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Author Topic: This doesn't really work, does it?  (Read 2227 times)

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Online justadude

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This doesn't really work, does it?
« on: September 27, 2017, 07:35:59 PM »
I'm a bit discouraged right now. I have just about reached the conclusion that pursuing a FSUW, or any other foreign woman, is rediculous and impossible.

If you have been paying attention (but why would you?), you know I was engaged to, and approved for a K1 visa for a woman I met in Ukraine last December whom I had known for 11 days. It didn't take a rocket scientist to predict that wasn't going to work out. I realized she wasn't what I wanted so I cancelled the visa. I was heartbroken as was she. I visited her again in April to say goodbye.

Then this summer I spent 7 weeks in Ukraine. I taught English to stay busy, dated a little, made a few friends, and was lonely most of the time. While there I explored the possibility of living more permanently in Ukraine at some point.

For the last week I headed further East in Ukraine and met a girl that I really like. We spent a week together which was super fun. I thought, as did she, that we would never see each other again. She cried and I cried when I was driving away.

We kept in touch and she made plans to come visit me here in the Western US late this fall. She applied for her tourist visa, traveled half way across Ukraine to the consulate for an interview, and was denied. She wants me to come visit her around Christmas time when I have a two week vacation. She has said that she would consider moving here to be with me in the future. We have talked about some of the larger issues but there is a lot more to discuss.

I am trying to decide whether or not to go. Let's say I go. What happens next? I propose and apply for another K1? (I think I still have another bullet in my two chamber K1 gun). Marry her there and apply for whatever the other visa is called when you marry over seas? Then what? In either scenario I am alone here until December at least. Then how much alone time until she actually arrives? At least 6 more months I would think.

Obviously the smarter thing to do is to go visit her a few more times and be more certain I'm making the right choice. But then how much more alone time? 2 years? I know I could meet someone here, but she wouldn't be as hot or as young and wouldn't have that captivating accent. If I did meet someone here, I don't think I would get married. If I did marry another American (I'm not married to one now, but I was:)) I think the financial implications of another divorce are not as stark.

Meanwhile, traveling back and forth is 24-36 hours of unpleasantness each way. I have been flying premium economy, which costs about $1900 round trip as opposed to $1200 for coach. A little more seat recline is all I seek, but you can't trust that from one airline's premium economy to the next. Business class is out of the question. I mean, I could afford it but I'm too much of a cheap ass to pay that much.

I know if I choose to move forward with her soon I need to tell her about my financial situation (good, but I'm not willing to support her. She will need to work), my health (very good for my age, but I'm not getting any younger) and my plans for the future (collecting a decent pension on an early retirement/ working part time in a new vocation that I am preparing for now).

And I don't think the stats are very good for success. It seems that many of the men who do this sort of thing end up in relationships where they don't live with their wife full time, and are often travelling back and forth to try to spend time together.

This whole thing just seems so foolish some times.

But then again this girl is pretty awesome.

Online Tom Cat

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2017, 08:04:08 PM »
With proper planning it can work. Keep in mind even if it takes a couple years she will still be much younger than you and most likely even more beautiful.
Some things in life are definitely worth the wait and efforts involved
Don't shoot the messenger, links to articles posted, don't necessarily reflect my personal opinion.

Offline Omega1982

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2017, 01:34:55 AM »
I would make the trip in December.  If things go well make another trip for spring break.  You should still have 2 bullets in the chamber because you still have not brought a foreign fiancé over.  The first application was cancelled.  If things go well in the springtime, it would have been 3 trips with her and you should know by then if she is a keeper or not.  If anything does not seem right then think with the big head.  If things go well, you can bring her and she can be here by Christmas 2018 which will be here sooner than later.  The visa process is between 6 and 9 months.  You might even have her here for Thanksgiving of 18.  But I would make two more trips to make sure she is the one.  You're right about the looks.  Here most of the woman that are slim, feminine and dress well are either married or out of ones league.  I would have an honest financial talk with her, and observe her financial habits to make sure you are on the same page.  I also work hard for the money and do not appreciate a woman that is wasteful and not intelligent with the finances.  We already know she is attractive, if you can decide she is a good person, and fiscally responsible, take the plunge.  You only live once and tomorrow is not guaranteed to anyone. 


Online msmoby

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2017, 01:44:09 AM »
Mate, I honestly think you are looking at this with finances being the priority.

IF a lass is going to move to another country - she'll be seeking a guy who can support  -  until the time she can get  ajob and she way not get a job commensurate to her abilities based on her qualifications - for a long time - if ever.

This is NOT a poor man's endeavour.

The hardest times are when she is here, leaning on you heavily, feeling useless and relying on you and hating it .  Especially, if you hit a rut in the road. 


Online andrewfi

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2017, 01:58:18 AM »
I'd be willing to bet lots of imaginary money that if you were to put similar resources into finding a mate from your own peer group that you'd do better than spaffing it all on finding a foreign bint.

Yes it works out for some blokes but I bet that they could also have done better for less, especially so for time poor Americans.

Proposing marriage after 11 days? What do you think was going to happen?

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Online AvHdB

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2017, 02:55:08 AM »
The statistics are against you. But if you want awesome than fight for it.

There are those who have succeeded. It takes both perserverance and a goal. The idea to spend more time together is intelligent, even in Ukraine, as your work schedule allows. I suspect you have more down (vacation) time than the the average Joe in the States.

Have you considered applying for a student (University) type visa for Ms. Awesome?

Av

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Online andrewfi

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2017, 03:26:35 AM »
By the way, if your goal is matrimony and your chosen place of residence is NOT Ukraine then 'would consider' is not an appropriate attitude from a potential mate.

Unless she is wholeheartedly on board with the idea of self export then you are wasting time and money, again.

Here's a trick, when looking for a life partner it helps to find somebody who wants to be with you. Now, she might tell you she loves you dearly but unless she is willing, ready, and able, to move to be with you then nothing counts. If she is considering a foreign mate then the first thing she has to do, the very first, is to get to be at one with the reality that self export is inevitable if such a marriage is to happen.

For you, the first question you need to get answered with any of the targets of your affection is 'do you WANT to move abroad to be with the right man?'. Possibly more certainly, 'do you understand that a marriage to a foreign guy, living abroad, inevitably means moving country and are you OK with that?' If the response is not an enthusiastic positive then you can move on to the next candidate.

"For what else is the life of man but a kind of play in which men in various costumes perform until the director motions them offstage?" -Erasmus

Online Texan77

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2017, 04:08:46 AM »
I have met people who have married a person from FSU countries and were happy and brought them here. It just requires more work than marrying a person from your home country. Those people who are not willing to put in the extra time seldom make a go of it. It is stressful when you first arrive and you need to have a strong relationship to get thru it and everyone be happy. Being in a hurry does not work. Even if she is a good woman if you do not have a good relationship you will seldom make it thru the adjustment period. I hate the K1 visa concept. They should let us bring the girl back to our home country for several visits here where she had time to adjust before she comes to stay.

The success rate is low in part of romantic tours. Where people meet and the bring her back after one meeting. The success rate of this is nearly zero.

Offline Poldark

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2017, 05:21:05 AM »
I have just about reached the conclusion that pursuing a FSUW, or any other foreign woman, is ridiculous and impossible.
It comes down to the man, if you rush then yes it fails, if you're too slow you lose and if you keep having cold feet, you'll also fail.
If you have been paying attention (but why would you?), you know I was engaged to, and approved for a K1 visa for a woman I met in Ukraine last December whom I had known for 11 days. It didn't take a rocket scientist to predict that wasn't going to work out. I realized she wasn't what I wanted so I cancelled the visa. I was heartbroken as was she. I visited her again in April to say goodbye.
You proposed after 11 days? Ridiculous.
Then this summer I spent 7 weeks in Ukraine. I taught English to stay busy, dated a little, made a few friends, and was lonely most of the time. While there I explored the possibility of living more permanently in Ukraine at some point.

For the last week I headed further East in Ukraine and met a girl that I really like. We spent a week together which was super fun. I thought, as did she, that we would never see each other again. She cried and I cried when I was driving away.

We kept in touch and she made plans to come visit me here in the Western US late this fall. She applied for her tourist visa, traveled half way across Ukraine to the consulate for an interview, and was denied. She wants me to come visit her around Christmas time when I have a two week vacation. She has said that she would consider moving here to be with me in the future. We have talked about some of the larger issues but there is a lot more to discuss.
This is going to come across as rude however you appear to be going for the low budget romantic film vibe here, you already got engaged within 11 days last time, you're now considering whether you should bring another girl across all because her visa was denied. I'd bet my left testicle that any US visa will be an uphill struggle for her.
I am trying to decide whether or not to go. Let's say I go. What happens next? I propose and apply for another K1? (I think I still have another bullet in my two chamber K1 gun). Marry her there and apply for whatever the other visa is called when you marry over seas? Then what? In either scenario I am alone here until December at least. Then how much alone time until she actually arrives? At least 6 more months I would think.
What's wrong with being alone for a period of time, are you so afraid of being alone for any space of time that this is the reason you're seeking a foreign bride? I don't think you're looking at this the right way.
Obviously the smarter thing to do is to go visit her a few more times and be more certain I'm making the right choice. But then how much more alone time? 2 years? I know I could meet someone here, but she wouldn't be as hot or as young and wouldn't have that captivating accent. If I did meet someone here, I don't think I would get married. If I did marry another American (I'm not married to one now, but I was:)) I think the financial implications of another divorce are not as stark.
Yes the smart thing is to keep visiting her, try and see if she can get a visa to the US as well so then she can see where you've come from and so what if you meet someone in the US? Is it the end of the world? No, it's probably what's going to happen anyway and you seem too focused on vain things such as accents, who cares about an accent that much?
Meanwhile, traveling back and forth is 24-36 hours of unpleasantness each way. I have been flying premium economy, which costs about $1900 round trip as opposed to $1200 for coach. A little more seat recline is all I seek, but you can't trust that from one airline's premium economy to the next. Business class is out of the question. I mean, I could afford it but I'm too much of a cheap ass to pay that much.
Well that's on you, you want to fly over but only stump up for PE, that's your own issue no one elses.
I know if I choose to move forward with her soon I need to tell her about my financial situation (good, but I'm not willing to support her. She will need to work), my health (very good for my age, but I'm not getting any younger) and my plans for the future (collecting a decent pension on an early retirement/ working part time in a new vocation that I am preparing for now).
Of course you can tell her these things, I wouldn't broach it any time soon though as you appear to be moving too fast, not as fast as the last girl but too fast still.

Overall I think you're someone who is lonely and wants someone, you can't fathom the wait of 6 months as you'll be alone and you're thinking about what happens if you meet someone in the US, you're not committed to this and I'd bet my right testicle that you'll bow out. This may come across as rude but frankly, someone needs to give you a reality check as this looks like the set up to a disaster.

Online Wiz

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2017, 05:38:22 AM »
Why don't you ask Andrew to explain to you his theory of "The dirty Barrel"?

I am sure you will learn alot as many other people did too!
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Offline Rockstar77

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2017, 09:09:33 AM »
Justadude...it sounds like your lacking in confidence and your coming off as desperate and needy. That's any man's enemy no matter what culture your in.

You have to think...you've been to Ukraine...you're from a first world country so you instantly have high value...life is fun psychologically. Ukrainians are fascinating people. When you just wear shorts and a nice shirt and walk through a crowd you'll tend to rub shoulders as you walk by people...now put on a suit and tie and watch the crowd disperse like your Moses parting the sea.

Being said that...most men don't realize they have so much going for them in Ukraine that it's far easier than you think. first is the men of Ukraine...ever watch a date in action...the man is on his cellphone, his girl has the kill me look on her face and then when the food arrives it's silence and that's it... the second is the fall of the Soviet Union. Understanding that part of history will tell you what these women want and how to steal their hearts.

Any girl that is 25 and over will tell you the nightmare of 10 to 15 years of their life was nothing but eating noodles and butter and the only time they had a chicken leg which was the highlight of the year was during a special occasion. Watch how a girl will eat her cold soup. They will lift the spoon slowly to their mouth and hit warp speed an inch and a half away like that food is going to be taking away.

So justadude...when you tell a girl that you can't support her financially and she'll need to get a job is not only weak but it should be no surprise if they run for the hill. It seems like everyone on this forum is all about money...boys..it's just a piece of paper. Justadude...you talk about it seems like most men that have a relationship with Ukrainian women see them only every six months...hmmm...maybe I'm just different and never followed a set path in life and it's served me beyond well.

I'm a pipefitter but when I met my wife...i looked at all the routes I could take. So I told my boss that I was quitting...oh my god..yes...I left my career...but was it bad...nope..I took all seasonal work...it was long hours and good money and in two months after I made what I needed for a plane ticket and money to stay in Ukraine for 50 days...I quit. Rinse and repeat every two months...My rule..." i work to live, not live to work." That's the best part about pipefitting..people need water and use the bathroom...that career isn't going anywhere.

After my wife gets her spousal visa approved I'm heading back to Alberta to continue my career...but in the eyes of a Ukrainian girl...that was that incredibly reliable and dedicated. I knew no man in the international dating was doing that sort of thing which was a rarity which is high value. She knew it too. Ukrainian men are no competition. That much is easy to see...it's funny how little Ukrainian women value looks. Sure it's appealing but it's not high on their list so I'm saying everyone has a awesome chance.

Justadude you just have noticed that you'll see the majority of Ukrainian men ages from 18-35 jacked up on their protein shakes and in great shape and walk in packs of 5 to 6 with not one woman in sight...then you'll see quite the enigma of a little guy with a beer belly strutting his stuff with a little leggy vixen... that should give any average guy the confidence to rock these girls world. But just through my own observations when running into American and European men...I would say 90% of them came off as creepy and awkward. No enthusiasm at all...their monotone voices even almost put me to sleep.

My god..you feel bad for the Turkish...those poor guys are very proactive but their religion or reputation is their biggest weakness even if they don't practice it at all. Go to any cafe and you'll see a Turkish guy with three women at his table...he'll take selfies with them like he's some woman magnet but at the end of his meal with them the girls leave...he has the look of defeat. This timeline on love that this forum has is absurd. If you go too fast you lose, if you're too slow you lose. It's simple. Be unique and fun. I think Ukrainian women mistake boring for serious but eventually catch on and run for the hills.

When your compliments are always you're so fun, cool, exciting, blah, blah, blah... that says a lot. I loved the robotic expressiveness attitude back in the day. I found it challenging and fun. But there was nothing better than their first laugh and smile. Then after a while it turned from the serious hello to lighting up like a Christmas tree when they see you.

Justadude...you have to go into this like your the best thing ever to happen. It sounds cocky and arrogant but it's not. This comes off as the strong man they seek. Yes long distance takes a massive effort and putting time and dedication is huge. But in the end the payoff is insanely rewarding. I found this journey to be the funniest thing I ever did in my life. Not once did I ever think to question is it all to much...me and the wife are now filling out the forms and all that jazz for immigration...I heard some people don't even get interviewed because they have all the necessary proofs which we have in spades...but if we get interviewed...I find that would be exciting. Bring it on.

I live for the unknown of what kind of things they'll try to fool me with or be all tough. Anyways justadude... don't be so insecure or you're buying your own prophecy. It's like I used to tell friends when we went to the bars.. if you see a girl you like and she's giving you the eye...don't approach her unless you've failed at it hundreds of times and you've conditioned your brain that it's not going to kill you...just wait for her to walk by and turn around fast and grab her by the hand and say come on Shelly let's dance...their reaction will catch them off guard but they'll say their name isn't Shelly and say I didn't ask you your name...I asked you to dance...instant attraction.

Your leading...Women are simple no matter where you go. They are mostly 5 foot nothing..what are they going to do...beat you up...you have the upper hand because most western girls are the toughest to bypass unless you have some incredible tactics and high level comedic skills...Ukrainian girls are happy go lucky... I'm sure even the pro daters in Ukraine would change their tune if the right man came along...good luck.

Offline Steveboy

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2017, 11:53:03 AM »
I dont understand people who propose after just a few days its impossible! You need to take 6 months off work and live with her first before deciding anything. As for finances any women who needs or asks for funding while you are dating her does NOT love you!!!! Its that simple... Bloody hell I only had a fiver when I met my wife so even 50p a week would of been to expensive for me.. :laugh:

Offline Manny

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2017, 01:01:38 PM »
Quote
This doesn't really work, does it?

It does, but you have to go about it the right way and dedicate time and money to it.

IIRC when you arrived here you wasn't very interested in taking the advice of those who had been there and done it. If you read back over the advice you were historically given, you may do better.

You can't rush this. Nobody sensible chooses a wife in 11 days. A relationship must be developed like any relationship at home. That means trips, more trips and money. Better still, have a woman visit you on a tourist visa to take a look at your life and country.

You cannot put yourself on a stopwatch to get it right. It takes as long as it takes and it costs what it costs. Better to spend more time and money and get it right than rush and get it wrong.

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2017, 03:34:44 PM »
Why don't you ask Andrew to explain to you his theory of "The dirty Barrel"?

I am sure you will learn alot as many other people did too!

http://ruadventures.com/forum/index.php/topic,1085.msg11835.html#msg11835

A load of tosh, then and now -  like you telling us you were leaving the UK for warmer climes 10 years ago... ? :chuckle:

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Re: This doesn't really work, does it?
« Reply #14 on: September 28, 2017, 04:03:43 PM »
Justadude...it sounds like your lacking in confidence and your coming off as desperate and needy. That's any man's enemy no matter what culture your in.

You have to think...you've been to Ukraine...you're from a first world country so you instantly have high value...life is fun psychologically. Ukrainians are fascinating people. When you just wear shorts and a nice shirt and walk through a crowd you'll tend to rub shoulders as you walk by people...now put on a suit and tie and watch the crowd disperse like your Moses parting the sea.

Being said that...most men don't realize they have so much going for them in Ukraine that it's far easier than you think. first is the men of Ukraine...ever watch a date in action...the man is on his cellphone, his girl has the kill me look on her face and then when the food arrives it's silence and that's it... the second is the fall of the Soviet Union. Understanding that part of history will tell you what these women want and how to steal their hearts.

Any girl that is 25 and over will tell you the nightmare of 10 to 15 years of their life was nothing but eating noodles and butter and the only time they had a chicken leg which was the highlight of the year was during a special occasion. Watch how a girl will eat her cold soup. They will lift the spoon slowly to their mouth and hit warp speed an inch and a half away like that food is going to be taking away.

So justadude...when you tell a girl that you can't support her financially and she'll need to get a job is not only weak but it should be no surprise if they run for the hill. It seems like everyone on this forum is all about money...boys..it's just a piece of paper. Justadude...you talk about it seems like most men that have a relationship with Ukrainian women see them only every six months...hmmm...maybe I'm just different and never followed a set path in life and it's served me beyond well.

I'm a pipefitter but when I met my wife...i looked at all the routes I could take. So I told my boss that I was quitting...oh my god..yes...I left my career...but was it bad...nope..I took all seasonal work...it was long hours and good money and in two months after I made what I needed for a plane ticket and money to stay in Ukraine for 50 days...I quit. Rinse and repeat every two months...My rule..." i work to live, not live to work." That's the best part about pipefitting..people need water and use the bathroom...that career isn't going anywhere.

After my wife gets her spousal visa approved I'm heading back to Alberta to continue my career...but in the eyes of a Ukrainian girl...that was that incredibly reliable and dedicated. I knew no man in the international dating was doing that sort of thing which was a rarity which is high value. She knew it too. Ukrainian men are no competition. That much is easy to see...it's funny how little Ukrainian women value looks. Sure it's appealing but it's not high on their list so I'm saying everyone has a awesome chance.

Justadude you just have noticed that you'll see the majority of Ukrainian men ages from 18-35 jacked up on their protein shakes and in great shape and walk in packs of 5 to 6 with not one woman in sight...then you'll see quite the enigma of a little guy with a beer belly strutting his stuff with a little leggy vixen... that should give any average guy the confidence to rock these girls world. But just through my own observations when running into American and European men...I would say 90% of them came off as creepy and awkward. No enthusiasm at all...their monotone voices even almost put me to sleep.

My god..you feel bad for the Turkish...those poor guys are very proactive but their religion or reputation is their biggest weakness even if they don't practice it at all. Go to any cafe and you'll see a Turkish guy with three women at his table...he'll take selfies with them like he's some woman magnet but at the end of his meal with them the girls leave...he has the look of defeat. This timeline on love that this forum has is absurd. If you go too fast you lose, if you're too slow you lose. It's simple. Be unique and fun. I think Ukrainian women mistake boring for serious but eventually catch on and run for the hills.

When your compliments are always you're so fun, cool, exciting, blah, blah, blah... that says a lot. I loved the robotic expressiveness attitude back in the day. I found it challenging and fun. But there was nothing better than their first laugh and smile. Then after a while it turned from the serious hello to lighting up like a Christmas tree when they see you.

Justadude...you have to go into this like your the best thing ever to happen. It sounds cocky and arrogant but it's not. This comes off as the strong man they seek. Yes long distance takes a massive effort and putting time and dedication is huge. But in the end the payoff is insanely rewarding. I found this journey to be the funniest thing I ever did in my life. Not once did I ever think to question is it all to much...me and the wife are now filling out the forms and all that jazz for immigration...I heard some people don't even get interviewed because they have all the necessary proofs which we have in spades...but if we get interviewed...I find that would be exciting. Bring it on.

I live for the unknown of what kind of things they'll try to fool me with or be all tough. Anyways justadude... don't be so insecure or you're buying your own prophecy. It's like I used to tell friends when we went to the bars.. if you see a girl you like and she's giving you the eye...don't approach her unless you've failed at it hundreds of times and you've conditioned your brain that it's not going to kill you...just wait for her to walk by and turn around fast and grab her by the hand and say come on Shelly let's dance...their reaction will catch them off guard but they'll say their name isn't Shelly and say I didn't ask you your name...I asked you to dance...instant attraction.

Your leading...Women are simple no matter where you go. They are mostly 5 foot nothing..what are they going to do...beat you up...you have the upper hand because most western girls are the toughest to bypass unless you have some incredible tactics and high level comedic skills...Ukrainian girls are happy go lucky... I'm sure even the pro daters in Ukraine would change their tune if the right man came along...good luck.

Great post Rockstar, I always enjoy your posts. Ukrainian or Russian women like confidence and especially generosity. You showed both with your time and $ and dedication until she knew she could trust you.

No wishy washy weak western "man" BS with Rockstar. Pay heed just a dude.