Spain and Italy Heaving with Russian Tourists

[Tom Cat]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.


Battered Russian ruble plunges amid oil price drops

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2015/12/31/battered-russian-ruble-plunges-amid-oil-price-woes/78133452/

[Markje]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.

You say that like its a bad thing 

[Tom Cat]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.

You say that like its a bad thing 

For the time being money circulating in Russia is good, but it does not give Russia outside money.

My question is what effect this is having on the Stans? For millions Russia has been the primary source for income. Lower value of the ruble is devastating to their economy. If the stans feel Russia is no longer able to help support their economies, will they in turn look to the west to partner with?

[Manny]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.

I am in Barcelona at the moment and it is heaving with Russians. Even the restaurants have Russian menus. Looks like Spain is sucking up some of the Turkey/Egypt traffic. The Roubles obviously buy enough Euros for them to get by here. And it isn't an especially cheap city to play in.

[Tom Cat]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.

I am in Barcelona at the moment and it is heaving with Russians. Even the restaurants have Russian menus. Looks like Spain is sucking up some of the Turkey/Egypt traffic. The Roubles obviously buy enough Euros for them to get by here. And it isn't an especially cheap city to play in.

Of course the rich have no problem with travel.
But on the whole Russians are not traveling as much.

Russians are making far fewer vacation trips abroad

http://money.cnn.com/2015/12/09/news/economy/russian-tourists-foreign-trips/

[Manny]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.

I am in Barcelona at the moment and it is heaving with Russians. Even the restaurants have Russian menus. Looks like Spain is sucking up some of the Turkey/Egypt traffic. The Roubles obviously buy enough Euros for them to get by here. And it isn't an especially cheap city to play in.

Of course the rich have no problem with travel.
But on the whole Russians are not traveling as much.

Russians are making far fewer vacation trips abroad

http://money.cnn.com/2015/12/09/news/economy/russian-tourists-foreign-trips/

I am not seeing "the rich" here, I am seeing regular people. I saw similar - but to a lesser extent - a few days ago in Napoli.

When I say restaurants have Russian menus out, I don't just mean top end places, street front cafes too. They are everywhere. You cant go five minutes without hearing spoken Russian in the street. Something I wasn't expecting actually. I would expect Greece to see more tourists from Russia than Spain.

Don't believe everything you read in western media (but you know that already TC).

[WestCoast]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.

I am in Barcelona at the moment and it is heaving with Russians. Even the restaurants have Russian menus. Looks like Spain is sucking up some of the Turkey/Egypt traffic. The Roubles obviously buy enough Euros for them to get by here. And it isn't an especially cheap city to play in.

Manny surely you know Spain has always been popular with Russians. Years ago when Spain was doing well financially Russians flocked to Spain to live and work because Spain needed the workers not to mention the weather's better in Spain than in Moscow.

When the economy went south many Russians stayed and worked, some legally and others off the books. Then of course there's the 'Golden Visa' for those with a few dollars, it makes immigrating to Spain easier.

Those are the Russians you're probably running into, Russians who have lived in Spain for years, not those stuck in Russia because the exchange rate makes travel to the EU too expensive.

[Steveboy]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.

I am in Barcelona at the moment and it is heaving with Russians. Even the restaurants have Russian menus. Looks like Spain is sucking up some of the Turkey/Egypt traffic. The Roubles obviously buy enough Euros for them to get by here. And it isn't an especially cheap city to play in.

Manny surely you know Spain has always been popular with Russians. Years ago when Spain was doing well financially Russians flocked to Spain to live and work because Spain needed the workers not to mention the weather's better in Spain than in Moscow.

When the economy went south many Russians stayed and worked, some legally and others off the books. Then of course there's the 'Golden Visa' for those with a few dollars, it makes immigrating to Spain easier.

Those are the Russians you're probably running into, Russians who have lived in Spain for years, not those stuck in Russia because the exchange rate makes travel to the EU too expensive.

I like that "Stuck in Russia"  What planet are you on! 

[andrewfi]

I like that "Stuck in Russia"  What planet are you on! 

As has been noted before the world is not quite how Westcoast imagines it to be. 

[Steveboy]

I like that "Stuck in Russia"  What planet are you on! 

As has been noted before the world is not quite how Westcoast imagines it to be. 

Poor man    Pity the poor women who will land up with him 

[WestCoast]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.

I am in Barcelona at the moment and it is heaving with Russians. Even the restaurants have Russian menus. Looks like Spain is sucking up some of the Turkey/Egypt traffic. The Roubles obviously buy enough Euros for them to get by here. And it isn't an especially cheap city to play in.

Manny surely you know Spain has always been popular with Russians. Years ago when Spain was doing well financially Russians flocked to Spain to live and work because Spain needed the workers not to mention the weather's better in Spain than in Moscow.

When the economy went south many Russians stayed and worked, some legally and others off the books. Then of course there's the 'Golden Visa' for those with a few dollars, it makes immigrating to Spain easier.

Those are the Russians you're probably running into, Russians who have lived in Spain for years, not those stuck in Russia because the exchange rate makes travel to the EU too expensive.

I like that "Stuck in Russia"  What planet are you on! 

Steveboy haven't you seen the articles that say Russians are vacationing at home because the exchange rates make travel outside Russia too expensive?

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2015/12/31/battered-russian-ruble-plunges-amid-oil-price-woes/78133452/
http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2016/01/02/461595663/russians-find-favored-holiday-destinations-suddenly-off-limits

Add in the threat of terrorism and there appears to be no safe place for Russians to vacation except at home. The link below is from RT so that means it's from official Russian government sources.

https://www.rt.com/politics/327239-leftist-lawmaker-urges-russians-not/

[Steveboy]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.

I am in Barcelona at the moment and it is heaving with Russians. Even the restaurants have Russian menus. Looks like Spain is sucking up some of the Turkey/Egypt traffic. The Roubles obviously buy enough Euros for them to get by here. And it isn't an especially cheap city to play in.

Manny surely you know Spain has always been popular with Russians. Years ago when Spain was doing well financially Russians flocked to Spain to live and work because Spain needed the workers not to mention the weather's better in Spain than in Moscow.

When the economy went south many Russians stayed and worked, some legally and others off the books. Then of course there's the 'Golden Visa' for those with a few dollars, it makes immigrating to Spain easier.

Those are the Russians you're probably running into, Russians who have lived in Spain for years, not those stuck in Russia because the exchange rate makes travel to the EU too expensive.

I like that "Stuck in Russia"  What planet are you on! 

Steveboy haven't you seen the articles that say Russians are vacationing at home because the exchange rates make travel outside Russia too expensive?

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2015/12/31/battered-russian-ruble-plunges-amid-oil-price-woes/78133452/
http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2016/01/02/461595663/russians-find-favored-holiday-destinations-suddenly-off-limits

Add in the threat of terrorism and there appears to be no safe place for Russians to vacation except at home. The link below is from RT so that means it's from official Russian government sources.

https://www.rt.com/politics/327239-leftist-lawmaker-urges-russians-not/

"no safe place for Russians to vacation except at home"    Are you smoking some drugs there or something?

My neighbours just come back from a few days in Paris! The exchange rate on the rouble of course makes it harder for many to travel But plenty of Russians still travel , you are so out of touch with reality its unreal!
Are you married ? Still searching? For how long? Years I would hazard a guess

[Manny]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.

I am in Barcelona at the moment and it is heaving with Russians. Even the restaurants have Russian menus. Looks like Spain is sucking up some of the Turkey/Egypt traffic. The Roubles obviously buy enough Euros for them to get by here. And it isn't an especially cheap city to play in.

Manny surely you know Spain has always been popular with Russians. Years ago when Spain was doing well financially Russians flocked to Spain to live and work because Spain needed the workers not to mention the weather's better in Spain than in Moscow.

When the economy went south many Russians stayed and worked, some legally and others off the books. Then of course there's the 'Golden Visa' for those with a few dollars, it makes immigrating to Spain easier.

Those are the Russians you're probably running into, Russians who have lived in Spain for years, not those stuck in Russia because the exchange rate makes travel to the EU too expensive.

Westy, I am a well-seasoned traveller and an FSU veteran.  You are not. I know the difference between residents and tourists. I know the cruise ship we just came off had similarly loads of Russian-resident average Russians on it; I can see it by the clothes alone. My wife relays the odd overheard conversation in passing; she knows I like to be well informed and know what is going on around me.

As ever, experience on the ground trumps your Googling. Go Google and Street View Samoa restaurant at Passeig del Gracia 101, 08008, Barcelona. Russian menus, and heaving with average Russian tourists. I had lunch there today, it is way better than the TripAdvisor score FWIW.

Google may be your friend, but it will never trump feet on the ground.

[rosco]

Money is being spent in Russia, because the ruble is not worth enough for Russians to have buying power anywhere else.

I am in Barcelona at the moment and it is heaving with Russians. Even the restaurants have Russian menus. Looks like Spain is sucking up some of the Turkey/Egypt traffic. The Roubles obviously buy enough Euros for them to get by here. And it isn't an especially cheap city to play in.

Manny surely you know Spain has always been popular with Russians. Years ago when Spain was doing well financially Russians flocked to Spain to live and work because Spain needed the workers not to mention the weather's better in Spain than in Moscow.

When the economy went south many Russians stayed and worked, some legally and others off the books. Then of course there's the 'Golden Visa' for those with a few dollars, it makes immigrating to Spain easier.

Those are the Russians you're probably running into, Russians who have lived in Spain for years, not those stuck in Russia because the exchange rate makes travel to the EU too expensive.

Sorry Westy but if you actually spent any time in Europe, you'd understand why your post is utter rubbish.

Italy and France are exactly like how Manny described Barcelona. We always see menu's in Russian, sales folks greeting us in Russian and Russians in hotels and restaurant's, seemingly having a good old time. We just got back from Cape Verde and I expect it'll be overrun with Russians this year, now that Egypt & Turkey are off the menu.

[andrewfi]

What Westcoast fails to understand, and oddly for a famous international banker, is that a small decline in the overall Russian economy actually has very little effect upon those with disposable income.

For example, assuming that the economy shrank by about 3.5% last year (which it did) and for simplicity assume that ALL that decrease was reflected in the incomes of the Russian people, which it isn't, then all that means is the Olga and Pavel might spend about 3.5% less on their vacations.

If we assume that Olga and Pavel had 25000 rubles spending money last year then this year they might have just 24125 this year.

That works out to drinking 3 glasses of wine less in their favourite restaurant. That's not 3 glasses of wine person, not 3 glasses of wine each day but 3 glasses of wine between them, over their entire vacation.

Now, I we know that some people have chosen different destinations, but the reality is that, far from Westcoast's fantasies and hopes the people of Russia, on the whole actually have more money in their pockets!

Again Westcoast might as a famous international banker with his his finger on the pulse of the global economy be expected to know the following but he does tend to disappoint us:
Because Russians have tended to not buy new cars or houses (and other high priced items that might be purchased on credit) they are not spending as much on these regular payments as before. The bloke who postponed his purchase of a new Nissan is going to be,  in Euro terms, a few hundred euros better off every month. That's several thousand euros of extra disposable income.

Do you think that these people feel poorer when they look at their bank balance or their new toys bought with disposable income cash?

[msmoby]

Seeing as andrewfi chose the analogy - let's discuss Olga and Pavel, in greater detail..


Olga works - like so many Russians in public service, Pavel is a Policeman

Their wages aren't keeping pace with inflation, they aren't allowed  to GO to the destinations-  Turkey and Egypt - for holidays - because in making things 'safer' their leaders have done the opposite ..so for their protection - the number of nations open for travel is shinking

If they wanted to go to Europe,Vietnam or Thailand it costs 2-2.5 times more than two years ago

Dairy products cost 20-25 percent more and nothing is cheaper in the shops..

Even fuel, has gone UP

Economics 101 stuff, really

[redroo]

Currently in Phuket. Have to tell you this place is still full of Russians also, but the locals are complaining they're not spending much in the shops, or going on as many tours as before. 70 rubles to the dollar will do that to you.
Hasn't stopped the girls still dressing to the nines while they promenade at night, or their men looking like fat ugly slobs in track suits. Some things never change.

[Steveboy]

Currently in Phuket. Have to tell you this place is still full of Russians also, but the locals are complaining they're not spending much in the shops, or going on as many tours as before. 70 rubles to the dollar will do that to you.
Hasn't stopped the girls still dressing to the nines while they promenade at night, or their men looking like fat ugly slobs in track suits. Some things never change.

Are you sure they are not "Just stuck there" maybe they cannot afford to fly home or hiding from terrorists?

[redroo]

My exlaws, who own a mid range wholesaling business in Ekaterinburg have really taken a hit to their monthly turnover this past year. Average Russians have indeed tightened their belts, but are most loathe to give up their holidays in the sun.
Dad is out for the Australian summer and to help with the school holiday minding of the fruit of my loins. Turned up with a lot less cash than usual.

[redroo]

LOL, well the "Slavic women" touting for business outside the night clubs and "Russian" strip bars must be surely "stuck here". They are truly fuggly. The tourist Russians leave them in the shade. Really shocked how low the quality of the pole dancers/ touts are in Phuket.......not that I would know what the inside of a place would look like 

[redroo]

I imagine Goa and Sri Lanka will be even more popular now that the Turks have shot themselves in the foot, and Egypt is off direct flights.
I am told the direct UIA flights from Kiev every second day into Bangkok are still full also, even though their economy is really in the toilet.

[andrewfi]

Not that anyone will remember...

During the US Great Depression (the one from 1929-39, not from 2008) unemployment was running at around 20% or so. Some folks had it really tough, but most people, just as in Russia now (where the economy is MUCH, MUCH better than the USA back then) still had money to spend. We concentrate upon the ones who were hit badly but they were always a minority. Russia right now has a minority who face problems, but often that's more about their over exposure to risk than to an inherently poor economy.

ANyone going on holiday is doing OK.
A vacation is the primo, cliche disposable income spend. Nobody, but nobody, needs to go to Thailand on vacation. I'd bet that some of the lower spenders are actually folks who would not have gone to Thailand in other circumstances, that is, they are not the same Russians, the same demographic as previously. For example folks who'd have been tuppeny ha'penny millionaires in their Hurghada all inclusive who have had to 'upgrade' to a half board package in Phuket and who have less money in their pocket as a result of spending more on the flight and hotel package.

Tuppeny ha'penny millionaires to nouveau poor by virtue of the destination.

[Manny]

I never saw so many as today, groups of them everywhere being led around by the obligatory flag holder were at every turn (Westy will tell us they were lost residents).

On Las Ramblas, every restaurant has a Russian menu and Russian signs outside, Russian speaking staff are outside the restaurants trying to lure the passers by in (Westy thinks they are all residents).

I've seen bits of it in other parts of Europe like Rosco noted, but never like this. It is similarly heaving with Chinese/Japanese photographing everything in sight (as they do).

Whoever the skint ones are we keep hearing about, they are not the ones keeping the restaurants rammed to the rafters in Barcelona.

Some are well-heeled though. A young couple walked in a restaurant by us today, the bloke didn't look Russian though he was (he looked more like a Brit). The girl was clearly Russian. The waiter held two menus up and said "Menu in Russian?", the guy replied, in English, "Russian, English, Italian or French will be fine - doesn't matter". Made me laugh anyway........

[msmoby]

and the reality ..

If you thought you saw loads... there were plenty more..before

Flights to Spain before Xmas were dirt cheap from Moscow and Piter on Skyscanner. How much they'll be spending is the key...There were plenty of Ex-pat Russians resident in Malaga BEFORE the crisis

The stats comparing 2014/5 from Rosstat showed overseas tourism was down 40 percent year on year ...

http://sputniknews.com/russia/20150608/1023077473.html

[Chris]

On Las Ramblas, every restaurant has a Russian menu and Russian signs outside, Russian speaking staff are outside the restaurants trying to lure the passers by in (Westy thinks they are all residents).

They did a couple of years ago when I was last there also.

PS watch out for the pickpockets!  the streets in that area are well known for them