European Parliament demands USA to eliminate visas for all EU member states

[fireeater]

ECR

Do you not think that those doctors and nurses have already passed all those requirements in this country. That they are not first year students, at some medical learning establishment, dreaming of working in the USA.
A lot with experience under their belt, so they are actually in demand in the US. They are being recruited with job offers, in their same field, by your hospitals. Not one of them would stay, in the US pushing a broom, when they could return to Canada, and have a lucrative career here. Get real with your ideas.   

Best buy requires nothing in training or education, they have some of my son's high school chums working their part time. Weak choice by you.
No I am talking engineers, and other professionals in fields other then medicine. My ex brother in law has been in many cities in the US building those LRT lines, that have been sold by us to you. He is an electrical engineer, university educated here in this city. Seems his education is accepted down there, without question. I also expect he is showing the Americans how it works, so he can take over when it is finished.

Now no one starts a new job without being shown how it is done. I have been shown, so many times I have lost count by now. And I only move around inside the same company. How long that last depends on your competence level and learning curve. Once they know you are it ends.
Even an experienced nurse is shown how things work in any job change she may have here. They do call it orientation to the job, as well as ensuring the person is competent for that job.

What we may be attempting to do may seem to some impossible, we are looking into the future, as to what could be, if things work out. That is how change occurs by thinking outside of the box, rather then looking only at what you understand it is today.     
 

[froid]

Someone I know doing residence for emergency medicine here in a few Toronto hospitals actually spent several months in the D.C. area and in Baltimore doing residence there because there were not enough shooting and stabing victims here to get properly trained.  And this was a normal thing with people rotating down there every few months.  Is this a special arrangement where she can do the work without the accreditation?

On the subject of eliminating visas...Croatia has just been allowed visa-free travel to Canada...congrats to all you Canadian's dating Croatians here.  

Norval, March 29, 2009 — Visitors from Croatia will no longer be required to obtain a temporary resident visa, Citizenship, Immigration and Multiculturalism Minister Jason Kenney announced today.

And they speak about the process of removing the requirement a little...

The Government of Canada conducted a comprehensive country review of Croatia, including a technical visit in December 2008. Visa policy decisions are based on a country-by-country assessment of a number of criteria such as socio-economic profile, immigration issues, travel documents, safety and security issues, border management, human rights, and bilateral relations.

I think we should start requiring American's to obtain a visa as well...they certainly do not have good border management in the south.  

[Brasscasing]

On the subject of eliminating visas...Croatia has just been allowed visa-free travel to Canada...congrats to all you Canadian's dating Croatians here.

This bothers me, I can think of other countries far more deserving of this exemption.

One example in particular.

http://www.amazon.com/Ghosts-Medak-Pocket-Canadas-Secret/dp/0679312943

Read the book description and buy it if you're so inclined. I've seen these wonderful world citizens in action when they think no one's watching. : Not impressed.

Brass

[ECR844]

ECR

Do you not think that those doctors and nurses have already passed all those requirements in this country. That they are not first year students, at some medical learning establishment, dreaming of working in the USA.
A lot with experience under their belt, so they are actually in demand in the US. They are being recruited with job offers, in their same field, by your hospitals. Not one of them would stay, in the US pushing a broom, when they could return to Canada, and have a lucrative career here. Get real with your ideas.   

They aren't 'ideas', they are reality, do some research and you'll find out. I work with a lot of docs pretty closely, many of who were trained in foreign medical schools. One of whom is a close friend, was a Paramedic for over 10 years and decided he wanted to move on up to be doc. He is someone who is a US citizen and chose to attend a foreign medical school and came back here to complete his residency and specialty training after wards. Frankly 'experience' has no bearing on the equation. I have a co worker who was a board certified endocrinologist, and the head of Endocrinology at a hospital in Russia. He now works 'on the street' as a medic while he negotiates the process to finish his accreditation, boards and required residency, licensing, etc.. here. He had 15 years experience by the way. He's not working as a doc. currently because he hasn't completed the required steps as I have outlined.

    I personally know a Polish woman, who emigrated here with her husband and is in her last year of a Family medicine residency here at an ivy league school. She had 5 years clinical post licensing experience in Poland as a practicing MD before coming here. She has been required to redo her residency, and jump through a number of other hoops. These are just a few real life examples which don't stand up to your imagination of what you believe things 'should be' as opposed to what they are. 

Best buy requires nothing in training or education, they have some of my son's high school chums working their part time. Weak choice by you.
No I am talking engineers, and other professionals in fields other then medicine. My ex brother in law has been in many cities in the US building those LRT lines, that have been sold by us to you. He is an electrical engineer, university educated here in this city. Seems his education is accepted down there, without question. I also expect he is showing the Americans how it works, so he can take over when it is finished.

Once again, this has nothing to do with the realities of clinical medicine practice in the international arena. Apples and oranges, work on your reading comprehension. if you can't follow what I've highlighted as far as facts and draw the appropriate parallels, then I'm not going to hold your hand or drool rag while I wait for you to catch up. Once again, if you don't believe what I'm telling you, research it and find out for yourself. Then post the results here with primary source and POC info of where you got it to back it up.

Now no one starts a new job without being shown how it is done. I have been shown, so many times I have lost count by now. And I only move around inside the same company. How long that last depends on your competence level and learning curve. Once they know you are it ends.
Even an experienced nurse is shown how things work in any job change she may have here. They do call it orientation to the job, as well as ensuring the person is competent for that job.

Thanks for admitting and conceding to part of my point and what i have posted, you're starting to get it...

What we may be attempting to do may seem to some impossible, we are looking into the future, as to what could be, if things work out. That is how change occurs by thinking outside of the box, rather then looking only at what you understand it is today.     

To be clear this won't be changing in the foreseeable future and more than likely won't as the amount of cooperation and concessions as well as the inability of many to meet the stringent standards that would be required would make the whole concept 'unacceptable' to many countries and parties outside of the first world. As previously mentioned when Md's from Britain, Canada and other places are still required to do all of the things I have previously posted and situation ally sometimes more. Those are facts. Once you leave the fairy tale land of conjecture, and come back to reality let us know.

[ECR844]

Someone I know doing residence for emergency medicine here in a few Toronto hospitals actually spent several months in the D.C. area and in Baltimore doing residence there because there were not enough shooting and stabing victims here to get properly trained.  And this was a normal thing with people rotating down there every few months.  Is this a special arrangement where she can do the work without the accreditation?

    The short answer is no. She was able to come here as an 'exchange student' for a limited time and gain experience. While she was here she was practicing under a short term educational-clinical agreement between her 'home country university' and the one here. While here she was supervised and closely watched as well as practicing under the attending s she worked under. Often for the most part residents  practice semi-autonomous 'actual medicine' until the third year. Before that everything is screened multiple times and every decision analyzed and verified multiple times (Usually by the senior resident on their rotation or team, again by the attending, and later reviewed at random times by other unaffiliated docs and specialists) before and after their 'orders' are carried out. In reality the 4th year of their residency is when they start to get alot more leeway and autonomy as they prepare for fellowship, specialty training, or boards to go into private practice. The process is again repeated some what in fellowship and specialty training but at that level with more leeway and autonomy.

    Your friend would be able to come and practice independently after completing the local requirements for licensing, certification, educational verification, specialty training, as previously outlined in the thread. There are some 'shorter' avenues that are possibly but they are very situational.

[fireeater]

ECR

Do you not think that those doctors and nurses have already passed all those requirements in this country. That they are not first year students, at some medical learning establishment, dreaming of working in the USA.
A lot with experience under their belt, so they are actually in demand in the US. They are being recruited with job offers, in their same field, by your hospitals. Not one of them would stay, in the US pushing a broom, when they could return to Canada, and have a lucrative career here. Get real with your ideas.   

They aren't 'ideas', they are reality, do some research and you'll find out. I work with a lot of docs pretty closely, many of who were trained in foreign medical schools. One of whom is a close friend, was a Paramedic for over 10 years and decided he wanted to move on up to be doc. He is someone who is a US citizen and chose to attend a foreign medical school and came back here to complete his residency and specialty training after wards. Frankly 'experience' has no bearing on the equation. I have a co worker who was a board certified endocrinologist, and the head of Endocrinology at a hospital in Russia. He now works 'on the street' as a medic while he negotiates the process to finish his accreditation, boards and required residency, licensing, etc.. here. He had 15 years experience by the way. He's not working as a doc. currently because he hasn't completed the required steps as I have outlined.

    I personally know a Polish woman, who emigrated here with her husband and is in her last year of a Family medicine residency here at an ivy league school. She had 5 years clinical post licensing experience in Poland as a practicing MD before coming here. She has been required to redo her residency, and jump through a number of other hoops. These are just a few real life examples which don't stand up to your imagination of what you believe things 'should be' as opposed to what they are. 

Best buy requires nothing in training or education, they have some of my son's high school chums working their part time. Weak choice by you.
No I am talking engineers, and other professionals in fields other then medicine. My ex brother in law has been in many cities in the US building those LRT lines, that have been sold by us to you. He is an electrical engineer, university educated here in this city. Seems his education is accepted down there, without question. I also expect he is showing the Americans how it works, so he can take over when it is finished.

Once again, this has nothing to do with the realities of clinical medicine practice in the international arena. Apples and oranges, work on your reading comprehension. if you can't follow what I've highlighted as far as facts and draw the appropriate parallels, then I'm not going to hold your hand or drool rag while I wait for you to catch up. Once again, if you don't believe what I'm telling you, research it and find out for yourself. Then post the results here with primary source and POC info of where you got it to back it up.

Now no one starts a new job without being shown how it is done. I have been shown, so many times I have lost count by now. And I only move around inside the same company. How long that last depends on your competence level and learning curve. Once they know you are it ends.
Even an experienced nurse is shown how things work in any job change she may have here. They do call it orientation to the job, as well as ensuring the person is competent for that job.

Thanks for admitting and conceding to part of my point and what i have posted, you're starting to get it...

What we may be attempting to do may seem to some impossible, we are looking into the future, as to what could be, if things work out. That is how change occurs by thinking outside of the box, rather then looking only at what you understand it is today.     

To be clear this won't be changing in the foreseeable future and more than likely won't as the amount of cooperation and concessions as well as the inability of many to meet the stringent standards that would be required would make the whole concept 'unacceptable' to many countries and parties outside of the first world. As previously mentioned when Md's from Britain, Canada and other places are still required to do all of the things I have previously posted and situation ally sometimes more. Those are facts. Once you leave the fairy tale land of conjecture, and come back to reality let us know.

ECR - Whether it is medical or some other profession is immaterial for what they are doing. They all have requirements for different organizations that must be met before they can do the job here, or us there. I also have medical personnel in my family and as friends. 

You are focusing on one part of this, medical, yet it covers more then just the medical industry. As for the part you think I am now getting one should not have to even mention that as it is a given for any job you do. So my answer was to enlighten you since you feel this requires mentioning.     

Do not need to prove what I say, if this agreement happens then that is all the proof required.  The fact that are doing this says to me it has a good possibility of actually happening. If it did not they would already know it was a complete waste of time, as your opinion seems to indicate.

For comprehison maybe you should think about why they believe this is possible, instead of finding reasons against it.  :
 
Even a better whu the EU and not you.   

[Leo512]

They know Obamamessiah will be typical lefty soft touch more like, eager to grab positive PR while new.  :

Who is the EU to demand anything of the US? They can do what they want with their borders IMO. The US knows what's best for the US I am sure.

The EU Gravy Train is rife with corruption and sleaze. Its all old pals scratching each others backs while free loading on tax payers cash in Strasbourg and Brussels. A bunch of unelected, ultra PC bureaucrats trying to tell the world what to do. 

The US should tell them to shove it where the sun don't shine.

Mmm,

Why is Obama so adamant for Turkey to  join the EU?  Whats good for the goose....

[1msmoby]

They know Obamamessiah will be typical lefty soft touch more like, eager to grab positive PR while new.  :

Who is the EU to demand anything of the US? They can do what they want with their borders IMO. The US knows what's best for the US I am sure.

Would that be a bit like how we should tell the US to butt out of Turkey's EU application, Manny ?....

>>"I've said publicly that I think Turkish membership of the EU would be important," Obama told reporters at a joint news conference with Sarkozy before they attended commemorations for the 65th anniversary of the D-Day landings in northern France.<<

http://www.america.gov/st/texttrans-english/2009/June/20090606145336ptellivremos0.2221491.html



OR..

>>President Bush voiced support for Turkey's entry to the European Union yesterday after meeting with Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan<<

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/02/AR2006100200101.html

[Manny]

Would that be a bit like how we should tell the US to butt out of Turkey's EU application, Manny ?....

Indeed.

I guess Obama is just itching to get even more Muslims in the EU. Curious, as that would give them visa free travel to the US shortly after (assuming they don't have it already). My guess is the US wants Turkey in so they can plonk a military base or some hardware there due to its proximity with Georgia.

I don't think the EU needs an Islamic country in it. Why not invite Egypt and Libya next? 

[1msmoby]

Indeed.

I guess Obama is just itching to get even more Muslims in the EU.

..and Mr Bush's motives  ?!

I don't think the EU needs an Islamic country in it. Why not invite Egypt and Libya next? 

I think having TR in the EU would be a great idea.. especially as it will be a transit point for a lot of energy pipelines.. They're already in NATO.

It may well be a "Islamic" state, but thanks to Ataturk's legacy, it is secular.

[Leo512]

Would that be a bit like how we should tell the US to butt out of Turkey's EU application, Manny ?....

Indeed.

I guess Obama is just itching to get even more Muslims in the EU. Curious, as that would give them visa free travel to the US shortly after (assuming they don't have it already). My guess is the US wants Turkey in so they can plonk a military base or some hardware there due to its proximity with Georgia.

I don't think the EU needs an Islamic country in it. Why not invite Egypt and Libya next? 

i work for the EC,

North Africa is next on the list, and i am not joking!

[Leo512]

Indeed.

I guess Obama is just itching to get even more Muslims in the EU.

..and Mr Bush's motives  ?!

I don't think the EU needs an Islamic country in it. Why not invite Egypt and Libya next? 

I think having TR in the EU would be a great idea.. especially as it will be a transit point for a lot of energy pipelines.. They're already in NATO.

It may well be a "Islamic" state, but thanks to Ataturk's legacy, it is secular.

Largely overturned by Turkey moving towards democracy.

"If you would have democracy in muslim countries today, there would be war with Israel tomorrow"

-- Ben gurion

[Leo512]

I think having TR in the EU would be a great idea.. especially as it will be a transit point for a lot of energy pipelines.. They're already in NATO.

That dont mean didly, when the USA need Turkey as a fall out position towards Iraque in the second gulf war, Turkey said "NO". Even after the fact that the USA offered Turkey a wap load of cash (80 billion USD).

Alliance towards orther muslim countries is bigger then alliance towards Nato partners. Dont be naive, thats not smart!!

[Fo]

[quote 

Just think a doctor who trained at the Count's Impalement Hospital could now specialize as a colorectal surgeon here. (Proctologist)    

[/quote]

  Vlad MD 

Haemorrhoid's a speciality

[1msmoby]

That dont mean didly, when the USA need Turkey as a fall out position towards Iraque in the second gulf war, Turkey said "NO". Even after the fact that the USA offered Turkey a wap load of cash (80 billion USD).

Alliance towards orther muslim countries is bigger then alliance towards Nato partners. Dont be naive, thats not smart!!

Dear Leo

1/ We are talking about the EU here - not the USA... the USA wanted to use TR as a base re military action in Iraq.. TR said no... when TR wanted permission to go after Kurds what did the USA say?....

2/ OMG.. what do they pay you for in the EU..? ! I'm not about to take advice on "nativity" re TR - as you seem to forget it has been a democracy for some time, now....otherwise it wouldn't be a candidate member at all ..

3/ Interesting you quote an Israeli Leader... up until recently ( Israeli action in S. Lebanon and Gaza )  IL and TR were "bosom buddies".... a fact most "experts" on Islamic states seem to "overlook"..