BREXIT before and After the Elections

[Wiz]

While there are good arguments to not leave, what we are seeing right now has nothing to do with those arguments, or with honesty.

YES IT IS A WAR between prospective sellers of our NHS on who
is going to get the best bribe for selling it to Trum!

Here is a film, in the making for the above subject, by John Pilger

It’s about the NHS, the last bastion of a truly people’s institution without which so many of us would stumble and fall and perhaps not survive.

The film is certainly a tribute to the NHS; but, above all, it’s a warning.

Under our noses, often secretly and deceptively, our National Health Service is being undermined and sold off: piece by precious piece to the likes of Richard Branson and the giant American health insurance companies that are at the root of the misery that is American healthcare.

The privatisation of the NHS has been mostly insidious – by “stealth”, as one of Mrs. Thatcher’s cohorts once advised. But since 2010 under Cameron, the “reforms” have speeded up. It’s got to the point that if we don’t act now, we’ll wake up one day to an unrecognizable health service that is no longer ours.

[rosco]

I don't often agree with George Galloway but I agree with every word of this.

I've said it before and I've said it again, the Remoaners need to be fought right to the bitter end, otherwise they'll destroy democracy and everything the western world has suffered to get here. Politicians are really starting to risk their own personal safety if they continue to fail the people, if we can't vote them out they'll be physically thrown out......possibly Guy Fawkes style.

The headlines will bemoan right wing extremism and completely ignore the undemocratic ways of the real coup, led by corny and Co. I'm not advocating it but mark my words this will turn ugly.

They want to stop Brexit, they'll only allow us to negotiate with an arm tied behind our back and now when given the opportunity for a 'peoples vote' via general election.....they don't want that either. It's this type of deadlock that provides oxygen for a dictator yet they're so stupid to even see it!

Watching Question Time last night was vile. The opposition don't want a solution, they want to ignore democracy for their own sick ideology. The only light hearted moment was Emily Thornberry prove how retarded Labour are. She said she would do her best to get a deal and then campaign against it......really!!

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/brexit/9874598/labour-admit-its-brexit-policy-is-to-negotiate-new-deal-then-reject/

What's your thoughts on George's clip? I see the resident retard has been in overdrive the last few days and I'm guessing none of Georges words will resinate with him. I'd be open to discourse if Moby could actually have the balls to admit he's one of those seeking to destroy this great nation.

What a mess and lets all remember who started the war.....when it comes. The other parties don't want to delivery democracy, they don't want a compromise, they don't want an election and the only party ready to admit their undemocratic ways, ironically enough is the Liberal Democrats who have openly said that they'll reverse the majority decision.

Leftests, remainers, the EU fanatics, the Guardian and the Moby's need a swift boot of justice so the country can move on. It's costing the UK a billion pounds a month as we stagnate whilst small businesses suffer. All the while, these idiots in Parliament get paid to cause the misery and are supported by their legions of sheep.......who are too stupid to understand that they're the minority.

They don't want Brexit. They don't want a General election to take power. They just want to play the victim and wreck everything out forefathers fought for. C*nts.....

[Wiz]

While there are good arguments to not leave, what we are seeing right now has nothing to do with those arguments, or with honesty.[/size]

Agreed. See my video above with George Galloway.

Rosco

I thought that you are an intelligent cool person and we can have an intelligent discussion about the shenanigans of the Tory Government and the real situation under the Name BREXIT.

Nice video with George and very precise to the point and the truth.

I am sorry but I don't like the comments you made after the Video. You appear to have lost your cool approach and fall for the kind of behaviour exhibited by the Retard Remoaner and Mr Know all!.

May I ask you to cool down and let's discuss this situation calmly without shouting etc.

1. May I ask you, which party has been in the Government for the Past 10 Years?

As you know It was, still is the same party, the Tories, therefore they have the major responsibility for running the Nation and of everything taking place today in the UK. I don't understand then, why we have to blame the opposition for their actions IF  the Tory governments have been incompetent, over the past 3 years to deliver the Referendum Result?

2. Have you read and understood Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty?

Have a read here:Article 50- Brexit – from its author Lord Kerr

3. When Theresa May invoked article 50 on March 2017, that was it;
The UK Government had then 2 years to negotiate terms of the separation and the way UK could continue its relationship with the EU.

Lets not forget that the EU it's the largest Block market on the world, of around 450 Million people, and very important for our export trade.

PM T MAY and her Party failed to protect the interests of the people of the Nation and cared to please its  Eurosceptics in the party and now the current clown PM fighting on how to flog our NHS to the Americans, free of any commitments.

According to the rules of article 50, after the 31 October 2019 we will automatically be outside of the EU.

4. Under the circumstances, like to ask, why do we have to blame the Opposition for their actions and not the incompetent Tory Governments, since and before the Referendum?

The Tories had 3 years to sort BREXIT and messed big time. Any opposition party will do what ever action it will help it to be elected.

The Zionist Party....err.. Conservative and Unionist Party since 1970 since Mrs Thatcher come to power and after have destroyed this Great Country and today it's a shadow of its self.  They are still in power with a Clown as a PM and fighting to deliver their promise to Trump.

I find it very stupid that  they are accusing the Labour Party and it's Leader for their failures and everything else?
[/size]

 

[andrewfi]

The blame goes to the various oppositions because of the manner in which they have worked very hard to sabotage progress to an exit.

There was nothing that Mrs May could've done to overcome that sabotage. Was the deal she got the best that could've been got? No. But, again, she was hamstrung by opposition stakeholders.

Johnson was the door kicker. He too is being hamstrung by the same opponents and activities which means that we will leave without a sensible framework in place. In the longer term that may well not matter too much given that most of the negotiations will happen after we leave, and that would've happened whether there was a deal or not.

From my perspective, that's not so good because it affects me personally. For the country as a whole, it is not such a huge matter.

We are now where I said we would be many months, if not a year or more ago. The pissing about from the opponents of the government and, to some degree within it, has enabled the EU to continue to avoid substantive discussions with the UK leave negotiators. That may, and probably will change as time leads to focus, but we are behind where we could've been.

[Wiz]

1. The blame goes to the various oppositions because of the manner in which they have worked very hard to sabotage progress to an exit.

2. There was nothing that Mrs May could've done to overcome that sabotage. Was the deal she got the best that could've been got? No. But, again, she was hamstrung by opposition stakeholders.

3. Johnson was the door kicker. He too is being hamstrung by the same opponents and activities which means that we will leave without a sensible framework in place. In the longer term that may well not matter too much given that most of the negotiations will happen after we leave, and that would've happened whether there was a deal or not.

4. From my perspective, that's not so good because it affects me personally. For the country as a whole, it is not such a huge matter.

5. We are now where I said we would be many months, if not a year or more ago. The pissing about from the opponents of the government and, to some degree within it, has enabled the EU to continue to avoid substantive discussions with the UK leave negotiators. That may, and probably will change as time leads to focus, but we are behind where we could've been.

Dear Andrew

I numbered the paragraphs in your post to help me making an orderly reply to your comments, thus avoiding any misunderstandings with my replies, below.

1. I think you are clutching at straws, when you first start accusing the opposition for their manner and actions and not the main culprit, which in this case, it’s the Tory Government. May I remind you that it was Cameron who promised and announced the referendum to pacify the Euroskeptics in his party and win the election and that had nothing to do with the opposition! He spent £10 Mill to supply every house in the country with his leaflet propaganda and when he lost, the rat jumped ship and then we heard about the “Panama Papers”.

Few days after the referendum, the EU published a list of the actions necessary to be taken with Brexit, on it’s site and somebody posted here a link and I read that list. Easy to be found if you wish to search their site.

2.  When the Xenophobic Home Office Minister “T. May” took over instead of taking action to guarantee the “permanent Status” of the legally arrived immigrants from the EU and the more than 3 million Britt’s living in the EU, she refused to take any action and instead she went to General elections and decimated her Majority in the Parliament. Then she had to bribe DUP to have a majority. Very clever PM!

Do you know why she did not do anything regarding the Permanent Residency of the EU immigrants, who exercised their right under the Directive 2007/38/EU, BECAUSE it was FREE ! Mean while she made the life of hundreds of thousand people a nightmare. Most of the people did not know if they are going to be ok or NOT!
People are people and not everybody is like me, Rosco or you for that matter.

Later she introduced the “Resident Status” application charging high fees. She thought she could blackmail the EU during the negotiations, but she was Fcuked!

You didn't  expect for the EU playing nice when its survival was at stake?

If she had Secured the Legal rights of all the EU immigrants (foreign and Brits) there were not more than 2-3 subjects to negociate….. and I am sure with a good will on her part everything would have been resolved including the Irish problem. Of course she listened to her friend…. Trump who come to help her!

3. Then Boris arrived and it wasn’t difficult for me to recognise the Liar characteristics of a Dictator coming centre stage and I told Manny…I had my Greek experience. We now blame the opposition because they don’t help him to prepare the sale of our Nations Biggest Asset and pride, the NHS and anything else still unsold.

4. Didn’t you exercised your “right under the directive” or you did not apply for dual Nationality, if it was permitted?

5. I am sorry but you still clutching at straws when you mainly blame the Opposition and ignore all the facts I mentioned previously!

The UK has been a member of the EU for 40 + years and during this period hundreds of new laws have been created with the UK agreement and then transposed into our National Law . When I read the EU Brexit pages, as mentioned previously, I realised that any sensible negotiator would know to identify and separate 2-3 subjects which the Brits didn’t agree, set aside for negotiation and let unchanged all other transposed to our National laws as they were working.

a) The UK has never adopted the Euro, End of the matter.

b) It is clear from the stats that the Majority of the immigration does not come from the EU anymore, but from the ex colonies and the rest of the world and it’s not a problem for the EU.

c) The UK is an island and controls it’s own borders and the Irish problem has been working fine until we fcuked the negotiations by doing nothing positive.

d) Boris the Clown has been lying to the British people during the referendum that UK contributes £350 Millions a week and he was proven wrong!

e) Fishing rights…. Easy to resolve. EU if you want access to our fishing grounds then we want reduction to our EU contribution. Then use that Money to increase the British fleet to such level that the Spanish and other fishing boats find it uneconomical to fish in the North sea thus becoming a monopoly. Having acquired back its sovereignty then should allow the British fleet to sell to the UK Market any fish caught instead throwing dead fish back to the see, what a waste of good fish.

f) ECHR how difficult would have been to change it’s status to advisory instead of above our sovereignty?

If our Government has shown GOOD will from the start then all problems would have been solved but we left people like Moby to negotiate on our behalf, we paid more attention to the “Special relation with USA” and invited the Mafia President to insult our Queen and advice Theresa May how to behave towards the EU, and we forgot his ulterior motives!

Let’s not blame the French negotiator Barnier or the Opposition parties… they are doing their JOB. It’s all the Con’s Government Fault and the actions of the opposition are like a fly in your milk!

I did not expect, YOU from all people to fall for this blatant CONSERVATIVE propaganda to cover their asses.

The end result is that on the 31 October, if Boris do not ask for an extension the UK will be out of the EU automatically and then…. we can continue blaming the opposition for our Governments failures.

Please don't forget to bring the Music band to play “God save our Queen” or..... RULE BRITANNIA!

 

[Wiz]

Back in September 2019 in the post Brexit II, we had an interesting conversation and I thought it would be useful and interesting to revisit those posts, after the election that took place; We may all have learned some lessons! (Not a Mod so sorry for any mistakes)
____________________________________________________________________________

While there are good arguments to not leave, what we are seeing right now has nothing to do with those arguments, or with honesty.

I POSTED THE FOLLOWING REPLY TO ANDREWFI

YES IT IS A WAR between prospective sellers of our NHS on who
is going to get the best bribe for selling it to Trump!

Here is a film, in the making for the above subject, by John Pilger

It’s about the NHS, the last bastion of a truly people’s institution without which so many of us would stumble and fall and perhaps not survive.

The film is certainly a tribute to the NHS but, above all, it’s a warning.

Under our noses, often secretly and deceptively, our National Health Service is being undermined and sold off: piece by precious piece to the likes of Richard Branson and the giant American health insurance companies that are at the root of the misery that is American healthcare.

The privatisation of the NHS has been mostly insidious – by “Stealth”, as one of Mrs. Thatcher’s cohorts once advised. But since 2010 under Cameron, the “reforms” have speeded up. It’s got to the point that if we don’t act now, we’ll wake up one day to an unrecognizable health service that is no longer ours.

[Wiz]

I have paid and watched the above film on line....... but today
I have news that ITV will show the film next Tuesday.



"The Dirty War On The NHS—Fierce and necessary"
Peter Bradshaw, The Guardian

"The threat our most cherished of institutions faces is laid bare in a timely
and thoroughly researched documentary by journalist John Pilger"
Dan Carrier, Camden New Journal

"The NHS many of us take for granted appears to be on life support and
 Pilger's documentary produces some troubling evidence"
Steven Sheehan, The Digital Fix

It is obvious that none of the MSM (apart of the Guardian) bothered to see the film or comment and that says all you need to know... Boris will sell it to the American Pharma conglomerates.

 

[msmoby]

Boris has already caused the GBP to fall back - by deliberately re-introducing uncertainty in the form of the "we WILL crash out without a deal  - until you help us agree trade deals that have NEVER, EVER been done in 11 months..it's not just trade deals of course - 'we' need to agree many things with the EU.

[Manny]

Boris has already caused the GBP to fall back

Why must you fib so? Look at a year chart: https://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=GBP&to=USD&view=1Y

[msmoby]

Naughty, Manny !


The Pound FELL exactly as I said





It HAD risen after the election result ... But then Boris opened his gob

https://www.poundsterlingforecast.com/2019/12/pound-to-euro-continues-to-fall-as-boris-prepares-2020-brexit-cliff-edge/

"Sterling has completely retraced the election night move now, with cable again taking a 1.30 handle. The abrupt shift is because Boris Johnson is said to be legislating to compel his own government to exit the transition arrangements with the EU in Dec 2020, with a deal in place or not," said Neil Wilson, chief market analyst at Markets.com"

Why do YOU suggest *I* am 'fibbing' when YOU are the culprit ? 

[Manny]

Moby, you are a funny little fellow. Does that dickie bow you wore recently spin and the flower squirt water?

What you describe as a "fall" is a 3c movement over several days. It is indicative of precisely nothing. This "fall" is 2p you bloody twerp.

Now read this really slowly with your finger under the words and read it out loud: "Using Manny's year chart linked above, I see now that there are recent lows of $1.20/£1 and $1.22/£1, but after Boris got elected we saw highs of $1.34/£1 which have today settled around $1.30/£1. I see now that Manny was right and the pound has got stronger by about 10% in recent months. I see now that I am a naughty fibber by disingenuously using a week long chart to create a misleading visual and describing a 3 cent fluctuation over a few days as a real fall. I'll try not to fib so much in the future. I don't know why I do it as I always get busted."

[d672]

 Couches Moby, stick with the couches 

[msmoby]

Manny,

All you needed to say was, "Yup, Moby...I w was wrong ..the Lound DID fall and for thereasons you stated..calling you a fibber was a mistake"...


I am always amused when two REALLY obese chaps call me 'little' ..

Now, perhaps we can discuss the 'wiseness' of your 'hero's' outburst, given uncertainty is back on the agenda?


Now, we see that rich Tory donors are buying citizenship of Cyprus to ensure they remainEU citizens...

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-conservative-donors-exclus/exclusive-the-brits-who-wont-brexit-idUSKBN1YN191

They really have conned you.

[Manny]

A spectacular bit of MobySwerve^TM there. 

Now, we see that rich Tory donors are buying citizenship of Cyprus to ensure they remainEU citizens...

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-conservative-donors-exclus/exclusive-the-brits-who-wont-brexit-idUSKBN1YN191

They really have conned you.

Two men, and for reasons unstated. And why should we care? Boris has a US passport as well. Even you have a Paddy passport. People have second nationalities occasionally.

You are very easily led.

[AvHdB]

The Brexit does not affect me directly but I think a democratic choice should be followed by the elected officials. Using a week long currency chart to prove a point that should be seen from a multi year long viewpoint? I would say inane.

You are jesting Moby, I assume & hope. You show the perspective of a gnat. 

[msmoby]

A spectacular bit of MobySwerve there. 

Your ability to control what is posted and 'insult' doesn't alter the FACT that Boris reintroduced the threat of a no deal exit and the GBP fell..


As usual ...you're in denial...

To cap it all...I give TWO examples of people funding support for leaving, buying EU nationality for themselves and family passports and you try to pretend it doesn't demonstrate who has been easily led ))

You're seeing the evidence of dadtness and avoiding pain, already.

Time you bought an EU passport..I will be passing the queues and laughing at the Sun and Daily Mail readers







They really have conned you.
[/quote]

Two men, and for reasons unstated. And why should we care? Boris has a US passport as well. Even you have a Paddy passport. People have second nationalities occasionally.

You are very easily led.
[/quote]

[rosco]

You’re such an argumentative, petty, little man Moby. Nothing you’ve posted above, disproves anything Manny said.

Just wait until Brexit is done and watch that pound soar. 

[Dogsoldier]

You’re such an argumentative, petty, little man Moby. Nothing you’ve posted above, disproves anything Manny said.

Just wait until Brexit is done and watch that pound soar. 

The man’s a typical remoaner anti democrat who cannot accept a majority verdict now given 3 times over.

I suppose for the MobyBeggars of this world a slight currency fluctuation causes real anxiety.
We’ve seen his pain, caused by $6.92, so it’s no surprise really.

[andrewfi]

A few days ago I transferred some sterling into a euro account. I was fortunate and did so at the point where the pound had hit a recent peak. A day or so later and it had fallen back. The concern that has moved moby so much amounted to enough to perhaps pay for one night of couch surfing for me and his 'bizniz partners'. For the rest of us, enough to pay for a cheap meal - that's to say, it is irrelevant, means nothing. Of course to the poor who need every last penny or cent, then such a small difference is important. For the rest of us, it is, quite a literally 'small change'!

Whatever happened to that pissant $6 and change that was so exercising our forum's indigent member so much?

[Wiz]

A few days ago I transferred some sterling into a euro account. I was fortunate and did so at the point where the pound had hit a recent peak. A day or so later and it had fallen back. The concern that has moved moby so much amounted to enough to perhaps pay for one night of couch surfing for me and his 'bizniz partners'. For the rest of us, enough to pay for a cheap meal - that's to say, it is irrelevant, means nothing. Of course to the poor who need every last penny or cent, then such a small difference is important. For the rest of us, it is, quite a literally 'small change'!

Whatever happened to that pissant $6 and change that was so exercising our forum's indigent member so much?

Obviously he needed that money to buy семечки (sunflower seeds) to feed his .... now wife, as she is fond of them!
 

[andrewfi]

Ha, I noticed a typo above:

couch surfing for me and his 'bizniz partners'.

should obviously read 'he and his 'bizniz' partners.

Sorry about that.

[msmoby]

You’re such an argumentative, petty, little man Moby. Nothing you’ve posted above, disproves anything Manny said.

Selective blindness is a trait around here, Rosco.

Just search for Boris speech Pound falls ..

Just wait until Brexit is done and watch that pound soar. 

Yeah  'right'...  In your dreams...

[msmoby]

The man’s a typical remoaner anti democrat who cannot accept a majority verdict now given 3 times over.

I suppose for the MobyBeggars of this world a slight currency fluctuation causes real anxiety.
We’ve seen his pain, caused by $6.92, so it’s no surprise really.

The man is smart enough to spot a gaunt john ... ).

What '3 times' ?

Be honest for once DS... Boris spoke and the GBP fell as uncertainty was back on the menu..

A few days ago I transferred some sterling into a euro account. I was fortunate and did so at the point where the pound had hit a recent peak. A day or so later and it had fallen back. The concern that has moved moby so much amounted to enough to perhaps pay for one night of couch surfing for me and his 'bizniz partners'. For the rest of us, enough to pay for a cheap meal - that's to say, it is irrelevant, means nothing. Of course to the poor who need every last penny or cent, then such a small difference is important. For the rest of us, it is, quite a literally 'small change'!

There goes andrewfi comparing his existence to mine...

What biz do you know that isn't concerned by 2 percent swings in a day...caused by the brain farts of stupid politicians?

Whatever happened to that pissant $6 and change that was so exercising our forum's indigent member so much?

You mean 20 Lari..? It's 7 USD, now..

It exercised others ( in the form of gossip ) and that inow includes you .

Boris is busy pushing the UK as place to invest / do biz in poster campaigns in nations where folks need visas to do biz   and those nations have aspirations to join the club 'we' are trying to leave..

I exchanged a shed more than a cheap night out on the town just before Boris' utterances..thinking "this cannot be the plan to have a strong Pound" ...and so it transpired..

Thank you, Boris...

[d672]

Ha, I noticed a typo above:

couch surfing for me and his 'bizniz partners'.

should obviously read 'he and his 'bizniz' partners.

Sorry about that.

 Glad you cleared that up, thought maybe you partnered up with him for a minute there!   

[Steveboy]

A few days ago I transferred some sterling into a euro account. I was fortunate and did so at the point where the pound had hit a recent peak. A day or so later and it had fallen back. The concern that has moved moby so much amounted to enough to perhaps pay for one night of couch surfing for me and his 'bizniz partners'. For the rest of us, enough to pay for a cheap meal - that's to say, it is irrelevant, means nothing. Of course to the poor who need every last penny or cent, then such a small difference is important. For the rest of us, it is, quite a literally 'small change'!

Whatever happened to that pissant $6 and change that was so exercising our forum's indigent member so much?

Obviously he needed that money to buy семечки (sunflower seeds) to feed his .... now wife, as she is fond of them!
 

I love those семечки problem is they are so bloody small and you have to do so much to eat just one!! We bought some a while back that were already shelled but they had a strange flavor probably the automated shell opener did some thing .. not nice so it's back to doing it manually one by one