Need help - Applying for Schengen from Ukraine

[Odessarents]

Why not just go meet the woman in her hometown or visit a country like Turkey which is easy for Ukrainians to visit?

Yup Sasha, that is now the plan which is a radical departure from what I initially intended- Western Eurrope. Will meet her in Kharkov then Istanbul and other countries where she can travel to without a visa.

I would  first plan to make a trip to her city to really get to know her in person first , as for many years I have lived in Ukraine and ran a business here there have been many guys I have meet that did what you are planning and it turned out to be a free vacation for the lady and that was here main goal, Once you have spent time with her , then made travel plans like you mention.

Does the lady speak fluent English ?

[Noypioz]

I would  first plan to make a trip to her city to really get to know her in person first , as for many years I have lived in Ukraine and ran a business here there have been many guys I have meet that did what you are planning and it turned out to be a free vacation for the lady and that was here main goal, Once you have spent time with her , then made travel plans like you mention.

Does the lady speak fluent English ?
[/quote]

Not really. She says she can understand but uses a translator to reply back.

Coming to meet her in Ukraine is only incidental as my original plan was to backpack around Europe solo.Then I met her online and decided why not bring her along to get to know her better. It will definitely be a free trip for her which I really don't mind. She is originally from Gorlovka but is now living with her grandmother in Kharkov. She has no job and stopped going to uni in Donetsk due to the conflict.

But to be honest, I'm now considering to just meeting her in Kharkov and visit at least one country i.e. Turkey for a couple of days. If all goes well then make bigger travel plans for later. I still have small doubts with what she is saying and not saying i.e. about her parents (she doesn't like to talk about which I respect).  I might just have to stick to my original solo travel plans and meet ladies along the way. Cheers

[Texan77]

I would not plan to take her anywhere. I would just show up and plan to visit her in her home town. I have written girls and then have the first meeting not go well. I have found it is a problem in the Ukraine that the girls do not want to talk about their parents or anything else that is important and try to keep the conversation very shallow. So you have to observed her behavior to determine what you have. You also have to meet the parents to see who you future outlaws will be. Remember her family will be a big deal if you get serious. If you are wanting more than dates you need to learn how she lives and how her life works. What her vision of her future is. When you spend close time with her, your feeling about her will change. Maybe for the better and maybe not. From this you will learn whether you really want to take her on a trip which can be very romantic if she is right for you and very difficult if she is not. I believe you will learn more about her in her home city than you will learn in Turkey or anywhere else. 

[TomT]

Not [met] in person yet Vinn though we Skype everyday.

Not really [speak fluent English]. She says she can understand but uses a translator to reply back.

Does she have a translator with her every day when you speak on Skype?

[Noypioz]

Does she have a translator with her every day when you speak on Skype?
[/quote]

C'mon TomT, what kind of a question is that? Do you really think that's possible???

We chat in Skype and most likely she uses an online translation software or google.

[Noypioz]

I would not plan to take her anywhere. I would just show up and plan to visit her in her home town. I have written girls and then have the first meeting not go well. I have found it is a problem in the Ukraine that the girls do not want to talk about their parents or anything else that is important and try to keep the conversation very shallow. So you have to observed her behavior to determine what you have. You also have to meet the parents to see who you future outlaws will be. Remember her family will be a big deal if you get serious. If you are wanting more than dates you need to learn how she lives and how her life works. What her vision of her future is. When you spend close time with her, your feeling about her will change. Maybe for the better and maybe not. From this you will learn whether you really want to take her on a trip which can be very romantic if she is right for you and very difficult if she is not. I believe you will learn more about her in her home city than you will learn in Turkey or anywhere else.

Totally agree Texan. And that's what I'm doing now. Every question I ask, every situation I present to her is meant to elicit a specific response that will enable me to at least paint a background of what her real intentions are. And if her reponse doesn't jive at all then that triggers a red flag. So far all is well except for the parents thing which is a big deal for me. Cheers

[welder]

Does she have a translator with her every day when you speak on Skype?

C'mon TomT, what kind of a question is that? Do you really think that's possible???

We chat in Skype and most likely she uses an online translation software or google.
[/quote]

Noy, not trying to bust your balls but devil is in the details.  You mentioned to Vinny that you skype everyday.  By writing such it is fair to assume that you are on camera and actually speak to one another.  It appears from your response that you chat, as in type messages back and forth.  Is this correct?  Are you at on camera/video to see each others expressions while you message? 

Glad to see you are planning to go to her city first.  I wouldn't push the parent thing, you can cover those issues when she gets to know you face to face and is comfortable, or not, to answer more personal issues. 

Based on your skype sessions do you think a translator will be required when meeting her for the first time?   If so you may want to organize your own translator now.   

Noy, just remember, if you are looking for red flags, you will find them in spades.  Especially true if her english is at a basic level.

[TomT]

C'mon TomT, what kind of a question is that? Do you really think that's possible???

It was a Socratic question but you failed to get the point. 

Even though we speak the same language, your communication is poor because you omit important details. If misunderstandings occur with someone who has excellent reading comprehension, imagine how many would occur with someone who has a poor grasp of English. Under these circumstances, there is no prospect of determining if someone would be a suitable lifelong partner.

[msmoby]

C'mon TomT, what kind of a question is that? Do you really think that's possible???

It was a Socratic question but you failed to get the point. 

hmmm, amazing how many of us see a 'Socratic' question from TomT' and know it is going to be another 'newbie put down'

YES, TomT... the lad has a lot to learn - but even he - 'a newbie' - could figure out where your question was going....

Perhaps his communication skills aren't as awry as you surmised.....

[ashbyclarke]

Even though we speak the same language, your communication is poor because you omit important details. If misunderstandings occur with someone who has excellent reading comprehension, imagine how many would occur with someone who has a poor grasp of English. Under these circumstances, there is no prospect of determining if someone would be a suitable lifelong partner.

Little or no knowledge of language could well be a blessing, hard work but rewarding if done right, I assume.

Besides we don’t know age of lady, or her willingness to learn, can’t imagine many here who are now married who’s wife was fluent in english.

Confusion in translation exists no matter the level of expertise in common language in this search and or adventure.

[TomT]

Mobiwan,

The issue was communication, an area in which I have some experience. If the OP had asked about STDs, I would have certainly deferred to you.

[Noypioz]

C'mon TomT, what kind of a question is that? Do you really think that's possible???

It was a Socratic question but you failed to get the point. 

Even though we speak the same language, your communication is poor because you omit important details. If misunderstandings occur with someone who has excellent reading comprehension, imagine how many would occur with someone who has a poor grasp of English. Under these circumstances, there is no prospect of determining if someone would be a suitable lifelong partner.

C'mon TomT, you being condescending now? Was there truly a need for a "Socratic question" for my simple Schengen visa question? I know where your question was leading to hence my reply.

And no, English is my second language.  I chose not to elaborate the intricacies of my situation because that will only open up the thread to all sorts of "Socratic questions" which will not achieve my purpose. That is why I narrowed it down to 2 simple and understandable items- 1) cost of International Passport in Ukraine and 2) eliciting experiences in applying for Schengen visa.

The issue isn't about communication or translator. My issue as a newbie was about 1 & 2.

And your posts simply didn't help TomT.

This thread will go nowhere from now on and I'm extremely disappointed.     

But hey my sincere thanks to those who responded sensibly to my first post, much appreciated!!! Cheers         

[Noypioz]

YES, TomT... the lad has a lot to learn - but even he - 'a newbie' - could figure out where your question was going....

Learn about communication msmoby?

[msmoby]

YES, TomT... the lad has a lot to learn - but even he - 'a newbie' - could figure out where your question was going....

Learn about communication msmoby?

  

[TomT]

Was there truly a need for a "Socratic question" for my simple Schengen visa question?     

Apparently there was a need because you deliberately withheld key information to increase the chances of your unrealistic scheme being validated... and you don't want to disclose that you're a Pinoy. There are both cheerleaders and level-headed members here. If you want to throw in with the former group, it's your call but it won't change reality. Evaluating someone, with whom you cannot have a lucid conversation, for the position of "lifelong partner" is ridiculous. Instead of chasing a fantasy, you should get about the business of getting her conversational English up to speed.



 

[leslied]

Noypioz,

Don't worry about your woman's level of English now, as long as she is keen to learn it will matter little in the long term.  Twelve+ years ago when I met my wife her English was non existent. My very poor Russian was better...

This still did not stop us building a successful 10+ year marriage with two daughters. This fact sits uncomfortably with some members here, but I am far from alone in this respect. I can think of several other couples who started in similar circumstances but are still together 10 years later...

We left UK to live in Turkey eight years ago, it is a great place to live.  The kids would never leave here.  The visa situation is very easy in Turkey.  Enjoy the bustle and sights of Istanbul but take a coach or a hop flight to the med coast - it is well worth it.

In any event, the best of luck.  Remember fortune favors the brave 

[msmoby]

Mobiwan,

The issue was communication, an area in which I have some experience.

TomT

1/ 'funny' how often you claim to have 'communication skills' and yet you repeatedly prove you don't / won't can't listen.. You and andrewfi suffering the same affliction .. The OP can communicate quite well in his second language.. and had your 'number' ...

2/  If the OP had asked about STDs, I would have certainly deferred to you.

Every time I'm donating blood or plasma, I remember your 'advice / expertise'  and smile a wry smile ....

[Noypioz]

Was there truly a need for a "Socratic question" for my simple Schengen visa question?     

Apparently there was a need because you deliberately withheld key information to increase the chances of your unrealistic scheme being validated... and you don't want to disclose that you're a Pinoy. There are both cheerleaders and level-headed members here. If you want to throw in with the former group, it's your call but it won't change reality. Evaluating someone, with whom you cannot have a lucid conversation, for the position of "lifelong partner" is ridiculous. Instead of chasing a fantasy, you should get about the business of getting her conversational English up to speed.

Cheers TomT, all good.

[andrewfi]

Noypioz, this language thing is important. As you have seen LeslieD managed to make a long lasting relationship with a person whose English was negligible. Most are not so fortunate.

Here's a thing, most women who seriously choose to find a future via self export by marriage have a decent idea of where they want to be. They understand that the odds of success are not in their favour and thus they take action to improve their chances. For that reason it always seems a little strange that a woman who has decided that her future lies in the English speaking world has taken no steps to be able to talk to the man who will be her means of leaving.

At the same time, without either shared language or well trusted and professional interpreters there's not much likelihood that either party can make good choices about a life partner in only a few days of contact time (Time on Skype counts for almost nothing here).

If you have the resources to manage a LOT of face time then one can get a good idea of how a person is and how you each get along but it takes much more time than for couples who share language and culture.

This site is kinda like a doctor's surgery. you may go in with a bad cold and want a sick note but the doctor may ask a few questions and come to suspect that your cold is actually a case of mononucleosis or tonsillitis. That's kinda what happened here.

There's a lot involved in making a success of this foreign relationships malarkey and a Schengen visa is almost the least of it and getting one pointless unless other ducks are well lined up first.

[Noypioz]

Noypioz,

Don't worry about your woman's level of English now, as long as she is keen to learn it will matter little in the long term.  Twelve+ years ago when I met my wife her English was non existent. My very poor Russian was better...

This still did not stop us building a successful 10+ year marriage with two daughters. This fact sits uncomfortably with some members here, but I am far from alone in this respect. I can think of several other couples who started in similar circumstances but are still together 10 years later...

We left UK to live in Turkey eight years ago, it is a great place to live.  The kids would never leave here.  The visa situation is very easy in Turkey.  Enjoy the bustle and sights of Istanbul but take a coach or a hop flight to the med coast - it is well worth it.

In any event, the best of luck.  Remember fortune favors the brave 

Hi Leslied,

Thanks for sharing, I appreciate it. Happy to hear of your successful marriage. Totally agree with you- we are still in the very early stages of the getting to know you bit and we can understand each other on very a basic level. Yes she is keen to learn which is important not only for me but for the future of a serious relationship if that's where we're headed. (Still in the selection process) 

Communication aside, I'm thrilled and excited about the prospects of travelling to a couple of countries where she won't need a visa as suggested by kind members of this forum, especially Turkey. If all goes well on this trip I might just invite her to a visit me here in Sydney. Cheers

[Noypioz]

There's a lot involved in making a success of this foreign relationships malarkey and a Schengen visa is almost the least of it and getting one pointless unless other ducks are well lined up first.

I understand your point Andrewfi and I cannot agree more. But I wish to emphasise nothing serious at this stage that's why I'm not too concerned yet about bringing her English capabilities up to speed. That will come in later which I will seriously pursue IF she is the right duck  I feel bad about saying this but yes, ducks are being lined up. Cheers

[NS1]

Welcome Noypioz, As you have learned here in a short time, some will
help, some not so much. You have the right attitude. There is lots of good information on this forum, do a little digging and lots of reading.
I agree with many, first trip is better off in her city. Get to know her and maybe meet some family or a few friends, lets you see how she is in her world.
Traveling is fun and will show you how she is out of her comfort zone also.
Best of luck

[Noypioz]

Welcome Noypioz, As you have learned here in a short time, some will
help, some not so much. You have the right attitude. There is lots of good information on this forum, do a little digging and lots of reading.
I agree with many, first trip is better off in her city. Get to know her and maybe meet some family or a few friends, lets you see how she is in her world.
Traveling is fun and will show you how she is out of her comfort zone also.
Best of luck

Hi NS1, thanks for your welcome and kind words. I've been away from this forum busy with my stuff and I feel I owe you all kind members an update of what's going on.

Ok, from where I left:- I was arranging travel plans to meet this lady from Kharkov- to meet her for the first time and travel to Western Europe. Hence, this thread on Schengen visa. To give you a background, she stopped attending Uni due to conflict in her hometown, moved to Kharkov and is unemployed. So naturally I had to provide for her passport application. But communication slowly dissipated during around the time she was to receive the money. She explained that she had to move again, this time to a "village near Artemovska". She finally confirmed receiving the money (after my repeated unanswered queries) and also advised a portion was used for moving and other expenses. I have no problems with that knowing I assisted someone in need. But the frequency of communication was now at all-time low; once in 2 weeks and she's blamed poor Internet connection from her friend's house as she didn't have internet. 

I believe she is not a scammer but travel and sight-seeing is not up there in her priority list. Survival and escaping from conflict would probably is. I figured this will drag on and go nowhere and I need to firm up my travel plans soon to avail of early booking discounts. With communication a major issue, I pulled the plug. But of course there is always a contingency plan :-)

During lag time with this Ukrainian woman, I met this wonderful lovely lady from Moscow. She has an economics degree, next to the CFO, simple, smart, level-headed and most of all, has more than adequate English! Not to mention gorgeous (for my taste). Since that first hello, we've been chatting everyday on viber and video skype during weekends.  And of course, I invited her to travel with me to WE to which she said yes. She even offered to repay my expenses before January 2016 which I declined so I can accumulate brownie points :-) She applied to the Embassy of Spain (acting on advise from her work colleagues) for a Schengen visa, which was eventually granted with 6 months validity. I applied and got my Russian visa (funny that they give the exact validity period as what was provided in the tourist visa vouchers/letters). 

So the latest is we're all set: flights, accommodation and other tour activities are all booked! Just waiting patiently for the date, chatting everyday...she calls me "mur mur" and I call her "fresh copek" - she feels she is like one after sauna :-)

Cheers all!



           

 

[Steveboy]

Welcome Noypioz, As you have learned here in a short time, some will
help, some not so much. You have the right attitude. There is lots of good information on this forum, do a little digging and lots of reading.
I agree with many, first trip is better off in her city. Get to know her and maybe meet some family or a few friends, lets you see how she is in her world.
Traveling is fun and will show you how she is out of her comfort zone also.
Best of luck

Hi NS1, thanks for your welcome and kind words. I've been away from this forum busy with my stuff and I feel I owe you all kind members an update of what's going on.

Ok, from where I left:- I was arranging travel plans to meet this lady from Kharkov- to meet her for the first time and travel to Western Europe. Hence, this thread on Schengen visa. To give you a background, she stopped attending Uni due to conflict in her hometown, moved to Kharkov and is unemployed. So naturally I had to provide for her passport application. But communication slowly dissipated during around the time she was to receive the money. She explained that she had to move again, this time to a "village near Artemovska". She finally confirmed receiving the money (after my repeated unanswered queries) and also advised a portion was used for moving and other expenses. I have no problems with that knowing I assisted someone in need. But the frequency of communication was now at all-time low; once in 2 weeks and she's blamed poor Internet connection from her friend's house as she didn't have internet. 

I believe she is not a scammer but travel and sight-seeing is not up there in her priority list. Survival and escaping from conflict would probably is. I figured this will drag on and go nowhere and I need to firm up my travel plans soon to avail of early booking discounts. With communication a major issue, I pulled the plug. But of course there is always a contingency plan :-)

During lag time with this Ukrainian woman, I met this wonderful lovely lady from Moscow. She has an economics degree, next to the CFO, simple, smart, level-headed and most of all, has more than adequate English! Not to mention gorgeous (for my taste). Since that first hello, we've been chatting everyday on viber and video skype during weekends.  And of course, I invited her to travel with me to WE to which she said yes. She even offered to repay my expenses before January 2016 which I declined so I can accumulate brownie points :-) She applied to the Embassy of Spain (acting on advise from her work colleagues) for a Schengen visa, which was eventually granted with 6 months validity. I applied and got my Russian visa (funny that they give the exact validity period as what was provided in the tourist visa vouchers/letters). 

So the latest is we're all set: flights, accommodation and other tour activities are all booked! Just waiting patiently for the date, chatting everyday...she calls me "mur mur" and I call her "fresh copek" - she feels she is like one after sauna :-)

Cheers all!

Thats a great story! And just as I keep telling guys!! FORGET ABOUT UKRAINE!! and those awful women who for sure will need some of your money for expenses 

Find yourself an educated women with a good job! preferably in Russia:) And who will not be living in your wallet daily!



           

 
[/quote]

[Markje]

She even offered to repay my expenses before January 2016 which I declined so I can accumulate brownie points :-)

Could also be, that this was her 'greedy' test, which you passed.

Thats speculation of course, but most RU women are afraid men are 'greedy' and had you accepted she would have paid you, and stopped communicating with you.

Mark.