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Author Topic: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW  (Read 32264 times)

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Offline longingforthesouth

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #15 on: October 01, 2014, 01:18:35 PM »
AJ, I have never used MOB agencies in my life. That's not for me. However I was reading their bullshit online. You know they have articles on their sites like: "why FSUW are superior to WW, they have the mysterious russian soul, they make borsch and babies".

And there are always fake testimonials, photos of blondes in bikinis, who "cannot find quality men". They post such crap to attract new customers, but I was never one of them. I have a well developed bullshit detector. I have never been scammed in my life.

What I used were honest dating sites. One was a pay site aimed at WM and the rest were all russian sites: Loveplanet, Mamba and social networks: VK, Odnoklassniki, Moy mir etc. I also met some FSU women without internet (e.g. on trains, planes, caffes etc.). I don't need wingmen, agencies or translators.


You need a reality check.

Why?
Travelling to Russia and Ukraine since 2005. Visited places: In Russia: Moscow, St. Petersburg, Tver, Voronezh, Rostov na Donu, Novocherkassk, Taganrog, Krasnodar, Kazan, Yekaterinburg, Novosibirsk etc. In Ukraine: Kiev, Odessa, Zaporizhia, Kharkiv, Dnipropetrovsk, Donetsk, Luhansk, Lysychansk etc. Longest relationship: 4 years + many shorter ones. Russian: almost fluent, Ukrainian: basic. ADVICE TO THE FORUM NEWBIES: Don't trust the guy with the short name. First shoot, then ask ;)

Offline AJ

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #16 on: October 01, 2014, 02:32:44 PM »
AJ, I have never used MOB agencies in my life. That's not for me. However I was reading their bullshit online. You know they have articles on their sites like: "why FSUW are superior to WW, they have the mysterious russian soul, they make borsch and babies".

And there are always fake testimonials, photos of blondes in bikinis, who "cannot find quality men". They post such crap to attract new customers, but I was never one of them. I have a well developed bullshit detector. I have never been scammed in my life.

What I used were honest dating sites. One was a pay site aimed at WM and the rest were all russian sites: Loveplanet, Mamba and social networks: VK, Odnoklassniki, Moy mir etc. I also met some FSU women without internet (e.g. on trains, planes, caffes etc.). I don't need wingmen, agencies or translators.

I met women through those means as well.my wife I met from her profile at an agency. I've lived in the FSU, met plenty of very nice RW here and there ,so i just can't completely  buy what you are selling.

 As far as the agencies, they tell the men they market to exactly what they want to hear.
Do you think your local new or used car dealer doesn't do the same? It may seem unethical,but its big business.

If you don't use them, I can't see why you'd be too concerned.

As far as meeting a boatload of stervas through more regular channels, then  labeling the society as utterly  flawed..

I find you're likely overstating, from my experience.
 I met women off mamba, most were quite well adjusted, nice and family oriented.
Could I find a lot of young party girls listed on mamba as well? sure.
The profiles normally give you a clue, any interaction after that certainly should. If they got past those filters, then a first date would let me know we weren't compatible.(but she would be with someone else)
nyet problem?

I certainly am not selling some fantasy that the FSU is absolutely chalk full of  young models who are family oriented and suzy homemakers?
 Yet I'm certainly well enough versed in both living in the FSU and dating/living with RW the last 2 decades to say it isn't filled with stervas either as a generality. (:)

 I know a dozen FSU women in the 25 to 32 age range off the top of my head that are very family oriented, beautiful and
nothing like your stereotype.Just fixed a guy up with one of them a few weeks ago, they seem to have hit it off and continue dating.

I'm not saying they are around every corner, but they certainly are not that hard to find,. You can hold on to your opinion dearly, but the average RW is married and has a family.She likely is reasonable and hardly a bitch.
More importantly, her unmarried friends are very much like her, and that constitutes the bulk of the female population, not what you portray.
Does the bitchy , entitled , party club  girl mentality exist ? Sure , absolutely. but no one needs to date them unless they want to,and its certainly not all you'd find in the FSU.
she had a hip with bad habits , and a shake that was a bit obscene

Offline JayH

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #17 on: October 01, 2014, 05:36:51 PM »
I think LFTS has got more right than wrong here.Generalisations are never 100% accurate but here is a fair attempt at outlining a lot of issues.Certainly   it does apply to at least some.As he has pointed out several times the "old" timers here are out of touch-- funny how are few jumped straight into thread !!

LFTS--your comments seem very like some conversations I had-- have you more recently been based in a city not in your signature?Maybe you had a small problem on exit?


Offline TomT

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #18 on: October 01, 2014, 06:43:29 PM »
AJ,

We've been debunking the myths about FSUW for nearly fifteen years now and the topic is getting very long of tooth. It's futile anyway because there so much variation between individuals that it's difficult to know where the average lies.
"Get away from the keyboard little man. I know where you live." (Message left in my facebook mailbox by our resident psychopath.)

Offline AJ

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #19 on: October 01, 2014, 06:57:13 PM »
Tom, true enough.

I'm hardly a defender of RW on a pedestal...
they are women ,and individuals, like any other nationality.

If folks think they have some cultural  monopoly on being bitchy, then those folks havn't dated in various cultures much.
she had a hip with bad habits , and a shake that was a bit obscene

Offline longingforthesouth

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #20 on: October 01, 2014, 07:16:02 PM »
Just fixed a guy up with one of them a few weeks ago, they seem to have hit it off and continue dating.

Meeting through mutual friends is great, but not all of us have that possibility like your lucky friend. I always had to "FIX" everything myself. Do you understand the difference?

the average RW is married and has a family.She likely is reasonable and hardly a bitch. More importantly, her unmarried friends are very much like her

OK, but we rarely see such good women on dating sites. They don't sit there 24/7. They work, study, workout, make handcrafts, dance kazachok, take care of babies (if they are single mums). Some of them may not be interested in foreigners and don't want to live abroad. Some hate  the dating industry and don't want to be in catalogues. Some don't believe in online dating, let alone international dating. Some may be shy. Some are already taken. Etc...

Do you think your local new or used car dealer doesn't do the same?

How can you compare cars and human beings? I've never been scammed by dishonest agencies, but still, what they do is intolerable. Misguided by their myths, many WM travel to the FSU and spend loads of $$$ only to find out that no one wants them there. The loss of money is not so important, but the emotional manipulation.

No offence, but you are married and maybe you are a little bit biased and you don't see the bad things so much.

Anyway, thank you for sharing your story, but I'm trying to understand it. Is it like you lived / worked in the FSU for a long time? You had friends there? Or you lived in the US and you travelled abroad to meet your lady? Details mean a lot.
Travelling to Russia and Ukraine since 2005. Visited places: In Russia: Moscow, St. Petersburg, Tver, Voronezh, Rostov na Donu, Novocherkassk, Taganrog, Krasnodar, Kazan, Yekaterinburg, Novosibirsk etc. In Ukraine: Kiev, Odessa, Zaporizhia, Kharkiv, Dnipropetrovsk, Donetsk, Luhansk, Lysychansk etc. Longest relationship: 4 years + many shorter ones. Russian: almost fluent, Ukrainian: basic. ADVICE TO THE FORUM NEWBIES: Don't trust the guy with the short name. First shoot, then ask ;)

Offline AJ

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #21 on: October 01, 2014, 08:00:10 PM »
Readers digest version- I lived and worked ,based out of a  FSU country a few years back in late the 90's. I moved back to the US in 99 but still worked part time over there  and married a UW soon thereafter.My job transitioned back to full time in the US ,we were married 7 years total, then parted ways amicably.
 I then dated both locally and internationally a couple years ,ultimately met a UW thru an agency in early 2010, we married in the fall of 2011.
Certainly doesn't make me an expert,yet i have plenty of family/friends and aquantences in the FSU that disprove ,at least to me, the *all sterva * theory.
You seem to be saying this is a difficult road for most western men to travel..i've never disagreed. Ive walked it a couple times and seen all the potholes you brought up.
You seem to feel the MOB agencies are in general suspect ,unethical. i dont disagree.


I have plenty of empathy,but feel you're approaching this with the wrong attitude.If your past experiences have you that jaded about it, then i'd move
simply on and forget the whole deal.
If you want to pursue it, I'd drop the *they are all bitches* mentality, and simply look for the right girl for you.. and recognize its not a cakewalk , in any country.
Life's not fair, seems rule number one .


she had a hip with bad habits , and a shake that was a bit obscene

Offline welder

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #22 on: October 01, 2014, 09:59:11 PM »

Why you guys defocus from the subject and always blame the OP? It's like: all FSUW are saintesses and there must be "something wrong with the guy".
Longing I focus on the OP because you are the one here posting. Not much I can do to assist nonexisting ladies whom seek advice/opinions on how they could be more successful in meeting men.  Of course I am attempting to make an effort to assist you.  I took the time and effort to read your previous posts before writing my response above.

Note that I didn't say there is something wrong with you, as in you are some freak.  Read my response above with this in mind.  You haven't reached your goal so something is not working.  What is it?  I don't know.  Only by asking questions can we expand our knowledge base and have an adult conversation.



Let's be grown up: a huge percent of FSUW are not serious. They are not SO different than the WW, they are not all family oriented, they are not all SO sophisticated, they easily fall for stupid trends, they are not interested in foreigners, they have local choices, they cheat, they fart. It's not a blasphemy to admit this.

Sure there are exceptions! Girls who read Turgenev, who like museums and cinema classics such as "Ирония судьбы". I told you that I had a girl, who was in her late teens and who was like this.

Of course, and who disagrees, you are singing to the choir.  The difference being that if these ladies are the same world over, then deal with it.  Stop worrying about the stuff you cannot control and move on to that which brings you closer to your end game.

But that does not mean that I necesaraly chase teenagers. You took that out of context. I do not choose by age. If I like the photo, I write. I like when the profile contains something inspirational.

But most of the profiles are empty, cause their owners don't give a sh. They are already taken anyway. VK.ru is your friend.

OK fair enough, but it was you who said that you had more success with younger ladies.  If that is the case then I was probing for why?  Is it because they are less jaded, more willing to listen to BS, intrigued by an older guy, have less self confidence, don't question as much, hard bodies, what?????

4 years of relationship (which nearly ended with a marriage) plus many shorter relationships with beautiful and smart young FSUW. Is that success or not? I guess it is something.
This is the same relationship where you said you blew it three years ago.  Are you still hung up on that girl?  Don't take that as a flame.  Obviously that was a special relationship for you but it's three years on mate.  Are you looking at each girl and speaking of this relationship?

Anyway longing, its up to you if you want to discuss your situation.  Yes that means having to have adult discussions where you may not like or want to hear other opinions. 

Maybe , just maybe, the older married guys do have something to offer you after all.  It isn't all luck, that's naive and dishonest.

Offline TomT

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #23 on: October 01, 2014, 10:29:02 PM »
If you state what you've learned since you posted in 2011, other than that FSU girls are bitches, it would save us all some time. Please be brief because some of our members have the attention span of fruit flies.
"Get away from the keyboard little man. I know where you live." (Message left in my facebook mailbox by our resident psychopath.)

Offline longingforthesouth

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #24 on: October 01, 2014, 11:39:19 PM »
Welder, I'm not searching anymore. I just shared my opinion. It's well founded on experience and I'll not change it. Now I'm on dating sites just to kill time. Also, we have pretty girls in my country. We make sexy time with no strings attached, cause they are "independent".

AJ, respect for your story! But you are not a typical online dater. You lived there since the 90's and you married a UW "before it was cool" as hipsters say.

While living there in the 90s, I assume you made friends, learned the mentality. You are an american and foreigners were "cool". It was the era of Yeltsin and Kuchma, the economy was bad. I assume that gave you an advantage.

Most of the WM could not have your experience. Their only "window" to the FSU is the monitor. They travel to the "lion's den" with no experience or local support. No friends to fix dates with trusted and quality women.

Not all of us can live in the FSU. If you live there dating is easier. Especialy 10-15-20 years ago.

TomT , y r u so angry? It's futile, yes. So what? We're just talking. I wanted to write a sort of "e-book". Not for the members,  of course, but for newbies and guests. If you think this all sux, close this thread. I dunno who's the mod.
Travelling to Russia and Ukraine since 2005. Visited places: In Russia: Moscow, St. Petersburg, Tver, Voronezh, Rostov na Donu, Novocherkassk, Taganrog, Krasnodar, Kazan, Yekaterinburg, Novosibirsk etc. In Ukraine: Kiev, Odessa, Zaporizhia, Kharkiv, Dnipropetrovsk, Donetsk, Luhansk, Lysychansk etc. Longest relationship: 4 years + many shorter ones. Russian: almost fluent, Ukrainian: basic. ADVICE TO THE FORUM NEWBIES: Don't trust the guy with the short name. First shoot, then ask ;)

Offline welder

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #25 on: October 02, 2014, 02:13:24 AM »
Welder, I'm not searching anymore. I just shared my opinion. It's well founded on experience and I'll not change it. Now I'm on dating sites just to kill time. Also, we have pretty girls in my country. We make sexy time with no strings attached, cause they are "independent".
 
I wanted to write a sort of "e-book". Not for the members,  of course, but for newbies and guests. If you think this all sux, close this thread. I dunno who's the mod.

Fair enough Longing.  I respect the effort you made in sharing your opinion.  I don't agree with it but that's the spirit of the forum, sharing our experiences. 

Experience can be your silent enemy.  If your experience is such that it limits your opinions and thinking than it works against you.  If you can step back and use your experiences in a new way that minimizes repeating old habits or by considering adapting those efforts to open new doors experience can move you forward rather quickly. 

This is not an "ebook" or personal blog so it is only fair, and expected, that new guests and members read alternate opinions, debate why you may have arrived at your conclusions and let folks decide for themselves. 

I don't see a reason to close the thread.  To date is has been healthy debate where members just don't roll over and accept what has been posted as gospel.  You should welcome that debate as it provides an avenue to drive home your opinion based on your experience and force you, me and others reading and posting, to broaden our view.

Offline welder

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #26 on: October 02, 2014, 02:38:13 AM »
As he has pointed out several times the "old" timers here are out of touch-- funny how are few jumped straight into thread !!
Really Jay?  Where have the so called "old " timers been out of touch on this topic, specifically? 

Longing presented an opinion which has been debated.   If his opinion and conclusions are accurate they will withstand debate.  Would it make you happier if everyone just rolls over an accepts everything written as gospel? 

Offline Slumba

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #27 on: October 02, 2014, 05:27:21 AM »
There is some truth in what you say, however, my experience (so far) has been that it is easy to filter out such women. 

Are there "proud-to-be-bitches" - yes. 

Of course, even the well-read person such as yourself will remember Chaucer's Wife of Bath and realize this is not a new discovery. ("What women most desire is sovereignty over their husbands" is the upshot, in case it has been a while for you.)

You might want to have a look at Edward Bernays or the TV series https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Century_of_the_Self which deals with how corporations and others have influenced societies, including US/UK and now, Russian society also.

My view is that non-married women, spend more on high-profit items, so those who would benefit from that, promote it.
Anchors Rewoven

Offline JayH

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #28 on: October 02, 2014, 05:48:34 AM »
As he has pointed out several times the "old" timers here are out of touch-- funny how are few jumped straight into thread !!
Really Jay?  Where have the so called "old " timers been out of touch on this topic, specifically? 

Longing presented an opinion which has been debated.   If his opinion and conclusions are accurate they will withstand debate.  Would it make you happier if everyone just rolls over an accepts everything written as gospel?
    No-- it would not make me "happier" -- look at the way replies are framed. The OP has obviously gone to a lot of effort to write that post as a 'think' piece and in my view it is an interesting piece of work .His conclusions are attacked and dismissed-- by those same people the OP mentions. Do they feel threatened by others with knowledge? With those that reach conclusions>? There is no evidence that the OP was on the forum 15 years ago to get the benefit of the collective wisdom- so his views are contemporary.
    In summary-- many things do and have changed in Ukraine since many here were there. That is virtually in every aspect of life and attitudes. Given that the OP comments were mostly about younger generation girls --that is something that some here would never connect with--let alone understand.One of the problems you have( although you are younger than the old phaffers I was referring to) is that a very narrow view of who can know anything is taken  ie  closed minds to others who do have actual on the ground current experience . The OP has made some observations -- a lot of which I would agree with-even if I would not necessarily express in the same way.
I am also heavily restricted on what I can say here as I am so rude and ill mannered-so difficult to give examples if I want the post to appear. :)

Offline AKA Luke

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Re: Sex, Lies and Videotape: Deconstructing the myths about FSUW
« Reply #29 on: October 02, 2014, 07:17:26 AM »
AJ, I have never used MOB agencies in my life. That's not for me. However I was reading their bullshit online. You know they have articles on their sites like: "why FSUW are superior to WW, they have the mysterious russian soul, they make borsch and babies".

And there are always fake testimonials, photos of blondes in bikinis, who "cannot find quality men". They post such crap to attract new customers, but I was never one of them. I have a well developed bullshit detector. I have never been scammed in my life.

What I used were honest dating sites. One was a pay site aimed at WM and the rest were all russian sites: Loveplanet, Mamba and social networks: VK, Odnoklassniki, Moy mir etc. I also met some FSU women without internet (e.g. on trains, planes, caffes etc.). I don't need wingmen, agencies or translators.


You need a reality check.

Why?

You appear to be in another world.

Yeah there's bitchy girls everywhere, how you've found that many is anyone's guess.

Change tactics and try again Go hard or go home.

When I went to Russia I met several girls, 1 was a bit of an airhead who i met in a club who called herself Maria Versace as she loved everything versace. She was a bit of a diva to say the least. We connected on social media, she was great to look at but not for me as above. All the other girls I bumped into in various places were lovely. 

You can slate them all or take a look at what you're doing wrong and why you feel hard done by?
I know I am I'm sure I am I'm Rotherham til I die!


 

 

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