Electric Cars

[msmoby]

Moby, stop drinking, go get a job, a legal one. Something to stop, or reduce, your public propensity to 'fantasy'.

I missed any valid 'riposte' or fact in this post .

 

[msmoby]

Seems that pulling up to a Motorway Service station, taking a ( 'rest') and a cup of coffee, making a business call - or two - and one'll be well topped up ..

Don't know if this is hype  - but the inconvenience ( time waiting ) of charging stops on long journeys  seems to be to be nearing the level where many would accept to go 'lecky

"The Tesla Model 3 is the first production electric car to be able charge at up to 250 kW using V3 Superchargers recently introduced by Tesla. One of the owners recently tested the V3 Supercharging and according to his report on reddit, the Model 3 state-of-charge (SOC) increased from 9% to 90% in just 35 minutes!"  ( in real terms it would seem the mean rate is 150W )

https://insideevs.com/news/343622/tesla-model-3-on-supercharger-v3-here-are-the-charging-specs/


I have no idea if this is the std or long range model  - but not many folks do 300miles / 500 km without a break, anyway ?

[rosco]

Seems that pulling up to a Motorway Service station, taking a ( 'rest') and a cup of coffee, making a business call - or two - and one'll be well topped up ..

Don't know if this is hype  - but the inconvenience ( time waiting ) of charging stops on long journeys  seems to be to be nearing the level where many would accept to go 'lecky

"The Tesla Model 3 is the first production electric car to be able charge at up to 250 kW using V3 Superchargers recently introduced by Tesla. One of the owners recently tested the V3 Supercharging and according to his report on reddit, the Model 3 state-of-charge (SOC) increased from 9% to 90% in just 35 minutes!"  ( in real terms it would seem the mean rate is 150W )

https://insideevs.com/news/343622/tesla-model-3-on-supercharger-v3-here-are-the-charging-specs/


I have no idea if this is the std or long range model  - but not many folks do 300miles / 500 km without a break, anyway ?

I'm one who does.

My 'long haul' car journey's consist of me working on the phone via bluetooth and drinking my home made coffee from my thermal cafe flask. If I do stop it'll be to splash the boots and get going again.

I could think of nothing worse than sitting at some dreary service station, staring at bushes, concrete, litter, fat people and eating over priced crap sandwiches whilst waiting for your car to charge. I'm not a patient man that way......

[Manny]

I could think of nothing worse than sitting at some dreary service station, staring at bushes, concrete, litter, fat people and eating over priced crap sandwiches whilst waiting for your car to charge. I'm not a patient man that way......

A man after my own heart..............

[msmoby]

Riight.. 

Now I'm still a bit of a road warrior - but rare are the days I do 300 mikes on the island of Ireland or GB ..

I guess you are outliers - as ever

[Chris]

When I was a lot younger I would also drive 300 miles without a stop, quick fill up and off again if needed, not these days, bladder range and a nice relaxed 30 to 40 minute break with a good coffee  is much more my style now, as you get older, the need to rush around the same like the young bucks do wanes 

[Chris]

Seems that pulling up to a Motorway Service station, taking a ( 'rest') and a cup of coffee, making a business call - or two - and one'll be well topped up ..

That's what most business people with an EV actually do, especially answering emails, it  actually is more relaxing being forced to take a break here and there.

don't know if this is hype  - but the inconvenience ( time waiting ) of charging stops on long journeys  seems to be to be nearing the level where many would accept to go 'lecky

Yes, many would and are doing 

The Tesla Model 3 is the first production electric car to be able charge at up to 250 kW using V3 Superchargers recently introduced by Tesla. One of the owners recently tested the V3 Supercharging and according to his report on reddit, the Model 3 state-of-charge (SOC) increased from 9% to 90% in just 35 minutes!"  ( in real terms it would seem the mean rate is 150W )

https://insideevs.com/news/343622/tesla-model-3-on-supercharger-v3-here-are-the-charging-specs/


I have no idea if this is the std or long range model  - but not many folks do 300miles / 500 km without a break, anyway ?

A very decent charge rate that is, Tesla have it sussed when it comes to charging, pity their build, quality is not very good. Although I hear they are getting there with the M3.

[andrewfi]

I was watching a video. Guy had a brand new model 3. At 800 miles he reversed into a wall going into his garage. Slight visible damage to the rear bumper and quarter panel. After 2 months the Tesla approved workshop still does not have all the parts and expects another month to get them. The repairs will then take 2-3 weeks and, at this time, cost is estimated at over $10k.

When you talk about badly made, this is a fine example. In order to access wiring for the rear lighting it was necessary to remove the rear window. It broke, apparently this is not unusual, happens about 50% of the time. When it broke, it took the front of the two pieces of glass out as well. Suffice it to say, the Tesla fan boy is much less of a fan boy now.

Last year, in Spain, I did something similar to my car. I didn't crack any of the rear lighting though. Cost of repair? About £200. Time taken? Less than a week and done at the same time as other maintenance and detailing work was done.

To be fair, I opted for a repair of the bumper. Had I replaced it then the price would have been higher. A replacement was about €500.

Badly made is not just about panel gaps and paint finish. Quality of manufacture is about making sure that a low speed crunch does not break the structure of the car, does not mean taking the roof off the car and that taking out a removable part does not routinely cause it to break.

[Contrarian]

When I think of Tesla I still think of the spontaneous combustion feature. 

Meanwhile let’s look at a real car.

[Contrarian]

According to the study directed by Christoph Buchal of the University of Cologne, published by the Ifo Institute in Munich last week, electric vehicles have "significantly higher CO2 emissions than diesel cars." That is due to the significant amount of energy used in the mining and processing of lithium, cobalt, and manganese, which are critical raw materials for the production of electric car batteries.


https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-04-21/new-study-shocks-electric-cars-considerably-worse-climate-diesel-cars

Considering the overall cost to the environment in order to manufacture an electric car, it seems to me that those who believe in these things might also believe in the fairytale that Communism works, or will work someday. With the exception of Chris of course. 

[rosco]

Riight.. 

Now I'm still a bit of a road warrior - but rare are the days I do 300 mikes on the island of Ireland or GB ..

I guess you are outliers - as ever

Outliers as ever? 

If electric vehicles are to be common place and 'save the world', then it has to be embraced by industry in general, not just wealthy middle ages guys who like a break here and there. Think sales reps and couriers , these guys aren't going to sit about charging at a service station when they should be working. they also make up a large proportion of the traffic.

I don't think these types are outliers either.

[msmoby]

Riight.. 

Now I'm still a bit of a road warrior - but rare are the days I do 300 mikes on the island of Ireland or GB ..

I guess you are outliers - as ever

Outliers as ever? 

If electric vehicles are to be common place and 'save the world', then it has to be embraced by industry in general, not just wealthy middle ages guys who like a break here and there. Think sales reps and couriers , these guys aren't going to sit about charging at a service station when they should be working. they also make up a large proportion of the traffic.

I don't think these types are outliers either.

Rosco

I have to go all over the islands and hope to get orders by demonstrating - the EVs if the Tesla Model 3  - with enhanced range - in combination with very fast charging permit  over 300 miles ( 500 Km) per charge

Most folks plan visits to see multiple clients - in an area rather than drive 300 miles to see one ..

Many utilities companies are evaluating  / going over to EVs for postal and courier deliveries ..

Only this morning I watched a Renault scheme whereby such vehicles can return their used power BACK to the grid -  re-charging at night

https://www.fleetnews.co.uk/news/latest-fleet-news/connected-fleet/2019/03/28/groupe-renault-begins-first-large-scale-v2g-pilot-scheme

[Chris]

Riight.. 

Now I'm still a bit of a road warrior - but rare are the days I do 300 mikes on the island of Ireland or GB ..

I guess you are outliers - as ever

Outliers as ever? 

If electric vehicles are to be common place and 'save the world', then it has to be embraced by industry in general, not just wealthy middle ages guys who like a break here and there. Think sales reps and couriers , these guys aren't going to sit about charging at a service station when they should be working. they also make up a large proportion of the traffic.

I don't think these types are outliers either.

Milk delivery companies were using EV's in the 1960's 

[msmoby]

Ah, but they weren't going 300 miles in a single run, Chris..


What range are you getting n Motorways with the I-Pace ?

How long to charge on fast chargers ?

[Chris]

Many utilities companies are evaluating  / going over to EVs for postal and courier deliveries ..

Only this morning I watched a Renault scheme whereby such vehicles can return their used power BACK to the grid -  re-charging at night

https://www.fleetnews.co.uk/news/latest-fleet-news/connected-fleet/2019/03/28/groupe-renault-begins-first-large-scale-v2g-pilot-scheme

Indeed, in fact Octopus Energy (who I use) have just started a scheme with Wallbox (who I also use and have one of their chargers) to do just that and give you money back each month for the power you have put back into the grid. There are many schemes in the early stages doing similar things to this. Car to grid etc.

[Manny]

Milk delivery companies were using EV's in the 1960's 

I saw an electric milk float the other morning actually. 1980s registered. Not seen one for yonks. The firm still has a photo of one on their homepage: https://www.creamline.co.uk/

[msmoby]

I think the current anti plastic campaign will see the Milkman back in biz - in the UK , at least

[Chris]

Ah, but they weren't going 300 miles in a single run, Chris..


What range are you getting n Motorways with the I-Pace ?

How long to charge on fast chargers ?

Nope, you have me there. bloody milkmen were always stopping for one reason or another 

I have managed 200 miles, but that is at ca.70mph and adaptive cruise control, HVAC switched on etc, I know some are getting 250 and up to nearly 300 now the weather is warmer and if driving it economically, not like its a Jaaaaag!

I charge once or twice a week, for about 4 hours at a time usually, overnight, costs me up to £1.60. The rest depends on how much charge you need, but generally a 50Kwh charger will take an hour for about 70% - 80% of charge, 100Kw obviously a lot less and 150Kwh which are now starting to be installed and providing the car can take it, 10 - 15 mins.

BTW Gridserve (who was mentioned UT)  have just got planning approval to start building their first UK site in Braintree, 12 chargers, shops, cafes, meeting rooms, etc a retail site with more like airport lounges for people to work etc, so people can make use of their 20 - 30 minute stops,  they have up to 100 sites already or in the process of being acquired.

[Chris]

Milk delivery companies were using EV's in the 1960's 

I saw an electric milk float the other morning actually. 1980s registered. Not seen one for yonks. The firm still has a photo of one on their homepage: https://www.creamline.co.uk/

I actually saw one a few weeks ago too, not seen one for years, maybe they are making a comeback!

[Contrarian]

I think the current anti plastic campaign will see the Milkman back in biz - in the UK , at least

I would love it if we had milk delivery in the USA with glass bottles, for that very reason as well as convenience.

In the late 70’s there was a local dairy where you could drive up and purchase milk in glass bottles. You had to pay a small deposit for the glass bottles which you got back when you returned them.

Back then there was true recycling as the bottles would be cleaned out and reused.

[Contrarian]

Milk delivery companies were using EV's in the 1960's 

I saw an electric milk float the other morning actually. 1980s registered. Not seen one for yonks. The firm still has a photo of one on their homepage: https://www.creamline.co.uk/

I was looking for a photo of that vehicle on their site but wasn’t sure which one it was, could you point it out for us?

[rosco]

Riight.. 

Now I'm still a bit of a road warrior - but rare are the days I do 300 mikes on the island of Ireland or GB ..

I guess you are outliers - as ever

Outliers as ever? 

If electric vehicles are to be common place and 'save the world', then it has to be embraced by industry in general, not just wealthy middle ages guys who like a break here and there. Think sales reps and couriers , these guys aren't going to sit about charging at a service station when they should be working. they also make up a large proportion of the traffic.

I don't think these types are outliers either.

Rosco

I have to go all over the islands and hope to get orders by demonstrating - the EVs if the Tesla Model 3  - with enhanced range - in combination with very fast charging permit  over 300 miles ( 500 Km) per charge

Most folks plan visits to see multiple clients - in an area rather than drive 300 miles to see one ..

Many utilities companies are evaluating  / going over to EVs for postal and courier deliveries ..

Only this morning I watched a Renault scheme whereby such vehicles can return their used power BACK to the grid -  re-charging at night

https://www.fleetnews.co.uk/news/latest-fleet-news/connected-fleet/2019/03/28/groupe-renault-begins-first-large-scale-v2g-pilot-scheme

Ahh but you're demonstrating that you like to take long breaks at service stations to 'top up', something we've already described as inconvenient.

Evaluating or discussing isn't the same as doing. If it were the preferred option, it would be happening now but clearly it isn't a viable option. It's merely a romantic notion of going green but the reality shows that the carbon footprint is currently higher to do so, the costs unmanageable and it's completely unpractical.

I work with a couple of well known global California based companies who pride themselves on sustainability. It gives them their certified B Corp status, which is a huge part of their marketing. The delivery vehicles are all electric and this counts towards their total score, given to be accredited. The sad bit is, the electric vehicles deliver a short distance down the road where the stock is then redistributed more efficiently by planes, trains and automobiles....none of which are electric.

[rosco]

Riight.. 

Now I'm still a bit of a road warrior - but rare are the days I do 300 mikes on the island of Ireland or GB ..

I guess you are outliers - as ever

Outliers as ever? 

If electric vehicles are to be common place and 'save the world', then it has to be embraced by industry in general, not just wealthy middle ages guys who like a break here and there. Think sales reps and couriers , these guys aren't going to sit about charging at a service station when they should be working. they also make up a large proportion of the traffic.

I don't think these types are outliers either.

Milk delivery companies were using EV's in the 1960's 

I know.......silent killers!! 

[rosco]

I think the current anti plastic campaign will see the Milkman back in biz - in the UK , at least

I would love it if we had milk delivery in the USA with glass bottles, for that very reason as well as convenience.

In the late 70’s there was a local dairy where you could drive up and purchase milk in glass bottles. You had to pay a small deposit for the glass bottles which you got back when you returned them.

Back then there was true recycling as the bottles would be cleaned out and reused.

My folks have a place in the Lake District and they get all their milk in glass bottles. The butchers, bakers and veg shops are all organic and local. I think its a bit of nostalgia and well being, rolled into one.

[msmoby]

Ahh but you're demonstrating that you like to take long breaks at service stations to 'top up', something we've already described as inconvenient.

Kindly read exactly what I said ... it is clear you didn'tt

1/ I said few of us actually do many 300 mile plus runs without a stop  - that would be 6 hours - at best - given the UK motoway network road works

and..

2/ There's not many EVs capable - yet of 300 mile ranges

I was pointing out that THAT sort of range (and fast charging)  meant that even you could stop for a 'leak' and in that time you'd get another 20-25 oercent - to allow 450 miles ..Don't you stop to eat ?  It's illegal top eat sarnies and drink behind the meal, now - like using a mobile phone ...

I work with a couple of well known global California based companies who pride themselves on sustainability. It gives them their certified B Corp status, which is a huge part of their marketing. The delivery vehicles are all electric and this counts towards their total score, given to be accredited. The sad bit is, the electric vehicles deliver a short distance down the road where the stock is then redistributed more efficiently by planes, trains and automobiles....none of which are electric.

Rosco

IF you've been going to SoCal or Florida you'd know the US Postal Service have been playing with EVs for decades - with varying degerees of sucess - I know these things as I'm an older git and even saw a Bride delivered in one to a wedding in 1990 !

UPS have trialing EVs that will allow urban runs - with multiple stops and capable of 2 ton loads

The most  efficient trains run on ...Electric..

Aeroplanes ? You should know that ultra light Private planes are already on the market

The first 8 mins 55 secs of this video might be instructive - the rest is an advert