America as a down-spiraling world power

[Markje]

By now, it must be obvious to anyone that the USA is loosing influence in the world.

- Russia's war with Ukraine
- Taiwan / Pelosi ... such a misstake cost the USA much credits in the world
- The decline of the worldwide dollar usage

Even now, Europe/USA's relationship seems more strained.

Veelzeggend is een citaat van de Franse veiligheidsadviseur François Heisbourg: „We beschouwen Amerikaanse inlichtingen niet meteen als een betrouwbare bron.”

Its a quote from the French secret service boss : We do not immediately trust American intelligence
The reasons he gave were :
- Irak and the lies that led eventually to Saddams downfall. We were lied to directly by the USA
- Afghanistan they also got totally wrong, the Taliban's advance after the retreat shows a severe lapse in foreign intelligence.
There are more, I will write them down if asked.

Original article is behind a dutch paywall discussing how the USA knew Russia was going to attack and got it right. That was a surprise to Europe, as they got it wrong so much lately.

Just for completeness sake :
https://www.telegraaf.nl/nieuws/492445434/hoe-de-vs-wist-dat-rusland-oekraine-zou-binnenvallen

[2tallbill]

By now, it must be obvious to anyone that the USA is loosing influence in the world.

- Russia's war with Ukraine
- Taiwan / Pelosi ... such a misstake cost the USA much credits in the world
- The decline of the worldwide dollar usage

Even now, Europe/USA's relationship seems more strained.

Veelzeggend is een citaat van de Franse veiligheidsadviseur François Heisbourg: „We beschouwen Amerikaanse inlichtingen niet meteen als een betrouwbare bron.”

Its a quote from the French secret service boss : We do not immediately trust American intelligence
The reasons he gave were :
- Irak and the lies that led eventually to Saddams downfall. We were lied to directly by the USA
- Afghanistan they also got totally wrong, the Taliban's advance after the retreat shows a severe lapse in foreign intelligence.
There are more, I will write them down if asked.

Original article is behind a dutch paywall discussing how the USA knew Russia was going to attack and got it right. That was a surprise to Europe, as they got it wrong so much lately.

Just for completeness sake :
https://www.telegraaf.nl/nieuws/492445434/hoe-de-vs-wist-dat-rusland-oekraine-zou-binnenvallen

U.S., Taiwan to start formal trade talks under new initiative
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/08/18/us-taiwan-to-start-formal-trade-talks-under-new-initiative.html


US to hold trade talks with Taiwan, island drills military
https://apnews.com/article/taiwan-biden-technology-china-united-states-c1b1509da6c8dafefee03e477452e169

[Bodine]

By now, it must be obvious to anyone that the USA is loosing influence in the world.

- Russia's war with Ukraine
- Taiwan / Pelosi ... such a misstake cost the USA much credits in the world
- The decline of the worldwide dollar usage

Even now, Europe/USA's relationship seems more strained.

Veelzeggend is een citaat van de Franse veiligheidsadviseur François Heisbourg: „We beschouwen Amerikaanse inlichtingen niet meteen als een betrouwbare bron.”

Its a quote from the French secret service boss : We do not immediately trust American intelligence
The reasons he gave were :
- Irak and the lies that led eventually to Saddams downfall. We were lied to directly by the USA
- Afghanistan they also got totally wrong, the Taliban's advance after the retreat shows a severe lapse in foreign intelligence.
There are more, I will write them down if asked.

Original article is behind a dutch paywall discussing how the USA knew Russia was going to attack and got it right. That was a surprise to Europe, as they got it wrong so much lately.

Just for completeness sake :
https://www.telegraaf.nl/nieuws/492445434/hoe-de-vs-wist-dat-rusland-oekraine-zou-binnenvallen

Well, I won’t argue with the content of the message only to say that’s pretty rich for a French-anything to say considering France, under Chirac at the time, was deeply mired in its corruptive ways being the central figure in the oil-for-food scandal, which was the driving force in its opposition in upholding the conditions of the cease fire treaty - which I may add, could’ve avoided the eventual invasion.

[WestCoast]

By now, it must be obvious to anyone that the USA is loosing influence in the world.

- Russia's war with Ukraine
- Taiwan / Pelosi ... such a misstake cost the USA much credits in the world
- The decline of the worldwide dollar usage

Even now, Europe/USA's relationship seems more strained.

Veelzeggend is een citaat van de Franse veiligheidsadviseur François Heisbourg: „We beschouwen Amerikaanse inlichtingen niet meteen als een betrouwbare bron.”

Its a quote from the French secret service boss : We do not immediately trust American intelligence
The reasons he gave were :
- Irak and the lies that led eventually to Saddams downfall. We were lied to directly by the USA
- Afghanistan they also got totally wrong, the Taliban's advance after the retreat shows a severe lapse in foreign intelligence.
There are more, I will write them down if asked.

Original article is behind a dutch paywall discussing how the USA knew Russia was going to attack and got it right. That was a surprise to Europe, as they got it wrong so much lately.

Just for completeness sake :
https://www.telegraaf.nl/nieuws/492445434/hoe-de-vs-wist-dat-rusland-oekraine-zou-binnenvallen

Markje don't know when your article is from. Here is two recent articles. The first article is about the head of French military intelligence, Gen Eric Vidaud, losing his job after failing to predict Russia's war in Ukraine.

The second article criticizes the spooks for not only not seeing the Russian invasion of Ukraine but also for not seeing a coup in Mali and for not seeing that Australia would cancel their deal with France over submarines.

France seems to have lots of problems with spying.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60938538
https://www.politico.eu/article/france-military-intelligence-failure-russia-invasion-ukraine/

[AvHdB]

France seems to have lots of problems with spying.

I assume some have never heard of the Dreyfus Affair.

[WestCoast]

France seems to have lots of problems with spying.

I assume some have never heard of the Dreyfus Affair.

Something a little more recent is the sinking of the ship the Rainbow Warrior by the French intelligence services.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinking_of_the_Rainbow_Warrior

[Markje]

By now, it must be obvious to anyone that the USA is loosing influence in the world.

- Russia's war with Ukraine
- Taiwan / Pelosi ... such a misstake cost the USA much credits in the world
- The decline of the worldwide dollar usage

Even now, Europe/USA's relationship seems more strained.

Veelzeggend is een citaat van de Franse veiligheidsadviseur François Heisbourg: „We beschouwen Amerikaanse inlichtingen niet meteen als een betrouwbare bron.”

Its a quote from the French secret service boss : We do not immediately trust American intelligence
The reasons he gave were :
- Irak and the lies that led eventually to Saddams downfall. We were lied to directly by the USA
- Afghanistan they also got totally wrong, the Taliban's advance after the retreat shows a severe lapse in foreign intelligence.
There are more, I will write them down if asked.

Original article is behind a dutch paywall discussing how the USA knew Russia was going to attack and got it right. That was a surprise to Europe, as they got it wrong so much lately.

Just for completeness sake :
https://www.telegraaf.nl/nieuws/492445434/hoe-de-vs-wist-dat-rusland-oekraine-zou-binnenvallen

Markje don't know when your article is from. Here is two recent articles. The first article is about the head of French military intelligence, Gen Eric Vidaud, losing his job after failing to predict Russia's war in Ukraine.

The second article criticizes the spooks for not only not seeing the Russian invasion of Ukraine but also for not seeing a coup in Mali and for not seeing that Australia would cancel their deal with France over submarines.

France seems to have lots of problems with spying.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60938538
https://www.politico.eu/article/france-military-intelligence-failure-russia-invasion-ukraine/

You're missing the point. Europe used to trust the fbi/cia without question. No more.

Article was posted this morning 10.30 am.

[AJ]

Pelosi (whom.i loathe) was on an asian country tour announced prior.
a stop in a country we do a lot of trade with, and have concerns regarding ,seemed usual

China actually saying they would not *allow* a visit to taiwan  was silly, remains silly. And since they took none of the drastic actions they stated they would, they look silly.

If that portrays  usa weakness or  promotes countries not wanting to trade with the usa that would be interesting,considering china still actively  trades with the usa.

Did they sanction america?

They seemingly sure blew a lot of hot air over nothing.
And they do appear weaker afterwards.

Oils at $86, same old,same old.

(And unfortunately as it may seem to some.still indexed by USD)

[Markje]

Pelosi (whom.i loathe) was on an asian country tour announced prior.
a stop in a country we do a lot of trade with, and have concerns regarding ,seemed usual

Except it isn't a country, if you lookup the world maps, it is a part of China. Only 13 countries out of 139 say its a different country.

China actually saying they would not *allow* a visit to taiwan  was silly, remains silly. And since they took none of the drastic actions they stated they would, they look silly.

Except China has jurisdiction over its own territory as seen by the USA. I'm surprised that point is lost even on lawyers like B.B. Ofcourse Taiwan should be supported, but officially China is in charge there. If USA recognises taiwan as a country, that all changes. But they don't do that!

Did they sanction america?

No? They also didn't say they would sanction america. they said they would 'punish' America.

They seemingly sure blew a lot of hot air over nothing.
And they do appear weaker afterwards.

No, they very validly complain Pelosis visit broke the law. Of course America is not going to prosecute, but the world is watching and aint liking it. If you do not respect sovereignity of such big powerful countries, perhaps it will be time to do something about that.

Oils at $86, same old,same old.

(And unfortunately as it may seem to some.still indexed by USD)

Tried to buy a car in the USA lately? have you seen the time between order/delivery rise ? If i wanted to buy a car today , new in netherlands, I'd wait 6 months for it to roll out of a factory.

When I inquire about that, you know what they said? Sorry, no computer chips are installed yet, there's a shortage. Do you know who builds 90% of those chips? thats Taiwan. And gee, look at that, China is blockading Taiwan with some military navy excercises. Dunno about you, but it seems punishment is underway but it takes some time to start feeling it.


Mark.

[AJ]

China is indeed blockading itself.
That seems a circular argument no?

Yeap chips are mostly tawain produced,not china produced ,and its been that way for some.time.

I have several vendors in Taiwan.
Oddly I view those products as made in taiwan not china, and the PC has always been superior, but I do understand your legal  point
As yes I know china doesnt recognize it as sovereign..

I'm curious if they would have forbid a visit from.Pelosi to China,  that seems a big tricky?

As far as vehicles here ,I  recently bought a new one,no wait.
🤷‍♂️

There are 4 dealerships within a mile of me they all have mostly full.lots

But I do know some models have had these delays ever since covid,and some dealers have struggled with enough inventory.

Still if you wwnt a new car it would be very little  issue unless you spec a certain model with speciific trim package or color.

What i bought was actually in high demand, and there werent many,but there were some in stock at several.places.


My own parts supply from.taiwan has remained ok,but slower.
I'd imagine that will change to a dwindle or stop.

[Contrarian]

China is indeed blockading itself.
That seems a circular argument no?

Yeap chips are mostly tawain produced,not china produced ,and its been that way for some.time.

I have several vendors in Taiwan.
Oddly I view those products as made in taiwan not china, and the PC has always been superior, but I do understand your legal  point
As yes I know china doesnt recognize it as sovereign..

I'm curious if they would have forbid a visit from.Pelosi to China,  that seems a big tricky?

As far as vehicles here ,I  recently bought a new one,no wait.
🤷‍♂️

There are 4 dealerships within a mile of me they all have mostly full.lots

But I do know some models have had these delays ever since covid,and some dealers have struggled with enough inventory.

Still if you wwnt a new car it would be very little  issue unless you spec a certain model with speciific trim package or color.

What i bought was actually in high demand, and there werent many,but there were some in stock at several.places.


My own parts supply from.taiwan has remained ok,but slower.
I'd imagine that will change to a dwindle or stop.

I heard a rumor that a factory in Northern Germany makes the tools that makes the chips and that the factory mysteriously had a very damaging fire. Has anyone heard the same rumor? Seems like a rumor that Mark or someone else in Europe would be more aware of.

As far as China and Taiwan, the weak Biden administration put off a test of Nuclear weapons, apparently as some sort of concession to Communist China.


https://www.heritage.org/defense/commentary/biden-administration-cancels-routine-missile-test-appease-adversary-again

[AvHdB]

Contrain is largely correct in that a majority of chip manufactures are in Taiwan based.

Another producer of chip manufacturing machines is a spin of Phillips called ASML and they have not done any business with mainland China.

[B.B.]

I'm surprised that point is lost even on lawyers like B.B.

B/B fully understands the difference between diplomacy and Realpolitik.

B/B

[Markje]

I'm surprised that point is lost even on lawyers like B.B.

B/B fully understands the difference between diplomacy and Realpolitik.

B/B

Sure, unofficially you can support Taiwan, but officially China still has a point. If the USA will finally recognise Taiwan, other countries may follow suit. As it is now, only 13 countries in the entire world recognise Taiwan. And those 13 aren't the big or prosperous ones

[WestCoast]

Yeap chips are mostly tawain produced,not china produced ,and its been that way for some.time.

If China took over Taiwan it's unlikely the world would continue buying chips being produced in a Taiwan occupied and run by China.

[Texan77]

If China took over Taiwan it's unlikely the world would continue buying chips being produced in a Taiwan occupied and run by China.

The company that produces the most advanced chips in Taiwan is building a plant in the USA. If China takes over, they plan to destroy the plant in Taiwan. This is done to give the Chinese one less reason to invade Tiawan.

[WestCoast]

If China took over Taiwan it's unlikely the world would continue buying chips being produced in a Taiwan occupied and run by China.

The company that produces the most advanced chips in Taiwan is building a plant in the USA. If China takes over, they plan to destroy the plant in Taiwan. This is done to give the Chinese one less reason to invade Tiawan.

I read that recently. Don't know how big the plant is. Is it possible to completely destroy the plant and all the IP if China invades?

[Texan77]

If China took over Taiwan it's unlikely the world would continue buying chips being produced in a Taiwan occupied and run by China.

The company that produces the most advanced chips in Taiwan is building a plant in the USA. If China takes over, they plan to destroy the plant in Taiwan. This is done to give the Chinese one less reason to invade Tiawan.

I read that recently. Don't know how big the plant is. Is it possible to completely destroy the plant and all the IP if China invades?

Only need to destroy a few pieces of high-tech equipment in the plant and a few computer systems. The computer systems hold the designs of the chips and the high-tech systems that do the extra fine printing on the wafers. Then maybe start a fire in the fab areas to ruin what is left. There is no reason to bring down the whole building.

[Wiz]

By now, it must be obvious to anyone that the USA is loosing influence in the world.

- Russia's war with Ukraine
- Taiwan / Pelosi ... such a misstake cost the USA much credits in the world
- The decline of the worldwide dollar usage

Even now, Europe/USA's relationship seems more strained.

Veelzeggend is een citaat van de Franse veiligheidsadviseur François Heisbourg: „We beschouwen Amerikaanse inlichtingen niet meteen als een betrouwbare bron.”

Its a quote from the French secret service boss : We do not immediately trust American intelligence
The reasons he gave were :
- Irak and the lies that led eventually to Saddams downfall. We were lied to directly by the USA
- Afghanistan they also got totally wrong, the Taliban's advance after the retreat shows a severe lapse in foreign intelligence.
There are more, I will write them down if asked.

Original article is behind a dutch paywall discussing how the USA knew Russia was going to attack and got it right. That was a surprise to Europe, as they got it wrong so much lately.

Just for completeness sake :
https://www.telegraaf.nl/nieuws/492445434/hoe-de-vs-wist-dat-rusland-oekraine-zou-binnenvallen

Economist Richard Wolff & Lee Camp!

[2tallbill]

By now, it must be obvious to anyone that the USA is loosing influence in the world.

How many of these threads do we need on the forum?
You could have posted your insights on one of the dozen
existing threads. 

The Nedderlands hasn't had influence in the world since they
traded some glass beads to the American Indians for
Manhattan island, then lost it after getting into another
silly European war.

[WestCoast]

By now, it must be obvious to anyone that the USA is loosing influence in the world.

- Russia's war with Ukraine
- Taiwan / Pelosi ... such a misstake cost the USA much credits in the world
- The decline of the worldwide dollar usage

Even now, Europe/USA's relationship seems more strained.

Veelzeggend is een citaat van de Franse veiligheidsadviseur François Heisbourg: „We beschouwen Amerikaanse inlichtingen niet meteen als een betrouwbare bron.”

Its a quote from the French secret service boss : We do not immediately trust American intelligence
The reasons he gave were :
- Irak and the lies that led eventually to Saddams downfall. We were lied to directly by the USA
- Afghanistan they also got totally wrong, the Taliban's advance after the retreat shows a severe lapse in foreign intelligence.
There are more, I will write them down if asked.

Original article is behind a dutch paywall discussing how the USA knew Russia was going to attack and got it right. That was a surprise to Europe, as they got it wrong so much lately.

Just for completeness sake :
https://www.telegraaf.nl/nieuws/492445434/hoe-de-vs-wist-dat-rusland-oekraine-zou-binnenvallen

Do you really think the US is losing influence? You're living and working in the Netherlands under the protection of NATO meaning the US when you could be living and working in Russia with your inlaws.

You must feel safe in the Netherlands otherwise you'd have moved to Russia. Correct?

[BC]

Maybe influence is the wrong word.

IMO prestige might be a better word.  I'd say rather tarnished and worn.

Mainly with the invasion of Iraq and our more recent political divide.  Obama being elected was a nice bounce, and Trump hung out all our dirty laundry and the darker side of American democracy.

US involvement in NATO enables the projection of US power overseas and is part of its national defense strategy. The US is one of the 30 NATO members.

[WestCoast]

Maybe influence is the wrong word.

IMO prestige might be a better word.  I'd say rather tarnished and worn.

Mainly with the invasion of Iraq and our more recent political divide.  Obama being elected was a nice bounce, and Trump hung out all our dirty laundry and the darker side of American democracy.

US involvement in NATO enables the projection of US power overseas and is part of its national defense strategy. The US is one of the 30 NATO members.

Do you think Russia lost any prestige for their time in Afghanistan? What about the Chechen wars? What about the invasion of Donbass or the seizing of Crimea in 2014? What about the current war with Ukraine?

In your opinion have these events enhanced or diminished Russia's prestige in the global community?

[BC]

Maybe influence is the wrong word.

IMO prestige might be a better word.  I'd say rather tarnished and worn.

Mainly with the invasion of Iraq and our more recent political divide.  Obama being elected was a nice bounce, and Trump hung out all our dirty laundry and the darker side of American democracy.

US involvement in NATO enables the projection of US power overseas and is part of its national defense strategy. The US is one of the 30 NATO members.

Do you think Russia lost any prestige for their time in Afghanistan? What about the Chechen wars? What about the invasion of Donbass or the seizing of Crimea in 2014? What about the current war with Ukraine?

In your opinion have these events enhanced or diminished Russia's prestige in the global community?

WC,

I'll stick to the topic at hand.  You are, of course, free to start a new topic instead of distractions here.

[Markje]

Maybe influence is the wrong word.

IMO prestige might be a better word.  I'd say rather tarnished and worn.

Mainly with the invasion of Iraq and our more recent political divide.  Obama being elected was a nice bounce, and Trump hung out all our dirty laundry and the darker side of American democracy.

US involvement in NATO enables the projection of US power overseas and is part of its national defense strategy. The US is one of the 30 NATO members.

If you read the comments from the opening post, influence  is the correct word. Where france first trusted the usa at face value, now they double check all intel gathered from their own sources.

And thats just 1 clear example.