or it never will be there.

[bobjf]

you know theses points because 
it takes all kinds to secede in this deal,personally i see an rw who is unsure of the future after a week or 2 of face contact & ph/calls,emails.

you guys are ready to right her off on this basis  ,on what evidence
i get a different feel from chili's report & i'm not surprised at how the woman has reacted & neither is my wife after reading the tr/report.
chili did the right thing with a lady who doesn't want to be rushed into a commitment that is far from being an easy experience, if its meant to be ,it will be.

time line is of no relevance,many couples take ages to reach commitment stage.
neither of them are young & silly,they have both had previous families & life experience to make them think.
nothing good comes easily in life,including the second time around which can be short lived if you don't work at it
it takes 2 to make it work,2 who know they are taking a chance that is even harder in this deal,makes sence to be feeling  comfortable with each other before jumping in.

why does it follow that you wouldn't bother  with a girl in your home town who was cautious just because there are  other fish in the sea.
are you looking for a life partner or not

as for it taking resources,the 1 thing i learned in this deal is you do not make it about resources,you either want it enough to do what ever it takes or your not in it for the right reasons & will probably fail.
nice that you can see into the future & say it will probably still end up nowhere ,mate if i & many others thought that  & walked away we would still be single
we have met many aus/rw couples now ,none of them had the same experience,some came together fast ,others took there time, all did what ever it took to be together.
something all should think about here,there are no hard & fast rules in this deal. there are 2 people involved who have there own thought process's on what works for them.
the day you think you can bend a woman ,specially an rw to only your way of thinking, you'v just bitten off more than you can chew
its a fight you will lose ,believe it
you do whatever it takes to make it work for you as a couple or your headed for disaster.

if i had listened to 1 posting on this forum years ago ,i would not be married now,thankfully others put me straight before i lost my Siberian princess.

[mobyone]

msmoby,

thanks for your comments,

I agree with most, but will comment on a couple that I am not in a greement with

1) I do not feel that there was anything I did "wrong" and quite the opposite, that no matter what comes, I have "no regrets"

2) lousy communication--- I disagree with this completely (maybe I did not project this well enough in my trip report) we had absolutely fantastic communication, conversations were always smooth and flowing. and my gut "tells me there is more going on then what is apparent on the surface" and this is why I have not given up, up to this point

my gut says, even without outward throwing me on the bed passion, she is feeling a good connection also.

Hi Chilli Dog

Glad you're home safe and still posting


I was sure you weren't doing anything "wrong" - you were being you - and that's how you must be... an act is hard to keep up..

Re lousy communication - I meant being able to put across your felings clearly - without an interpreter - "my bad", as you say over there..

You are a brave guy to post your emotions here and all the posters wanted to "help" - and *I'M* sorry that I contributed to a side show of a bun fight - but *I* feel VERY passionate about guys who advise about "Plan B's" and "train wrecks".

Marina, has been honest and polite with you and now what happens over the next two weeks will tell you a lot. You'll know what I mean..

There can be two great people and they just don't spark - no matter how much one partner desires it...

BUT..

..and it is hard - because of the distance - I DO NOT agre with Andrew that there'll "never" be that physical attraction ... I would say it might be less likely.

You could take the "easy"  ( sensible?!)  option, and try to "move on" - but if YOU think there's a chance - no-one should "disuade" you..

I had a similar experience to you and she ended up wanting to be with me and *I* was the one who found someone else.... The path of love / life is never  easy and we all wish you both good luck

[mirror]

Chillidog
I ...gave her a kiss (in front of Yana).

So what Marina did for you on return:smile,kiss,hug...what?

[shakespear]

you guys are ready to right her off on this basis  ,on what evidence   i get a different feel from chili's report & I'm not surprised at how the woman has reacted & neither is my wife after reading the tr/report.  chili did the right thing with a lady who doesn't want to be rushed into a commitment that is far from being an easy experience, if its meant to be ,it will be. 

What more evidence do you need?

"After answering Marina’s questions, I have “1” question to ask her, so with Yana acting as translator, I again asked the question that was most on my mind “does Marina wish/desire to meet me again?” (I wanted no misunderstanding, or miscommunication).

Marina, said 9 days is a very short time to learn and to know a person, (I told her I agree) that she cannot commit to a ’future’ with me, she said that I was great man, and everything in person I was in letters, everything she hoped I would be, but she did not feel ’love’ that it takes time for love to grow, that she could not promise me anything, but that she also has very high hopes and dreams for a future together with me. Again I felt a bond with Marina and before we rejoined Tatiana I put both hands on the sides of Marina’s waist and looked into her eyes and gave her a kiss (in front of Yana)."

What did you expect her to do.  Tell him directly , "No I don't want to see you again because I'm not attracted to you"?  No polite well breed Russian lady would ever do such a thing.  Your "mistake" was expecting a brutally honest answer that would be uncomfortable to deliver and uncomfortable for you to hear.   

The answer he received is CLEARLY a polite Russian blow-off.  If Chilli doesn't understand that now he will if and when he makes plans to head back to visit her a second time in Omsk.

I stand by my original opinion in this thread.  Sorry but sometimes the truth hurts and you can't force someone to be attracted to you.   

[mirror]

shakespear

The answer he received is CLEARLY a polite Russian blow-off.  ...
 Sorry but sometimes the truth hurts and you can't force someone to be attracted to you.   

+1000
Sorry,Chilli    You sound like a good man so don't worry you will find YOUR WOMAN.

[Chillidog]

before I continue with "Day 9" psot I will try to address some of the recent postings

Mirror,

She KISSED back.

Andrew,

thanks for your comments and you are correct, we should look at this as if the woman lives next door/down the street and if we would be interested in dating her again. I do look at it this same way. I epect nothing different from a LDR, in fact there must be much, much more going on to continue or go back to meet a second time.

I think when it goes with relationships, in many instances we must go with our 'gut instinct' even in a local dating scene this is many time all we have to go on.

Shaky,

you bring up many valid points, that I will not argue. Is she 'reserved' or is she a 'polite host'? will I take your advice and be smart or give up on a relationship than is good? will I not listen and crash and burn or discover in future meetings that each is the person we have been waiting for?

msmoby & Bob,

I give both of you and both of your wives big thanks!!!! I wish at times I did not write the trip report as I have (only brief) because I really feel if I have tied my hands and cannot state at this time (today a week after returning home) what is going on in my mind.

Yet I am also glad that I have 'put it out there' this report and my feelings and what I was thinking as it happened. I have recieved great help and feed back from everyone,

Sharky, andrew, Wild orchid, mirror, and all of the rest I appreciate it greatly.

I may have already crashed and burned, already planning my next trip or someting in between?

all i know is everyone's comments/opinions have been valuable and when I am finished with this report will NEED even more everyone's comments/opinions

Thank you everyone

[Chillidog]

Day 9 Wednesday September 24th

Well it is my last day in Omsk. Prior to going to Marina’s apartment to spend our last day together I stop off at a street side flower shop (kiosk) on Маркса across from the building that houses the circus and pick up a small bouquet of flowers for Marina. It contains 3 Red Roses and some other flowers mixed in with greens and wrapped that tinted crinkly plastic (what the other flowers are?) I picked the arrangement that appealed to me the most, and hope she will like it also. I give the flowers to Marina as I enter her apartment and she smiles very big and gives me a kiss. Then she gives me a gift each to bring home for Sherilyn and Samantha (my twin daughters) when she first starts to give me the gifts I start to protest, but she then tells me these are for my daughters, which I of course accept and which also makes me feel really good, for 2 reasons one that she has asked often about my daughters and again shows her heart with these gifts and the 2nd reason because I hate receiving gifts and being the center of attention and it was a relief to me that these gifts were not for me. 

Today we do not have anything in particular planned, I have yet to get some souvenirs for my daughters so I suggest that we go for a walk and while we are out we could prose the different shops for some souvenirs. In previous days I had picked up a book from the Art Museum for my parents (it is written in both Russian and English) and a nice religious figurine type for my Great Aunt (it does not strictly say “Omsk” but feel she will like it and just knowing it was bought in Omsk will make it special for her and my Great Uncle). I was originally going to pick up a couple of Matroshka dolls but while we were out I found some nice hand painted, hand carved jewelry boxes (small). The hand painting was of the bronze statue of the woman sitting on the bench on Ленин, which actually we never visited (I told her next time we must visit these statues).

Today there was a big discussion again between Marina and I about me taking my camera to a photo shop to get pictures printed. Marina did not understand, (we had discussed this yesterday and she said she understood) so again today like we did yesterday use her translation program to clear up the confusion. So as we are shopping/walking around Marina takes me into a shop and tells the worker about my ’camera flash disk” and he takes me over to a display to buy another memory disk for my camera. I tell the sales person and Marina Нет, and walk out. Marina is confused (so am I since she has told me twice she understands) Marina gets on her mobile and calls Yana so I can talk with her and she can explain to Marina. It is eventually straightened out and we find a photo shop that will make actual pictures from my memory disk, and we also pick out a photo album. The pictures will be ready tomorrow for Marina to pick up.

This saves me from sending a package of these photo’s in an album from the States to Russia and have to worry if this shipment will ever arrive at Marian’s house. This brings me a little piece of mind. It also illustrates even when communication is good, some thoughts and ideas may not be understood properly and that patience is a virtue (which Marina and I feel I have also shown with each other).

As we are walking Marina comments that her foot/toe is hurting  (mine would be killing me if I had to walk in those pointed boots these women wear) so we go back to her house to rest her feet. She again prepares tea and again there are cookies on the table and I am told to eat, she is not happy if I eat just one, only if I have a cookie or something in my hand to eat at all times, so I have begun to master the skill of eating these cookies very very very slow, where then she cannot tell me to have another cookie (I feel diabetes 2 kicking in). We discuss my flight tomorrow and how I will need her help to tell the hotel to arrange a ‘wake-up call for me’ and help in arranging a Taxi to take me to the airport. My flight is at 6:50am and so we discuss the best time for each. Marina states that she will call me at 4:45am to be my wake-up call (as she says ‘stand-up’), and that she will call for the taxi, that first the taxi will come to her house to pick her up and then arrive at my hotel to get me, and we feel 5:30am will allow us/me enough time to arrive at the airport and check-in.

With Marina’s foot properly rested, we decide (I insisted) that we go to a restaurant to eat on my last day in Omsk. I enjoyed the food and the atmosphere at the ‘Fancy Restaurant’ we had gone to earlier in the week and suggest this restaurant to Marina; she likes this idea so we walk the few blocks to the restaurant. All the time today I am looking at Marina, trying to permanently imprint a picture of her in my brain. As usual she looks wonderful to me, she of course notices me looking and smiles a lot and asks Что?
Our conversation over dinner is again very good as they have been all week. As a beginner in the Russian language, we learn what the book or program has us learning but you learn a whole new ‘set of words’ ‘phrases’ depending on the person and what they use most frequently in conversation, 9 days is just too short, it feels like we are now just beginning to learn of each other and our time must come to an end, damn this losing 2 days because of travel! I envy those in England or Europe, who do not have to travel 12 time zones and also as this trip was for me, 16 hours spent in the air on 3 different flights.

Dinner ends and before walking Marina home she says she wants to go to the 24 hour supermarket (think more like a convenient size type store) to pick up a few things and also reminds me we have not bought any “Russian Tea” for me to take back with me to the States. We go into the first shop and she goes straight to where they have the tea, after inspection she says this store does not have ‘good Russian tea’ and we leave a walk just a few blocks to the next store. She likes the tea and picks out the tea she has in her house for me and also recommends a couple of others (different fruit tastes) and we pick up the couple of items for her home.

It is getting late, but I try to walk as slow as possible, with my arm around Marina, we eventually arrive at Marina’s apartment around 9:30 she asks if I want to come up, she says Ivan is home, even before hearing this I was going to say “yes” with Ivan home this is good news because I can say my goodbyes to Ivan in person. The three of us have a short but nice conversation (Marina encourages Ivan to speak with me in English) finally it is time to say good-night, I shake Ivan’s hand good-bye and Marina walks me to her front door. I take one last long look into Marina’s crystal clear blue eyes and we kiss goodnight.

[Chillidog]

Pictures,

1st pic----the name of the 'Fancy Restaurant'


2nd pic---the inside of the restaurant

[bobjf]

chili ,ultimately only you can decide to go forward or not.
points made by others are opinions at best & do not always apply to every situation.
i think you need to have a serious think about marina & come to a decision that you can live with.
natasha feels your rw would of told you if she didn't wish to continue,at least consider this is the case before bailing.
i would hate to see you walk away for the wrong reasons
good luck mate,all the best whichever way it goes

[BCKev]

Hey CD! I'm glad you were able to make the trip. I understand from what you've had to say that you are not yet clear about how to proceed with this relationship into the future.

I don't want to get left out to advice offering party, so here's my two bits worth for you to consider: Lots has happened in a short time during your visit. Take your time and reflect on the events. Then make your decision on how to proceed. I get the feeling you're doing this already!  Oh well.

Good luck

[Chillidog]

This is why I would never post anything but a generic trip post. Shake is probably right but like Bobjf I think everyone should let Chili post his entire TR before everyone comments. Making a trip is a very emotional thing for most of us. What really bothers me is guys making judgments without ever making the trip. I really wonder why some guys are on this board as they will never take a step beyond writing women and wasting everyone's time. Those who know me know that I made less than ten posts before I made my trip. I just read the forums and learned everything that I could. But I understand that some guys just can't help themselves as they are experts in everything. Sorry, Chili, for interrupting your thread. I know the mixed feelings you must have had. I had the same thing happen during my first week in Ukraine, before I met Sveta. I wish you the best.

Barry

Barry,

Thanks for your comments, Yes, I guess the generic TR would be taking the 'safe road' but those who know me know I have never taken the safe road. or why would I be doing what we all are attempting to do?

I hope in writing this trip report, I will gain some insight from others, but in all things I must make the my own decisions and be honest with myself, because I am the one looking back at me in the morror every morning,

[mirror]

Chillidog
I hope in writing this trip report, I will gain some insight from others, but in all things I must make the my own decisions and be honest with myself, because I am the one looking back at me in the morror every morning,

I can not say about others but your report made me feel bitterly and sorry for you. Don't get depressed and pessimistic.You are a good man and finaly everything will be the best for you.
Sometimes we have everything in our hands to keep ourselves happy but we are too blind to see it.

We can look from different side -you had a good organised trip to Russia and you learned nearly everything about Russian style of life so now you are experienced man 

[Norwegian Viking]

There is an old saying that Men never leave Women who make them feel good about themselves!

Clearly you are not feeling to good about yourself.

This just further illustrates that Eduards model - pre-screen several - visit several long enough to see their family dynamics and behaviour seems to be the best here.

I am actually seeing red here... 

Once again we're on the same page, Cufflinks!

[Chillidog]

Leaving & my final thoughts

Thursday September 25th,

Marina acts as my alarm clock today calling me at 4:45am as we had discussed and has arranged for a Taxi, which will first pick Marina up and then come to the hotel. The ride to the airport is about 15 minutes so I figured 5:30 for the taxi should give me plenty of time for my 6:50am flight.

We arrive at the airport and I am actually surprised by all of the cars and the number of people at the airport. It is of course a smaller airport so the people are not all spread out but I am still surprised. The outside of the airport terminal is under construction. Marina and I head to an information booth to find where I need to check in (I am sure if we looked around a little longer we could have done this ourselves)

It is my turn to check-in and Marina takes it upon herself to make sure all my flight plans and details are correct and that I understand everything, making sure that I know that when I arrive at London’s Heathrow airport that I will have to collect my luggage there and then check these in again for my last flight home (London to Chicago).

From there we proceed to the security entrance area. We discuss small things, Marina tells me how much she has enjoyed my visit, she also wants to know when I will call her, she says she wants to make sure I am home safe but even more feels she will want to hear my voice again. I take some final photos that due to there not being much light in the building at this time of the morning do not come out very good, but I do not want to play around with the various settings on the camera, and instead concentrate on Marina and our final minutes together.

It is now my turn to go thru security and our time to say our final ‘goodbyes’. I again try to memorize every detail of Marina especially her beautiful face and eyes, I tell Marina that I will miss her, and she smiles, Marina gives me a big embrace and we kiss ’goodbye’

Friday September 26th

All my flights (3) on my return go off without any delays, probably like all others my mind during these flights constantly return to thoughts of the city (Omsk) the places I visited and even more and always my thoughts are about Marina and our time spent together. It did not feel like 9 days, time went by much too fast. I am happy to be back home, but in honesty I am sad to not be in Omsk with Marina.

I feel very good about my efforts, I think bringing with me as gifts the pictures of my house, a book about Chicago, has helped Marina understand better what I had tried to describe in our letters and conversations, if she desires she can now look at these pictures in her own time and pace, she was very happy to bring these photos with her when we went to Tatiana’s, for Tatiana, Yana and Andrei to also view.

I also feel very good at Marina being able to learn of my personality and me as a person.  9 days is way too short to fully understand and learn of a person, and I can fully understand how Marina feels, and not wanting on this first visit to fully commit her feelings and make a lifetime commitment (which I would never ask of myself to do at so early a stage). She is still reserved and guarded in discussing her feelings, and at this time she says “her life is too changeable to make concrete plans for a second visit” but she also adds that “it would be very pleasant to me to see you again” and so I leave with mixed feelings.

I truly believe that she had a wonderful time, and as our time progressed that she has some good strong feelings for me. The risks of a future are greater for her than me, they would not only entail big changes for her but there is the greater concern for her son, his happiness and how these changes would effect him and his life and happiness. So I think her actions are natural and normal.

It is impossible even when trying to detail on paper all of the day’s events, to include all of the little details and feelings that go into making of the day, the little gestures made or words spoken that indicate feelings of happiness or give the impression of being cold and keeping one's distance.

They say that “only fools rush in”, I am also not one to rush in, and went into this trip, knowing if there was chemistry we would still need additional meetings to learn more about each other and before either of us could commit to a life together, that this 1st meeting was to build the foundation of our relationship and be the cornerstone for our future hopes and dreams.

In my heart and in my gut, I feel we accomplished this. We have been able to look inside the other person and have created a bond, but I left Omsk without any certainty of a future meeting, the words "I needed" to feel confident that Marina desires a second meeting and that her hopes and dreams of a future are the same as mine. I had hoped for stronger indications that these hopes and dreams would actually grow stronger for Marina during our time together. I think in very subtle ways she has shown and indicated to me that they have, but of course has not come right out and stated them in a manner that I as a man would even understand.

I am a man in every way so this means I possess the necessary LACK of skills in understanding women and their nature. I feel as confused as ever.

So I ask myself: “Omsk, win, lose, or draw?”

I really do not know. I think only ‘time’ will be the answer to this question.

but my gut instinct is I like the direction in which it is headed.

[Markje]

Hi CD: After reading it all, I have only 1 suggestion: Followup with a second visit on very short notice (within 3 months). I believe that this is the only way to be sure about her feelings.

I do however share other people's concerns that she didn't really warm up. She could of course be a private person and thats where the second visit comes in.

[shakespear]

So I ask myself: “Omsk, win, lose, or draw?”

Oh clearly a "win"

Even if things don't work out with this lady, you've gained valuable experience into the activities of Russians and their culture.  In spite of what the ignorant may write, I'm rooting for your success in this endeavor.  You seem like a nice guy and I'm sure your efforts will be rewarded with eventual success; if not with this fine lady, then with another.

[Ade]

Chillidude,

I also think it was a win.

It's of course difficult for anyone else to judge a situation like this as we're all dependant on your descriptions which, by their very nature, are one sided and very subjective. Still, assuming that what you've written is as accurate as it can be, I'd say that there is at the very least, hope. She certainly doesn't seem like the horrible woman that some people here describe her as : and her behaviour towards you seemed exemplary given the circumstances; not everyone can expect the women they visit for the first time to be jumping for joy and falling over themselves to touch you up.

Assuming that she is attracted to you, her distance may stem from the fact that she's afraid of being hurt and needs to know she can trust you before allowing herself to go to that next level. You are basically a stranger from another country and she's no reason to believe that you are the sort of person you say you are; some people require evidence of that before trusting and another visit in not too long a time may well be enough to show her that. And she has her son to consider too, which I'd bet is a very big consideration.

If nothing else comes out of this, you at least had a nice holiday in good company.

[Manny]

That was an excellent TR, and I thank Chilli for writing it with such honesty! 

I was waiting until he had finished until commenting. I was firmly in the "lose" camp through most of it - although there are a couple of glimmers of hope.

Assuming that she is attracted to you, her distance may stem from the fact that she's afraid of being hurt and needs to know she can trust you before allowing herself to go to that next level. You are basically a stranger from another country and she's no reason to believe that you are the sort of person you say you are; some people require evidence of that before trusting and another visit in not too long a time may well be enough to show her that.

That may be true. It may be her character that she takes longer to open up. She would be odd in that regard - as a Russian - that trait is more of a Western thing in my experience.

Oh clearly a "win"

Even if things don't work out with this lady, you've gained valuable experience into the activities of Russians and their culture.  In spite of what the ignorant may write, I'm rooting for your success in this endeavor.  You seem like a nice guy and I'm sure your efforts will be rewarded with eventual success; if not with this fine lady, then with another.

That is certainly true. The experience he has gained is invaluable. I too am rooting for his success, I am 90/10 sure that it won't be with this woman; let me explain why....

Nobody has openly mentioned this yet, but we are all adults here so maybe someone should: It is my opinion that if the relationship is not consummated on the first visit, then the bottom line is she ain't really into you. Yes she may have actually dug him, and had "issues" that prevented her from doing so, but one reason we go to the FSU is to escape women with "issues" isn't it? Women with "issues" are ten a penny at home - even smokin' hot ones.

If she thinks you are (or might be) "her man", she will "seal the deal" on your first visit. 

I offer proof of my theory above: Ask any married man here if they consummated their relationship on the first visit; I will stick my neck out and say we could count those who didn't on one hand. (If actually any at all.) Furthermore, he almost had to beg for a kiss - that ain't a woman with burning passion in her loins.

Second element: He has left without a plan for a second visit; indeed, she didn't press him for one even - nor did she suggest it. Why? Because she isn't too bothered in my opinion.

I don't recall how old she was (if it was mentioned), but if she is over 35, I can just about believe it may be possible she has trust issues and is waiting for a second visit, and things will go much better then. But that is the 10% of the 90/10 I mentioned above.

My "spidey senses" here are telling me that she enjoyed his company, likes him as a guy and respects him, etc., and she may even marry him if conditions are right in the future. However, she doesn't love him, doesn't find him terribly attractive and if she marries him, it will be because he is a "good man" or a "serious man" and not for the reasons that we Westerners would consider the right reasons. (Russian women will marry a "good man" they do not love - hence all the one-trip K-1 visas.)

I reckon Chilli gauges her mood via correspondence in the coming weeks/months - effectively puts her on the back burner - and seeks a meeting with another woman ASAP. Only after meeting another (or other - multiple) women will he have the clarity of sight to see what he experienced was not ideal; and he could probably do much better.

Advice I always give people is: If a Russian woman is "into you", she will let you know about it pretty quickly. If you have to wonder if she is "into you", she isn't.

Sorry if that's not what you wanted to hear Chilli, but it is my opinion. I am happy to be proved wrong, if I am.

[Norwegian Viking]

Yeah, what Manny said  :

You seem like a nice guy, ChilliDog, and that's a good thing of course. But I think there's a difference between being "nice" and saying "this isn't going to cut it", and I personally wouldn't have spent more time with this lady as I found her suprisingly reserved, so reserved that Manny's analysis seems to be quite right.

I'm sure you can make a lot of RWs go ga-ga, so I personally don't see the point of settling for less than that.

Just  my two cents.