Anastasia.com scam or real?

[andrewfi]

Yeah, but if some of the people with the 'claimed' side effects had only experienced them after stealing the product.
If some of the people claiming the 'side effects' had also had the same 'side effects' with other different drugs.
If some of the people claiming the 'side effects' displayed the same symptoms of thse claimed side effects in normal life.

In those cases it'd make sense for even a very casually handled forum to want to try to sort out the people who were simply the mentally ill, disaffected, liars and dishonest crowd seekers from those who might, just possibly, have had some kind of extra side effect.

Coz that's what we have here and it is what Brass was trying, I think, to address.

I'd be really interested to see credible people with real stories to tell. The odd thing is that the most credible folks seem to be those who say stuff like 'I hear they (whoever 'they' may be in this context) are a bit hinky and I came across some strange profiles but I ignored those and met up with XYZ person in Kiev last month and we are getting on just great.'

The moaners and whiners are folks who, on the whole, never come to terms with the reality that the very process of MOB stuff is riddled with dishonesty and take actions to minimise the effects and go on to find that which they seek.

Andrew,
You are a comercial member living of promoting a competitor to AW. Sorry I can take you seriously.

1) No I am not. I am labelled as a commercial member because some folks were unhappy that I wrote an independent reprot about the mail order bride industry.

2) If you are unable to read and analyse objectively that which you read then your problems go MUCH MUCH further than how you conduct your relationships with any particular company that is helping you to meet and marry a woman.

Your post illustrates where you might be running into problems. You are not thinking, you are jumping to conclusions and you are, as you told us, unable to read and analyse what you read in an objective fashion. In such circumstances you find yourself in the unhappy position of believing all that you read and not being able to sort out fact from advertising copy which should be fact based but sometimes is not.
Aweb may well not be perfect, indeed I am sure of it, but you are contributing to your own problems here.

[eldanes]

Eldanes:


I've read your communication record and the comments I'm making are not meant to ridicule, but to educate.

Your experience documented upthread is virtually the "textbook" Pro-Dater scam that is being practiced all over Ukraine on unsuspecting western men.  You have documented very well how the "plot develops" in this situation and as such, your post does have educational and informative value to others. 

I do have say, in hindsight that you ignored virtually every red flag and warning sign that came across your path toward the conclusion of this disaster.  A man who is true to himself will examine a bad experience, accept his share of the blame for the bad outcome and do what he can to recognize and eliminate repeating the mistakes he made in the process.  It's really wasting energy to flail your arms and shriek about how horrible the people who scammed you are.

I think it is safe to say that most men who have spent time educating themselves about the process of finding a bride in the FSU wouldn't have wasted their time repeatedly trying to make contact and follow through with a meeting with such a lady.  She would have been "dismissed" early on the the initial contact phase of the courtship.  You really must have fallen for the picture of those boobs.   

I've always considered it a fact that western men who claim they were scammed by women in Ukraine bear a large responsibility for "scamming themselves".  I think this is unquestionably true in your case.     I think your post is not so much of a condemnation of Anastasiaweb as it is a caution to men of the dating reality which is prevalent in an economically depressed country like Ukraine. 

I'm hopeful that you emerged from this disaster a bit bruised, but a great deal wiser for the experience.  After all, the bruises will heal, but isn't learning from experience what life's all about? 

Mate, thanks for the kind words. No offence taken at all. If I had been bruised from this encounter I would have returned back to the customer services MUCH faster. She was written off almost before I went to Odessa. I had nothing to loose as I have friends in Odessa and Kherson so I too the chance and was just well prepared from previous trips. See I am no stinggy person and take what ever life has to offer. So if a lady feels happy having "stolen" 500 USD from me by all means bear with her. I look at it as if finding out the lady is a cheat and has bad moral judgement for USD 500 is cheaper than spending mony on passport, language courses, ticket, visas etc.... well, I am sure you know what I mean.

You are right about this is not just about AW. It is a generic problem in Ukraine not just relating to AW but to the entire MOB business.

Whenever I have been dealing with FSU birds all my enviroment knows. I become edgy, irritated, annoyed with all and everything and I think this is because of these mind games the agencies and ladies play on the men.
I have not been dealing with FSU women for quite some time and even a member here on the site told me he noticed a change of mood from when I gave up on FSU birds and went back tu South American birds.

I am aware of a gent who has spent considerable time in Colombia and I can agree to some extend to his statements but fra from all and mind you I have been travelling in Colombia since 1995. My first trip to Colombia took place 2 months after my frist trip to Ukraine and 1 weeks after a Ukainian bird had visited me in Denmark for 2 weeks and I had had my sample of Ukraine mentality.
So why go back? You know what? I have no fing clue but it almost as crack cocaine. You get off it but have to try it again to see if it really was so bad as you remembered.

Now, I have been on the waggon for suficient time to to declare myself "clean"

[eldanes]

Yeah, but if some of the people with the 'claimed' side effects had only experienced them after stealing the product.
If some of the people claiming the 'side effects' had also had the same 'side effects' with other different drugs.
If some of the people claiming the 'side effects' displayed the same symptoms of thse claimed side effects in normal life.

In those cases it'd make sense for even a very casually handled forum to want to try to sort out the people who were simply the mentally ill, disaffected, liars and dishonest crowd seekers from those who might, just possibly, have had some kind of extra side effect.

Coz that's what we have here and it is what Brass was trying, I think, to address.

I'd be really interested to see credible people with real stories to tell. The odd thing is that the most credible folks seem to be those who say stuff like 'I hear they (whoever 'they' may be in this context) are a bit hinky and I came across some strange profiles but I ignored those and met up with XYZ person in Kiev last month and we are getting on just great.'

The moaners and whiners are folks who, on the whole, never come to terms with the reality that the very process of MOB stuff is riddled with dishonesty and take actions to minimise the effects and go on to find that which they seek.

Andrew,
You are a comercial member living of promoting a competitor to AW. Sorry I can take you seriously.

1) No I am not. I am labelled as a commercial member because some folks were unhappy that I wrote an independent reprot about the mail order bride industry.

2) If you are unable to read and analyse objectively that which you read then your problems go MUCH MUCH further than how you conduct your relationships with any particular company that is helping you to meet and marry a woman.

Your post illustrates where you might be running into problems. You are not thinking, you are jumping to conclusions and you are, as you told us, unable to read and analyse what you read in an objective fashion. In such circumstances you find yourself in the unhappy position of believing all that you read and not being able to sort out fact from advertising copy which should be fact based but sometimes is not.
Aweb may well not be perfect, indeed I am sure of it, but you are contributing to your own problems here.

'
Andrew,

What is http://www.planetlovematch.com to you?

[mendeleyev]

Eldames:

My first trip to Colombia took place 2 months after my frist trip to Ukraine and 1 weeks after a Ukainian bird had visited me in Denmark for 2 weeks and I had had my sample of Ukraine mentality.

(emphasis added)

Jumpin' Jehosaphat, you've been at the wrong sites!

Here is what you seem to need:

http://www.birdlist.org/ukraine.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_birds_of_Ukraine

http://avibase.bsc-eoc.org/checklist.jsp?region=UA

Guys, we've isolated the problem here. I think that  for all the long discussion about ladies and women we've overlooked what this gentleman has been trying to say. He is after birds, not boobs. Perhaps the agencies should have been more clear in promoting their products. (duh)

Personally I'd think the birds in Columbia to be more exotic anyway. 

[CzechMate]

Nothing about the promoting of the report or the advertising of the match service has been independent.  Your business partnership is completely obvious......lying and denying only keeps bringing more attention to the arrangement.

Both of you need "us" to keep this website popping up on the search engines.  Why bother with the hide and seek?

[Manny]

Eldanes, you have been at this stuff long enough to know to avoid Odessa surely?

Observe: Has anyone here actually married a woman from Odessa or Kiev?

Foreign men are an industry in these places.

Most men don't find success there.

Why not look to Russia and meet normal women?

What is with this Ukraine fixation?

Why members of RUA still flock like lost sheep to Odessa and Kiev is beyond me........ guys are not marrying women from there now. That was ten years ago. Read what people write here. Hello? Everyone is mostly in Kazakhstan and Uzbekistan now.

Stuff changes.

In my view, Ukraine is done (apart from far flung villages). The action now is elsewhere.

Probably a good topic starter. I'll do it tomorrow unless someone beats me to it....

[eldanes]

Eldames:

My first trip to Colombia took place 2 months after my frist trip to Ukraine and 1 weeks after a Ukainian bird had visited me in Denmark for 2 weeks and I had had my sample of Ukraine mentality.

(emphasis added)

Jumpin' Jehosaphat, you've been at the wrong sites!

Here is what you seem to need:

http://www.birdlist.org/ukraine.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_birds_of_Ukraine

http://avibase.bsc-eoc.org/checklist.jsp?region=UA

Guys, we've isolated the problem here. I think that  for all the long discussion about ladies and women we've overlooked what this gentleman has been trying to say. He is after birds, not boobs. Perhaps the agencies should have been more clear in promoting their products. (duh)

Personally I'd think the birds in Columbia to be more exotic anyway. 

Mendeleyev,

You cracked my ar$e bust 
Guess too much time in the UK... Picking up on the terminologies here.
As in Ukraine there has been huge developments in standard of living and things in Colombia is no where the same as 10 years back. But that is totally 

Never the less, thanks for making my night.

Eldanés

[eldanes]

Eldanes, you have been at this stuff long enough to know to avoid Odessa surely?

Observe: Has anyone here actually married a woman from Odessa or Kiev?

Foreign men are an industry in these places.

Most men don't find success there.

Why not look to Russia and meet normal women?

What is with this Ukraine fixation?

Why members of RUA still flock like lost sheep to Odessa and Kiev is beyond me........ guys are not marrying women from there. That was ten years ago. Hello? Everyone is mostly in Kazakhstan and Uzbekistan now.

Stuff changes.

In my view, Ukraine is done. The action now is elsewhere.

Probably a good topic starter. I'll do it tomorrow unless someone beats me to it....

Manny,

Hi and thanks for the comment. Long time no hear or see. Well, I go where the "birds" with the biggest boobs are. No matter if Odessa, Poltava, Kherson, Nikolayev. Do I get burned? Hell yeah, but could I care? If I get screewed over I just run back to the few friends I have in Ukaine and lick my wounds.

I have actually been to Russia. I went to Skt P back in '97 or so. Pain in the arse with all that visa shite.
I was on a cultural group tour. Arrived in Skt. P. The target turned up in the airport, went with me and the rest of the group to the hotel where she sneaked in together with all of the group. Shagged me, took her perfume I had brought as a gift and fuked off. Never saw her again and she never answered her telephone when ever I phoned her.
So much for my Russian experience.

Eldanés   

[Manny]

Pain in the arse with all that visa shite.

You are now an official American. 

What is a Russian visa? A few days in the mail and £100 or so? Is that so hard?

Get a grip man. 'Big boobs' aside, foreign blokes as an industry and rip off's are what we here are seeing from most of Ukraine recently.

Thinking people already moved on.

Sex tourists and stragglers are what we are seeing in Ukraine now. Like the drunks who wander into the bar at 11pm. End of the bubble mate.......

Manny,...... Long time no hear or see.

Same here. Nice to see you back. 

[andrewfi]

Nothing about the promoting of the report or the advertising of the match service has been independent.  Your business partnership is completely obvious......lying and denying only keeps bringing more attention to the arrangement.

Both of you need "us" to keep this website popping up on the search engines.  Why bother with the hide and seek?

I am not going to back through this crap with you. If you can't be bothered to read then I can't be bothered to pander to your sloth. However I will not accept you impugning me when you can find the matters covered before, suffice it to say that you are wrong and that if you repeat incorrect assertions then it is you who will be spreading untruths.

Apart from anything else you have not even cottoned on to the fact that there is no 'both' of us. I do not advertise on this website, never have done.

There's some stuff you need to catch up on before you go round making accusations that make you look like a bt of a twat.

Of course if you suffer the same issues as Eldanes above then you also need to do some work on the critical reading, it will be a big help to you when you are, at some time in the future, in a position to do that which you fantasise about at the moment.

[Boris]

Eldanes, you have been at this stuff long enough to know to avoid Odessa surely?

Observe: Has anyone here actually married a woman from Odessa or Kiev?

Foreign men are an industry in these places.

Most men don't find success there.

Why not look to Russia and meet normal women?

What is with this Ukraine fixation?

Why members of RUA still flock like lost sheep to Odessa and Kiev is beyond me........ guys are not marrying women from there now. That was ten years ago. Read what people write here. Hello? Everyone is mostly in Kazakhstan and Uzbekistan now.

Stuff changes.

In my view, Ukraine is done (apart from far flung villages). The action now is elsewhere.

Probably a good topic starter. I'll do it tomorrow unless someone beats me to it....

I would not go as far as Manny in writing off Ukraine but I would definitely not look in Odessa, Kiev and maybe even Kharkov because of saturation (Though I love Odessa dearly). That said, and I've said this in other posts, if I was starting today with what I know I would look in Russia from Samara eastward and the 'Stans...

As far as Anastasia goes I had a brief experience with them. Very brief because as a human being with an IQ higher than a geranium I could tell it was a classic money sucking operation.  I can't believe it is still being discussed.

[eldanes]

Nothing about the promoting of the report or the advertising of the match service has been independent.  Your business partnership is completely obvious......lying and denying only keeps bringing more attention to the arrangement.

Both of you need "us" to keep this website popping up on the search engines.  Why bother with the hide and seek?

I am not going to back through this crap with you. If you can't be bothered to read then I can't be bothered to pander to your sloth. However I will not accept you impugning me when you can find the matters covered before, suffice it to say that you are wrong and that if you repeat incorrect assertions then it is you who will be spreading untruths.

Apart from anything else you have not even cottoned on to the fact that there is no 'both' of us. I do not advertise on this website, never have done.

There's some stuff you need to catch up on before you go round making accusations that make you look like a bt of a twat.

Of course if you suffer the same issues as Eldanes above then you also need to do some work on the critical reading, it will be a big help to you when you are, at some time in the future, in a position to do that which you fantasise about at the moment.

Andrew, patronising does not suit you very well. You should be the last person to ridicule others. I still have fresh in memory you on your promotional video clip.
If you want to promote your business you should be more courteous to prospective customers even those you have not yet met. They may be reading this thread as we speak and will probably choose to put their custom somewhere else thinking; “if he treat these people like that here how does he treat them when they are customers..”

[B.B.]

Foreign men are an industry in these places.

Most men don't find success there.

Why not look to Russia and meet normal women?

What is with this Ukraine fixation?

You realize that if you replaced "Russia" with "America" and "Ukraine" with "Russia" in the previous, you'd be an official American woman. 

In my view, Ukraine is done (apart from far flung villages). The action now is elsewhere.

I recall the back-and-forths on the old RWL as to whether Tver was "fished out" or not. 

Anyway, I think you are correct about the direction, if not the degree as well. 

B/B

[GOB]

Pain in the arse with all that visa shite.

What is a Russian visa? A few days in the mail and £100 or so? Is that so hard?

Manny, you probably forgot the part about filling out all that pesky paperwork? or finding someone to "invite " you? 

If you are right about this Manny, (and you probably are) the sad fact is that the FSU pimps will have to pack up in Ukraine and move their traveling MOB/Romance Tour pimp show to Russia. 

GOB

[missAmeno]

What is with this Ukraine fixation?

In this particular case it seems to be variation of Münchausen syndrome in MOB.

[eldanes]

What is with this Ukraine fixation?

In this particular case it seems to be variation of Münchausen syndrome in MOB.

I suppose you refer to the Münchausen syndrome in regards to this German nobleman, who purportedly told many fantastic and impossible stories about himself (i.e this time not about Münchausen but the MOB) and not the psychiatric factitious disorder. 

If this is true then as previously indicated the statement made with regards to Colombia in a previous posting, "Colombia is hyped up as having amazingly stunning and beautiful women." is also true about FSU.

Which mean our primary goal should actually be to crush the hype about FSU in order to make an impact on the ever growing misconception about beauty and these marvellous creatures they promote in FSU.

[Manny]

Pain in the arse with all that visa shite.

What is a Russian visa? A few days in the mail and £100 or so? Is that so hard?

Manny, you probably forgot the part about filling out all that pesky paperwork? or finding someone to "invite " you? 

One form and the agency do the rest in with their fee. Falling off a log couldn't be easier. However, penny-watching MOBsters tried to do it all themselves and spend ages collecting stuff, filling forms, and writing people to save a $50 agency fee. I think that's where the rumour came from that a visa to Russia was in some way hard. Give an agency an extra $50, fill in one form, yawn, and watch it drop through your mailbox a few days later.

[missAmeno]

I suppose you refer to the Münchausen syndrome in regards to this German nobleman, who purportedly told many fantastic and impossible stories about himself (i.e this time not about Münchausen but the MOB) and not the psychiatric factitious disorder. 

No, I was referring to factitious disorder 

Münchausen syndrome is a type of factitious disorder, in which a person repeatedly acts as if he has a physical or mental disorder when, in truth, he has caused the symptoms. People with factitious disorders act this way because of an inner need to be seen as scammed or taken adantage by FSU women, not to achieve a concrete benefit, such as marriage or engagement with FSU woman. They are even willing to undergo painful and timewasting membership with Anastasia.com in order to get the sympathy and special attention from people who are truly seeking real realationshp with FSUW. Some will secretively scam themselves to cause signs of financial loss or emotional abuse.

Which mean our primary goal should actually be to crush the hype about FSU in order to make an impact on the ever growing misconception about beauty and these marvellous creatures they promote in FSU.

Yeah, sure. Just give me time to convience myself that my marvellousness is only hype and misconception 

[andrewfi]

Eldanes, no need to 'crush' anything.

All that anyone needs to do is to learn to apply critical judgement to that which the read or hear. It really is that easy. What you seem to have been doing is to take everything you read as being literally true - not just from agencies but from the 'women' with whom you have dealt.

Now, I am a big one for truth in advertising and I absolutely reject the idea held by many that telling lies is a part of selling and thus marketing but I understand that words are used to create images and that many statements madse as part of a marketing process are not literally true and should not be expected to be so.

Here's an example or two of what I mean.
For fun I took these examples from ads in an old visitors guide to Tampa Bay, Florida.

Claim 1) 'No one can beat us for fresh seafood dinners'
I've been there, good food but the best anywhere? Not a chance and nobody should expect it to be true.

Claim 2) 'Wherever we go in Tampa Bay people are asking to buy these shirts right off our backs'
It's a t-shirt, when was the last time anyone asked to buy any item of clothing you were wearing?

Claim 3) 'Fashion for all occasion'
This was a little strip mall boutique, no chance this was true unless all you ever wear is semi-formal clothing and consider such appropriate at all times.

Chances are that you can see these examples are normal usage in advertising materials, even you Eldanes would not expect these statements to be literally true. So, why would you turn off your critical thinking when looking for a life partner - a much more significant choice than where to dine tonight or which clothing to buy?

Bottom line here is this:
Whilst I absolutely do not condone dishonest business practices it is the buyer's choices that lead to the unhappy outcomes. All that you or anyone else has to do to avoid problems is to think about what you are doing.

If you want to stop bad stuff happening to other people then you need to document what goes on and relate it to specific claims made by the vendor/service provider; If you do not take this step then there is no form of recourse open to you from any source other than those which enable hearsay and rumour and treat those two imposters as fact.

[eldanes]

Bottom line here is this:
Whilst I absolutely do not condone dishonest business practices it is the buyer's choices that lead to the unhappy outcomes. All that you or anyone else has to do to avoid problems is to think about what you are doing.

Andrew,

I took your advice. As a buyer I made a bad choice in the first place and changed brand.
I am now dealing directly with the whole seller and not the distributors albeit I get a more direct approach to the produce, and more fresh produce, and I can check the produce before I buy it. I can first hand get all the information directly from the source. I.e the lady as I get her contact details incl telephone number. I can instantly detect if she is one of the rotten apples that I should discard of.
Any mistake is entirely down to my bad judgement and can't be blamed on distributors as they do not exist.
True there are distributors on my marked and quite interestingly they belong to the same organisation we are discussing in this thread.
I will leave it to your imagination, but do you think I would ever use their services?
As ChelseaBoy, I did for the hell of it make a profile to get a sniff of what it was. With my 10 credits I had as sure as amen in the church seen that the concept was the same.
I have even later met one of the potential candidates from AmoLatina on another web site where you buy all personal details and spoken to the lady. She confirmed she had been hired to do the chat work. She even told the owner was her ex-boyfriend's brother.
As a curiosum I can add the ex-boyfriend took off to abroad when he impregnated her and she is now looking for a foreigner to take over his responsibilities. Does this sound familiar to the image we see in FSU?
I tend to believe so.

Eldanés

[eldanes]

Münchausen syndrome is a type of factitious disorder, in which a person repeatedly acts as if he has a physical or mental disorder when, in truth, he has caused the symptoms. People with factitious disorders act this way because of an inner need to be seen as scammed or taken adantage by FSU women, not to achieve a concrete benefit, such as marriage or engagement with FSU woman. They are even willing to undergo painful and timewasting membership with Anastasia.com in order to get the sympathy and special attention from people who are truly seeking real realationshp with FSUW. Some will secretively scam themselves to cause signs of financial loss or emotional abuse.

So, if this is your analysis of men (or perhaps this is your anlysis of me) then I suppose you also have step by step instructions of how to understand these mavelous, but complicated, machines and perhaps even access to the wholeseller.

I am sure you could make a few quid if you could introduce us guys to some seriously attractive ladies who were not in it for the adventure but for a serious relationship until dead do us apart and not until the coffer is empty.

[missAmeno]

So, if this is your analysis of men (or perhaps this is your anlysis of me) then I suppose you also have step by step instructions of how to understand these mavelous, but complicated, machines and perhaps even access to the wholeseller.

Just you    and solely based on what you posted in this thread in last few days.

There is no instructions but basic common sense should intervene with wasting time on Anastasia.

I am sure you could make a few quid if you could introduce us guys to some seriously attractive ladies who were not in it for the adventure but for a serious relationship until dead do us apart and not until the coffer is empty.

If after 20+ trips you failed to meet simple minded, uncomplicated and honest girls in FSU then problem is within yourself and unlikely anyone can help you with meeting right girl.

[NS1]

Münchausen syndrome is a type of factitious disorder, in which a person repeatedly acts as if he has a physical or mental disorder when, in truth, he has caused the symptoms. People with factitious disorders act this way because of an inner need to be seen as scammed or taken adantage by FSU women, not to achieve a concrete benefit, such as marriage or engagement with FSU woman. They are even willing to undergo painful and timewasting membership with Anastasia.com in order to get the sympathy and special attention from people who are truly seeking real realationshp with FSUW. Some will secretively scam themselves to cause signs of financial loss or emotional abuse.

So, if this is your analysis of men (or perhaps this is your anlysis of me) then I suppose you also have step by step instructions of how to understand these mavelous, but complicated, machines and perhaps even access to the wholeseller.

I am sure you could make a few quid if you could introduce us guys to some seriously attractive ladies who were not in it for the adventure but for a serious relationship until dead do us apart and not until the coffer is empty.

Finding a serious women is not that difficult! Read your own posts, you basically travelled as a sex tourist and are now pissed you could not find a women It takes work real work. Sometimes even with serious women, its not the right fit. Did you get scammed, maybe so. Life is full of them, most people learn adjust and move on.
It is only as hard as you make it. Feeling sorry for yourself and making excuses for your failures will get you right where you are. No where!

[eldanes]

Andrew, I am still a "new guy" here and I figured it all out easily a long time ago.

YOU are PLM and everybody already knows it! 

Yeesh!


P.S.  Should I post the links to the proof within this website again?

CzechMate,

If you use Firefox you can install an add on calls Adblock Plus that will block any banner and comercial on any web page.

Just see this screen dump from my browser on ruadventures http://dl.dropbox.com/u/98050088/No%20banners.jpg

After that you will never be bothered with banner from Planetlovematch and all the other banners on RUA.

[eldanes]

So, if this is your analysis of men (or perhaps this is your anlysis of me) then I suppose you also have step by step instructions of how to understand these mavelous, but complicated, machines and perhaps even access to the wholeseller.

Just you    and solely based on what you posted in this thread in last few days.

There is no instructions but basic common sense should intervene with wasting time on Anastasia.

I am sure you could make a few quid if you could introduce us guys to some seriously attractive ladies who were not in it for the adventure but for a serious relationship until dead do us apart and not until the coffer is empty.

If after 20+ trips you failed to meet simple minded, uncomplicated and honest girls in FSU then problem is within yourself and unlikely anyone can help you with meeting right girl.

A bit rich coming from a FSU girl. But as always FSU girls know better than Westernes.