Should non USA Agencies Adhere to IMBRA?

[sharpbws]

For clarification to the passing reader.......
The IMBRA law is only applicable to US Citizens, and only enforceable against US registered agencies. The US has no jurisdiction outside US borders. A US Citizen who uses a non US agency that is not obligated to enforce US IMBRA laws (or as some Americans do, get a foreign friend to purchase the information for them) will have circumvented this law. The US touts the denial of a K1 visa as punishment for the non compliant citizen, however if the US citizen claims to have met the woman 'walking down the street' or 'whilst feeding the ducks in the park' IMBRA would be effectively null and void. This is becoming increasingly the avenue of choice for US citizens who believe that the government should not intervene in their personal relationships.

All true.

I have mixed feelings about IMBRA.  Nobody wants women from the FSU to fall prey to a sexual preditor.  I personally know of one such instance where a man with a prior sexual molestation conviction went and married a RW 37 years his junior.  They had a child and eventually his true nature came out.  When she told him she wanted out of the relationship he tied her up, raped and sodomized her and left her in a closet and kidnapped their son.  He's now serving a 60+ year prison sentence in the Oklahoma State Penetentiary.  These preditors are masters of manipulation.  Had the law been in place before this girl agreed to marry this man, she definitely would have thought twice about her decision had she known about his previous criminal background.  If the new law can save even one such abuse, I think it's worth it.

And any American citizen who knowingly tries to circumvent the law; the question I have to ask is "What are they trying to hide?"  If I was starting the process right now, I wouldn't hesitate one instant about providing the required information for a background check.

Remember, it's your RIGHT to marry anyone you like, but it is a PRIVLEDGE for you to jump her immigration priority over others by using the K-1 or K-3 process.

That said, I think the "risk" of such circumstances is dropping as the economic conditions in Russia continues to improve.  Women aren't nearly so desperate to exchange their youth and beauty in exchange for a life in a prosperous country with a man they hardly know as they were back in 1997-2003.

But I can see where some people might consider this an infringement on their basic rights. 

:-)
Brad

[Turboguy]

I agree that one situation is too many but it still is a violation of our basic rights.

The only survey ever done of domestic abuse among foreign brides was one done by the US government in 1999 and showed a rate of domestic abuse that was 1/7 the rate of an AM-AW marriage.   Why fix a problem that doesn't exist.

If IMBRA does make it harder for foreign women to come to America those who would have been here will remain in a society where domestic abuse really is rampant and IMBRA will kill for more women than it saves.   There is already at least one death as a result of the IMBRA laws which was a young woman in India. 

I have no objection to stronger criminal background checks during the immigration stage.  I do think having to have one to say hello is wrong.

I will be very surprised if foreign agencies will be able to bypass the IMBRA regulations a few years from now.   Yes, not telling the truth is a way out.  It is a shame our government wants to turn us into liers.

[Bobalouie]

Remember, it's your RIGHT to marry anyone you like, but it is a PRIVLEDGE for you to jump her immigration priority over others by using the K-1 or K-3 process.

I dissagree.  it is not a privledge, it is a right.  The immigration process does not work the same for non USC as it does for a USC.  That is the advantage of being an American.  Just like the immigration policies of most every country favor the lawful residents of that country.  Of course I should get preferential treatment from the US government to bring a fiancee or spouse to my home country.  Just like any American should over people who are not USC and are applying to come to the US.

It works the same as in any US Embassy around the world.  You walk up to the Marine outside, show him the navy blue passport, and you go straight to the front of the line.  Your business comes first because you are a USC, and the governments job is to look out for YOUR intrests, not those of a foriegn national.

[sharpbws]

I dissagree.  it is not a privledge, it is a right.  The immigration process does not work the same for non USC as it does for a USC.  That is the advantage of being an American.  Just like the immigration policies of most every country favor the lawful residents of that country.  Of course I should get preferential treatment from the US government to bring a fiancee or spouse to my home country.  Just like any American should over people who are not USC and are applying to come to the US.

I'm sorry but with all due respect your view is errant.  Just because she is your wife doesn't mean SHE has a RIGHT to live in the USA.   And even if it doesn't seem like it,  the K-1 and K-3 process DOES move her to the front of the line in immigration priority.

For example, say a female US citizen marries a known Al Qaeda terrorist.  Does he automatically have the RIGHT to immigrate to the USA because he's married to a US citizen?  Of course not and the same principal holds true for your foreign citizen wife.

Having your foreign-born wife join you in the USA is a PRIVLEDGE, not a right.  People need to remember that.

:-)
Brad   

[sharpbws]

Your business comes first because you are a USC, and the governments job is to look out for YOUR intersts, not those of a foriegn national.

I think you'll discover that the government considers it HER petition for immigration; not yours.  All you are is a sponsor.  People who have failed marriages and try to get information from the BCIS on the status of an immigration petition they've sponsored find this fact out quickly enough.

:-)
Brad   

[Manny]

I will be very surprised if foreign agencies will be able to bypass the IMBRA regulations a few years from now.

Why so? What right does the US have to attempt to legislate against foreign agencies?

US men would all end up marrying abroad and going straight to K3 having met in the park feeding ducks one day in the past

Two adults should be able to introduce themselves to each other without Big Brothers permission. A good agency is one that would assist men to circumvent stupid laws that serve no purpose and inhibit civil liberties. Is this idea not buried in your constitutional rights somewhere?

[Turboguy]

Well the pen had barely touched the paper before they got to the part about the inalienable right to life, liberty and the persuit of Russian women,  oops I mean happiness but isn't searching and finding the woman we dream of happiness. 

We can walk down the street and smile and say hello to a perfect stranger (who may be a serial rapist) without a bit of problem.   It seems to me that it is total infringement on our rights to tell us we can't say hello to a woman from across the pond if she happens to be single and someone we could be interested in.

I can see it coming to two choices, being dishonest in our applications (which many already are doing) or not getting the visa.   George Orwell was right, just wrong about the year.   May 6th 2006 was one big step towards a totalitarian society.   How long until the feminists want all internet communication between people screened.   Perhaps when they pass the next law and apply it to Match and Yahoo there will be enough of us to change it. 

[sharpbws]

We can walk down the street and smile and say hello to a perfect stranger (who may be a serial rapist) without a bit of problem.   It seems to me that it is total infringement on our rights to tell us we can't say hello to a woman from across the pond if she happens to be single and someone we could be interested in.

What about the rights of Olga who was beaten, raped, sodomized and left tied up in a closet to die while her husband with a criminal record (and 7 1/2 years prison time for previous sexual misconduct) kidnapped their 3 year old son and left for parts unknown.  I'm not bullshitting here.  I actually KNOW this woman!

I've heard some men in this process describe pamplets written in ladies native language that inform potential international brides of their rights in the USA and what to do if they find themselves in a abusive situation as a "How to Scam the System Manual"

I think many men in interested in this way of finding a wife have some serious control issues.

:-)
Brad

   

[Manny]

Olga as in Olga & Mike Conroy? She used to post at a long forgotten forum. A one off event. You cant credibly legislate against a land mass the size of the states over one, or a few isolated incidents. Mike could have done it to a local woman or any woman.

All internet communication is already screened! The Yanks are clever enough to put the listening station in the UK, slap bang in the middle of the Yorkshire Moors and guarded by machine gun toting US Army.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECHELON and http://tinyurl.com/3qhoa

I doubt they will be using it to watch e-mails between yanks and smokinhotkovas anytime soon.

George Orwell was indeed a prophet.

[sharpbws]

Olga as in Olga & Mike Conroy? She used to post at a long forgotten forum. A one off event. You cant credibly legislate against a land mass the size of the states over one, or a few isolated incidents. Mike could have done it to a local woman or any woman.

Yep, that's her.  And do you think the US government would have established the whole I-360 process if abuse of foreign wives was an "isolated event?  We're not talking about just women from the FSU here.  Have to include Asians, Philippians and ladies from South and Central America.

:-)
Brad

[Manny]

Point being, a man can abuse local women to his hearts content, he need not fly to Dumpsk to secure a victim.

And if the law is so easily circumvented, it is worthless.

I assume 'introductions by mutual friends' are similarly exempt?

[sharpbws]

Point being, a man can abuse local women to his hearts content, he need not fly to Dumpsk to secure a victim.

Apples and oranges.  Local women understand the culture and know what to do to protect themselves.  Women from foreign countries are much more isolated and unfamiliar with what rights and legal protections they have in the USA.  Many have a fear of police stemming from abuses in their own countries.  There is no question that a large number of men seek brides from overseas because they feel they'll be able to control them.     

And if the law is so easily circumvented, it is worthless.

The situation with Olga happened well before the passage of IMBRA.  My point is that IF she would have access to the knowledge that Myke was a convicted sexual predator who previously spent 7 1/2 years in jail for his offenses, do you think she would have agreed to marry him?

:-)
Brad 

[Manny]

Perhaps not, but if Mike was searching today, he would use an agency that is not US based making the IMBRA law worthless as they probably would not adhere to it. Even if Europe [as a whole] joined this scheme, agencies avoiding regulation would all end up registered in Belize or somewhere.

Non US agencies have a worldwide client base also, so it is not worthwhile to pander to only US clients by signing up to this scheme for a non US agency.

As with anything, over regulation makes for higher prices.

Further; if Mike Conroy was wanting to meet a woman today, what is to stop him arriving at an agency's office in person in Dumpsk and slapping a wad of notes down, do you expect Hairy Agency Boris to care too much about IMBRA then? Mike would have 6 dates that night!

IMBRA only displaces the problem it is aimed at, it does not solve it. What it does do is inconvenience agencies and clients who do not want to be over regulated.

[Turboguy]

Point being, a man can abuse local women to his hearts content, he need not fly to Dumpsk to secure a victim.

Apples and oranges.  Local women understand the culture and know what to do to protect themselves.  Women from foreign countries are much more isolated and unfamiliar with what rights and legal protections they have in the USA.  Many have a fear of police stemming from abuses in their own countries.  There is no question that a large number of men seek brides from overseas because they feel they'll be able to control them.     

And if the law is so easily circumvented, it is worthless.

The situation with Olga happened well before the passage of IMBRA.  My point is that IF she would have access to the knowledge that Myke was a convicted sexual predator who previously spent 7 1/2 years in jail for his offenses, do you think she would have agreed to marry him?

:-)
Brad 

I think it is not apples and oranges.   If AW know how to protect themselves why do so many stay in abusive relationships.   Why on a percentage bases are 7 times as many AW abused and killed. 

I won't say there are not controlling men who get involved with this endever but if they try it with a RW they might find they got something they had not bargained for it.   I really think those types may target Asian women.

[lonely]

I was quoted this IMBRA law and I laughed at them. I said how can an American law affect two people that do not live in an American country?

So how does the American agency check foreign nationals that use its services? How can a little agency from cletusville Idaho get around other countries tough personal information laws and check the history of the client?

If they can't are they obligated to refund all the money that people have spent with them because they are legally not allowed to provide the service they were selling?

It is good in it's basic idea but like all modern PC laws only keeps the honest people honest.