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Author Topic: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"  (Read 1533 times)

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Offline Manny

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The MSM has gone into meltdown the last few days imagining Russia is poised to invade Ukraine. It's been a while since they were pedalling this fantasy, so it was probably due to be recycled. Here's the editorial from the British Sunday Times on the subject:

==========

The Sunday Times view on Russia and Ukraine: The West must fire a warning at Putin

Two Russian tank-landing ships sailed through the Bosporus into the Black Sea yesterday, and satellite photographs revealed a huge new encampment of Russian armour in southern Crimea. Troop trains have been bringing men and materiel to the zone relentlessly. Ukraine is in a frenzy, fearing invasion. Yet nobody outside the presidential suite in the Kremlin is sure what Vladimir Putin is up to or how to respond. Is this just destabilisation, an aggressive feint in his permanent chess game with western powers? Or is he about to resume the assault on Ukraine that has been frozen for the past seven years? President Joe Biden has responded cautiously in public. Is that the right way to deal with a man whom Biden himself has described as a “killer”?

Putin’s macho preening intrigues psychologists of power. He likes it to be known that he learnt to fight dirty when growing up on a tough estate in Leningrad. Little boys are taught to stand up to bullies, but governments rarely do so: too much is at stake, so conflict is ducked until it is unavoidable. There is another way, however: a private but resolute warning that an attack on Ukraine will have consequences far beyond the expulsion of a few Russian spies and financial sanctions on Putin’s cronies. The fast-tracking of Ukraine into Nato, crossing the Russian president’s red line and creating a genuine crisis for him, is dismissed by some in the West as unrealistic. But weakness is no alternative.

Confronting Putin may be too much to ask of Joe Biden, who is still less than 100 days into his presidency and immersed in domestic crises. It is certainly too much to expect of Angela Merkel, drifting at the helm of Europe’s most powerful country and shackled to Russia by the Nord Stream pipeline. Emmanuel Macron hosted President Volodymyr Zelensky of Ukraine in Paris on Friday but is in no mood to act. Boris Johnson is silent. All are weary from the long war against the coronavirus, but the menace in the east cannot be ignored.

==========

A bit more hysteria here from The Mirror:

==========

US warships heading to Black Sea warned to turn away 'for their own good'

Russian deputy foreign minister, Sergei Rabyov, has warned the US Navy to stay away from the Black Sea amid rising tensions between his country and Ukraine

FEARS of an all-out war in East Ukraine ramped up yesterday after Russia warned America
to stay away from the region: “For their own good.”

Deputy foreign minister Sergei Rabyov made his aggressive demand as two US destroyers raced towards the flashpoint region.

USS Donald Cook and USS Roosevelt are due to arrive in the Black Sea today. Ten Russian warships will arrive there in days.

Rabyov accused the US of “provocation” to test Moscow’s “nerves”.

But, in a call to Russian leader Vladimir Putin yesterday, US President Joe Biden voiced concern about a huge Russian military build-up, of close to 100,000 troops, in Crimea and on Ukraine’s borders.

The White House said he also stressed America’s “unwavering commitment to Ukraine’s sovereignty and territorial integrity” and called for a summit meeting.

NATO chief Jens Stoltenburg also pledged the alliance’s “unwavering” support for the government in Kyiv.

As the war of words takes the border to a knife edge, the Mirror can reveal Russian-backed forces have dumped illegal “Butterfly Bombs” in East Ukraine.

The devices were placed near Donestk, where Russian separatists are fighting domestic troops.

As many as 14,000 people have been killed in battles since Russia’s 2014 Crimea annexation.

British and American assessments have logged the situation as reaching “crisis point”.

Ukraine and its allies are trying to track GRU intelligence operatives, working undercover in East Ukraine and stirring up support for Russia.

Six RAF Typhoon jets are bolster-ing Ukraine’s forces. And a small number of British and US special forces are monitoring the situation.

==========

Why our military is involved is a mystery. We have no business messing about on Russia's borders.

One interesting bit touched on above but reported in Politico and elsewhere is this bit:

Quote
The ships, the USS Donald Cook and the USS Roosevelt, are in the Mediterranean Sea conducting maritime security operations, the person said. They were still a few days from the Black Sea when the decision was made to scrap the transit, so they were not forced to abruptly reverse course.

So the US had two warships on the way to the Black Sea in the usual act of provocation, Russia warned them off "for their own good", and they turned around and cleared off again!  :ROFL:

It looks like for all his bellyaching, the old Biden waxwork realises that putting two warships in the Russian sphere of influence might not be such a good idea. At least he got something right.
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2021, 11:14:16 AM »
If anyone has a Times log in (you're only allowed 3 articles a week free), post the full article from here please, it's equally hilarious reading. 
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2021, 03:14:48 PM »
Meanwhile, the USA has withdrawn their hard feces and the ships are going home.

Now Great Brittain is sending 2 boats there :-).

US warships:  https://www.politico.com/news/2021/04/15/us-navy-ukraine-russia-tensions-481897
GB Ships : https://www.newsy-today.com/british-media-great-britain-with-two-warships-to-black-sea/

I especially like how GB are saying that if there's a threat from Russian warships they can respond.

Yeah sure they can, for about 2 seconds ..... and then war will be inevitable.
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2021, 04:00:46 PM »
The drama queens need to sell ink & paper.

From Politico this gives a more responsible view of the situation and the American approach. With out doubt there is both an escalation of attacks by the Russian and there allies in Donbass as well as a substantial buildup of forces on the Russian side. Russia has realized a direct incursion into Ukraine will result in an initial serious casualty count and a drawn out war. 


U.S. drops plans to send destroyers into the Black Sea due to concerns over Russia
The tentative transit was not unusual or designed to send any particular new signal, an official familiar with the plans said.

The Pentagon has scrapped a potential Black Sea transit by two Navy destroyers this week due to concerns about escalating tensions between Russia and Ukraine, according to two U.S. officials familiar with the plans.

Earlier this month, the Navy notified Turkey, which manages traffic through the Bosporus and Dardanelles straits leading to the Black Sea under the 1936 Montreux Convention, that they were tentatively planning a routine transit by the two destroyers, according to a U.S. defense official.

The tentative transit, first reported by CNN, was not unusual or designed to send any particular new signal, as the U.S. Navy typically conducts eight or nine such movements per year, the person said.

But after new fighting erupted in Eastern Europe between Ukrainian soldiers and Russian-backed separatists, officials decided not to undertake the transit to avoid needlessly escalating the situation, the person said.

Naval movements are frequently subject to change due to maintenance or shifting operational plans, the person said. This particular transit was scrapped due to a “myriad” of reasons, including a desire not to provoke Moscow during a delicate time, the person said.

Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu said in an interview with NTV TV that the U.S. had notified Turkey on Wednesday that the ships would not be heading to the Black Sea. Reuters first reported that the movement was called off, quoting diplomatic sources who, like Çavuşoğlu, did not provide a specific reason.

But after new fighting erupted in Eastern Europe between Ukrainian soldiers and Russian-backed separatists, officials decided not to undertake the transit to avoid needlessly escalating the situation, the person said.

Naval movements are frequently subject to change due to maintenance or shifting operational plans, the person said. This particular transit was scrapped due to a “myriad” of reasons, including a desire not to provoke Moscow during a delicate time, the person said.

Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu said in an interview with NTV TV that the U.S. had notified Turkey on Wednesday that the ships would not be heading to the Black Sea. Reuters first reported that the movement was called off, quoting diplomatic sources who, like Çavuşoğlu, did not provide a specific reason.

The Pentagon has declined to discuss the possible transit since the reports first surfaced. “We routinely operate and conduct operations in the Black Sea and throughout the European Command [area of operations],” Pentagon spokesperson John Kirby told reporters last week. “And as you also know, I'm not going to forecast or speak about hypotheticals or about future operations.”

The ships, the USS Donald Cook and the USS Roosevelt, are in the Mediterranean Sea conducting maritime security operations, the person said. They were still a few days from the Black Sea when the decision was made to scrap the transit, so they were not forced to abruptly reverse course.

But some in Kyiv were disappointed that the destroyers would not be traveling to the Black Sea after all, said a former senior Ukrainian official. The show of force from the U.S. in the region would have been welcomed as Russia continues to amass thousands of troops at the eastern Ukrainian border, this person said.

Ukrainian officials are also tracking Russian movements suggesting a buildup along the Kerch Strait Bridge to Crimea. The strait connects the Black Sea to the Sea of Azov, and officials are wary of Russia moving to block access to the Black Sea and link its mainland to Crimea.

Ukraine's Ministry of Foreign Affairs said on Thursday that Russia announced it would be closing part of the Black Sea near the Kerch Strait for foreign warships until October, under the pretense of conducting military exercises. A spokesperson said Russia's actions violate international law and reiterated that Ukraine "has the right to regulate shipping in these waters of the Black Sea."

U.S. officials note that President Joe Biden has repeatedly reaffirmed Washington’s commitment to Ukraine’s territorial integrity and recently approved an additional $125 million worth of lethal aid to help the country defend its borders, including two armed patrol boats and counter-artillery radar.

And NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg said Wednesday during a joint press conference with Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin and Secretary of State Antony Blinken that the organization has increased its military presence in the Black Sea region, including with additional air policing and naval presence.

“We are committed to assisting Ukraine with its self-defense needs,” he said.

Still, the situation is escalating quickly: Russia has sent more than 85,000 troops to the border in recent weeks, and at least seven Ukrainian soldiers have been killed since late last month amid a spike in violence in the Donbass region. Ukrainian government forces have been battling Russia-backed separatists there since 2014.

The G-7 foreign ministers — representing Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, the United Kingdom, the United States and the European Union — condemned Russia's buildup on Ukraine's borders in a Monday statement, saying they were "deeply concerned" by the move.

"These large-scale troop movements, without prior notification, represent threatening and destabilising activities," they wrote. "We call on Russia to cease its provocations and to immediately de-escalate tensions in line with its international obligations."

Meanwhile, Pentagon leaders have been eyeing the Russian military buildup along the border with Ukraine as well as increased Russian activity at sea and in the air.

The commander of U.S. forces in Europe on Thursday predicted there is a "low to medium" likelihood that Russia will invade Ukraine over the next several weeks.

U.S. officials note that President Joe Biden has repeatedly reaffirmed Washington’s commitment to Ukraine’s territorial integrity and recently approved an additional $125 million worth of lethal aid to help the country defend its borders, including two armed patrol boats and counter-artillery radar.

And NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg said Wednesday during a joint press conference with Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin and Secretary of State Antony Blinken that the organization has increased its military presence in the Black Sea region, including with additional air policing and naval presence.

“We are committed to assisting Ukraine with its self-defense needs,” he said.

Still, the situation is escalating quickly: Russia has sent more than 85,000 troops to the border in recent weeks, and at least seven Ukrainian soldiers have been killed since late last month amid a spike in violence in the Donbass region. Ukrainian government forces have been battling Russia-backed separatists there since 2014.

The G-7 foreign ministers — representing Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, the United Kingdom, the United States and the European Union — condemned Russia's buildup on Ukraine's borders in a Monday statement, saying they were "deeply concerned" by the move.

"These large-scale troop movements, without prior notification, represent threatening and destabilising activities," they wrote. "We call on Russia to cease its provocations and to immediately de-escalate tensions in line with its international obligations."

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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2021, 07:42:28 PM »
Meanwhile, the USA has withdrawn their hard feces and the ships are going home.

Now Great Brittain is sending 2 boats there :-).

US warships:  https://www.politico.com/news/2021/04/15/us-navy-ukraine-russia-tensions-481897
GB Ships : https://www.newsy-today.com/british-media-great-britain-with-two-warships-to-black-sea/

I especially like how GB are saying that if there's a threat from Russian warships they can respond.

Yeah sure they can, for about 2 seconds ..... and then war will be inevitable.

Exactly Mark. Two seconds or two minutes, Russia and Putin have had enough of the West playing games in their backyard.

We (the USA) did not like it at all when the Soviets tried arming Cuba with missiles. The Biden Administration and the UK should take a good long look in the mirror. Do they really want to provoke Russia, over there?

As Lavrov recently said, why are the Russians there on the border? Because they live there and it's their right to be there. Unlike the friggen over extended foolish USA. Quite frankly I hope Biden gets his ass handed to him.
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2021, 06:07:13 PM »
Meanwhile, the USA has withdrawn their hard feces and the ships are going home.

Now Great Brittain is sending 2 boats there :-).

US warships:  https://www.politico.com/news/2021/04/15/us-navy-ukraine-russia-tensions-481897
GB Ships : https://www.newsy-today.com/british-media-great-britain-with-two-warships-to-black-sea/

I especially like how GB are saying that if there's a threat from Russian warships they can respond.

Yeah sure they can, for about 2 seconds ..... and then war will be inevitable.

Exactly Mark. Two seconds or two minutes, Russia and Putin have had enough of the West playing games in their backyard.

We (the USA) did not like it at all when the Soviets tried arming Cuba with missiles. The Biden Administration and the UK should take a good long look in the mirror. Do they really want to provoke Russia, over there?

As Lavrov recently said, why are the Russians there on the border? Because they live there and it's their right to be there. Unlike the friggen over extended foolish USA. Quite frankly I hope Biden gets his ass handed to him.

While I understand the point being made. Look at the scenario from a different viewpoint.

Germany sends tank battalions and masses regiments on the border of France and Belgium where there are German speakers living to 'protect' them.

Or Mexico sends military forces to the border with Texas and California, where there is Spanish speaking population present in the North, because they needed to be liberated from an oppressive government.   
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2021, 08:31:58 PM »
Meanwhile, the USA has withdrawn their hard feces and the ships are going home.

Now Great Brittain is sending 2 boats there :-).

US warships:  https://www.politico.com/news/2021/04/15/us-navy-ukraine-russia-tensions-481897
GB Ships : https://www.newsy-today.com/british-media-great-britain-with-two-warships-to-black-sea/

I especially like how GB are saying that if there's a threat from Russian warships they can respond.

Yeah sure they can, for about 2 seconds ..... and then war will be inevitable.

Exactly Mark. Two seconds or two minutes, Russia and Putin have had enough of the West playing games in their backyard.

We (the USA) did not like it at all when the Soviets tried arming Cuba with missiles. The Biden Administration and the UK should take a good long look in the mirror. Do they really want to provoke Russia, over there?

As Lavrov recently said, why are the Russians there on the border? Because they live there and it's their right to be there. Unlike the friggen over extended foolish USA. Quite frankly I hope Biden gets his ass handed to him.

While I understand the point being made. Look at the scenario from a different viewpoint.

Germany sends tank battalions and masses regiments on the border of France and Belgium where there are German speakers living to 'protect' them.

Or Mexico sends military forces to the border with Texas and California, where there is Spanish speaking population present in the North, because they needed to be liberated from an oppressive government.   


Your argument is mostly without merit.

Has France and Belgium shelled German speakers with artillery barrages, resulting in deaths of those German speaking civilians?

Has Texas or California shelled Spanish speakers in certain cities with artillery barrages, resulting in deaths of those Spanish speakers?

Your last statement is key: "because they needed to be liberated from an oppressive government".

That hasn't happened, because in fact the US government is very generous with illiterate illegal immigrants, doling out free food, free medical care, etc.
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2021, 08:35:53 PM »
You need to understand what all of this is about. It is a military build up but it is really about damaging the economy of Ukraine because it is growing faster than Russia would like. The hope of all of this is to scare away anybody who would want to invest in Ukraine by making the country look unstable. Russia was waging war inside the Ukraine and much of that has been stopped including pro Russian TV stations. If Ukraine does much better than Belarus it might would create a problem for Putin as maybe he would find it impossible to keep that country from going to the EU also. With Putin nothing is ever about what it seems but look at the result. Ukraine bonds are dropping in price. 

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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2021, 08:42:24 PM »
You need to understand what all of this is about. It is a military build up but it is really about damaging the economy of Ukraine because it is growing faster than Russia would like. The hope of all of this is to scare away anybody who would want to invest in Ukraine by making the country look unstable. Russia was waging war inside the Ukraine and much of that has been stopped including pro Russian TV stations. If Ukraine does much better than Belarus it might would create a problem for Putin as maybe he would find it impossible to keep that country from going to the EU also. With Putin nothing is ever about what it seems but look at the result. Ukraine bonds are dropping in price.

The USA interfered in the affairs of Ukraine which caused a de facto coup. After that, per Russia, Ukraine as a normal sovereign nation ceased to exist.

Russia had a right to secure Crimea in order to secure their Naval base there. And according to Russia, they had a right to intervene in Donbas because of Ukrainian nationalists from the far West of Ukraine rushing over there with weapons.

If you had a better knowledge of WWII history and the history of Ukraine and Russia in general, you would know it was a very bad decision for Ukraine to send armed militants over to the Donbas.

I don't personally agree with what Russia has done in the Donbas however it's clear I understand history a lot better than you do.

Sure that's right, Russia wants to punish Ukraine economically. If you understood history, you would understand why.

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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2021, 08:52:30 PM »
Try being a contrarian and do a little original thinking and talk about something beside what i in the Russian fake news.

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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2021, 11:55:39 PM »
You need to understand what all of this is about. It is a military build up but it is really about damaging the economy of Ukraine because it is growing faster than Russia would like. The hope of all of this is to scare away anybody who would want to invest in Ukraine by making the country look unstable. Russia was waging war inside the Ukraine and much of that has been stopped including pro Russian TV stations. If Ukraine does much better than Belarus it might would create a problem for Putin as maybe he would find it impossible to keep that country from going to the EU also. With Putin nothing is ever about what it seems but look at the result. Ukraine bonds are dropping in price.

The USA interfered in the affairs of Ukraine which caused a de facto coup. After that, per Russia, Ukraine as a normal sovereign nation ceased to exist.

Russia had a right to secure Crimea in order to secure their Naval base there. And according to Russia, they had a right to intervene in Donbas because of Ukrainian nationalists from the far West of Ukraine rushing over there with weapons.

If you had a better knowledge of WWII history and the history of Ukraine and Russia in general, you would know it was a very bad decision for Ukraine to send armed militants over to the Donbas.

I don't personally agree with what Russia has done in the Donbas however it's clear I understand history a lot better than you do.

Sure that's right, Russia wants to punish Ukraine economically. If you understood history, you would understand why.

It has been posted elsewhere on RUA. I see no need to repeat myself except to note your knowledge both of recent history and the historical background of the Donbass is deeply misinformed.
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2021, 12:28:17 AM »
You need to understand what all of this is about. It is a military build up but it is really about damaging the economy of Ukraine because it is growing faster than Russia would like. The hope of all of this is to scare away anybody who would want to invest in Ukraine by making the country look unstable. Russia was waging war inside the Ukraine and much of that has been stopped including pro Russian TV stations. If Ukraine does much better than Belarus it might would create a problem for Putin as maybe he would find it impossible to keep that country from going to the EU also. With Putin nothing is ever about what it seems but look at the result. Ukraine bonds are dropping in price.

The USA interfered in the affairs of Ukraine which caused a de facto coup. After that, per Russia, Ukraine as a normal sovereign nation ceased to exist.

Russia had a right to secure Crimea in order to secure their Naval base there. And according to Russia, they had a right to intervene in Donbas because of Ukrainian nationalists from the far West of Ukraine rushing over there with weapons.

If you had a better knowledge of WWII history and the history of Ukraine and Russia in general, you would know it was a very bad decision for Ukraine to send armed militants over to the Donbas.

I don't personally agree with what Russia has done in the Donbas however it's clear I understand history a lot better than you do.

Sure that's right, Russia wants to punish Ukraine economically. If you understood history, you would understand why.

It has been posted elsewhere on RUA. I see no need to repeat myself except to note your knowledge both of recent history and the historical background of the Donbass is deeply misinformed.

In other words you don't have a substantive reply to make, so you utter this nonsense.

Try a little bit harder next time. So far you're failing in epic fashion. It's expected from Wiz who is showing signs of dementia. What's your excuse? Back on the sauce?  :chuckle:
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2021, 12:47:03 AM »
You need to understand what all of this is about. It is a military build up but it is really about damaging the economy of Ukraine because it is growing faster than Russia would like. The hope of all of this is to scare away anybody who would want to invest in Ukraine by making the country look unstable. Russia was waging war inside the Ukraine and much of that has been stopped including pro Russian TV stations. If Ukraine does much better than Belarus it might would create a problem for Putin as maybe he would find it impossible to keep that country from going to the EU also. With Putin nothing is ever about what it seems but look at the result. Ukraine bonds are dropping in price.

The USA interfered in the affairs of Ukraine which caused a de facto coup. After that, per Russia, Ukraine as a normal sovereign nation ceased to exist.

Russia had a right to secure Crimea in order to secure their Naval base there. And according to Russia, they had a right to intervene in Donbas because of Ukrainian nationalists from the far West of Ukraine rushing over there with weapons.

If you had a better knowledge of WWII history and the history of Ukraine and Russia in general, you would know it was a very bad decision for Ukraine to send armed militants over to the Donbas.

I don't personally agree with what Russia has done in the Donbas however it's clear I understand history a lot better than you do.

Sure that's right, Russia wants to punish Ukraine economically. If you understood history, you would understand why.

It has been posted elsewhere on RUA. I see no need to repeat myself except to note your knowledge both of recent history and the historical background of the Donbass is deeply misinformed.

In other words you don't have a substantive reply to make, so you utter this nonsense.

Try a little bit harder next time. So far you're failing in epic fashion. It's expected from Wiz who is showing signs of dementia. What's your excuse? Back on the sauce?  :chuckle:

This is a thread about will Russia invade Ukraine from a Western media perspective.

Since literacy and comprehension are clear challenges for you go read some other more pertinent threads. I see no need to repeat myself here.
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2021, 10:17:19 AM »
You need to understand what all of this is about. It is a military build up but it is really about damaging the economy of Ukraine because it is growing faster than Russia would like. The hope of all of this is to scare away anybody who would want to invest in Ukraine by making the country look unstable. Russia was waging war inside the Ukraine and much of that has been stopped including pro Russian TV stations. If Ukraine does much better than Belarus it might would create a problem for Putin as maybe he would find it impossible to keep that country from going to the EU also. With Putin nothing is ever about what it seems but look at the result. Ukraine bonds are dropping in price.

The USA interfered in the affairs of Ukraine which caused a de facto coup. After that, per Russia, Ukraine as a normal sovereign nation ceased to exist.

Russia had a right to secure Crimea in order to secure their Naval base there. And according to Russia, they had a right to intervene in Donbas because of Ukrainian nationalists from the far West of Ukraine rushing over there with weapons.

If you had a better knowledge of WWII history and the history of Ukraine and Russia in general, you would know it was a very bad decision for Ukraine to send armed militants over to the Donbas.

I don't personally agree with what Russia has done in the Donbas however it's clear I understand history a lot better than you do.

Sure that's right, Russia wants to punish Ukraine economically. If you understood history, you would understand why.

It has been posted elsewhere on RUA. I see no need to repeat myself except to note your knowledge both of recent history and the historical background of the Donbass is deeply misinformed.

In other words you don't have a substantive reply to make, so you utter this nonsense.

Try a little bit harder next time. So far you're failing in epic fashion. It's expected from Wiz who is showing signs of dementia. What's your excuse? Back on the sauce?  :chuckle:

This is a thread about will Russia invade Ukraine from a Western media perspective.

Since literacy and comprehension are clear challenges for you go read some other more pertinent threads. I see no need to repeat myself here.


So as usual you've got nothing. Duly noted.
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2021, 02:43:36 PM »
If anyone has a Times log in ...

You actually don't need one: Linky.

After that, per Russia, Ukraine as a normal sovereign nation ceased to exist.

Russia had a right to secure Crimea in order to secure their Naval base there. And according to Russia, they had a right to intervene in Donbas because of Ukrainian nationalists from the far West of Ukraine rushing over there with weapons.

Russia violated it's obligations under the 1994 Budapest Memorandum by invading the sovereign territory of Ukraine, then offered a laughable, fig leaf "referendum" which doesn't pass the sniff test.

So in order to 'secure' a naval base (was it under some sort of ominous threat?), Russia had to grab...ALL of Crimea?  Again, completely bullshit rationale.  Don't kid yourself; seizing Crimea was ALWAYS on the agenda.

Then Russia had to "intervene" - careful, that's not exactly their story, last I knew - in Eastern Ukraine because of what Ukrainians did (maybe) on the opposite side of the country?

Kindly dial 1-800-GETOFFDRUGS immediately....

Don't kid yourself.  Russia did what it wanted to advance its agenda because Putin knew that it would be popular at home because: Muh RUSSIAN NATIONALISM! - AND he also knew that Obama would have little interest in intervening.  Poor Ukraine - so far from God, so close to Russia.  (Hat Tip: José de la Cruz Porfirio Díaz).

Expect Putin to continue to flex within reason because he understands that (a) Biden is a weak-ass "internationalist" figurehead who is no better than a Mandarin, and (b) there will be no substantive consequences for doing so.

B/B

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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #15 on: April 21, 2021, 04:27:30 PM »
If anyone has a Times log in ...

You actually don't need one: Linky.

After that, per Russia, Ukraine as a normal sovereign nation ceased to exist.

Russia had a right to secure Crimea in order to secure their Naval base there. And according to Russia, they had a right to intervene in Donbas because of Ukrainian nationalists from the far West of Ukraine rushing over there with weapons.

Russia violated it's obligations under the 1994 Budapest Memorandum by invading the sovereign territory of Ukraine, then offered a laughable, fig leaf "referendum" which doesn't pass the sniff test.

So in order to 'secure' a naval base (was it under some sort of ominous threat?), Russia had to grab...ALL of Crimea?  Again, completely bullshit rationale.  Don't kid yourself; seizing Crimea was ALWAYS on the agenda.

Then Russia had to "intervene" - careful, that's not exactly their story, last I knew - in Eastern Ukraine because of what Ukrainians did (maybe) on the opposite side of the country?

Kindly dial 1-800-GETOFFDRUGS immediately....

Don't kid yourself.  Russia did what it wanted to advance its agenda because Putin knew that it would be popular at home because: Muh RUSSIAN NATIONALISM! - AND he also knew that Obama would have little interest in intervening.  Poor Ukraine - so far from God, so close to Russia.  (Hat Tip: José de la Cruz Porfirio Díaz).

Expect Putin to continue to flex within reason because he understands that (a) Biden is a weak-ass "internationalist" figurehead who is no better than a Mandarin, and (b) there will be no substantive consequences for doing so.

B/B

"There will be no substantive consequences for doing so" is common sense, unless you are of the type who would like to start World War III over Ukraine? Then yeah, take your own advice and get off drugs.

Also, I never said what happened did so on "the other side of the country".  What I said was that West Ukrainian nationalists, such as Azov battalion, rushed over to the Donbas with weapons, which they did.

Kyiv could have offered the Donbas some sort of autonomy instead of just rushing over there and shelling villages, causing death and destruction. Is there enough blame on both sides to go around?

Of course. And as you stated again, Poor Ukraine, so far from God, so close to Russia.

Which is exactly why Ukrainian leaders should have engaged more diplomacy and less military.

Having said that you know damn well that the overthrow of Yanukovich was financed by the CIA and that Soros character. As usual, where the USA sticks it's nose into the affairs of other nations claiming to want to bring "democracy", death and destruction follow.  :coffeeread:

Quote

"Last week the website Zero Hedge posted a report about hacked emails between billionaire George Soros and Ukrainian President Poroshenko.
Soros is very close to the Ukrainian president, who was put in power after a U.S.-backed coup deposed the elected leader of Ukraine last year. In the email correspondence, Soros tells the Ukrainian leadership that the U.S. should provide Ukraine “with same level of sophistication in defense weapons to match the level of opposing force.” In other words, despite the February ceasefire, Soros is pushing behind the scenes to make sure Ukraine receives top-of-the-line lethal weapons from the United States. Of course it will be up to us to pay the bill because Ukraine is broke.
But Soros seems to have the money part covered as well. In an email to Ukrainian leaders, he wrote that Ukraine’s “first priority must be to regain control of financial markets.” Soros told Poroshenko that the IMF would need to come through with a $15 billion package, which was confident would lead the Fed to also come through with more money. He wrote: “the Federal Reserve could be asked to extend a $15 billion three months swap arrangement with the National Bank of Ukraine. That would reassure the markets and avoid a panic.”

source: Ron Paul

https://www.gbtribune.com/opinion/columnists/ron-paul-soros-pushes-us-bailouts-weapons-for-ukraine/

More:

"How would the Fed be convinced to do that? Soros assured Poroshenko: “I am ready to call Jack Lew of the U.S. Treasury to sound him out about the swap agreement.”
So George Soros will use his influence in the U.S. government to put the American people on the hook for a bankrupt Ukraine -- forcing us to pay for weapons, more military training, and Ukraine’s crippling debt.
Who is thrilled with Soros’ drawing the U.S. government into more intervention in the region? The military-industrial complex for one is happy at the prospect of big weapons “sales” to Ukraine. The bankers are thrilled. Washington power-brokers are thrilled
. There is something in this for everyone who is politically well-connected. The only losers are the people who will be forced to pay for it, the American taxpayers."
Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. P. J. O'Rourke

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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2021, 05:09:44 PM »
From Christian Science Monitor.

Quote

Looking east, looking west

"These divisions are rooted in Ukrainian history. The country’s eastern regions have been part of Russian-run states for over 300 years. Three decades of Ukrainian independence have brought little in the way of economic development or other strong reasons to embrace a Ukrainian identity. At the same time, Russia has become a far more prosperous, orderly place that exudes confidence and power since Vladimir Putin came to power. Millions of eastern Ukrainians have gone to Russia as guest workers – and more recently as war refugees. Today, the Ukrainian diaspora in Russia is by far the world’s largest."


https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2019/0819/In-eastern-Ukraine-a-broad-desire-for-peace.-But-whose-peace
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2021, 05:15:28 PM »
Read Ukrainian decree 117/2021. Pretty bold and seemingly a pro war w/Russia declaration by Ukraine.

Quote

"So what made the Russians suddenly move a massive invasion force toward Ukraine?

Well, it turns out that Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky essentially signed a declaration of war against Russia on March 24th.  The document that he signed is known as Decree No. 117/2021, and you won’t read anything about it in the corporate media.

I really had to dig to find Decree No. 117/2021, but eventually I found it.  I took several of the paragraphs at the beginning of the document and I ran them through Google translate…

In accordance with Article 107 of the Constitution of Ukraine, I decree:

1. To put into effect the decision of the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine of March 11, 2021 “On the Strategy of deoccupation and reintegration of the temporarily occupied territory of the Autonomous Republic of Crimea and the city of Sevastopol” (attached).

2. To approve the Strategy of deoccupation and reintegration of the temporarily occupied territory of the Autonomous Republic of Crimea and the city of Sevastopol (attached).

3. Control over the implementation of the decision of the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine, enacted by this Decree, shall be vested in the Secretary of the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine.

4. This Decree shall enter into force on the day of its publication.

President of Ukraine V.ZELENSKY

March 24, 2021"



https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/russian-tanks-move-toward-ukraine-globe-braces-world-war-3
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #18 on: April 21, 2021, 05:29:52 PM »
No, it wasn't a declaration of war.  The strategy is primarily for diplomatic negotiations.  It wasn't about war.

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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #19 on: April 21, 2021, 05:42:07 PM »
From the link I just posted above.

Quote

"In the days ahead, the corporate media in the western world is going to continue talking about “Russian aggression”, and the Russians are going to continue to blame Zelensky and the Biden administration for the rise of tensions in the region.

Ultimately, we could spend countless hours debating who is in the right and who is in the wrong.

But what really matters is keeping this from escalating into a global conflict.  Because if someone does something really stupid and the Russians feel a need to send their invasion force into Ukraine, there will be no going back ever.

I have been warning about a future conflict between the United States and Russia for a very long time, and we have never been closer than we are right now.

With Trump in the White House, relations with Russia were relatively stable, but now Joe Biden is in charge.

Biden is a hothead that is showing signs of advanced cognitive decline, and he is surrounded by a team of warmongers that are determined to put Russian President Vladimir Putin in his place.

The inmates are running the asylum, and it won’t take much of a mistake at all for things to go horribly, horribly wrong
."

*  *  *

Michael’s new book entitled “Lost Prophecies Of The Future Of America” is now available in paperback and for the Kindle on Amazon.
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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #20 on: April 21, 2021, 06:44:06 PM »
Read Ukrainian decree 117/2021. Pretty bold and seemingly a pro war w/Russia declaration by Ukraine.

Quote

"So what made the Russians suddenly move a massive invasion force toward Ukraine?

Well, it turns out that Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky essentially signed a declaration of war against Russia on March 24th.  The document that he signed is known as Decree No. 117/2021, and you won’t read anything about it in the corporate media.

I really had to dig to find Decree No. 117/2021, but eventually I found it.  I took several of the paragraphs at the beginning of the document and I ran them through Google translate…

In accordance with Article 107 of the Constitution of Ukraine, I decree:

1. To put into effect the decision of the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine of March 11, 2021 “On the Strategy of deoccupation and reintegration of the temporarily occupied territory of the Autonomous Republic of Crimea and the city of Sevastopol” (attached).

2. To approve the Strategy of deoccupation and reintegration of the temporarily occupied territory of the Autonomous Republic of Crimea and the city of Sevastopol (attached).

3. Control over the implementation of the decision of the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine, enacted by this Decree, shall be vested in the Secretary of the National Security and Defense Council of Ukraine.

4. This Decree shall enter into force on the day of its publication.

President of Ukraine V.ZELENSKY

March 24, 2021"

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/russian-tanks-move-toward-ukraine-globe-braces-world-war-3
What can one say? Perhaps a better comprehension of English might help those who are challenged. Together with an understanding of how global politics works might be helpful.

The Russian buildup began at least six weeks before the publication of the decree.

The sudden and marked increase in attacks from the Russian side started some ten weeks earlier than the date of decree. 

As I noted above Biden is on one side trying to defuse the tensions by NOT sending war ships to the Black Sea. On the other side there are bills pending to give increased military aid from the United States to Ukraine and tactical attack aircraft stationed in both Czech Republic and Poland.

This is all playing out against the reality that the majority of Ukraine wants to further integrate into Western Europe. This includes membership in NATO. I suspect this reality does not sit well with his nibs Vladdie.

As I recall there were before the Revolution of Dignity two referendums years apart in the East of Ukraine asking what would be there preference for their future. The clear and decided majority wanted to remain in Ukraine. While I have noted elsewhere the ex-criminal V. Yanukovych is from Donetsk, why does that not seem kosher seeing the present situation?

There was a number of years back on RUA  a prediction after Ukraine received visa free travel to Western Europe there would be a marked increase in drugs, prostitution and day labours from Ukraine inundating the Schengen countries. I have not noted that reality.
“If you aren't in over your head, how do you know how tall you are?” T.S. Eliot

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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #21 on: April 21, 2021, 07:06:07 PM »
Biden is trying to diffuse the situation?

 :ROFL:     :ROFL:       :ROFL:       :ROFL:

Someone clearly failed their English as a Second Language classes.

Biden is on the record as recently calling Putin a “killer” who “has no soul”.

This from the crooked moron who voted for the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. The Iraq war alone has taken at least one million civilian lives.

Has Biden taken any real action against the Saudis for crimes in Yemen?

Pot. Kettle. Black.

https://merip.org/2020/09/birth-defects-and-the-toxic-legacy-of-war-in-iraq/


https://news.un.org/en/story/2020/09/1072012





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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #22 on: April 21, 2021, 07:21:07 PM »
Putin is only rising to Biden’s provocation. This might be a surprise for the usual suspects.  :chuckle:


Zero Hedge article

How To Start A War

Tyler Durden's Photo
BY TYLER DURDEN
SUNDAY, APR 18, 2021 - 10:00 PM
Authored by Victor Davis Hanson via AmGreatness.com,

Wars often arise from uncertainty. When strong powers appear weak, truly weaker ones take risks they otherwise would not.




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Sloppy braggadocio and serial promises of restraint alternatively trigger wars, too. Empty tough talk can needlessly egg on aggressors. But mouthing utopian bromides convinces bullies that their targets are too sophisticated to counter aggression.

Sometimes announcing “a new peace process” without any ability to bring either novel concessions or pressures only raises false hopes—and furor.

Every new American president is usually tested to determine whether the United States can still protect friends like Japan, Europe, South Korea, Israel, and Taiwan. And will the new commander-in-chief deter America’s enemies Iran and North Korea—and keep China and Russia from absorbing their neighbors?

Joe Biden, and those around him, seem determined to upset the peace they inherited.

Soon after Donald Trump left office, Vladimir Putin began massing troops on the Ukrainian border and threatening to attack.

Putin earlier had concluded Trump was dangerously unpredictable, and perhaps better not provoked. After all, the Trump Administration took out Russian mercenaries in Syria. It beefed up defense spending and upped sanctions.

The Trump Administration flooded the world with cheap oil to Russia’s chagrin. It pulled out from asymmetrical missile treaties with Russia. It sold sophisticated arms to the Ukrainians. The Russians concluded that Trump might do anything, and so waited for another president before again testing America.

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/how-start-war



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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #23 on: April 21, 2021, 07:27:12 PM »
Here's the text -

https://www.president.gov.ua/documents/1172021-37533

It basically reiterates what the international community has already stated.  That is why Crimea is still under sanctions.  It does not declare war, nor even threaten war.

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Re: Western Media Wetting Itself About Imaginary Ukraine "Invasion"
« Reply #24 on: April 21, 2021, 07:58:45 PM »
The Biden Doctrine. Speak provocatively and carry a twig.  :ROFL:

(from the Zero Hedge article above)
Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. P. J. O'Rourke