Electric Cars

[Manny]

Milk delivery companies were using EV's in the 1960's 

I saw an electric milk float the other morning actually. 1980s registered. Not seen one for yonks. The firm still has a photo of one on their homepage: https://www.creamline.co.uk/

I was looking for a photo of that vehicle on their site but wasn’t sure which one it was, could you point it out for us?

It says “about us” in the frame. XBA 271X is the registration number on it. The X tells us that vehicle was registered in 1982.

[Manny]

I think the current anti plastic campaign will see the Milkman back in biz - in the UK , at least

I agree. I think glass milk bottles are overdue for a comeback.

And also the amount of plastic carrier bags we use is a thing now. We should use those paper grocery bags like they have in the US. In fact, if one of our American friends wouldn’t mind exchanging some information about American grocery bags made of paper, send me a PM. I want some measurements, photos, thicknesses and possibly some manufacturers. It may be a viable import item from the US. It was something I was researching as a sideline last time I was in China but the US is a more sophisticated and mature market for paper grocery bags. The Chinese don’t really understand the concept. If somebody here is in the paper bag business in the US especially, please @ me.

Paper bags and glass bottles are coming back I think. Better than choking our oceans with plastic.

[Contrarian]

I think the current anti plastic campaign will see the Milkman back in biz - in the UK , at least

I agree. I think glass milk bottles are overdue for a comeback.

And also the amount of plastic carrier bags we use is a thing now. We should use those paper grocery bags like they have in the US. In fact, if one of our American friends wouldn’t mind exchanging some information about American grocery bags made of paper, send me a PM. I want some measurements, photos, thicknesses and possibly some manufacturers. It may be a viable import item from the US. It was something I was researching as a sideline last time I was in China but the US is a more sophisticated and mature market for paper grocery bags. The Chinese don’t really understand the concept. If somebody here is in the paper bag business in the US especially, please @ me.

Paper bags and glass bottles are coming back I think. Better than choking our oceans with plastic.

I frequently request paper bags instead of plastic ones when I’m at the grocery store. I also try to re-use them.

Earlier today I was at Albertsons, owned by the same company who owns Safeway.

The bag I received is made by International Paper, made in the USA. It says 40% PCW with a triangle made with arrows around it. www.brownbaggreenglobe.com/ is listed on the bag. It also says “Sustainable Forestry Initiative Certified Sourcing” www.sfiprogram.org/

Hope this helps!

[dcguyusa]

The local recycling program is shifting away from glass because recyclers are not buying the material.  They are focusing on clean paper, metal, and plastic components.  Glass is easily breakable and shatters into many pieces contaminating other recycled materials.  Paper, metal, and plastic items can be crushed and still retain its original made structure.  Glass cannot.  Not many glass food containers sold in the local grocery store in my town. In one local county, they instructed the residents to stop leaving the glass items in their recycling container and to take them directly to a glass recycle facility on their own volition.  Otherwise, just dump them with the regular trash.

The old Coke in the glass bottle vending machines are long gone.  No one is going to pick up the empty bottles anymore.   

[msmoby]

Met a guy at the sailing club who seems to be handy at repairing cars .. He expects to get a LOT of Tesla biz when the cars get to the end of their service plans.  Appaerenly Harrords have an EV from the early 1900's still in use !

[dcguyusa]

“The simple fact is, there is just too much plastic – and too many different types of plastics – being produced; and there exist few, if any, viable end markets for the material,”

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/jun/17/recycled-plastic-america-global-crisis

After humans disappear, the Styrofoam will still be here.  THAT will be mankind's legacy.   

[Markje]

A new Dutch car-manufactorer is jumping in the electric fray.

They however do some things differently:

- Every car gets 5m2 solar-roof, meaning the car can charge whether plugged in or not. (estimate 20.000km / year purely on solar-power).
- Every car will get a 700km range (which would put it in a 'usable' ballpark for me.
- The car will not have 1 big engine, but rather 4 small electric engines in-wheel for a 4-wheel car. (10% more efficiency)
- The car will have closed rear-wheels (10% more efficiency)

- Initial manufactoring will be 500 vehicles, of which 100 are already sold at about 110k eur.

Original article in Dutch here : https://www.ad.nl/auto/nederlandse-zonneauto-overschaduwt-tesla~a252028d/

[Contrarian]

A new Dutch car-manufactorer is jumping in the electric fray.

They however do some things differently:

- Every car gets 5m2 solar-roof, meaning the car can charge whether plugged in or not. (estimate 20.000km / year purely on solar-power).
- Every car will get a 700km range (which would put it in a 'usable' ballpark for me.
- The car will not have 1 big engine, but rather 4 small electric engines in-wheel for a 4-wheel car. (10% more efficiency)
- The car will have closed rear-wheels (10% more efficiency)

- Initial manufactoring will be 500 vehicles, of which 100 are already sold at about 110k eur.

Original article in Dutch here : https://www.ad.nl/auto/nederlandse-zonneauto-overschaduwt-tesla~a252028d/

Very cool! 

[Chris]

A new Dutch car-manufactorer is jumping in the electric fray.

They however do some things differently:

- Every car gets 5m2 solar-roof, meaning the car can charge whether plugged in or not. (estimate 20.000km / year purely on solar-power).
- Every car will get a 700km range (which would put it in a 'usable' ballpark for me.
- The car will not have 1 big engine, but rather 4 small electric engines in-wheel for a 4-wheel car. (10% more efficiency)
- The car will have closed rear-wheels (10% more efficiency)

- Initial manufactoring will be 500 vehicles, of which 100 are already sold at about 110k eur.

Original article in Dutch here : https://www.ad.nl/auto/nederlandse-zonneauto-overschaduwt-tesla~a252028d/

I watched this earlier today, some neat ideas with it, production about 18 months away yet

[Contrarian]

Now this is exciting!

Porsche debuts new Taycan all electric sports car. Move over Tesla, you’ve just been outclassed!

           

[Chris]

In the last few days the all electric Volkswagon ID.R has just smashed the hill climb record which has stood for about 20 years. The same car that beat the Pikes Peak record early last year.

Same car V's a McLaren MP4

Pikes Peak, but watch to the end to see the next challenge

[Contrarian]

In the last few days the all electric Volkswagon ID.R has just smashed the hill climb record which has stood for about 20 years. The same car that beat the Pikes Peak record earlier this year.

Same car V's a McLaren MP4

Porsche shares some technology with Volkswagen don’t they?

[Chris]

In the last few days the all electric Volkswagon ID.R has just smashed the hill climb record which has stood for about 20 years. The same car that beat the Pikes Peak record earlier this year.

Same car V's a McLaren MP4

Porsche shares some technology with Volkswagen don’t they?

Same group

[Steveboy]

If you want to see the latest in Electric cars I would suggest just popping into your local McDonalds .. you will find plenty of  people suffering bad backs, bad hips and many other fake problems so they can sit their fat ass in a car all day and scoff hamburgers and chips..

They are easy to spot usually a dirty grey track suit top and bottom with food stains all over the place..

[msmoby]

In the last few days the all electric Volkswagon ID.R has just smashed the hill climb record which has stood for about 20 years. The same car that beat the Pikes Peak record early last year.




Same car V's a McLaren MP4

Hmm, not sure of the validity of testing a AWD 2019 spec EV with a another forum 1988 design F1 car .. 

Mika Hakkinen's lap record at Monaco in your 1988 McLaren MP4 was 1:19.798.. Lewis Hamilton (2019)  1:10.166  .. nearly 10 seconds faster !

Souirce: https://www.statsf1.com/en/circuit-monaco.aspx

[Chris]

In the last few days the all electric Volkswagon ID.R has just smashed the hill climb record which has stood for about 20 years. The same car that beat the Pikes Peak record early last year.




Same car V's a McLaren MP4

Hmm, not sure of the validity of testing a AWD 2019 spec EV with a another forum 1988 design F1 car .. 

Mika Hakkinen's lap record at Monaco in your 1988 McLaren MP4 was 1:19.798.. Lewis Hamilton (2019)  1:10.166  .. nearly 10 seconds faster !

Souirce: https://www.statsf1.com/en/circuit-monaco.aspx

Well maybe because that was previously the record holder and had been held for ca.20 years, so what else can you compare it with?

[msmoby]

Well maybe because that was previously the record holder and had been held for ca.20 years, so what else can you compare it with?

 

That's akin to comparing internet speeds in 1998 and 2019 !

[d672]

 Something to think about if you are thinking of getting an electric car and live in a country with freezing winter weather

https://www.disclose.tv/new-test-reveals-electric-cars-are-practically-unusable-in-winter-383233?fbclid=IwAR13od9fhhhZS5r-KA5KHvLXickhh0ZuppOueNYvI3bxY87fcaUKJb8K4Xg

[Markje]

So , the biggest fast-charger network in Europe has upped its pricing to 0,79 EUR / Kwh.

A quick check by my favorite newspaper said that the km-pricing would now be:
45 Euro / 220 km range. (my BMW does triple that on the same dime ....)

I am sure people can convert this to gallons, miles and other non-scientific measurements.

I have only 1 reaction to this 

I would love to drive electric, but as many nay-sayers already said: Its just not worth it yet without some heavy government-help.

For large-distance driving like me, Its simply not feasible to have such a huge operational cost.

[NS1]

Government help just comes out of same pocket in a different way.
Does not make it any cheaper

[Chris]

So , the biggest fast-charger network in Europe has upped its pricing to 0,79 EUR / Kwh.

A quick check by my favorite newspaper said that the km-pricing would now be:
45 Euro / 220 km range. (my BMW does triple that on the same dime ....)

I am sure people can convert this to gallons, miles and other non-scientific measurements.

I have only 1 reaction to this 

I would love to drive electric, but as many nay-sayers already said: Its just not worth it yet without some heavy government-help.

For large-distance driving like me, Its simply not feasible to have such a huge operational cost.

Yep Ionity have hiked their prices and shot themselves in the foot, however, there are plenty of other providers much cheaper spread around the country/Europe, so you don't have to use them, but even if you do, you would probably only use them once on a trip and rapid charging makes it worthwhile in time savings alone, never mind the fact that most of your charging would be done at home on cheap rate electricity, so one or two rapid charges at higher rates if you have too, and once in a while is hardly going to break the bank.

I rarely charge away from home and even when I do, the costs are negligible. Last year I did two 500+ mile trips, the first one cost me only £5 for the whole trip and the second one about £9, charging to full at home costs me hardly anything at £0.05p Kwh and if you plan your trips like I did above, you can get FREE charging at hotels, and lots of other place. I have done quite a lot of travelling in the 10 months since I got my I Pace and never paid more than £15 to rapid charge it on the motorway. It is a shame that Ionity have taken this stance as they are opening quite a few sites in the UK, but they are going to feel it now people will stop using them. Having said that, I hear they are soon going to be offering a subscription service so it remains to be seen what that will be.

[andrewfi]

A quick mental arithmetic estimate suggests that this pricing is very similar to the cost of running my car on Diesel.

it is inevitable that pricing for electric cars will rise, in one way or another, to a similar level to that of liquid-fuelled cars. Nobody, whether commercial enterprise or governments seeking taxes, is going to leave all that money on the table. The current relatively low cost of leccy for cars is an aberration whose purpose is to encourage people to buy into 'cheap' electric vehicles.

While one might, with some justification, say that even if leccy prices rose to similar to liquid fuels that this is OK and a reasonable expectation, it is cheapness that makes the inconvenience of electricity acceptable. Take away low cost per mile and a heavy driver does not have much to crow about.

[NS1]

If the day fossil fuels are not around ( I suspect I will be bead by then)
The costs will go through the roof, the more options you have the more likely
costs stay under control.

[Texan77]

Almost anything will start off expensive and then get cheaper. Electricity whole price in the USA is about 9 cents a KW. Someone has to make a profit and they have cost buying and repairing the chargers. At one time oil and gasoline were very expensive also. AS drilling technology and the ability to find oil got better the price came down. That happened before ford made the model T and gasoline became the energy of choice. There are most likely not enough electric cars on the road to pay for the chargers so the try to charge the few customers more to make up for it. When there are more electric cars on the road competition in the charger market will happen and most likely the price will drop. One would expect it likely get below 20 cents a KW which is likely twice what they pay for the electricity.

[msmoby]

Andrewfi says 'leccie car prices will 'rise'?! ..Did he miss price falls in (Tesla) ?

That's like saying the Rouble will recover and 5 years on it is still 2 times less than it's previous level...