The World's #1 Russian, Ukrainian & Eastern European Discussion & Information Forum - RUA!

This Is the Premier Discussion Forum on the Net for Information and Discussion about Russia, Ukraine, Eastern Europe and the Former Soviet Union. Discuss Culture, Politics, Travelling, Language, International Relationships and More. Chat with Travellers, Locals, Residents and Expats. Ask and Answer Questions about Travel, Culture, Relationships, Applying for Visas, Translators, Interpreters, and More. Give Advice, Read Trip Reports, Share Experiences and Make Friends.

Author Topic: My Story of Stupidity, Poor Judgement & Thinking with the Penis & Not The Brain  (Read 19982 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline shakespear

  • Supporting Member
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 8136
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Status: Just Looking
  • Trips: 20+
Well, yes. If effect you married a stranger. MOB version of Russian roulette with five bullets in a six chamber pistol. 

Yep.  Exactly.  I think the name I selected for this thread was totally appropriate.
"If you obey all the rules, you miss all the fun" - Katharine Hepburn

Offline Wild Orchid

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3682
  • Country: au
  • Gender: Female
So, if I understand this correctly, you had in total 1 hour of face-to-face time and dinner together before proposing? 

Yep.  Really stupid wasn't I?

She would never ever got her visa if you were Australian. Strange immi. regulations you've got there in USA

Offline Norwegian Viking

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 587
  • Country: 00
  • Gender: Male
  • Trips: 1-5
I work as a lawyer and one day this asian woman (thai, by the look of her) came in and tried to book some sort of appointment. She spoke so badly Norwegian that I was unsure what it was all about, but when she came with her husband I learned she had wanted a divorce.

The husband had told her that she wasn`t entitled to anything as the couple had not accumulated any wealth worth mentioning during the marriage and the property you own before the marriage stays with you after a divorce according to Norwegian law.
We told the couple the same thing, as she didn`t believe her husband, and the look on her face was priceless! :)

This was on a Friday and on Monday she called me at my office. I couldn`t understand a word she was saying, so she put her husband on. He quickly said that I could stop working on the divorce papers as they had decided to stay married after all.

Why this man wanted to stay married to a woman who had stayed just long enough to get citizenship and then take as much of his money as possible is beyond me.
It is also beyond me why you didn`t get divorced halfway through chapter 1, but I guess I`m way more proud and cynical than you, and maybe that`s even worse than being naive. I also tend to bear a grudge and would have refused to have sex with my wife, no matter how hot she was, simply out of spite if she had done 10% of the things you were a victim of to me. As I said, this might not necessarily be a good trait  ::)


Offline shakespear

  • Supporting Member
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 8136
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Status: Just Looking
  • Trips: 20+
If any of you are curious, I recently came accross this now current picture of Luba, my former step-daughter now nearly 19.  

I think I got off lucky 10 years ago.  No, she's not dressed for a costume party, that's the way she normally looks - total goth.  Can you imagine living in a house with this?
"If you obey all the rules, you miss all the fun" - Katharine Hepburn

Offline Voyager

  • Meмber
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 5212
  • Gender: Male
If any of you are curious, I recently came accross this now current picture of Luba, my former step-daughter now nearly 19.  

I think I got off lucky 10 years ago.  No, she's not dressed for a costume party, that's the way she normally looks - total goth.  Can you imagine living in a house with this?

Yikes!  :o

Offline RG

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2416
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouses Country: Now the US
  • Status: Married
Oof!

Good riddance to both of them.

Offline clancyhound

  • Member
  • Posts: 129
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouses Country: Russia / USA
  • Status: Engaged
  • Trips: 5-10
Thanks for sharing your experieance.

After reading the posts in this forum, Im thinking of just looking for a AW.


Offline dbneeley

  • RIP
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1671
  • Country: ua
  • Gender: Male
Thanks for sharing your experieance.

After reading the posts in this forum, Im thinking of just looking for a AW.



There are countless similar stories among those who never left home and found a mate locally, from their own cultures. The divorce courts are full of them, after all.

However, I will grant you this is not a venture for everyone. If you are timid, for example, it would indeed be best to stay home. If you have to have everything handed to you, too, your chances aren't very good for long-term happiness this way.

At the same time, the qualities that make for success in seeking a mate abroad are often largely the same as the qualities that give you a better chance of being truly happy when seeking a mate next door. If you think you are deficient in those areas, your time may be best spent in working on yourself no matter where you choose to look.

The only "advantage" you have in looking locally is that you understand the culture better, enough that you may *think* you can avoid problems. The operative word is "think"--otherwise, the divorce rate would be much lower.

If a few stories of how others have made some classic mistakes are enough to scare you off rather than becoming determined to learn from the experiences of others--and avoid those problems--then you would be doing exactly the right thing to abandon the effort. Leave the field to those who are confident, adventurous, and determined.

David



Offline Ralph Kramden

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 566
  • Gender: Male
Send the Goth Girl a few Black Sabbath albums and she will remain a friend for life. In my day long hair and jeans were thought to be outrageous.
One of these days, Alice. Pow! Zoom! To the moon.

Offline skiingandrunning

  • Meмber
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 829
  • Gender: Male
Quote
If a few stories of how others have made some classic mistakes are enough to scare you off rather than becoming determined to learn from the experiences of others--and avoid those problems--then you would be doing exactly the right thing to abandon the effort. Leave the field to those who are confident, adventurous, and determined.

David,

Would you not agree that reading about these train wrecks and classic mistakes should make a person think with the correct head and they might realize that they do not want to add the burden of distance, language, and potential uncertainty of motive to ones dating life.  I think in most cases, they would probably realize that there is no need to complicate life any more than what dating in the domestic market bring (as you write correctly, similar type train wrecks can happen if you meet someone locally, but they usually do not include GCG's) and there is nothing wrong with the decision.

Offline Vinnvinny

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 5674
  • Country: england
  • Gender: Male
  • Trips: 20+
If any of you are curious, I recently came accross this now current picture of Luba, my former step-daughter now nearly 19.  

I think I got off lucky 10 years ago.  No, she's not dressed for a costume party, that's the way she normally looks - total goth.  Can you imagine living in a house with this?

Gawd, I must be so liberal and easy going as I would have no problems whatsoever if any of my daughters grew up looking like that young lady. There are so many other more important things than dress sense that I wouldn’t want them to be.

Offline BelleZeBoob

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1508
  • Country: ca
  • Gender: Female
  • Status: Dating
[
The only "advantage" you have in looking locally is that you understand the culture better, enough that you may *think* you can avoid problems. The operative word is "think"--otherwise, the divorce rate would be much lower.

 

In my opinion, the only advantage in local dating would be the short distance, that allows people to communicate more often and better, and to spend as much eye-to-eye time together as they can. I'd say culture in many cases would not be an issue, especially if you talk about internationally versed Russian professional women. They may be just like your next door upper-middle-class AW, but with Russian appearance, education, romanticism and a pinch of Russian mystery. :)

 The differences in culture are there, but as soon as you come across  and face them, you note and understand them, so that next time they are recognizable and already 'yours', they are not the differences any more, if I put the issue correctly.
Men are like Bluetooth: he is connected to you when you are nearby, but searches for other devices when you are away.
Women are like Wi-Fi: she sees all available devices, but connects to the strongest one.

Offline froid

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2134
  • Country: ca
  • Gender: Male
  • Status: Married
Quote
In my opinion, the only advantage in local dating would be the short distance, that allows people to communicate more often and better, and to spend as much eye-to-eye time together as they can.

And local dating means less paperwork too! 
Look, we're gonna spend half the night driving around the Hills looking for this one party and you're going to say it sucks and we're all gonna leave and then we're gonna go look for this other party. But all the parties and all the bars, they all suck. <-Same goes for forums!

Offline dbneeley

  • RIP
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1671
  • Country: ua
  • Gender: Male
Quote
If a few stories of how others have made some classic mistakes are enough to scare you off rather than becoming determined to learn from the experiences of others--and avoid those problems--then you would be doing exactly the right thing to abandon the effort. Leave the field to those who are confident, adventurous, and determined.

David,

Would you not agree that reading about these train wrecks and classic mistakes should make a person think with the correct head and they might realize that they do not want to add the burden of distance, language, and potential uncertainty of motive to ones dating life.  I think in most cases, they would probably realize that there is no need to complicate life any more than what dating in the domestic market bring (as you write correctly, similar type train wrecks can happen if you meet someone locally, but they usually do not include GCG's) and there is nothing wrong with the decision.

No, I am not so sure I would agree with that. In my experience, most people who read of the "train wrecks" fall into one of several categories:

--Those who won't learn from the mistakes of others, and go ahead and make the same mistakes themselves.

--Those who are scared off, and who often should be as they are often not very good at this "social interaction" thing to begin with.

--Those who read, and heed, the real lessons of these stories and usually avoid similar things happening to them.

Those who fail at this often would say "there's no way to avoid a real scammer". In most cases, though, the signs were there relatively early on--they were simply ignored. To be naive and gullible is some people's lot in life, and often they will be taken advantage of in many ways over the years if they fail to learn.

Certainly you are correct that it is every person's right to pursue an international relationship or not to. Just don't try to justify yourself with "it's too hard" or "I couldn't avoid a scammer" or whatnot. How "hard" it is depends upon the level of commitment and the priorities you have in your life. Financially, it is simple to spend the same amount of money dating locally when all is said and done.

I am also fairly well convinced that finding and marrying the right person *should* be hard at least to a degree. It's too darned easy to fall into a marriage without doing the work necessary to give it the best chance of being mutually fulfilling over a long period of years.

I should add that I was a family law attorney for about ten years, and handled hundreds of divorces. Thus, my view is at least a little different from most of you. So many people want things to be "easy" that they marry the wrong person. Then, often with one or more kids on the ground, they seek an "easy" divorce--often severely impacting the children in the process.

So--if you or any man should opt for "easy" then by all means avoid a bicultural marriage. In fact, staying single is often the "easiest" course of all. That way, you certainly avoid the cost, the paperwork, the hassle, and the chance of being hurt.

David

Offline alenika

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2346
  • Country: ge
  • Gender: Female
If any of you are curious, I recently came accross this now current picture of Luba, my former step-daughter now nearly 19.  

I think I got off lucky 10 years ago.  No, she's not dressed for a costume party, that's the way she normally looks - total goth.  Can you imagine living in a house with this?
What? you don't like FSU woman?? But as you know we all are old-fashioned, like to cook and to please  :reading:
I close eyes to see better

Offline skiingandrunning

  • Meмber
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 829
  • Gender: Male
Quote
So--if you or any man should opt for "easy" then by all means avoid a bicultural marriage.


David,

Again, I agree with most of what you write as you contribute a lot of positive and interesting information to RUA, but (IMHO) I think many men are drawn to a relationship with an FSUW because it's advertised as "easy" for a not so attractive and maybe older man to come home with stunning young model.  It's the very premise that the man does not need to really improve himself to compete for the women he wants that makes this relationship path attractive to many (I'll even admit that seeing a rough looking old man with a smokinhotkova, at the theatre one night, made me think, "if he can manage that, what can I do").  But, as we all know, to do it right will take much more time and effort than a one or two week visit to her country allows (what many might only be able to afford) as we need to get to know the true person and that takes time and effort and it's this "time and effort" that seems to be often bypassed by those going the MOB route.  Yes, your counter point is correct as the same person might bypass it in their own country, but if reading about the train wrecks can make them realize that an FSUW is not any easier, therefore, saving them a lot of time and treasure and the telling of even more train wrecks then the stories have served a point and the person should be complimented for making the right decision for themselves.  

Now if you go through with the process and take the time to get to know the person and follow Shaky's rules (getting this post back on topic), you have a chance to meet a really nice, intelligent, and interesting person who will probably be more than a little different (for me it's interesting) from those who you date locally.

Shakespear, related to your rules I think you nailed it with both 1 & 6 as far too often people ignore these feelings and it comes back and haunts them later.

Quote
1)  If you see a "red flag" in the relationship; address and resolve it or walk away and start over.  It will not get better with the passage of time or after she "adjusts" to life in the new country or any number of other rationales you might use to ignore or postpone dealing with the problem.  

6)  Be prepared to walk away from the relationship AT ANY AND EVERY STAGE of the relationship if you feel things aren't going right or you get a "gut feeling" something is wrong.  This would mean anywhere in the process from the first date up to the walking down the aisle.  If you're feeling this way, there almost always IS something wrong in the relationship.  





Offline Wild Orchid

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3682
  • Country: au
  • Gender: Female
I think I got off lucky 10 years ago.  No, she's not dressed for a costume party, that's the way she normally looks - total goth.  Can you imagine living in a house with this?

with the photos you posted it is a piece of cake to find your stepdaughter in the net.



I think she is very-very creative, very interesting person and very attractive as well. Would you rather live with some mousy creature?



[Mod edit: WO compressed the link so it fit the page - Brass :) ]

Offline dbneeley

  • RIP
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1671
  • Country: ua
  • Gender: Male

David,

Again, I agree with most of what you write as you contribute a lot of positive and interesting information to RUA, but (IMHO) I think many men are drawn to a relationship with an FSUW because it's advertised as "easy" for a not so attractive and maybe older man to come home with stunning young model.    



I must be from another planet than the fools who would accept advertising puffery as legitimate fact without extensive "due diligence" on my part.

I'll be the same guys have houses full of crap from the "As seen on TV" places, although most of them do not, in fact, work as advertised.

As I said previously, those who are naive and gullible are often taken advantage of through life, yet far too few learn from the experience.

I, too, saw an old man closely resembling a gnome with one of the most gorgeous women I have ever seen. Of course, this particular gentleman just *maybe* isn't a billionaire, but certainly a centimillionaire for sure. I was introduced to the young lady in question, actually--she was from Poland, and spent about half the year traveling the world with the man, mostly from opera house to symphony halls to art galleries, as those were his private passions.

For those less "endowed" with liquid assets, things can be a bit different...and believing some of the advertising people speak of in this pursuit is merely attempting fantasy fulfillment for many.

(When I say "advertising people speak of" I am referring to the fact that I generally ignore inflated claims of this kind except to distrust the advertiser from the outset.)

David

Offline Jinx

  • Watched
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1563
  • Gender: Male
I think I got off lucky 10 years ago.  No, she's not dressed for a costume party, that's the way she normally looks - total goth.  Can you imagine living in a house with this?

with the photos you posted it is a piece of cake to find your stepdaughter in the net.


I think she is very-very creative, very interesting person and very attractive as well. Would you rather live with some mousy creature?



 I don't see anything wrong with her either. Think about how you were at 19, I was a punk rocker in the 80's, kids experiment...nothing new. I think she's interesting and attractive too W.O. Looks to have some artistic talent as well.

[Mod edit: Quote link modified to fit page.]-Brass

Online andrewfi

  • Supporting Member
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 20730
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Articles About Almost Anything!
If any of you are curious, I recently came accross this now current picture of Luba, my former step-daughter now nearly 19.  

I think I got off lucky 10 years ago.  No, she's not dressed for a costume party, that's the way she normally looks - total goth.  Can you imagine living in a house with this?

Gawd, I must be so liberal and easy going as I would have no problems whatsoever if any of my daughters grew up looking like that young lady. There are so many other more important things than dress sense that I wouldn’t want them to be.

I agree! She will grow and change.
At about the same age I was heavily into the New Romantic thing, looked as bent as a nine bob note for a while. I don't think it harmed me.
On the positive side, as well, it suggests that she thinks about her appearance and how that works in her life. This is not a bad thing, in my opinion.

Of much more concern would be other less obvious issues common to people no matter how they dress... substance abuse, social behaviour, work ethic.

She looks an attractive young girl who will look very different in a few months time and be more attractive in a few more years.
...everything ends always well; if it’s still bad, then it’s not the end!

Offline Olga_Mouse

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3384
  • Country: ru
  • Gender: Female
  • Trips: Resident

Would you rather live with some mousy creature?


...and what can you possibly have against us mice, W_O?  :popcorn:

Leaving Russia is not an emigration, rather an evacuation.

Online andrewfi

  • Supporting Member
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 20730
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Articles About Almost Anything!
Brad, I agree with most of what you write about except this about walking away. Walking away is easy and safe but many things in life take work and walking away because there is a problem is not the solution.
I guess it depends upon how much you think YOU want and how much you think SHE wants. If you think either or both WANTS is not very much then, yes, toddle off into the sunset.
If you think that BOTH want and much then walking off may become necessary but it should not be done too soon. (What is the right time to walk away? Aha!, know that and become the richest and most loved man inthe world!)

Dbneely and skiiingandrunning, there is an old saying 'age and experience buys youth and beauty' and I believe this to be true. The big issue is that in this particular market men are told that the cost of youth and beauty is lower than it truly is. I tend to think that, as with so many costly things, if you have to ask the price you can't afford it.
From what I have seen, older guys with younger girls do not really have to try very hard, they ARE attractive in whatever terms their particular partner of the moment chooses to see the attraction. The attraction is rooted less in the money or power per se but rather in the attributes that got them the money/power/whatever and they were attractive throughout their lives.

Sadly, many men, for all sorts of reasons believe what they are told, probably because they want to believe.
Last night Petra and I were going over some profiles of blokes for her mother - won't go into why right now - anyway, we saw endless profiles from hopeful sixty year olds looking for women as young as 18 and many for 25 to 30 year old women. It was quite shameful to see as a member of the male gender.
Thing is that these were very 'average' guys who were blarting on about how wealthy they were, what a great change they'd make to their young bride's life etc etc. Truth be told, from what we saw, none of them had anything to make an 18 year old do anything other than have chills up and down her spine.

A few guys can pull it off, but they sure as hell do not need marriage agencies to do it! Sadly, Petra's conclusion was that it was going to be hard to find a man for her 56 year old mother. I agree.

Olga don't forget, you are the Mouse That Roars!


...everything ends always well; if it’s still bad, then it’s not the end!

Offline Brasscasing

  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 8299
  • Country: ca
  • Gender: Male
  • Status: Committed
  • Trips: 1-5
Folks,

I've removed the original link info and the links supplied in the subsequent post and quote.

The OP and an Administrator at this forum were the recipients of an on line attack this evening which involved making public, private/personal information. In light of the nature of the attack and the unscrupulous behaviour of the attacker (a banned former member of this forum), I believe that if the attacker were to gain access to the information I've removed, he would use it to continue his harassment.

I'll leave it to the OP to elaborate if he so chooses but at this point I'd rather be cautious as this young lady does not deserve to have a similar attack perpetrated on her as a result of the information posted here and I have no doubt that would be the case.

My apologies for this somewhat cryptic post.

Brass
“I am a Canadian, free to speak without fear, free to worship in my own way, free to stand for what I think right, free to oppose what I believe wrong, or free to choose those who shall govern my country. This heritage of freedom I pledge to uphold for myself and all mankind."  ~ John Diefenbaker

P.S....Unless you happen to live in Quebec and are subject to the Quebec Charter Of Values, of course.

Offline dbneeley

  • RIP
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1671
  • Country: ua
  • Gender: Male


Dbneely and skiiingandrunning, there is an old saying 'age and experience buys youth and beauty' and I believe this to be true. The big issue is that in this particular market men are told that the cost of youth and beauty is lower than it truly is. I tend to think that, as with so many costly things, if you have to ask the price you can't afford it.
From what I have seen, older guys with younger girls do not really have to try very hard, they ARE attractive in whatever terms their particular partner of the moment chooses to see the attraction. The attraction is rooted less in the money or power per se but rather in the attributes that got them the money/power/whatever and they were attractive throughout their lives.

A few guys can pull it off, but they sure as hell do not need marriage agencies to do it! Sadly, Petra's conclusion was that it was going to be hard to find a man for her 56 year old mother. I agree.


Andrewfi, for the most part I agree with you. However, the bit about "it's not the money or power per se but rather the attributes that got them..." and that "...they were attractive throughout their lives" I do not agree with. True enough in some cases, perhaps, but unless you have been close to power and have seen the magnetic attraction it holds over some women, you are not very qualified to speculate.

I served as campaign press secretary many years ago now for a U.S. Senator who had originally been elected somewhat by accident, having been an obscure college professor previously. He narrowly won re-election several times subsequently. (John Tower of Texas, if anyone cares.) Traveling with him and watching women throwing themselves at the man was something of a revelation to me--and not in a good way. Power is for many an aphrodisiac, and unless you have seen it up close you may not understand this. It had little, if anything, to do with qualities that got them the power, and much to do with the perceived power itself.

In various capacities, I have subsequently been around some very wealthy people from time to time, more than a few of which are somewhat personally obnoxious. Still, none of them had any difficulty in attracting women if they wished to.

In short, my experience indicates that you speak from pure speculation and, it seems, little directly observed experience.

David

Online andrewfi

  • Supporting Member
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 20730
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
    • Articles About Almost Anything!
David, I do have some knowledge of what I speak and I am sure that you understand this: in order to be where we are we need to have certain attributes.
Money, power and social position are merely outward manifestations of the attributes that got the person those outward manifestations. That is what I meant and I apologise for not making myself clear enough to be readily understood.

There are plenty of men with money who are not attractive. There are plenty of men with power who are not attractive, There are plenty of men with social position who are not attractive. Money alone is not enough except to buy a prostitute.

Also, and to emphasise the point, there are plenty of men without power, wealth or social position who are attractive to women however because it is easier to recognise those outward manifestations (money, power, social position) it is easy to recognise and ascribe the attractiveness directly to them. The lie to the truth of the idea that it is simply the money, for example, and nothing else is the rich men who are not with young attractive women, who are not attractive to women.

One thing that is certainly true is this: experience and the insight to make use of our lifetime learning IS a great assister when seeking a mate. The knowledge to be able to deploy one's resources to best effect is very useful. A rich bloke who has no idea as to how to use his money/power/position to best effect is going to do less well than a bloke who knows exactly what buttons to press in a particular case with a particular woman.

Aside from the genetic accident of inherited good looks and accompanying youth, most men who are attractive to women know WHY they are attractive to women and, in one way or another, they HONE their skills, whether with one woman or many.

BTW, academics seem to do pretty well in this game. I doubt the examplar you gave was unknowing or nieve here. I'd lay odds that he knew what was going on and worked it, he was probably pretty much of a fox in the chicken coop at his university.
As a decently socialised bloke he'd also know, I am sure, of the positive power effect that accrues from the presence of women around a man, it'd be a tool of his trade, used to emphasise his postion.
I bet most most men would not even notice how he worked, seeing only the effect. Of course, reputation also has a part here, nothing succeeds like success, but that is surely too basic to need noting here.
...everything ends always well; if it’s still bad, then it’s not the end!


 

 

Registration