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Author Topic: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?  (Read 71795 times)

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Offline shakespear

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Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« on: January 12, 2009, 07:49:37 AM »
Thought this might be an interesting topic for discussion.  We all know that living life on a fixed pension in Russia, especially in light of the current revival of inflation is certainly not an easy thing to do.  Children, especially if they're only children may have provided financial support for their parents while they were living in Russia.  After they're married and moved to their new country they still feel that same obligation.

So how do you handle it?  What suggestions do you have for others when confronted with this request from your wife?  Are there other things you do to provide financial support to your in laws?

I know we send $300 per month to my wife's parents.  The bank charges $6 for a foreign ATM withdrawl so the total is $306 per month.  They use some of this money to pay the fees and taxes on my wife's apartment in Volgograd but the rest is for them to spend as they wish.

How about others?
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Offline GreyScales

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2009, 08:17:54 AM »
Thought this might be an interesting topic for discussion.  We all know that living life on a fixed pension in Russia, especially in light of the current revival of inflation is certainly not an easy thing to do.  Children, especially if they're only children provided financial support for their parents while they were living in Russia.  After they're married and moved to their new country they still feel that same obligation.

So how do you handle it?  What suggestions do you have for others when confronted with this request from your wife?  Are there other things you do to provide financial support to your in laws?

I know we send $300 per month to my wife's parents.  The ban charges $6 for a foreign ATM withdrawl so the total ins $306 per month.  They use some of this money to pay the fees and taxes on my wife's apartment in Volgograd but the rest is for them to spend as they wish.

How about others?

Howe about

Apologies for replying but not yet being married :)

"G" and I have talked about this already ourselves.  She contributes about $200 towards her half of the Apartment she and mom own.  The dollar amount varies based on expenses - but this covers the cost of the mortgage and utilities.  She and I have already talked that we will continue sending this money each month once G arrives here.

As for "how" we'll get money to her mom...  I purchased a GreenDot travel Visa credit card and got a second physical card in G's name.  I gave G this card and use it to send money to G for her Visa stuff and for English classes and such.

We've talked that G will give the card to her Mom when she comes to America.  This will allow us to send mom money that Mom can withdraw from any ATM.

The fee for withdrawing money internationally is like $4 each transaction.  They charge like $2 if you do a balance check, and charge a flat $4.95 a month fee for the account.

This isn't the only card of this type available.  I felt the fees were reasonable and would make it so G and I can send mom money any time we/she needs it.  And the fees weren't out of the world - especially when compared to things like Western Union...

just my 2 kopeks


GS

Offline Bobalouie

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2009, 08:19:37 AM »
My wife rents her flat out (she owns it outright) and her parents keep that money if they need it, and if they dont, they send it to my wife.
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Offline shakespear

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2009, 08:30:09 AM »
As for "how" we'll get money to her mom...  I purchased a GreenDot travel Visa credit card and got a second physical card in G's name.  I gave G this card and use it to send money to G for her Visa stuff and for English classes and such.  We've talked that G will give the card to her Mom when she comes to America.  This will allow us to send mom money that Mom can withdraw from any ATM.  The fee for withdrawing money internationally is like $4 each transaction.  They charge like $2 if you do a balance check, and charge a flat $4.95 a month fee for the account. 

We just use a regular bank ATM card (no Visa or debit card).  She kept the one that my wife used while she was living in Russia.  Every couple of years the bank replaces them and we either bring the replacement over when we travel or recruit someone to "packmule" it over to her.  Many don't know this but it is illegal to send bankcards thru the mail to Russia and Ukraine. 

For the longest time withdrawl in dollars from the local Alfa Bank ATM on my account in the USA carried no fee.  ZERO COST.  But when our bank was bought by National City, they instigated a 2% fee for foreign bank ATM withdrawls.  That means a $300 withdrawl costs $6.  Reasonable when you consider the alternatives.     
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Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2009, 09:02:29 AM »
Excellent topic, SS.  My MIL lives in our Moscow home and our situation is somewhat similar to Bobalouie's arrangement, but sometimes we send $ and use a Visa card with withdrawal limits in case the card is lost or stolen.  

I think this is worthy of being discussed because of the cultural aspects.  Often we think of the FSU as a place where the idea of "from he who has the most to him who has the least" was only practiced during the 78 years of Communism.

But given the serfdom life before the revolution, this idea of sharing within a larger group is well over 1,000 years old in Slavic practice....that being one of the reasons why the idea of group living in apartments and on farms was an easy transition for many.  For a large percentage of citizens, it was simply a change of focus from factory/farm owner to state ownership.  Somebody else did the "owning" and much of the lifestyle remained constant.

It's not uncommon to share expenses across a broad extended family. Uncle Boris needs an operation and some extra money must be paid to the doctor--money will come from family members even out of town and the only expectation regarding repayment is "I helped you today, and because we're family, in time of need you'll help me later."

When a lady comes to the West she may be very surprised to learn how "individualistic" is Western society where we each take care of our own problems and are reluctant to ask family members for financial assistance.  Our mindset in the West is "independence" versus the mindset in the East is of being "connected." That fuels differences in how we raise children, relate to extended family, and even to business and politics.

One of my closest American friends is going thru a situation where his youngest son had been unemployed 3 months and moved back home.  He just found a job and my friend can't wait for the young man to get an apartment and move out into "independence" again.  This is not exactly how many Russian/Ukrainian families would feel given the same scenario.  Even with a reasonable desire to have an apartment of one's own, the parents would feel a great deal of reluctance in letting go.

Thusly, sending mother/father a few shillings each month not only helps ease her mind about their welfare, but helps her feel "connected" to her family. In harsh truth, her marriage to you has helped support her extended family.  That is foreign to us, but very intimate and normal to her understanding of how it should work. And when a man resists, if a wife sees that the resources are there, she doesn't see it in terms of independence but rather given centuries of cultural conditioning she quickly comes to the conclusion that he is "greedy." If she were home, it might be reason enough to exit a marriage.  Living across the oceans makes it harder to exit, but can certainly damage a marriage relationship.

If the resources for sharing are not there, she may wonder if the marriage was a mistake since in her culture a "good marriage" is often not only about love, but also about ability to care for a family, including contributing from time to time in extended family context.  A WM can argue all he wants that he is supporting his "family" but in her cultural mindset "family" is much more than "the two of us."

Fallout number 1: a man on a limited income must realize that this venture is more than just about affording air travel and costs of her Visa and green card.

Fallout number 2: WM talk a lot about finding a "traditional" lady without really understanding what that means. If she is "traditional" she may be what I've outlined above and that is something a man should understand before he begins the journey.

Offline BCARTR

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2009, 11:56:05 AM »
My wife owns an apartment in Ukraine.  When she moved to the US, her sisters family moved in. This helped them as they did not have to pay rent anymore. Wife is not charging them rent, however they do have to pay the utilities and taxes. But it is better then what they had before.

I spent alot of time in Ukraine with the five trips I took, I came to love her grandparents so every now and then I send $100 or so via Western Union(Grand parents do not work).  This is my decision and not the wifey.
However we do send money for birthdays/christmas etc.... I usually add it on top of the money I send the grandmother with a note on what to do with the rest.  Actually Anya does this part. lol.
TR.

Offline Wild Orchid

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2009, 02:50:24 AM »
de ja vu? is it an old thread revived or what?

Offline Boris

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2009, 03:47:49 AM »
de ja vu? is it an old thread revived or what?

We run out of new things to talk about. :)

Offline MBS01

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2009, 05:13:58 AM »
Different approach:
For us this is a none issue as her family is comfortable by say both FSU, or western standards.  Also other family members in Russia are in similar circumstances to the in-laws in Ukraine.

However we do send parcels with local items for family members and friends a few times a year.  Items with Canadian logos are great and they enjoy them.  Also health products (FIL is diebetic) and some local teas here are not availabe in the FSU like they are in the chinese market here.

For example her brother wants some warm winter slippers to wear at home a the floors are colder there.  Lora found some on sale yesterday so will send the along later.

Recently we sent off a parcel to Lora's grandmother in Russia on the border with Estonia.  Grandmother is blind and was born back in the time of the Tzars.  Up until recently her oldest son saw to a lot of her needs, but as reported in the thread about "Her Orthodox Faith" he passed away not so very long ago himself.  There is another Aunt of Lora's not too far away that does see to grandmother's needs and the Monastery where her son is buried still sees to her food needs ec. too.  Again many memers of the family seeing to he needs of the family elders.

A few years ago Lora's brother visited and this past summer a family friend visited us here in Toronto. We helped with providing a place to stay and some expences while thery were here.  However travel expenses and others costs they paid forthemselves.

So in summery not everyone in the FSU is dirt poor so to speak.  There are a number of middle income families there just like here.

Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2009, 09:43:03 AM »
Quote
not everyone in the FSU is dirt poor so to speak.  There are a number of middle income families there just like here.

Obviously.  And there are some wealthy Russians, and Ukrainians, too.  Forbes lists more millionaires in Moscow that just about anywhere else in the world.

However, this doesn't change a cultural perspective.  A wife's feelings about sharing resources with extended family members from time to time will be in large part driven by cultural conditioning as well as current balance sheets and men should be aware off the cultural nuances when getting into this deal.


Offline cufflinks

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2009, 07:39:18 PM »
Quote
not everyone in the FSU is dirt poor so to speak.  There are a number of middle income families there just like here.

Obviously.  And there are some wealthy Russians, and Ukrainians, too.  Forbes lists more millionaires in Moscow that just about anywhere else in the world.

However, this doesn't change a cultural perspective.  A wife's feelings about sharing resources with extended family members from time to time will be in large part driven by cultural conditioning as well as current balance sheets and men should be aware off the cultural nuances when getting into this deal.



Mendy - how much a year would a smart AM put aside for such family expenses?  Could put aisde some of my Vegas or Honolulu mad money!

Offline Wild Orchid

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2009, 08:04:49 PM »
However, this doesn't change a cultural perspective.  A wife's feelings about sharing resources with extended family members from time to time will be in large part driven by cultural conditioning as well as current balance sheets and men should be aware off the cultural nuances when getting into this deal.

is there much difference in cultures? When my in laws were living in their house my husband paid for all house repairs, quite often he paid for rates, etc... Wouldn't you help your parents if they needed it?

Offline Bobalouie

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2009, 08:36:02 PM »
However, this doesn't change a cultural perspective.  A wife's feelings about sharing resources with extended family members from time to time will be in large part driven by cultural conditioning as well as current balance sheets and men should be aware off the cultural nuances when getting into this deal.

is there much difference in cultures? When my in laws were living in their house my husband paid for all house repairs, quite often he paid for rates, etc... Wouldn't you help your parents if they needed it?

Of course we would.
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Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2009, 08:51:20 PM »
W/O, as you're perhaps learning in the West there are strong feelings of independence and freedom whereas in the East there is a strong culture of interdependence and being connected.  Most WM look forward to the day when children will leave home and be independent. Eastern parents do to an extent because it's natural but look at how much longer a Russian child lives with parents versus the West.

I've seen (and experienced) an extended Russian family pooling resources so someone could have an operation or afford a large apartment repair bill.  Cousins, aunts, etc.  How often have you seen that in your time of Western living?

Culture and money always intersect at some point.  Most men on a forum like this are different in that they care and are preparing for how to have a good relationship.  But even for us, we're not used to sending $ back home to parents every month.  Guys who don't participate in places like this one and who go over quickly to bring home the arm candy and could care less about preparation and her culture are not for the most part going to enjoy sending a single penny back to Russia.

Most men, if we lived with our parents, would step in if our parents needed help.  Home remodeling, yes especially if it made the home more secure and safe for an elderly parent. But depending on the parents financial situation some might rather share those expenses with a parent.  What I don't see in the West is 2-3 children pooling resources to help Mom/Dad each month.  It's more common to have one child who helps and the other 2 say they don't have the ability.

A RW with an elderly Mom who is barely surviving will want to help mom on a consistent basis. Many Western husbands may feel like that wasn't part of the bargain. WO, if your dear mother was in failing health back home and her finances depleted and her situation dire, if your husband bulked at helping, how long would you allow your Mom to suffer before you made a difficult choice and went back?

But it goes even further than a parent in dire circumstances.  If a RW arrives in the West, and the parent is back home perhaps not in dire circumstances but in a life much more basic that the RW, her desire will be to help make life more secure for her parents.  That seems normal to many of us.  But you'd be amazed at the attitudes of many Westerners who would feel this wife ungrateful for what her WM has provided.  Many would say that her concern for her parents unfounded. 

Offline Wild Orchid

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2009, 09:30:17 PM »
W/O, as you're perhaps learning in the West there are strong feelings of independence and freedom whereas in the East there is a strong culture of interdependence and being connected.  Most WM look forward to the day when children will leave home and be independent. Eastern parents do to an extent because it's natural but look at how much longer a Russian child lives with parents versus the West.
here in Au we have many families with grown up children still living at parents home. Nothing unusual at all. In Russia young people live with parents more often because they don't have any other choices. Rent is not as affordable as it is in the West.  There is no such thing as shared accommodation in Russia. Young couple can rent a flat, bunch of young mates - no way, but it happens here all the time.

Quote
I've seen (and experienced) an extended Russian family pooling resources so someone could have an operation or afford a large apartment repair bill.  Cousins, aunts, etc.  How often have you seen that in your time of Western living?
I've never seen anything like that in Russia.. Cousins? Aunts? Not even heard about relatives of that type helping with repair bill. In my family help comes in the case of funeral, with ordinary stuff everyone deals on their own. The same in all other families I know. Parents and children are helping to each other, but distant relatives? You are too optimistic about Russian families I think

Quote
Culture and money always intersect at some point.  Most men on a forum like this are different in that they care and are preparing for how to have a good relationship.  But even for us, we're not used to sending $ back home to parents every month.  Guys who don't participate in places like this one and who go over quickly to bring home the arm candy and could care less about preparation and her culture are not for the most part going to enjoy sending a single penny back to Russia.
Well, I don't send money every months. I did send to my family members when somebody died. My mom is a pensioner with pension of 4500 rubles. She has my debit card and can take money any time she wants, which means almost never. She probably takes around $500 a year, she did it for her birthday when few of her sisters were coming for visit, to buy a coat, things like that. I don't know anyone who'd be sending $300 every months. But I've heard that some parents demanding money from their daughters. My mom is other way around, you have to make her to take them.

Quote
Most men, if we lived with our parents, would step in if our parents needed help.  Home remodeling, yes especially if it made the home more secure and safe for an elderly parent. But depending on the parents financial situation some might rather share those expenses with a parent.  What I don't see in the West is 2-3 children pooling resources to help Mom/Dad each month.  It's more common to have one child who helps and the other 2 say they don't have the ability.
The same was happening with my husband, he is oldest out of 3 children and he was the one who paid for everything. But when his father died and mother was afraid to live on her own (though capable in my view, she wasn't old at all by Western standarts), nursing home or retirement village was out of the question, she didn't want to live there with her 3 children alive and well, so her daughter took her in and lives with her for a few years by now, poor thing... I lasted only 2 months  :innocent:

Quote
A RW with an elderly Mom who is barely surviving will want to help mom on a consistent basis. Many Western husbands may feel like that wasn't part of the bargain. WO, if your dear mother was in failing health back home and her finances depleted and her situation dire, if your husband bulked at helping, how long would you allow your Mom to suffer before you made a difficult choice and went back?
it would be up to my mom judgment. She is very determent woman and has problems with accepting help. I will never find out if she needs it from her, only from her sisters and all of them live far away. Saying that we don't treat my MIL any differently. If she needs help, she gets it. There was no question about that. And I'm sure you won't let your mother suffer.

Quote
But you'd be amazed at the attitudes of many Westerners who would feel this wife ungrateful for what her WM has provided.  Many would say that her concern for her parents unfounded. 
My mom doesn't live in the hut somewhere in Thailand or Fillipines. I'm not trying to bring her living standarts up to mine, she doesn't want it. I didn't get the phrase about attitude of Westerners and ungratefulness at all. Nobody here is interested what I do for my mom, nobody ever asked me about it, it is non of their business and I don't think any one would care.

Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #15 on: January 14, 2009, 10:17:09 PM »
Cufflinks, I think it depends on the family and if there are needs, if so how much can you send.  Some, as WO points out may not want it.  Others may need it.  And of course you can only give what you can share and for each that will be different. 

With all due respect to Wild Orchid, this is common in Russia and there are some situations where it's a very good thing to help Mom back home.  If she is eating one meal a day and having to choose between food or heat, then most of us would want to be involved.  If she's doing okay and just needs a winter coat once in a while that's okay too.

I know a guy in the US who lost his job last year and his wife's Russian family was sending them a few bucks monthly until he got back up on his feet.  Other families in our church send $100-250 back on a regular basis. A very close church buddy of mine is very concerned about his MIL who is quite elderly and starting to fall down, forget to turn off the kitchen stove gas, etc.  They are thinking of paying a small stipend to another older relative, not as elderly, to move it with the lady.

Our family has a very elderly widowed relative who we all chip in, from my wife and I to my MIL to 2 cousins.  It's next to nothing when several of us contribute whatever she needs.  Her only child died years ago and if we don't.....

Offline Wild Orchid

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #16 on: January 14, 2009, 11:43:26 PM »
With all due respect to Wild Orchid, this is common in Russia and there are some situations where it's a very good thing to help Mom back home.  If she is eating one meal a day and having to choose between food or heat, then most of us would want to be involved.  If she's doing okay and just needs a winter coat once in a while that's okay too.

What are you implaying? Who is having one meal a day? I don't know people like that. If your mother had one meal a day, wouldn't you help her? Everyone would... So what does it have to do with the culture? You are so fond of cultural differences, but this is all coming to human nature and normal people help to each other everywhere. If I learn that one of my aunties has one meal a day I'd help her even though I may be haven't seen her for 20 years or so and don't really have a relationship with her, and it is not because I'm Russian. Many people help their families here as well.

And don't forget, there are some people who don't need it but still want it. Many men married to young women in their 20-s, so it makes parents to be in their 40-s.. The father of the family should be at the pick of his career, help him just because he is in Russia? Unfortunately some families really demand financial help, I'm lucky that I have different sort of problems. My mother keeps saying, you always dreamed of travelling, so spend your money on that, I'm fine. And if my mother-pensioner can be fine, I don't see why working parents can't be.  At the same time I have nothing against help, I'm helping myself.

Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2009, 12:56:14 AM »
WO, are you implying that there are no cultural differences between East and West in human nature and family relationships?  I'm not talking about the common sense stuff, I talking about differences in focus.

I'm glad you eat more than one meal a day and I don't know anyone who does either.  Well, I take that back.  Sometimes my wife gets busy and when she is focused, food is the last thing she thinks about in her routine.  But you know what I mean.

We're not talking about working parents either and I thought you might have understood that.  But anyway, I'm happy to know that "down under" the culture is just like Russia.  Who woulda thought!   :hidechair:


Offline Chillidog

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #18 on: January 20, 2009, 05:55:13 PM »

Many don't know this but it is illegal to send bankcards thru the mail to Russia and Ukraine. 

Shakes,

have you ever looked at using a card/service such as something like this to send money;

https://www.ikobo.com/
"If you want others to be happy, practice compassion. If you want to be happy, practice compassion."

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Offline shakespear

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #19 on: January 20, 2009, 06:22:15 PM »
Shakes,

have you ever looked at using a card/service such as something like this to send money;

https://www.ikobo.com/ 

No.  The fees look more than double what I'm paying now with my simple atm bank card. 
"If you obey all the rules, you miss all the fun" - Katharine Hepburn

Offline Chillidog

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #20 on: January 20, 2009, 06:45:05 PM »

No.  The fees look more than double what I'm paying now with my simple atm bank card. 

not in your position (married) but when you wrote about "illegal" to send credit cards. So i have not look into all the details (right now really don't have anything to compare it to) like you have with sending money.  I thought of this becuase I have saved the link for this type of possible future. so I thought I run past you incase it was something that would work better than your current method. who knows it might work better for someone else out there.

any ways just trying to help or give options as I know you viewed it that way and responded accordingly. and you in return have done the same for me in the past, and will most likely do again for me in the future
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Offline Manny

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #21 on: January 21, 2009, 04:40:08 AM »
My wife rents her flat out (she owns it outright) and her parents keep that money if they need it, and if they dont, they send it to my wife.

We have a similar kind of model to Boba.

Here is a twist: my wife knows of two different women, married to English guys in England, and the women's parents send them money from Russia. One mother recently sent her daughter the $1000 to renew her UK visa because her husband had no cash.  :o
Read a trip report from North Korea >>here<< - Read a trip report from South Korea, China and Hong Kong >>here<<

Look what the American media makes some people believe:
Putin often threatens to strike US with nuclear weapons.

Offline MrMann

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #22 on: January 21, 2009, 05:51:49 AM »
What is the cheapest way of sending money to Russia?

My girlfriend has said she will want to send some money back to her mum once she starts working.

Is there any way of doing this cheaper than the £20 banks charge for international transfers?

Offline Chris

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #23 on: January 21, 2009, 05:57:03 AM »
What is the cheapest way of sending money to Russia?

My girlfriend has said she will want to send some money back to her mum once she starts working.

Is there any way of doing this cheaper than the £20 banks charge for international transfers?

I got a non credit status Visa card from Virgin, costs a tenner and used that, I gave it to my wife in Ukraine prior to our wedding so she could use money for whatever she wanted to use it for, in shops etc or withdraw cash from an ATM in local currency, very little if any ongoing costs and I could top it up direct from my bank.

The only problem I had was getting my wife to actually spend money  ::) however, she is still the same even now she is in the UK  :party0011:
Слава Україні

Offline MrMann

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Re: Do You Send Money Back To Her Family And If So, How Much?
« Reply #24 on: January 21, 2009, 07:20:11 AM »
Thanks Chris, hadn't thought of that option.

Seems like there are a lot of cards, some charging a flat £3 fee for withdrawals, some a percentage.

Found this site which might be of use to others too:

[link removed at website owners request]


 

 

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