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Author Topic: Quick Exit from Afghanistan  (Read 246 times)

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Online Steveboy

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Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« on: May 04, 2022, 11:37:27 PM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb
I support no government anywhere, ever, never. No institution, No religion!!

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #1 on: May 05, 2022, 08:50:52 AM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb

Seriously, Yahoo source.

Buzzz .... and thank you for playing.  :8)
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Offline B.B.

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #2 on: May 05, 2022, 11:29:58 AM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb

We had Afghanistan locked down with 2k troops.  So less that 1/5 of one percent of the US Active Duty military.

So this idea gets a "no" from me.

B/B
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Online Texan77

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2022, 01:49:03 PM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb

The military spending in this war in Ukraine will cost the USA much less than the cost of rising gasoline or food. USA military budget is 800 billion and so far, we have sent 2.8 billion dollars of stuff. It is true we are talking about sending much more in near future but that is still being argued in Congress. 

The war in Afghanistan was very small after the first year or so.
3) There has been no "threat" to invade Ukraine. The US invented that and fed it to a complicit media.

Offline Jonas!

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2022, 02:41:29 PM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb

The military spending in this war in Ukraine will cost the USA much less than the cost of rising gasoline or food.
Perhaps that is true although currently we have all the costs...war costs, rising food, and rising gas.  Had we not encouraged war, and facilitated peace we would probably have none of the above costs...and tens of thousands wouldn't be dead, and the landscape wouldn't be ruined possibly for generations.     I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources.   

Jonas!   

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2022, 12:20:14 AM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb

The military spending in this war in Ukraine will cost the USA much less than the cost of rising gasoline or food.
Perhaps that is true although currently we have all the costs...war costs, rising food, and rising gas.  Had we not encouraged war, and facilitated peace we would probably have none of the above costs...and tens of thousands wouldn't be dead, and the landscape wouldn't be ruined possibly for generations.     I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources.   

Jonas!

I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources. So just doing what the US has been doing for years.. But there will be plenty of contracts for US firms to re build Ukraine and of course most importantly re arm it..

Mean while the average person in Ukraine will probably still not have much out of all of this ..
I support no government anywhere, ever, never. No institution, No religion!!

Offline Jonas!

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2022, 07:40:00 AM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb

The military spending in this war in Ukraine will cost the USA much less than the cost of rising gasoline or food.
Perhaps that is true although currently we have all the costs...war costs, rising food, and rising gas.  Had we not encouraged war, and facilitated peace we would probably have none of the above costs...and tens of thousands wouldn't be dead, and the landscape wouldn't be ruined possibly for generations.     I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources.   

Jonas!

I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources. So just doing what the US has been doing for years.. But there will be plenty of contracts for US firms to re build Ukraine and of course most importantly re arm it..

Mean while the average person in Ukraine will probably still not have much out of all of this ..
Keep all the Ukraine resources out of the west's hands...driving the price of bread and wheat products up a lot already. 
If the US can go around seizing Russian businessman's yachts willy-nilly I guess Russia can seize Ukraine crops. 

Jonas! 

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2022, 08:02:32 AM »
It's the disruption of war that will cause the future crop shortages there.
 Although Russia has already seized tons of grain from storage in kherson and zap oblast regions.  Even made new regulatiins entitling* them to do so.

And then there is the complete looting-
You see the 3 to 5 million in new tractors and combines stolen from a john deere dealership ,and shipped by train to Chechnya?
They were.geo located to grozny and electronically disabled.
They still sit there.


While  I'm zero fan of  confiscating oligarchs yachts without due process.

I think crops snd equipment stolen  that feed many nations, and a billionaires toy are a bit removed from each other.

As a point of law,and ethics  I disagree with all of them.

As a point of reality,  during a time of war  , the two are different.

Both are theft though.



.




Offline Jonas!

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2022, 08:15:12 AM »
While  I'm zero fan of  confiscating oligarchs yachts without due process.

I think crops snd equipment stolen  that feed many nations, and a billionaires toy are a bit removed from each other.

As a point of law,and ethics  I disagree with all of them.

As a point of reality,  during a time of war  , the two are different.

Both are theft though.
Since Russia is now in possession of the crops they can sell them and receive the money they are now worth, and with that money they can buy new yachts that were stolen from their business people.  They can forget about the yachts and buy something more useful in today's world. 
Jonas! 

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2022, 08:32:01 AM »
You see the 3 to 5 million in new tractors and combines stolen from a john deere dealership ,and shipped by train to Chechnya?

There's a reason those john deere were at the dealership and not sold somewhere. They are very unpopular because of the antics played by the Factory John Deere.

Repairing them is nigh impossible unless you have an expensive john-deere-maintenance-contract which will let john deere repair them and they are out of comission for days sometimes weeks not earning money instead of repaired on-site as their competitors do. No if they keep this up JD will go out of business soon.

Put in expensive "operator licenses" or they will not work at all because the software will be locked (which is what happened to the stolen trucks by Russia). And some other nightmares and the picture is complete.

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2022, 09:44:55 AM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb

The military spending in this war in Ukraine will cost the USA much less than the cost of rising gasoline or food.
Perhaps that is true although currently we have all the costs...war costs, rising food, and rising gas.  Had we not encouraged war, and facilitated peace we would probably have none of the above costs...and tens of thousands wouldn't be dead, and the landscape wouldn't be ruined possibly for generations.     I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources.   

Jonas!

I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources. So just doing what the US has been doing for years.. But there will be plenty of contracts for US firms to re build Ukraine and of course most importantly re arm it..

Mean while the average person in Ukraine will probably still not have much out of all of this ..
Keep all the Ukraine resources out of the west's hands...driving the price of bread and wheat products up a lot already. 
If the US can go around seizing Russian businessman's yachts willy-nilly I guess Russia can seize Ukraine crops. 

Jonas!

Some do not understand the legal concept/principle of ‘Ill gotten gains’.

Simply illustrated if you rob grand ma and buy a watch with the proceeds, if caught you loose said watch, if you rob a bank and buy a fancy car upon verdict guilty the car is no longer yours. If you plunder the assets of a nation and purchase a yacht than that vessel is fair game for being arrested.

The powers to be, primarily the United Kingdom and the United States, will follow the letter of law and let the seizure follow the meandering path of the legal river. I suspect some Russians will be able to prevail and reclaim there yachts and properties.
“If you aren't in over your head, how do you know how tall you are?” T.S. Eliot

Online AJ

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2022, 10:11:52 AM »
You see the 3 to 5 million in new tractors and combines stolen from a john deere dealership ,and shipped by train to Chechnya?

There's a reason those john deere were at the dealership and not sold somewhere. They are very unpopular because of the antics played by the Factory John Deere.

Repairing them is nigh impossible unless you have an expensive john-deere-maintenance-contract which will let john deere repair them and they are out of comission for days sometimes weeks not earning money instead of repaired on-site as their competitors do. No if they keep this up JD will go out of business soon.

Put in expensive "operator licenses" or they will not work at all because the software will be locked (which is what happened to the stolen trucks by Russia). And some other nightmares and the picture is complete.

Mark.

Yeap,  I'm a u.s. midwest breadbasket resident,and grandson of two farmers with about 7 great uncles that all farmed. (And most all my  cousins still do)
Im.aware of john Deere's apple like polices, their proprietary software and their need for being serviced at an authorized dealership .
Its compounded by them.not having enough service personal.
Huge problem here and I'm sure moreso  in Ukraine.

Doesnt change much about  them being  looted/stolen,
Dealerships carry inventory  regardless brand.
They were solvent dealership so had to be selling something, ,  and purchising them direct or on thier floorplan financing with john deere, or it would have been taken back  by john deere and sent to dealerships elsewhere .

The fact they were looted,  transported and put on a train to Chechnya  is a bit higher level of looting though ;)

As much as john Deere's software sucks for the end user,
 the irony is that it is not easy or cheap to over come for the looters.

They are likely better off breaking them.down and selling as parts .

I feel really sorry for them to have to go through such hassles,all because john deere sucks.

🤣






Online AJ

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2022, 10:27:37 AM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb

The military spending in this war in Ukraine will cost the USA much less than the cost of rising gasoline or food.
Perhaps that is true although currently we have all the costs...war costs, rising food, and rising gas.  Had we not encouraged war, and facilitated peace we would probably have none of the above costs...and tens of thousands wouldn't be dead, and the landscape wouldn't be ruined possibly for generations.     I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources.   

Jonas!

I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources. So just doing what the US has been doing for years.. But there will be plenty of contracts for US firms to re build Ukraine and of course most importantly re arm it..

Mean while the average person in Ukraine will probably still not have much out of all of this ..
Keep all the Ukraine resources out of the west's hands...driving the price of bread and wheat products up a lot already. 
If the US can go around seizing Russian businessman's yachts willy-nilly I guess Russia can seize Ukraine crops. 

Jonas!

Some do not understand the legal concept/principle of ‘Ill gotten gains’.

Simply illustrated if you rob grand ma and buy a watch with the proceeds, if caught you loose said watch, if you rob a bank and buy a fancy car upon verdict guilty the car is no longer yours. If you plunder the assets of a nation and purchase a yacht than that vessel is fair game for being arrested.

The powers to be, primarily the United Kingdom and the United States, will follow the letter of law and let the seizure follow the meandering path of the legal river. I suspect some Russians will be able to prevail and reclaim there yachts and properties.


AV,
I understand the concept .
It used often for all kinds of things.

Typically it is thru some due process.

I do get that often its confiscating up front without due process.
But is followed up with legal.proceedings and can be returned.

I dont see the due process portion of that  here .

If political leanings prove *ill gotten gains* ,despite any time line for when or how those gains werec aquitlred  I completely disagree with that concept.

I drug dealers yacht being confiscated is a tad.different  ,when no other income suffucient enough to.procure it can be shown.

Weaponizing that into the political.arena is incredibly slippery slope.





Offline Jonas!

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2022, 10:31:37 AM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb

The military spending in this war in Ukraine will cost the USA much less than the cost of rising gasoline or food.
Perhaps that is true although currently we have all the costs...war costs, rising food, and rising gas.  Had we not encouraged war, and facilitated peace we would probably have none of the above costs...and tens of thousands wouldn't be dead, and the landscape wouldn't be ruined possibly for generations.     I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources.   

Jonas!

I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources. So just doing what the US has been doing for years.. But there will be plenty of contracts for US firms to re build Ukraine and of course most importantly re arm it..

Mean while the average person in Ukraine will probably still not have much out of all of this ..
Keep all the Ukraine resources out of the west's hands...driving the price of bread and wheat products up a lot already. 
If the US can go around seizing Russian businessman's yachts willy-nilly I guess Russia can seize Ukraine crops. 

Jonas!

Some do not understand the legal concept/principle of ‘Ill gotten gains’.

Simply illustrated if you rob grand ma and buy a watch with the proceeds, if caught you loose said watch, if you rob a bank and buy a fancy car upon verdict guilty the car is no longer yours. If you plunder the assets of a nation and purchase a yacht than that vessel is fair game for being arrested.

The powers to be, primarily the United Kingdom and the United States, will follow the letter of law and let the seizure follow the meandering path of the legal river. I suspect some Russians will be able to prevail and reclaim there yachts and properties.


I just don't the US and UK are in position to be arbiters of what is just or not.   The yachts were private property with excellent value.   Prior to the war they were free to roam the seas, suddenly they are 'ill gotten gains'.   I think the fact is that the West would like to punish Russia however they can.  That has much more to do with them being confiscated than anything regarding law and order.

We (The West) have lots of vulnerable assets and I think they are all in greater jeopardy than before.  We chose to escalate on this particular front.   

Jonas!   

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2022, 02:10:55 PM »
Both AJ and Jonas have valid points. It does not change how the funds were obtained to acquire said vessel. Certainly I suspect the UK & US courts will follow the law.

There is another fear that I have, owning or maintaining a mega yacht is expensive, seriously expensive. If the daily and required maintenance is not conducted, the value of said vessels will decline substantially and in fact quickly.
“If you aren't in over your head, how do you know how tall you are?” T.S. Eliot

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #15 on: May 06, 2022, 04:18:51 PM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb

The military spending in this war in Ukraine will cost the USA much less than the cost of rising gasoline or food.
Perhaps that is true although currently we have all the costs...war costs, rising food, and rising gas.  Had we not encouraged war, and facilitated peace we would probably have none of the above costs...and tens of thousands wouldn't be dead, and the landscape wouldn't be ruined possibly for generations.     I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources.   

Jonas!

I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources. So just doing what the US has been doing for years.. But there will be plenty of contracts for US firms to re build Ukraine and of course most importantly re arm it..

Mean while the average person in Ukraine will probably still not have much out of all of this ..
Keep all the Ukraine resources out of the west's hands...driving the price of bread and wheat products up a lot already. 
If the US can go around seizing Russian businessman's yachts willy-nilly I guess Russia can seize Ukraine crops. 

Jonas!

Some do not understand the legal concept/principle of ‘Ill gotten gains’.

Simply illustrated if you rob grand ma and buy a watch with the proceeds, if caught you loose said watch, if you rob a bank and buy a fancy car upon verdict guilty the car is no longer yours. If you plunder the assets of a nation and purchase a yacht than that vessel is fair game for being arrested.

The powers to be, primarily the United Kingdom and the United States, will follow the letter of law and let the seizure follow the meandering path of the legal river. I suspect some Russians will be able to prevail and reclaim there yachts and properties.


When this is all over I'm sure many oligarchs and possible even the Russian government are going to hire some very pricey lawyers in the UK, EU, the US and other countries and sue those responsible, probably the federal governments, for seizing their assets.

What would be the ultimate irony is if the Russian government sued in some countries and won. What would the UK government do if they had to pay, not only a number of oligarchs but also the Russian government, millions of pounds for seizing the properties?

One thing you can bet will not happen is that the Russian federal government will lose any suit filed against it for seizing the Russian based property of foreign companies. No Russian court is going to tell Putin he was wrong. 
Ipsa scientia potestas est. Knowledge itself is power.   Sir Francis Bacon

Online AvHdB

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Re: Quick Exit from Afghanistan
« Reply #16 on: May 06, 2022, 04:24:35 PM »
I wonder why the US got out of Afghanistan so fast like over night!!

Maybe it was all part of a plan knowing they will have bigger war to fight very soon..Cant afford to big wars to fund..

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/escalation-ukraine-part-us-strategy-090004856.html?soc_src=social-sh&soc_trk=fb&tsrc=fb

The military spending in this war in Ukraine will cost the USA much less than the cost of rising gasoline or food.
Perhaps that is true although currently we have all the costs...war costs, rising food, and rising gas.  Had we not encouraged war, and facilitated peace we would probably have none of the above costs...and tens of thousands wouldn't be dead, and the landscape wouldn't be ruined possibly for generations.     I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources.   

Jonas!

I think Russia will ruin Ukraine before they permit the west to make use of ANY of it's resources. So just doing what the US has been doing for years.. But there will be plenty of contracts for US firms to re build Ukraine and of course most importantly re arm it..

Mean while the average person in Ukraine will probably still not have much out of all of this ..
Keep all the Ukraine resources out of the west's hands...driving the price of bread and wheat products up a lot already. 
If the US can go around seizing Russian businessman's yachts willy-nilly I guess Russia can seize Ukraine crops. 

Jonas!

Some do not understand the legal concept/principle of ‘Ill gotten gains’.

Simply illustrated if you rob grand ma and buy a watch with the proceeds, if caught you loose said watch, if you rob a bank and buy a fancy car upon verdict guilty the car is no longer yours. If you plunder the assets of a nation and purchase a yacht than that vessel is fair game for being arrested.

The powers to be, primarily the United Kingdom and the United States, will follow the letter of law and let the seizure follow the meandering path of the legal river. I suspect some Russians will be able to prevail and reclaim there yachts and properties.


When this is all over I'm sure many oligarchs and possible even the Russian government are going to hire some very pricey lawyers in the UK, EU, the US and other countries and sue those responsible, probably the federal governments, for seizing their assets.

What would be the ultimate irony is if the Russian government sued in some countries and won. What would the UK government do if they had to pay, not only a number of oligarchs but also the Russian government, millions of pounds for seizing the properties?

One thing you can bet will not happen is that the Russian federal government will lose any suit filed against it for seizing the Russian based property of foreign companies. No Russian court is going to tell Putin he was wrong.

I think it is called in Russia the Yukos principle.
“If you aren't in over your head, how do you know how tall you are?” T.S. Eliot


 

 

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