put 2 year marriage visa in Russian passport that expires the end of 2012?

[DavidSWP]

My fiance from Moscow is here in the UK on a 6 month Fiancee settlement visa expiring 11/11/2011.  We plan to get married 9th October 2011 and apply for the 2 year marriage settlement visa shortly after.  Her Russian international passport expires at the end of 2012 - does this cause any problems?  For example:

• Will the UK visa/border agency even put a 2 year visa in a passport that expires in about 16 months?
• If they will can it be swapped into a new Russian passport at a later date, and if so is there a charge for this?
• It seems that it's impossible to get a new Russian international passport and a 2 year visa before the current visa expires on 11/11/2011  - will UK immigration give us some lenience if we are married but haven't get a new visa yet?

Is there any way around having to pay another £850 for a marriage visa which is essentially just the same thing as a fiance visa but for a longer time period - can the fiance visa be 'upgraded' some way?

Thanks for advice.

Dave and Katya.

[Chris]

Dave

Others may be more up to date with this, but the way I see it, as long as the passport has 6 months or longer to expiry it shouldn't be a problem and when it does expire I think you can have it put into a new passport but you will have to pay and it is not necessary, just carry the old one with the visa in it with you aswell as the new one.

We have just had to get a new passport for my daughter, her ILR Visa is in the old one obviously, the passport does not actually expire until June next year, so planning ahead and as we won't be able to travel back to Ukraine in June we are getting it 9 months or so early. Her ILR Visa won't be transferred, we will just carry the old one and the new one.

[nicknick]

My fiance from Moscow is here in the UK on a 6 month Fiancee settlement visa expiring 11/11/2011.  We plan to get married 9th October 2011 and apply for the 2 year marriage settlement visa shortly after.  Her Russian international passport expires at the end of 2012 - does this cause any problems?  For example:

• Will the UK visa/border agency even put a 2 year visa in a passport that expires in about 16 months?
• If they will can it be swapped into a new Russian passport at a later date, and if so is there a charge for this?
• It seems that it's impossible to get a new Russian international passport and a 2 year visa before the current visa expires on 11/11/2011  - will UK immigration give us some lenience if we are married but haven't get a new visa yet?

Is there any way around having to pay another £850 for a marriage visa which is essentially just the same thing as a fiance visa but for a longer time period - can the fiance visa be 'upgraded' some way?

Thanks for advice.

Dave and Katya.

To answer your questions:-

1 Yes
2 Yes and there is a charge.  However, as Chris says above, you don't need to do this.  As long as your fiancee keeps her old passport with the visa in when she gets her new passport - which she can do but she has to request this - then when she enters the UK she just needs to show her new passport and the old passport with the visa in it.
3  No.  The fiancee visa is for 6 months and you must marry and apply for the correct visa or she must leave the country within the 6 months.

To be honest, I would suggest that you don't need to worry about the passport expiring.

One thing to consider, you may prefer to get married in Russia - it's certainly a lot cheaper and your fiancee's family and friends are, I would suggest, a lot more likely to be present.  Also, there is absolutley no problem with coming here for 6 months and then returning to Russia and getting married there.  A close friend of mine and his wife did that a few years ago.

Is there any way around having to pay another £850 for a marriage visa which is essentially just the same thing as a fiance visa but for a longer time period - can the fiance visa be 'upgraded' some way?

The marriage visa IS the upgrade.

The big difference is that after marriage your wife can work in the UK, at the moment your fiancee isn't allowed to work.

[DavidSWP]

Hi,

Thanks for the advice.  I am sure that getting married in Moscow would be more expensive.  We have a Russian Othodox church that will perform a ceremony for £50 and will go for a meal in a restaurant after.

It just seems a bit strange to me that if someone gets married in another EU country to a none EU person then that person requires no Visa to enter or stay in the UK under EA regulation 2004/38/EC (Surinder Singh ruling etc.)  but if they get married in the UK then they need a visa to  and stay here and re-enter.   I'm not sure if the person has the right to work in the UK under 2004/38/EC mind you.

Dave

[nicknick]

Hi,

Thanks for the advice.  I am sure that getting married in Moscow would be more expensive.  We have a Russian Othodox church that will perform a ceremony for £50 and will go for a meal in a restaurant after.

It just seems a bit strange to me that if someone gets married in another EU country to a none EU person then that person requires no Visa to enter or stay in the UK under EA regulation 2004/38/EC (Surinder Singh ruling etc.)  but if they get married in the UK then they need a visa to  and stay here and re-enter.   I'm not sure if the person has the right to work in the UK under 2004/38/EC mind you.

Dave

Dave,

Just a couple of comments on the above.

First of all, just double check that the priest is actually licensed to register marriages.  Otherwise you will also need to have a civil ceremony as well, or have the registrar in the church as well as the priest.

Church of England weddings - and incidentally also Jewish weddings - are automatically registered but all other religions. including Catholic, Orthodox etc need to have their priests specifically licensed for them to be lawful.

While it is certainly possible to do things very cheaply here, have you asked your fiancee if she would want her family and friends to be present?  It often seems to me that weddings are much more about the woman than the man and it may well be that it would mean a lot to her if her parents and friends were at the wedding.  Of course, I don't know anything about your circumstances so I'm just saying this without knowing anything about your and her background.


With regard to the Surinder Singh ruling.  There's a bit more to it than just getting married abroad - you actually need to be working and living in Europe, not just getting married there.

Also there are various differences in how soon your wife can get different visas.

Going the Surinder Singh route your wife would get a five year residence card and then at the end of five years she MAY get permanent residency.

Doing things the ''proper'' way your wife will get permanent residency - Indefinite Leave to Remain or ILR - after two years and she will get a British passport after three years in the country - which, if she came here on a fiancee visa on the dates you mention mean that she could qualify for a British passport in May 2014.

I would suggest that this is rather better than waiting five years just to get ILR.

[Chris]

Dave,

Just a couple of comments on the above.

First of all, just double check that the priest is actually licensed to register marriages.  Otherwise you will also need to have a civil ceremony as well, or have the registrar in the church as well as the priest.

Church of England weddings - and incidentally also Jewish weddings - are automatically registered but all other religions. including Catholic, Orthodox etc need to have their priests specifically licensed for them to be lawful.

While it is certainly possible to do things very cheaply here, have you asked your fiancee if she would want her family and friends to be present?  It often seems to me that weddings are much more about the woman than the man and it may well be that it would mean a lot to her if her parents and friends were at the wedding.  Of course, I don't know anything about your circumstances so I'm just saying this without knowing anything about your and her background.


With regard to the Surinder Singh ruling.  There's a bit more to it than just getting married abroad - you actually need to be working and living in Europe, not just getting married there.

Also there are various differences in how soon your wife can get different visas.

Going the Surinder Singh route your wife would get a five year residence card and then at the end of five years she MAY get permanent residency.

Doing things the ''proper'' way your wife will get permanent residency - Indefinite Leave to Remain or ILR - after two years and she will get a British passport after three years in the country - which, if she came here on a fiancee visa on the dates you mention mean that she could qualify for a British passport in May 2014.

I would suggest that this is rather better than waiting five years just to get ILR.

Dave, I agree with everything Nick has said, however

British passport after three years in the country

There are talks going on that this is likely to change to 5 years and if so also the ILR Visa aswell,  in fact, I made a thread about it on here in the Visa section a month or so ago. So whilst this is correct now, by the time you come to apply for whatever visa you go for, the rules could have changed significantly.

[DavidSWP]

Dave,

Just a couple of comments on the above.

First of all, just double check that the priest is actually licensed to register marriages.  Otherwise you will also need to have a civil ceremony as well, or have the registrar in the church as well as the priest.

Church of England weddings - and incidentally also Jewish weddings - are automatically registered but all other religions. including Catholic, Orthodox etc need to have their priests specifically licensed for them to be lawful.

While it is certainly possible to do things very cheaply here, have you asked your fiancee if she would want her family and friends to be present?  It often seems to me that weddings are much more about the woman than the man and it may well be that it would mean a lot to her if her parents and friends were at the wedding.  Of course, I don't know anything about your circumstances so I'm just saying this without knowing anything about your and her background.


With regard to the Surinder Singh ruling.  There's a bit more to it than just getting married abroad - you actually need to be working and living in Europe, not just getting married there.

Also there are various differences in how soon your wife can get different visas.

Going the Surinder Singh route your wife would get a five year residence card and then at the end of five years she MAY get permanent residency.

Doing things the ''proper'' way your wife will get permanent residency - Indefinite Leave to Remain or ILR - after two years and she will get a British passport after three years in the country - which, if she came here on a fiancee visa on the dates you mention mean that she could qualify for a British passport in May 2014.

I would suggest that this is rather better than waiting five years just to get ILR.

Dave, I agree with everything Nick has said, however

British passport after three years in the country

There are talks going on that this is likely to change to 5 years and if so also the ILR Visa aswell,  in fact, I made a thread about it on here in the Visa section a month or so ago. So whilst this is correct now, by the time you come to apply for whatever visa you go for, the rules could have changed significantly.

Hi, no the Russian Orthodox church is not registered to make a legal marriage, I already have hopefully ensured that a legal marriage can be made at the registry office the day before with 2 witnesses.   The religious ceremony is importat to her but I don't think that having her relatives and friends from Russia there is very important.  Her mum and dad are already dead and we will make a Skype broadcast to Russia for her friends.

[Ste]

You don't get a visa vignette anymore for spouse/UPV anymore, it's a separate card...