Gold is at 1150 usd and rising, .......anyone scared yet?
http://www.youtube.com/user/geraldcelente#p/u/8/1pOC0eHaeA8
By the way, I have read somewhere that only Ukrainian nationals can buy farmland? Or is this the wrong country to invest into assest like that?
Gold is at 1150 usd and rising, .......anyone scared yet?
http://www.youtube.com/user/geraldcelente#p/u/8/1pOC0eHaeA8
By the way, I have read somewhere that only Ukrainian nationals can buy farmland? Or is this the wrong country to invest into assest like that?
The third biggest land holder/farmer (farmland) in Ukraine is a British Company, not sure how they go about buying it though. I was going to buy some 2-3 years ago but having a Ukrainian wife would have sorted out any problems, not sure if you as a foreignor can buy/own land or not and even if you could, it is still risky owning something where the rules can change on someones whim.
Chris
Gold is at 1150 usd and rising, .......anyone scared yet?
....I wouldn't be too sure about that. Stories go already that UK *might* be the next Greece. Pending elections and insecurities about the future policies of the government steer investors away from the UK. The GBP has been dropping again in the past few weeks due to this...
Your lucky the UK is not in the Eurozone, (Greece situation)
Gold is at 1150 usd and rising, .......anyone scared yet?
http://www.youtube.com/user/geraldcelente#p/u/8/1pOC0eHaeA8
By the way, I have read somewhere that only Ukrainian nationals can buy farmland? Or is this the wrong country to invest into assest like that?
The third biggest land holder/farmer (farmland) in Ukraine is a British Company, not sure how they go about buying it though. I was going to buy some 2-3 years ago but having a Ukrainian wife would have sorted out any problems, not sure if you as a foreignor can buy/own land or not and even if you could, it is still risky owning something where the rules can change on someones whim.
Chris
Hey Chris, that is really weird, do you have a name of that company, so i can ask some questions in the legal forums
Ukraine has a huge farming potential, but it is clogged with small farms, growing patch-work quilts of near-subsistence crops, in between thousands of hectares of land abandoned years ago.
The soil is superb black loam and the rainfall in Western Ukraine at least is a very adequate 600mm - 700mm, long hot summer days ensure 6tonnes per hectare of milling wheat and 4tonnes per hectare of oilseed rape can be harvested under long summers clear blue skies.
However, there is virtually no investment. Nobody will back what was the former breadbasket of the Soviet Union. Nobody, that is, apart from a few British entrepreneurs here and there who have already secured over 60,000ha of prime arable land and their goal is to secure over 500,000 hectares over the next five years.
This group of British entreprenuers are already the third largest farmer in Ukraine and soon it will be the largest.
Western Ukraine offers ideal growing conditions. Three hundred kilometres further east the soil is still as good, but rainfall is half what it is in this region.
Of course these British entreprenuers are using the latest farming equipment, and are therefore much more efficient than the horse and cart are in the pictures above. I have never seen Ukrainian farmers using anything as modern as this tractor below.
Manny,
All things equal you would be right, but i believe it is not a bubble as bubbles are artificially created by low interest rates.
Don't forget that historically gold's value as a store of wealth was its portability and relative scarcity. Hiding a decent value of gold in one's personal clothing is not hard. Hedging against inflation (currency devaluation) is a much more recent phenomenon since we moved away from the gold standard toward fiat currencies.
Investment bubbles are not created by artificially low interest rates but low rates are commonly found in bubble conditions.
Don't forget that historically gold's value as a store of wealth
Exactly ! The fees involved with assaying gold each time you want to change title to the property make it a rather inappropriate short-term trading vehicle. My overall retirement portfolio is close to $500,000 with no exposure to precious metals. I thought a little diversification in these uncertain times might prove beneficial. In the next three years I'm looking to have 5% of my total portfolio in gold coins, preferably Krugerrands, appraised by a recognized services as real, sealed in plastic, rated as to condition and therefore highly liquid.
I'm not a huge alarmist, but I have been buying 1 South African Krugerrand every three months for the past 3 years - more to provide a bit of diversification than a fear about the collapse of the worldwide financial markets.
It is just a delayed form of Mugabenomics! Since 1970 the USD has lost 75% of its value through inflation.
its because you cannot create gold out of thin air as you would paper fiat Money by running a printing press and thereby stealing your savings via inflation
Gold has NO intrinsic value. Its only value is what we choose to believe. We could choose, as other cultures have done, to value certain kinds of sea shells. Gold has some advantages, it does not break and it is convenient to divide and subdivide but gold is not even particularly rare. As I noted, historically its value was as a store of wealth as generations numberless of refugees can testify.
So you have about 12 "Rands" plus the self assurance that they are real by getting an authenticity certificate from some sort of recognized service. As someone who buys coins for my customers I give you a few comments on this. I have never seen a counterfeit gold coin but I have seen counterfeit silver dollars. I seen some last Monday. Usually a magnet will detect them as they are made of steel. Also they are tumbled to age them. Mostly they come out of China. In regards to gold coin it would be easy to tell a fake from the real thing. Gold coins have a specific density that is next to impossible to reproduce. One could do it with tungsten but the cost would be prohibitive. Tungsten has been used with gold bullion (bars) in the 400 Troy Ounce range to rip off the big boys. One ounce gold coins no one would bother with. So it's just a matter to take a good look at the coin and feel it's weight (density) and that will tell you if it's gold or not. Roughly a present day coin is about half the weight of a same size silver coin and a gold coin is about twice the weight of a silver, roughly. A gold coin looks and feels like it is worth something unlike the slugs we call coins now. Frankly I do not see the need for documentation. Of course there are those who make a living appraising things who might disagree...
The preferred coin among myself and my peers in the business is the Canadian Maple leaf. Reason being is that it is 99.99% fine gold and not alloyed with base metals like the US Eagle (90%) and SA Rand (91.66%). The later two have to be refined (what I do) to pure metal (like the Maple Leaf) in order to be used for where gold is usually consumed (dental and jewelry alloys).
Maxx, there is traded good in the world that is worth anything other than what people are willing to pay for it. Gold is no exception. That is why gold has no intrinsic value.
In times when I have serious doubts about society - world war, pogrom or persecution of me and mine then I want to have some gold with me when I become a refugee. Absent that situation, whatever I think of how the Fed is manageing the US economy I see no benefit in holding gold in my house and CERTAINLY not in bullion storage.
If you live in the U.S., I would avoid buying Gold for concerns of inflation of the U.S. dollar. Inflation has been flat over the past six months. You're not going to gain anything in short.
Davos 2010: George Soros warns gold is now the 'ultimate bubble'
Gold is now "the ultimate bubble", billionaire investor George Soros has declared, sparking fears that prices for the precious metal may soon suffer a tumble.
By Edmund Conway in Davos Published: 6:15AM GMT 28 Jan 2010
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/davos/7085504/Davos-2010-George-Soros-warns-gold-is-now-the-ultimate-bubble.html
http://www.cnbc.com/id/35428772/Soros_Doubled_Gold_ETF_Investment_Buys_Citi
Soros Doubled Gold ETF Investment, Buys Citi
Published: Wednesday, 17 Feb 2010 | 3:52 AM ET
By: Reuters
Billionaire investor George Soros' hedge fund more than doubled its bet on the price of gold during the fourth quarter, a portion of the firm's total U.S.-listed equity holdings of $8.8 billion at the end of 2009.
Jim Rogers Gold Bubble 2010
http://commoditysurge.blogspot.com/2010/01/jim-rogers-gold-bubble-2010.html
Jim Rogers was talking investing in 2010 recently, and he said the continual concerns about the possibility of a gold bubble are unfounded, and still maintains the position that gold will eventually reach $2000 an ounce, although when that will happen of course can't be known.
Rogers added that gold is going up in price because of the falling value in the U.S. dollar, concerns over inflation, consumption of gold by China and India, and the buying up of gold by central banks. The only bubble Jim Rogers is concerned about is one in the U.S. government bond market. Otherwise he said there isn't another bubble he sees emerging anywhere.
If there's a reason for gold prices rising, there isn't a bubble, according to Rogers. It's when everyone starts buying gold without knowing why is when you need to be concerned about a gold bubble. As of now, the majority of people on the street haven't even looked to gold as an investment, so concerns that way are irrelevant.
Wanna know how to see when the next big thing is about to go bust? Read this forum. When you see posts on the subject here then SELL SELL SELL as fast as you can, the ride is about to go fast and downhill.
The mug punter buying teeny tiny amounts of gold as an 'investment' Each buyer and seller pays a 'dumb tax' that goes directly into the pockets of those better able to benefit.
The mug punter buying teeny tiny amounts of gold as an 'investment' Each buyer and seller pays a 'dumb tax' that goes directly into the pockets of those better able to benefit.
I generally agree with your sentiment when you're talking about "Joe Average" trying to compete for short-term speculative profits with the big boys.
However, it is my opinion that if you are using capital that is committeed to a portfolio of diversified investments earmarked to fund retirement and have an investment holding timeframe of 10-20 years; an appropriate holding in gold can positively contribute to the positive overall returns of your holdings.
I'm talking about an allocation of 3-5% of the total in gold (bullion or coins) with the 95-97% balance being in stocks or bonds.
I ain't an investment adviser but yes, it seems that gold, held long term, will likely be a safe but low return investment.
It does not matter what I think of the future.
If we posit an uncertain future but one in which there is a functioning paper currency then gold is not more than something to buy. In such a world I'd want to be holding the most liquid store of value/medium of exchange, or close proxies such as baked beans or fish hooks. Gold would be of little use to me.
I think this description would be accurate for gold bullion. That is one of the reasons I selected gold coins for my chosen investment vehicle. Remember, they ACTUALLY ARE currency. They're recognizable, easily bought and sold and come in denominations of 1 oz, 1/2 oz, 1/4 oz and 1/10 oz. Therefore in some kind of unplanned total world financial collapse, they could actually be used to purchase necessary items and "change" could be made.
Ironically, gold has not done as well as I thought it should.
Great post!
Check this out
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
Check this out
http://www.usdebtclock.org/
Maxx
Our debt is totally crazy. We convinced the Japanese to try and borrow their way out of a recession and they got the forgotten decade (for the last 20 years).
And now we are getting it. I do not think it will be as bad as Argentina, Mexico, or others - our leaders are promising they will not devalue.
They have promised to enslave our country. The world believes we are enslaved to them to pay off this debt. They may be right.
The only real wild card in the equation is: "China's demand for oil jumped by an "astonishing" 28% in January"
Our demand went down, so prices are not being impacted strongly, but should that change - we are in trouble.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/8563985.stm
From the Daily Telegraph and Sunday Telegraph newspapers
(http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k131/Maxx_1953/PF-gordon-brown-go_1602795c.jpg)
Explain why you sold Britain's gold, Gordon Brown told
Gordon Brown has been ordered to release information before the general election about his controversial decision to sell Britain's gold reserves.
By Holly Watt and Robert Winnett
Published: 11:55AM GMT 24 Mar 2010
Gordon Brown pushed ahead with the of Britain's gold despite serious misgivings at the Bank of England, it is believed
The decision to sell the gold – taken by Mr Brown when he was Chancellor – is regarded as one of the Treasury's worst financial mistakes and has cost taxpayers almost £7 billion.
Mr Brown and the Treasury have repeatedly refused to disclose information about the gold sale amid allegations that warnings were ignored.
Following a series of freedom of information requests from The Daily Telegraph over the past four years, the Information Commissioner has ordered the Treasury to release some details. The Treasury must publish the information demanded within 35 calendar days – by the end of April.
The sale is expected to be become a major election issue, casting light on Mr Brown's decisions while at the Treasury.
Last night, George Osborne, the shadow chancellor, demanded that the information was published immediately. "Gordon Brown's decision to sell off our gold reserves at the bottom of the market cost the British taxpayer billions of pounds," he said. "It was one of the worst economic judgements ever made by a chancellor.
"The British public have a right to know what happened and why so much of their money was lost. The documents should be published immediately."
Between 1999 and 2002, Mr Brown ordered the sale of almost 400 tons of the gold reserves when the price was at a 20-year low. Since then, the price has more than quadrupled, meaning the decision cost taxpayers an estimated £7 billion, according to Mike Warburton of the accountants Grant Thornton.
It is understood that Mr Brown pushed ahead with the sale despite serious misgivings at the Bank of England. It is not thought that senior Bank experts were even consulted about the decision, which was driven through by a small group of senior Treasury aides close to Mr Brown.
The Treasury has been officially censured by the Information Commissioner over its attempts to block the release of information about the gold sales.
The Information Commissioner's decision itself is set to become the subject of criticism. The commissioner has taken four years to rule on the release of the documents, despite intense political and public interest in the sales. Officials have missed a series of their own deadlines to order the information's release, which will now prevent a proper parliamentary analysis of the disclosures.
It can also be disclosed that the commissioner has held a series of private meetings with the Treasury and has agreed for much of the paperwork to remain hidden from the public. The Treasury was allowed to review the decision notice when it was in draft form – and may have been permitted to make numerous changes.
In the official notice, the Information Commissioner makes it clear that only a "limited" release of information has been ordered.
Ed Balls, who is now the Schools Secretary, Ed Miliband, now the Climate Change Secretary, and Baroness Vadera, another former minister, were all close aides to the chancellor during the relevant period.
If the information is not released by the end of April, the Treasury will be in "contempt of court" and will face legal action. A spokesman said last night that the Treasury was not preparing to appeal against the ruling.
HOW AUCTIONS COST TAXPAYER £7BN
The price of gold has quadrupled since Gordon Brown sold more than half of Britain’s reserves.
The Treasury pre-announced its plans to sell 395 tons of the 715 tons held by the Bank of England, which caused prices to fall.
The bullion was sold in 17 auctions between 1999 and 2002, with dealers paying between $256 and $296 an ounce. Since then, the price has increased rapidly. Yesterday, it stood at $1,100 an ounce.
The taxpayer lost an estimated £7 billion, twice the amount lost when Britain left the Exchange Rate Mechanism in 1992.
The proceeds from the sales were invested in dollars, euros and yen. In recent years, most other countries have begun buying gold again in large quantities.
Gold is just a lump of metal like lead and iron.
It won't provide money to loan like putting money in the bank.
Jean, as before it is worth knowing a little history before making posts.
1) estimates suggest that the total weight of all gold ever produced is around 158,000 tons. This is equivalent to an allotment of just under 24g of gold per person on the planet, assuming no gold is used for any purpose other than as a carrier of value. Clearly such a small amount of gold is impractical for use as currency.
Gold was OK as a carrier/store of value in former times because there were very few people who actually used money and our economies were much smaller. Gold's rarity was then a benefit.
Gold is NOT typically used in barter.
There ARE benefits to having a currency backed by gold but you should not make the mistake of thinking that this is the same as carrying around gold.
Please do some proper reading about fractional reserve banking.
Please do some proper reading about fractional reserve banking. If you do you will come to understand that in an unfettered market the increase in money in circulation becomes a reflection of increased productivity.
Update: Actually their was a time where a 100% fiat currency did work this was in the Colonies (before the American revolution). Its name was "Colonial script". Infact the sole reason for the American civil war (according to Thomas Jefferson letters) was the fact that King George demanded the use of Gold and Silver as legal tender outlawing the use of this fiat Colonial currency. And because the liquidity was not sufficient for the Colonies it resulted in immediate economic stagnation.
A gold backed currency is the only way to prevent government to create inflationary sinkholes (realestate prices out of control) which absorb this fake wealth.
Here's a link to the history of the fiat Colonial currency and how it's failure led to a silver and gold backed currency as spelled out in the constitution.
And because the liquidity was not sufficient for the Colonies it resulted in immediate economic stagnation.
And because the liquidity of gold and silver was not sufficient for the Colonies it resulted in immediate economic stagnation.
Just look at the first German central bank right after WWII its started out with an extremely strict monetary policy, but that eventually waned a bit.
I believe you mean WW I right?
Andrew is right that when there is white noise everywhere about something, it is about to fall. I noted above that one newsletter I (and Chris and Cufflinks) read was touting gold several years ago. They have a short/medium view. As a long term holding, dripping into gold over time as Shakey suggests is not a bad move. The benefit of dripping into something is that your average buy-in is buffered by differing values over time thus reducing risk ofdumping all your chipsbuying in a speculative bubble.
The economist Robert Beckman said "Cash is king in the downwave" - I think he was right. Collect cash and wait for opportunities. Buy right and sail into the upwave.
QuoteJean, as before it is worth knowing a little history before making posts.
I see you have an economics degree from the central bank of Zimbabwe, Mine is from the "Universities of Aix-Marseille" Masters in mathematics with a postdoc in economics. I work at ING bank calculating the convenience yield for oil and other (non degradable assets) and commodities in the city of Nice.
Its funny how you think I am the layman but maybe you could pickup a good freshmen course on the history of banking and Money. But i know people would rather be lazy and shout their mouth off instead of reading a 875+ page scientific work describing past and present FACTUAL banking laws ( and their subversion, aka the subsequent removal of checks and balances that led to this crisis.) But i will give you my old course name anyway:
Money-Bank-Credit-and-Economic-Cycles
pdf alert-> http://mises.org/store/Money-Bank-Credit-and-Economic-Cycles-P290.aspx
Jesús Huerta de Soto, professor of economics at the Universidad Rey Juan Carlos, Madrid, has made history with this mammoth and exciting treatise that it has and can again, without inflation, without business cycles, and without the economic instability that has characterized the age of government control
So we all did have an economy without manufactured "pump" and "dump" cycles? Well well, ( No andrew that was not in the middle ages, but early 20Th century.Quote1) estimates suggest that the total weight of all gold ever produced is around 158,000 tons. This is equivalent to an allotment of just under 24g of gold per person on the planet, assuming no gold is used for any purpose other than as a carrier of value. Clearly such a small amount of gold is impractical for use as currency.
Nonsense, Not a rational statement but an emotional one, what would be enough? 1 KG per person?, 500gr?, 1.5gr? And why do you 'feel' 24gr is not enough? or any arbitrary number? You big toe twinkled?
An old 1920's US dollar states "Redeemable in Gold" how much grams of gold would that have bought back then? hardly 24grams. The current dollar states "Legal tender". If the thugs of government would NOT demand payment in taxes (Note: this is not an argument against taxes perse, but your brain will delete this sentence anyway) , the fiat currency would be worthless.
The SOLE reason why fiat money has worth, is because goverment demands the payment in taxes in said currency-> http://en.wiped.org/wiki/Fiat_money
Silver has massive liquidity, so has copper, etc. and both of them was used for pennies and single dollars coins.QuoteGold was OK as a carrier/store of value in former times because there were very few people who actually used money and our economies were much smaller. Gold's rarity was then a benefit.
How is making stuff up, even rational? Maybe it sounds right emotionally to you, but is it the same as being factual? Where is the discipline of being rational? What are "former" times anyway? Nixon left the last remnants of the gold standard in the 1970's. (There was price - fixing of gold, but still limited the abuse of the currency by government). Since leaving the gold standard then there has been a hockystick like inflation of the USD.QuoteGold is NOT typically used in barter.
Ah, so you also work in the financial sector? What bank is that may i ask? Gold is THE MOST bartered asset used in financial transactions (although it changes ownership, it hardly ever leaves the vault), just like silver, other rare earth metals. Oil, Iron (metric tons), copper (metric tons) are also used but that is different, these have a convenience yield.
Guess this is the first time you hear the word "convenience yield" (dont lie) so here->http://en.wiped.org/wiki/Convenience_yieldQuoteThere ARE benefits to having a currency backed by gold but you should not make the mistake of thinking that this is the same as carrying around gold.
Could you not read my post at 500km/h,.., you are missing some words i wrote! I hate repeating myself. Gold IS the value, because the free market has determined this to be so!!!
End of storyQuotePlease do some proper reading about fractional reserve banking.
Mugabenomi cs is wrong; because its stealing. Free market is good, because it is based on the free choice of humans, instead of state coercion.
But here are some chapters you to upgrade your knowledge.
Money-Bank-Credit-and-Economic-Cycles
Basics:
Chapter 1: The Legal Nature of the Monetary Irregular-Deposit Contract
Chapter 2: Historical Violations of the Legal Principles-> Legal Principles Governing the Monetary Irregular-Deposit Contract
The scam:
Chapter 3: Attempts to Legally Justify Fractional-Reserve Banking
..§2Why it is Impossible to Equate the Irregular Deposit with the Loan or Mutuum Contract
..§3The Roots of the Confusion
..§4The Mistaken Doctrine of Common Law
effects of stealing, via inflation
Chapter 5: Bank Credit Expansion and Its Effects on the Economic System
JeanClaude you basically seem to be saying that we should listen to you because you're a real smart, highly educated guy
you're a real smart, highly educated guy who works in international banking doing financial calculations that most people don't understand?
Aren't those the type of bankers that brought about the current global recession?
The current recession that has caused major downsizing at ING?
JeanClaude you basically seem to be saying that we should listen to you because you're a real smart, highly educated guy who works in international banking doing financial calculations that most people don't understand? Aren't those the type of bankers that brought about the current global recession? The current recession that has caused major downsizing at ING?
I doubt if Andrew will admit to being on either side but he is a Keynesian.
The bankers, noteable the central bankers operate off of the Keynesian economic model. They are Keynesians.
QuoteJeanClaude you basically seem to be saying that we should listen to you because you're a real smart, highly educated guy
I wrote: ....But i know people would rather be lazy and shout their mouth off instead of reading a 875+ page scientific work describing past and present FACTUAL banking laws....
I don't see people as "smart" or "stupid", I see them as "lazy" or "hardworking". I believe everybody has a goodworking engine between the ears, but if you do not fill it up with fuel. The engine is not going to do you much good.
Being ignorant is not cool and ignorance/lying is not a form of "opinion" either.
Liberalism (in all it forms) caters to lazy egos, these egos want an easy "backdoor" it to intellectual standing, just like liberalism caters to people who want an easy backdoor to the middle class . Buying houses and cars they cant afford.Quoteyou're a real smart, highly educated guy who works in international banking doing financial calculations that most people don't understand?
You need mathematical proof that stealing (by inflation) is wrong ?QuoteAren't those the type of bankers that brought about the current global recession?
Governments and central banks cause pump and dump cycles, please read the chapters I outlined in the book (you can download it as pdf). Bankers do what they have to do to survive this thievery. They position themselves on the right side of the fence for them (and it is not on the side you are standing).QuoteThe current recession that has caused major downsizing at ING?
Management used it as an excuse to cut away a lot of pork fat tissue (which would have happened anyway if the employees weren't protected by social labor laws).
JeanClaude I too have a degree in economics and spent 20+ years in banking.
The Austrian School is one of the smaller and less popular schools of thought in economics.
..Laissez-faire capitalism sounds like a good idea, [but]...
as we've seen though out the 20th century and earlier money tends to corrupt.
I'm know that government bears some responsibility
for these and other economic problems but I don't think that giving banks, financial institutions and others an even freer hand in the economy is the answer.
You are all for freer free market capitalism but when it comes to layoffs at the company that you work for you are happy that the government social labour laws were there to prevent layoffs
Jesus Huerta de Soto: Central banks should mimic as close as possible the working of a purely private monetary system based on a 100 per cent reserve pure gold standard: A stable monetary supply (growing no more than 2 per cent per year); non-involvement with interest rates and strong separation of short term commercial banking from investment banking (i.e. reintroduction of a kind of Glass-Steagall act).
A world wide purely private monetary system is never, ever in the wildest dreams of any economist going to happen. No nation on Earth would ever give up control of it's monetary system to the business world. How would we revert to a 100% reserve pure gold standard now? The world economy is far, far larger than the current available supply of gold?
Complete chaos and undoubtedly a situation that would make Zimbabwe look like an economic paradise.
Jesus Huerta de Soto: Central banks should mimic as close as possible the working of a purely private monetary system based on a 100 per cent reserve pure gold standard: A stable monetary supply (growing no more than 2 per cent per year); non-involvement with interest rates and strong separation of short term commercial banking from investment banking (i.e. reintroduction of a kind of Glass-Steagall act).
A world wide purely private monetary system is never, ever in the wildest dreams of any economist going to happen. No nation on Earth would ever give up control of it's monetary system to the business world. How would we revert to a 100% reserve pure gold standard now? The world economy is far, far larger than the current available supply of gold?
Two things. One, the growth of gold supply per year from mining is 2%. Two, the price of the metal would have to be far higher. It is been calculated to cover just the US currency in circulation and in the banks it would have to be $17,000 per ounce. Then there is silver. I haven't got any numbers off the top of my head on that. Figure in other commodities and perhaps land and we might get to something workable.QuoteComplete chaos and undoubtedly a situation that would make Zimbabwe look like an economic paradise.
I believe this is going to happen. When it does a commodity based currency might be able to be sold to the public. However IMO a tightly controlled economic dictatorship is more likely to happen.
A world wide purely private monetary system is never, ever in the wildest dreams of any economist going to happen.WestCoast: "Freedom for common subjects?, bullocks; never going to happen". I guess you would be the one fighting on the side of King George III during the civil war.
No nation on Earth would ever give up control of it's monetary system to the business world.Most countries on Earth are liberal/socialist or outright tyrannical (Islam,communism)! So what else is new? The reason why people love to move to the US is because its different from the rest. But the rampant raping of the economy by Keynesian's is changing that.
How would we revert to a 100% reserve pure gold standard now? The world economy is far, far larger than the current available supply of gold?
Another quote from de Soto in chapter 9 "THE OBLIGATION OF ALL AGENTS IN A FREE-BANKING SYSTEM TO OBSERVE TRADITIONAL LEGAL RULES AND PRINCIPLES,
PARTICULARLY A 100-PERCENT RESERVE REQUIREMENT ON DEMAND DEPOSITS".
in 2010 most people can't tell which cell phone plan is best for themselves, how would they ever be able to judge which bank is best
I grow dill, parsley and basil in my yard...am I in trouble? :(
I grow dill, parsley and basil in my yard...am I in trouble? :(
News from Peter Schiff's video blog today (April 2nd) - our socialist Marxist government just slipped in a currency control rider in the new "Jobs" bill - seems they want Euro and Swiss banks to deduct and forward 33% of each USA account holders funds on any withdrawals overseas???
Can't make this up:
http://www.europac.net/videoblog.asp?a=watch
After all Cuffy better the rich US citizens pay their taxes
I grow dill, parsley and basil in my yard...am I in trouble? :(
Don't worry, Ed. Your little garden will be OK. I don't think I would be relying on Doreen for advice on the Interstate Commerce Act and gardening. :ROFL: I really like the dialog between Claude and Moby. Is this how the Guerre de Cent Ans started?
I have been reading some of Gorky Guy's old posts. Is it possible that Andrew was/is Gorky Guy? :laugh: Is it possible that Moby has Multiple Personality Disorder? Are Jean Claude and Moby the same person engaged in a never ending argument involving multiple page bending quotes? My English friends tell me that there isn't much difference between a "Paddy" and a "Frog" anyway so I guess it is possible. :chuckle:
Moby, I apologize to you in advance if you and Jean Claude are, in fact, two different personages. :hidechair:
Under the program, foreign financial institutions
voluntarily report income earned and taxes withheld on
U.S.-source income, providing some assurance that taxes on
U.S.-source income sent offshore are properly withheld and
that income is properly reported. Foreign financial institutions
that are part of the QI program assume responsibility
for ensuring the proper imposition of the U.S. withholding
tax with respect to the foreign persons that hold accounts
with those institutions. This means that the foreign
financial institution agrees to collect identifying documentation
from its customers, withhold U.S tax based on that
documentation, and deposit the withheld tax with the IRS.
It also agrees to submit to periodic audits performed by
external auditors supervised by IRS examiners.
QuoteUnder the program, foreign financial institutions
voluntarily report income earned and taxes withheld on
U.S.-source income, providing some assurance that taxes on
U.S.-source income sent offshore are properly withheld and
that income is properly reported. ..
..SNIP..
with those institutions. This means that the foreign
financial institution agrees to collect identifying documentation
from its customers, withhold U.S tax based on that
documentation, and deposit the withheld tax with the IRS.
It also agrees to submit to periodic audits performed by
external auditors supervised by IRS examiners.
And with this American's living abroad will become the pariahs of the world's banks and financial institutions. Who will want to go through this hassle? Who will want their business?
WestCoast:QuoteAfter all Cuffy better the rich US citizens pay their taxes
Grace Commision Report:
100 percent of what is collected is absorbed solely by interest on the Federal debt and by Federal Government contributions to transfer payments. In other words, all individual income tax revenues are gone before one nickel is spent on the services which taxpayers expect from their Government.
Mr "economist", :ROFL: :ROFL: your taxes aren't paying for shit,
Ron Paul said it best
"The Chinese are our masters now"
Looks like the IRS now wants to be the International Revenue Service.
Westy I would not gloat safe up there in commodities rich Canada - as soon as the US Dollar dies its natural fiat currency death which is now fairly inevitable - the replacement currency the Amero which will be the currency of choice in all the New World - including in Canabisidia - you will then be subject to further "harmonized" international revenue laws to be shared with your Ottowa overseers.
In other words what happens here will soon follow both North and South, we have to do something to recapture all of the untaxed Canadian spice and Mexican herbal and Coca profits! :8)
MAxx, what do you think about these people? http://www.offshore-professional.com/en/offshore.html
Especially the nominee service through a laywer
http://www.offshore-professional.com/en/company/seychelles-company.html
Some of them are 100% fraudulent, some offer no longer existing citizenship programs along with the twice higher prices for the existing ones, some appear on the list of public advisories as not authorized to deal with citizenship, some try to sell documents that lead people to troubles once used or appear useless at best and received a good portion of negative feedback from their customers. Should you come for our advice, below are the companies that we do not recommend you to deal with.
Second Citizenship Providers Blacklist
South American Citizenship Program (www.gosacp.com)
Crown Associates, Crown Law Firm (www.crownpassport.com)
Felice Consulting Group (www.felicegroup.com, inactive)
Shustak Morris & Heller Inc. (www.new-citizenship.com)
Gerald Associates (www.geraldassociates.com)
Goldstein Associate (www.goldsteinassociate.com)
Greenway (www.valeho.com)
P&L Group Inc. (www.plgroup-eu.com)
Ashbridge Consulting Limited (www.ashbridge-consulting.com, inactive)
Goldstein Associates (www.goldstein-lawyers.com)
Right Way (www.right-way.net)
Coldwell Diplomatic Consultants (www.diplomaticsecondpassports.com, inactive)
Viza.cc (www.viza.cc, inactive)
D & T Group (www.second-passport-citizenship.com)
First Business Group (www.firstbusinessgroup.com)
EuroHome (www.euhome.info)
Immigration Club (www.immigration-club.info)
KLP Trade Company (www.europassport.org)
General Council of Diplomacy (www.generalcouncil.info)
International Privacy Consultants (www.diplomaticsecondpassport.com)
Baywest International Ltd., Baywest Group (www.secondpassportsolutions.com, inactive)
Second Passport Solutions (your-second-passport.com, 2nd-passports.net, inactive)
Privacy Solutions (second-passports.net)
2nd Passport Consultants (www.diplomaticsecondpassport.ws)
2nd Citizenship Ltd. (www.2ndcitizenship.eu)
Inc Seychelles & Alda Immigration (www.incseychelles.com)
Seymore Associates (visafreetravel.com)
We keep this list updated. Your comments and new information are very welcome. If you have any evidence of fraud as to the second citizenship, please let us know and we will put it on the list.
Cuffy I'm not gloating I pretty much agree. I also agree that if a way could be found to do that the federal governments in the US and Canada should tax the drug trade. Of course the feds would then go on another spending spree and spend that money too. :laugh:
my gut feeleng tells me to keep my money in gold and silver for a year or two, then maybe put a portion if it into real estate.
WestCoast:QuoteAfter all Cuffy better the rich US citizens pay their taxes
Grace Commision Report:
100 percent of what is collected is absorbed solely by interest on the Federal debt and by Federal Government contributions to transfer payments. In other words, all individual income tax revenues are gone before one nickel is spent on the services which taxpayers expect from their Government.
Mr "economist", :ROFL: :ROFL: your taxes aren't paying for shit,
Ron Paul said it best
"The Chinese are our masters now"
JeanClaude like you I'm NOT American and I speak Chinese already so I'm ready for when the Chinese take over the world.
You got a link to that article?
good article, Mike!
I knew something wasn't right when the price of gold and silver dipped in the beginning of 2010. The prices of basic staples - have gone up a lot. Vegetables are 20 to a 100% (tomatos are now $3.50 to $4.00 per lb in a supermarket!! ) more expensive than they were just 3 months ago which would indicate dollar loosing it's value which in turn would indicate the price of gold and silver going up.
I'm not an economics or a finance pro like some of you guys, but my gut feeleng tells me to keep my money in gold and silver for a year or two, then maybe put a portion if it into real estate.
So this trip, I can only speak about what’s changed in NY. For one thing…the price of virtually everything has doubled in the 5 years I’ve been away…literally doubled. $5 for a Sunday Times? $8 for an order of onion rings? $85 for a Knickerbockers T-Bone for 2 that used to be $40? How anyone affords taxis in the city anymore is a mystery.
There is a organization called GATA (Gold Anti Trust Association) that has been exploring this issue of only paper being traded at the COMEX and in London. Apparently there is a whistle blower from Goldman Sachs who recently (March 23rd '10) provided proof that the gold market is being manipulated by JP Morgan and Chase. This is so they could make profits in the short selling of the metal and to suppress the cost of gold.
So this trip, I can only speak about what’s changed in NY. For one thing…the price of virtually everything has doubled in the 5 years I’ve been away…literally doubled. $5 for a Sunday Times? $8 for an order of onion rings? $85 for a Knickerbockers T-Bone for 2 that used to be $40? How anyone affords taxis in the city anymore is a mystery.
Starbucks just announc€ed they are stopping 401K contributions and:o :o Oops
cutting 7000 employees.
There is a organization called GATA (Gold Anti Trust Association) that has been exploring this issue of only paper being traded at the COMEX and in London. Apparently there is a whistle blower from Goldman Sachs who recently (March 23rd '10) provided proof that the gold market is being manipulated by JP Morgan and Chase. This is so they could make profits in the short selling of the metal and to suppress the cost of gold.
There is a organization called GATA (Gold Anti Trust Association) that has been exploring this issue of only paper being traded at the COMEX and in London. Apparently there is a whistle blower from Goldman Sachs who recently (March 23rd '10) provided proof that the gold market is being manipulated by JP Morgan and Chase. This is so they could make profits in the short selling of the metal and to suppress the cost of gold.
Isnt this illegal?
How about actually owning gold in a vault (preferably Switzerland as FDR outlawed gold ownership in 1932).
http://www.bullionvault.com/?gclid=CP-n1syl7qACFUKZ2AodMUHlNw
Quotemy gut feeleng tells me to keep my money in gold and silver for a year or two, then maybe put a portion if it into real estate.
Go with your gut!
@cufflinks,
You got a link to that article?
There is a organization called GATA (Gold Anti Trust Association) that has been exploring this issue of only paper being traded at the COMEX and in London. Apparently there is a whistle blower from Goldman Sachs who recently (March 23rd '10) provided proof that the gold market is being manipulated by JP Morgan and Chase. This is so they could make profits in the short selling of the metal and to suppress the cost of gold.
The limitation on gold ownership in the U.S. was repealed after President Gerald Ford signed a bill legalizing private ownership of gold coins, bars and certificates by an act of Congress codified in Pub.L. 93-373 which went into effect December 31, 1974.So the abolishment of slavery in 1863 is proof that slavery never existed before that?.
http://www.fdic.gov/regulations/laws/rules/5000-200.html
JC for a trained economist you seem to miss a lot of important events regarding economic markets around the world.
There is a organization called GATA (Gold Anti Trust Association) that has been exploring this issue of only paper being traded at the COMEX and in London. Apparently there is a whistle blower from Goldman Sachs who recently (March 23rd '10) provided proof that the gold market is being manipulated by JP Morgan and Chase. This is so they could make profits in the short selling of the metal and to suppress the cost of gold.
Isnt this illegal?
How about actually owning gold in a vault (preferably Switzerland as FDR outlawed gold ownership in 1932).
http://www.bullionvault.com/?gclid=CP-n1syl7qACFUKZ2AodMUHlNw
Westcoast:QuoteThe limitation on gold ownership in the U.S. was repealed after President Gerald Ford signed a bill legalizing private ownership of gold coins, bars and certificates by an act of Congress codified in Pub.L. 93-373 which went into effect December 31, 1974.So the abolishment of slavery in 1863 is proof that slavery never existed before that?.
http://www.fdic.gov/regulations/laws/rules/5000-200.html
Does the 1974 legislation remburs-ed the gold stolen by the fed?
Sorry my brain doesn't do libtardlogic. If the government can outlaw the possession of gold, it can do so again. I wonder if everybody who was forced to sell his/her gold to the federal reserve, was duly compensated for the theft in 1974. Oh that's right, that never happened.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_6102
Executive Order 6102 required U.S. citizens to deliver on or before May 1, 1933 all but a small amount gold coin, gold bullion, and gold certificates owned by them to the Federal Reserve, in exchange for $20.67 per troy ounce. Under the Trading With the Enemy Act of October 6, 1917, as amended on March 9, 1933, violation of the order was punishable by fine up to $10,000 ($166,640 if adjusted for inflation as of 2008) or up to ten years in prison, or both.QuoteJC for a trained economist you seem to miss a lot of important events regarding economic markets around the world.
I was warning people (who are thinking of buying gold) that the US government has set a precedent of outright steeling gold from its citizens. How this warning can be translated in being unknowlegable about the 1974 (almost 40 years later) "legalisation" of gold ownership is only possible in a mind that suffers from libtardlogic.
Besides I am wondering how you could graduate from an education in economics and not even know what a IDC is or how a gold standard works.
JC perhaps you should do a little more reading before advising people to own gold and hide it in a bank vault in Switzerland. Even if people did buy gold and place the gold in a vault in Switzerland they would still have to fill out Treasury Department Form 90-22.1 every year if they own, or have an interest in, any foreign bank accounts this includes gold in a safety deposit box in a bank in Switzerland. http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/article/0,,id=210249,00.html#FA6
JC I fully understand how the gold standard works I've read about it extensively and even read the part of Jesus Huerta de Soto's text dealing with it.
What I've never been able to find out is how a country especially one as economically large as the US would return to the gold standard.
JC if people are going to worry about what the government did in the past and think that the government might repeat the legislation perhaps women, non-whites and non property owning white males should worry about losing the vote.
Most of what you post is either wrong or not on point.
....JC, guess what we have here already in NL? Yes you pay tax on savings already above X amount. They assume you get a Y% interest rate as well, if you get less you're screwed anyway and you'll lose money....
The last 3 presidents where fiscal socialist (Bush=borrow and spend, Obama=tax, borrow,print and spend) Americans have now voted someone for president who is far more socialist then FDR ever was, and is now proposing a tax on savings (wait a minute, didn't people pay income tax already?). The very definition of socialism is (Obama quote) "spreading the wealth around".
....JC, guess what we have here already in NL? Yes you pay tax on savings already above X amount. They assume you get a Y% interest rate as well, if you get less you're screwed anyway and you'll lose money....
The last 3 presidents where fiscal socialist (Bush=borrow and spend, Obama=tax, borrow,print and spend) Americans have now voted someone for president who is far more socialist then FDR ever was, and is now proposing a tax on savings (wait a minute, didn't people pay income tax already?). The very definition of socialism is (Obama quote) "spreading the wealth around".
Another nice tax we have is on inheritance. Can vary between 10% and 40% depending on your relation to the deceased person....
Time for some change here, I hope the upcoming elections will bring some :popcorn: I'm fed up paying a lot of taxes for a lot of things but receiving back close to 0 every year for this >:(
Chances are slim though. Government has to achieve saving of about 5% of the total GDP, which of course they'll try to achieve by cutting on important things like education and of course raising some taxes or costs on health insurance It would be better if they cut a lot of those useless and inefficient government employees
I hear Wilders wants to fire 50% of all government employees, how is he doing in the polls?Not that well since the Social Democrats/Labour Party (PvdA) decided to chose a Jewish guy as their runner. How ironic, the majority of the Muslims will have to vote for the Jew, since it's the party they usually vote for ;)
http://whitelocust.wordpress.com/2010/02/21/is-this-how-democracy-ends-by-patrick-j-buchanan/
I used to think it would take a great financial crisis to get both parties to the table, but we just had one,”
William Hoagland, a former adviser to the Senate Republican leadership on fiscal policy.
This week, a smoke detector went off. China, in December, had unloaded $45 billion of its $790 billion in T-bills. Is Beijing is bailing out?
Later this year or early next, to avoid a debt crisis, Obama will ask Congress to raise taxes and pare back entitlement programs. Republicans will fight the taxes to the last ditch. Democrats, having lost dozens of colleagues in the November massacre, will rebel against the cuts in social spending.
And a paralyzed government will drift closer toward the maelstrom.
QuoteJC perhaps you should do a little more reading before advising people to own gold and hide it in a bank vault in Switzerland. Even if people did buy gold and place the gold in a vault in Switzerland they would still have to fill out Treasury Department Form 90-22.1 every year if they own, or have an interest in, any foreign bank accounts this includes gold in a safety deposit box in a bank in Switzerland. http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/article/0,,id=210249,00.html#FA6
Why are you advising people to not comply with the tax code? BTW tax avoidance is not the same as tax evasion. Trust funds can be set up cheaply (this format is very popular in the medical profession).QuoteJC I fully understand how the gold standard works I've read about it extensively and even read the part of Jesus Huerta de Soto's text dealing with it.
No you don't! And your next quote is proof of this!QuoteWhat I've never been able to find out is how a country especially one as economically large as the US would return to the gold standard.
On 5 march 1971 the USA went off the gold standard, at that same time the USA had the largest manufacturing base in the world (not the phony inflated bubble service economy we see now). So accordion to your liberal logic, that could not even be possible.
This is the second time you delete historical fact from your conscience, I am real curious how your brain works!
You avoided many questions I asked on the legal aspects of an IDC, so that alone is proof you never studied economics or banking laws, nor did you explain the LEGAL difference between an IDC and a Mutuum contract.QuoteJC if people are going to worry about what the government did in the past and think that the government might repeat the legislation perhaps women, non-whites and non property owning white males should worry about losing the vote.
If Americans were crazy enough to vote for a KKK clansman for president nonwhites would have to start worrying about Jim Crow Laws 2.0.
The last 3 presidents where fiscal socialist (Bush=borrow and spend, Obama=tax, borrow,print and spend) Americans have now voted someone for president who is far more socialist then FDR ever was, and is now proposing a tax on savings (wait a minute, didn't people pay income tax already?). The very definition of socialism is (Obama quote) "spreading the wealth around".QuoteMost of what you post is either wrong or not on point.
People like you, who think stealing by government is OK, cannot be expected to tell the truth. So i will take your last statement for what it is, ..
Please JC explain how putting the USA back on the gold standard. The US still has by far the largest manufacturing base in the world. Far larger than China or India.
You avoided many questions I asked on the legal aspects of an IDC, so that alone is proof you never studied economics or banking laws, nor did you explain the LEGAL difference between an IDC and a Mutuum contract.
QuotePlease JC explain how putting the USA back on the gold standard. The US still has by far the largest manufacturing base in the world. Far larger than China or India.
I am not your stooge, i am not going to explain it again for the 10th time.
something else i keep repeating is this question of mineQuoteYou avoided many questions I asked on the legal aspects of an IDC, so that alone is proof you never studied economics or banking laws, nor did you explain the LEGAL difference between an IDC and a Mutuum contract.
Answer?
This is the bombshell about the recent happenings in regard to gold and silver manipulation by JP Morgan and Goldman Sachs.
<<WARNING>> if you read it you might start believing in conspiracies :laugh:
http://www.marketskeptics.com/
Maxx
This is the bombshell about the recent happenings in regard to gold and silver manipulation by JP Morgan and Goldman Sachs.
<<WARNING>> if you read it you might start believing in conspiracies :laugh:
http://www.marketskeptics.com/
Maxx
Apparently this has been going on for years without anything being done. If you do a Google search on the subject you will find the same type of articles going back to the beginning of the decade.
Too easy. :laugh:
QuoteToo easy. :laugh:
I wonder how EASY you are going to survive on your retirement when gold gets to be 10.000 an ounce.
USA=Weimar republic part 2.0
Look at all themdollarmark bills,.., tomatos costing 5 bucks a kilo, you aint seen nothing yet!!
(http://www.kitco.com/ind/Degraaf/images/nov212008_2.jpg)
Just spent a hour this morning watching a business program this morning. The program was live and dealt extensively with the price of gold and its price movements over the last couple of years. Not once was the manipulation of gold prices mentioned. The gold market in London was not mentioned at all.
Just spent a hour this morning watching a business program this morning. The program was live and dealt extensively with the price of gold and its price movements over the last couple of years. Not once was the manipulation of gold prices mentioned. The gold market in London was not mentioned at all.
After the hearing, according to Douglas, Murphy was contacted by several major media outlets for more interviews. Within 24 hours, all the interviews were canceled. All of them.
Very Interesting list - see silver coins of first half of last century:
http://inflation.us/coins/
The preferred coin among myself and my peers in the business is the Canadian Maple leaf. Reason being is that it is 99.99% fine gold and not alloyed with base metals like the US Eagle (90%) and SA Rand (91.66%). The later two have to be refined (what I do) to pure metal (like the Maple Leaf) in order to be used for where gold is usually consumed (dental and jewelry alloys).
Love him or hate him, Rolling Stone's Matt Taibbi always offers an interesting read.
I bought my Girl a nice golden necklace, why stick it in a vault somewhere if you can put it inside jewelry.Hey Mark, don't know if you were just joking or serious, but I want to make sure that you realise that buying a piece of jewelry at a jewelry store does not equal investment in gold? Typically investment grade gold is gold bullion 99.999% pure gold. You can buy it in a form of gold bars or coins. Coins usually hold an additional "collector" value so they run a bit more than a gold bullion bar. Here in the states the most popular investment gold coins are "American eagle", Canadian "Maple Leaf" and "American Buffalo" 1 oz. pure gold.
Very Interesting list - see silver coins of first half of last century:
http://inflation.us/coins/
I hear the US allows minting of your own "liberty dollars". I am looking for some Ron Paul Liberty dollars, coins with his silhouette.
Max:
I need to correct my post upthread.
What can you tell me about the resale value of these gold coins?
Austria 100 corona -- 1915 restrikes, gold bullion coins
Fineness: .900
Actual Gold Content: 0.9803 troy ounce
Minted face value: 100 corona
Notice they're slightly less than one full ounce of gold. Wonder why? Maybe the original molds they're using from 1915 were flawed in some way?
Max:
I need to correct my post upthread.
What can you tell me about the resale value of these gold coins?
Austria 100 corona -- 1915 restrikes, gold bullion coins
Fineness: .900
Actual Gold Content: 0.9803 troy ounce
Minted face value: 100 corona
Notice they're slightly less than one full ounce of gold. Wonder why? Maybe the original molds they're using from 1915 were flawed in some way?
Expert analysis and feedback welcome - though snarky comments best kept to onseself :smokin:
Expert analysis and feedback welcome - though snarky comments best kept to onseself :smokin:
Personally, I'd NEVER consider buying such an investment.
OK, cufflinks,
thanks for the explanation.
OK, cufflinks,
thanks for the explanation.
That said Professor Shiller an economics professor at Yale Univeristy was on a news show this weekend stating in reality there is a massive shadow inventory of real estate in arrears and eventually pending foreclosure and that banks and that the Fed and Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae are trying to hold off the market in order to prop up the value of the remaining banks balance sheets and that if fact eventually this inventory will flood the markets and supply demand laws will "equillibrate" as they always do and there should be some amazing Real Estate discounts available in most regions of the country over the next 24 to 36 months.
Absolutely the right strategy to keep your powder dry (invest in gold and other assets) till this real estate thing unwinds so you can buy for pennies on the dollar. As of now, avoid real estate!
Absolutely the right strategy to keep your powder dry (invest in gold and other assets) till this real estate thing unwinds so you can buy for pennies on the dollar. As of now, avoid real estate!
I have a close friend who just lost $500,000 in a real estate deal in Phoenix AZ. Rental properties that he owns that are costing him a bundle every month. He's about to walk away from the whole deal. Instead he is teaming up with me on making gold buys from the public. He was like many here who has disdain for gold "no earned interest" etc. Real estate is not the only thing that is unwinding.
Maxx
Absolutely the right strategy to keep your powder dry (invest in gold and other assets) till this real estate thing unwinds so you can buy for pennies on the dollar. As of now, avoid real estate!
I have a close friend who just lost $500,000 in a real estate deal in Phoenix AZ. Rental properties that he owns that are costing him a bundle every month. He's about to walk away from the whole deal. Instead he is teaming up with me on making gold buys from the public. He was like many here who has disdain for gold "no earned interest" etc. Real estate is not the only thing that is unwinding.
Maxx
Maxx, what is this rumour i am hearing the IMF is selling off all of its gold and pushing down the price to maybe 800-500 and ounce? In a last ditch attempt to save the USD before all goes south like the Weimar Republic?
Why buy milk when you can buy the cow?
I've spent many years working in gold mines, the fascination with this shiny metal has been lost. To me it is just another commodity that some people are willing to pay ridiculous prices for.
I agree with many that holding physical gold is a good store of wealth, but it remains nothing but a dead asset. If you believe that the price of gold will increase dramatically, it would make a lot more sense to me to invest in gold mining companies. You get a lot more leverage as the price increases.
I like to have some exposure to gold in my investments, and have accomplished this by owning shares of mining exploration companies that have proven gold resources in the ground. This is probably one of the riskiest ways to provide gold diversification, but the rewards can be outrageous.
BCKev - would appreciate your opinion of these companies:
http://inflation.us/stockupdates2.html
Shakes - great post and good healthy scepticism - may I ask and probe a little more why you would never consider this investment -
Shakes - great post and good healthy scepticism - may I ask and probe a little more why you would never consider this investment -
I have a rule - if it takes more than one page (front and back) typset to explain the investment, I want no part in it.
BCKev - would appreciate your opinion of these companies:
http://inflation.us/stockupdates2.html
Hey Cuff, here's a quick and dirty opinion on your list of gold and silver stocks.
Overall it is a pretty good list of solid companies. Some would be much riskier than others: EGI and IVN are not producers, but appear to have some decent projects going; CGLD has only one operating mine and many of the companies have the benefit of multiple operating mines.
RGLD and SLW are not mining companies, but royalty companies. This could be an interesting way to play the Au/Ag price with some insulation from operational or political problems and good diversification by having revenue streams from multiple mines, companies and jurisdictions. Franco-Nevada (FNV) is another well known gold royalty company, a guy could learn a lot reading through their website. I've read good things about SLW over the past year.
Unless you are willing to spend a lot of time researching these outfits and keeping up with their operations, I figure you would be a lot safer either going with one of the royalty companies, or with the mid to large gold producers (AUY, EGO, GG, NEM, ABX).
I have no opinion on the current share price of any of these, ie.: whether this is a good time to buy or not.
Great feedback - may I ask the technical difference between a mining company and a "royalty" company?
Whaddya think, is there a market for these puppies in North America? :chuckle:
http://www.breakingtravelnews.com/news/article/emirates-palace-goes-for-gold/
Brass
might take a lot more than 3 goons to lift a machine full of gold... :nod:Whaddya think, is there a market for these puppies in North America? :chuckle:
http://www.breakingtravelnews.com/news/article/emirates-palace-goes-for-gold/
Brass
Considering that a very popular crime in our area is to steal one armed bandits - er ah um Private ATMs from Convenience stores in the wee hours by the Smash with a Truck and grab method - wrap a very heavy duty steal chain around it and then gun the truck motor with the chain attached to the tow hitch and then get 3 big goons (accomplices) to toss it into the back of the truck and take it to a clandestine chop shop and divide the loot - the Gold Machine would last about a day or two :smokin:
Gold is at 1150 usd and rising, .......anyone scared yet?
http://www.youtube.com/user/geraldcelente#p/u/8/1pOC0eHaeA8
Gold is at 1150 usd and rising, .......anyone scared yet?
http://www.youtube.com/user/geraldcelente#p/u/8/1pOC0eHaeA8
Six months later and Gold is at $1270 per ounce. That's an increase of 10%.
Silver from $17.50 to $20.50 an increase of 15%
That is the same day Gold will fly to ...heck that could be over 6000 USD , and probably see the return to Rosevelt-like confiscation of all privatly held gold.
Well same highly regarded Montreal Investment Advisor now feels USA Sunbelt (Eduard's neck of the Palms) is best value in a lifetime:
Forget Home-Builder Stocks; Buy Real Estate Properties Directly for Real Yield & High Value Eric Roseman (September 8, 2010)
Montreal, Canada
Some big names in the hedge fund business are currently long and strong the home-builders. Master trader, John Paulson, whose hedge funds circumvented betting against mortgage-backed securities with Goldman Sachs four years ago, is now long the home-building stocks. The man who helped bring down housing now likes the sector. Can you believe this guy?
I’ve got some respect for Paulson because he’s a gold bull. Yeah, he’s got a few more bucks than I do, but in all fairness, I was bullish on gold long before he was. The same goes for Soros.
In all honesty, I have little respect for these hedge fund types because they’re fickle characters; one day in and the next out, regardless of fundamentals. Not my style.
If you’re worried about financial markets like I am and don’t believe we’ve seen the ultimate bottom in stock prices, then consider real estate. I’m talking about distressed residential properties in the sunbelt either for a personal dwelling or rental.
I just made my first offer on a condominium in Montreal. Rates are super low and high-end Montreal residential real estate is still attractive compared to cities like Toronto and Vancouver. I just paid $366 per square foot for one of the best buildings in Montreal. That’s not expensive.
I’m also interested in properties in the ravaged sunbelt. To get an idea about how bad things still are in Florida check out Zillow.com ( http://www.zillow.com/local-info/FL-home-value/r_14/ )
I’ve been harping on this for more than a year. Though the real estate market might not have bottomed yet in the United States, now is the time to start hunting for bargains.
Some real estate bears I know – and they might be right – believe the market hasn’t hit a floor yet as the economy waffles again. But the numbers say otherwise.
As a Canadian or a foreigner, U.S. real estate is cheap. Financing is now at a 40-year low. And the Canadian dollar, at about 1.05 USD, is still a great trade at this price for the Yankee buck.
If you’re planning on living somewhere in the sun, then now is the time to start looking for bargains.
Who really cares if prices decline another 10%? Isn’t that just being greedy? Prices have already crashed up to 50% in some markets.
If you plan on living in your new home or condo in Miami, Orlando or Las Vegas, or perhaps considering renting that property out for income, does it really matter what the market does over the next few years?
I don’t think it matters, unless you’re objective is to flip that property.
I’d be a buyer in places like Florida, California, Nevada and Arizona. Value investors buy when there’s Blood in the Streets. I’m not sure if waiting for a Massacre on Elm Street is going to happen. Prices are already way down and it’s a big buyer’s market. United States sunbelt property is the bargain of the century.
Though the real estate market might not have bottomed yet in the United States, now is the time to start hunting for bargains.
Roseman is a very highly regarded Montreal Based fund manager
Roseman is a very highly regarded Montreal Based fund manager
Probably a moron who cares more about being highly regarded than telling the truth.
Roseman is a very highly regarded Montreal Based fund manager
Probably a moron who cares more about being highly regarded than telling the truth.
Now Maxxy - he is actually a huge gold proponent and has been for 20 years - he really is just like you. (Almost) :biggrin:
Roseman is a very highly regarded Montreal Based fund manager
Probably a moron who cares more about being highly regarded than telling the truth.
Now Maxxy - he is actually a huge gold proponent and has been for 20 years - he really is just like you. (Almost) :biggrin:
So he's a KOOK? (Keeper Of Odd Knowledge)
although the real estate prices did drop in Russia by about 10 or 15% seems like they are now back to the same level as before the bubble burst. And even though there are many apartments on the market the prices seem to just stay at this very high level.
Do you guys think they are going to have the same thing happen like we have here sometine in the future, or will real estate there just keep going up?
[
Well Moscow has by what I was told and saw up to 20 Million people in the Metro Area with a housing shortage and being as it is both the financial and political power center of all Russia it attracts career motivated people from all Russia and all the world - fueled by Hong Kong style 15% low taxes, the periodic table of elements in the ground across 13 time zones and an arbitrage on the production costs of raw and manufactured industrial materials versus EU UK and USA/NA and the fact that there will never be a Fed Reserve hyper bubble as like the USA sunbelt as there is simply far more demand than Supply and even with cranes everywhere New Modern Construction is uber costly so old Arbat like Row 6 to 10 story Apt buildings over looking the Lotte center and close to every thing and the Metro have likely corrected as low as they will after the "financial crisis" and even the Margined Billionaires who saw wealth dissolve from 30 B to 3 B are back up around $13B now and not much likely to margin on debt like before but still sizable and growing wealth by any standards. Moscow is called the City of Billionaires and almost all self made as no one inherited much beyond an education from pre-perestroika Russia.
I didn't read through all the 12 pages, but I feel Peter Schiff should be mentioned in this thread, he is an expert on this subject;
Too bad he recently lost the election for republican candidate for senator in Connecticut though, this guy could probably do much to enlighten US economic politics.
His answers are probably quite similar to Celente's, allthough I think Schiff is maybe even better at explaining how the economy works and why dollarinflation or even -hyperinflation in the nearest future is inevitable.
[/b]
That is the same day Gold will fly to ...heck that could be over 6000 USD , and probably see the return to Rosevelt-like confiscation of all privatly held gold.
This time it will be different. People have no trust in the government unlike in the thirties. Gold and silver will be swapped back and forth for needed goods. They won't turn it in. Dumb guys :) like Andrew and Turbo will wished they had some.
Hi Ray,[/b]
That is the same day Gold will fly to ...heck that could be over 6000 USD , and probably see the return to Rosevelt-like confiscation of all privatly held gold.
This time it will be different. People have no trust in the government unlike in the thirties. Gold and silver will be swapped back and forth for needed goods. They won't turn it in. Dumb guys :) like Andrew and Turbo will wished they had some.
Don't hold your breath on that one. Over the last 80 years or so the real return on investments in gold is 1%. Gold is the same as tulip bulbs were hundreds of years ago. You are not investing in gold. You are speculating. There are lots of other ways to speculate as well.
My gold investment is limited to one $ 10.00 gold coin my dad bought me as a Christmas present when I was a teen for $ 19.95. Too bad he didn't buy more of them.
You will be saying the same about yourself someday. You do not seem to have much knowledge about the fiscally insanity of government economic policies. Two years of 1.4 trillion dollar deficits and "trillion dollar deficits as far as the eye can see".
“Either a swift economic recovery or further dismal economic performance should bring new buyers into the market,” said Eugen Weinberg, an analyst at Commerzbank AG in Frankfurt who was the most accurate forecaster in the first quarter and expects the metal to rise as high as $1,400 next year. “A stronger economy would create more jewelry demand. If the economy stays weak or gets worse, then investors will be looking for a safe haven.”
Maxx, if you think the world as we know it is going to end then perhaps gold might have some value.
Personally I think can's of soup might have more value in that scenario.
Even in the great depression the dollar still had value.
I do think the Tea Party is evidence that the American people won't let that happen.
I personally think we have big problems but just as in the 80's when interest rates and inflation were rampant we will survive this.
Gold is @ $1,273 per ounce already and silver @ $20.78
Great news for those of us who are holding PM but very sad for our economy because what this really means is that the Dollar is loosing it's value fast!
Any price it sells for on top of that is speculation.
Also a weak dollar is good for creating jobs and selling USA manufactured goods globally.
Turbo, talking to you is like talking to someone who is suffering from "cognative dissonance"
So what does gold have to give it value.
It's pretty,
Trying to convince me of something I don't believe in is
QuoteSo what does gold have to give it value.
Here it comes,QuoteIt's pretty,
Game over dude!
Economics is not a cargo cult science, but a true science.
I hate to say it but there are small fortunes to be made picking up the pieces of others shattered lives now...
Everyone told me to buy buy buy in 2007 and I drove around Nashua, Merrimack and Hudson New Hampshire - the only state rated in the Top 10 Business Climates (PM me I have the PDF report if interested) in the NE USA - NY and NJ rated 48 and 49 if I recall correctly and MA around 40 - NH is Number 7 and we have an unemployment rate 3 points below MA 8.8%. I could see problems and kept my powder dry.
Our state directory of manufacturers is over 3,000 companies.
Yet there is over 3,000,000 sq ft vacant in old Mill, Industrial Park and Office space and that is not including the cities of Manchester and Concord or Rochester. The best rental neighborhoods (owner occupied 1, 2, 3, and 4 families which you could only get into via the local church networking to the owners all now have permanent for rent signs.
And yet the bubble burst at a AFI to Home Price ratio of 4 here in NH - was 13 in San Diego and over 10 in most FL and other Sunbelt locations.
Bottom line is Realtytrac reported last night that the banks are sitting on over 900,000 REOs and only a third are on the market ostensibly to "keep the market from panicking"
WTF - the fact that the real Shadow inventory according to shadow stats may be 5 Million homes going under with 900,000 REOs right now shows that both the major parties are going into the midterms petrified at what may happen knowing full well the FDIC will have to put several hundred more banks into the grinder to be absorbed by healthy banks - but wait with 5 Million shadow inventory the sad fact is all the banks or institutions holding mortgages will see the market value of their "assets" plummet after the elections and the only thing that will work is another RTC which will sell homes to anyone willing to paint and rent them at Detroit style home prices. So really there are no healthy banks and they will be dumping REOs in the vain hope of saving their banks and jobs - Fannie and Freddie are cooked and Credit Cards are staying at 30% for almost all small business owners for the foreseeable future.
The Sunbelt home values are really cooked and the diversified economies like New England or Texas that never went over 4 times the average family income to average home value will survive but just about everyone who bought at the peak will be tempted to strategically default and 2011 is going to be a time of blood running in the streets and incredible opportunities to redeploy housing at mark to market values (Very steep discounts).
So Gold and Silver will surely not correct any time soon and money is to be made in the carnage. The politicians are clearly manipulating the banks and markets to keep the excess shadow home inventory off the market and not have 5 Million more ultra pissed off angry new TEA party voters before election day.
Sigh,
Let me give you some insight into how science works
If I changed my hat from assistant student to teacher and was to grade your definition of "how science works" I would be generous to give you a D.
Sigh,
Let me give you some insight into how science works
Theories explain observable facts, that doesnt make the theory= "the truth" because the instruments have finite accuracy. The more accurate the instruments, the more accurate the observation and measurements of facts, that is why theories change, because we "see" new facts that is in contradiction with existing thought.
Economics:
With economics (with the exception of the Austrian school) it is more like this
:'( :'( :'( hitting your head against the same wall over and over
JC it is interesting that someone like you would be from the Austrian School of Economics.
Your background is in pure mathematics yet Austrians reject that mathematics can adequately replicate complex human actions.
Austrians favour the use of logical deduction and tend to avoid mathematics.
Your poor wife((
She hasn't suggested speculating in gold however.
QuoteJC it is interesting that someone like you would be from the Austrian School of Economics.
Because...QuoteYour background is in pure mathematics yet Austrians reject that mathematics can adequately replicate complex human actions.
And they are correct, mathematics cannot solve non linear systems analytically, because they are not based on causality. Every freshman in mathematics knows this.QuoteAustrians favour the use of logical deduction and tend to avoid mathematics.
:ROFL: :ROFL: :ROFL:
Mathematics is the application of rigorous logic!
Most Keynesian economists (95%) are not mathematicans!
Most "climatologists" tend not to be phycisist, (Like the head of the IPCC,he is a railroad engineer from India :ROFL: )
Oh brother, well it does explain why you are Kenesyan, all mathematicians with an advanced degree are Austrians. Not all mathematicians are honest people who think stealing is wrong, but that is another story.
Once again statements with no references to back them up.
I seriously doubt that all mathematicians with graduate degrees are Austrians
I will also add if your owning gold than your saying your a financial idiot and you have no idea how to invest. Compare gold from 1975 to 2010. Lowest gold was is $50 to current price. Not that great of return as stock market has out performed that. Only a couple years was it under $300 in those 35 years. So 4 times investment unless you bought all time low and sol all time high. Very low return. Dow Jones has grown more than gold even with the crash.
Gold is for people who have no clue about the market and is safe when in the $300 to $600 range. When you buy gold over this amount your taking on risk.
Also a weak dollar is good for creating jobs and selling USA manufactured goods globally.
Come on... Get a clue!... :whistle: Are you calling us precious metal investors idiots for investing in gold??? Are you calling George Soros idiot for his betting on gold? I want to thank you for that. I know that I'm doing it right.
It is just a matter of time when our American economy and society will collapse... I don't know when, but it is gonna happen for sure. Get ready for this!
QuoteShe hasn't suggested speculating in gold however.
Your skull is real thick, again for the xxx time... I do not speculate in gold. <== please repeat 10x so your memory retains it.
Maybe you can take my previous multiple choice question and show it to your sudent wife!
I bought gold at 860 , I am laughing my ass off!
PS: I did not "double" my money, I prevented my savings from being halved!
I bought gold at 860 , I am laughing my ass off!
PS: I did not "double" my money, I prevented my savings from being halved!
Ah, by the way JC, I am gathering from the posts here that you are a mathmetician. Cool, howeverQuoteI bought gold at 860 , I am laughing my ass off!
PS: I did not "double" my money, I prevented my savings from being halved!
Bought at $ 860.00 Currently at $ 1275.00 or so, JC, double your money would not be until $ 1720.00. If you want I can send you the times tables like I learned in school.
I can send you the times tables like I learned in school.I see you learned calculus and economics from the central bank of Zimbabwe
Also, if the US goes bankrupt the entire world does as well. China, Japan, India, Mexico, Canada, and Brazil so tied into USA they will get dragged down as well.
Ah, by the way JC, I am gathering from the posts here that you are a mathmetician. Cool, howeverQuoteI bought gold at 860 , I am laughing my ass off!
PS: I did not "double" my money, I prevented my savings from being halved!
Bought at $ 860.00 Currently at $ 1275.00 or so, JC, double your money would not be until $ 1720.00. If you want I can send you the times tables like I learned in school.
By the way, if I were a teacher grading your post I would give it an A+.
JC, I get it, you and Turbo disagree, but do you have to be so mean and nasty to him?
More and more countries view gold as metal and not currency. Its very risky just like diamonds and the stock market longterm has grown a lot more. Gold is a good buy less than $600 usd. Look at it longterm prices. Past 40 years it is usually under $600 usd. Also it was high 30 years ago and crashed. Right now many investment companies are hyping gold on TV, radio, etc but there positions are it crashing. They want to hype up prices and when it goes back down to normal levels they make a windfall. They did the same thing with oil and even held oil in tankers to drive up prices.
More and more countries view gold as metal and not currency. Its very risky just like diamonds and the stock market longterm has grown a lot more. Gold is a good buy less than $600 usd. Look at it longterm prices. Past 40 years it is usually under $600 usd. Also it was high 30 years ago and crashed. Right now many investment companies are hyping gold on TV, radio, etc but there positions are it crashing. They want to hype up prices and when it goes back down to normal levels they make a windfall. They did the same thing with oil and even held oil in tankers to drive up prices.
Obviously, we do not see eye to eye on those beautiful and shiny metals... It is apparent that you are looking at gold from a pure investment point of view, whereas I am looking at gold from a "cash" point of view. I simply buy gold and silver bullions to preserve or increase my purchasing power...
Sure, gold is viewed as metal... However, I am betting on my money that gold/silver are going to be viewed as currency down the road. It would happen when the whole fiat currency becomes completely worthless due to excessive government printing or hyperinflation. Free market wants gold/silver as a medium of exchange...
I have absolutely no desire to hold all of those funny looking "US Dollar" that screams "Federal Reserve Note". It is really nothing more than a bank IOU backed by debt or government's promissory notes. US Dollar is really nothing more than a debt-backed currency. Why in the world would I want to hold a bank liability?
What can I get when I want to redeem this funny looking "Federal Reserve Note"? NOTHING!!! Why in the world would I want to work hard to earn just this piece of paper that is backed by nothing but debt??
All I want is honest money, where the value of the medium of exchange cannot be manipulated at will, and is not born from or backed by a debt-based system... I believe that Gold/silver-backed money is the best solution for the honest monetary system...
some smart people I know believe that we are heading toward the greatest depression this country has ever seen and hyperinflation that's gonna make "The great depression" look like a walk in the park. They say that at this point the train is a "runaway" and can't be stopped.Ifwhen this happens it is very likely that precious metals will become "money". $1.00 is probably gonna be worth 1 ruble or less.
I love this country and it saddens me beyond words to watch politicians (both Democrats and Republicans) destroying it.
More and more countries view gold as metal and not currency.
NEW DELHI -- India's central bank bought 200 metric tons of gold from the International Monetary Fund last month, in the first major move by a major central bank to diversify its foreign-exchange reserves.
Analysts said the move is potentially bullish for gold, but it is by no means the start of a significant shift away from U.S. dollar holdings. The Reserve Bank of India said in a statement that the move was part of its effort to manage its foreign-exchange reserves.
Maybe part of it is faith Eduard.
I do think layoffs are close to the bottom
If Obama turns out to be a two term president and Democrats retain control of the house and senate, we are probably done for.
The goverment needs to realize we can't afford everything we could posibly want and at this stage they don't seem to.
Turbo:QuoteMaybe part of it is faith Eduard.
Faith? Change we can believe in.
Turbo:QuoteI do think layoffs are close to the bottom
Really? so the marxist policy of Statist central planning , bail out and economic intervention did work?
Turbo:QuoteIf Obama turns out to be a two term president and Democrats retain control of the house and senate, we are probably done for.
True, just look at the track record of Republicans, all I see is real economic growth instead of the pyramid schemes (aka bubbles) we are so familiar with!
Turbo:QuoteThe goverment needs to realize we can't afford everything we could posibly want and at this stage they don't seem to.
Dont worry, when the Chinese, Japanese, Saudi's, Indians, Brazilians decide to stop picking your cotton for free, its pretty much "game over"
Those who couldn't compete and had to close thier doors have done so. Those who are left seem to have reached the point where they are most likely to survive and a few are even prospering because of less competition.
The track record of Republicans is far better than the Democrats as far as providing an environment that is good for business.
There are lots of things that could make it "game over".
For example the Chinese need a place to sell their cheap DVD players and we are still the biggest export market.
Turbo:QuoteThose who couldn't compete and had to close thier doors have done so. Those who are left seem to have reached the point where they are most likely to survive and a few are even prospering because of less competition.
the facts are totally different arent they?
What actually happened is that those who could not compete got bailout money stolen from people (taxes) who were fiscally responsible, so we have government thugs using threat of force to kill businesses who are doing well. No bottoming out at all, government dug a deeper hole!!!
Turbo:QuoteThe track record of Republicans is far better than the Democrats as far as providing an environment that is good for business.
I was being sarcastic actually. My perception of reality is based on laws passed and growth of government, "lesser of to evils" means only a delay of the inevitable. Lowering your speed only means you drive off the cliff a few hours later, but driving off the cliff you still do.
There are lots of things that could make it "game over".
QuoteFor example the Chinese need a place to sell their cheap DVD players and we are still the biggest export market.
Little physics lesson, look at pic below, the kid is pushing his dad while seated on a beackseat
(http://www.cartoonstock.com/lowres/shu0503l.jpg)
What will happen?
[ ] The kid pushing adds to the speed of the bike.
[ ] The kid is delusional
Turbo, of course you will not answer above question, just like last time you will stick your head in the sand and continue your funny oratory exercise of voodoo economics.
Lets translate this to the China vs America problem.
China makes stuff => Sells it to Americans=> Americans buy the stuff from money borrowed from the Chinese workers who made the stuff in the first place. :D
Now if you think the Chinese (or anyone else in the same relationship with the US) are "depedent" in above scenario then your a couple cans short of a sixpack.
Personally I think welfare ( or at least unemployment checks) are making the problem worse. If they couldn't get them many of those would go out and get a job. People don't hunt seriously for jobs until thier unemployment is about to run out. The stimulus program has generated lots of jobs. I saw the total the other day and it was really impressive and the cost to generate each job was only $ 300,000.00 per job.
Heck, why not raise the wellfare checks of jobless people, that would boost spending and the economy right? :ROFL: :ROFL: :ROFL:
Well Actually JC most of the bailout money went to very few companies, mostly big banks and the auto industry.
I will agree the biggest problem we face is debt and it can't be solved by spending money. It is not a problem that will be solved overnight. The first thing they need to do is get spending under control. I really don't think it is past the point of no return
First off, JC, where I live there is little sand, so I can't easily stick my head in it.
I have to admit like many things the meaning of the cartoon goes over my head but
the kid pushing would probably prompt the dad to peddle faster.
Turboguy:QuoteWell Actually JC most of the bailout money went to very few companies, mostly big banks and the auto industry.
My brain hurts when confronted with irrationality, ...it is about the total amount of money not how many/few are getting a piece of it.Quote
JC, I was responding to this quote of yours.
the facts are totally different arent they?
What actually happened is that those who could not compete got bailout money stolen from people (taxes) who were fiscally responsible, so we have government thugs using threat of force to kill businesses who are doing well. No bottoming out at all, government dug a deeper hole!!!
Contrary to what you said, those who could not compete did not get bail out money unless they happened to be a bank or an auto company who was considered too big to fail.
it is about the total amount of money not how many/few are getting a piece of it.
What actually happened is that those who could not compete got bailout money stolen from people (taxes) who were fiscally responsible
If the USA dollar weakens than the USA will sell more local goods and foreigners will buy realestate in USA.
There is a reason the Euro got weaker past year as a strong Euro not good for many people in Europe.
USA still produces more than any other country in the World.
I made a nice 9% today on gold dropping in price.
QuoteIf the USA dollar weakens than the USA will sell more local goods and foreigners will buy realestate in USA.
Yeah, Zimbabwe exports must be peaking right now! Inflating the USD is stealing from savers, I dont think its the savers job to subsidize US exports. Marxism doesnt work. Marxism never works, ever, period!QuoteThere is a reason the Euro got weaker past year as a strong Euro not good for many people in Europe.
repeat after me "Greece", "PIGS" ,...yeah, i want a euro weak enought so i can pay 10 euro for a loaf of bread. :ROFL: :ROFL:QuoteUSA still produces more than any other country in the World.
Look around in your house (everybody reading this), point out the things that don't say "made in china", "made in Japan", "made in germany", "made in Taiwan", "made in Korea".QuoteI made a nice 9% today on gold dropping in price.
Well if you have telepathic ability and can predict the stockmarket please DO SHARE....otherwise this is more of a "big swinging dick" tail.
PS: I got my understanding of economics from a fortune cookie as well :sick0012:
The US is still the world's top manufacturer and China is in 2nd place at about 70% of USA's capacity. The US produces items such as production machinery and equipment, industrial supplies, consumer goods, motor vehicles and parts etc.
Westcoast, there are surprisingly few global or even international companies that are US owned. There are many large companies that derive almost all their income from the US market alone yet have well known brand names, even internationally, as I recall, Motorola, for example derives less than 40% of its revenues from outside the US but in the US is seen as a world leader.
As a North American based person you may therefore have a biased view of what you see around you.
As a citizen of the wider world I see exactly what JC noted. There is very little US manufactured goods in the homes of the world citizen. And, as you probably know, the GDP of most developed countries is around 70% based upon consumer spending. This means that even if the US made the machines that the world manufacturers use to build the consumer goods used by the citizens of the world that this contribution would only be quite small in the US context.
Even if the world citizen buys a US branded good in the rest of the world, there is a very good chance it was produced in the foreign market, thus the only benefit to the US economy is the repatriated profit element and, guess what, most firms try to minimise the amount of profit they repatriate to the US. Of course the funnding of these exported businesses may well come from spending of dollars earned by the firm in its US market...
Interesting note for the Ameriphiles out there, of the top ten largest non-financial multinationals denoted by foreign assets, 3 of the top 4 are from the UK and only two are US based. Don't be feeling too comfy, eh? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multinational_corporation
Westcoast, I was using words to make a point but as something more than an armchair traveller with a very limited perspective on the world I think there is a difference 'tween you and I. Don't forget I have lived and worked in several different countries, visited many for shorter but extended periods and spent shorter times up to several week is loads more. (of course I could be worng and you could, even as I type this, be on your way back from an expended sojourn in Moscow before you pop over to France to tie up a little business deal and then hie your way over to London for a reunion of your graduating class from the London School of Economics - I could be wrong, but I doubt it. ;) )
Knowing that the North American market is insular is not news, although it might be to you. ;) The point I was making that what YOU see is not the same as the rest of the world sees and your perspective of North American might is not actually as true as you were suggesting.
Motorola has not ever, as far as I am aware, consistently made more than 40% of its revenues outside the home market. 40% is a useful figure used to make comparisons between companies that trade internationally and those that are international businesses. It is something of a notable point that many US firms are unable to ever cross that threshold. There are good reasons why a large home market is a good thing, but then other reasons why in the end the large home market can lead to big problems. Cars, computers, home electronics, clothes, footwear, electronics components all are areas where we can see the effect, a large home market leads to lesser quality or efficiency of goods and ultimately failure of diminution of the home market ability to provide goods demanded by consumers at a price they will pay at a quality/efficiency level they demand. Chinese stuff is not in your homes just because it is cheap, if it were so then it'd be coming from Vietnam or Laos coz they are even cheaper.
USA dollar is not backed 100% by gold.
JC once again for an economist you show a surprising lack of knowledge of the world economy. The US is still the world's top manufacturer and China is in 2nd place at about 70% of USA's capacity. The US produces items such as production machinery and equipment, industrial supplies, consumer goods, motor vehicles and parts etc.
As for making money in a volatile stock market once again JC for an economist you show a lack of knowledge about the world economy. Warren Buffet and George Soros aren't the only ones who know how to track equities or commodities and buy low and sell high and do it repeatedly.
kievstarQuoteUSA dollar is not backed 100% by gold.
That is zero percent. The USD is not backed by gold at all, and since the fed doesn't allow external entities to audit them, nobody knows how much (if any) gold is being held in Fort Knox.
WestyQuoteJC once again for an economist you show a surprising lack of knowledge of the world economy. The US is still the world's top manufacturer and China is in 2nd place at about 70% of USA's capacity. The US produces items such as production machinery and equipment, industrial supplies, consumer goods, motor vehicles and parts etc.
Once again you engage your keyboard before you engage your brain,
Westy lets make a deal, you stop telling lies about me and I stop telling the truth about you !
Since I don't drink the Kenesyan cool aid, or get a hardon from fractional reserve banking, like you or Turboguy do. I tend to deal with hard economic facts. Lets look at the hard data, instead of Kenesyan dogmatic mantra.
(http://www.icmarc.org/ImageCache/rc/content/marketview/chart/2004/20041126ustradebalance_2ectt/v2/image_5b_40id_3d_22chart_22_5d/1/chart20041126.gif)
The US trade deficit is running at over 50 billion a year, and since exports (in a normal Austrian economic world) should pay for imports , the US has to borrows the difference from other central national banks (selling bonds). Hence more money is going out then there is coming in. So despite the capital goods your bragging about the "NET" transfer of wealth is NEGATIVE in a big way!
Now Turboguy (who is obviously Kenesyan like you are, although he at least admits to not knowing jack shit about how the economy works), uses this fallacy as an argument that the economy is still good. Yeah right, sure!!!
WestyQuoteAs for making money in a volatile stock market once again JC for an economist you show a lack of knowledge about the world economy. Warren Buffet and George Soros aren't the only ones who know how to track equities or commodities and buy low and sell high and do it repeatedly.
The world is not as simple as your leftist Kenesyan ideology paints it.
Kievstar (who was bragging about speculation on gold) held this as proof that gold was a "succers bet". Now If you like to equate short term speculation with long term weath storage (I have been holding gold since march 2008), I think you should give back that free bachelor degree you got when buying that happy meal at McD's.
13% is not that great in 6 months.
The key is gold going to hit 2,000 or 1,000 first. I like what gold is doing now going up and down and all the big financial firms are hyping gold and making money shorting it. So many novice investors want gold to hold that you can make a short term fortune on options. 500% after tax returns are easy on gold right now per month.
Up down up down and tons of activity. Gold is being hyped like oil and housing market was a few years ago.
After this latest display of ignorance I've concluded that you are not an economist, you may be a mathematician but you lack any academic training in economics. The graph you display, without a title so we have no way of knowing what it means, isn't the US trade imbalance with the world. It might be the US trade imbalance with Canada, http://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/balance/c1220.html#2008 .
You state the "The US trade deficit is running at over 50 billion a year". In 2003 the US trade deficit with Canada was running at over $50 billion US a year. The current US trade deficit with the world is running at $42.8 billion/month http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704644404575481411027521610.html?mod=googlenews_wsj . If this is extrapolated to cover a full year that would put the US trade deficit with the world at about $513.6 billion a year.
JC the days of buying and holding securities for years may be possible for multimillionaires and billionaires but for the average investor in equities it is the era of buy and hold equities for a short amount of time and then sell for a profit. That's how you make money in a volatile stock market.
After this latest display of ignorance I've concluded that you are not an economist, you may be a mathematician but you lack any academic training in economics. The graph you display, without a title so we have no way of knowing what it means, isn't the US trade imbalance with the world. It might be the US trade imbalance with Canada, http://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/balance/c1220.html#2008 .
You state the "The US trade deficit is running at over 50 billion a year". In 2003 the US trade deficit with Canada was running at over $50 billion US a year. The current US trade deficit with the world is running at $42.8 billion/month http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704644404575481411027521610.html?mod=googlenews_wsj . If this is extrapolated to cover a full year that would put the US trade deficit with the world at about $513.6 billion a year.
JC the days of buying and holding securities for years may be possible for multimillionaires and billionaires but for the average investor in equities it is the era of buy and hold equities for a short amount of time and then sell for a profit. That's how you make money in a volatile stock market.
Isn't it amazing that when you confront Monsieur Jack C with facts, he goes in hiding? Never seen a scientist run from facts. :ROFL:
and unless Obama hands in his resignation very soon it's going to continue going up. American people have not faith or trust in this government. Glenn Beck and a few other real patriots have done an excellent job exposing who Obama really is, his background, his agenda and the people who are behind him. It will take decades to undo all the damage that has been done, real estate market is in for another huge wave of foreclosures, the dollar is being devalued....where to put your money? The stock market? Unless you are very good at shorting I wouldn't dare playing with stocks right now. Personally, to me, precious metals give a piece of mind right now. But off course now we find out that Obama stuck another surprise in his "healthcare bill". Every time you sell gold (over $600), you will now have to do a 1099!!! WTF??? I hope you all are voting this November!
Gold $1,319.79 Silver $22.10
Personally, to me, precious metals give a piece of mind right now. But off course now we find out that Obama stuck another surprise in his "healthcare bill". Every time you sell gold (over $600), you will now have to do a 1099!!! WTF??? I hope you all are voting this November!
Gold $1,319.79 Silver $22.10
13% increase in 6 months sure beats savings bonds or just about any other investment. What beats it? The dollar has decreased in value 40% over the last seven years while the price of gold increased 400%.
13% increase in 6 months sure beats savings bonds or just about any other investment. What beats it? The dollar has decreased in value 40% over the last seven years while the price of gold increased 400%.
Precious metals are considered high risk
Brass
By those who get commissions from trading stock. It is stock in a crumbling economy that is high risk. The stock market crashes and will again along with the currency it is based on....
By those who get commissions from trading stock. It is stock in a crumbling economy that is high risk. The stock market crashes and will again along with the currency it is based on....
Well, I've put my money where my keyboard is so I'll keep you updated. ;D If it all goes to hell in a henbasket, it's not really going to matter what you're holding (stock) anyways, I suppose...
Brass
Guns and beans in that case. Maybe after the Apocalypse it will be something real like gold and silver that will back the dollar. I'm a strange sort I know. I am probably the only guy you know who gets paid in gold and silver. I work on a percentage of the metal I process and for outside contractors I deal with they work on the same. That is why I see a certain value in the stuff plus all the additional income I get by the rising prices.
Guns and beans in that case. Maybe after the Apocalypse it will be something real like gold and silver that will back the dollar. I'm a strange sort I know. I am probably the only guy you know who gets paid in gold and silver. I work on a percentage of the metal I process and for outside contractors I deal with they work on the same. That is why I see a certain value in the stuff plus all the additional income I get by the rising prices.
:ROFL: Good one, Maxx...
Well, if that's how you're getting paid, as you've stated, as far as the rising prices - you're going about it the right way... :)
Brass
BTW recently I have been spending some time with a very kind and thoughtful RW. She's got it all, looks, humor and is very very sweet. It's her whole personality. :loving: She is so refreshing to be around. It's been more than seven years since my train wreak and it finally feels like I am getting some oxygen if that makes any sense.
BTW recently I have been spending some time with a very kind and thoughtful RW. She's got it all, looks, humor and is very very sweet. It's her whole personality. :loving: She is so refreshing to be around. It's been more than seven years since my train wreak and it finally feels like I am getting some oxygen if that makes any sense.
Good to read, Maxx! Some of us have been around the forums long enough to know you deserve it. :party0011:
Brass
Big drop in gold today hope you guys are day trading with options like I mentioned more than a week ago. 10% daily returns not hard right now.
usd=toiletpaper,Ah, I sure am glad to find a use for it and just when I was running low on Charmin too.
Some people on fixed income with young FSU wives are going to find out how much their 20+ year younger spouse REAAAALY loves them.
I wonder what the difference is between living on a fixed income and having an income that hasn't changed in 10 years or more?
wasnt talking about you, but if the shoe fits
My opinion it is not so much your income today as your expenses today.
The guy on the fixed income can always go back to work as well if things get tough. My granddad retired comparitively wealthy, got hooked up with a con artist when he was in his 80's and had to go back to work as a bell hop at age 82 to help support himself and his 25 year younger wife.
Considering your views on how the economy works, I think history will repeat itself again.
Hi Ray, I was wondering how did you come up with these numbers?
Considering your views on how the economy works, I think history will repeat itself again.
My view on how the economy works has little to do with my own situation and little to do with anything. How I handle my own finances may have some pertinence. As far as me having to go back to work at 80 if my health holds up I don't plan to quit working until way after that point so it can't repeat itself.
So, at what point does everyone think the gold bubble will burst? Part of me thinks about $ 1497.00 and part of me thinks it will go all the way to about $ 1750.00 before the bottom falls out. I don't see it happening until at least Spring.
So, at what point does everyone think the gold bubble will burst? Part of me thinks about $ 1497.00 and part of me thinks it will go all the way to about $ 1750.00 before the bottom falls out. I don't see it happening until at least Spring.
Hi Ray, I was wondering how did you come up with these numbers?
yes, Ray, and it looks like they are going even further down :( Too many forclosures, and even more coming...plus this new forclosure crisis...I think real estate could go another 30 to 50% down in the next year or two. Scary!
Eduard, we talked a while back about me looking at property down your way. I just browsed for the first time in 6 months a few mintues ago and it looks to me that things have fallen even futher down there. I was a little shocked at the prices. Gold would have definately been a wiser choice than real estate so far.
Considering your views on how the economy works, I think history will repeat itself again.
My view on how the economy works has little to do with my own situation and little to do with anything. How I handle my own finances may have some pertinence. As far as me having to go back to work at 80 if my health holds up I don't plan to quit working until way after that point so it can't repeat itself.
So, at what point does everyone think the gold bubble will burst? Part of me thinks about $ 1497.00 and part of me thinks it will go all the way to about $ 1750.00 before the bottom falls out. I don't see it happening until at least Spring.
Khelkhov, I agree that traditional Republicans are not the answer. I think the Tea Party may be a step in the right direction and like a lot of Americans I would like to see everyone in office voted out and start over with all new legislators that have some business sense and to good of the country at heart. I do think Obama has done more damage in his short time than virtually any president in the history of this country. I won't say it is to the point where it can't be salvaged but more of the same and we are cooked gooses. I still see gold as a bubble and don't think gold that costs $ 400.00 an ounce to mine is worth even the price they ask now. Some people are in a panic and some are riding the bubble just as they did with real estate a few years ago and tulip bulbs 4 centuries ago.
Another thing, it seems that the average Americans are pouring their money into U.S. treasuries at this time...
Well, they got crushed when the dot-com bubble collapsed, they got decimated when the Real Estate bubble burst, and now they are loading into dollar-denominated assets. At the time same time, the Federal Reserve is trying to destroy the purchasing power of the U.S. dollar by printing up more money...
So, It is the reality that the U.S. treasuries are actually the bubbles that are about to burst! It is NOT the gold...
Well, they got crushed when the dot-com bubble collapsed, they got decimated when the Real Estate bubble burst, and now they are loading into dollar-denominated assets. At the time same time, the Federal Reserve is trying to destroy the purchasing power of the U.S. dollar by printing up more money...
That is correct Brass. It is not a total shutdown but many banks have stopped all forclosures and put a freeze on selling homes that have been foreclosed. I saw a video from one expert who thinks it will last for a couple of months as they review all the paperwork and procedures. This will take a lot of homes off the market but only temporarily. Most of the procedures were probably legal and ok but not properly handled. Once things open up again there will likely be a glut of homes that could bring prices down even more.
Interesting Newsletter Article
The End of a Currency Era
Why the Hong Kong Dollar’s End Will Mark the Beginning of a New Reserve Currency
By Evaldo Albuquerque
Have you ever heard of a Cruzeiro, Escudo, Deutschemark, Peseta, or Sucre?
If not, I’ll give you a hint. If there was a currency cemetery, you would find a headstone with each one of these names.
That’s right: They are all dead, long gone currencies. While hyperinflation destroyed some of these currencies, most were simply replaced by the dollar or the euro.
Now there’s one more currency that’s about to be buried: the Hong-Kong dollar.
But it will not follow the typical “dollarization” or “euroization” path. And the implications of that go well beyond Hong Kong. In fact, the Hong Kong dollar’s end could be the very event that introduces a new reserve currency into the world.
Let me explain…
Why Hong Kong Citizens Are Ditching Their Own Currency
Our emerging market strategist Jeff Opdyke just returned from a trip to Hong Kong and Singapore. While in Asia, he met with several local business contacts. Overall, Jeff says most locals believe the Hong Kong dollar (HKD) will go the way of obsolete currencies soon.
They expect the Chinese yuan (CNY) will replace the Hong Kong dollar.
For good reason. As I mentioned in my previous article, the Chinese yuan is gaining in prominence with each passing month.
A few months ago, you could buy yuan outside of China, but you were only allowed to convert it back to the original currency if you were inside the country. That has changed.
Jeff says you can now open bank accounts in Hong Kong to hold yuan directly. And you can trade it back and forth into whatever major currency you wish, as often as you wish.
China already allows Hong Kong residents to buy as much as HKD 20,000 (US$2,500) worth of yuan per day. And a lot of local residents Jeff spoke with are taking advantage of that. They are loading up on the Chinese currency.
These locals believe it is just a matter of time before the yuan replaces the Hong Kong dollar for good. They know the yuan is deeply undervalued against the dollar. The Hong Kong dollar is pegged to the buck, so that means the yuan is also undervalued against Hong Kong’s currency.
That’s why yuan denominated deposits in Hong Kong are about to go parabolic. Just this past August, Hong Kong's yuan deposits surged 26%. Some estimate that in one year yuan deposits will reach at least CNY 500bn, increasing the current yuan deposit base fivefold.
Going Regional Before it Goes Global
Do Hong Kong citizens know something that we don’t? Not really. We warned you before.
Last month, I told you why the yuan could replace the dollar by 2015. In that article I showed you how China is planting the seeds of a powerful reserve currency. What’s going on in Hong Kong is part of a much bigger plan.
China wants the yuan to become a world reserve currency fairly soon. China's allowance of a freely traded yuan in Hong Kong is one more step towards freeing the currency completely.
Becoming a regional currency it’s a natural step before the yuan can effectively capture the dollar’s place as a reserve currency.
And China continues to push its agenda forward. For example, President Hu Jintao just said that China will support a Russian proposal to commence direct trading between the yuan and the Russian ruble.
China is also trying to develop its Forex, bond and equity markets to meet different investor demands. As China’s capital markets continue to mature, more and more people will invest in Chinese yuan assets. That will just provide more support to the yuan.
While the yuan continues to gain international ground, the Fed is preparing to print up more money, flushing the dollar down the toilet.
Maybe that’s why a former member of the Chinese Central Bank recently told an audience in Singapore that we are “one step nearer to a U.S. dollar crisis.”
What Does This All Mean to You?
After this conversation with Jeff, it seems crystal clear that Asia views the Hong Kong dollar as a currency with a fairly short life span.
The HKD is heading towards extinction. And it’s a mistake to think that this development has no implications for U.S. investors.
The yuan is becoming more and more popular in Asia. That not only sets the stage for the yuan to gain importance in the international scenario, but also puts the U.S. dollar in a dangerous situation.
And if you’re holding all of your assets in dollars, like the majority of Americans do, that puts your finances in danger.
The dollar has already been losing status in the international market for some time. In recent years countries like China, India, Brazil and Russia have been diversifying their reserves away from the dollar. That’s one explanation behind the long period of dollar weakness between 2002 and 2008.
That process will only accelerate in the coming years. If some of the strongest Central Banks around the globe are diversifying away from the dollar, why shouldn’t you?
Now that Gold and Silver appear to be on a USA based ultrainflationary tear (mega rise) and somewhat risky - curious what folks think of the idea of Commodity Basket CDs - liquid cash investments that pay interest with currencies from the countries that are actually some of the major Gold and Silver producers among many other commodities - got to like the marketing "Global Power Shift Basket CDs"
Gutting the dollar is now official!
by Martin D. Weiss, Ph.D. 10-17-10
It’s official now. The Fed said it in their meeting notes. And Bernanke said it again on Friday:
He’s going to run the money printing presses.
It’s the same trick we’ve seen in countries like Brazil, Argentina and Russia. It’s the age-old tactic of GUTTING THE CURRENCY — this time targeting the most important one on Earth, the U.S. dollar.
Larry Edelson has been warning about this for many moons. Our friend Franz Pick warned about it almost a half century ago. My father, J. Irving Weiss, issued his warnings about similar dangers even earlier.
How did they know? Because trashing paper currency is an insidious tactic that governments the world over have repeatedly used when skyrocketing deficits and debt threatened the collapse of their economies. It never works. It always ends in disaster.
And now …
Here it is — striking the U.S.
dollar directly and relentlessly!
Right before our very eyes!
I had hoped I’d never live to see this day. Now, here it is in aces and spades.
Our own Fed chairman has virtually sworn on a stack of bibles that he’s not only going to print paper money … he’s going to do it FAST!
Doesn’t he realize that every time a government plays these games, the majority of its people suffer? Doesn’t he know that our wealth is hopelessly eroded by the falling value of our currency? Doesn’t he remember the lessons of history?
Of course he does!
The real problem is he doesn’t seem to care. No matter how LOW the chances of these old tricks working … and no matter how HIGH the probability that they will backfire … Bernanke is determined to plow ahead ANYHOW!
Indeed, the fast track for Bernanke’s plan is no longer in dispute. And there’s no disputing how the markets are voting either:
Despite some profit-taking on Friday, gold continues to trade well above the $1,350 level, keeping it poised for further new record highs.
Select commodities are rising at an even faster clip.
The dollar is sitting very near a fatal tipping point — its lowest level in history.
Good luck and God bless!
Martin
... Commodity Basket CDs
Despite some profit-taking on Friday, gold continues to trade well above the $1,350 level, keeping it poised for further new record highs.
Select commodities are rising at an even faster clip.
The dollar is sitting very near a fatal tipping point — its lowest level in history.
Good luck and God bless!
Martin
I agree with this JC. Gold isn't going up, the dollar is going down, that's what we are witnessing right now. Siver went up 25% since summer. I think that silver eagles and maple leaves are going to be the new every day currancy here for a while. So if you can get them now is the time.QuoteDespite some profit-taking on Friday, gold continues to trade well above the $1,350 level, keeping it poised for further new record highs.
Select commodities are rising at an even faster clip.
The dollar is sitting very near a fatal tipping point — its lowest level in history.
Good luck and God bless!
Martin
funny how some on this here board speak about a "gold bubble"
I think it is more accurate to talk about the "dollar bubble" as your article on "fedspeak" (acronym to Orwells 1984 "newspeak") clearly states they will go for the nuclear option to get ridd of all debts and liabilities.
Me thinking China is pretty pissed holding over 2 trillion worth in (soon to be) funny monopoly money. They might dump it and just buy all the gold in sight before it totally turns to toilet paper;
Wich would mean gold is going easily over 5k in the comming month
And i bought that stuff at 0.8k
Is this funny or what?
Anyone here on fixed income married to a very young hot smokingnova
Big loyalty test comming up!!!
funny how some on this here board speak about a "gold bubble"
I think it is more accurate to talk about the "dollar bubble" as your article on "fedspeak" (acronym to Orwells 1984 "newspeak") clearly states they will go for the nuclear option to get ridd of all debts and liabilities.
Wich would mean gold is going easily over 5k in the comming month
Anyone here on fixed income married to a very young hot smokingnova
Big loyalty test comming up!!!
.... junk made in China doesn't seem to have gone up. Yes, other currencies have gone up relative to the dollar and that would have an effect on the price of gold. ....Isn't the Yuan rate directly linked to the US Dollar rate and therefore if US Dollar goes down, so does Yuan and when it goes up Yuan does as well? This might explain why you don't see a difference in Chinese goods. At least that's how they explained it over here in the media when they were discussing the (dis)advantages of the "high" Euro.
I thought the US News and world report had an interesting article on Gold. Here it is.
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Gold-May-Rise-But-Is-It-usnews-394308882.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=6&asset=&ccode=
One of the parts I particularly thought was good was the following.
Unlike jewelry or industrial demand for the metal, which remains somewhat steady, investment demand climbs and falls at a much steeper rate. But as history has taught us--with the 1980 gold bubble, the dot-com bubble, the Japanese financial bubble, and the recent housing bubble--when any asset class is overridden with buyers, new information or a change in sentiment can quickly cause a run that quickly destroys the gains of a decade.
I also noticed they used the word "bubble" a lot in their article.
I thought the US News and world report had an interesting article on Gold. Here it is.
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Gold-May-Rise-But-Is-It-usnews-394308882.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=6&asset=&ccode=
One of the parts I particularly thought was good was the following.
Unlike jewelry or industrial demand for the metal, which remains somewhat steady, investment demand climbs and falls at a much steeper rate. But as history has taught us--with the 1980 gold bubble, the dot-com bubble, the Japanese financial bubble, and the recent housing bubble--when any asset class is overridden with buyers, new information or a change in sentiment can quickly cause a run that quickly destroys the gains of a decade.
I also noticed they used the word "bubble" a lot in their article.
Read same article. Gold is being manipulated by big investors. For people who cannot afford to lose money gold is risky at current levels.
Day trading still the way to go with so many people hot about gold right now. However with current 2% drop today double digit daily gains are gone.
The questions to ask yourself is gold going to 2,000 or to 1,000 next. I have no idea but the option method I know works on gold. If you think gold is going to 2,000 or you know how to play options than buy if not there are better places to put your money.
For those kind of people, the safest assets that they can be able to hold in order increase and maintain their purchasing power are physical gold/sliver such as coins, bars, rounds and ingots... Right now, US Dollar is way, way too risky to hold...I agree, Brian
For those kind of people, the safest assets that they can be able to hold in order increase and maintain their purchasing power are physical gold/sliver such as coins, bars, rounds and ingots... Right now, US Dollar is way, way too risky to hold...
It could be very smart to put 10% of your investment money in gold but someone who bets the farm on it may get very hurt.
My own personal "guess" is that the gold bubble is nowhere near bursting at this moment. I would be quite shocked to wake up a week from now and find gold selling for $ 500.00 an ounce. That is just not in the cards with all that is going on in the economy and in politics.this I agree with, Ray.
I do think someday it will sell for less than it does now, maybe a lot less. I also think before that happens it may sell for a lot more than it does now. If someone gets out in time they will do fine. Sometimes knowing when that time is can be a very difficult thing. Usually when everyone is saying things will go up is when the crash and sometimes when the outlook is bleak things will do the opposite of what people expect. If everyone had a working crystal ball everyone could get rich quick in either gold or the stock market.
My own personal "guess" is that the gold bubble is nowhere near bursting at this moment. I would be quite shocked to wake up a week from now and find gold selling for $ 500.00 an ounce. That is just not in the cards with all that is going on in the economy and in politics.
I do think someday it will sell for less than it does now, maybe a lot less. I also think before that happens it may sell for a lot more than it does now. If someone gets out in time they will do fine. Sometimes knowing when that time is can be a very difficult thing. Usually when everyone is saying things will go up is when the crash and sometimes when the outlook is bleak things will do the opposite of what people expect. If everyone had a working crystal ball everyone could get rich quick in either gold or the stock market.
Golds value is jewelry and fear. The fear will go away at some time.
The average Joe who puts there money in gold will not keep up with inflation. Gold has been logging behind inflation for years.
Golds value is jewelry and fear.
As I said before, an average new car is still going to be worth about 30 ounces of gold and an average house 150 ounces of gold. What it's going to be in dollars, your guess is a good as mine... it will sound good though "hey I live in a 30 million dollar house!" ($200,000 in todays dollars).
If I may offer a small correction:
a value of a commodity is dependant on its perceived scarcity.
Many times the difference between perception and reality is huge. Just sayin'
I can imagine some people thinking when watching their salary and house price going up a big time due to hyperinflation, "Ooooh Wow! I am a multi-millionaire living in a million dollar house! Whoo!!! Awesome! I am so rich!! :king:" :ROFL: :ROFL:
a value of a commodity is dependant on its perceived scarcity.
If I may offer a small correction:
a value of a commodity is dependant on its perceived scarcity.
Many times the difference between perception and reality is huge. Just sayin'
I will agree with you to a degree, but value involves much more than scarcity. There are lots of scarce things that normal people don't speculate in. Why not collect plutonium or uranium which are both scarcer than gold but the answer is obvious, well how about dinosaur dung. That is scarcer than gold too and it won't kill you and can be weighted so it could be sold by the ounce.
perceived? [edit-inflammatory. Brass] Au (the atom of gold) is pretty hard to find.
Being hard to find does not, by default, does not make it scarce.
I would imagine an equal amount of effort would be required to find a single atom of iron, oxygen or silicon,
QuoteBeing hard to find does not, by default, does not make it scarce.
Well actualy that is exactly how it works .
QuoteI would imagine an equal amount of effort would be required to find a single atom of iron, oxygen or silicon,
You imagine incorrectly, thats not true!
Turbo,
Of course there is more to it, and that is where perceived comes into play. People also have to want it (demand). If it is perceived that demand is increasing, the cost/value will go up. The demand does not necessarily have increase, people only need to perceive that that it has. Hence the word "speculation".
There was this 23 yr old chemist you found a way to mass produce aluminium relativly cheaply in the 1920's.
I dont think Boeing, Grummann or McDonald Douglas are bubble companies.
Mja, we live in what is called Western civilisation, created by scientist and engineers, no sense talking about what really matters to someone who has a skewed perception of reality madup of "bubble" gum.
Speaking of "no sense" I can't make sense of what you mean with that post.
Personally the way technology changes,
My guess is that there will be some kind of machine where they dump in something like lead on one side, bombard it with something and gold comes out the bottom at a very low cost.
QuoteSpeaking of "no sense" I can't make sense of what you mean with that post.
I am not surprisedQuotePersonally the way technology changes,
Why is the word "pesonally" (meaning you) and "technology" in the same sentance?
QuoteMy guess is that there will be some kind of machine where they dump in something like lead on one side, bombard it with something and gold comes out the bottom at a very low cost.
I see you didnt ace physics either.
If I wanted someone to guess the name of the business I own that would make a pretty good clue since it happens to be "Turbo Technologies, Inc." I thought that was a bit funny.
Actually physics was my favorite subject and I almost even passed it which would have been very unusual for me to pass anything except gas.
QuoteBeing hard to find does not, by default, does not make it scarce.
Well actualy that is exactly how it works [edit-inflammatory. Brass].QuoteI would imagine an equal amount of effort would be required to find a single atom of iron, oxygen or silicon,
You imagine incorrectly, thats not true!
So tell me something guys. I am not that up on some parts of investing in gold but do most of you posses your own gold or does the service you buy it from store it for you?
It sounds like Maxx does a lot of his gold purchases by buying used gold and melting it so I am assuming he does, but how about the rest of you. Do you have it in your possession, what form? Krugerlands or other coins or ???
So tell me something guys. I am not that up on some parts of investing in gold but do most of you posses your own gold or does the service you buy it from store it for you?
China reportedly ends exports of silver and rare earth (high tech) metals - and is stockpiling gold purchased with collapsing dollars:
http://inflation.us/videos.html
So tell me something guys. I am not that up on some parts of investing in gold but do most of you posses your own gold or does the service you buy it from store it for you?
I don't like holding gold. I see it as stale asset.
I have exposure to gold through ownership of a mining exploration company that has gold resources in the ground.
So tell me something guys. I am not that up on some parts of investing in gold but do most of you posses your own gold or does the service you buy it from store it for you?
I don't like holding gold. I see it as stale asset.
I have exposure to gold through ownership of a mining exploration company that has gold resources in the ground.
I hope your gold mining stock has done better for you than the 1000 shares of the gold mining company I own has done for me.
TG there are dozens of gold mining stocks that have crashed during this run up in the price of gold. ??? Kind of hard to believe. Most of these companies had little or no chance of actually finding or mining any significant amount of gold. :GRRRR:
TG there are dozens of gold mining stocks that have crashed during this run up in the price of gold. ??? Kind of hard to believe. Most of these companies had little or no chance of actually finding or mining any significant amount of gold. :GRRRR:
When I bought this stock they were complaing that the price of gold (about $ 325.00) was below their cost to produce it (about $ 400.00). I had hopes that with the gold price going through the roof they would start minting money but the stock price is a fraction of what it was when gold was cheap. Oh, well, It is still doing better than the GM stock I bought before all the mess.
So tell me something guys. I am not that up on some parts of investing in gold but do most of you posses your own gold or does the service you buy it from store it for you?
I don't like holding gold. I see it as stale asset.
I have exposure to gold through ownership of a mining exploration company that has gold resources in the ground.
I hope your gold mining stock has done better for you than the 1000 shares of the gold mining company I own has done for me.
First-Ever TIPS Auction at Negative Yield: What It Means
by Daniel Gross, Yahoo! Finance
Tuesday, October 26, 2010
ShareretweetEmailPrintIt's perhaps the most fundamental law of lending: People extend credit to a borrower today with the expectation that they'll be paid back, with interest, in the future.
But a U.S. government bond offering on Monday appeared to defy this fundamental law. The offering of $10 billion in Treasury Inflation Protected Securities (known as TIPS) was priced to yield an interest rate of -.55 percent. That's negative .55 percent. The deal: You give the government $105.50 today. Over the next five years you get annual interest payments of 50 cents and $100 in cash. The interest payments are adjusted for inflation -- if prices rise, the interest payments rise a bit. At the end of five years, investors receive their $100 back. But that sum is also adjusted for inflation. If the CPI rises by five percent in the five-year period, an investor would receive $105. If inflation is flat over that period, the investor would only get $100.
Rampant issuance of dollars by the United States is saddling China with "imported inflation", Chinese commerce minister Chen Deming was quoted as saying by state media on Wednesday.
"Given the current situation, companies have thought ahead and prepared for exchange rate fluctuations as well as an increase in labour costs," Chen said, according to the state-run China Business News.
"But because the issuance of dollars is out of control, and international commodities prices are continuing to rise, China is confronted with imported inflation, which has created major uncertainties for businesses," he said.
What happens if you own a trillion in cash and thezimbabwen central bankfederal reserve start printing dollars like crazy?
You would get severly pissed, right?
China is hopping mad:
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CNG.18a92e9878f71f90e7b491d0afd4b1a3.501&show_article=1QuoteRampant issuance of dollars by the United States is saddling China with "imported inflation", Chinese commerce minister Chen Deming was quoted as saying by state media on Wednesday.
"Given the current situation, companies have thought ahead and prepared for exchange rate fluctuations as well as an increase in labour costs," Chen said, according to the state-run China Business News.
"But because the issuance of dollars is out of control, and international commodities prices are continuing to rise, China is confronted with imported inflation, which has created major uncertainties for businesses," he said.
If China is going to peg their currency to the US dollar then they are going to have to live with any problems that creates.
Globalization has made China, India, Mexico, Canada, and Brazil best friends with USA
QuoteIf China is going to peg their currency to the US dollar then they are going to have to live with any problems that creates.
Dont worry, the Japanese, chinese, Saudi's are not going to be that stupid again sinking all their eggs into one reserve currency. Not even the Euro (wich is the only currency that has the lequidity to replace to USD) is going to be trusted.
QuoteIf China is going to peg their currency to the US dollar then they are going to have to live with any problems that creates.
Dont worry, the Japanese, chinese, Saudi's are not going to be that stupid again sinking all their eggs into one reserve currency. Not even the Euro (wich is the only currency that has the lequidity to replace to USD) is going to be trusted.
Since the US is by far the EU's largest partner there is not a chance the EU would want to replace the USD as the world's reserve currency.
QuoteIf China is going to peg their currency to the US dollar then they are going to have to live with any problems that creates.
Dont worry, the Japanese, chinese, Saudi's are not going to be that stupid again sinking all their eggs into one reserve currency. Not even the Euro (wich is the only currency that has the lequidity to replace to USD) is going to be trusted.
Since the US is by far the EU's largest partner there is not a chance the EU would want to replace the USD as the world's reserve currency.
Whats the use of having a customer if he is a deadbeat?
I've been a member here for a long time..[Just never have posted that I recall]
Probably, most of us don't have quite the caviar income [sadly]
Silver rises and falls in the precious metals market along w/gold and platinum.
It is also more affordable and not as risky to keep at home.
However, I do recommend [highly] keeping all guns and valuables locked up tightly.
Earlier in the thread, there was mention of 'intrinsic' value in gold currency..
Probably, the esthetic value is better phrased.
Nat Geo had a special on the discovery of the SS Republic that sank with a sizable gold bullion aboard in 1865.
The treasure was found some 2000' deep along the Atlantic floor.
Est was $5 million in recovered gold.
This is based on esthetic [or collectible] value as an 1853 prestine $20 gold piece was appraised at some $20,000.00
Gold is still only worth it's market value when the rubber meets the road on value.
Some readers might not be aware of this...The United States Gov't has never been authorized to print money. Period
The Federal Reserve [which does print money] is not a government agency.
I've been a member here for a long time..[Just never have posted that I recall]
Probably, most of us don't have quite the caviar income [sadly]
Silver rises and falls in the precious metals market along w/gold and platinum.
It is also more affordable and not as risky to keep at home.
However, I do recommend [highly] keeping all guns and valuables locked up tightly.
Earlier in the thread, there was mention of 'intrinsic' value in gold currency..
Probably, the esthetic value is better phrased.
Nat Geo had a special on the discovery of the SS Republic that sank with a sizable gold bullion aboard in 1865.
The treasure was found some 2000' deep along the Atlantic floor.
Est was $5 million in recovered gold.
This is based on esthetic [or collectible] value as an 1853 prestine $20 gold piece was appraised at some $20,000.00
Gold is still only worth it's market value when the rubber meets the road on value.
Some readers might not be aware of this...The United States Gov't has never been authorized to print money. Period
The Federal Reserve [which does print money] is not a government agency.
Glad to see you posting.
I believe the best storage for gold is someplace that is very hidden. It is also a good idea to get some of it out of the country. I really do not trust the governments of the West not to nationalize it. Declare an "National emergency" and take everyone's gold and all industry that deals with it. Of course they would mess things up but since when does the government care about that happening?
I've been a member here for a long time..[Just never have posted that I recall]
Probably, most of us don't have quite the caviar income [sadly]
Silver rises and falls in the precious metals market along w/gold and platinum.
It is also more affordable and not as risky to keep at home.
However, I do recommend [highly] keeping all guns and valuables locked up tightly.
Earlier in the thread, there was mention of 'intrinsic' value in gold currency..
Probably, the esthetic value is better phrased.
Nat Geo had a special on the discovery of the SS Republic that sank with a sizable gold bullion aboard in 1865.
The treasure was found some 2000' deep along the Atlantic floor.
Est was $5 million in recovered gold.
This is based on esthetic [or collectible] value as an 1853 prestine $20 gold piece was appraised at some $20,000.00
Gold is still only worth it's market value when the rubber meets the road on value.
Some readers might not be aware of this...The United States Gov't has never been authorized to print money. Period
The Federal Reserve [which does print money] is not a government agency.
Glad to see you posting.
I believe the best storage for gold is someplace that is very hidden. It is also a good idea to get some of it out of the country. I really do not trust the governments of the West not to nationalize it. Declare an "National emergency" and take everyone's gold and all industry that deals with it. Of course they would mess things up but since when does the government care about that happening?
Maxx you really think if the USA or Canada did declare a "National emergency" and take everyone's gold that the western governments wouldn't also have agreements in place with other countries to report deposits of gold or bank safe deposit boxes. After all the USA, Canada, the UK and other countries have or are negotiating agreements with countries like Switzerland regarding hidden bank accounts used to avoid taxes in their home countries.
this will probably create the black market where people will buy and sell gold without reporting it.I've been a member here for a long time..[Just never have posted that I recall]
Probably, most of us don't have quite the caviar income [sadly]
Silver rises and falls in the precious metals market along w/gold and platinum.
It is also more affordable and not as risky to keep at home.
However, I do recommend [highly] keeping all guns and valuables locked up tightly.
Earlier in the thread, there was mention of 'intrinsic' value in gold currency..
Probably, the esthetic value is better phrased.
Nat Geo had a special on the discovery of the SS Republic that sank with a sizable gold bullion aboard in 1865.
The treasure was found some 2000' deep along the Atlantic floor.
Est was $5 million in recovered gold.
This is based on esthetic [or collectible] value as an 1853 prestine $20 gold piece was appraised at some $20,000.00
Gold is still only worth it's market value when the rubber meets the road on value.
Some readers might not be aware of this...The United States Gov't has never been authorized to print money. Period
The Federal Reserve [which does print money] is not a government agency.
Glad to see you posting.
I believe the best storage for gold is someplace that is very hidden. It is also a good idea to get some of it out of the country. I really do not trust the governments of the West not to nationalize it. Declare an "National emergency" and take everyone's gold and all industry that deals with it. Of course they would mess things up but since when does the government care about that happening?
Maxx you really think if the USA or Canada did declare a "National emergency" and take everyone's gold that the western governments wouldn't also have agreements in place with other countries to report deposits of gold or bank safe deposit boxes. After all the USA, Canada, the UK and other countries have or are negotiating agreements with countries like Switzerland regarding hidden bank accounts used to avoid taxes in their home countries.
Yes I agree with you. My thinking is that the US will someday become the most restricted and brokeback nation on this earth. A smart guy would find a haven in a country that is mostly self sufficient in food and energy and keep his gold well hidden there. Already the Department of Treasury requires the US citizen disclose any bank accounts held abroad. It also requires foreign countries to disclose this information or face restrictions on their operations and dealings in the US. As of 2012 it is required that all transactions of $600 or more have 1099s issued on them. It's going to get rough for those who want financial privacy. At least with gold you can use it to barter with. It's being done a lot more than you think.
Past three years USD has strengthened against the Euro.
Also why would an someone put 70% of his assets in gold unless he makes jewelry. Buffet would laugh non stop.
Only days after the former Federal Reserve chairman Alan Greenspan warned that “fiat money has no place to go but gold,” the dollar has collapsed to a new low. The remarks of the former Fed Chairman were made a week ago at the Council on Foreign Relations, causing a flurry of excitement on the Internet. The dollar shed value, dropping to a record low yesterday, within minutes of the Federal Reserve declaring that it was, as characterized by Reuters, “ready to provide more support for the economy and expressing concerns about low inflation.”
JC you really don't understand economics or business.
The EU has at least as high as unemployment rate as the US.
Who really is the deadbeat? Seems more like the EU.
France's unemployment rate is higher. The citizens of France are quite literally rioting in streets because the average citizen doesn't want to work until 62 to qualify for a pension.
Past three years USD has strengthened against the Euro.
Also why would an someone put 70% of his assets in gold unless he makes jewelry. Buffet would laugh non stop.
QuoteJC you really don't understand economics or business.
Ok mr Harverd economics professor, school me, LOOOL, ;D ;DQuoteThe EU has at least as high as unemployment rate as the US.
Yeah, USA has gone socialist too. SO how are you folks liking it up till now? LOOL, can anyone say 'mid-term elections', LOOOLQuoteWho really is the deadbeat? Seems more like the EU.
"Socialism light" or "the middle road" doesnt work either, Luckily countries in the Eu are cutting spending, cutting public sector jobs, Obama on the other hand, is trying to immitate the other big African economist, Mr Mugabe, (big surprise there?)QuoteFrance's unemployment rate is higher. The citizens of France are quite literally rioting in streets because the average citizen doesn't want to work until 62 to qualify for a pension.
I call it justice, That's what you get if you spend money you never had in the first place.
But why are you bitchin about France? I am a Luxembourg resident!
Two posts removed - inflammatory.
Brass
QuoteJC you really don't understand economics or business.
Ok mr Harverd economics professor, school me, LOOOL, ;D ;DQuoteThe EU has at least as high as unemployment rate as the US.
Yeah, USA has gone socialist too. SO how are you folks liking it up till now? LOOL, can anyone say 'mid-term elections', LOOOLQuoteWho really is the deadbeat? Seems more like the EU.
"Socialism light" or "the middle road" doesnt work either, Luckily countries in the Eu are cutting spending, cutting public sector jobs, Obama on the other hand, is trying to immitate the other big African economist, Mr Mugabe, (big surprise there?)QuoteFrance's unemployment rate is higher. The citizens of France are quite literally rioting in streets because the average citizen doesn't want to work until 62 to qualify for a pension.
I call it justice, That's what you get if you spend money you never had in the first place.
But why are you bitchin about France? I am a Luxembourg resident!
JC when did you move to Luxembourg? Job related? You've always stated that you were going to stay in France and fight the socialism.
Past three years USD has strengthened against the Euro.
Also why would an someone put 70% of his assets in gold unless he makes jewelry. Buffet would laugh non stop.
I do agree with you Kievstar. Someone who puts 70% of his assets in gold is probably a fool.
QuoteI do agree with you Kievstar. Someone who puts 70% of his assets in gold is probably a fool.
Thanks for the honer badge Turbo, comming from someone like you its a compliment.
Alan GreenSpan (his quote) ..fiat money has nowhere else to go but gold... is one of those "fools" you seem to disagree with, but then again, Greenspan has returned to his original Capitalists root (he once was a prominent fellow of the Ayan Rahnd society, before he sold out and started printing money). Same as the governments of India and China who are buying up gold by the metric tons, them must be total idiots I recon , buying up gold even at todays prices.
it is the demicratic system in combination with people with your (even selfadmitted by yourself) gaping holes of knowledge about of what "money" actually is , that can put a former great power as the USA to its knees.
Nationwrecking is always a deliberate choice.
that can put a former great power as the USA to its knees.
Nationwrecking is always a deliberate choice.
Per NIA:
'End of Liberty' is without a doubt the scariest movie ever released on Halloween because it exposes the truth about the societal collapse that is ahead for all Americans. 'End of Liberty' is the most eye-opening film ever produced about the U.S. government. It is perhaps the most important documentary ever released in our nation's history!
...See "gold bubble" discussion at end of video...
1. United States
Value of Reserves: $358.63 billion
Holdings Total: 8,965.65 tons
Quote1. United States
Value of Reserves: $358.63 billion
Holdings Total: 8,965.65 tons
Bull, there hasnt been an independant audit since President Eisenhower
"Senator Ron Paul on the Rockwell show"
Of course we all know politicians can be trusted {Edit: Insult removed - Brass}
[SARCASM MODE OFF]
wow! Just finished watching the movie - very depressing! :( The worst part is that it seems like there's nothing we as people can do about it. Even if Republicans become a majority, they still will continue selling us to the special interest groups. This bit about them trying to put a stop on people growing own food is outrageous! Is this true?
Per NIA:
'End of Liberty' is without a doubt the scariest movie ever released on Halloween because it exposes the truth about the societal collapse that is ahead for all Americans. 'End of Liberty' is the most eye-opening film ever produced about the U.S. government. It is perhaps the most important documentary ever released in our nation's history!
...See "gold bubble" discussion at end of video...
wow! Just finished watching the movie - very depressing! :( The worst part is that it seems like there's nothing we as people can do about it. Even if Republicans become a majority, they still will continue selling us to the special interest groups. This bit about them trying to put a stop on people growing own food is outrageous! Is this true?
Per NIA:
'End of Liberty' is without a doubt the scariest movie ever released on Halloween because it exposes the truth about the societal collapse that is ahead for all Americans. 'End of Liberty' is the most eye-opening film ever produced about the U.S. government. It is perhaps the most important documentary ever released in our nation's history!
...See "gold bubble" discussion at end of video...
Who is Senator Ron Paul? There is Ron Paul in the U.S. House of Representatives.
JC you've demonstrated numerous times that you have almost no comprehension of the economy,
JC you've demonstrated numerous times that you have almost no comprehension of the economy
Westy:QuoteJC you've demonstrated numerous times that you have almost no comprehension of the economy
Can we get by the usual personal attacks and smoke blowing tactics and focus on your unfactual statement that the gold reserve at fort Knox are actually existant as you stated. This was the issue at hand.
My provided link shows that there has never been an audit of the supply since Eisenhower. (again, I refer to the youtube interview of RON PAUL, see posted link).
Quote1. United States
Value of Reserves: $358.63 billion
Holdings Total: 8,965.65 tons
Bull, there hasnt been an independant audit since President Eisenhower
"Senator Ron Paul on the Rockwell show"
Of course we all know politicians can be trusted {Insult removed - Brass}
[SARCASM MODE OFF]
Just because the Fort Knox vaults haven't been audited doesn't mean the gold isn't there.
QuoteJust because the Fort Knox vaults haven't been audited doesn't mean the gold isn't there.
True, just because we cant prove Santa Claue doesnt exist, .......
This bit about them trying to put a stop on people growing own food is outrageous! Is this true?
Thus, if you have tomato plants in your back yard for use solely in your own kitchen, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” and are subject to regulation by Congress. The court’s reasoning is this: If you weren’t growing tomatoes in your back yard, you’d be buying them on the market. If you were buying them on the market, some of what you bought might come from another State. So! By not buying them on the market, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” because you didn’t buy something you otherwise would have bought. See? And we have to stand up when these people walk into a room!
ed:QuoteThis bit about them trying to put a stop on people growing own food is outrageous! Is this true?
Eduard, it has been going on for some time now, growing tomatoes (or is it tomato's?) in your backyard is violating "interstate commerce acts" and is a federal offense
link:http://publiushuldah.wordpress.com/2009/10/07/82/QuoteThus, if you have tomato plants in your back yard for use solely in your own kitchen, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” and are subject to regulation by Congress. The court’s reasoning is this: If you weren’t growing tomatoes in your back yard, you’d be buying them on the market. If you were buying them on the market, some of what you bought might come from another State. So! By not buying them on the market, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” because you didn’t buy something you otherwise would have bought. See? And we have to stand up when these people walk into a room!
Let me tell you right now , if some federal agents were dumb enough to enter my property and destroy my tomatoplants , I think you would see the second amendment kick in!
Westy, stop being a troll,.., reading comprehension mate, :)
the word "IF" was used...., luckily no federal agents in Luxembourg plowing the tomatofields!
ed:QuoteThis bit about them trying to put a stop on people growing own food is outrageous! Is this true?
Eduard, it has been going on for some time now, growing tomatoes (or is it tomato's?) in your backyard is violating "interstate commerce acts" and is a federal offense
link:http://publiushuldah.wordpress.com/2009/10/07/82/QuoteThus, if you have tomato plants in your back yard for use solely in your own kitchen, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” and are subject to regulation by Congress. The court’s reasoning is this: If you weren’t growing tomatoes in your back yard, you’d be buying them on the market. If you were buying them on the market, some of what you bought might come from another State. So! By not buying them on the market, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” because you didn’t buy something you otherwise would have bought.
yeah, but in order to grow them tomatos I had to buy seedlings or young plants, furtilizer, irrigation equipment, compost, etc. etc. Don't they take in consideration that all those sales wouldn't be made if I didn't decide to grow tomatos in my yard?
ed:QuoteThis bit about them trying to put a stop on people growing own food is outrageous! Is this true?
Eduard, it has been going on for some time now, growing tomatoes (or is it tomato's?) in your backyard is violating "interstate commerce acts" and is a federal offense
link:http://publiushuldah.wordpress.com/2009/10/07/82/QuoteThus, if you have tomato plants in your back yard for use solely in your own kitchen, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” and are subject to regulation by Congress. The court’s reasoning is this: If you weren’t growing tomatoes in your back yard, you’d be buying them on the market. If you were buying them on the market, some of what you bought might come from another State. So! By not buying them on the market, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” because you didn’t buy something you otherwise would have bought.
yeah, but in order to grow them tomatos I had to buy seedlings or young plants, furtilizer, irrigation equipment, compost, etc. etc. Don't they take in consideration that all those sales wouldn't be made if I didn't decide to grow tomatos in my yard?
I was trying to point out that this "protectionist" policy doesn't make any sense. It protects commercial tomato growers, but damages all other businesses that sell goods to people who want to grow their own tomatoes. Where is the logic there? It also infriges on people's freedom IMO which is the worst thing that can happen in this country that always prided itself on having the most freedom in the world. I don't believe there is such a law in Russia.ed:QuoteThis bit about them trying to put a stop on people growing own food is outrageous! Is this true?
Eduard, it has been going on for some time now, growing tomatoes (or is it tomato's?) in your backyard is violating "interstate commerce acts" and is a federal offense
link:http://publiushuldah.wordpress.com/2009/10/07/82/QuoteThus, if you have tomato plants in your back yard for use solely in your own kitchen, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” and are subject to regulation by Congress. The court’s reasoning is this: If you weren’t growing tomatoes in your back yard, you’d be buying them on the market. If you were buying them on the market, some of what you bought might come from another State. So! By not buying them on the market, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” because you didn’t buy something you otherwise would have bought.
yeah, but in order to grow them tomatos I had to buy seedlings or young plants, furtilizer, irrigation equipment, compost, etc. etc. Don't they take in consideration that all those sales wouldn't be made if I didn't decide to grow tomatos in my yard?
I really don't see how any level of government is going to regulate home gardens. The feds may be legally able to regulate people growing tomatoes in their backyard but how many federal agents would they need to do it all over the country? On the other hand if the feds did try to keep people from growing tomatoes in their gardens they would need so many new federal employees that it would drastically lower the unemployment rate. :laugh:
I was trying to point out that this "protectionist" policy doesn't make any sense. It protects commercial tomato growers, but damages all other businesses that sell goods to people who want to grow their own tomatoes. Where is the logic there? It also infriges on people's freedom IMO which is the worst thing that can happen in this country that always prided itself on having the most freedom in the world. I don't believe there is such a law in Russia.ed:QuoteThis bit about them trying to put a stop on people growing own food is outrageous! Is this true?
Eduard, it has been going on for some time now, growing tomatoes (or is it tomato's?) in your backyard is violating "interstate commerce acts" and is a federal offense
link:http://publiushuldah.wordpress.com/2009/10/07/82/QuoteThus, if you have tomato plants in your back yard for use solely in your own kitchen, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” and are subject to regulation by Congress. The court’s reasoning is this: If you weren’t growing tomatoes in your back yard, you’d be buying them on the market. If you were buying them on the market, some of what you bought might come from another State. So! By not buying them on the market, you are “affecting” “interstate commerce” because you didn’t buy something you otherwise would have bought.
yeah, but in order to grow them tomatos I had to buy seedlings or young plants, furtilizer, irrigation equipment, compost, etc. etc. Don't they take in consideration that all those sales wouldn't be made if I didn't decide to grow tomatos in my yard?
I really don't see how any level of government is going to regulate home gardens. The feds may be legally able to regulate people growing tomatoes in their backyard but how many federal agents would they need to do it all over the country? On the other hand if the feds did try to keep people from growing tomatoes in their gardens they would need so many new federal employees that it would drastically lower the unemployment rate. :laugh:
I really don't see how any level of government is going to regulate home gardens.
I really don't see how any level of government is going to regulate home gardens.
The Federal and State government do a rather poor job at stopping people from growing marijuana - perhaps they are afraid of getting tomatoe on there face. In fact a number of middle sized cities, have allowed local residents to keep up to five chickens on there property for egg production.
I really don't see how any level of government is going to regulate home gardens.
The Federal and State government do a rather poor job at stopping people from growing marijuana - perhaps they are afraid of getting tomatoe on there face. In fact a number of middle sized cities, have allowed local residents to keep up to five chickens on there property for egg production.
there are already incidents of gardens being uprooted by federal agents, so if you think like a "wildebeast" (the lion will not catch me but that other slow wildebeast) then you already lost your freedoms
Glen Beck talks about this
Westy, again you read very selectivly, please go back to my link,
I am quoting a judge on this one!
Eduard, it has been going on for some time now, growing tomatoes (or is it tomato's?) in your backyard is violating "interstate commerce acts" and is a federal offense
But in Wickard v. Filburn (1942), the Court said the “commerce clause” extends to local intrastate activities which “affect” interstate commerce, even if the activities aren’t “commerce”!
Westy, your reading comprehension has gone out the window, dude,
My quote:QuoteEduard, it has been going on for some time now, growing tomatoes (or is it tomato's?) in your backyard is violating "interstate commerce acts" and is a federal offense
The link:QuoteBut in Wickard v. Filburn (1942), the Court said the “commerce clause” extends to local intrastate activities which “affect” interstate commerce, even if the activities aren’t “commerce”!
Gold $1384.60(USD), Silver $26.08(USD) as I type.
Brass
Again, let me remind you guys - gold and silver didn't go up, they stay the same. It's your currency that is loosing value because of what the Fed is doing. They are devaluing the dollar and Mr. Soros is getting richer while most Americans are getting poorer.
Again, let me remind you guys - gold and silver didn't go up, they stay the same. It's your currency that is loosing value because of what the Fed is doing. They are devaluing the dollar and Mr. Soros is getting richer while most Americans are getting poorer.
Maxx, per your article link.
The FT’s Martin Wolf explains that the biggest problem for a reformed gold standard would be the “mismatch between the value of official gold holdings and the size of the monetary system,” which in 2008 stood at $1,300 billion and $61,000 billion.
Wolf considers an even more serious problem is that a peg to gold wouldn’t even guarantee international stability. “A peg to gold may prove to be radically destabilizing for any currency if other significant countries failed to sustain domestic monetary and financial stability,” which could lead to dramatic flows of gold between currencies that are better managed, drastically changing their relative values.
Article nice read and one of many to put more fear into people. Remember you make real money day trading gold and you need fear and demand to make that work. Wall Street is trying to get gold to $1,600 so they (me) can day trade it the next $200 increase. Its very easy to day trade gold and takes 2 minutes a day of time.
Having gold as a standard does have it's limitations that is for sure.
Maxx:QuoteHaving gold as a standard does have it's limitations that is for sure.
Yes, limitations on the abuse by government)))
But Maxx pointed out the me earlier this year not so much returning to the goldstanderd , but removing the enFORCED legal tender status of the greenback. AKA, have other currencies exist next to the fiat dollar system. This would require the removal of restriction using gold (or cold certificates) as a direct currency.
This way people can choose whenever they trust fiat currency or not, this competition will keep politicians in check of abusing fiat currency.
Maxx, you got that Ron Paul video somewhere, where he explains this idea?
Maxx:QuoteHaving gold as a standard does have it's limitations that is for sure.
Yes, limitations on the abuse by government)))
But Maxx pointed out the me earlier this year not so much returning to the goldstanderd , but removing the enFORCED legal tender status of the greenback. AKA, have other currencies exist next to the fiat dollar system. This would require the removal of restriction using gold (or cold certificates) as a direct currency.
This way people can choose whenever they trust fiat currency or not, this competition will keep politicians in check of abusing fiat currency.
Maxx, you got that Ron Paul video somewhere, where he explains this idea?
Maxx:QuoteHaving gold as a standard does have it's limitations that is for sure.
Yes, limitations on the abuse by government)))
But Maxx pointed out the me earlier this year not so much returning to the goldstanderd , but removing the enFORCED legal tender status of the greenback. AKA, have other currencies exist next to the fiat dollar system. This would require the removal of restriction using gold (or cold certificates) as a direct currency.
This way people can choose whenever they trust fiat currency or not, this competition will keep politicians in check of abusing fiat currency.
Maxx, you got that Ron Paul video somewhere, where he explains this idea?
JC I think you and Maxx misunderstand the meaning of the term "legal tender". What "legal tender" means is:
"United States coins and currency (including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues."
This however, doesn't mean that two people, businesses, corporations or entities could agree to accept some other type of payment. Because there is no federal statute that mandates that that a private business, a person or an organization must accept currency or coins as for payment for goods and/or services. Private businesses are free to develop their own policies on whether or not to accept cash unless there is a State law which says otherwise. For example, a bus line may prohibit payment of fares in pennies or dollar bills. In addition, movie theaters, convenience stores and gas stations may refuse to accept large denomination currency (usually notes above $20) as a matter of policy.
So Maxx, JC if you want to start a business in the USA and only accept gold for payment you are perfectly free to do so. How successful such a policy will be is an entirely different matter.
http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/currency/legal-tender.shtml
Maxx:QuoteHaving gold as a standard does have it's limitations that is for sure.
Yes, limitations on the abuse by government)))
But Maxx pointed out the me earlier this year not so much returning to the goldstanderd , but removing the enFORCED legal tender status of the greenback. AKA, have other currencies exist next to the fiat dollar system. This would require the removal of restriction using gold (or cold certificates) as a direct currency.
This way people can choose whenever they trust fiat currency or not, this competition will keep politicians in check of abusing fiat currency.
Maxx, you got that Ron Paul video somewhere, where he explains this idea?
JC I think you and Maxx misunderstand the meaning of the term "legal tender". What "legal tender" means is:
"United States coins and currency (including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues."
This however, doesn't mean that two people, businesses, corporations or entities could agree to accept some other type of payment. Because there is no federal statute that mandates that that a private business, a person or an organization must accept currency or coins as for payment for goods and/or services. Private businesses are free to develop their own policies on whether or not to accept cash unless there is a State law which says otherwise. For example, a bus line may prohibit payment of fares in pennies or dollar bills. In addition, movie theaters, convenience stores and gas stations may refuse to accept large denomination currency (usually notes above $20) as a matter of policy.
So Maxx, JC if you want to start a business in the USA and only accept gold for payment you are perfectly free to do so. How successful such a policy will be is an entirely different matter.
http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/currency/legal-tender.shtml
Can't do that. The Fed will close you down. You must accepts FRNs or you will be prosecuted.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21836699/ BTW the R. P. coins are NOT "fake" silver and gold. That is just a misleading headline by the establishment media.
Maxx:QuoteHaving gold as a standard does have it's limitations that is for sure.
Yes, limitations on the abuse by government)))
But Maxx pointed out the me earlier this year not so much returning to the goldstanderd , but removing the enFORCED legal tender status of the greenback. AKA, have other currencies exist next to the fiat dollar system. This would require the removal of restriction using gold (or cold certificates) as a direct currency.
This way people can choose whenever they trust fiat currency or not, this competition will keep politicians in check of abusing fiat currency.
Maxx, you got that Ron Paul video somewhere, where he explains this idea?
JC I think you and Maxx misunderstand the meaning of the term "legal tender". What "legal tender" means is:
"United States coins and currency (including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues."
This however, doesn't mean that two people, businesses, corporations or entities could agree to accept some other type of payment. Because there is no federal statute that mandates that that a private business, a person or an organization must accept currency or coins as for payment for goods and/or services. Private businesses are free to develop their own policies on whether or not to accept cash unless there is a State law which says otherwise. For example, a bus line may prohibit payment of fares in pennies or dollar bills. In addition, movie theaters, convenience stores and gas stations may refuse to accept large denomination currency (usually notes above $20) as a matter of policy.
So Maxx, JC if you want to start a business in the USA and only accept gold for payment you are perfectly free to do so. How successful such a policy will be is an entirely different matter.
http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/currency/legal-tender.shtml
Can't do that. The Fed will close you down. You must accepts FRNs or you will be prosecuted.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21836699/ BTW the R. P. coins are NOT "fake" silver and gold. That is just a misleading headline by the establishment media.
Maxx the people from your link were minting the Ron Paul gold and silver coins and claiming the coins was currency. They were also trying to circulate the coins in the economy. Both of those activities are highly illegal. The link from the US Treasury is quite clear, it states: There is, however, no Federal statute mandating that a private business, a person or an organization must accept currency or coins as for payment for goods and/or services. Private businesses are free to develop their own policies on whether or not to accept cash unless there is a State law which says otherwise.
I think your business would be in deep financial trouble quite quickly if your company policy was to only accept gold and silver coins. In addition, it is far easier to tell counterfeit currency from counterfeit gold and silver, providing of course you've had the proper training and have the right equipment.
http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/currency/legal-tender.shtml
http://www.federalreserve.gov/generalinfo/faq/faqcur.htm Same statute this time from the US Federal Reserve
Maxx:QuoteHaving gold as a standard does have it's limitations that is for sure.
Yes, limitations on the abuse by government)))
But Maxx pointed out the me earlier this year not so much returning to the goldstanderd , but removing the enFORCED legal tender status of the greenback. AKA, have other currencies exist next to the fiat dollar system. This would require the removal of restriction using gold (or cold certificates) as a direct currency.
This way people can choose whenever they trust fiat currency or not, this competition will keep politicians in check of abusing fiat currency.
Maxx, you got that Ron Paul video somewhere, where he explains this idea?
JC I think you and Maxx misunderstand the meaning of the term "legal tender". What "legal tender" means is:
"United States coins and currency (including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues."
This however, doesn't mean that two people, businesses, corporations or entities could agree to accept some other type of payment. Because there is no federal statute that mandates that that a private business, a person or an organization must accept currency or coins as for payment for goods and/or services. Private businesses are free to develop their own policies on whether or not to accept cash unless there is a State law which says otherwise. For example, a bus line may prohibit payment of fares in pennies or dollar bills. In addition, movie theaters, convenience stores and gas stations may refuse to accept large denomination currency (usually notes above $20) as a matter of policy.
So Maxx, JC if you want to start a business in the USA and only accept gold for payment you are perfectly free to do so. How successful such a policy will be is an entirely different matter.
http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/currency/legal-tender.shtml
Can't do that. The Fed will close you down. You must accepts FRNs or you will be prosecuted.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21836699/ BTW the R. P. coins are NOT "fake" silver and gold. That is just a misleading headline by the establishment media.
Maxx the people from your link were minting the Ron Paul gold and silver coins and claiming the coins was currency. They were also trying to circulate the coins in the economy. Both of those activities are highly illegal. The link from the US Treasury is quite clear, it states: There is, however, no Federal statute mandating that a private business, a person or an organization must accept currency or coins as for payment for goods and/or services. Private businesses are free to develop their own policies on whether or not to accept cash unless there is a State law which says otherwise.
I think your business would be in deep financial trouble quite quickly if your company policy was to only accept gold and silver coins. In addition, it is far easier to tell counterfeit currency from counterfeit gold and silver, providing of course you've had the proper training and have the right equipment.
http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/currency/legal-tender.shtml
http://www.federalreserve.gov/generalinfo/faq/faqcur.htm Same statute this time from the US Federal Reserve
Dig a little deeper and you will see you are wrong. You make distinctions without a difference. It's rigged when it gets into the courts.
The individuals minting and distributing the Ron Paul gold and silver coins are fools.
Everyone talking about the usd losing value but the Euro in worse shape.
Euro vs usd 10/10/ 2010 .714 on 11/9/2010 .726. However gold during that time 1342 to 1421. Euro just getting trashed. So people in Euro zone with any assets in Euro (including house) losing value on global stage. Euro .73 today.
If Obama continues to make a weak dollar the Euro is in big trouble. England was smart by not going to the Euro. Germany may want to bail on the euro zone as there the only country doing well on mainland euro zone.
Also gold down today. Oil still better than gold past two years. $1,600 usd is the critical point for gold if it gets there easy to $2,000 usd however if it stalls than Wall street will make it go below $1,000 usd. Gold was $832 usd on 11/09/07 and up 68% past three years less than 20% yearly returns.
JC said he bought gold in 2008 however the price he said was lower than every market date. I question if he actually has gold. You might want to go back and edit your post. You bought gold for $680 usd in 2008. Find me a daily price at that level in 2008. http://www.usagold.com/reference/prices/2008.html
http://www.kitco.com/scripts/hist_charts/monthly_graphs.plx
Maybe your a pirate and stole some. :party0031:
also gold down today
Everyone talking about the usd losing value but the Euro in worse shape.
If Obama continues to make a weak dollar the Euro is in big trouble.
England was smart by not going to the Euro.
Germany may want to bail on the euro zone as there the only country doing well on mainland euro zone.
Westy:QuoteThe individuals minting and distributing the Ron Paul gold and silver coins are fools.
Let us stay on target, wether or not we are fools is not the issue, the issue is we cannot use GOLD/SILVER coins as legal payment for goods and services if BOTH parties agree to it. And it is typical how you first claim we are free to do so, and then claim the opposite, you have a retention correlation problem.
We are not free to barter (lets call it that) with gold coins, if you try, you will feel the cold hard steel of a police glock in the back of your head.
Yeah...land of the free and all that....riiight!!!
1msmoby.
Day 1 Euro vs usd would give you less than 1% yearly return. Is that a great deal? However when you adjust it for countries coming in after day 1 is is a negative return.
Why during World Cup it was England and not Britain on the uniforms?
Maybe inside Britain / England they need to sort out whether there England or Britain. Also British papers use England and Britain and refer to one country.
I have lived in Europe before and you do need to worry about Forex. Every country has that issue.
JC you got the $680 price from previous years and it was not a typo.
I bought gold at 860 , I am laughing my ass off!
PS: I did not "double" my money, I prevented my savings from being halved!
860 usd, that was when 1 euro was 1.6 usd
(or did you also forget I live in France), meaning I bought it for 537 euros.
Now it is at 1275,
....[SNIP]....
I would call it roughly "doubling" in my book. Notice i used the quotes again , as the factuality means , my money didnt get cut in half by inflation (Thanks to Greece and other PIGS countries)
I have lived in Europe before and you do need to worry about Forex. Every country has that issue.
JC still waiting for you to point out why gold can't be used for payment in the USA?
Edit: Maxx what about you?
The short answer is that federal legal tender laws require creditors to accept payment denominated in dollars, but generally do not require businesses to accept any particular form of payment -- such as cash.
JC still waiting for you to point out why gold can't be used for payment in the USA?
Edit: Maxx what about you?
Been busy. The issue as I understand it is one cannot opt out of the FR system or aid others to do so as a USC.
http://legallad.quickanddirtytips.com/legal-tender.aspxQuoteThe short answer is that federal legal tender laws require creditors to accept payment denominated in dollars, but generally do not require businesses to accept any particular form of payment -- such as cash.
JC still waiting for you to point out why gold can't be used for payment in the USA?
Edit: Maxx what about you?
Been busy. The issue as I understand it is one cannot opt out of the FR system or aid others to do so as a USC.
http://legallad.quickanddirtytips.com/legal-tender.aspxQuoteThe short answer is that federal legal tender laws require creditors to accept payment denominated in dollars, but generally do not require businesses to accept any particular form of payment -- such as cash.
It is PERFECTLY legal to buy and sell goods and/or services in the US without using dollars (FRN's) or coin. It is done all the time. It is called barter(ing). However, the transaction must be 'benchmarked' against a dollar value.
If I were to remodel your house for a value of $50,000 and you wanted to pay me with gold, silver, corn, cars, other professional services or whatever, all of which is perfectly legal, just generally not practical. The issue is the buyer needs to have something the seller wants or is willing to accept. I would happily do work for a car dealer for a new service truck. However I have no interest in doing the same work for say a BMW or SmartCar.
The caveat here is, that the 'income' must be declared as in USD and the appropriate taxes be paid.
JC still waiting for you to point out why gold can't be used for payment in the USA?
Edit: Maxx what about you?
Been busy. The issue as I understand it is one cannot opt out of the FR system or aid others to do so as a USC.
http://legallad.quickanddirtytips.com/legal-tender.aspxQuoteThe short answer is that federal legal tender laws require creditors to accept payment denominated in dollars, but generally do not require businesses to accept any particular form of payment -- such as cash.
It is PERFECTLY legal to buy and sell goods and/or services in the US without using dollars (FRN's) or coin. It is done all the time. It is called barter(ing). However, the transaction must be 'benchmarked' against a dollar value.
If I were to remodel your house for a value of $50,000 and you wanted to pay me with gold, silver, corn, cars, other professional services or whatever, all of which is perfectly legal, just generally not practical. The issue is the buyer needs to have something the seller wants or is willing to accept. I would happily do work for a car dealer for a new service truck. However I have no interest in doing the same work for say a BMW or SmartCar.
The caveat here is, that the 'income' must be declared as in USD and the appropriate taxes be paid.
And pay taxes? Maxx and JC will not be liking that.
JC still waiting for you to point out why gold can't be used for payment in the USA?
Edit: Maxx what about you?
Been busy. The issue as I understand it is one cannot opt out of the FR system or aid others to do so as a USC.
http://legallad.quickanddirtytips.com/legal-tender.aspxQuoteThe short answer is that federal legal tender laws require creditors to accept payment denominated in dollars, but generally do not require businesses to accept any particular form of payment -- such as cash.
It is PERFECTLY legal to buy and sell goods and/or services in the US without using dollars (FRN's) or coin. It is done all the time. It is called barter(ing). However, the transaction must be 'benchmarked' against a dollar value.
If I were to remodel your house for a value of $50,000 and you wanted to pay me with gold, silver, corn, cars, other professional services or whatever, all of which is perfectly legal, just generally not practical. The issue is the buyer needs to have something the seller wants or is willing to accept. I would happily do work for a car dealer for a new service truck. However I have no interest in doing the same work for say a BMW or SmartCar.
The caveat here is, that the 'income' must be declared as in USD and the appropriate taxes be paid.
And pay taxes? Maxx and JC will not be liking that.
For all the crimes he committed personally or others committed in his name, it was tax evasion that eventually put Al Capone in jail.
And pay taxes? Maxx and JC will not be liking that.
QuoteFor all the crimes he committed personally or others committed in his name, it was tax evasion that eventually put Al Capone in jail.
Your missing the point and putting the horse behind the cart, if the US had not had an intrusive government deciding what is best for people (outlawing and criminalizing alcohol), Organized crime wouldn't exist in the first place, so it is funny to see how some people attribute the solution of a problem to government ,......the problem it created in the first place.
Ps: Lets say I trade 2 live chickens for a "porcelet" (pigglet). Not paying VAT on that is criminal.
Land of the free, :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
QuoteFor all the crimes he committed personally or others committed in his name, it was tax evasion that eventually put Al Capone in jail.
Your missing the point and putting the horse behind the cart, if the US had not had an intrusive government deciding what is best for people (outlawing and criminalizing alcohol), Organized crime wouldn't exist in the first place, so it is funny to see how some people attribute the solution of a problem to government ,......the problem it created in the first place.
Ps: Lets say I trade 2 live chickens for a "porcelet" (pigglet). Not paying VAT on that is criminal.
Land of the free, :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
The US government may be intrusive by your definition but according to experts in the field it is far less intrusive than most of the governments of the world.
Once again it is you, taking an excerpt, placing it out of context,
almost bought some silver eagles today, but hesitated and didn't. What do you guys think? Will there be a pullback in silver soon? I have a feeling it might test 23-24dollar range again before it shoots up to $50 or $60 by summertime. Thoughts?
almost bought some silver eagles today, but hesitated and didn't. What do you guys think? Will there be a pullback in silver soon? I have a feeling it might test 23-24dollar range again before it shoots up to $50 or $60 by summertime. Thoughts?
Premier Wen Jiabao shakes hands with his Russian counterpart Vladimir Putin on a visit to St. Petersburg on Tuesday.ALEXEY DRUZHININ / AFP
St. Petersburg, Russia - China and Russia have decided to renounce the US dollar and resort to using their own currencies for bilateral trade, Premier Wen Jiabao and his Russian counterpart Vladimir Putin announced late on Tuesday.
RUSSIA AND CHINA QUIT THE DOLLAR
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2010-11/24/content_11599087.htm
(http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/images/attachement/jpg/site1/20101124/0023ae73cfef0e569b3f59.jpg)Quote
Premier Wen Jiabao shakes hands with his Russian counterpart Vladimir Putin on a visit to St. Petersburg on Tuesday.ALEXEY DRUZHININ / AFP
St. Petersburg, Russia - China and Russia have decided to renounce the US dollar and resort to using their own currencies for bilateral trade, Premier Wen Jiabao and his Russian counterpart Vladimir Putin announced late on Tuesday.
Thanks for the "spend" and "print" policies of the last to fiscally socialist presidents Bush and Obama!
Logic Westy,
If crooks seem to trust other crooks more then the fed, doesnt thay say something about the fed?
Not getting the point as usual,
Anyway,
Eurozone is not going to make christmas fellas
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704693104575638132375883318.html?mod=WSJ_hp_LEFTTopStories
Spain needs immediate infusion of money! and represents 10% of GDP of the Eurozone!
Look at that big domino called Spain:
(http://sg.wsj.net/public/resources/images/WO-AD491A_BAILO_NS_20101126181638.gif)
almost bought some silver eagles today, but hesitated and didn't. What do you guys think? Will there be a pullback in silver soon? I have a feeling it might test 23-24dollar range again before it shoots up to $50 or $60 by summertime. Thoughts?
My college degree helped me - worth every penny.
If your worried about paying for future children's college education marry a tall RW and your kid will easily get a paid athletic scholarship. Or worst case super model.
Interesting read especially as I am involved in small scale mining in Africa. Gold is the 56 rarest mineral on earth and its intrinsic value is based on its many ways of use. No other mineral is that workable like gold doing thin sheets of gold without them breaking the elasticity of the gold. But his real value is the fact that gold is the only monetary value which can not be altered by politicans or groups. One of the reason why gold is on the raise, if all money is nothing worth anymore gold will become the major currency deposit. Money without real gold reserves will have no value, that is the way how nations will be formed in the future.
On the other hand is small scale mining an important factor for millions of people who doing that mining for their daily life with all the advantage and disadvantage behind and within the small scale mining groups. The biggest disadvantage are the environmental destruction and the bacterial, viral and heavy metal poisoning of Body and surroundings. I tested for the last couple of week the Advanced Oxidation system in several small scale mining concessions and the results are great and have lead to the set up of the final practical system for small scale mining. Providing excellent water in the mining process, fish farming and other agricultural projects so the assets out of the ground become an Asset and as well a Liability in social capital community systems.
Gold as an asset holds its value by it rarity which is good so! We as humans have to renew our way of financial thinking and handling as Countries we are mostly bankrupt, being able to print as much as they want and see fit the collaps is just extended but will come.
So having a bit of gold is a good option.
Cheers
U.S. Home Prices Slump Again
I don't see any mention that gold has done it's share of slumping lately. Any of you speculators getting nervous yet?
Personally, although I have enjoyed this thread I would find a thread on stocks much more interesting.
I don't see any mention that gold has done it's share of slumping lately. Any of you speculators getting nervous yet?
Personally, although I have enjoyed this thread I would find a thread on stocks much more interesting.
My stock's lost some ground since the beginning of the year but still up overall. :) Watching it, though. But yeah, precious metals (gold) has dropped off. Talking heads are saying maybe as low as $1270.(USD) Reasons being a higher interest rate and a return of investor confidence (US).
Brass
we could easily see $5,000 per ounce gold and $500 per ounce silver, and everybody will regret not loading up as much as possible at these levels.
If money is worthless you want to hold assets,
aka companies, gold, land, etc etc
@Westy,
This thread started when gold was well below $1000 usd, during its steep rise, the only thing you can say "its all a scam",
Sure dude, trust your federal issued funny paper, its your choice to sink your time and labor into it.
On March 10th, the day of the first post in this thread, the DOW closed at 10,561. Today it was bouncing up and down at the 12,000 mark. Now you could look at that and say that a given amount of money invested either way would have returned a similar amount. When you invest in gold you have a lump of metal that does nothing except sit there and look pretty (like some AW I have known) Stocks are a piece of a real live company that does something and sometimes they do this funny thing like pay dividends. Add in some dividend income and stocks were the better investment. Personally I think that will be much more the case over the next few months. I expect gold to drop at least $ 100.00 and stocks to go up over 12,500 or more.
...A scare story to be sure but well grounded in known fact and sound economics. One might be looking at buying assets that are not denominated in dollars and that are controlled or produced in a productive economy.
When those exported dollars come back to the US there will be a mighty wailing and gnashing of teeth - unless one is holding assets priced in the new reserve currency and purchased with 'old' dollars. ;)
Personally I think that will be much more the case over the next few months. I expect gold to drop at least $ 100.00 and stocks to go up over 12,500 or more.
This thread was started by you on March 10th and in your first post you stated the price of gold was $ 1150.00. If that is below a grand we learned a different kind of math. Go back and read your first post.
Well I just came from having dinner at Waffle House and they seemed to have no problem tanking my money so it's not worthless yet.
Could be that China is trying to take U.S. currency out of the equation.
Brass
I suppose it depends upon the distance of your horizon: http://sovereign-investor.com/2011/01/28/why-america-will-be-blindsided-by-this-currency-shock/
A scare story to be sure but well grounded in known fact and sound economics. One might be looking at buying assets that are not denominated in dollars and that are controlled or produced in a productive economy.
When those exported dollars come back to the US there will be a mighty wailing and gnashing of teeth - unless one is holding assets priced in the new reserve currency and purchased with 'old' dollars. ;)
so, i'm expecting a 5-10% correction within the next month.
i listen to a financial show in Houston, www.streettalklive.com. i think i've mentioned it before; but these guys are great, they have a free weekly newsletter that i would highly advise anyone interested in the US economy and markets to get. if i would have been following them in 2007 and 2008, i would be retired now(yes, theyre that spot on).
Did it by heart, did not took the effort to go back to page one and search, but I have been discussing gold since i bought it at 860 (yeah i said 860, not 680, please don't misread again).
QuoteWell I just came from having dinner at Waffle House and they seemed to have no problem tanking my money so it's not worthless yet.
Paying the same price for waffles as you did a year ago? I think not!
By the way it is legal tender by law, try using something else and you will feel the cold hard steel of a policeglock in the back of your head!
Quote from: leeholsenso, i'm expecting a 5-10% correction within the next month.
i listen to a financial show in Houston, www.streettalklive.com. i think i've mentioned it before; but these guys are great, they have a free weekly newsletter that i would highly advise anyone interested in the US economy and markets to get. if i would have been following them in 2007 and 2008, i would be retired now(yes, theyre that spot on).
Well, the nice thing about that prediction is that we only have to wait a month to find out. I will remember this and respond again in 30 days.
Humm, being able to retire in profits from 2007 to 2011 is great. Of course if you listened to JC you could have done that in a year.
Westcoast, yes, I know the writer has something to sell, but I also understand, in part because of my training that the fundamentals of his article are spot on.
You can argue from your armchair about when the GDP of China will overtake that of the US but for sure it will happen. Prediction is always a task done with a cloudy crystal ball but when you look at many sources you see figures ranging from as soon as 2015 out to as far as 2030 with a mean, based upon my quick look at around, of about 2020. Of course, if one were to use PPP figures then the numbers close in a lot!
In truth though it does not really matter when this happens, what really matters is the market expectation of it happening. Currency trading, like many other trades is kinda like pass the parcel, you don't want to be the one holding the parcel (US dollars) when the music stops so the incentive is to move before the market which means that everyone brings forward the expectations and the process gathers speed, just as happened with the US real estate boom and bust.
My guess is that China well understand the benefits of being the global reserve currency - export of inflation, economic control, global influence and will seek to firstly reduce the degree to which the US can benefit from the tool (they are already doing this) and secondly to remove the tool from the hands of the US.
I DO recall the ideas a few years ago of 'The Japanese Are Coming' and, of course they never did, not quite as we feared anyway, but China is a different case. IMHO the Japanese did not want to rule the world, they just wanted to be able to go and play golf in it, an ambition fully achieved!
Andrew, your training in what? In economics or finance, both doubtful.
Why do I say this, because nobody with extensive education, training and real world work experience in either disciple would say, as you stated "the GDP of China will overtake that of the US but for sure it will happen".
with later dates being more likely and the very real possibility of it not happening at all becoming even more likely.
I don't agree that is a sure thing however.Red Herring:Chinese can :censored: up too, so both countries can end up at the bottom of the food chain, I
also don't agree it is a sure thing that the economy will colapse throwing us into chaos and only those with gold will thrive.
I also don't agree it is a sure thing that the economy will colapse throwing us into chaos and only those with gold will thrive.True, Ray. People who have enough silver, platinum and real estate that is paid for will also do OK IMO. So gold is not the only commodity to help us survive a crisis. The right type of education/profession is another one. not to be ignored.
It is a sure thing that my yacht won't sink JC. I guess there really are some sure things.
I also don't agree it is a sure thing that the economy will colapse throwing us into chaos and only those with gold will thrive.True, Ray. People who have enough silver, platinum and real estate that is paid for will also do OK IMO. So gold is not the only commodity to help us survive a crisis. The right type of education/profession is another one. not to be ignored.
Let's pray that we, as people, can change that in 2012 and that it's not too late by then...I do think it is facing some of the more difficult challenges while at the same time it has the worst leadership to guide us through it.I also don't agree it is a sure thing that the economy will colapse throwing us into chaos and only those with gold will thrive.True, Ray. People who have enough silver, platinum and real estate that is paid for will also do OK IMO. So gold is not the only commodity to help us survive a crisis. The right type of education/profession is another one. not to be ignored.
You commented that you had bought gold at 860 US dollars. When I commented that gold was well over that price when you said you bought it then all of a sudden you decided that you had bought them in Euros.
Now it isn't $ 860 or $ 680 it's $ 540.00.
bought gold at at 540 somewhat euros,
Personally I don't know what to think of you JC
Undoubtedly there are arbitrage opportunities on both the upswing and down again and, I am sure JC is not the only European to have benefited
it is kinda hard to debase a piece of paper.
Heck, JC, the only gold I own was bought when gold was $ 35.00 an ounce.
Let me change the subject here. I used to see a lot of big bolded posts about the price of gold. Where does everyone think the price of gold will be about a month from now. Let's say March 15th, 2011. Give me your guess. Mine is $ 1290.00 Anyone for $ 2000? Just for reference Friday, Feb 11th was $ 1,359.90
QuoteHeck, JC, the only gold I own was bought when gold was $ 35.00 an ounce.
No, it means your money was worth something back then,...., 35 usd of your money could buy 1 ounce
Now its slightly different,....1.3k buys one ounce.
Not quite right JC. Actually the government had regulated the price of gold and fixed it at $ 35.00 an ounce
When they deregulated it
there was a rapid increase in the price.Printing money raises everything in price...aka inflation?
Wow, I must be a mind reader. I knew somehow you would get the $ 860 that became $ 680 that became $ 540 to less yet.
You bought it at 860 USD or $ 540.00 Euro's
Ray, I hope you bought some silver and gold last month when it took a temporary dip down. Silver at $31.13 right now and I expect it to go to $40 by the end of this summer. Gold again is only $18 bucks away from hitting $1,400. US dollar is loosing value...time to wake up and smell the roses tiphat
Ray, I hope you bought some silver and gold last month when it took a temporary dip down. Silver at $31.13 right now and I expect it to go to $40 by the end of this summer. Gold again is only $18 bucks away from hitting $1,400. US dollar is loosing value...time to wake up and smell the roses tiphat
I thought that gold price is the same for every country, it's like world standart set by the markets? It could vary in relation to each individual country's currency though, not because gold price varies but because country's currencies go up or down.Ray, I hope you bought some silver and gold last month when it took a temporary dip down. Silver at $31.13 right now and I expect it to go to $40 by the end of this summer. Gold again is only $18 bucks away from hitting $1,400. US dollar is loosing value...time to wake up and smell the roses tiphat
You know what's odd? Canadian gold prices, which usually almost mirror US gold prices has started to break away recently (currently sitting at $1360.86 (CAD). Silver's still real close to the US price at $30.77 (CAD) as I type this.
Brass
I thought that gold price is the same for every country, it's like world standart set by the markets? It could vary in relation to each individual country's currency though, not because gold price varies but because country's currencies go up or down.
I'm not an expert in this so I might be wrong. But the reason for what you are describing, Brass, might be that Canadian dollar is fluctuating differently from US dollar?
Let me change the subject here. I used to see a lot of big bolded posts about the price of gold. Where does everyone think the price of gold will be about a month from now. Let's say March 15th, 2011. Give me your guess. Mine is $ 1290.00 Anyone for $ 2000? Just for reference Friday, Feb 11th was $ 1,359.90
I'm thinking some significant fluctuations in both directions, maybe around +/- $30. USD and probably settle right around where it is now ($1360. +/- $5. USD) over 30 days. Longer term 60 or 90 days, it may drop into TG's area.
Let me change the subject here. I used to see a lot of big bolded posts about the price of gold. Where does everyone think the price of gold will be about a month from now. Let's say March 15th, 2011. Give me your guess. Mine is $ 1290.00 Anyone for $ 2000? Just for reference Friday, Feb 11th was $ 1,359.90
I'm thinking some significant fluctuations in both directions, maybe around +/- $30. USD and probably settle right around where it is now ($1360. +/- $5. USD) over 30 days. Longer term 60 or 90 days, it may drop into TG's area.
Gold $1416.93 (USD) - Market closed. Well, that's my prediction out the window...How you makin' out TG? ;D
Brass
I missed by a country mile Brass. Of course something like the unrest in the Middle East is a little difficult to predict and that was one big factor in the rise in gold prices.
JC, I think most anyone except you would find little to disagree with about the fact that gold tends to rise when people are worried about things and to do down when peoples fears are calmed.
Still there are enough potential problems in the world no one, not even the great JC can positively forcast anything regarding the price of gold.
"Fiat money has nowhere else to go but gold"
Wow, so he is the same kind of idiot as me,..., thanks for the honer badge!
Well this is unexpected - worst Nuclear Nightmare in Japan sice Hiroshima and Nagasaki and Gold goes DOWN on massive selling of all commodities...
Yup, and after Japans starts rebuilding its infrastructre after the quake, what do you think will happen to the price of raw materials and the oil needed to transport them?
Yeah,.., thinking ahead for Keynesians seems to be difficult.
Well this is unexpected - worst Nuclear Nightmare in Japan sice Hiroshima and Nagasaki and Gold goes DOWN on massive selling of all commodities...
Are you saying that no one will trust the Yen and they will have to pay in Gold?
Japan is a rather small country
your brain works kinda funny , reading your conclusions about my supposed intent.QuoteJapan is a rather small country
Really,.., I thought it was an economic giant....[edit: Ease up JC. Brass]
and i'm feeling about the luckiest sob on the planet last as week i pulled everything out except my 401k. i didnt get hit by most of this, but i still got slapped around in 2007/2008; so i'm no expert.
this is the concept that so many people can't grasp for some reason. Most of them will start getting into gold and silver just when it's time to get out. When you see lines forming at coin stores, that's the time to sell!
Gold and silver are constants. Their Current appreciation relates primarily to the debasement of the currencies in which they are quoted, a debasement incidentally which is rapidly accelerating.[/b]
I will say that most infomercials and advertisments selling gold do recommend buying gold. It does seem like most of the independent financial managers don't or at best suggest keeping a very small (1%) or so of your investments in gold.
I A Technical and Fundamental Dismissal of the “Burst Gold Bubble”
Eric Roseman (February 2, 2011)
- Dugald Malcolm, Montreal, Canada
But don’t take my technical word for it – how about some fundamental analysis from a true guru, John Embry.
Gold and silver are constants.
Good point Eduard. I have always been amazed at investor psychology. You heaar everyone say buy low and sell high and yet in practice that scares people to death and they are drawn to do the opposite. Buying high and selling low just doesn't make sense to me.
this is the concept that so many people can't grasp for some reason. Most of them will start getting into gold and silver just when it's time to get out. When you see lines forming at coin stores, that's the time to sell!
The above is a weekly chart of gold. We can see that the price channel from 2005 (which, I might add, is even steeper than its longer-term trend line dating back to 2001) is still very much intact.
The above is a weekly chart of gold. We can see that the price channel from 2005 (which, I might add, is even steeper than its longer-term trend line dating back to 2001) is still very much intact.
I have a feeling that a chart of home prices done in 2007 would have looked much the same as the gold chart you posted and probably the home price chart could be extended a few more decades than you can do with gold. A gold chart going back to about '75 should look much different when you include the last gold bubble before the current one.
TG, doesnt want to understand the fundamentals that drive economic reality, its more like voodoo to him, or something to do with "consumer confidence" LOOOL
Anyway...lets stick to the facts,..., should "Alt's" be unravelling by now?
Wow, that huge wavefront,
Thats a tsunami if I ever saw one!!!
TG - not trying to be argumentative but the Real Estate bubble was caused by a flood of cheap cash and liberal 120% Loan to Value mortgages underwritten with risk transfer by a flood of unregulated CDSs and CDOs that inflated home prices and now that those liberal lending policies are over and cash tight again home values have plummeted - one might think the same will happen with Gold and Silver etc but the irony is just the opposite as the FED printing presses and virtual money machines (QE1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 ad nauseum) as the good professor states - gold and silver outside of traditional industrial and jewelry demand are the only real money and their relative value is a constant -
Now you know why Bernanke's nut bag is up around his Adams apple for the next couple of years :snivel: :duh: >:(
What you saw on TV in Fukushima - is also happening in the US economy right now! Recovery just temporary QE12345... smoke and mirrors for Obamsters 2012 re-election bid - now that he is bombing Libya he can claim he is strong on defense too boot. Does not look like the fed will pull back on the printing presses and virtual QE money machines throttles any time soon - balanced budgets now a permanent fantasy - so Gold and Silver not about to collapse anytime soon either - you need Prosperity, Stability, Low to no Inflation and Peace for gold and silver to drop in value - not gonna happen in my lifetime.
I do want to respectfully ask you this Cuff. If gold is a constant, why did you say "Gold and Silver not about to collapse anytime soon either " If it is a constant how can it collapse at all?I think it's just a figure of speech, Ray. Everything is relative, and if the dollar suddenly gains strength gold will go down in price or "collapse" relative to the dollar. Think about it. Why do all governments maintain gold reserve?
Yes, the speculation a few weeks ago was that there would be no QE3 and now the expecations are there will be and that could well happen to make a 4-5-?.
Now you know why Bernanke's nut bag is up around his Adams apple for the next couple of years :snivel: :duh: >:(
What you saw on TV in Fukushima - is also happening in the US economy right now! Recovery just temporary QE12345... smoke and mirrors for Obamsters 2012 re-election bid - now that he is bombing Libya he can claim he is strong on defense too boot. Does not look like the fed will pull back on the printing presses and virtual QE money machines throttles any time soon - balanced budgets now a permanent fantasy - so Gold and Silver not about to collapse anytime soon either - you need Prosperity, Stability, Low to no Inflation and Peace for gold and silver to drop in value - not gonna happen in my lifetime.
Yes, the speculation a few weeks ago was that there would be no QE3 and now the expecations are there will be and that could well happen to make a 4-5-?.
I bolded the part where you said it doesn't look likely that gold and silver will collpase any time soon. Personally a few weeks ago I thought we were at the top and the economy seemed to be picking up steam, jobs were getting better, the move to really correct some of the ills in the economy seemed to be winning and if people started pulling out of gold that the price could drop rapidly.
Now with a third war all the problems in Japan and the like I think the gold price will not drop for a while.
I do want to respectfully ask you this Cuff. If gold is a constant, why did you say "Gold and Silver not about to collapse anytime soon either " If it is a constant how can it collapse at all?
QuoteYes, the speculation a few weeks ago was that there would be no QE3 and now the expecations are there will be and that could well happen to make a 4-5-?.
Its dead easy predicting the economy if you are from the "Austrain" persuasion...
easy to understand Economics in one lesson,..rap video between Keynes and Hayek (watch full, its funny like hell)
@Cuff,
I see in the graph that the wavefront will hit april/jun 2012,..., thats a coincidence right? ;D
Where is that tin foil hat when you need it, tiphat
Goldman Sachs, in a recent research note,
said that gold could rally to $1,480 an ounce through June but that once the Federal Reserve raises interest rates
JC:
I say declare bankruptcy and start over! I hear Donald trump is an expert in that.
Excuse my ignorance guys but on page 3 of this topic someone mentions non hybrid garden seeds. Is that some kind of business term or are we talking about seeds?
Can one of you gold experts help me out here?try www.kitco.com they have historic charts, you might be able to look that up there.
I need to get the closing value of 1oz Krugerrand coins on December 31, 2010 for a portfolio evaluation. Bid and asked if available.
Can't seem to find anything but a current price on the internet.
Can one of you gold experts help me out here?
I need to get the closing value of 1oz Krugerrand coins on December 31, 2010 for a portfolio evaluation. Bid and asked if available.
Can't seem to find anything but a current price on the internet.
Shakey Krugerrands aren't bought and sold on the market like gold is so there isn't one true price for the value of a 1 oz Krugerrand. The price at any time will vary from dealer to dealer. The accepted way of valuing something like a Krugerrand is to gather several quotes for the specified date from different dealers and average the quotes. If you don't want to do all that work simply get a quote from a local dealer and use that number.
Mike, what is the likelyhood of balancing the budget while the Dems are in power?
Shakey Krugerrands aren't bought and sold on the market like gold is so there isn't one true price for the value of a 1 oz Krugerrand. The price at any time will vary from dealer to dealer. The accepted way of valuing something like a Krugerrand is to gather several quotes for the specified date from different dealers and average the quotes. If you don't want to do all that work simply get a quote from a local dealer and use that number.
OK, but all I can find is a current price. I need a price from 12-31-2010. The Wall Street Journal used to have a daily closing proice for Krugerrands with a bid (sell) and asked(buy) price. Can't seem to find that anywhere on the internet.
http://inflation.us/reviews/
http://inflation.us/reviews/gainesvillecoins.html
Gainesville coins was the only Gold and Silver seller on NIA to achieve a 5 Star rating - they do sell Krugerrands - they will probably be more than helpful as you might become a new customer ;)
Gold - $1,486.37(USD) / Silver - $43.01(USD) as I type (Market Close).yeah, I just was looking at it myself...unbelievable! This means that US dollar is going to sheet...
Brass
By JAMES MARSON
Belarussians scrambled to convert their local currency into U.S. dollars Sunday after President Alexander Lukashenko hinted that the Belarussian ruble could be devalued in coming days as Russia stalled on granting much-needed loans.
Lengthy queues formed outside currency exchanges, while some people turned to the black market to ditch their rubles at 10% to 20% above the official rate.
Mr. Lukashenko indicated Saturday that Belarus would adjust the exchange rate "in the next few days."
"Today, tomorrow, the day after tomorrow, we'll straighten out the situation with foreign currency. ... The exchange rate is a matter of several days, [we] need, perhaps, a week," he said, in comments carried by the state news agency.
One day earlier, he had suggested devaluation might not be necessary.
The ruble has come under pressure as Belarus's foreign reserves dwindled after the government boosted spending ahead of presidential elections in December and Russia cut crucial oil and gas subsidies.
The autocratic Mr. Lukashenko was elected to a fourth term since taking power in 1994, as thousands of people took to the streets to demonstrate against alleged vote-rigging.
The government has asked Russia and other ex-Soviet nations for a $3 billion bailout, but Moscow has demanded an economic stabilization program.
Belarus allowed a de facto 10% devaluation of the ruble on the interbank market in March, but cash exchanges have continued operating at the official rate.
Some Belarussians queued for several hours at exchanges Sunday or turned to friends and relatives to swap currency in order to protect savings or pay off foreign-currency loans.
"Everyone knows foreign currency isn't worth what it's being sold for at exchanges," said a 41-year-old woman who gave her name as Svetlana.
Mr. Lukashenko also said Saturday that the government would cut spending and lending, steps recommended by the International Monetary Fund to help Belarus deal with its large current-account deficit.
The increased economic uncertainty comes after Minsk, the capital, was shaken last week by a subway bombing that killed 13 people.
Mr. Lukashenko blamed unnamed enemies for trying to "destabilize" the country, saying that the bombing, the currency crisis and panic buying of sugar and vegetable oil amid rumors of imminent price increases were part of a "chain."
Mr. Lukashenko said Wednesday that the bomber had been caught, but the motive behind the attack remains a mystery.
Mounting economic woes and questions about security could dent the image Mr. Lukashenko cultivates as the country's guarantor of peace and stability.
—Olga Tomashevskaya contributed to this article.
Gold - $1493.85(USD) as I type. It's starting to get cozy with $1,500. We may see it go over in a day or two.
Brass
Gold - $1493.85(USD) as I type. It's starting to get cozy with $1,500. We may see it go over in a day or two.
Brass
Its a bubble i tell you,. LOOOOOL!!!!!
QE4, QE5? So how is Zimbabwenomics working for yaz? I hear China surpassed the US as nr 1 in undustrial output.... Its all Bushes fault I tell you
{Obama mode off}
having a liberal Ego dont pay the rent,...,hard work does!
I would post this question again will it go to 2,000 or 1,000 first. Mentioned this last year. Stock market has doubled for many stocks past year so gold was not a better buy this last year than many stocks.
You should buy gold now if you think it will go to 2,000 before 1,000 or you can day trade it. If the answers are no and no do not buy. If one of the answers is yes, than buy.
Gold is an easy thing to day trade when people have fear and demand. Spend less than 10 minutes a day and double you money easily every month. Fear and demand are back however agriculture is more hot now.
I fall into the camp have no idea if 2,000 or 1,000. If Obama gets killed tomorrow I would say not buy. However if Obama is going to get 4 more years it may go to 10,000.
Funny, how the Keynesians on this forum still are having NO clue!
Cuffy, take it away! I dont have the patience anymore to explain!
Gold - $1,511.80 (USD), Silver - $48.02(USD) as I type.
Brass
Unless the Federal Reserve acts now to dramatically raise interest rates
Note, price of silver is severly depressed, ..why? ...because in most (if not all) European countries there is a hefty 20% vat tax on the transaction of silver....so people dont sink their wealth into silver , because they would loose 20% buying and 20% when selling the stuff...
Brass, I'm not an expert but I will share a couple of thoughts with you. Remember that you are seeing prices in the US dollar. Canadian dollar is also going to be rising (actually has been rising) in relation to the US dollar simply because the US dollar is being devalued. This is one of the biggest reasons you see the rise in gold prices. Silver, on the other hand has been artificially held down by the banks so it is now starting to catch up with the true market value. And according to some, silver should be about 10% the value of gold, which makes it still about a $100 undervalued.Note, price of silver is severly depressed, ..why? ...because in most (if not all) European countries there is a hefty 20% vat tax on the transaction of silver....so people dont sink their wealth into silver , because they would loose 20% buying and 20% when selling the stuff...
I was thinking of buying scrap silver coin from the Canadian Mint here a few months ago but didn't. Think I'll buy some silver coins now. It's still affordable at $50. a coin (ounce) and although I can't invest enough to potentially get rich on (more along the lines of 'dabbling' really). I might be able to find enough cash lying around to pick up a tube or two and see what happens. :-\
Brass
I was thinking of buying scrap silver coin from the Canadian Mint here a few months ago but didn't. Think I'll buy some silver coins now. It's still affordable at $50. a coin (ounce) and although I can't invest enough to potentially get rich on (more along the lines of 'dabbling' really). I might be able to find enough cash lying around to pick up a tube or two and see what happens. :-\Brass, I'm not an expert but I will share a couple of thoughts with you. Remember that you are seeing prices in the US dollar. Canadian dollar is also going to be rising (actually has been rising) in relation to the US dollar simply because the US dollar is being devalued. This is one of the biggest reasons you see the rise in gold prices. Silver, on the other hand has been artificially held down by the banks so it is now starting to catch up with the true market value. And according to some, silver should be about 10% the value of gold, which makes it still about a $100 undervalued.
It's important for you to keep in mind that if you do hold US dollars then by all means get rid of them and put that money into silver. But Canadian dollar is not being devalued so I'd be a bit more careful with that since you are not going to see as much PM appreciation as we have in the US.
And lastly you might want to wait till June 30th or so. There might be a temporary pull back in the market so if that happens you could get more for your buck.
For the record,...Gold will go to above 2000 without breaking a sweat!, You can frame this post for future reference, although it will not stop you playing denial games again!
MissileMe.
I disagree with some of what you say and some of your terminology here. Making money on PM last 6 months? This bull run has been going on for years now. I don't think that "making money" is the right term here. Preserving your wealth would be more accurate. As it has been pointed out several times Gold price is a constant and is not really changing outside of daily fluctuations caused by the speculators. As Mike said, the price of a new, good suit paid for in gold was the same 400 years ago as it is now. The dollar is being devalued and gold is only rising in relation to the dollar. Yes, it did double since 2006 but so did many goods and food. That is your indicator that the dollar is being berried and people who made profit in the stock market didn't actually do any better than those who's been holding gold and silver.
Just added to my "gold stash" yesterday.
Bought a US 2006 $50 Buffalo MS70 First Strike for about $1725
Has value for the gold AND as a collectable. Most coin dealers are charging about $125 more for the exact same quality of coin. Good deal? Perhaps. Only time will tell.
The UN wanted to also send jobs from France, Germany, and the rest of the EU. But, socialists were smarter in the EU than in USA. so a trickle of jobs were outsourced from Europe. The flood of jobs were lost in the USA.
And no one said thank you.
YW.
Throughout human history good security always cost good money and if you have no security you loose your money.
QuoteThroughout human history good security always cost good money and if you have no security you loose your money.
Sounds like Don Corleone selling security......,weird things might happen if you dont buy his policy))))
QuoteThroughout human history good security always cost good money and if you have no security you loose your money.
Sounds like Don Corleone selling security......,weird things might happen if you dont buy his policy))))
LOL - WTF JC you never met me - I might resemble that remark! :smokin:
If the shoe fits...
LOL - at $5 a gallon for gasoline and $5 for a loaf of multi-grain bread - the only wheeling and dealing is Obama sucking up to Mark Zuckerberg and his 19 Million Facebook :money: friends for 2012 campaign donations!
Even worse, as Sean noted:
• Our national debt is increasing by $4,000,000,000 a day.
• 0% interest rates are pummeling savers.
• And there’s no end in sight.
the US just pulls too much of the world economically.
Quotethe US just pulls too much of the world economically.
I think you missed this newsflash
http://biggovernment.com/publius/2011/04/25/chinas-economy-to-surpass-u-s-economy-in-5-years/
If any one thinking of getting into silver right now is the time. This currant pull back is caused by the Fed pushing the price down, plus people like Soros took some profits. They will be buying back into it at todays prices though. Word is, depression is almost eminent as well as hyperinflation. Your dollars will loose lots of value by the end of this year so if you are thinking that you are doing great on the stock market see how you did after you deduct the capital gains tax along with another 30% dollar devaluation by the end of this year.
This is just my opinion though.
If any one thinking of getting into silver right now is the time. This currant pull back is caused by the Fed pushing the price down, plus people like Soros took some profits. They will be buying back into it at todays prices though. Word is, depression is almost eminent as well as hyperinflation. Your dollars will loose lots of value by the end of this year so if you are thinking that you are doing great on the stock market see how you did after you deduct the capital gains tax along with another 30% dollar devaluation by the end of this year.
This is just my opinion though.
If any one thinking of getting into silver right now is the time. This currant pull back is caused by the Fed pushing the price down, plus people like Soros took some profits. They will be buying back into it at todays prices though. Word is, depression is almost eminent as well as hyperinflation. Your dollars will loose lots of value by the end of this year so if you are thinking that you are doing great on the stock market see how you did after you deduct the capital gains tax along with another 30% dollar devaluation by the end of this year.
This is just my opinion though.
thats not correct. in order to have hyperinflation, you need bascially 3 things. 1 - commody inflation(check), velocity of money and wage growth; the US does not have the last two. now, the FED is putting a lot of money into use; but its just going back and forth between finiancial institutions; main street isnt getting it or trying to use it.
now, short term to mid term, next 6 months; the dollar should actually rally as people move out of stocks and thats going to hurt silver and gold; but the FED hasnt shown anything to expect they wont do a QE3 in the fall which will prop up everything again.
in the long term, 2 to 10 years; the US may go thru another market meltdown and certainly at least one more recession; but a depression or the dollar going down for the count just isnt going to happen. as bad as the dollar is; its still the best around and no one is going to knock it off the top no matter what some may say.
short term, i'm staying in cash becasue i mostly dont have the time and knowledge to play the bond and money mkts, but i'm betting a summer selloff and then QE3 with the normal fall strong period to be good for stocks and will look to buy again then.
People like to speculate about the downfall of the US dollar, but the simple fact is that it is by far and away the most popular currency. Yes, more places in Europe and the middle East take euros but the US dollar is still preferred. Other currencies just aren't trusted enough and the idea of the world's reserve currency being some mix of other currencies and gold or silver is too complicated and risky.
right now is probably your last chance to get into silver for under $40 per ounce...
again, no. i think the majority would agree that everything - stocks,oil,metals has runup over the past 6 months minimum.
Quoteagain, no. i think the majority would agree that everything - stocks,oil,metals has runup over the past 6 months minimum.
So what? economics is not a casino son, winning streaks? LOOL
no, but the markets do typically trade in a chart/pattern
and right now stocks and commodities are extremely over bought on historical levels.
once the commodities unwind-my add).
LOOOL!,.., prices of commodities rise, because money is being printerd,,-> hence fewer goods being chase by more and more money...
I dont do chart and patterns, apply basic Austrian economic principles, you dont see me changing my story since I started this thread and Gold rose from 1.1K now to over 1.5k per ounce.
Another more realistic view would be that Gold remained the same and the dollar DROPPED in INTRINSIC VALUE from 1.1 by a factor of
.... 1.1/1.5 = 28%
Actually, JC things rise when demand is greater than supply
I won't say printing more money won't have any effect
if everyone got gold fever
Your viewpoint is a little over simplistic.
First of all, silver and gold most likely have not bottomed yet.
I susupect that silver will see something closer to 27, possibly 23, maybe as low as 21 or 18.
Gold will probably correct till 1320. The correction may last up until fall / winter.
The reason is because if you look at the prices when QE2 started, this was the price.
Dont get me wrong, prices will go up. Many think that we will be looking at 1700 by the end of they year.
i'm hoping some will listen and follow because i'd like all of you guys to have a lot of money to spend on your RW/UW
(Attachment Link) Its official they are planning to release the New Omero - a.k.a Obamugabe bucks. in the new Obamugabe run IMF one OBM will buy you 1 Gallon of Gasoline or One loaf of Bread. :rolleye0009:
I'm being told by a lot of people (who supposedly know such things) USD is going to go back up. That flies in the face of most predictions here I know but I'm still going to buy.
Brass
I think it may be more to do with the weakness of the Euro rather than any particular strength of the dollar.
It does look as though the Euro might be about to change direction over the next couple of weeks - it's been on a steady rise since June of last year.
So, if you've got Euros you might want to start changing them into Dollars.
However, I believe that the Canadian Dollar is usually quite strongly correlated with the US Dollar so I'm not too sure how much a change there will be. However, I really don't know anything about USD/CAD so don't listen to me about that.
I'm being told by a lot of people (who supposedly know such things) USD is going to go back up. That flies in the face of most predictions here I know but I'm still going to buy.
Brass
Brass,
I think it may be more to do with the weakness of the Euro rather than any particular strength of the dollar.
It does look as though the Euro might be about to change direction over the next couple of weeks - it's been on a steady rise since June of last year.
So, if you've got Euros you might want to start changing them into Dollars.
However, I believe that the Canadian Dollar is usually quite strongly correlated with the US Dollar so I'm not too sure how much a change there will be. However, I really don't know anything about USD/CAD so don't listen to me about that.
Spain is has an OFFICIAL un-employment rate of 21%!!! ( who do you think is funding that? Thats right ECB is buying Espaniol debt) . If Spain falls, Italy will fall-> Game over Euro!
In that case quite likely one of my companies will eventully be HQed in Zug with a winter office in Panama.
Hate to say it but there seems to be an attitude that with Germany's economy booming internationally and the rest of the EU excpet for the several technical and scientific "engines" in UK, Switzerland, Austria and parts of France and Italy will also boom - much of the rest of the EU sporting an attitude that the Bosch destroyed Europe 60 years ago and never had to pay reparations after WWII so now is ther time to pay and carry the rest of the EU on their backs!
Hate to say it but there seems to be an attitude that with Germany's economy booming internationally
Will be very interesting - 4 of 5 of my more trusted Newsletters see the debt and currency bombs going off uncontrollably like a row of Japanese nuke reactors within 12 to 24 months if not sooner - so if that happens and the house of cards tumbles we would actually see Marshall Law in the USA and all bets are off.
The last and perhaps final wake up call:
I think taxes in Russia are 9% (thats IF YOU ARE RUSSIAN!!)
I think taxes in Russia are 9% (thats IF YOU ARE RUSSIAN!!)
I was told 13% but that does not include the unofficially required "baksheesh" taxes which can be quite significant...
Another Ominous Newsletter...
Jun 01, 2011
The Death Spiral is Here
Brief update…but important…and a theme that I will be writing about often in the days and weeks to come.
Another Ominous Newsletter...
Jun 01, 2011
The Death Spiral is Here
And, the Death Spiral is almost here for employment…soon, it will become clear to all that forced austerity measures will mean that the largest employer on the planet…government…can no longer sustain the global economy.
Let's face it Cuffy if the US is ever going to reduce its debtload and deficit it is going to have to reduce its military budget and the jobs it outsources to the private sector. In other words fewer nuc boats, fewer private contracts for new cutting edge technology of new nuc boats. Either that or teach your children and grandchildren to speak Mandarin.
http://www.opm.gov/feddata/HistoricalTables/ExecutiveBranchSince1940.asp
Another Ominous Newsletter...
Jun 01, 2011
The Death Spiral is Here
And, the Death Spiral is almost here for employment…soon, it will become clear to all that forced austerity measures will mean that the largest employer on the planet…government…can no longer sustain the global economy.
Cuffy the largest employer is the US government but if you look at where the employment in the US government has grown over the last couple of decades you will discover that the major source of new employees has been in the military, Homeland Security, Justice and Veterans Affairs. In other words all the growth in US government employment over the last 2 decades can be attributed to the US military industrial complex. The departments of Health and Human Services, Education and Social Security actually employ fewer people today than in 1974. The Department of Agriculture employs fewer people today than in 1962. The Department of the Interior employs fewer people today than in 1974. The Department of Transportation employs fewer people today than it did in 1969. Even figures listed under "Others" were at times higher in years dating back to the 1940's.
Add to these numbers the number of people involved in contract employment tendered by the US government and the number of employees is millions more. Of course the vast numbers of these contracts don't deal with cutting edge technology to be used by the Department of Agriculture. The vast majority of these contracts will be related to the US military.
Let's face it Cuffy if the US is ever going to reduce its debtload and deficit it is going to have to reduce its military budget and the jobs it outsources to the private sector. In other words fewer nuc boats, fewer private contracts for new cutting edge technology of new nuc boats. Either that or teach your children and grandchildren to speak Mandarin.
http://www.opm.gov/feddata/HistoricalTables/ExecutiveBranchSince1940.asp
Another Ominous Newsletter...
Jun 01, 2011
The Death Spiral is Here
And, the Death Spiral is almost here for employment…soon, it will become clear to all that forced austerity measures will mean that the largest employer on the planet…government…can no longer sustain the global economy.
Cuffy the largest employer is the US government but if you look at where the employment in the US government has grown over the last couple of decades you will discover that the major source of new employees has been in the military, Homeland Security, Justice and Veterans Affairs. In other words all the growth in US government employment over the last 2 decades can be attributed to the US military industrial complex. The departments of Health and Human Services, Education and Social Security actually employ fewer people today than in 1974. The Department of Agriculture employs fewer people today than in 1962. The Department of the Interior employs fewer people today than in 1974. The Department of Transportation employs fewer people today than it did in 1969. Even figures listed under "Others" were at times higher in years dating back to the 1940's.
Add to these numbers the number of people involved in contract employment tendered by the US government and the number of employees is millions more. Of course the vast numbers of these contracts don't deal with cutting edge technology to be used by the Department of Agriculture. The vast majority of these contracts will be related to the US military.
Let's face it Cuffy if the US is ever going to reduce its debtload and deficit it is going to have to reduce its military budget and the jobs it outsources to the private sector. In other words fewer nuc boats, fewer private contracts for new cutting edge technology of new nuc boats. Either that or teach your children and grandchildren to speak Mandarin.
http://www.opm.gov/feddata/HistoricalTables/ExecutiveBranchSince1940.asp
nice, but likely not accurate.
i'm not certain about reducing numbers in education of HHS, but i am sure that many departments budgets have skyrocketed because i wrote a book on it and did the reaserch persoanlly.
the department of water transporatation grew 56% from 2001 to 2006 and dept of enegry grew by over a thousand times in the same period. i dont remember what education or hhs did, but i'm guessing easily more than 25%, did your company budget grow 25% from 2001 to 2006 ?
also, from their beginning to now, medicare and medicaid both grew over 100 times in about 40 years, did your house increase in value 100 times in 40 years ?
during the same 40 year period, military spending has remained under 20%(the 2 wars not withstanding).
its flat out government agencies and programs that are making federal budgets skyrocket, military spending behaves itself by comparison.
Another Ominous Newsletter...
Jun 01, 2011
The Death Spiral is Here
And, the Death Spiral is almost here for employment…soon, it will become clear to all that forced austerity measures will mean that the largest employer on the planet…government…can no longer sustain the global economy.
Cuffy the largest employer is the US government but if you look at where the employment in the US government has grown over the last couple of decades you will discover that the major source of new employees has been in the military, Homeland Security, Justice and Veterans Affairs. In other words all the growth in US government employment over the last 2 decades can be attributed to the US military industrial complex. The departments of Health and Human Services, Education and Social Security actually employ fewer people today than in 1974. The Department of Agriculture employs fewer people today than in 1962. The Department of the Interior employs fewer people today than in 1974. The Department of Transportation employs fewer people today than it did in 1969. Even figures listed under "Others" were at times higher in years dating back to the 1940's.
Add to these numbers the number of people involved in contract employment tendered by the US government and the number of employees is millions more. Of course the vast numbers of these contracts don't deal with cutting edge technology to be used by the Department of Agriculture. The vast majority of these contracts will be related to the US military.
Let's face it Cuffy if the US is ever going to reduce its debtload and deficit it is going to have to reduce its military budget and the jobs it outsources to the private sector. In other words fewer nuc boats, fewer private contracts for new cutting edge technology of new nuc boats. Either that or teach your children and grandchildren to speak Mandarin.
http://www.opm.gov/feddata/HistoricalTables/ExecutiveBranchSince1940.asp
nice, but likely not accurate.
i'm not certain about reducing numbers in education of HHS, but i am sure that many departments budgets have skyrocketed because i wrote a book on it and did the reaserch persoanlly.
the department of water transporatation grew 56% from 2001 to 2006 and dept of enegry grew by over a thousand times in the same period. i dont remember what education or hhs did, but i'm guessing easily more than 25%, did your company budget grow 25% from 2001 to 2006 ?
also, from their beginning to now, medicare and medicaid both grew over 100 times in about 40 years, did your house increase in value 100 times in 40 years ?
during the same 40 year period, military spending has remained under 20%(the 2 wars not withstanding).
its flat out government agencies and programs that are making federal budgets skyrocket, military spending behaves itself by comparison.
As the Chinese curse goes "May you live in INTERESTING times" so -IS THE EU THE NEXT BELARUS?
Porter Stansberry: The next stage of the crisis is starting now
Monday, June 20, 2011
We're about to see a return to crisis-like conditions in the world's credit markets. This will devastate financial stocks. It should also hit commodity prices and commodity-related stocks hard. In today's Digest, I'll show you why I believe this will happen.
As longtime readers know, I write Friday's Digest personally. In general, I try my best to teach our subscribers something useful. I've always run my research company with a few simple principles in mind. Among them, I strive to provide you with the information I would expect if our roles were reversed. You should know… abiding by this principle often requires me to share information with you before I can be 100% certain it's correct.
That's the case with today's Digest. I want to show you the warning signs as I see them, right now. I want to guide you through my thinking process. And while I'll give you my predictions about what these things mean, I hope you'll realize that, as Yogi Berra famously said, predictions are tough – especially about the future.
The next stage in the ongoing global financial crisis will feature the collapse of both the Spanish and the Italian economies. This should occur within the next six months. Concurrently, I believe the "Chinese miracle" will be unmasked as mostly a fraud powered by a huge increase in bad lending from state-controlled banks.
Ironically, the coming wave of financial trouble will probably force people back into U.S. dollars. Gold will also do well. In the currency markets, I believe the euro will collapse in the second half of this year, as will the Australian dollar, which serves as a proxy for the Chinese economy.
I expect this next "down leg" in the world's markets to be more severe than the crisis of 2008, because the balance sheets of the Western democracies are now less prepared to manage the losses.
Finally, I believe the euro will simply cease to exist.
The first thing I want to show you is the share price of UniCredit. You have probably never heard of UniCredit, but it is a major European bank, with significant operations in eastern and southern Europe. UniCredit is based in Italy. I've been keeping my eye on UniCredit for years, for reasons I'll explain below. UniCredit is the ultimate "canary in the coal mine" of the world's global currency system.
Most people don't know that UniCredit is the direct descendent of Oesterreichische Credit-Anstalt, the largest bank in Eastern Europe before World War II. Translated the name means: Imperial Royal Privileged Austrian Credit-Institute for Commerce and Industry. It was a Rothschild bank. The family founded it 1855, and it became one of the most important banks in Europe.
Credit-Anstalt held assets and took deposits from all over Europe. In 1931, the bank failed as a direct result of the U.S.'s Smoot-Hawley tariff. The act crippled Germany's economy and led French investors to redeem all the capital they'd lent to the bank. The failure of Credit-Anstalt caused Austria to abandon the gold standard, which set off a series of economic dominoes. Germany left gold… then Great Britain… and finally, in 1933, so did America.
The failure of Credit-Anstalt is what really kicked off the Great Depression. I have long been convinced the failure of its successor bank – now called UniCredit – would presage the next global monetary collapse.
I first began warning investors about UniCredit's likely collapse and its historic role in the world's monetary history back in March 2010. Since then, the bank's shares have grown weaker and weaker. And since March, the shares have fallen off a cliff, hitting lows not seen since March 2009.
The sudden weakness in UniCredit's shares (down 21% in the last several weeks) indicates to me that big trouble is brewing in Europe. I don't believe efforts to stop the crisis in Greece will work. The austerity measures undertaken in Ireland, Spain, Italy, and Greece have severely weakened these economies, causing loan losses to banks like UniCredit.
And if there's a run on UniCredit (and I believe there will be), the losses will be too large for Italy to manage without a huge international bailout. UniCredit has borrowed $300 billion from other European banks. And Italy's government already owes creditors more than 120% of GDP. There aren't any easy solutions to this problem.
Another warning comes from a friend who is a senior executive at a major Wall Street bank. He sees more high-yield bond deals than just about anyone else in the world. He told our Atlas 400 group last weekend that credit markets around the world were suddenly shutting down. Yields were moving up. Spreads (the cost to borrow above the sovereign rate) were getting wider for the first time since March 2009.
Why? Because the market knows that the U.S. Federal Reserve is going to stop buying $85 billion-plus per month of U.S. Treasury debt. But the Treasury is going to continue to issue more debt. In total, 61% of the entire federal debt will mature within four years. That means roughly $10 trillion in U.S. Treasury bonds will have to be sold, plus whatever the total deficit adds up to over the next four years – maybe another $6 trillion.
It's difficult to imagine this amount of Treasury issuance won't have a big impact on the world's credit markets because these bonds always sell first and at the lowest yields. As these yields "back up" because of the large issuance, they should drain liquidity away from other issues, causing other bond prices to fall. This will reduce liquidity and make issuing debt more expensive across the credit spectrum.
China's boom since 2009 was fueled by massive domestic debt issuance, which was unsustainable and is reversing. In addition, one Chinese company after another is being revealed as a fraud – and then crashing. These are not isolated events. I have studied Chinese companies for more than a decade. Out of all the stocks I've analyzed closely, I've only seen a handful I didn't believe were fraudulent.
So far, none of the major Chinese banks have come under serious scrutiny. But I believe they will… and I believe major fraud will be discovered. Take the recent weakness in the shares of China Life Insurance (LFC), for example. This isn't a minor company. It's a $90 billion life insurance company. As fraud allegations spread into major Chinese financials, the entire underpinning of the Chinese boom will fall apart. It has all been fueled by debt and fixed-asset investments (land, buildings, equipment, and machinery). Consider just a few of these facts…
Fixed-asset investment remains greater than 50% of GDP in China, for the 12th year in a row. No other country has ever had more than nine years of this kind of sustained fixed-asset investment.
In the first five months of 2011, fixed-asset investment grew by 25.8% according to China's National Bureau of Statistics. That's $1.39 trillion worth of investment.
Jim Chanos, the famed short seller, says China is currently building 30 billion square feet of commercial real estate. That is enough to provide every person in China with a five-square-foot cubicle.
Jeremy Grantham, one of the world's most astute investors, points out that China has been purchasing gigantic quantities of raw materials. The scale of these purchases makes them impossible to sustain. China makes up 9.4% of the world's economy, but it is currently consuming 53% of the world's cement, 47% of the world's iron ore, and 46.9% of its coal.
A massive increase in China's domestic debt fueled this investment. In 2010, for example, Chinese banks extended $55 billion in loans – up 95% from the year before. Now, banking regulators are increasing reserve requirements, greatly reducing the amount of available credit. In May, lending was down 25% versus last year.
With Europe's crisis heating back up, with credit tightening in the U.S. (thanks to the end of quantitative easing), and with China's boom unraveling… it's time to be extremely cautious. I don't know when it will start… but we're entering another period of soaring volatility, increasing interest rate spreads, and falling stock and bond prices. How the authorities deal with these problems will set the stage for what happens next. If they try to paper over these continuing crises again – with new money-printing programs from the Federal Reserve – you can expect a massive inflation and what I call The End of America.
Our best hope for more stability and a return to prosperity is for people to realize that bailing out banks doesn't solve these problems. It only makes them worse. But… I'm not optimistic.
Bad news for the EU and China would be good news for the US.
With all this going on, I'm glad I'm back in the gold business again. :)
With all this going on, I'm glad I'm back in the gold business again. :)
Hopefully you are watching your back if still in Mexico - Titanium Ore looks like Rocks to Them but Gold they put in their teeth and know what it is...
With all this going on, I'm glad I'm back in the gold business again. :)
Hopefully you are watching your back if still in Mexico - Titanium Ore looks like Rocks to Them but Gold they put in their teeth and know what it is...
Not to worry Cuff. I've been out of Mexico for over a year. Haven't heard any news on the titanium lately. Staked a huge magnetite claim just before I left, needs a lot of work but could turn out to be an elephant.
Back in more familiar territory now, mining gold in Canada, a lot closer to home.
Gold - $1651
Silver - $40.55
Gold - $1651
Silver - $40.55
No real budget cuts and instead raising spending, means our economy is going to shit, the money printing is going to continue, dollar's value will plummet which means precious metals are going up in value whether you like it or not. The only thing that can hurt holders of gold is ifourgovernment will decide to confiscate it as they did in the thirties. Please don't talk to me any more about corruption in Russia. The US now is right up there with the Putin's group IMO. If some one like Ron Paul happens to win, and goes after the Fed and the rest of corrupt entities he will probably wind up the same way as John Kennedy did. God help us all.
Gold - $1651
Silver - $40.55
No real budget cuts and instead raising spending, means our economy is going to shit, the money printing is going to continue, dollar's value will plummet which means precious metals are going up in value whether you like it or not. The only thing that can hurt holders of gold is ifourgovernment will decide to confiscate it as they did in the thirties. Please don't talk to me any more about corruption in Russia. The US now is right up there with the Putin's group IMO. If some one like Ron Paul happens to win, and goes after the Fed and the rest of corrupt entities he will probably wind up the same way as John Kennedy did. God help us all.
Stock Markets are in free fall worldwide... :coffeeread:
Brass
Just curious if any one knows what caused a sudden pullback in the price of gold right before 12PM today from $1682 to $1642 ?
That's a pretty big drop in just a few minutes, did Soros or somebody like that decide to take some profits or what?
I mean, yes; over the next decade; its going to be a rough ride; and you are not going to make money in the stock mkt unless you can time the peaks and valleys(i recommend streettalklive to help you w/ that for free); but the US will turn it around.
Just curious if any one knows what caused a sudden pullback in the price of gold right before 12PM today from $1682 to $1642 ?
That's a pretty big drop in just a few minutes, did Soros or somebody like that decide to take some profits or what?
short dollar and Euro against harder currencies.How do you do that, JC?
short dollar and Euro against harder currencies.How do you do that, JC?
short dollar and Euro against harder currencies.How do you do that, JC?
All American stock markets crash.
Dow 11,383.68 -512.76 -4.31%
Nasdaq 2,556.39 -136.68 -5.08%
S&P 500 1,200.07 -60.27 -4.78%
Recession again? Goldman Sachs says it's a possibility.
http://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/2011/08/04/goldman-stalling-jobs-market-may-foreshadow-recession/
Remember after the last recession when companies like Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers and others failed and companies like Goldman Sachs were given billions of taxpayer dollars to survive? If the US and world economy go into another recession and companies like Goldman Sachs show signs of going under is the US government going to give them billions of dollars again to save them?
If they were too big to fail the first time around Goldman Sachs and others are definitely too big to fail now. The US government may have no choice but to give more US taxpayer dollars to the large multinational companies to keep them solvent.
All American stock markets crash.
Dow 11,383.68 -512.76 -4.31%
Nasdaq 2,556.39 -136.68 -5.08%
S&P 500 1,200.07 -60.27 -4.78%
Recession again? Goldman Sachs says it's a possibility.
http://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/2011/08/04/goldman-stalling-jobs-market-may-foreshadow-recession/
Remember after the last recession when companies like Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers and others failed and companies like Goldman Sachs were given billions of taxpayer dollars to survive? If the US and world economy go into another recession and companies like Goldman Sachs show signs of going under is the US government going to give them billions of dollars again to save them?
If they were too big to fail the first time around Goldman Sachs and others are definitely too big to fail now. The US government may have no choice but to give more US taxpayer dollars to the large multinational companies to keep them solvent.
All American stock markets crash.
Dow 11,383.68 -512.76 -4.31%
Nasdaq 2,556.39 -136.68 -5.08%
S&P 500 1,200.07 -60.27 -4.78%
Recession again? Goldman Sachs says it's a possibility.
http://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/2011/08/04/goldman-stalling-jobs-market-may-foreshadow-recession/
Remember after the last recession when companies like Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers and others failed and companies like Goldman Sachs were given billions of taxpayer dollars to survive? If the US and world economy go into another recession and companies like Goldman Sachs show signs of going under is the US government going to give them billions of dollars again to save them?
If they were too big to fail the first time around Goldman Sachs and others are definitely too big to fail now. The US government may have no choice but to give more US taxpayer dollars to the large multinational companies to keep them solvent.
Dollar zone=game over!
Anyone delerious on some false sense of patriotism?
Gold hitting 1700 hundred and my puts went in the money, when the EUR/CHF when under 1.13.I offer you $ 1.000.000,-
You kidding me?
Onyone looking to buy a second hand yacht?..., I am looking to upgrade mine))))
Just curious if any one knows what caused a sudden pullback in the price of gold right before 12PM today from $1682 to $1642 ?
That's a pretty big drop in just a few minutes, did Soros or somebody like that decide to take some profits or what?
Its back to 1660 though,..,(I just checked)....1680->1642 is a total drop in the bucket... compared to the balistic rise the last couple of days
Just curious if any one knows what caused a sudden pullback in the price of gold right before 12PM today from $1682 to $1642 ?
That's a pretty big drop in just a few minutes, did Soros or somebody like that decide to take some profits or what?
Its back to 1660 though,..,(I just checked)....1680->1642 is a total drop in the bucket... compared to the balistic rise the last couple of days
overall. thats because QE 2 pushed everything up. even gold would pullback some in that kind of selloff.
i've been hard on gold and silver long term, but short and medium term its a good idea to own some(10% is my max), the dips will keep rising . i just think my opportunities are still better on stocks if i'm very, very, very patient.
Gold hitting 1700 hundred and my puts went in the money, when the EUR/CHF when under 1.13.I offer you $ 1.000.000,-
You kidding me?
Onyone looking to buy a second hand yacht?..., I am looking to upgrade mine))))
ZW $ that is :ROFL:
Gold hitting 1700 hundred and my puts went in the money, when the EUR/CHF when under 1.13.I offer you $ 1.000.000,-
You kidding me?
Onyone looking to buy a second hand yacht?..., I am looking to upgrade mine))))
ZW $ that is :ROFL:
That wouldnt even get you a plastic replica from the toystore)))
overall. thats because QE 2 pushed everything up
Gold hitting 1700 hundred and my puts went in the money, when the EUR/CHF when under 1.13.I offer you $ 1.000.000,-
You kidding me?
Onyone looking to buy a second hand yacht?..., I am looking to upgrade mine))))
ZW $ that is :ROFL:
That wouldnt even get you a plastic replica from the toystore)))
Overview
"Star 7" has six staterooms. Two on the upper deck that are very large and spacious. Both have 42" flatscreen TVs and large heads. The twin beds can be joined to make a queen berth. There are four equal staterooms on the main deck. Three have twin beds that can be converted to queens and large heads. One has a queen bed and a large head. All of the staterooms have large windows and are well appointed. The wood through out is American maple.
So when do we race?
So when do we race?
Planning on qualifying for the Worlds in May 2012 in France.
FOX News: "Don't you all wish you had a lot of gold now!"
Gold is $1706 right now
Your favorite prez is going on TV to assure everyone he knows what he is doing.
I bet the Canadians and the rest of the world's media say they believe him. "It is all Bush's fault." "He did focus on getting the troops home and putting Americans to work before he pushed through his homosexual progressive agenda, SEE! The stock market is doing great. There! That proves it."
I happen to think so too. What is their purpose and goal in your opinion, JC?Your favorite prez is going on TV to assure everyone he knows what he is doing.
I bet the Canadians and the rest of the world's media say they believe him. "It is all Bush's fault." "He did focus on getting the troops home and putting Americans to work before he pushed through his homosexual progressive agenda, SEE! The stock market is doing great. There! That proves it."
We got a bunch of the highest educated people running the USA,
No :censored:ing way they dont know what they do...., this is on purpose.
Maybe the rank-and-file idiots are clueless,..,but not the top-brass!
JP Morgan is now projecting gold at $2500 by the end of this year.
I happen to think so too. What is there purpose and goal in your opinion, JC?Your favorite prez is going on TV to assure everyone he knows what he is doing.
I bet the Canadians and the rest of the world's media say they believe him. "It is all Bush's fault." "He did focus on getting the troops home and putting Americans to work before he pushed through his homosexual progressive agenda, SEE! The stock market is doing great. There! That proves it."
We got a bunch of the highest educated people running the USA,
No :censored:ing way they dont know what they do...., this is on purpose.
Maybe the rank-and-file idiots are clueless,..,but not the top-brass!
JP Morgan is now projecting gold at $2500 by the end of this year.
Anything is possible in this chaos,.., JP Morgan has possibly has probably some short-term puts on Gold and is floating this "advice".
which would be nothing new in the financial industry...JP Morgan is now projecting gold at $2500 by the end of this year.
Anything is possible in this chaos,.., JP Morgan has possibly has probably some short-term puts on Gold and is floating this "advice".
Which would be illegal.
JP Morgan is now projecting gold at $2500 by the end of this year.
Anything is possible in this chaos,.., JP Morgan has possibly has probably some short-term puts on Gold and is floating this "advice".
Which would be illegal.
which would be nothing new in the financial industry...JP Morgan is now projecting gold at $2500 by the end of this year.
Anything is possible in this chaos,.., JP Morgan has possibly has probably some short-term puts on Gold and is floating this "advice".
Which would be illegal.
@WC found a link (*claps hands*)
I happen to think so too. What is their purpose and goal in your opinion, JC?Your favorite prez is going on TV to assure everyone he knows what he is doing.
I bet the Canadians and the rest of the world's media say they believe him. "It is all Bush's fault." "He did focus on getting the troops home and putting Americans to work before he pushed through his homosexual progressive agenda, SEE! The stock market is doing great. There! That proves it."
We got a bunch of the highest educated people running the USA,
No :censored:ing way they dont know what they do...., this is on purpose.
Maybe the rank-and-file idiots are clueless,..,but not the top-brass!
@WC found a link (*claps hands*)
I could follow your example and just post statements without any links.
JP Morgan is now projecting gold at $2500 by the end of this year.
Anything is possible in this chaos,.., JP Morgan has possibly has probably some short-term puts on Gold and is floating this "advice".
Which would be illegal.
Bullshit! Its legal, aslong as they are upfront about disclosure, but who takes the effort these days to perform due dillegence, certainly not Water CLosets
@WC found a link (*claps hands*)
I could follow your example and just post statements without any links.
And my purpose in life is to educate a WC?
No to back up your statements.
@WCQuoteNo to back up your statements.
Because you forgot to read a history book about something that is common knowledge to every 6 grader?
Maybe YOU could give us some sound Keynesian advice (*cough*) you just drank out of your coolaid bottle? You being a banker and all (ahum)
I know your begging for knowlegde just like Oliver twist was asking for an extra bowl of porage,.., but maybe its time you did the hard work yourself, instead of getting it for free from me?
You flip burgers at McDonald's
I'm semi-retired and I've financed my retirement for the last decade by playing the stock market.
There is something that you could help me with, I've always wondered what's in the special sauce on the Big Mac?
No, I live in a pretty rural area and between 3 German Shepherds and several guns and shotguns I could handle most of intruders as long as they don't come in large numbers. Plus if things get bad, I'm friends with some of my neighbors who also have dogs and guns so we'll have to stick together to defend our families and property. But I feel bad for good family people who live in urban areas... it's not gonna be pretty. Look at London today... One might say it's a different situation but I think it's all part of the wave of civil unrest that's gonna sweep Europe next, then the USA when things get really unravelled here.I happen to think so too. What is their purpose and goal in your opinion, JC?Your favorite prez is going on TV to assure everyone he knows what he is doing.
I bet the Canadians and the rest of the world's media say they believe him. "It is all Bush's fault." "He did focus on getting the troops home and putting Americans to work before he pushed through his homosexual progressive agenda, SEE! The stock market is doing great. There! That proves it."
We got a bunch of the highest educated people running the USA,
No :censored:ing way they dont know what they do...., this is on purpose.
Maybe the rank-and-file idiots are clueless,..,but not the top-brass!
Ed, I surely hope you dont live within city limits,..., this ride is not going to be pretty
Look at London today... One might say it's a different situation but I think it's all part of the wave of civil unrest that's gonna sweep Europe next, then the USA when things get really unravelled here.
No, I live in a pretty rural area and between 3 German Shepherds and several guns and shotguns I could handle most of intruders as long as they don't come in large numbers. Plus if things get bad, I'm friends with some of my neighbors who also have dogs and guns so we'll have to stick together to defend our families and property. But I feel bad for good family people who live in urban areas... it's not gonna be pretty. Look at London today... One might say it's a different situation but I think it's all part of the wave of civil unrest that's gonna sweep Europe next, then the USA when things get really unravelled here.I happen to think so too. What is their purpose and goal in your opinion, JC?Your favorite prez is going on TV to assure everyone he knows what he is doing.
I bet the Canadians and the rest of the world's media say they believe him. "It is all Bush's fault." "He did focus on getting the troops home and putting Americans to work before he pushed through his homosexual progressive agenda, SEE! The stock market is doing great. There! That proves it."
We got a bunch of the highest educated people running the USA,
No :censored:ing way they dont know what they do...., this is on purpose.
Maybe the rank-and-file idiots are clueless,..,but not the top-brass!
Ed, I surely hope you dont live within city limits,..., this ride is not going to be pretty
not that i think things are going to get so bad ,,but the bad economy is [SNIP] until it turns around and i think thats going to be 2 more years minimum
It was not a good day on the markets today.
Dow 10,810.76 -633.85 -5.54%
Nasdaq 2,357.69 -174.72 -6.90%
S&P 500 1,119.46 -79.92 -6.66%
Gold 1,715.50 +66.70 +4.05%
The one good sign oil is down to just over $80/barrel
Oil 80.67 -6.21 -7.15%
http://finance.yahoo.com/
It was not a good day on the markets today.
Dow 10,810.76 -633.85 -5.54%
Nasdaq 2,357.69 -174.72 -6.90%
S&P 500 1,119.46 -79.92 -6.66%
Gold 1,715.50 +66.70 +4.05%
The one good sign oil is down to just over $80/barrel
Oil 80.67 -6.21 -7.15%
http://finance.yahoo.com/
It is now a very good buying opportunity. I guarantee that the real pros are licking their chops and cannot wait to get back into this market...
It was not a good day on the markets today.
Dow 10,810.76 -633.85 -5.54%
Nasdaq 2,357.69 -174.72 -6.90%
S&P 500 1,119.46 -79.92 -6.66%
Gold 1,715.50 +66.70 +4.05%
The one good sign oil is down to just over $80/barrel
Oil 80.67 -6.21 -7.15%
http://finance.yahoo.com/
It is now a very good buying opportunity. I guarantee that the real pros are licking their chops and cannot wait to get back into this market...
The stock market opens at 06:30 EDT tomorrow. I'll be on my computer and watching the opening numbers for bargains.
Buy GOLD and GUNS:
Looks like it is pay the piper day - but really with USA corporations sitting on record global profits (all their new workers are in China and India making minimal wages) just wall street shaking out the nervous nellies, the margin buyers and shorts at fire sale prices - only to sell back to them in full price a few months or a year or two from now - and -the Multinationals will get their tax amnesty holiday from Obama and the Dumbocrats and the Republicants will go along with Big Business and Wall Street to unlock their $2.5 Trillion "trapped" overseas to start creating some jobs here so that the same hordes of disaffected urban youths don't rob their wives while out shopping or their kids at school and themselves on the golf courses!
Dow plunges more than 600 points after downgrade
Stocks plunge after S&P downgrade; Dow down 634; Europe, economy fears send Treasurys, gold up
Gold sets all time new record high prices:
The price of Treasurys rose sharply, and yields, which move in the opposite direction from price, fell. The yield on the 10-year Treasury note fell to 2.34 percent from 2.57 percent Friday. That matches its low for the year, reached last week.
"This is largely a flight to safety," said Thomas Simons, money market economist with Jefferies & Co. "The bond market is really trading off of what's going on in the stock market." Money flowed out of stocks and into Treasurys.
Gold set a record. It rose $61.40 to settle at $1,713.20.
Crude oil, natural gas and other commodities fell sharply on worries that a weaker global economy will mean less demand. Oil fell 6.4 percent to settle at $81.31 per barrel.
Fear is spreading quickly through the market, said Dimitre Genov, senior portfolio manager with Artio Global Investors. "It's becoming a vicious cycle and could feed into consumers reducing their demand as well."
The Dow was down 5.5 percent a 10,809.85. The sharp drop extended Wall Street's almost uninterrupted decline since late July, when the Dow was flirting with 13,000. It fell below 11,000 for the first time since November.
The S&P 500 fell 79.92, or 6.7 percent, to 1,119.49. The Nasdaq composite index fell 174.72, or 6.9 percent, to 2,357.69.
Stock markets in Asia began Monday's global rout. The main stock index fell almost 4 percent in South Korea and more than 2 percent in Japan. European markets opened later and fell, too, with Germany down 5 percent and France 4.7 percent.
In the U.S., stocks fell even as Moody's, another major credit rating agency, stood by its top rating of Aaa for the United States. It said it could downgrade the U.S. if it doesn't cut its deficit, "but it is early to conclude that such measures will not be forthcoming."
Financial markets also did not appear comforted by an afternoon statement by President Barack Obama, who said Washington needs more "common sense and compromise" to tame its debt.
"Markets will rise and fall," he said. "But this is the United States of America. No matter what some agency may say, we've always been and always will be a triple-A country."
S&P, in its downgrade, criticized dysfunction in the American political system. The downgrade wasn't a total surprise but came when investors were already feeling nervous about the U.S. economy and European debt, among other problems.
Last week, the Dow Jones industrial average fell almost 700 points. That was its biggest weekly point loss since October 2008, during the financial crisis. Counting Monday, the Dow has dropped in 10 of the last 12 trading days. It is down more than 1,900 points, or 15 percent, since July 21.
The Russell 2000 index of small stocks has now lost nearly 25 percent from its most recent high on April 29. A decline of 10 percent or more off recent highs is considered to be a correction. But a drop of 20 percent or more is said to be the start of a bear market.
The Nasdaq and S&P 500 are both down about 18 percent since the end of April. The Dow is down 16 percent.
The last bear market for the S&P 500 ran from October 2007 until March 2009. The index lost 57 percent of its value during the downturn.
S&P on Monday downgraded mortgage lenders Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac and other agencies linked to long-term U.S. debt. Fannie and Freddie own or guarantee about half of all U.S. mortgages. Their downgrade could eventually mean higher mortgage rates.
Worries about weaker profits that could result from a slowing economy have slammed the financial industry since late July. As a group, financial stocks in the S&P 500 index fell 10 percent on Monday to their lowest level since July 2009.
Bank of America plunged 20.3 percent, to $6.51, after AIG filed suit against the bank. The insurer alleged Bank of America sold it overvalued mortgage-backed securities. The bank denied the allegations. Its stock is down 51 percent this year, from $13.34.
Stocks in other industries whose profits are closely tied to the strength of the economy also fell sharply. Energy stocks in the S&P 500 fell 8.3 percent, for example.
The smallest losses came in safer industries such as consumer staples whose profits tend to be steadier, regardless of the economy. Even in a bad economy people will still buy things like toothpaste and bread.
The Vix index, a measure of fear among investors, shot up 47 percent to its highest level since May 2010. The index shows how worried investors are that the S&P 500 will drop over the next 30 days. It does this by measuring prices for stock options that investors can buy to help protect their portfolios.
Investors are also worried that Italy or Spain could become the next European countries to have trouble repaying its debts. Greece, Ireland and Portugal have already received bailout loans because of Europe's 21-month-old debt crisis.
The fears have pushed investors to shun Spanish and Italian bonds, which led to higher yields on the bonds. That resulted in even higher borrowing costs for the countries.
The European Central Bank stepped in Monday and bought bullions of euros worth of their bonds. The move helped to lower yields on Spanish and Italian bonds, at least temporarily.
Seeking to avert panic spreading across financial markets, the finance ministers and central bankers of the Group of 20 industrial and developing nations issued a joint statement Monday saying they were committed to taking all necessary measures to support financial stability and growth.
"We will remain in close contact throughout the coming weeks and cooperate as appropriate, ready to take action to ensure financial stability and liquidity in financial markets," they said.
Worries about the U.S. economic recovery have been building since the government said that economic growth was far weaker in the first half of 2011 than economists expected.
The economy grew at a 1.3 percent annual rate from April through June, below economists' expectations. It expanded at just a 0.4 percent rate in the first quarter. The first half of 2011 was the slowest since the end of the recession.
Then reports showed that the manufacturing and services industries barely grew in July. Job growth was better than economists expected last month. But the 117,000 jobs created in July were still well below the 215,000 that employers added in February, March and April, on average.
The Federal Reserve will meet on Tuesday, but economists don't expect much to come out of the meeting. The central bank's key interest rate is already at a record of nearly zero, where it has been since 2008.
The Fed has also already said that it plans to keep rates low for "an extended period." Chairman Ben Bernanke said last month that the Fed could step in to help the economy if it further weakened.
Fears about a weaker U.S. economy have overshadowed the profit growth that companies have reported for the second quarter. For the 441 companies in the S&P 500 that have already reported, earnings rose 12 percent in the second quarter from a year earlier. Revenue growth has also topped 10 percent for the first time in a year.
Verizon Communications Inc. fell 3.9 percent after it was unable to come to terms with 45,000 workers on health care costs, pensions and other issues.
More than 69 stocks fell for every one that rose on the New York Stock Exchange. Consolidated trading volume was heavy at 9.7 billion shares, nearly triple the volume in early July.
AP Business Writers Matthew Craft, David K. Randall and Daniel Wagner contributed to this report.
Jesus H C. WC,.., you cant quote even if your life depended on it!
Jesus H C. WC,.., you cant quote even if your life depended on it!
And yet I still quote better than you.
Google the Sig Sauer Academy in Exeter NH -great advanced firearms training and - German Quality firearms at NH Sales Tax Free prices - also the Italian Baretta, good old Colt Arms and Sturm Ruger (Also In New Hampshire) and Remington shotguns fun for skeet and bird hunting (fowling).
Taser (kind that shoot electrodes with up to 250K volt shock) still best for dropping an attacker wacked out on drugs crystal meth heroin and alchohol who will not feel a gun shot - then they make an easier target to shoot - less ammo wasted.
my Sig is bigger than yours, Lee! :chuckle:
i recommend a sig too. its been my favorite since i bought it.
i recommend a sig too. its been my favorite since i bought it.
At least the Swiss got 3 things right
1) Gold
2) Guns
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIG_SG_550
The SG 550 is an assault rifle manufactured by Swiss Arms AG (formerly Schweizerische Industrie Gesellschaft) of Neuhausen, Switzerland (SG is an abbreviation for Sturmgewehr, or "assault rifle").
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b7/Stgw_90.jpg/300px-Stgw_90.jpg)
3) public open vote and direct democracy
In some parts and villages, voting without being fully armed is not allowed (discourages miscounting of votes)
my Sig is bigger than yours, Lee! :chuckle:
i recommend a sig too. its been my favorite since i bought it.
Lee, I'm not an expert, but IMO gold might only come down if our economy starts turning around, the Fed stops printing money and the stock market goes up naturally without any QE. Somehow I don's see this happening unless some one like Ron Paul becomes our president. It saddens me greatly to say this, but IMO the USA is on the way to economic crisis that hasn't been seen here ever before. At this point it will take a miracle to avoid this from happening. Sure, America is not going to disappear, it will go through some rough times and then will start coming back in several years possibly with the new currency and new politicians running the country. It may get better or it may get worse, no one really knows. But to think that it's business as usual at this point is naive IMO. Once hyperinflation hits us (and I think it's a real possibility), every one is gonna run to gold and there will be lines to buy it at coin stores.... that's the time to sell actually.my Sig is bigger than yours, Lee! :chuckle:
i recommend a sig too. its been my favorite since i bought it.
you know, it probably is. mine's just a 22. i got a .45 thug stopper, but the accuracy of that sig is so good; i love it.
and on gold, its unbelievabe. chart says its so over bought, a pullback is going to chop 20% off in any rally, but a rally just isnt coming.
we're probably around 5 standard deviations down now and anyone who took stats will tell you a snap back rally is over due, but as one of my financial advisors is fond of saying; the market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent.
when that rally comes, i'll sell some more stocks/funds and buy gold with it unless qe 3 comes. we are on track for probably another 10% down, minimum.
and on gold, its unbelievabe. chart says its so over bought, a pullback is going to chop 20% off in any rally, but a rally just isnt coming.
Gold is at: 1797.30
1802
anyone who is still a keynesian is a fuuucking retard
1855where do you see that, JC? I'm looking on kitco and it is $1775.00
1762
weird, Kitco doesn't show that gold has ever risen to the price you quoted (1855). around $1817 was the highest according to kitco.com1762
Gold is volatile, violent mood swings,
I look at http://goldprice.org/
Depends on the market,..., If a future matures at strike 1855 ,someone HAS to buy/sell it at 1855, so that individual trade is listed, some tickers might discard it,.., bloomberg is famous for such "corrections"I see, thanks!
Lee, I'm not an expert, but IMO gold might only come down if our economy starts turning around, the Fed stops printing money and the stock market goes up naturally without any QE. Somehow I don's see this happening unless some one like Ron Paul becomes our president. It saddens me greatly to say this, but IMO the USA is on the way to economic crisis that hasn't been seen here ever before. At this point it will take a miracle to avoid this from happening. Sure, America is not going to disappear, it will go through some rough times and then will start coming back in several years possibly with the new currency and new politicians running the country. It may get better or it may get worse, no one really knows. But to think that it's business as usual at this point is naive IMO. Once hyperinflation hits us (and I think it's a real possibility), every one is gonna run to gold and there will be lines to buy it at coin stores.... that's the time to sell actually.my Sig is bigger than yours, Lee! :chuckle:
i recommend a sig too. its been my favorite since i bought it.
you know, it probably is. mine's just a 22. i got a .45 thug stopper, but the accuracy of that sig is so good; i love it.
and on gold, its unbelievabe. chart says its so over bought, a pullback is going to chop 20% off in any rally, but a rally just isnt coming.
we're probably around 5 standard deviations down now and anyone who took stats will tell you a snap back rally is over due, but as one of my financial advisors is fond of saying; the market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent.
when that rally comes, i'll sell some more stocks/funds and buy gold with it unless qe 3 comes. we are on track for probably another 10% down, minimum.
Hi Lee,
I kindof tracked your advice in this thread and if you indeed did all the things you said you are either rich with bottemless assets or you have a printingpress in your cellar!!
Another really bad day on the market.
Dow 10,990.58 -419.63 -3.68%
Nasdaq 2,380.43 -131.05 -5.22%
S&P 500 1,140.65 -53.24 -4.46%
Want to make some money? Wake up early tomorrow and look for bargains.
Gold is at $1866.30
This doesn't look good for the dollar...
Eduard why not good for the dollar? It is getting stronger against the Euro.you seem to have asked and answered your own question. But IMO people seek safety in gold because they believe that the paper currency is and will continue to loose value.
If the dollar drops 10% against the Euro who is going to buy Euro made goods? Yen has gotten stronger mainly because nuclear crisis has caused a shortage of Japanese made goods driving up prices. Ford can not even use 2 paint colors on USA assembled cars they offer as Japan can not make them until next year.
To many people have no idea why gold is strong right now and has nothing to do with $ or Euro.
People buy gold when they have fear or want to make jewelry. When fear goes away gold drops fast. Good news fear is going to be around for awhile until more countries go bankrupt. World has to many people with money and only works when you have more poor people.
Gold is at $1866.30
This doesn't look good for the dollar...
Lee, don't feel bad. I wouldn't know anything about precious metals if I didn't have a good friend who is an investor and makes a living at it. He turned me onto gold back in 2006 and he's been right on everything so far, not just gold. He also thinks that Ron Paul is the only man who can save our country at this point, that we will go through a period of depression no matter who is in the office at this point. But if the right government is elected (with Ron Paul heading it) we may still recover in a decade or two. Funny thing, he admitted to me that he voted for Obama... because he knew that Gold would go up during Obama's reign and he has a lot of it. :-XGold is at $1866.30
This doesn't look good for the dollar...
Proving that i'm not perfect on my investing.
I was going to start taking a gold position mainly as a hedge for what i have in my roth when it dropped to 1740 thinking that we're in a second recession and another 10-20% mkt drop is likely and gold will rise against a hedge, but my advisors says its very,very over bought and to wait until a pullback of around 1600.
Since they've been preety spot on on the overall market since 2007, i took thier advice.
Now, look at it. :'(
I don't think its going back to 1600 for years. 1740 was the pullback and i missed it, darn.
Also, i'm reading endgame now.
for those of you that think the US will never come back, its very good on how the US will come back and what to expect financially while it does.
JP Morgan and Citigroup have cut growth forecasts for the American economy. Gross domestic product will grow 1 percent in the fourth quarter rather than the 2.5 percent previously forecast and 0.5 percent in the first quarter of 2012 instead of 1.5 percent, JPMorgan said in a note e-mailed to clients today. Citigroup cut its 2011 growth forecast to 1.6 percent from 1.7 percent and lowered its projection for next year to 2.1 percent from 2.7 percent, according to a note to clients dated yesterday.But according to our great communist leader recession ain't gonna happen again? Shouldn't we believe him?
A 1% growth in GDP instead of 2.5% is a big drop. A new recession is a definite possibility if these numbers are correct.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-19/u-s-growth-forecasts-lowered-at-citigroup-jpmorgan-amid-global-slowdown.html
JP Morgan and Citigroup have cut growth forecasts for the American economy. Gross domestic product will grow 1 percent in the fourth quarter rather than the 2.5 percent previously forecast and 0.5 percent in the first quarter of 2012 instead of 1.5 percent, JPMorgan said in a note e-mailed to clients today. Citigroup cut its 2011 growth forecast to 1.6 percent from 1.7 percent and lowered its projection for next year to 2.1 percent from 2.7 percent, according to a note to clients dated yesterday.But according to our great communist leader recession ain't gonna happen again? Shouldn't we believe him?
A 1% growth in GDP instead of 2.5% is a big drop. A new recession is a definite possibility if these numbers are correct.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-19/u-s-growth-forecasts-lowered-at-citigroup-jpmorgan-amid-global-slowdown.html
JP Morgan and Citigroup have cut growth forecasts for the American economy. Gross domestic product will grow 1 percent in the fourth quarter rather than the 2.5 percent previously forecast and 0.5 percent in the first quarter of 2012 instead of 1.5 percent, JPMorgan said in a note e-mailed to clients today. Citigroup cut its 2011 growth forecast to 1.6 percent from 1.7 percent and lowered its projection for next year to 2.1 percent from 2.7 percent, according to a note to clients dated yesterday.But according to our great communist leader recession ain't gonna happen again? Shouldn't we believe him?
A 1% growth in GDP instead of 2.5% is a big drop. A new recession is a definite possibility if these numbers are correct.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-19/u-s-growth-forecasts-lowered-at-citigroup-jpmorgan-amid-global-slowdown.html
It's too late Eduard, the writing is on the wall and the recession is already here. It's going to be a bloodbath in some parts of the world that rely on tourism...
Lee, don't feel bad. I wouldn't know anything about precious metals if I didn't have a good friend who is an investor and makes a living at it. He turned me onto gold back in 2006 and he's been right on everything so far, not just gold. He also thinks that Ron Paul is the only man who can save our country at this point, that we will go through a period of depression no matter who is in the office at this point. But if the right government is elected (with Ron Paul heading it) we may still recover in a decade or two. Funny thing, he admitted to me that he voted for Obama... because he knew that Gold would go up during Obama's reign and he has a lot of it. :-XGold is at $1866.30
This doesn't look good for the dollar...
Proving that i'm not perfect on my investing.
I was going to start taking a gold position mainly as a hedge for what i have in my roth when it dropped to 1740 thinking that we're in a second recession and another 10-20% mkt drop is likely and gold will rise against a hedge, but my advisors says its very,very over bought and to wait until a pullback of around 1600.
Since they've been preety spot on on the overall market since 2007, i took thier advice.
Now, look at it. :'(
I don't think its going back to 1600 for years. 1740 was the pullback and i missed it, darn.
very well said, Mike! tiphatLee, don't feel bad. I wouldn't know anything about precious metals if I didn't have a good friend who is an investor and makes a living at it. He turned me onto gold back in 2006 and he's been right on everything so far, not just gold. He also thinks that Ron Paul is the only man who can save our country at this point, that we will go through a period of depression no matter who is in the office at this point. But if the right government is elected (with Ron Paul heading it) we may still recover in a decade or two. Funny thing, he admitted to me that he voted for Obama... because he knew that Gold would go up during Obama's reign and he has a lot of it. :-XGold is at $1866.30
This doesn't look good for the dollar...
Proving that i'm not perfect on my investing.
I was going to start taking a gold position mainly as a hedge for what i have in my roth when it dropped to 1740 thinking that we're in a second recession and another 10-20% mkt drop is likely and gold will rise against a hedge, but my advisors says its very,very over bought and to wait until a pullback of around 1600.
Since they've been preety spot on on the overall market since 2007, i took thier advice.
Now, look at it. :'(
I don't think its going back to 1600 for years. 1740 was the pullback and i missed it, darn.
What about a President Perry and Ron Paul as Treasury Secretary or the last Fed Chairman as he and Perry dismantel the cult of secrecy at the Fed and institute a regime of Audits and full transparency of who owns the Fed and who makes the decisions with true oversight by the peoples representatives rather that the lying and obfuscation based upon the legacy of Greenspan Speak gibberish to baffle the congress and people with BS while the Fed serves its international Banksters owners.
There is hope yet and lifting the crushing weight of taxation and socially inspired politically correct regulations on USA businesses would reingite the spirit of entrepreneuralism in the USA lest we crumble like the Roman, British and French empires did. Perhaps they might dismantle and abolish the Fed and cyberize the Fed and distribute the control back to the peoples representatives and the States - devaluing the currency from $1 value in 1914 to less than 2 cents today via deficit spending and hyperinflationary policies only robs the people and businesses of their capital savings and means of production encouraging a debt driven society and punishing the savers who create the capital means of production. Perry is right the Bernanke and the banksters should all be tried for high crimes and felonious TREASON!
Time for some Perry-Paul T.E.A. friendly Austrian school policies in actual governance as the Obamunists Keynesians took a bad situation and made it much much worse. Off course the anti american Wall Street internationalist banksters will fight this tooth and nail but their unending greed and avarice is likely to be their downfall - one can hope and VOTE!
@Eduard
Wow, I see the coolaid drinkers are finally waking up (albeit with a big hangover).
@LeeQuoteAlso, i'm reading endgame now.
Thats a book on economics? (SARCASM MODE OFF)
@LeeQuotefor those of you that think the US will never come back, its very good on how the US will come back and what to expect financially while it does.
Its clearly obvious why America is in the situation it is , no wonder your politicians weren't seriously dealing with problems,..,if the citizenry (Lee et al) were sticking their heads in the sand,...with a dosis of wishfull thinking and delerium-americanium-cannot-failum drug....yeah...you cant blame anyone but yourself,....and..even then you completely refuse to learn a lesson here.... I am starting to believe that for most people things can get bad as you can ever imagine and that "point of learning" will never be reached.
Slaves seeking slavery...enjoy oblivion....its the Chinese's turn now to run things for a while
Lee,
What's your advice for someone with a much shrinking 401K and it's too late to buy gold now?
JC are resident Swiss expert doesn't see a problem with the rapid appreciation of the Swiss franc but then his working experience in fiance is from running the till at McDonald's in Zurich so it's probably best to seek financial advice from someone else.
Seriously JC ? You think i'm still missing it.
Well, then we're going to have to disagree here and you will never think i'm seeing this correctly, but i am.
Lee,
What's your advice for someone with a much shrinking 401K and it's too late to buy gold now?
Gold is at $1887 right now but earlier was at $1896 (days high for today). Guess people are prepairing for Obama's next ingenious plan to be revealed in September, realizing too well where that plan is going to take our economy and the US dollar.
Gold is a rocket ship at the moment and there are many factors that make us expect further gains.
Firstly, the global recovery has juddered to a halt and, with the obvious uncertainty surrounding the situation, people have been looking to buy tangible assets.
Secondly, we are likely to see inflation remain high and with the prospects of further quantitative easing in the UK and US this will translate to an increased erosion of the value of money; something that gold investors tend to crow about
Alright enough crowing for now
What the mainstream gold world and Planet Wall Street do not understand is that one of the reasons gold is acting like it has been is because of a Commercial Signal Failure. There were a number of players who have played the gold trading game allied with The Gold Cartel. They would short and short and then cover those shorts when The Gold Cartel attacked the price and forced spec longs to sell. This is how they made money over and over again by being short in a bull market.
Well, over the past couple of weeks the game totally changed as The Gold Cartel began to lose control of their management of the gold price, as evidenced by the breaking of the 2% Rule. The total financial chaos in Europe and the US sent them into a panic, and instead of shorting more as the gold price rose (which they have done for so long), they became buyers (taking huge losses on their short positions), leaving The Gold Cartel to hold the fort. In other words, these commercial shorts abandoned the fort. This is what the GATA camp foretold long ago.
The other factors which have to have them spooked are:
*The strong potential for a bank holiday, which could be announced out of the blue.
*Central banks asking for their lent gold back. You won’t hear this outside of the GATA camp, but the notion of lent gold to support the gold price suppression scheme has been one of our basic themes of understanding the gold market. If central banks, like Venezuela, ask for their gold back, it could cause a PANIC, and has to have sheeple central bankers who have lent gold out, to be in a twit. These are risk adverse types whose worst nightmare is to be embarrassed and exposed to their public as having been duped into folly. If this is so, as I suspect, the price of gold is likely to advance much faster than even we thought, as nervous central bankers start making demands of those who have their gold. Yeah baby!
Investors are realizing around the world, there is no way out of the fiscal mess our politicians have put us in. It is a NIGHTMARE for the little guy and girl. It is SO BAD, investors don’t have to be convinced too much that gold can take out $3,000, even $5,000. Silver will be the big surprise. WATCH!
great article! Thanks for posting it, Maxx tiphat
Not easy for bullion banks to put golden Humpty Dumpty back together again
August 20 (USAGOLD) —
I can’t help but think that the recent news about Venezuela has had something do with gold’s rise late this past week. And it may have had something to do with the strong run-up over the past few weeks.
When Venezuela first made its intentions for gold repatriation public, the press reports indentified the Bank of England as the depository for 211 tonnes of its gold. Later, it came out that 99 tonnes were on deposit at BoE and the rest sprinkled among JP Morgan Chase, Barclays, Standard Chartered, and Bank of Nova Scotia — gold bullion banks all.
It was the addition of the bullion banks in press reports that sent off alarm bells in the gold market. We were no longer talking simply about gold under a depository arrangement at the BoE (a rather benign proposition), but metal that had been committed to various lending operations. The inclusion put a whole new light on the Venezuela matter in that it suggests a short position in the physical metal that would need to be filled. Financial Times called the Venezuela withdrawal “one of the largest transfers of physical gold in recent history.” When the news sunk in, gold promptly rallied — trading at $1850 as this is written and trading as high as $1875 overnight Thursday/Friday. Too, and overlooked, Venezuela’s repatriation effort might have been one of the chief driving factors for gold’s strong rally over the past several weeks. The bullion bank scramble, in other words, may have started weeks ago long before Venezuela went public with its intentions.
In plain terms, it is unlikely that Venezuela’s gold is sitting prettily in the above named bullion banks just waiting to be loaded on a cargo plane and sent to Caracas. It was probably loaned out long ago, and then perhaps, redeposited at some other bullion bank and loaned out again, etc. on down the line until it was fractionalized, atomized, and otherwise depleted from its unified whole. In short, it will not be easy for the bullion banks to reassemble this golden Humpty Dumpty.
In turn, failure to materialize the physical metal could prompt similar demands from other gold-depositing nation states and private funds and individuals alike. Moneyed interests globally, as reported extensively in the mainstream press, are on a hair trigger, and ready to move defensively at a moment’s notice. At the whiff of trouble, the equivalent of a bank run could develop in the bullion banking sector. (It is interesting to note that a similar circumstance 40 years ago, almost to the day, forced the United States to close the gold window.)
At the very least, some depositors might be prompted to move their gold into allocated accounts thus removing it from the lending pool. In other words, a great deal more incipient demand may be bubbling beneath surface of the gold market than we presently know.
Michael J. Kosares
Last time I checked earlier today Gold was $1920 an ounce. I suspect it will easily be over 2K an ounce within 3 to 5 days. If those Pol's in Congress do not get a real budget done by around Thanksgiving; we are in for a very very bumpy ride. Us Yanks might be apologizing for our criticisms of the riots in London after the fury of a hungry angry mob of 320 Million people gets unleashed!!I don't know about 320 million, but there will be riots in the "urban" areas once the entitlements get cut off for the lack of funds. It's not going to be pretty and some American cities will prolly wind up looking worse than Detroit
Gold will keep going up if people want to buy it. Like a baseball card the value is based on what people will pay for it.
Whale oil used to be valuable as well.
Better to day trade gold than hold on to it at current price.
There was a time that tulip bulbs were also a valuable commodity.
Maxx,
Thanks for the post. It's a little over my head as I have never purchased gold or really considered myself very astute in the investment world.
I did Google Lear and found a huge number of complaints. If I were to invest in gold I think I would be afraid of doing it with this company.
If you want to keep $100K or more stashed best to keep with a reliable overseas source like Switzerland Lichtenstein etc where even though you must report to the IRS all of your offshore holdings - at least it is outside the reach of US courts and gov confiscatory policies.
Interest rates will increase and the economy will recover.
@kievstarhaha, tell it like it is, brother!QuoteInterest rates will increase and the economy will recover.
Lets use our brains for a moment instead of fancy stocktraders jive talk, ok?
14 trillion,,(soon to be 18 trillion) , how much money is that per point interest rate?
14.000.000.000.000 * 0.01= 140.000.000.000 thats 140 billion a year per percent interest rate
No way the US is going to RAISE interest rates, where the fuuuck are they going to get the money..
Oh wait....print even more crap I guess. and thats going to bring the price of gold down?
Unlikely!
It is silly to keep gold and silver at home, why would any one do that?
@kievstarQuoteInterest rates will increase and the economy will recover.
Lets use our brains for a moment instead of fancy stocktraders jive talk, ok?
14 trillion,,(soon to be 18 trillion) , how much money is that per point interest rate?
14.000.000.000.000 * 0.01= 140.000.000.000 thats 140 billion a year per percent interest rate
No way the US is going to RAISE interest rates, where the fuuuck are they going to get the money..
Oh wait....print even more crap I guess. and thats going to bring the price of gold down?
Unlikely!
NEW YORK (TheStreet ) -- High gold prices need to watch their backs because margin hikes could be right around the corner.
With gold prices seeing $20-$50 swings daily, the CME could be tempted to increase the amount of money it takes to buy an 100 ounce gold futures contract -- a technique often employed to stem volatility.
Silver was the latest victim of margin hikes and is still recovering. The CME raised margins five times between April 26th and May 9th a massive 68% which eventually resulted in silver losing almost 30% of its value in less than 3 weeks. If the same fate were to befall gold, prices could tank to $1,400 an ounce.
The CME has raised margin requirements for gold twice this year, once in January and once in early August, by 11% and 22% respectively. The moves did little to stem gold's rally. A week after the margin hikes in January gold was down just 2% and a week after the August hike gold was up 1.5%.
"If you want to hedge against the quickly diminishing dollar, take advice from George Soros. Get rid of all your precious metal, buy farmland, and learn
how to create great gardens. Organically grown food and clean water are the next precious commodities, and you don't need hallmarking there to know whether or not you've got the real thing."
I partially agree with this. I agree having farmland and creating a productive farm from it is a very good idea. Ecuador is a GREAT place for this. But why is it a good idea to sell all of your precious metals? Why should it be a 'either or' proposition? Just a few years back Soros badmouthed gold (when it was selling for half of what it today) and at the same time bought a large amount of gold a few weeks later. Could he be doing the same thing now? Soros is not to be trusted. If the gold "bubble" bursts it will only go down a few hundreds of dollars of an ounce, maybe several hundreds until many individuals, institutions and central banks scoop in and buy up what is being sold by the "weak hands". Thus driving the price back up again. I hear arguments against gold all the time. The one usual tactic is to assume gold will be such and such at a given time. Then use this as a reason not to buy it. This reasoning of assuming a certain timeline in all fairness is being used by gold sellers as a reason for buying gold (from them). As example it is said that when the economy crashes fish hooks and non-hybrid seeds might be worth more than their weight in gold, much more. So buy farmland and non-hybrid seeds and some boxes of fish hooks for barter instead of gold and silver. But the question that should be asked is "how long will these conditions where fish hooks and non-hybrid seeds are king last?" Fish hooks can be manufactured and non-hybrid seeds harvested in almost unlimited numbers, gold and silver cannot. Gold and Silver will have incredible worth and value as the fiat currencies inflate in a more free economy like the US. Buy two ounces of gold now at $3,700 and in a year or so sell them and buy a $60,000 2010 SRT Dodge Challenger (or something else to your liking). Or buy some farmland with it. Of course capital gains taxes will have to be paid to the government which is irritating in that they are causing all the inflation in the first place. For Ecuador because of the present conditions of the government spoiling the free market, gold will have its use after the crash. Then it will be useful for barter in an underground economy. Times will change and the possibility of getting caught crossing the SRI, CONSEP and even the IRS will be seem like risks worth taking. Ask Liliya. She was I believe living in the FSU when their ruble inflated away. So even if gold and silver where not familiar means of exchange with the Soviet people then or with Americans or Ecuadorians now it does have the strong potential to be so. Believe me more and more people are becoming "their own central banks" and getting their stash of gold and silver. I see a time when people with a wink and a nod will exchange land, boats and vehicles for what is in a small leather bag and in addition some 'on the books' dollars to make it look legit. It is sad that conditions are coming where participating in an underground economy will become a necessity. Again ask Liliya.
It is silly to keep gold and silver at home, why would any one do that?
It is silly to keep gold and silver at home, why would any one do that?
It is silly to keep gold and silver at home, why would any one do that?
People who are smart keep it in several places well hidden. If one place is found the sneak thief, gun wielding hold up man or the IRS will think they've got it all. Keeping it in bank safety deposit boxes need to remember 1933 where suddenly all access to safety deposit boxes were frozen. That is until a sheriff or an IRS agent was there to watch them and confiscate any gold they had. Same might apply to independent bullion holding vaults of various business that hold your gold. I have a belief that things will get rather strange when fiat currencies collapse.
I'm off! See you later.
It is silly to keep gold and silver at home, why would any one do that?
People who are smart keep it in several places well hidden. If one place is found the sneak thief, gun wielding hold up man or the IRS will think they've got it all. Keeping it in bank safety deposit boxes need to remember 1933 where suddenly all access to safety deposit boxes were frozen. That is until a sheriff or an IRS agent was there to watch them and confiscate any gold they had. Same might apply to independent bullion holding vaults of various business that hold your gold. I have a belief that things will get rather strange when fiat currencies collapse.
I'm off! See you later.
Maxx if you want to hide your gold from the US government and the IRS why not buy and stash your gold in Canada? Unlike the American government the Canadian government did not confiscate gold during the Great Depression. It is easy for Americans to cross the border into Canada. Canada has a banking system that is among the strongest in the world. We have many companies that sell real gold products and a large number of companies that will provide storage for gold products.
It is silly to keep gold and silver at home, why would any one do that?
People who are smart keep it in several places well hidden. If one place is found the sneak thief, gun wielding hold up man or the IRS will think they've got it all. Keeping it in bank safety deposit boxes need to remember 1933 where suddenly all access to safety deposit boxes were frozen. That is until a sheriff or an IRS agent was there to watch them and confiscate any gold they had. Same might apply to independent bullion holding vaults of various business that hold your gold. I have a belief that things will get rather strange when fiat currencies collapse.
I'm off! See you later.
Maxx if you want to hide your gold from the US government and the IRS why not buy and stash your gold in Canada?
It is silly to keep gold and silver at home, why would any one do that?
In other words how much bread and beef will you be able to buy with an ounce or gram?
If you offer enough ounces to JC for his "vessel" will you be the proud owner of a floating movable condo?
It is silly to keep gold and silver at home, why would any one do that?
Cuffy, can you help me out here? Your the url-link-meister,...isnt there a clause in the patriot act that gives police search and seize powers to search personal rented bank vaults (those little ones) and specifily with regards to GOLD seize that asset?
I have little sympathy as most of these pizza shop owners are boat jobs that I am amazed were allowed into the country in the first place
May I ask the following; some of us following the price of gold measure the climb in US Dollars or Euro's. Fair enough but if these currencies are nearly worthless, what is the value of gold?
The survivalist guys I know are buying rugged plastic wide mouth quart size screw on top containers and filling them up by weight with "junk" silver coins and some gold coins
Time to think like a real survivalist if you want to survive. :money:
Time to think like a real survivalist if you want to survive. :money:
A real survivalist IMHO would have a few hundred acres, a hut, some seed potatoes, a pair of goats and would have learned how to be his own blacksmith, and just to be safe, would know how to knap flint, make his own bows and arrows and would be able to tan hides... tiphat Anything less is survivalist posing :scared0005:
Time to think like a real survivalist if you want to survive. :money:
A real survivalist IMHO would have a few hundred acres, a hut, some seed potatoes, a pair of goats and would have learned how to be his own blacksmith, and just to be safe, would know how to knap flint, make his own bows and arrows and would be able to tan hides... tiphat Anything less is survivalist posing :scared0005:
So JC, your saying interest rates will not increase for 500 years?
Time to think like a real survivalist if you want to survive. :money:
A real survivalist IMHO would have a few hundred acres, a hut, some seed potatoes, a pair of goats and would have learned how to be his own blacksmith, and just to be safe, would know how to knap flint, make his own bows and arrows and would be able to tan hides... tiphat Anything less is survivalist posing :scared0005:
Posers? On RUA? Preposterous... :laugh:
Tougher than me and anybody else on this board
Bows and Freaking Arrows? A compound bow maybe but Dude that's why the Chinese invented Gun Powder a thousand years ago - so a couple of Black Powder Rifles (to back up a 12 guage pump and 30-06 with a hand cannon .357 Magnum) so you can make your own ammo and powder if need be, some basic fishing gear, wire snares along with a great Tree Ax and a Two man crosscut saw and I am good to go - oh and the Post Hole Digger as previously discussed :smokin:
Point is I already have them... thats why I said survivalist not stoneage Neanderthalist
Time to listen and get your Cro Magn-On :smokin:
I know for a fact the Korean women have skills. :biggrin:
I know for a fact the Korean women have skills. :biggrin:
Endulge us with anekdotes...
Gold is 1875. teasing 1900 like a stripper!Once the Oblowme genius reveals his
Gold is 1875. teasing 1900 like a stripper!Once the Oblowme genius reveals hissame old socialist agenda, centralized government"new" plan I wouldn't be surprised if Gold started testing the $2000 threshold.
My side is free, constitutional, non socialist USA with as little corruption as possible. I don't agree with everything conservatives advocate but I don't agree with anything Obama socialist (the son of communist daddy Obama) is doing. This is my opinion and I'm going to express it whether you like it or not. Freedom of speech is still legal in this country last I checked. Don't know if this is gonna be the case if them social democrats remain in power for another term. I'm simply frustrated and disgusted what they are doing to this country.Gold is 1875. teasing 1900 like a stripper!Once the Oblowme genius reveals hissame old socialist agenda, centralized government"new" plan I wouldn't be surprised if Gold started testing the $2000 threshold.
Ed, conservatives, et.al.
Please desist of your description of Obama as a socialist. The man cannot be more on your side if he tried. Actually, he tried: http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/obama-pulls-back-proposed-smog-standards-in-victory-for-business/2011/09/02/gIQAisTiwJ_story.html?wpisrc=al_national
Gold is 1875. teasing 1900 like a stripper!
My side is free, constitutional, non socialist USA with as little corruption as possible. I don't agree with everything conservatives advocate but I don't agree with anything Obama socialist (the son of communist daddy Obama) is doing. This is my opinion and I'm going to express it whether you like it or not. Freedom of speech is still legal in this country last I checked. Don't know if this is gonna be the case if them social democrats remain in power for another term. I'm simply frustrated and disgusted what they are doing to this country.Gold is 1875. teasing 1900 like a stripper!Once the Oblowme genius reveals hissame old socialist agenda, centralized government"new" plan I wouldn't be surprised if Gold started testing the $2000 threshold.
Ed, conservatives, et.al.
Please desist of your description of Obama as a socialist. The man cannot be more on your side if he tried. Actually, he tried: http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/obama-pulls-back-proposed-smog-standards-in-victory-for-business/2011/09/02/gIQAisTiwJ_story.html?wpisrc=al_national
One thing I remember about Moscow in March of 2010 was that when I opened my apt window I could taste the air - don't know if it is all the trucks burning heavy mazut fuel oil or that cars and trucks without catalytic converters - sort of like any Mexican city or North England Village when the Pubs are burning coal for "ambiance".hey, he goes after Gibson guitars business! while not touching their competitors who use the same wood. Here is an idea for you - corruption! Everything this guy touches turns to shit.
Can't recall the last time I could taste the air in any USA city unless driving behind an Asphalt carrying 10 wheeler or by an Oil Refinery.
Point is we can hold off a bit of more EPA economy killing regulations for now.
Gold is 1875. teasing 1900 like a stripper!
JC I really wish you would stop paying all the strippers with gold - you are ruining it for those of us stuck with Obamugabe Bucks :smokin:
Gold is 1875. teasing 1900 like a stripper!
JC I really wish you would stop paying all the strippers with gold - you are ruining it for those of us stuck with Obamugabe Bucks :smokin:
apology #2 coming.
i was sure gold was continuing on down when it dropped into the low $1700s and my #1 advisor said to not buy until 1600. i dont think its going to 1600 now but i'm short enough that i can wait for the next pullback, even if it isnt for 3 months. i was all ready to buy at 1600 and gloat, darn. :)
thought i'd pass along that guy says he can see gold $3000(after a serious pullback) or better until the US comes to grips w/ reality or the bond market forces reality upon us. :hidechair:
Gold is 1875. teasing 1900 like a stripper!Once the Oblowme genius reveals hissame old socialist agenda, centralized government"new" plan I wouldn't be surprised if Gold started testing the $2000 threshold.
Ed, conservatives, et.al.
Please desist of your description of Obama as a socialist.
i was sure gold was continuing on down when it dropped into the low $1700s and my #1 advisor said to not buy until 1600.
The Latest Column by Peter Schiff in Forbes hot off the presses:
Obama Looking Like Job Killer In Chief
http://news.yahoo.com/obama-looking-job-killer-chief-223223598.html
The Latest Column by Peter Schiff in Forbes hot off the presses:this article summarizes everything quite nicely
Obama Looking Like Job Killer In Chief
http://news.yahoo.com/obama-looking-job-killer-chief-223223598.html
The Luxembourgers doubled down and said FUUUUCK YOU!
Why dont those people just say 'shove it' and move their business to Panama?
The Luxembourgers doubled down and said FUUUUCK YOU!
Why dont those people just say 'shove it' and move their business to Panama?
Of course what a great idea, the IRS and the US Attorney General would never go after the Panamanian banks or government. :ROFL:
OK why not some islands, Far Tortuga at least the diving is good!
The Luxembourgers doubled down and said FUUUUCK YOU!
Why dont those people just say 'shove it' and move their business to Panama?
Of course what a great idea, the IRS and the US Attorney General would never go after the Panamanian banks or government. :ROFL:
OK why not some islands, Far Tortuga at least the diving is good!
Thats the life
(http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1175/1453823472_8b19f9e7aa_o.jpg)
The Luxembourgers doubled down and said FUUUUCK YOU!
Why dont those people just say 'shove it' and move their business to Panama?
Of course what a great idea, the IRS and the US Attorney General would never go after the Panamanian banks or government. :ROFL:
Reading comprehension,..,I was talking about emigration,..,not just a foreign bank account!
3 transom trolleys, 8 grinders, helmsman plus the fotogragher on a late IOR boat. :sick0012:
I will stay on my Star! :knit:
The Luxembourgers doubled down and said FUUUUCK YOU!
Why dont those people just say 'shove it' and move their business to Panama?
Of course what a great idea, the IRS and the US Attorney General would never go after the Panamanian banks or government. :ROFL:
Reading comprehension,..,I was talking about emigration,..,not just a foreign bank account!
Yes of course that explains it so much better. Live in Panama instead of Switzerland. Doing business in Panama would be so much better than doing business in Switzerland. Panama has a corruption index of 3.6/10 (higher is better), Switzerland has a corruption index of 8.7/10. At least the surfing is better in Panama.
[edit: Insult removed. Brass]
http://www.transparency.org/policy_research/surveys_indices/cpi/2010/results
ECB raises interest rates to be on par with inflation,..., these will impact the gold price negativly!!!
Also more then likely Greece will be amputated out of the Eurozone..., this will be a good thing for the currency!
Good buying oppertunity for gold! (1789 USD now)
ECB raises interest rates to be on par with inflation,..., these will impact the gold price negativly!!!
Also more then likely Greece will be amputated out of the Eurozone..., this will be a good thing for the currency!
Good buying oppertunity for gold! (1789 USD now)
i would wait until it drops under 1700. w/ central banks throwing money around in the EU to save greece and others now and in the US speculation that the US FED may do something at their upcoming meeting, i'm speculating this rally continues into next week and keeps knocking down gold.
also, gold's been pretty overbought for a while.
Lee, the shit is going to hit the fan pretty soon IMO. There's gonna be a very serious inflation, hopefully not hyper inflation but I expect gold to go up to 5K or more. It may drop down to $1700, tomorrow, then again it might not but the dollar is going to shit until they decide to raise interest rates. Only then gold is going to go down and will probably stabilize somewhere in the area of $2500 to $3000. But before that happens it is not out of the question that it will get close to $10,000.ECB raises interest rates to be on par with inflation,..., these will impact the gold price negativly!!!
Also more then likely Greece will be amputated out of the Eurozone..., this will be a good thing for the currency!
Good buying oppertunity for gold! (1789 USD now)
i would wait until it drops under 1700. w/ central banks throwing money around in the EU to save greece and others now and in the US speculation that the US FED may do something at their upcoming meeting, i'm speculating this rally continues into next week and keeps knocking down gold.
also, gold's been pretty overbought for a while.
Clueless!!
dollar cost averaging would be a smart idea. It applies to gold too.
Clueless!!
JC gold has skyrocketed, it's bound to pop up and down a bit.
with a general trend upwards. I disagree with Lee, if it's a buy
at 1700 then it's a buy at 1786 however deciding to buy at
1700 if it drops down to that wouldn't be a bad idea would it?
I also remember when Carter was president and gold was at
nearly $700 and everyone that bought it got burned a little later
when Reagan was president and he got inflation under control
Paul Volker (spelling?) helped. Gold prices were under $400 for
over a decade.
Saying he is clueless? surely you can make a better argument than
that.
Bill
Several months ago I mentioned is gold going to 2,000 or 1,000 next. We still do not know.we don't??? Do you see anything on the news that I don't? Today they are saying that economists predict that there is 1 out of 3 chance of another recession (as if we ever got out of the first one). Obama is continuing his policy based on his ideology, nothing is changing therefore we are approaching a serious crisis. How is that conducive to gold going down I don't know.
Gold is at 1804.10 right now... good luck waiting for thet 1700 mark...
however deciding to buy at
1700 if it drops down to that wouldn't be a bad idea would it?
ECB raises interest rates to be on par with inflation,..., these will impact the gold price negativly!!!
Also more then likely Greece will be amputated out of the Eurozone..., this will be a good thing for the currency!
Good buying oppertunity for gold! (1789 USD now)
i would wait until it drops under 1700. w/ central banks throwing money around in the EU to save greece and others now and in the US speculation that the US FED may do something at their upcoming meeting, i'm speculating this rally continues into next week and keeps knocking down gold.
also, gold's been pretty overbought for a while.
Clueless!!
GOld was about 1600 (approx) on 1 AUG THE BEGINNING OF THIS MONTH been rising
Its now peaked 1920, next week, easily breaking 2000 without a fuuucking sweat!!!
and when that barrier breaks,,,, its not going to be funny.
excuse me, but i think this was by you nearly a month ago now JC. so, you are no more a genuis than I.
Peter Schiff Congressional Testimony:man, I love this guy!
On Russia Today:
Another really bad day on the stock market, after a bad day yesterday. Dow was down about 280 points yesterday. Two bad days.
Dow 10,733.83 -391.01 -3.51%
Nasdaq 2,455.67 -82.52 -3.25%
S&P 500 1,129.56 -37.20 -3.19%
Also the banks will start charging 1% on cash checlking and savings deposits?
@Mr johnny-come-lately.Quoteexcuse me, but i think this was by you nearly a month ago now JC. so, you are no more a genuis than I.
Being a genius has nothing to do with it, just using common sense! and think for yourself instead of delegating it to (your quote) "advisors"/
I started this thread when gold was at 1100 approx, its now over 1800 (peaked 1920)..,Some people would call it a winnings streak,, I call it "the school of Austrian economics". (www.mises.org)
Since that time we have heard nothing from you then the "..recovery is just around the corner.." :ROFL: Voodoo-witch-doctor-Keynesian-crap. Untill you selfadmittedly converted to "Hey, printing money indeed doesnt work" (lightbulb moment) and getting some tin-foil-hat-education by watching "Zeitgeist" (wtf?) :D
...Wow...maybe the Titanic was sinking (once "Mr Clue" saw the bow of the ship was sticking its ass in the air.)..yup.., your just as smart as me alright.... :ROFL: Congrats!!
Back to serious issues:
Sure there is still a lot of volatility because obviously a lot of $$$ dumbfuucksss with cash still playing around with asset classes they should stay away from,..., I guess some considering buying UBS stock aswell..
As I clearly stated before (Mr Clue paying attention?) Gold will go down if:
1) INterest rates go up and FED STOPS printing money
2) we go back to the gold standard (impossible with the USD)
3) Ron Paul gets elected and he abolished the fed before he gets assasinated (Nearly happened with President Jackson when he killed the second incarnation of the Federal Reserve)
Got this email from a friend that I trust today:
Sarasota county and perhaps the entire state of Florida is trying to pass a law that requires PM dealers, pawn shopes and scrap dealers to hold any buying orders for 30 days, and limit the pay out to sellers to $100.00 per day.
Get ready for trouble. Also the banks will start charging 1% on cash checlking and savings deposits?
A collapse must be close.
Lee, hope you bought some gold today? Your wish did come true and gold is down quite a bit. It's not gonna last long though.
. Where's all the money going if it's leaving the stock market and gold?
. Where's all the money going if it's leaving the stock market and gold?
It's just going out of everything and onto the sidelines. People are looking for a safe haven now. Cash, US Dollars. :money: :money: :money: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Not really, Ray. People sold gold today to cover their losses in the stock market. Today was a good buying opportunity for gold and especially for silver.. Where's all the money going if it's leaving the stock market and gold?
It's just going out of everything and onto the sidelines. People are looking for a safe haven now. Cash, US Dollars. :money: :money: :money: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Not really, Ray. People sold gold today to cover their losses in the stock market. Today was a good buying opportunity for gold and especially for silver.. Where's all the money going if it's leaving the stock market and gold?
It's just going out of everything and onto the sidelines. People are looking for a safe haven now. Cash, US Dollars. :money: :money: :money: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Just my opinion.
I can agree with you to an extent but my own thoughts would be that it would depend on how long they felt they wanted to keep the money on the sidelines. If it was for a very short time I am not so sure you are right but if they plan to stay out of things for months then yes, treasuries would be a good choice for most. There must be a lot of money sitting on the sidelines right now since not only did stocks and gold drop but most commodities as well.
My post was a little tongue in cheek since many consider gold a "safe haven" and this week it seems many feel dollars are safer. The next few weeks could be quite interesting.
Not really, Ray. People sold gold today to cover their losses in the stock market. Today was a good buying opportunity for gold and especially for silver.
Just my opinion.
TG I understand that you were being tongue in cheek to some extent. However with the stock market down so much over the past month, gold down, even oil has dropped below $80/barrel, these are signs that the financial downturn could last a while. T-bills can be had for 28 days, 91 days, 182 days, and 364 days so there is a variety of choices for short term holdings.
Not really, Ray. People sold gold today to cover their losses in the stock market. Today was a good buying opportunity for gold and especially for silver.. Where's all the money going if it's leaving the stock market and gold?
It's just going out of everything and onto the sidelines. People are looking for a safe haven now. Cash, US Dollars. :money: :money: :money: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Just my opinion.
3 best companies to buy and put away (Buffet Buy it and forget it method) for the next 100 years McDonald's, P&G and Coca-Cola...
if you still think that Gold is your only option and you are putting all of your eggs in one basket I would suggest that you do a lot more reading about the subject. Consider reading Warren Buffet's opinion about Gold. He would apparently much rather put his money into investments with people who have creative new ideas and creative products (stocks). That is where the long term growth always has been, as well as in Real Estate. Gold is just a metal. It sits there and does nothing. It has no new ideas and produces no new products.
Gold down almost $100 today. Down from over $1800, yet the stock market is also down, Greece looks to declare bankruptcy and Italy is in fiscal chaos. Where's all the money going if it's leaving the stock market and gold? US treasuries in one destination and probably the main beneficiary of the money.
Gold 1,642.50 -96.70 -5.56%
http://finance.yahoo.com/
3 best companies to buy and put away (Buffet Buy it and forget it method) for the next 100 years McDonald's, P&G and Coca-Cola...
My guess is that 20 years ago Buffet's list of three companies to buy and put away for 100 years would have been Kodak, General Motors and AT&T.
That was one of the best posts in the thread and I particularly like and agree with the corp tax part.
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
Swiss immigration caught up with him. :laugh:
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
As much as JC gives me a hard time, i really shouldnt defend him; but he's still right overall on gold.
while gold has fallen, it is just really consolidating and will eventually be over $2000. the world has resolved nothing and has taken the US FED monetary policies worldwide. gold will continue to be a good investment until that changes. i'm guessing at least another year. maybe if those darn tea partiers take over, it'll change; but i'm quite sure they wont do anything until they have to just like any other politician.
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
As much as JC gives me a hard time, i really shouldnt defend him; but he's still right overall on gold.
while gold has fallen, it is just really consolidating and will eventually be over $2000. the world has resolved nothing and has taken the US FED monetary policies worldwide. gold will continue to be a good investment until that changes. i'm guessing at least another year. maybe if those darn tea partiers take over, it'll change; but i'm quite sure they wont do anything until they have to just like any other politician.
JC may be right on gold but if he is really shorting the US dollar and the world economy falters gold may go up but for certain the value of the US dollar will climb. It is still the world reserve currency and a shelter in times of economic turmoil. Shorting the US dollar is a bad idea when the world economy is bad.
JC may be right on gold but if he is really shorting the US dollar and the world economy falters gold may go up but for certain the value of the US dollar will climb. It is still the world reserve currency and a shelter in times of economic turmoil. Shorting the US dollar is a bad idea when the world economy is bad.
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
Swiss immigration caught up with him. :laugh:
Or he is playing with a new toy :laugh:
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
Swiss immigration caught up with him. :laugh:
Or he is playing with a new toy :laugh:
As much as possible,!!!
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
Nice lil fantasy your having
I was Shorting EUR/CHF (and cashed out when both were on par)
My advice is to short the USD long term against stronger currencies (which doesnt inlcude the CHF as of recent)
I didnt say I was shorting the USD, but I would still do it long term Put calls in (2012/2013)
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
Nice lil fantasy your having
I was Shorting EUR/CHF (and cashed out when both were on par)
My advice is to short the USD long term against stronger currencies (which doesnt inlcude the CHF as of recent)
I didnt say I was shorting the USD, but I would still do it long term Put calls in (2012/2013)
More burger boy economics JC? Short the US dollar starting in 2012 or 2013? This problem with the world economy, whether it is an economic downturn, recession or depression won't be over in 2012 or even 2013. Most economists are saying it will be at least 2015 before the world economy improves. This means that the US dollar is going to be a haven currency and will maintain its status as the world's reserve currency for at least the next 3 years.
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
Nice lil fantasy your having
I was Shorting EUR/CHF (and cashed out when both were on par)
My advice is to short the USD long term against stronger currencies (which doesnt inlcude the CHF as of recent)
I didnt say I was shorting the USD, but I would still do it long term Put calls in (2012/2013)
More burger boy economics JC? Short the US dollar starting in 2012 or 2013? This problem with the world economy, whether it is an economic downturn, recession or depression won't be over in 2012 or even 2013. Most economists are saying it will be at least 2015 before the world economy improves. This means that the US dollar is going to be a haven currency and will maintain its status as the world's reserve currency for at least the next 3 years.
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
Nice lil fantasy your having
I was Shorting EUR/CHF (and cashed out when both were on par)
My advice is to short the USD long term against stronger currencies (which doesnt inlcude the CHF as of recent)
I didnt say I was shorting the USD, but I would still do it long term Put calls in (2012/2013)
More burger boy economics JC? Short the US dollar starting in 2012 or 2013? This problem with the world economy, whether it is an economic downturn, recession or depression won't be over in 2012 or even 2013. Most economists are saying it will be at least 2015 before the world economy improves. This means that the US dollar is going to be a haven currency and will maintain its status as the world's reserve currency for at least the next 3 years.
And it would be especially not wise to short the dollar in 2013 considering that there is a very high likelyhood that we will have a pro business Republican as President.
Most economists are saying it will be at least 2015 before the world economy improves.
And it would be especially not wise to short the dollar in 2013A agree that with you that wc's advice is a bit dumb
Where is JeanClaude?? He certainly is not bragging about all of his holdings in Gold right now!! And if he was shorting the US dollar as much as he claimed, oh well...
Nice lil fantasy your having
I was Shorting EUR/CHF (and cashed out when both were on par)
My advice is to short the USD long term against stronger currencies (which doesnt inlcude the CHF as of recent)
I didnt say I was shorting the USD, but I would still do it long term Put calls in (2012/2013)
More burger boy economics JC? Short the US dollar starting in 2012 or 2013? This problem with the world economy, whether it is an economic downturn, recession or depression won't be over in 2012 or even 2013. Most economists are saying it will be at least 2015 before the world economy improves. This means that the US dollar is going to be a haven currency and will maintain its status as the world's reserve currency for at least the next 3 years.
Chico,.., how many times have I said to stop yammering about your imaginary friend who works at McD's
and your daydreaming caused you to miss a spot on my masserati , please re-clean or no apple sauce for grandpa!
Another way to really fight inflation:
Subject: Warren Buffett interview with CNBC
Warren Buffett, in a recent interview with CNBC, offers one of the best
quotes about the debt ceiling:
"I could end the deficit in 5 minutes", he told CNBC. "You just pass a law that says that anytime there is a deficit of more than 3% of GDP, all sitting members of Congress are ineligible for re-election."
The 26th amendment (granting the right to vote for 18 year-olds) took only 3 months and 8 days to be ratified! Why? Simple! The people demanded it. That was in 1971 before computers, e-mail, cell phones, etc.
Of the 27 amendments to the Constitution, seven (7) took 1 year or less to become the law of the land all because of public pressure.
Warren Buffet is asking each addressee to forward this email to a minimum of twenty people on their address list; in turn ask each of those to do likewise.
In three days, most people in The United States of America will have the message. This is one idea that really should be passed around.
Congressional Reform Act of 20111:
1. No Tenure / No Pension. A Congressman collects a salary while in office and receives no pay when they are out of office.
2. Congress (past, present & future) participates in Social Security. All funds in the Congressional retirement fund move to the Social Security system immediately. All future funds flow into the Social Security system, and Congress participates with the American people. It may not be used for any other purpose.
3. Congress can purchase their own retirement plan, just as all Americans do.
4. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. Congressional pay will rise by the lower of CPI or 3%.
5. Congress and loses their current health care system and participates in the same health care system as the American people.
6. Congress must equally abide by all laws they impose on the American people.
7. All contracts with past and present Congressmen are void effective 1/1/12. The American people did not make this contract with Congressmen. Congressmen made all these contracts for themselves. Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, so ours should serve their term(s), then go home and back to work.
If each person contacts a minimum of twenty people then it will only take three days for most people (in the U.S.) to receive the message. Maybe it is time.
THIS IS HOW YOU FIX CONGRESS!!!!!
If you agree with the above, pass it on. If not, just delete. You are one of my 20+..
If you agree, please pass it on and share with friends.
Well 6o Minutes news show had a show tonight about how Congress approval ratings are the lowest ever and 60 Minutes dug up even more "issues" - they now have the Right T.E.A. folks and the Left Occupy Wall St folks equally pissed off and even thought the lefties and righties vehemently disagree there is a huge Venn Diagram overlap of common ground and should they both vote their self interests versus knee jerk demagogue inspired wedge issues the Congress and Senate are in for a huge problem
Another way to really fight inflation:
Subject: Warren Buffett interview with CNBC
Warren Buffett, in a recent interview with CNBC, offers one of the best
quotes about the debt ceiling:
"I could end the deficit in 5 minutes", he told CNBC. "You just pass a law that says that anytime there is a deficit of more than 3% of GDP, all sitting members of Congress are ineligible for re-election."
The 26th amendment (granting the right to vote for 18 year-olds) took only 3 months and 8 days to be ratified! Why? Simple! The people demanded it. That was in 1971 before computers, e-mail, cell phones, etc.Amen. Possibly difficult to implement, but it's the right thought.
Of the 27 amendments to the Constitution, seven (7) took 1 year or less to become the law of the land all because of public pressure.
Warren Buffet is asking each addressee to forward this email to a minimum of twenty people on their address list; in turn ask each of those to do likewise.
In three days, most people in The United States of America will have the message. This is one idea that really should be passed around.
Congressional Reform Act of 20111:
1. No Tenure / No Pension. A Congressman collects a salary while in office and receives no pay when they are out of office.
2. Congress (past, present & future) participates in Social Security. All funds in the Congressional retirement fund move to the Social Security system immediately. All future funds flow into the Social Security system, and Congress participates with the American people. It may not be used for any other purpose.I can't stress how completely I support this one. I'd also be OK with a 401k, with contributions tied to the average of contributions the American people are getting with respect to any "matching funds" or not.
3. Congress can purchase their own retirement plan, just as all Americans do.
4. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. Congressional pay will rise by the lower of CPI or 3%.It's a good starting point, but seems tied to the wrong index with CPI.
5. Congress and loses their current health care system and participates in the same health care system as the American people.Oops, it was here, agree 100%.
6. Congress must equally abide by all laws they impose on the American people.
7. All contracts with past and present Congressmen are void effective 1/1/12. The American people did not make this contract with Congressmen. Congressmen made all these contracts for themselves. Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, so ours should serve their term(s), then go home and back to work.
There's an old saying that “the higher you fly, the harder you fall.” The US government is, by any measure, the luckiest government in centuries. It has risen to unforeseen heights of monetary excess – and has been rewarded for doing so. But it looks like lower flying planes are starting to stall out, and one can only imagine – from this height – how fast and how far the US may fall.
My humble advice is not to try to time it, but rather to use your golden parachute before it's too late.
John Browne is a consultant to Euro Pacific Capital.
S&P downgrades top US banks' credit ratings
AP By EILEEN AJ CONNELLY AP – 5 hrs ago
NEW YORK (AP) — Standard & Poor's Ratings Services has lowered its credit ratings for many of the world's largest financial institutions, including the biggest banks in the U.S.
Bank of America Corp. and its main subsidiaries are among the institutions whose ratings fell at least one notch Tuesday, along with Citigroup Inc., Goldman Sachs Group Inc., JPMorgan Chase & Co., Morgan Stanley and Wells Fargo & Co.
S&P said the changes in 37 financial companies' ratings reflect the firm's new criteria for banks, and they incorporate shifts in the industry and the role of governments and central banks worldwide. The agency did not release its evaluation of each company but said it plans to discuss the changes during a conference call early Wednesday.
Bank of America's issuer credit rating was cut to "A-" from "A," as were its Countrywide Financial Corp. and Merrill Lynch & Co. Inc. units, along with a series of related subsidiaries
Ratings downgrades are never seen as positive, but this round may be particularly damaging for Bank of America.
Concern already was growing Tuesday about whether B of A has enough capital to withstand another downturn in the U.S. economy or further trouble in Europe, and the bank's stock fell to a two-year low before the ratings announcement.
The Charlotte, N.C.-based bank said in a recent regulatory filing that downgrades from S&P or Fitch Ratings, which also is reevaluating its ratings, "could likely have a material adverse effect on our liquidity" and cut off its access to credit markets.
It typically costs companies more to borrow when their credit ratings are cut, the same way a decline in a person's credit scores drives up the interest rates that banks and credit cards will offer him.
Downgrades could hurt parts of the bank's businesses where creditworthiness is critical, Bank of America said in a filing Nov. 3 with the Securities and Exchange Commission.
A downgrade also could trigger provisions in derivative contracts that require B of A to put up more collateral, and it could terminate the contracts, resulting in losses and hurting the bank's liquidity. The bank posted a $6.2 billion profit for the third quarter, mostly the result of accounting gains and the sale of a stake in a Chinese bank, but it was still moving toward a loss for the year as of Sept. 30.
Bank of America shares fell 17 cents, or 3.2 percent, to close Tuesday at $5.08 and lost another penny after hours.
S&P cut its rating on Citigroup Inc.'s credit to "A-" from "A''; a series of its subsidiaries also saw changes. Citigroup shares closed up 19 cents, at $25.24, and lost 14 cents aftermarket.
Goldman Sachs also was cut to "A-" from "A," which triggered some downgrades for subsidiaries. The investment bank's shares closed regular trading down $1.62, at $88.81, and lost another 12 cents in late trading.
JPMorgan Chase's rating also dropped to "A'' from "A+," and its Chase Bank unit was downgraded to "A+" from "AA-" and other subsidiaries ratings also changed. JPMorgan Chase took the place of Bank of America as the nation's largest bank in recent months.
The bank's stock lost 6 cents aftermarket after closing the regular session down 60 cents, or 2 percent, at $28.56.
Morgan Stanley's rating slipped to "A-" from "A'' and several of its units also got cut one notch. Shares slipped 9 cents in late trading from their close down 49 cents, or 3.6 percent, at $13.31.
Wells Fargo fell to "A+" from "AA-" which likewise triggered downgrades for several subsidiaries. Shares closed down 7 cents at $24.08, then lost 18 cents aftermarket.
In addition, Bank of New York Mellon Corp., the sixth biggest bank in the U.S., was cut to "A+" from "AA-," and some units were downgraded. Bank of New York Mellon is a custodian bank, which collects dividends on stocks and holds cash deposits, among other things, on behalf of its customers, which are mainly large pension funds and money market funds. The stock closed down a penny at $18.08, then lost 8 cents in late trading.
Top U.K. downgrades include Barclays PLC, HSBC Holdings PLC, Lloyds Banking Group PLC and The Royal Bank of Scotland.
Ratings for several big European banks, including Credit Suisse, Deutsche Bank, ING Groep N.V. and Societe Generale were unchanged, but in some cases they were given a "negative" outlook.
But then again, who am I to have any claim to knowing anything. It was me who guessed that the gold prices would drop before they climed to over $ 1900.00 for a while.
We only have to wait a year to see which of us is right. I just went from a fair amount of cash on the sidelines to fully invested yesterday morning.
Point is technology is now at the point where every lecture can be YouTubed or Vimeoed for posterity with immediate PDF lecture notes and transcripts and any child with reasonable comprehension can now learn at the collegiate level for free online from home - the days of $600 per credit Community College courses and $250K ivy league educations (A Dentist friend in Boston accumulated $250K in loans and interest to get their DMD and licenses to practice. Add malpractice and no wonder veneers cost $800 a pop and Crowns and implant posts cost $3K each). Only real reason to go off to school is to break the apron strings and engage in all the social bad habits one quickly learns in College - Silicon Valley model is to teach yourself Coding by doing Coding and emulating Gates, Jobs and Zuckerberg - almost considered a waste to study engineering for 4 or 6 years when you can take night school classes and build equity in several new tech firms in 6 years time. Of course a PhD in Math or Physics or Bio/pharma fields will pay in patent royalties over time some debt not bad - but the current house of cards system of debt for education is long overdue for a major economic reality check. Same for nearly every other USA government subsidized social safety net programs that have gone completely out of control - as if they were ever in control in the first place.
Personally I think your crystal ball will turn out to be a little murky. My guess is that a year from now you will hear little about financial problems in Europe, the stock market will be 10% or better ahead of where it is now, unemployment in the USA will be about 7.5-8%, the GDP will be growing a bit faster than now and gold will be less than $ 1500.00.
But then again, who am I to have any claim to knowing anything. It was me who guessed that the gold prices would drop before they climed to over $ 1900.00 for a while.
We only have to wait a year to see which of us is right. I just went from a fair amount of cash on the sidelines to fully invested yesterday morning.
But then again, who am I to have any claim to knowing anything. It was me who guessed that the gold prices would drop before they climed to over $ 1900.00 for a while.
We only have to wait a year to see which of us is right. I just went from a fair amount of cash on the sidelines to fully invested yesterday morning.
My guess backed by a bet gold over $2000 (for a while) and the Euro to the dollar € 1,= is $ 1,24
We all shall see.
And where is JC?
AvHdB
Peter Schiff Update on PM/GOLD:
http://www.europacmetals.com/commentaries/newsid416/116/global-central-banks-ring-gold-buyers-bell.aspx
Friends,
Today’s unprecedented announcement by the world’s most powerful central banks was a loud and clear bell ringing to buy precious metals. The move, disguised as an attempt to help the fragile state of the global economy, is in reality a move to prop up failing banks in Europe and the US.
By reducing interest rates paid for dollar swaps, central bankers are in effect increasing the quantity of global dollars in circulation. The result? The dollar will weaken, inflation will rise, and gold will soar. Gold was up more than $30 today, and the dollar got crushed.
I urge you to take 7 minutes to watch the video I recorded exclusively for my subscribers a few hours ago. It explains, in plain language, what happened today – and what is the likely outcome for your portfolio. This may be one of the most important economic events of the year.
Sincerely,
Peter Schiff
Chief Executive Officer
Euro Pacific Precious Metals
Peter Schiff Update on PM/GOLD:
http://www.europacmetals.com/commentaries/newsid416/116/global-central-banks-ring-gold-buyers-bell.aspx
Friends,
Today’s unprecedented announcement by the world’s most powerful central banks was a loud and clear bell ringing to buy precious metals. The move, disguised as an attempt to help the fragile state of the global economy, is in reality a move to prop up failing banks in Europe and the US.
By reducing interest rates paid for dollar swaps, central bankers are in effect increasing the quantity of global dollars in circulation. The result? The dollar will weaken, inflation will rise, and gold will soar. Gold was up more than $30 today, and the dollar got crushed.
I urge you to take 7 minutes to watch the video I recorded exclusively for my subscribers a few hours ago. It explains, in plain language, what happened today – and what is the likely outcome for your portfolio. This may be one of the most important economic events of the year.
Sincerely,
Peter Schiff
Chief Executive Officer
Euro Pacific Precious Metals
I think that you do have to be aware of who is making these statements. I would suggest that the CEO of ''Euro Pacific Precious Metals'' has a vested interest in talking up the prospects for gold.
However, I would agree that it's mostly about ''a move to prop up failing banks in Europe''
His comment that ''the dollar got crushed'' is quite a bit of an exaggeration.
The dollar is now stronger against the pound than it was before this announcement and almost back to the previous level against the Euro.
On the day, the dollar ended up 130 pips down against the Euro, after being around 240 pips down at one point from when the announcement was made at 1pm GMT.
That is quite a large daily range, but nothing exceptional. There were just as large, if not larger, daily moves on 10th, 27th and 31st October and 9th and 23rd November and today was almost as big a move as well following the NFP figures.
Serious Stuff really....
Goldman Sachs has $700 million in exposure to Italy. The loss from a write-down similar to that on the Greek debt, 50 cents on the dollar, would erase 10% of the $3.43 billion in profit Goldman earned in the first nine months of 2011.
The major fear is that the U.S. banks don’t have enough capital to cover losses from the euro zone.
With the coming economic collapse at hand,
Personally I do think there is a possibility of a total financial collapse that might make the great depression look like a cake walk. I also think that the odds are better that it won't happen. That we have not passed by the point of no return. I do think we need better leadership here and around the world and we need to take better steps to financial solvency.
I see 2012 as being a lot brighter than Mr Browne does. I do think that a major disruption in the oil supply is one of the bigger dangers that we face. It could lead to a global financial collapse and may be more of a concern than the problems in Greece etc.
Sovereign Society Video - these guys are not known to be part of the Tin Foil hats club so...
Switch to digital currency:
http://www.sovereignsociety.com/pages/svs/digital_currency_video2.php?pub=DIGICURR&code=ESVSN106&o=578939&s=583098&u=40710228&l=361513&r=Milo
Facebook Raises IPO Price Range to $34-38 per Share
http://www.cnbc.com/id/47421520
(FB) Everybody knows the syndicate is there supporting @38, but they are still dumping all ovah the banker's stinkin face.
Would probably be 28 without that fake support
Yes, it's called the "syndicate bid". Legal for the underwriters (Bankers) to manipulate stocks but not legal for others to manipulate stocks.(FB) Everybody knows the syndicate is there supporting @38, but they are still dumping all ovah the banker's stinkin face.
Would probably be 28 without that fake support
It was the IPO underwriters that were making sure FB didn't go below $38/share. It would be embarrassing for the underwriters if the price dropped below $38/share because the underwriters determined that was the best entry point for the stock. Wait till Monday, when trading resumes the IPO underwriters won't be offering any support for FB and more importantly the short sellers will be in the market, then the public will see what happens to the stock.
(FB) prices @38
Looked like the bankers tried to support @35 today.(FB) prices @38
End of the day $38,27 - heard it needed support during the first trading day!
Looked like the bankers tried to support @35 today.(FB) prices @38
End of the day $38,27 - heard it needed support during the first trading day!
Now it's low 34s. :party0011:
Just so you know: I'm cheering for it to go to ZERO, and kill the banks.Looked like the bankers tried to support @35 today.(FB) prices @38
End of the day $38,27 - heard it needed support during the first trading day!
Now it's low 34s. :party0011:
Not really my sort of stock but around $25 maybe $ 28 - I would purchase some stock.
The Facebook billionaire nobody is talking about. Priscilla Chan is Mark Zuckerberg's long time girlfriend and whether she knows it or not she just became a billionaire today. Chan met Zuckerberg at Harvard and has been with him ever since. On May 14th she earned her medical degree from from University of California, San Francisco's School of Medicine, and membership into the exclusive National Medical Honor Society. According to none other than Donald Trump Chan has earned herself a large portion of Zuckerberg's fortune if they were ever to split, even if they never marry.
http://shine.yahoo.com/secrets-to-your-success/facebook-billionaires-girlfriend-priscilla-chan-big-week-too-193200386.html
I tend to agree with everyone that Facebook will bottom out somewhere and turn into a good investment. I do think they will continue to grow fast.
I think the part that concerns me is thier ability to monotize their popularity. Just as GM found their ads there don't pay I do think people are so intent on other things they don't pay any attention to the ads. I spend very little time on Facebook but when the topic of ads came up in the news I had been unaware they had ads. In the small amount of time I spend on Facebook I have always been so busy on other things I never noticed any ads.
I think it will be interesting to see where the bottom is. I hear numbers as low as under $ 10.00. I think it will be in the mid to high teens myself.
A good stock to gage the economy in USA and Europe is Rockwell Automation. They are a big player in factory automation - when they decline or stall in sales usually indicates a slowdown on plant investment (new or rebuild of old). They do not do as well in Asia so you need to use a different stock for Asia.
Regarding gold more than a year ago I mentioned would it go to 1,000 or 2,000 first - I did not know. But we know the answer neither as it hovers in the middle. Gold is not a great longterm investment its more of a short term play right now. I may start day trading it again - as mentioned 1 plus year ago was making 30 times my initial investment by day trading it. When you have fear gold is an easy short play.
The OP has not been here once this year (per his last login) and I remember him telling me it would be 5,000 plus by now on gold price.
Regarding gold more than a year ago I mentioned would it go to 1,000 or 2,000 first - When you have fear gold is an easy short play.
The OP has not been here once this year (per his last login) and I remember him telling me it would be 5,000 plus by now on gold price.
my short plays are volatiltiy - vix etfs and s+p shorts. you dont make as much as shorting a stock, but itsd a lot safer.
and my 2 favorite stocks are john deere and catepillar. when we hit the bottom of this next recession; i'm buying a whole lot of both of them. i own neither now as i think we're at a mkt top.
but now it's back to 1420... some people think that by the beginning of next year it's going to be over 2000
AV, are you saying it ain't gonna happen?but now it's back to 1420... some people think that by the beginning of next year it's going to be over 2000
I would now ask them how much they have bought recently and how much they purchased a few years back.
Ask again on the 15th of January, well after Eastern Orthodox Christmas.
AV, are you saying it ain't gonna happen?
Haha, just came across this Ukrainian woman's profile, she says: "Don’t steal, don’t lie, don’t cheat, don’t sell drugs. The government hates competition......)) )))".
How very true! :))) So wise and she is a beauty too!
Dear Muzh, I see you are back to work today! :-XHaha, just came across this Ukrainian woman's profile, she says: "Don’t steal, don’t lie, don’t cheat, don’t sell drugs. The government hates competition......)) )))".
How very true! :))) So wise and she is a beauty too!
Hmmm, looking for her contact information.
Nope, nowhere to be found.
Is she one from your stable?
The following has been brought to you by:
ED - Your Trusted MOB Broker. "If you can't find happiness with an American Feminazi, I'll show you a place where you will find women your daughter's age outnumber men 8 to 1 and are dying to make your house cosy and cook tasty dishes."
The following has been brought to you by:why not take it a step further and say "your great, great grand daughter's age". If you're going to come up with BS claims might as well :)
ED - Your Trusted MOB Broker. "If you can't find happiness with an American Feminazi, I'll show you a place where you will find women your daughter's age outnumber men 8 to 1 and are dying to make your house cosy and cook tasty dishes."
The following has been brought to you by:why not take it a step further and say "your great, great grand daughter's age". If you're going to come up with BS claims might as well :)
ED - Your Trusted MOB Broker. "If you can't find happiness with an American Feminazi, I'll show you a place where you will find women your daughter's age outnumber men 8 to 1 and are dying to make your house cosy and cook tasty dishes."
I always found it so disingenuous of you, the man who married a bride from Ukraine stigmatising others who are trying to find love in that part of the world. What a hypocrite!
How is your work day going? Must be real busy today :laugh:
I could make gold & silver triple in value overnight....
.....by selling all of mine.
Me the next day -----> :GRRRR:
For those of you who advocated a huge rush to gold in your investment portfolio -
Gold today hit the lowest price since 2010 -
For those of you who advocated a huge rush to gold in your investment portfolio -Yup, China just sold a load if gold, I believe.
Gold today hit the lowest price since 2010 -
For those of you who advocated a huge rush to gold in your investment portfolio -Yup, China just sold a load if gold, I believe.
Gold today hit the lowest price since 2010 -
Yes, China did reveal this but there was a big sell of on Monday causing the price to fall by 4%.For those of you who advocated a huge rush to gold in your investment portfolio -Yup, China just sold a load if gold, I believe.
Gold today hit the lowest price since 2010 -
Nope, they revealed they have far less gold holdings than what people believed they have. However some believe it is a lie to keep the price low so they can buy more.
Gold is likely getting near a bottom now. With the world wide money printing I expect gold will do well over the coming months. Gold has been correcting from recent gains and though it is possible it could still go lower it appears to me to be putting in a bottom.
Just so everyone understand that economic collapse usually sends the price of gold lower as you can not do anything with it. You can not drive, eat it or live in it. Gold does well in inflation, low interest rates, and large scale money printing.
I am expecting to be a buyer soon.
Wiz all things go up and down. d672 In 2010 the price of gold was about a thousand dollars now it is about twice that. Gold goes up in waves and it is nice to try to pick the next wave. I think we are close to the next wave up not the end of the world. Actually I am a big believer in the long term out look for the USA.
Wiz, The doom of the US dollar has been anticipated and predicted for a long time. BUT LIKE SEX IT IS ONLY A REALITY WHEN IT HAPPENS!
Yes there are forces some external but mostly internal that may very well bring 'down' the dollar. There are some today cheering and hoping for the demise of the dollar, I consider them seriously challenged. This scenario is a nightmare. Long ago on RUA I noted the greatest danger and perhaps most lethal weapon the United States posses is its debt. That has not changed. In fact D. Trump has done a marvelous job at increasing its power.
My guess as the poem reads it will end not with a bang but rather a whimper.
AvHdb
Firstly we have to wait for you to decide who will be your next President and then we can talk...... about your comments.
The US unemployment rate fell to 7.9% in September, since hitting a historic record of 14.7% in April, the labour department announced on Friday, in the last snapshot of the jobs market ahead of the presidential election.
Take a read at: A Brief History of U.S. Debt
https://www.investopedia.com/updates/usa-national-debt/
Still dreaming about sex?
Sorry I forgot a Greek saying ...... that a hungry person always dream about food and bread!
tiphat :ROFL:
TexanHey Wiz, Tex doesn’t do wholesale copy and paste like you.
This text is definitely not yours and you forgot to post the source of the article.
When in the past I forgot to give the source... may I remind you all the attacks and comments I received over here!
If I had done the same , like you did, everybody, especially the Master of the Board, will jump on my throat.... while I am trying to make a sensible conversation.
Never mind.... Will have to read your post later, as for now I must prepare myself, because I am waiting for my granddaughters to arrive for lunch!
tiphat
I don't buy metals. They don't give dividends and the gains are fully taxed. Stocks you get a tax break.
I don't buy metals. They don't give dividends and the gains are fully taxed. Stocks you get a tax break.
I hear what you're saying about wanting to get dividends. Usually stocks which pay dividends are real expensive.
I am only buying small quantities of metals as a hedge against inflation, which I predict is going to continue to get much worse under Biden.
Can someone else with more financial experience than myself please comment on this article? Cuffy? Andrew? Thanks.
https://www.fa-mag.com/news/a-new-global-monetary-order-threatens-the-dollar-62029.html