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Author Topic: Live in FSU to study language  (Read 4541 times)

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Offline cufflinks

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Live in FSU to study language
« on: October 26, 2009, 11:31:00 AM »
Like Bill, Cuff, and some of the others the idea of sending him over to learn and enjoy a new culture sounds like a good place to start. I love the language school suggestion.

Mendy:

Perhaps we could start a new thread about Russian Language Immersion Studies programs... in my experience visiting Mexico nothing like being in the country to focus the mind and bring back the few years of Spanish I studied.

Imagine it would be even more so in Russia/Ukraine...

The programs I researched are:

Moscow Lomonosov University - MGU:
http://www.rlcentre.com/group_e.shtml

Saint Petersburg State University:
http://russian-language.org/programs.shtml

Russian Studies at Pyatigorsk State Linguistic University
http://www.pglu.ru/information/structure/management/international/en/study.php

Ukrainian Catholic University AMIGOS Language School - KIEV - Spanish, English, Russian and Ukrainian Kiev
http://languagestudy.studentuniverse.com/su-listingsp3.cfm/listing/65553/hostx/studentuniverse

Yalta:
http://www.russian-in-russia.com/english/yalta/accommodation.asp

Novosibirsk State University - Akademgorodok:
http://ciep.nsu.ru/index.htm

All programs seem reasonably priced and focused more on cultural enrichment rather than skirt chasing but since the classes are less than an hour long each day - plenty of time for both...

- also for younger people Ambergh Education offers internships with multinational companies in Russia...
http://www.russian-in-russia.com/english/news/index.asp

Could be a good way for a young man deciding on future career choices to combine finding something they would like to do with a bit of Russian adventure.  The economy in the BRIC countries is already bouncing back.

Offline Vinnvinny

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Russian language programs
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2009, 04:02:17 PM »
Alls seem reasonably priced and focused more on cultural enrichment rather than skirt chasing but since the classes are less than an hour long each day - plenty of time for both...

In your experience how easy would it be for a 23 yr old western boy who doesn't speak Russian to find work in the FSU to fund such a course, accommodation, living expenses etc?

Offline TwoBitBandit

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Russian language programs
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2009, 09:07:57 PM »
The programs I researched are:

I'm aware of at least two more:

There's a program at the Linguistic University in Nizhny Novgorod.  (http://www.lunn.ru/) Unfortunately, their web site has changed and the English-language pages seem to be down/removed.

Here's the most recent contact information I have:
Quote
Department of International Affairs
Linguistic University of Nizhny Novgorod
31-A Minin Street, Nizhny Novgorod,
603155, Russia
Phone: +7 (8312)362-049 or +7 (8312)780-939
Fax: +7 (8312)780-939
E-mail admission questions to: admissions@lunn.ru

This company offers lessons in Petersburg, Moscow and Volgograd.
http://www.russian.language.ru/livingv.htm


Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2009, 03:19:37 AM »
Quote
In your experience how easy would it be for a 23 yr old western boy who doesn't speak Russian to find work in the FSU to fund such a course, accommodation, living expenses etc?


Finding work is going to be daunting at that age. Its unlikely that he'd have some unique skill which would qualify him to work. If he is a bit entrepreneurial it might help, but such things take time and a lot of energy to find the right opportunity.

These schools have packages which includes a place to live, etc, but usually doesn't include work opportunity.

Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2009, 03:23:30 AM »
Add this excellent program to the list: The School of Russian and Asian Studies

http://www.sras.org/

Offline chivo

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Re: Russian language programs
« Reply #5 on: October 27, 2009, 03:49:44 AM »
Alls seem reasonably priced and focused more on cultural enrichment rather than skirt chasing but since the classes are less than an hour long each day - plenty of time for both...

In your experience how easy would it be for a 23 yr old western boy who doesn't speak Russian to find work in the FSU to fund such a course, accommodation, living expenses etc?

In my experience, if he has a degree, rather simple. Next question.

Offline Kimosabe

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2009, 04:09:35 AM »
Does anyone have experience with any of these programs?  Would really like to see a rating or comparison of the programs.
Yalta sounds like a great place to be while studying but is it a quality program?  You see the problem... ;D

Offline Vinnvinny

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Re: Russian language programs
« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2009, 05:19:46 AM »
Finding work is going to be daunting at that age. Its unlikely that he'd have some unique skill which would qualify him to work. If he is a bit entrepreneurial it might help, but such things take time and a lot of energy to find the right opportunity.

These schools have packages which includes a place to live, etc, but usually doesn't include work opportunity.

In my experience, if he has a degree, rather simple. Next question.

Thanks gentlemen for your answers, so it's somewhere between daunting, unlikely and simple.  I'm pleased we cleared that up so easy.  ???

Online andrewfi

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2009, 06:03:45 AM »
A few years ago I took a course at the Smolny Institute in Saint Petersburg. It was an intensvie course running across the summer.
Sadly it was very good for folks who were on for the whole course - about 6 months ab initio to being fluent enough to be able to take full part in university lectures and coursework in Russian. I know at least one guy who was able to accomplish pretty much this goal.

However it quickly became obvious that if I was there for just a few weeks tht I'd not see much benefit. Pupils on the short courses simply take the same course as full-timers and simply finish at the point at which their time ends. No effort was made to cater to reaching a degree of fluency in a shorter period. Classes were for several hours each day.
The big failing was that the course started from the perspective of teaching grammar and not vocabulary. By the end of week one we were dealing with tenses but with a vocabulary of perhaps 100 words - madness for people on a short course.
The GOOD thing was this by the endof the first week I could read Russian (not well, but enough to learn more for myself)
At the end of the second week I dropped out. If the teacher is talking about grammatic principals I do not know about in English then in Russian one is without hope. ;)

That said, by the end of a month in Saint Petersburg I was at a point of what others have called 'taxi Russian'. I could survive in a Russian speaking environment - buy food, travel, meet people and manage restaurants and shops. Probably with a similar goal then self directed learning of reading skills would probably enable others to do the same without needing to go to classes.

Is there a point to htis?
Yes, there is!

Check the kind of teaching, not just from andministrators and teachers - they have a vested interest in getting scapls, as I found ot my cost. Ask students for their opinions and research the methods used to teach them - in the classroom, not as claimed in the brochure or webpages. ;)

Oh, yes, often accommodation can be provided but put it this way...
While I was there I had several students asking me about my accommodation becasue the places they were paying to stay in fell far below their own, not unreasonable, expectations. I have stayed in student accommodation in the FSU, but not in Russia and I can tell you that it ain't nice and it ain't good. What I know of SPb student accommodation tells me that I had previously lived in a place at least the equal of that the other students were in at Smolny.

Oh, I'd also express some curiosity as to just what paid work an illiterate and dumb foreigner would get in metro Russian cities, degree or no degree. Even English teaching is gonna be hard without some TEFL training and experience.
...everything ends always well; if it’s still bad, then it’s not the end!

Offline cufflinks

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Re: Russian language programs
« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2009, 08:01:34 AM »
Alls seem reasonably priced and focused more on cultural enrichment rather than skirt chasing but since the classes are less than an hour long each day - plenty of time for both...

In your experience how easy would it be for a 23 yr old western boy who doesn't speak Russian to find work in the FSU to fund such a course, accommodation, living expenses etc?

In my experience, if he has a degree, rather simple. Next question.

To add to Chivo's point who has lived there for 6 years - That's why they are called internships - the companies get to hire bright young men and women at a reasonable fee and benefit from their positive energy and the interns get great references on their resumes if they basically show up and do a good days work... Considering what I was paid at the time for 7 days a week 24 hours a day duty 11 months a year (30 days leave per year included weekends I wanted off)  I did a 6 year internship on USN Nuclear Submarines - I dare say these multinational corporate internships would be much more fun as they are only about 40 hours per week and most interns are being evaluated for future junior executive/managerial positions.

Offline cufflinks

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2009, 08:46:23 AM »
For reference (I have no fiduciary interest in Ambergh) - based in Sweden - they charge a bit more than arranging things on your own but handle all the details and will arrange stays with local families if the Dorm concept does not work for you - of course that might crimp your dating agenda but it is an additional Russian language immersion option and of course Mendy's extensive how to behave as a guest in a Russian home will be of obvious benefit.

Link: http://www.russian-in-russia.com/english/news/index.asp

Internship with a Russian company: practice your Russian and improve your CV!

Combine your Russian studies with a corporate internship in Russia

Internship with a Russian company: practice your Russian and improve your CV!

AMBergh Education provides Russian language studies combined with internships of 2-6 months with multinational corporations in Russia.

The program is primarily designed for:

Business students specialized in accounting, corporate finance, tax and marketing

Law students in international law and tax

Students of engineering specialized in production and logistics

Strong English skills and ability to communicate in Russian are prerequisites.

Other options - Study, Intern or Volunteer:

http://www.amerispan.com/country/Russia/32

or;

http://www.studyabroad.com/programs/language/ukranian


Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2009, 09:05:46 AM »
Vinny, I'll go with Chivo based on his personal experience today.

Offline Vinnvinny

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2009, 09:50:06 AM »
Cheers again gents. I have a couple of sons of a similar age to the original OP (before it was dissected) that I could do with getting shot of so I’ll bare this info in mind. Whilst they both have degrees I’m not sure about them being bright or having positive energies so I guess they will fit in quite nicely to the multinational corporate scene. Doubt if they would want to form a career there though as the both like a good Madras 2 or 3 times a week.

Offline cufflinks

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2009, 09:57:47 AM »
Cheers again gents. I have a couple of sons of a similar age to the original OP (before it was dissected) that I could do with getting shot of so I’ll bare this info in mind. Whilst they both have degrees I’m not sure about them being bright or having positive energies so I guess they will fit in quite nicely to the multinational corporate scene. Doubt if they would want to form a career there though as the both like a good Madras 2 or 3 times a week.

Madras?  Looks like another Brit-Yank translation required... as I assume from context not:

Chennai (Tamil: சென்னை IPA: [ˈtʃɛnnəɪ]), formerly known as Madras.ogg Madras, is the capital city of the Indian state of Tamil Nadu. Chennai is the fourth most populous metropolitan area and the fifth most populous city in India. Located on the Coromandel Coast of the Bay of Bengal, Chennai city had a population of 4.34 million in the 2001 census within the area administered by the Corporation of Chennai.[4] The urban agglomeration of metropolitan Chennai has an estimated population over 8 million people.[5]

The city was established in the 17th century by the British, who developed it into a major urban centre and naval base. By the 20th century, it had become an important administrative centre, as the capital of the Madras Presidency.

Offline Vinnvinny

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2009, 10:12:43 AM »
Madras?  Looks like another Brit-Yank translation required... as I assume from context not:

Chennai (Tamil: சென்னை IPA: [ˈtʃɛnnəɪ]), formerly known as Madras.ogg Madras, is the capital city of the Indian state of Tamil Nadu. Chennai is the fourth most populous metropolitan area and the fifth most populous city in India. Located on the Coromandel Coast of the Bay of Bengal, Chennai city had a population of 4.34 million in the 2001 census within the area administered by the Corporation of Chennai.[4] The urban agglomeration of metropolitan Chennai has an estimated population over 8 million people.[5]

The city was established in the 17th century by the British, who developed it into a major urban centre and naval base. By the 20th century, it had become an important administrative centre, as the capital of the Madras Presidency.

..... it's a curry.

Offline cufflinks

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #15 on: October 27, 2009, 11:14:23 AM »
Madras?  Looks like another Brit-Yank translation required... as I assume from context not:

Chennai (Tamil: சென்னை IPA: [ˈtʃɛnnəɪ]), formerly known as Madras.ogg Madras, is the capital city of the Indian state of Tamil Nadu. Chennai is the fourth most populous metropolitan area and the fifth most populous city in India. Located on the Coromandel Coast of the Bay of Bengal, Chennai city had a population of 4.34 million in the 2001 census within the area administered by the Corporation of Chennai.[4] The urban agglomeration of metropolitan Chennai has an estimated population over 8 million people.[5]

The city was established in the 17th century by the British, who developed it into a major urban centre and naval base. By the 20th century, it had become an important administrative centre, as the capital of the Madras Presidency.

That's a relief - thought it might be some new India Pale Ale I have not tried yet :BEER:

..... it's a curry.


Offline chivo

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #16 on: October 29, 2009, 01:21:07 PM »
That said, by the end of a month in Saint Petersburg I was at a point of what others have called 'taxi Russian'. I could survive in a Russian speaking environment - buy food, travel, meet people and manage restaurants and shops. Probably with a similar goal then self directed learning of reading skills would probably enable others to do the same without needing to go to classes.

[Personal attack deleted as per TOS]

Oh, yes, often accommodation can be provided but put it this way...
While I was there I had several students asking me about my accommodation because the places they were paying to stay in fell far below their own, not unreasonable, expectations. I have stayed in student accommodation in the FSU, but not in Russia and I can tell you that it ain't nice and it ain't good. What I know of SPb student accommodation tells me that I had previously lived in a place at least the equal of that the other students were in at Smolny.


Do you have any idea what a decent 1-room flat cost in Moscow? I mean really cost, not what you can google on the internet. What I could get here because of what I know. Do you have any idea what a teacher makes at a lower level school that would accept a degreed person with no experience? Do you have any idea how many English schools are here relative to the native speakers and how big the demand for native speakers is? No.

He could easily make enough to pay for a decent flat and have enough to enjoy himself. He could also share a room in a nice flat with like minded people to lower his expenses even more if he so desired, and live much better than the people you met almost 6 years ago that's for sure. Something a 23 yr old does often without any problems.

[Personal attack deleted as per TOS] Let me tell you, its not fact. One doesn't have to live like that. Only people with very little funds, and no other money coming in. [Personal attack deleted as per TOS]

Oh, I'd also express some curiosity as to just what paid work an illiterate and dumb foreigner would get in metro Russian cities, degree or no degree. Even English teaching is gonna be hard without some TEFL training and experience.

Why is he dumb and illiterate, because you say? [Personal attack deleted as per TOS] Do you have any idea what one can make as a teacher after getting a year or two of experience under his belt? Do you have any idea what is taught at the native level at these schools? No you don't.

Oh, you'll reply that you know about this and that, blah, blah, blah, but you don't know. This is very apparent to me.

[Personal information deleted as per TOS] Living in Russia and living in Estonia are two completely different situations.

If you don't know what you're talking about, and in this case you don't, leave the guessing at the door and let the people who actually know what they're talking about give the advice.


Offline cufflinks

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #17 on: October 29, 2009, 05:25:30 PM »
Chivo -

I for one am willing to admit my ignorance of how things really are there now in the current economy - rather than years ago - at best I can learn what I read in Pravda english version or translating local Russian on line city newspapers with babelfish or google translate which we all know tends to loose much nuance and meaning in the often literal machine translations.

That said many of us are here to learn from those like you with real on the ground expertise and I for one would actually like to know many of the things you spoke of  - that we know we really do not know - if you would care to share here...

Sincerely,

Cufflinks

Online andrewfi

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #18 on: October 30, 2009, 11:10:08 AM »
[Personal attack deleted as per TOS]

Cufflinks there are always internships of various kinds floating around. I do not know how things are in the US in exact terms but in Europe they tend to become available by the 3rd year of a four year degree and are usually quite closely tied to the subject under study. So, in a similar manner to that which applies to older guys wanting to work in the FSU the ability to make such a change is often a situational one. If one is studying the right stuff at the right time then opportunities pop up so if one wants to do an internship one pretty much needed to be making choices about one´s study path with a view to the potential career paths and opportunities. This does rather restrict the availability of such courses in practical terms.

The example that you shared seems a little odd but it does specify that Russian should already be a part of an applicant´s skill set so they´d likely already have been through something in the FSU. It is not for ab initio Russian speakers. I somehow doubt that these are internships in the sense that most students would understand them but I am sure they offer valuable experience to those wishing to pursue an FSU based career.
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Offline msmoby

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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #19 on: October 31, 2009, 01:39:34 AM »
Wow... this thread has been 'calmed down'.... it was MUCH more 'fun' before ;)
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Re: Live in FSU to study language
« Reply #20 on: October 31, 2009, 09:54:10 AM »
If these chaps want a bun fight to argue who was once the most impecunious between them or anything else, they can have a topic to do it in.  :-\ 

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