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Author Topic: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia  (Read 1453 times)

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Online Tom Cat

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American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« on: December 31, 2018, 02:40:26 PM »
Not a good way to end the year.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2018/12/31/paul-whelan-american-arrested-russia-spy-charges/2448683002/
Don't shoot the messenger, links to articles posted, don't necessarily reflect my personal opinion.

Online BillyB

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #1 on: December 31, 2018, 02:53:05 PM »

Standard procedure before negotiations for a spy or criminal swap.

Online Omega1982

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #2 on: December 31, 2018, 06:48:47 PM »
Is it safe to go to Russia now as an American? 


Online AvHdB

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #3 on: December 31, 2018, 07:25:31 PM »
Is it safe to go to Russia now as an American?

Well it is one way to influence your countries tourist income.
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Online Omega1982

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #4 on: December 31, 2018, 08:10:27 PM »
it definitely affects tourism.  if its politically motivated then any innocent tourist could be a target. 

Online andrewfi

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #5 on: December 31, 2018, 11:02:44 PM »
Whether or not the Russian woman is an intelligence agent, I think that the American guy very probably is.

If this is to become the basis of a swap then it makes sense for Russia to take a real piece off the board. There's two obvious reasons:
1. Taking out a real agent serves to decrease the operational effectiveness of the United States in Russia.
2. A genuine spy is likely to be a bigger and more valuable bargaining piece than some random tourist.
...everything ends always well; if it’s still bad, then it’s not the end!

Online msmoby

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2019, 12:14:43 AM »
Whether or not the Russian woman is an intelligence agent, I think that the American guy very probably is.

..and the basis for that conclusion is...?

Russia doesn't have form for making stuff like this up.
He really did say that
Here is my Russophobia/Kremlinphobia topic

Online Markje

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #7 on: January 01, 2019, 04:45:06 AM »
Whether or not the Russian woman is an intelligence agent, I think that the American guy very probably is.

..and the basis for that conclusion is...?

Because the FSB said so?

Its basicly the same with Maria Butina, except the countries are reversed.

(And no, confessing after months of solitary confinement isn't a worthy confession)
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Offline Manny

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #8 on: January 01, 2019, 06:03:39 AM »
Is it safe to go to Russia now as an American?

I expect you'll be fine if not a spy.
please tell me where I'm being / have been 'dishonest'? 
Yes, he said that.........

Online msmoby

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2019, 06:46:21 AM »
or a bit like being a Canadian - if in China ? ...

Russia doesn't have form for making stuff like this up.
He really did say that
Here is my Russophobia/Kremlinphobia topic

Online andrewfi

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2019, 09:09:03 AM »
Whether or not the Russian woman is an intelligence agent, I think that the American guy very probably is.

..and the basis for that conclusion is...?

Reading getting harder for you? (among the few things that are still getting harder these days, eh?)
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Offline SL0413

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #11 on: January 01, 2019, 09:42:14 AM »
Whether or not the Russian woman is an intelligence agent, I think that the American guy very probably is.

If this is to become the basis of a swap then it makes sense for Russia to take a real piece off the board. There's two obvious reasons:
1. Taking out a real agent serves to decrease the operational effectiveness of the United States in Russia.
2. A genuine spy is likely to be a bigger and more valuable bargaining piece than some random tourist.

Why is the American an intelligent agent?

There were months of stories about Maria Butina.  Then there is just a couple of paragraphs about the American, who was only there about a week to attend a wedding of a friend.  And yet the "American guy very probably is"...  What???





Online andrewfi

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #12 on: January 01, 2019, 09:47:07 AM »
Read what I wrote and get back to me. The number of days spent in Russia is irrelevant as, on reflection, I am sure you will agree.
...everything ends always well; if it’s still bad, then it’s not the end!

Online msmoby

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #13 on: January 01, 2019, 10:07:34 AM »


Reading getting harder for you? (among the few things that are still getting harder these days, eh?)

NOTHING you wrote gave any near plausible explanation - hence the question - ALL you offered up was an opinion
Russia doesn't have form for making stuff like this up.
He really did say that
Here is my Russophobia/Kremlinphobia topic

Offline SL0413

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Re: American suspected or spying arrested in Russia
« Reply #14 on: January 01, 2019, 02:16:03 PM »
Read what I wrote and get back to me. The number of days spent in Russia is irrelevant as, on reflection, I am sure you will agree.

Yes, I have read it.  Please stop misdirecting and state why the "American guy very probably is" an intelligent agent.  Or leave it vague and make it look like an informed opinion, as you are doing.

You follow it up with statements to "take a real piece off the board", making an assumed inference that the American is an intelligent agent.  I assume you think that the act of arresting the American automatically makes him "very probably" an agent?   I would offer the counter view that arresting someone who is an easy target - ex US military, current occupation in corporate security - can make it easy to turn the opinion of those with FSU bias to support them when they do not offer up any other evidence.

He may or may not be.  There has not been much information provided, other than the accusation by Russia and denials by family. 

I liked you sly comment of "whether or not the Russian woman" with the follow up that the american is very probable.  Nice wordplay to infer that the Russian woman is likely not an agent by contrary association, without direct statement.